Guild Wars 2

I thought it was clear that Penguins comment about “part human” was a descriptor of how human-like they are. “if you you prick them…….” is a Shakesperian reference from the Merchant of Venice that was making a point of how alike two different people are.

“If you prick us, do we not bleed? if you tickle us, do we not laugh? if you poison us, do we not die? and if you wrong us, shall we not revenge?". – (Act III, scene I).”

That said, Weindrasi hit the nail on the head. Charr have their own cultural version of romance. It doesn’t mirror human romance. So, it is in the lore, but it different.

Hey, uh…, Penguin? How many cats do you own? Do they tend to put their backs against the wall when you are around?

You can stab an elephant and it will bleed too. Doesn’t make it human

It’s heart warming until you realize that cats are quite… spikey…

Although a love triangle between a Charr, Asuran and Quaggan would be interesting to see I suppose.

Well as part of the community as pointed out in another thread, Charr are absolutely no part human just all beast although having a humanoid stance. (And they also pointed out how many furries we have in the game that love horns and tails).

But I agree that it would be nice if there was some romance or something besides War War War War thoughts with charr and at this point its going to be something between Rox and that bald norn guy.

Sock.2785:

@Aaron Ansari

There are two stages in the corruption, in order:

1. Physical corruption: the altering of the physical form via imbuing the target with specific aspects of magic.
2. Mind corruption: once under a specific “sphere of influence” the subjugation of the mind can take place.

This is supported by the fact that both Twitchy and Glint retained their altered body form once their minds got cleansed on the Altar of Glaust.

While the physical change cannot be undone, they happen simultaneously in all dragon minion cases. It is not an order of events. And, ultimately, the mind is not corrupted – the free will is simply removed. Not subjugated either, removed.

Sock.2785:

On a side note, sylvari are already plants so Mordremoth doesn’t need to imbue them with plant magic, hence it can skip the first stage with them.

Mordremoth doesn’t corrupt sylvari in the traditional sense. This is a major error on your part. If it did, then we’d not see Mordrem Guard resisting him – dragon corruption is irresistible no matter what, both when it happens, and afterwards.

Yet we see sylvari resist the act of corruption, as well as the mental hold once Mordremoth’s voice goes quiet.

Sock.2785:

Zhaitan corrupts dead beings and ultimately the ones you listed are exactly that: once living trees and sea creatuers now risen from death by Zhaitan (I’d argue that, in Tyria, all of these creatures have a mind, as simple or as primordial as it can be (or, as you say, non-thinking)). We don’t see Zhaitan really making heavy use of those though; even if he subjugated their minds, they’d be of very little use: mussels, sea urchins, corals, “normal” plants, they’re all limited both in their minds and in movements, and would be of very little use in spreading the corruption. On the other hand, the Elder Undead Dragon doesn’t corrupt objects; I can’t think of any case right now except maybe a couple of Dwayna’s statues in the Cathedral of Zephyrs (but I doubt they are obtained via magic). In this regard, the real mistery with Zhaitan would be the orrian spectral weapons, but they appear to be a mystery in general (orrian ones, “chaos” Forgotten ones, bloodstone ones etc.).

Zhaitan is well known to corrupt living beings, actually.

• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Corporal_Kellach – despite Aaron’s claim, Kellach never dies. He does turn rotten and decayed (Vigil instance only) but never dies when that happens.
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fight_the_Mysterious_Quaggan_Affliction – Living quaggans affected weakly by Zhaitan’s corruption results in their bodies decaying
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Assist_Crusader_Aisling_of_the_Vigil_recover_lost_skritt_territory – living plants become corrupted and must be chopped down to cease its spread
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Assist_Jezza_and_the_Vigil_in_clearing_Risen_from_Fort_Cadence – corrupted bushes here, still living, must be burned to cease corruption’s spread
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Help_Ayomichi_slow_the_spread_of_Risen_corruption – risen corruption spreading from dead fish to the animals which eat it, resulting in corrupted drakes and other wildlife, which then spreads it to tree stumps and other animals
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Help_Brannen_maintain_Caer_Brier – like in the skritt area, living trees are corrupted here and must be destroyed to slow the spread of corruption

Those are the most primary examples.

There is not a single case I can think of with dead plants being corrupted. Those are very much living – leaves are there, still, but the appearance of the trunks are the same as Kellach’s skin before becoming decayed and rotten: purple veins coarsing thickly beneath the skin/bark.

