Guild Wars 2

RWinter.1680:

Attack is a fairly useless number, better to look simply at power. So it’s a decent enough rough number, but doesn’t really indicate anything, and is never used in any calculations.

This is because “attack” is the maximum weapon strength of the equipped weapon plus the character’s power, but all damage calculations use the weapon strength multiplied by the character’s power.

Although true that attack isn’t directly used, that does not make it a useless number. It’s a figure of merit used at the very least to quickly compare builds.

No? Max is 100%? I’m sure someone will yell at me if I’m wrong but that’s what I recall. I’m pretty sure N.V. does not stack with food either.

Note about the wiki page: vigor is 100% and natural vigor is 50% so it’s still a good boon to get.

About the youtube comments: a few people seemed to think it stacks. I would test it if I wasn’t feeling lazy. I’m looking forward to learning the answer.

That’s about the highest I’ve gotten it using valkryie and the food that gives +200 power on kill. Ascended is zerk/valkryie mix (bahg nakh). I think I may have been slightly higher I cannot recall and I’d have to double check. But I do not recall breaking 5000.

Ranger in 1v1 can often be lethal. As fights scale, rangers strengths begin to shine less for a variety of reasons (dominance of CC, pet death to aoe). There are many positives though. I am working on relying on brown bear for condi removal. I think it’s not so bad.

Yeah I think we’re seeing them revamping the tooltip system still. We thought it would be done on the 15th but it appears they only made the GUI and framework. When they get it right, it will be awesome. Like stooperdale said, as they tweak it, we’ll see weird numbers until they finally get done cleaning up under the hood.

I am also sad. Yet, shortbow remains hilariously strong.

Yeah, the art and animations are consistently amazing. At least we got back items fixed, right? Right? Because everyone is using mainhand axe, right???? Haha

Seriously though, you’re right. For all the complaining about bloodlust, gvg, how fun or lame point capture mode is, has there been a single criticism about the new terrain on the borderlands? It’s darn near perfect to me.

Well, I think I do fairly well roaming—if I choose one of maybe two or three builds. If there’s a problem, it’s the reliance on conditions, regeneration, or pet damage. If there is shaving in the future, adjustments to conditions or immobilize will have a detrimental effect on my K/D. Zerker or power type builds are viable but if and only if the ranger can create space and gaps. It is difficult to have the same K/D with zerker as with the other aforementioned builds. But blowing someone up with zerker ranger feels fun and almost trollish. So that’s a good thing.

So as far as roaming goes, this patch didn’t affect that (yet, unless a bunch of nasty new meta appears like the perma 25 stack confusion thief build). I have a high K/D rate roaming (counting fair fights) and I sometimes win battles I shouldn’t through skill. I have lost to stronger players (sometimes through rock, paper, scissors builds, other times through being outplayed). These professions include mesmers, guardians, thieves, warriors, engineers, and elementalists. I generally do not lose to necros. I always defeat rangers.

So, from that perspective, balance appears to be improving. I just wish bug fixes came at a faster rate (which was my big gripe yesterday).

I just read on another forum that engies have a list of over 20 bugs with turrets. I guess I shouldn’t be so demanding about bug fixes considering there’s a lot of them to fix on various professions. Engies get the same kind of thing we do: “fixes” listed in patch notes and then bugs live.

I feel like patch notes are a vision of where devs want the game to be, not actually where it is. There’s a schedule and they release live what they have when it’s due. Patch notes are likely just a summary of intended upcoming features that may or may not have been implemented right on patch day.

Interpretting it this way is much better and makes me not want to gripe anymore. Maybe prysin was right. After all, none of my specs really change. I was just really bummed that the tooltips were still broken. Oh well, maybe next time.

Well, to be honest, Ryan.8367, that’s not a terrible idea for a build. I’ve attempted similar things. What makes it (in theory) strong in tpvp is that you can pressure a point with the drake and ranged weapons. In practice, it’s a decent build that just doesn’t have some of the extra gas or control of builds I usually play in tpvp and wvw.

I would love for that build to work though. Imagine something like that where you use companion’s might and basically buff your pet through crits. I have found that, in his version, it’s lack if control makes it weak (this is rooted in the choice of signets) such that it’s ineffective. This is a mid range build you sort of peel with. If they close the gap (as warriors so often do) you might find yourself in trouble. Most thieves will pick you apart.

I would love to see that build. Anyways, thanks for baiting me into another post. I will see you guys later!

HugoCosta.6735:

All you are QQing for nothing, the ranger is great! You guys don’t know how to play with the profession, so you start QQ’ing for every patch, stop crying and go to learn how the skill work make your own build, test it if not ok, try again until you like it.

Skady is right, posting here is clearly a waste of time. I’ll see you guys on the flip side.

