First I’d like to think John and the rest of dev team for their response and apparent behind the scenes work they’ve been doing for the ranger profession. I like many other players completely understand that not very update is going to contain changes for everyone. However it is very disheartening to go two weeks with no positive change while everyone else has gotten something. It’s like Christmas when Santa forgets your coal or present.
And to my fellow players while this is a move in the right direction, I’d like to point out that there will always be haters that won’t be satisfied until they’re the big cheese. And we also don’t know for timeline for when to expect this update. The coming weeks? Thanksgiving?(was that celebrated in GW1?) Maybe as late as Wintersday?
And now we wait for the follow through.
We’re not out of the storm yet. I’m not giving Anet my trust back yet. I’m am however giving them the chance. And now only time will tell.
Anet just save your self the effort and remove Rangers from the game and forums.
Stop giving us false hopes of updates and let us move on to other classes/other non-Anet games.
~~Very disgruntled Ranger who is now rolling a Charr S/P Thief.
Anet just save your self the effort and remove Rangers from the game and forums.
Stop giving us false hopes of updates and let us move on to other classes/other non-Anet games.
~~Very disgruntled Ranger who is now rolling a Charr S/P Thief.
Anet just save your self the effort and remove Rangers from the game and forums.
Stop giving us false hopes of updates and let us move on to other classes/other non-Anet games.
~~Very disgruntled Ranger who is now rolling a Charr S/P Thief.
Anet just save your self the effort and remove Rangers from the game and forums.
Stop giving us false hopes of updates and let us move on to other classes/other non-Anet games.
~~Very disgruntled Ranger who is now rolling a Charr S/P Thief.
We haven’t even gotten any updates since our “animation fix” weeks ago. All while everyone else is getting fixed/balanced.
I read somewhere on another thread about someone suggesting that the Ranger class be given access to a staff to enhance the woodsman/warden/druid feel of the class. I thought this was an interesting idea so this is my take on it.
Staff, a hybrid martial/magical weapon that focuses on far-reaching melee strikes and cc.
1: Swing>Evasive Swing>Enfeebling Jab Range: 180 3rd strike causes1s of Weakness
Basic attack that functions like the Greatsword.
2: Lightning Strike: Range: 600 Cast: 3/4s Recharge 15s.
Strike target and nearby foes, causing weakness and cripple.
3: Encroaching Earth: Instant Cast version of Churning Earth w/o the bleed.
4: Whirling Strike Range: 180
Basically Whirling Defense but w/o the vulnerability.
5: Ankle Sweep: Range: 180 Cast: 1/2s Recharge 25s
Knocks down enemies hit. Pet gains fury. If hit from behind causes daze.
Edelweiss and Rizzy, you both make valid points.
1) Most of the OP’s original suggestion is just a general anti-burst strategy. The current meta is all about bursts to kill and bunkers to survive, it’s why you don’t see many pressure/condition builds around. Common sense for those that lack it. Not really thief specific.
2) Again, most of the traits mentioned aren’t really designed to counter leaves. They are just more anti-burst abilities.
3) With the new graphics and animations, many skills have distinct giveaways that alert you to what’s about to hit you in the face. However, I have to agree with Edelweiss on this one since in anything other than a 1v1, there’s going to be too much going on to notice one character that’s not your target, let alone their sounds.
4) This one too I also have to agree with Edelweiss. As long as the thief didn’t blow all his CDs and initiative, he can easily stealth and disappear.
5) This one goes to Rizzy and the OP. If you can survive the initial attack, and get a thief to reveal, then imo, the worst is over. Snares to slow him down and AoE for damage and even just area denial are going to keep you alive, or at least waste more of the thief’s time.
6) For this one, I think each of you are half-right. Edelweiss is correct that bunker builds probably won’t have enough damage to decisively hurt a thief so that they die or run. However, back-stab/CnD thieves are pretty predictable, so random AAing where they are expected to be should reveal them.
7) This one I’m inclined to agree with Edelweiss. changing something as major as weapon sets, just to counter 1/8 of the professions is extreme.
@Levetty
SILENCE!!
If Anet takes that away, then there would truly be nothing left in ranger class for me.
Perhaps pets should deal a very small amount of damage when attacking but give some sort of buff to you or nearby allies whenever it uses its auto-attack, much like how rampage as one gives 1 might every time your pet attacks, but that’s all they should do on their own. Each pet should also give its own buff for auto-attacking.
In addition, all passive benefits, along with access to the F2 skill, should be disabled upon your pet getting knocked out. This would make pets a strategically important target if you are fighting a ranger.
