Guild Wars 2

Ithir Darkleaf.7923:

Cecilia.5179:

I’m hoping they left some really good things out. Base necro needed more than this. Why doesn’t Corrupter’s Fervor reduce incoming condi damage?

It does actually, up to a 20% reduction condition damage, just like the Scrapper: Corrupter’s Fervor Wiki

Ok, so all the QQ threads I read were ignorant? Shame on me for not fact checking them.

They missed the part where they were supposed to reduce burning across all professions and boost bleeding… I’m not particularly happy about the renewing stamina nerf, because it is a major trait, and the other vigor traits are minors, so it was not actually “normalized.”

This feels like the most painful nerf. I was hoping they wouldn’t mess with Arcana.

I’m hoping they left some really good things out. Base necro needed more than this. Why doesn’t Corrupter’s Fervor reduce incoming condi damage?

I’m not sure “sustained healing” has much of a place. If you spread out bursty heals, they will still feel “sustained,” but they will actually be efficient at keeping everyone topped off. I feel like Ventari could still use a few more things. A water field would be a good place to start, in my opinion.

Necromancer will still be offensively oriented. Keep in mind that Reaper can get 100 crit with Valk gear, which means that it can take hits AND do huge damage. Hopefully, conditions will also become more viable in PvE as they make foes with massive amounts of toughness and low HP.

Feast of Corruption is awesome now, but scepter 2 is still sad, and offhand dagger is also pretty sad.

I’m wondering if the nerf to Lingering Curses means that it will once again affect all condis applied while wielding Scepter. Otherwise, I’m just not sure the changes are all good. However, since I do not use Lingering Curse, it doesn’t actually impact me. The speed of Scepter/Offhand Dagger wasn’t improved, which concerns me. The CPC change is great albeit overdue. It will probably be somewhat mandatory in Ranger duels. That can’t be the only Axe change. There will be many moderately annoyed discussions if it is. The transforms change was overdue. No staff changes is also concerning.

Nerfing Necro would make us sad. It wouldn’t help us become viable.

Hitting Necros right after they drop Death Shroud hurts them the most. Interrupting the heal with pistol #4 is also extremely painful for them. Blind spam will make them miss all of their important skills, and it will make staff unable to generate decent life force.

I don’t like this because it would make curses feel congested. I don’t want to have to choose between dhuumfire and weakening shroud

Now that Reaper Shroud holds its own, I don’t feel like we need this. Instead, I’d like to see our ranged weapons (Axe, Scepter, Offhand Dagger, Focus, Staff) receive buffs, because they are all pretty bad right now, which is the main reason Reaper feels so limited at range.

Remember when cleaving a mesmer’s clones could be fatal?

Vital persistence ought to be baseline. I miss being able to to run master of terror without a huge opportunity cost.

Celestial is optimal, but it is hard to get. Alternative options include using a mix with knight’s gear, or using Dire gear and running Diamond Skin.
D/P thief can be hard, but if they don’t properly blind you, you can destroy them with a few well placed hits. Your burns will do a lot to them.
PU condi mesmer somewhat counters d/d without diamond skin. They will kite you and confuse you endlessly. With diamond skin, they can’t really hurt you.
Flipping a camp isn’t too hard because you have stability and skills that hit 5 targets. Fully upgraded camps are pretty hard to flip while solo in general.

Luvok.5697:

Wow, so many great responses.

I notice people mentioning frost bow which kind of makes my point. The best ranged weapon for a caster class…is a bow. It’s very weird.

I also noted that D/D’s main benefit is survivability which is also very odd for a caster archetype.

I’m not saying Ele is “wrong”- that’s completely subjective. It’s just between the dagger builds, conjured weapons, stance-dancing etc. it feels/plays nothing like what I expected. I also looked over what we know about the Tempest and it seems even stranger!

The idea behind attunement dancing is to allow you to get a “Jack of all Trades,” though some would say D/D ele is a little too good at everything right now. Fire is your standard MMO nuker, Air is single target burst, Water is healing, and Earth is defense. Of course, each weapon set accentuates a few of those different things. Staff is focused around powerful Fire and Water attunements, Scepter focuses on Air, Daggers focus on a bit of everything but have an exceptionally strong Fire Attunement, and focus “focuses” on defensive stuff (Can you tell I don’t use focus?).