Zhaitan’s corruption entirely affects the living, but it starts weak enough that it appears like a disease and is akin to the Sons of Svanir slowly being corrupted by Jormag – the influence starts low and slow, but becomes more and more powerful and irresistible.

As for corrupting objects:

• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Assist_Jezza_and_the_Vigil_in_clearing_Risen_from_Fort_Cadence – has corrupted Orrian artifacts that must be destroyed as they’re spreading corruption (to the local plantlife)
• https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ossuary_of_Unquiet_Dead – the end of this story step has us destroying Orrian artifacts steeped in Zhaitan’s concentrated dragon corruption.

Two examples off the top of my head, excluding god statues (not just Dwayna’s – all five temples get corrupted, and the statues in Arah are even more so) and the Spectral Weapons. I’m sure there’s many more cases.

-character limit-

Sock.2785:

Jormag’s territory is filled with icy formations, but not all are sentiet nor hostile. The ones that do interact with us are comparable to elementals, from the small corrupted ice formations (which themselves summon “typical” icebrood elementals) to the enormous ice elemental being summoned in Wayfare Foothills (the Frozen Maw).
It’s as if the normal (inanimate) icy formations are a crystallization of Jormag’s ice magic.

Three problems:

1) Ice Formations can fight back. There are many that do, both large and small.
2) Icebrood Elementals are not summoned. They are corrupted ice elementals as can be seen in this heart when Svanir are attacking local Ice Elementals with shards of corrupted ice – ice changes into different kind of ice.
3) Dragonspawn was basically a sentient and hostile corrupted ice formation, and the Claws of Jormag may be too.

Sock.2785:

Kralkatorrik twisted everything invested by its foul breath, turning the land black and generating a clear and defined aura surrounding the affected areas. The air itself seems twisted: by walking into the Brand its almost like walking into corruption itself. However, we aren’t attacked" by the soil, by the twisted structures or by the air itself, more generally by inanimate things.

This is false on three accounts:

1) The Crystalline Giant in Ghosts of Ascalon is the land itself attacking. So is the Shatterers, technically, both the land and air being corrupted into an assaulting force.

Also: I believe the five formations during this guild challenge causes PBAoE damage via lightning. I may be wrong here.

2) The air does attack. I don’t think players can get damaged, but in some areas of the Dragonbrand (such as Varim’s Run in Fields of Ruin) lighting strikes the ground.

3) You treat this as if unique to Kralkatorrik, but Orr is the same. The soil is decayed, and if you look up you’ll see an oily coat to the sky, and in Straits (if not elsewhere) the water is green and putrid.

Sock.2785:

Ultimately, Elder Dragons use the same magic we use (and every other magic user)

There is no strong case for this, honestly, given that everyone and their grandmothers call it “dragon magic” and “draconic energies”.

Furthermore, the Astralaria collection treats it differently than the ley energy which is what “every magic uses” uses.

It seems that draconic energy is derived from ley energy, but that they are not the same thing.

Sock.2785:

However if this was the case the seeds would’ve been corrupted from the start, a being like Malyck (and its tree) would not exist. The Dream’s visions can be misinterpreted.

They can exist if they seeds were purified while still seeds and placed in that cave. Ronan was never said to flee from the cave, but found monsters within it. Those monsters could have been purified mordrem too.

Sock.2785:

There could be another explanation: the seeds (and, as a consequence, the plants from which they come from) exist in nature but aren’t corruptible by Mordremoth yet, because they are somehow immature in that stage. Mordrem (you know, the “terrible plant creatures” Ronan encountered) will then guard them, making sure they remain in the cave where Mordremoth gathered them.

There are two problems with your argument:

1. Why would they not corrupt the seeds in the first place? There is no strategic benefit to not corrupting immediately. Further, all dragon minions corrupt while they are awake, even if they’re trapped (such as Drakkar).

2. If they were part of the natural world and not the Elder Dragon’s cycle (ergo, hibernating minions), why are they restricted to this cave and not existent elsewhere?

Sock.2785:

By the way, there’s no real mordrem counterpart to a Pale Tree (referring to the entity’s mind, which also projects itself with an avatar), which is in its own unique.