If we add both of these to Sdric’s suggestion I’d be perfectly content with it.
Really nice suggestion. Just as a sampler, Drakes give their master a chance to cause a condition aligned with their element, Bears might give 1s of Proteciton, Birds fury….etc. Really, interesting idea. In addition, I think that more, if not all of our weapon skills be designed to work in conjunction with our pets like Hilt Bash and Pounce.
How so? I think it would be too niche to be worth it.
Sorry if this was answered before, I wasn’t able to find it.
But is CnD>Steal combo that teleports you into melee for CnD’s cloak attack a bug?
Or is stealing one of those instant abilities that can be used mid-action? I checked the wiki, and didn’t find any mention there.
Either way, do people out there think this is a fair combo? Especially when traited with mug and comboed with back stab?
Many people complain about a thiefs ability to one-shot single character from stealth, would many thieves, good thieves, be hurt if they took out that bit of functionality?
On the topic of terrain and obstructed, I was playing my thief and I was getting the same message while standing on an ankle high ledge 900 units away. The best part about it is that they were able to hit me normally anyway I wasn’t even unreachable to them.
I don’t think this is a ranger specific problem. It just so happens that our “best” weapon was affected by it raher frequently.
Slow down the pet to compensate? Slow enough that even someone on swiftness can just out run your pet? I use the trait that gives pets extra 30% run speed and they have a hard time chasing down targets to even get into striking range and you want to slow them down some more?
What you’re indirectly asking for is for pets to ignore range because it’s physically impossible to chase down something like a thief if you nerf run speed and also for a different set of numbers for the pet’s DPS. Instead of getting 2k, miss, miss, miss, you’ll get 200, 200, 200, 200, 200 etc while the pet damage it’s not really going up.
What the OP said cannot be avoided. You have a bot as part of your class and you want the bot to never miss. It’s not going to happen.
You make a fair point, I forgot that the other professions have very easy access to speed buffs. However, using your numbers, going from a 1/4 chance for 2k dmg to a guaranteed chance to get 200 dmg is 60% drop in raw attack power over a given amount of time.
My point is that, like the SB fiasco, total dps is controlled by many factors, so heavy handed changes like Anet and your proposed changes have to be taken with care.
Also if you’re playing melee, for example great sword, you can use pet swapping to bypass the movement issues. Combine a canine’s knockdown or a spider’s stun , along with your own skills, lets you snare most opponents long enough to do some dmg
If pets out putted more damage, by being able to apply consistent dmg on the move, then our weapons wouldn’t be in such need for a dmg buff because our pets pick up the slack.
If anyone still thinks giving rangers a partial aim bot would boost rangers from the depths of the underpowered to the peaks of the FOTM, then how about a rng system where pet accuracy is determined by their precision stat?
And onto the topic of “bots,” can other summons attack on the move? For example: illusions, undead, or spirit weapons? If they can, then why aren’t rangers the same?
To be honest,I have yet to play any class other than ranger extensively, but is the damage of other summons comparable to a pet? What about their attack speed? What I am saying is if the disposable pets of other professions are so effective, why aren’t the permanent pets, in which rangers have a fair portion of their dmg delegated to, comparable if not better?
I just started my Charr thief which was collecting dust since start up, always wanted an Ash Legion assassin, and I got to say the AoE from the thief shortbow is pretty fun to play with in PvE. I will admit the short range, slower speed, and initiative reliance take a while to get used to, it is surprisingly fun, and I don’t have to worry about getting beatdown by a nerf because:
a) it’s not the dagger CnD or Backstab build,
and
b) I’m not spamming one button like Ranger SB and Heartseeker Thieves.
To be exact, I’m spamming 4>2>2>2 .
I don’t see why pets can’t attack on the move as long as their damage, attack or movement speed is reduced to compensate…
I also don’t want to see something like your pet aura implemented because that is pretty close to just stowing your pet for a stat buff.
Instead of taking the easy way out of swapping your pet for buffs, Anet should man up and start fixing bugs, instead balancing and promoting the game as an esport.
Q: What is a "bunker"? Is it only certain classes and builds, or is it an Engineer item?
in PvP
Posted by: ChillyChinaman.6057
Can someone elaborate on this ranger bunker I here often enough about?
I can assume it revolves around GS for the passive evade on 1 and 12s of invulnerability from “Protect Me” and Stone Signet, but what about attributes?
I don’t need a full build break down, but some toughness/health numbers would be appreciated.