If you’re looking for something that feels more traditional, try Necro. It can be really fun.

Kikidori.5916:

Windler.4815:

DiogoSilva.7089:

Roy Cronacher.1576:

Kidel.2057:

Since so many are asking for condi cleanse I’m sure it will be considered. Shiro+Glint has none.

Revenant as a whole is designed to not have much condition cleanse. That’s not to say there won’t be any tweaks for removal, but it won’t be any large changes. can’t have everything.

Besides conditions, what other weaknesses do you expect there to be, Roy?

Well Rev is weak to condis and physical CC since it has pretty much zero stab. Good to see Shiro/Glint/Jalis power specs are becoming more cohesive. However, Condi rev, should rename Mallyx the Unyielding to Mallyx the Outlier.

Funny enough. If you go Corruption + Mallyx, you are essentially just an improved Necro.

Not really. Mallyx is more about sitting on the conditions until they run out, while Necromancer likes to cleanse them or give them to his foes.

Wow, that back and forth thing there was like watching monkeys throw poop at each other. No offense to you Ron, I respect your opinion.

I will be starting a new campaign on ever class in this game.

Necro LF will be treated like adrenaline. It rapidly depletes when oocyte

Engi now have 20 second cd on all kits and elixir s skill and passive have to be used 45 secs a part or fail.

Mesmers PU now only gives 1 sec extra stealth and zero protection and lose all access to blind

Warriors can no longer stack stances and have to wait 20 secs between stances.

Rangers lose all burning and taunt.

Ele loses blinding ashes and ALL blast finishers on daggers

Guardian’s healing will be 1/3rd of its current effectiveness. Burning will no longer stack as well

I feel like the only part of this that would go over well with anybody would be the changes to burn, and even those are a little harsher than what is necessary.

Lahmia.2193:

Why does Curses have to be an only Condi line though? Spite is used for Condi and it is considered a the Power line.

Spite is used in condi builds primarily for boon hate and Signet cooldown reduction. Curses has a few things a Power build might like, but for condition builds, it carries build defining traits such as Terror and Weakening Shroud. Another big reason Curses may be associated with conditions is because all of its traits have to do with giving others conditions, and the weapon that curses boosts is scepter, which is a pure condi weapon.

Fay.2357:

Cecilia.5179:

Question: Is PU condi mesmer actually viable in other gamemodes?

PU condie Mesmer is not viable in PvP. It is not viable in PvE. It is not viable in WvW raids. It has substantially reduced viability in roaming groups with more than 5 people.

So it is only a problem in very small scale WvW combat… I feel like the devs could find a way to rebalance this one specific build to make it less brutal without damaging mesmer in PvE or sPvP. Small scale WvW can be very fun if the metagame doesn’t go stale. I don’t think it should be neglected.

I’d really like to see Path of Corruption become a minor, as this would be seriously beneficial to curses in PvP and possibly also in HoT PvE.

Question: Is PU condi mesmer actually viable in other gamemodes?

Bhawb.7408:

We get that Shouts suck for PvE and other professions got better PvE. Not everything can be great in PvE, and in this case they addressed a major issue we had in PvP/WvW, and a major issue we had been asking for. Gyros are cool, Shouts are also cool.

The only thing we should be salty about Scrapper is the fact that Adaptive Armor is better, and “different situations” doesn’t matter, they have the same type of traiting that would make ours too good, and the fact that Superspeed is another mechanic that is an irremovable, not possible to counterplay, counter to a heavy mechanic of Necro: soft CC.

I’m afraid of how much daze a Scrapper has. Necromancer is very vulnerable to interrupt spam.

Guild Wars 2 likes to subvert mmo sterotypes by making things like D/D ele, which, in the hands of an experienced ele, is very fun to use. Staff ele actually does pull up some of the best dps for PvE. In WvW, Staff ele is vital for water fields and D/D ele is great for skirmishes. However, Scepter, the single-target burst weapon of ele, is not quite at the glass cannon nuke that is expected.
If you want something that uses scepters and staves to do bursty damage, Ele is really the only option, because on Mesmer and Necomancer, Scepter/Staff are the primary condi weapons.