Again, your argument has two major issues:

1. The Pale Tree created the Avatar in recent years. Aside from the fact that it’s 250 years older than the Blighting Trees, and has been absorbing magic for herself in that time (rather than for Mordremoth), she created the Avatar of the Tree for the explicit purpose of communication with non-sylvari.

Sylvari could communicate with the Pale Tree by talking to the tree itself directly, and it could communicate back both telepathically with sylvari, and through words made by the wind through branches.

Blighting Trees, on the other hand, have no reason to communicate with non-mordrem – the Mordrem Commanders can do that for them (and every time we see a Blighting Tree, there is a dragon champion overseeing it – whether it’s one of the three commanders or that one annoying, taunting, Champion Blademaster in Auric Basin that we cannot fight).

2. We never see other purified trees, whether Malyck’s tree or another, so we cannot say that they do not create an Avatar to talk with others. It would not be surprising at all if Malyck’s tree were to make an “Avatar of that Tree” to communicate with the PC when/if we ever go see it.

Ultimately, these are two huge assumptions you’re making based on the claim of absence of evidence is evidence of absence.

Sock.2785:

In conclusion: like the seeds and the trees, sylvari are not Mordremoth’s creation. After all, Wynne also says: “we’re meant to serve it”; the jungle dragon intended to corrupt the trees (and what may come with them).

This sounds more like they were corrupted but were purified thus removed from their original role of being made to serve Mordremoth.

Most of them came when I had income. I haven’t actually counted, it isn’t necessarily over a hundred, but it is a few tabs. Some are multiples of things like the celebration hat and other once-town-clothes that got converted. There are BL skins I got when they were one ticket because I liked them but didn’t yet have an alt that was right for them. Then there’s the issue that a lot of gem skins now unlock in Wardrobe when bought, I forget to look by the time I’m using the skin, I use a charge … And then there are the armor sets which I might use one piece of and then I have five more pieces waiting for if/when they suit a look.

At any rate, the only purpose of an unlocked account bound skin is to give you one free application of that skin. I understand that a transmutation charge is fungible but I can’t see how it makes any financial difference to ANet at all if a player uses the free charge to change to something other than the sold skin. Maybe that’s because I don’t spend gems on charges? Regardless, the skin is a charge and nothing else, so why not have the option of turning it into one to clear out inventory space?

I have so many skins taking up slots in my bank. Most of them I’ll probably never use but some of them I’ve put on characters. Unfortunately about 98% of the time I forget to use the skin so I wasted a transmutation charge and there’s the skin still taking up a slot in my bank.

What if when you select “Store in wardrobe” it would actually store the free skin charge as well. That would be sweet. Then I could put more important things in my bank, like all the different “keys” we now have… :P

A reminder to everyone whether or not your clocks will change tomorrow night: this weekend is “Fall Back” for most of the US, when clocks get set back one hour as of 2 am Sunday. ANet’s time will be affected. This means that if your time remains the same, the hour for Guild Chat will be different until the spring time change, the time your friends and guild mates get home from work will change, etc.

And if your time changes, remember that the game’s daily reset will be an hour earlier on the clock as it is not based on US time. For example I am in Eastern time; reset for me is 8 pm (20:00 hours for you 24 hour users). As of Sunday, reset for me will be at 7 (19:00 hours).

Enjoy your feeling of getting an extra hour’s sleep in the morning, don’t get caught by surprise by an “early” reset, and please don’t get too depressed by how dark it is in the evening!

Behellagh.1468:

The first slot was NEVER a random reward but a random booster.

Actually, that’s not completely true. The greatest results I ever got out of a single BLC was 1 ticket and 2 scraps, and that was less than a year ago.

If the bank errored in my favor, please disreggard this post.

~EW

Behellagh.1468:

I’ve always argued that one person’s “junk” is another person’s useful utility item.

Usually those who keep using “junk” when referring to the common drops from BL Chests either didn’t understand the “gem store sampler” concept behind chests from their introduction before BL tickets/scraps or expect every chest to include some highly valuable item they could sell, which if true that item would no longer be highly valuable.

Or, option 3: we understand what a skinner-box is, and equate getting what we see as “junk” as equivocally the same as getting no grain pellets when we pigeons peck the buttons.

Getting something still feels better than getting nothing… but that feeling is the only value to “junk,” and is why this black lion skinner box is a bit more sophisticated for our pecking pigeon selves.

~EW

I’ve always argued that one person’s “junk” is another person’s useful utility item.