Currently I’m running with this:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fMAQNBhOD7koisgLswvCWLDErHEa/D6VIWuHjCV+H;TgAA1CtosxYjwGrNObk2A
Just wondering what happens to other “summons?” Like necromancer minions or spirit weapons? Do they persist? If they do, then for the sake of consistency they’d have to do the same for other professions.
On the internet I usually go by Chilly Chinaman
So, I rolled as Chilly Canthan….
They way I deal with thieves as a GS ranger is to use counter-attack after the initial hit. The knockback will interrupt their chain and then you can use hilt-bash and zephyr’s speed to hit them with your pet and quickness.
Thanks for all the responses and advice!
Currently in the process of testing out this build:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fMAQNBhODbkoKwuwyyi1SQseQI9MougvA3jRhK/XhTmA;TgAA1Cto2yslYL7WutkbB
By your definitions, it should be a fairly survivable build. ~3500 power, 27k armor, and 24k health.
At this point I’m not playing ranger for damage any ankittenrying the bunker root before I roll a guardian for the first time.
Good guide for pvp newbies. As you pointed condition removal is probably the hardest one to get. I play ranger and although we have quite a few options, most of them are reliable enough for whatever reason, cooldown, pet or cast time.
Thanks for the response, I’m actually well acquainted with the terms themselves, I was just wondering how they fit into the GW2 landscape. So from your post, 3k+ damage can be considered high with around 20k health being normal? I’ve heard people posting about how they run around with 16k health and have no idea how they survive, if they do. Then thief, ele, and guardian health starts out at only about 11k.
You hear the term glass cannon being used a lot, but what exactly does it mean?
Is there a range of numbers for attack/armor/health that qualifies one for being a glass cannon?
As an example, I play as a GS ranger with 3352 attack, 2030 armor, and 20372 health.
Am I a glass cannon? I also run a trap build with stats around 2600/2300/2200. Is the a glass cannon build?
And then in contrast, what exactly is a tanky/bunker build?
Okay, I actually went into each thread and counted the number of bugs, and the results are as follows:
Mesmer: 30
Guardian: 45
Engineer: 64
Ranger: 67
Warrior: 70
Necromancer: 81
Elementalist: 95
Thief: Not organized into a single updated post, will come back with data.
So as it turns out, warriors are actually one of the more bugged classes upon further inspection.
Taking the majority of these forums and saying its the entire ranger community is a terrible idea. People only come on these forums to say something negative. Look at every classes forum, they all have a ridiculous amount of negativity. The people who are skilled are generally in the game being skilled. Enjoying the class. There is nothing wrong with ranger, there is definitely something wrong with you(the negative community).
Ummm…Hello? Yeah, you might have missed my post, so I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt. but the other professions are not as negative as the ranger community nor are there as many complaints. On average the other professions had as of last night 5 complaint threads on the first page of 26 threads. Guess how many are on the Ranger page? 20/26. So I guess that the majority of the rangers out there, you know the the 2nd most played class after 2 weeks of release, are all bad players. Or maybe, they have some game breaking bugs that should’ve have been fixed before the dev team started, “balancing” the game.
Sorry to double post, but I forgot to add this:
Here is the number of bugs(by number of posts in their bug thread) of each profession:
Warrior: 30
Engineer: 146
Elementalist: 166
Thief: 190
Ranger: 202
Mesmer: 220
Guardian: 258
Necromancer: 570
A few things stand out here:
-Necromancers have almost three times the average of the other classes number of bugs.
-Warriors have 1/5 the bugs as the next least bugged class.
What this says:
-Assuming that Anet does plan on fixing these bugs, forget class balance, it seems that they have been unfairly prioritizing Warriors. This results in power skewing toward that profession since it is working closer to 100% as intended.
-Necromancers have the biggest reason to complain. However, only 6/26 first page threads are about Necro specific complaints. This is in contrast to Rangers who have 20/26 being complaints.
For the other professsions:
Elementalist: 7/26
Engineer: 7/26
Guardian: 1/26
Mesmer: 4/26
Thief: 6/26
Warrior: 3/26
Sorry to double post, but I forgot to add this:
Here is the number of bugs(by number of posts in their bug thread) of each profession:
Warrior: 30
Engineer: 146
Elementalist: 166
Thief: 190
Ranger: 202
Mesmer: 220
Guardian: 258
Necromancer: 570
A few things stand out here:
-Necromancers have almost three times the average of the other classes number of bugs.
-Warriors have 1/5 the bugs as the next least bugged class.
What this says:
-Assuming that Anet does plan on fixing these bugs, forget class balance, it seems that they have been unfairly prioritizing Warriors. This results in power skewing toward that profession since it is working closer to 100% as intended.