BobbyT.7192:

They both are mid range none projectiles weapons, that’s got to have some value right?

It’s like cake icing without the cake. Like if you wrote, “Happy Birthday Friend!” on an empty plate.

Lynnie.7213:

Kodama.6453:

Tim.6450:

Lynnie.7213:

What i am most mad at scrapper and others specializations and ofc Anet because they did it, is that they are trying to kill condition builds slowly.
Berserkers can remove 3 conditions every 4 seconds if they play it right.
Scrappers now can remove 2 conditions every 3 seconds …

No condition build will kill them once everyone learn their classes, unless the player sucks.

Oh don’t you worry engineer is cursed with double kit and elixer S will always be strong contender so I’m not worried about the gyro. The hammer on the other hand, …. .

I do share your sentiment with the condition hate in this game though.

You guys realize that there will be a gyroscope for this? Kill the gyroscope, no condi clean. It’s simple.

Yeah, kill the gyro and its done. But as the dev said: “they’ll have a good amount of health” and get even stronger via others skills and traits, like aoe protection.
On a power build you probably can kill that fast enough, on a condition build depending on its sustain, i don’t know …
And that trait -20% condition damage taken … lool

That trait is gross. It’s like perma protection, but against condis.

Misguided.5139:

This isn’t GW1 and things are balanced differently. Adding condition transfer to Shiro would be a problem, IMO.

It would have to be lightweight, because a condition transfer on any attack is very powerful. Maybe it would be 1 or 2 conditions on a 5 or 10 second icd, because Impossible Odds is a very expensive upkeep.

Lynnie.7213:

I think only things we reapers are in need now is a rework or buff on scepter and axe. Because with reaper line the majority of our problems got solved.

A scepter rework would be nice for condi reaper, i felt it was really weak in last BWE. I mostly camp staff and Shroud.

What you guys think?

I had the same problem! It was like, “I don’t remember scepter sucking so much. Is this what it is like to have a good shroud for condis?”

I will trust him when we get good scepter/axe changes, a buff to offhand dagger/focus/staff, and a solid specialization when the game launches. As long as everything is in the air, I’ll withhold my trust.

Run a transfer, and, as always, you will have a sad engi.

I hate it when we take 3 steps forward and 2 steps back. Please nothing else like this.

I believe in being productive when I’m roaming by myself or with 1 or 2 other people, so while I frequently engage in fights against bold people, I also make an effort to steal camps and towers whenever possible. I’m being a positive influence on the map AND I get to have fun in difficult 1v1-2 scenarios (I’m a necro, so more than two is generally ending in me being cc’ed to death). Of course, this is in T1, so I have to be sneaky and aloof, because it only takes 1 scout to be crushed by 30 people. Still quite doable, of course.

Very strong 1v1, but not a dps spec. I don’t recommend it for PvE.

How many of these threads have popped up in the last week? It think we have the Necromancer equivalent of a riot right here…

I float around the forums, and I agree with you. The necromancer forum has the most well-behaved members out of the profession forums. Even in our darkest hours, we aren’t too terribly hostile (maybe that’s why they’ve taken so long to buff us?).

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Cecilia.5179:

So I took a look at the damage numbers for Chilling Nova on a condi spec. It definitely won’t be breaking a diamond skin. The trait that is supposed to be great for the condi chill spec is not that great for a condi chill spec…

It wouldn’t break Diamond Skin anyway, because it’s a condition.

I was talking about the sigil of fire style on proc damage they boosted and how it doesn’t do anything for the condi specs who were probably the only ones even using Chilling Nova.

Karl McLain.5604:

Hey all,
here’s some other changes that happened today.

note: There was a bit of feedback that the auto-attack wasn’t up to snuff. We took a look today and decided that it was quite the case, being that damage on this weapon set is more localized onto the auto-attack.
Staff Strike: Increased damage by 5%.
Staff Bash: Increased damage by 18%.
Punishing Strikes: Increased damage by 20% per attack. Added a missile reflect skill fact.
Hook Strike: Increased damage by ~250%. note: The damage is still on the lower side for the weapon, but now deals more than practically zero. This ability is intended to set up high damage combos through crowd control, thus we’re trying to keep the damage lower than other from-stealth abilities.