Usually those who keep using “junk” when referring to the common drops from BL Chests either didn’t understand the “gem store sampler” concept behind chests from their introduction before BL tickets/scraps or expect every chest to include some highly valuable item they could sell, which if true that item would no longer be highly valuable.

I never said it’s the only problem with immersion in GW2. We never talked about waypoints, yet you’re claiming I don’t consider it to be immersion brekaing? How would you know?

Do you walk to a waypoint before using it like the NPCs do? If not then you don’t consider it immersion breaking and your problem with the NPCs changing looks is still selective.

The reason why others aren’t agreeing with you is because they don’t have this immersion problem and so don’t see a need for a fix. I suggest you role play that people have jobs and take turns at places. Or that Hungry Hal has a fake beard he sometimes wears. That will help your immersion so it doesn’t bother you.

Tekey.7946:

All I can see is that you’re constantly avoiding the actual topic and still can’t accept it being Anet’s fault. I’ve been criticizing it, giving Anet the chance to fix it.

Herein lies the problem.

Fault = yes, they intentionally programmed it that way.

You’re criticizing it = something you’re entitled to do.

Giving them a chance to fix it = assumes something done intentionally is broken.

The fact you don’t like the NPC changing when you change maps or login or out, is NOT proof it is broken. It is your opinion.

Edit: in my opinion raids were a horrible idea and they should not add anymore to the game. That is NOT proof that they were a bad idea or not working as intended. I just don’t think they should have added them.

What I want to know is why NPC’s don’t react to your character disappearing and then reappearing in the exact same spot, with anywhere from minutes to days in between those events.

Do you have some sort of mursaat ability to step sideways through reality which no one has questioned up to this point? You would think after being the Pact commander and all that someone would have brought it up.

Tekey.7946:

Why should I change my perception?

1) Your perception is based off of unrealistic expectations and a lack of information.
2) Your perception is likely to lead to blood pressure medications.
3) Your perception is abrasive and does not incite constructive criticism and discussion.
4) Your perception is not the only plausible one, and you asking that question admits to that possibility. It’s always good to attempt to see the world from other perspectives.
5) Your perception disallows cheesecake.

~EW

Skittish.4539:

Npc #347 has fainted from exhaustion
Cheesecake, I choose you!

You are now my favorite person for the day.

~EW

Npc #347 has fainted from exhaustion
Cheesecake, I choose you!

Tekey.7946:

And why is it so hard to acknowledge a problem with GW2?

It’s not about acknowledging a problem… it’s about your reaction to it being disproportionate to the problem.

Tekey.7946:

There are so many people defending Anets intention of a thing I would call lazy work or a bug. Give me a reason why they shouldn’t do anything about it.

1) It’s their game, and not yours. While any one of our suggestions about improving GW2 might be worth considering from a standpoint of pleasing their audience, ultimately any problems or perceived problems are theirs to act on as they see fit and aren’t subject to a player’s perception of importance.

2) You don’t know why it’s happening, you just assume it’s a bug or laziness on ANet’s part without any proof of your own…. where as others have given you reasonable doubt about it being a bug (or at least a way to understand it from a narrative standpoint)…

…sorry, that was 2.

Like all problems in life, the solution comes down to 1 of 2 choices. Either 1) Quit taking it so seriously, or 2) kill it with fire. edit: Occasionally there’s a third solution: cheesecake.

~EW

Tekey.7946:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Maybe the castaways change because they have 8 hour shifts doing their jobs as well as 15 minute breaks every hour, and a lunch break, and when they’e gone someone else takes over. Wouldn’t it be more immersion breaking to see one person standing at one spot 24/7 instead of different people?

There’s this one guy, sitting around and talking about his fiancée (the statue: Delsa). Is that a job? I don’t think that they need shifts to replace a guy sitting near a statue. Also, that would mean that the statue is literally engaged to the whole circus. And every single circus guy uses the exact same words while talking to you.

The same happens with the asuran researchers. They change their appearance, but their voice and their dialogue remains the same. It’s still the same person, so that’s not really an explanation.

They were also replaced within 1 minute, as Healix said:

NPCs that don’t have a fixed appearance have their appearance randomly generated when the map is initialized.

As soon as you get into another instance of the map, they’ll look different.

There’s this one guy, sitting around and talking about his fiancée (the statue: Delsa). Is that a job?