-Necromancers have the biggest reason to complain. However, only 6/26 first page threads are about Necro specific complaints. This is in contrast to Rangers who have 20/26 being complaints.
For the other professsions:
Elementalist: 7/26
Engineer: 7/26
Guardian: 1/26
Mesmer: 4/26
Thief: 6/26
Warrior: 3/26
My ranger was only missing it’s legendary at this point but since there has been no update nor have we received any news from Anet, I started a warrior tonight. I will play it until I find another game with another company that may treat its player base a little better.
And the day this happens, the people of the world will lay down their weapons and join hands in peace and brotherhood.
Seriously, I’ve gamed for the majority of my childhood, and I sorry to say I know of no such game or company. Company are about turning a profit first, pleasing their fans second. If they could make money without keeping us happy and make it easier on themselves, they would do it in a heartbeat. Once you’ve paid your money you’re nothing to them, unless it’s a monthly subscription game, I’ve never played one of those.
At this point, I’m waiting for the mods to do a mass shutdown of the Ranger subforum since most of the threads are complaining about one aspect of how we’re broken or another. Would be funny to log in and see the page empty and whine free. It’d be funnier to see how long that would last. To see if any cared enough at that point to post again.
In closing, as you can all see I’m in a crappy mood and am venting whining on the internet.
@Ryoki Hokishami
First off, I did say that I only made this because I was bored…..
Shielded by the anonymity of the internet I felt like doing someting, “trolly”
Shoot me for it.
Secondly, it’s not so much that these problems are unfixable, on the contrary, I personally believe that with enough time, effort, and willpower, anything can be accomplished. However, from what we have seen the past week with how the dev team handled the public backlash, they aren’t going to make any changes. To rehash the old sentiments, they unintentionally reduced the effectiveness of our main weapon, and then retroactively claim it was an intended nerf to correct an “error” in play style that was more of a problem with the skill design.
And finally, why do you care if people are complaining in these threads? If they bother you so much, don’t read them. Better yet, don’t dignify their existence by posting in them. People want to feel like their voice has meaning and power, especially when the class they want to enjoy lacks such meaning and power, and one way to do that is by voicing their opinion to the world.
Now I don’t believe Anet really pays attention to these forums, but I helps my ego and dang it I don’t really care what other people think.
Good night, to you all and I hope you all enjoy the game, whatever class you may play. FYI I just rolled rolled an Ash Legion Thief and an Asuran Mesmer. Trying to figure out which one to play. Leaning mesmer at the moment.
@Laef
Not to detract from the awesome victory too much, but I have to say that the other team was probably trash…….I’ve got the feeling that the ranger class is good before too. Win a few games, score good points, I even carried my team to victory and became the MVP a couple times.
Then they’re those other games. The games where you’re spiked to death, or ganked, or spawn-camped.
The sad thing is that it’s more of the latter than the former, especially after the patch. Pre-patch, at least we could burst someone down every 15-60s depending on your traits. Now, I think the only thing rangers can do well is tank and conditions. And let’s be honest, they’re are better class/profession out there for those roles.
(edited by ChillyChinaman.6057)
I’d like to first state that I’m writing this mostly because I’m bored.
I am well aware that this will most likely be deleted very soon.
Now where to begin…..
Well, It’s been about a week and no changes at all. I think it is safe to say that for the forseeable future the ranger is a done. Anet might as well close to the Ranger forum to save server space and delete all rangers characters and be done with the bot problem, if only until the switch over to something else.
Just as a point of reference, I am PvP rank 8 and actually just came back from what might have been the defeat of the century. My team of 8 lost 63/500 with no one leaving halfway through. It was so bad that I got spawn camped inside my own base for half the game.
Now this doesn’t really have anything to do with rangers in particular, but I finished the game with a measly 10pts while the top scorer on my team was only at 65. All of this just left a really bad taste in my mouth.
In conclusion, yes I know this is very whiny and completely unecessary, and if wasn’t for the other classes, namely thief and mesmer, being pretty fun to play, I would have dropped GW2 for BF3, at least until an expansion or something.
I forgot to post this last night, but after my Orrian GS run, I have to agree that a pet’s tanking ability has SOMETHING to do with their stats.
Used to run 0/25/20/10/15 here.
Ditto for the Hide in Plain Sight/Shared Anguish Combo.
Back when QZ worked, having 2s of quickness every 15s was a nice way to keep the pressure on.
Nowadays I’m testing this for lulz:
0/30/20/20/0
Traits:
Agility Training/Trapper’s Expertise/Trap Potency
Shared Anguish/Martial Mastery
Nature’s Protection/Two-Handed Training
Running with a GS and Axe/horn combo.