Weakening Charge: This ability is now targeted, with the animation being cleaned up a bit. Distance traveled is slightly less, to increase the ease of landing multiple hits on a target. Reduced aftercast slightly (120ms).

Debilitating Arc: Included an evade fact. This ability continues to evade from the start of the ability.

Impaling Lotus: Removed the hidden initiative cost.

EDIT FOR BOLD!!!!!!

psst, you should remove that fun little part where dodging with Impaling Lotus will almost always reveal you if you are in combat.

A good D/P thief is satan for a Necromancer. They can blind all of the must-land skills, and they always interrupt the heal. D/P is probably the best thief has to offer in wvw.

So I took a look at the damage numbers for Chilling Nova on a condi spec. It definitely won’t be breaking a diamond skin. The trait that is supposed to be great for the condi chill spec is not that great for a condi chill spec…

I was using Curses over Spite during the beta weekend, and I was doing just fine. I don’t think Spite will be mandatory, but I’d really like to see PoC become a minor trait.

I feel like the devs treat a weakness to conditions like it’s the same as a weakness to kiting builds. Unfortunately, that is very wrong. Being weak to conditions means that you’re basically helpless against half of the damage spectrum. Just as an example, there aren’t any classes who are helpless against power builds. It just wouldn’t be acceptable. Imagine how bad ele would be against power if they removed all of the ele’s protection. People would riot. Conditions are not a secondary aspect of a build. They should not be treated like mobility or CC. All classes deserve decent options to combat condis.

Thief is not the worst class; however, it isn’t close to being the best either. People calling for thief nerfs are overreacting to a learning curve. Thief needs to be moved in a positive direction to regain some of the distinction it has lost.

I don’t know if I could handle scpeter buffs and Reaper at the same time. It would be too awesome.

Scepter and staff can’t go completely extinct as long as we have usable condition builds. Offhand dagger and warhorn are decent offhands, but the dagger could really use some adjustments, as it is just too slow.

So, Chilling Nova is now Sigil of Fire + Sigil of Ice in terms of what it does… The buff to damage probably doesn’t do enough to make a difference on a rabid condi spec, but if it let us break diamond skin, that would be amazing. The problem with Chilling Nova is that it feels extremely random. I’m not sure, but does it compete with Sigils and traits for the on critical proc? If so, it competes with Sigil of torment and barbed precision.

babazhook.6805:

Cecilia.5179:

Ballerina Thief is probably the most nonsensical condition build right now. I seriously doubt that there is a worse spec intended for condis.

Well it obviously beyond your ken. The build can be made to work, it not as easy as some other builds but the OP did not ask for an easy build.

The DB evade needs fixing to be sure and the build will be much better with the DD spec but it hardly as bad even in its current start than you proclaim.

Is it a thing in the thief forums where you are automatically assumed to suck at the game if you find something to be lackluster? You will be hard pressed to do anything impressive with death blossom spam against things that don’t stand still. I can’t think of any weapon on any other class that wants you to use a condition build, but brings almost nothing that makes it worthwhile for it. The closest thing I can think of is Earth Attunement on ele, but ele gets fire attunement on the same spec, so earth is just defensive. You’d be much better off using p/d for condis on thief.

It has a very high Sodium Chloride content, so it dissolves in water. It is still with you; in spirit, at least.
Hope this helped

Usually, I don’t get over 15 stacks on someone who dodges my slow scepter and dagger attacks, but I’m generally trying to do other things, especially when I was using Reaper.

Shiki.7148:

Cecilia.5179:

If they tuned up the passive on Signet of Undeath to 1% lf per second, I couldn’t see myself not using it. That’s like having a healing signet that can’t be affected by poison.

They’d need to , like, half both casttime and cooldown aswell.

The active effect is completely useless 1v1, but the passive lf regen has the potential to make Necro impossible to break.

If they tuned up the passive on Signet of Undeath to 1% lf per second, I couldn’t see myself not using it. That’s like having a healing signet that can’t be affected by poison.