You complain about that but you don’t think that someone at one spot 24/7 forever and ever isn’t immersion breaking?

And every single circus guy uses the exact same words while talking to you.

Have you ever worked for a job and they hand you a set of lines to memorize to say to the customer? Happens all the time. People who have the same job and get asked the same questions over and over have set answers, often given to them by their employees.

Here’s how it’s coded.

Spot X on Map Y has a code for “Generic NPC”

So “Generic Male NPC” is plopped down.

“Generic Male NPC” references some code that tells it what race, gender, hair color, hair style, etc.

Gender – Set to male
Race – Random choose between #‘s 1-5, with each # corresponding to a race.
Hair Color- Random choose a number that corresponds with a hair color ANet wants NPC’s to have
Hair Style – Random…

That’s how the game can make things random.

Tekey.7946:

Skittish.4539:

Have you ever seen an npc change appearance right in front of you? Have you ever noticed an npc’s appearance altered at all while you were in that map, without changing maps or logging off? I have a sneaky suspicion that the only time an npc looks different is because it’s a different instance. Therefore a different plane of existence. Therefore not even a little immersion breaking.

Since when are different map instances different planes of existence? You’re mixing up gameplay with lore. Map instances do not exist in the GW lore. They’re just there because of technical limitations of our game.

And why is it so hard to acknowledge a problem with GW2? There are so many people defending Anets intention of a thing I would call lazy work or a bug. Give me a reason why they shouldn’t do anything about it.

Why are map instances a technical limitation of the game and the progress of events in different map instances a technical limitation of the game and the inability to interact with other real life players across different map instances a technical limitation of the game, but how an npc looks across different map instances can’t just be written off as a technical limitation of the game?

Ever noticed how when a map starts closing and you have to switch, all the events that you just did aren’t done anymore? Pretty sure alternate reality is the only way that makes sense.

Have you ever seen an npc change appearance right in front of you? Have you ever noticed an npc’s appearance altered at all while you were in that map, without changing maps or logging off? I have a sneaky suspicion that the only time an npc looks different is because it’s a different instance. Therefore a different plane of existence. Therefore not even a little immersion breaking.

So, in a game with makeover kits(that also allow sex changes); the ability to name change; shapeshifting, magic; mesmers (illusions, clones); etc…you claim this “problem” is ruining your gameplay.

Maybe, the circus folks are messing with you/everyone.
Maybe, the generically named NPC is standing watch.
Maybe, just maybe, another NPC relieves the previous generically named NPC and is now standing the watch.

There is nothing immersion breaking about any of this. This would actually improve immersion because it fits more neatly into humans perceived notion of the world around them and puts a semblence of reality in to the game.

Immersion breaking would be if the NPC addressed you by your real world name and told you to log off because you “think” there is something wrong with something that was programmed in to the game.

Is it possible that there are bugs in the game…oh yeah, too many to count.
Is this one item you seem obsessed with a bug, not in my opinion and nothing you have offered so far indicates it is bugged.

Edit: I left out fractals and alternate dimensions.
Different life choices made them look different. Log out/back in…they look different because you have logged in to an alternate reality.

I’ll wait patiently for the thread where map closings ruin immersion and force you to log off because “real” maps wouldn’t just turn off.

The truth is, every npc works for Anet. So every little thing Anet tells them to do is a job. The dialogue is a job. The statue loving is a job.

The npc in the other instance is a different npc, obviously.

Meanwhile we change our own appearance practically daily, and the NPCs don’t even comments on our new outfits. Shameful.

Tekey.7946:

And I find that you’re just arguing about semantics rather than facing the problem. I could have also said I find it illogical and it ruins my gaming experience instead of using the term immersion. Now what’s your explanation on NPC’s changing their looks every day?

See, words don’t change a thing about Anet’s failure.

It’s not semantics. You’re using a psychological concept to legitimize your assertion (you even put it into your thread title), and your use of the term is inapplicable. On top of that, it’s a rage post with hyperbole (like, “changing their looks every day”). The failure here isn’t with ANet.

Tekey.7946:

And that’s another point of having an immersive game. Open world games do much better than GW2, having no loading screens, no separated maps, just like a real world. That surely does kill immersion in GW2, too.

If you want to play a game that lends itself to extended or frequent periods of immersion, you don’t play MMOs. And, if changes to the game world upset you, then you certainly don’t play MMOs.

~EW