My choice of traps are Spike and Flame.
You can get QZ from the 5pt BM minor trait Zephyr’s Speed whenever you swap pets.
Combined with the 15pt minor trait Loud Whistle, you could get 2s of QZ every 15 seconds for a total of 6s of QZ every 60s compared to the 4s QZ from the actual skill.
This doesn’t really help burst ability though. Nor does it help melee pets since they have to take a few seconds to run up to their targets before attacking.
I’m gonna try out a 0BM build tonight and see if I notice any aggro changes in the Strait of Malchor.
After branching out and using other weapons, while not amazing to the levels of some of the other classes we are still playable. Not that I agree with the handling of the SB glitch fix/ retroactive nerf.
As a side note, and I hope this doesn’t get removed for being off topic, but people often cite the Mesmer as being the best 1v1 class. Whole certainly powerful, I don’t think they’re dominating that well in that field. Can anyone explain this to me?
QZ=Quickening Zephyr=Quickness
Is 15 points really that deep though? It’s only halfway down the tree.
To put it in perspective, I ran with the following stats:
0/25/20/10/15
I mean if people used QZ as much as they seem to on the other SB thread, why wouldn’t they want half a QZ with a quarter the cooldown?
Just chiming in, back when I rolled short bow, I ran with 15 BM for QZ and pet swap reduction. I didn’t face any tanking problems until I hit Orr mainly in the Strait of Malchor.
That makes a lot more sense…..3 stacks at 1700 malice will let you hit for…..1155 per skill. And if you’re running torch too then I guess you don’t need the trap.
Someone should fix the wiki page for Pain Inverter since it only says it does 1 stack.
I know it’s no comparison, but I tried out the GS against Utahein, Svanir and the Keep Guards in the Heart of the Mists, it actually wasn’t that bad……the only catch is that you have to build the rest of your skillset around it.
By that I mean, using traps for the combos and speccing for the sword traits.
Xsorus how do you have almost 1100 dmg confusion? Multiple stacks?
In sPvP the max malice you can get is about 1400.
That equals about 340 dmg per skill
Meanwhile burning does continuous 678 dmg/s
That’s almost twice the damage at all times.
I know that you can go much higher in PvE and WvW, but you’d need about 6400 malice to have 1100 dmg from a single stack of confusion.
I will admit the two skills work in different ways.
Pain Inverter works like daze, it prevents you from attacking, unless you want to take damage.
On the other hand, Flame Trap works more as area denial.
Oh and as a final note, I usually run with about 1300 malice and that equals:
~100 bleed per stack
~200 poison
~650 burn
Really? Better than Flame Trap?
At the very least, FT has half the cooldown.
At the lowest, Pain Inverter does 397 damage per attack absorbed vs 328 damage /s of the trap
Pretty close. The trap is also AoE.
Just my 2 cents.
No it overrides the other wasting your cool down.
@Lobo
To infinity and beyond!!
Rangers still do nominal damage no? They can take that.
We still apply conditions right? Not anymore.
We can still move right?
We can still log in right?
In all seriousness though. The rangers are still a PLAYABLE class, ie can and does exist in the game. I play pvp and I can get in a couple kills, even in dueling 1v1 situations. So unless I have the good fortune of only playing against complete idiots. The class still works.
However, there is almost always a more efficient alternative to a ranger. Ranged DPS? Rifles. Spiking? Thieves. Tanking? Eles and Guardians. Rangers are severely the jack of all trades, master of none syndrome. It’s a shame we don’t/barely have the jack of all trades part.
Get use to it. It’s the “ranger tax”
In all seriousness though, I think most of the ranger’s “panic button” type escapes are intended to allow us to weather the storm as opposed to slip away unscathed.
For me, I use the following:
Nature’s Protection – Protection when spiked.
Hide in Plain Sight – Stealth when CCed. Really useful and has actually saved me from a down a few times. Just be careful of channels and aoe.
If you want to avoid damage, I can suggest the following.
Lightning Reflexes – Standard stun break with the added benefit of Vigor.
Natural Vigor – More endurance=more dodge= less damage.
I play(ed) ranger because I also rolled a ranger in GW1, like to play archer/gunner type characters in other games, play a sniper in FPS. I also like the idea of “controlling” to characters in tandem.
Too bad most other classes outdo us at range and pet’s only work 50% of the time.
PvE is still fun outside of the dungeons though. The downside is that I’m a PvP player.
Are you talking about total crit damage % or additional? Because I think I once got my ranger 50% crit damage + the 50% base for double damage crits.