Definitely the highlight of the patch haha so funny you managed to pull it off

No…Ision….Min/max dungeon comps benefit from A ranger. Spotter and frost spirit traited cannot be matched. It’s unique buffs only ranger can provide. Indeed, I am not joking: ranger is awesome in dungeons. It’s very hard to play, you eat a lot of aggro and inexperienced players will die with sword. Experienced players will die with sword occassionally. But thats how you have to play. The difficulty needs toned down but it’s very solid. We need aoe stability for some fractals but who knows if anet will give that to us. But that’s about my only gripe there.

The issues are all pvp related. Wvw and tpvp. There are only two builds that work: spirits build or immobilize condi build. People claim zerker ranger works but it does not except in some very situational niches. Beastmaster ranger was nerfed too heavily in june to rely on.

Asudementio.8526:

Chopps.5047:

Kaon.7192:

Chopps.5047:

You still steal a 15s water field from rangers. Ranger’s own water field is only 10s now. Please, consider things like that before carrying on too much guys.

Not sure where you’re pulling this 15s number from, because the stolen water field lasts 5 seconds. Please, consider this before pretending to know what you’re talking about.

(Not that this is even relevant to the discussion, I just can’t stand such blatant misinformation.)

Source: I asked this question to a twitch streamer (docMed) “is it more than 10s?” And he responded “5s”. I interpreted that answer as 10s + 5s. It’s not blatant misinformation just a misunderstanding. Why don’t you just relax hmmmm, I have 80s but not thief yet.

Then don’t speak as an authority or at least double check your information beforing stirring kitten up.

Clearly you don’t understand what a misunderstanding is. I’m sorry life is so complicated for you. Also, who said I’m an authority? My signature says “Ranger Extraordinare”. I know reading is hard, I won’t get on your case too badly.

Prysin.8542:

i like dis patch. because i expected far less.

you people never learn. EXPECT TO GET NERFED, THEN ANYTHING ELSE IS A BUFF.

ANET sold us on tooltip fixes and bug fixes and they failed to deliver. Regardless of the balance discussion, they failed to deliver on what was supposed to be this months big feature. So I can’t really have any expectations. ANET has a pattern of not following through so, prysin, I love you man, but how can you defend ANET on this? Vigorous training doesn’t even work. :/

zabriel.4852:

I am an engineer. I feel your pain to a certain extent. We are close on the charts of broken classes. Just wanted to ask. Were rangers at beta better than rangers now? I was talking with my Ranger friend and he says Rangers were so much better during the beta weekends. Just want to hear your taughts to that.

/salute to all you Rangers!

Hmm lets see…

Greatsword was ~ 3x stronger, shortbow shot faster, we got quickness on pet swap for 5 in BM, and our pets did roughly twice the damage.

Kaon.7192:

Chopps.5047:

You still steal a 15s water field from rangers. Ranger’s own water field is only 10s now. Please, consider things like that before carrying on too much guys.

Not sure where you’re pulling this 15s number from, because the stolen water field lasts 5 seconds. Please, consider this before pretending to know what you’re talking about.

(Not that this is even relevant to the discussion, I just can’t stand such blatant misinformation.)

Source: I asked this question to a twitch streamer (docMed) “is it more than 10s?” And he responded “5s”. I interpreted that answer as 10s + 5s. It’s not blatant misinformation just a misunderstanding. Why don’t you just relax hmmmm, I have 80s but not thief yet.

A true jack of all trades casts aoe stability.

>with 50% condi duration + trait (+200% for trap conditions total)

You used 50% condition duration AND the trait, Indoles? Wait a second. You should be able to use 0% condition duration and the trait and get 200% total. Trap potency is supposed to double trap duration. Unless the tooltip has been wrong for the entirety of the game?

You still steal a 15s water field from rangers. Ranger’s own water field is only 10s now. Please, consider things like that before carrying on too much guys.

Confirmed: thieves steal a 15s water field from ranger according to docMed’s twitch stream. haha that’s pretty funny.

Tricare.2946:

My favorite part is, we got a 4 second reveal.

They got a blast finisher on blinding powder, so all they have to do is steal from us drop the healing spring and get a nice 2-3k heal plus condition removal and stealth.

Is that water field (healing seed) a full 15s duration? lol I bet it is based on our luck today

ilr.9675:

Chopps.5047:

Why are you apologizing to me? lol I’m honestly confused

B/c this….
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/Sic-em-cannot-be-dodged/first#post3022260
was complete sarcasm that I probably didn’t make clear enough the first time…

Oh, haha I was making a joke there. Revealed in that sentence was a stupid pun. I was just kidding, sounds like we’re talking passed each other. Like that never happens on forums haha

ilr.9675:

kitten nic Touch.7960:

Yay for stealth nerfs.

Totally called it… (sorry Chopps!)

Why are you apologizing to me? lol I’m honestly confused

boondocksaint.6529:

Hello and GL in WvW. First thing to realize is that there is no dedicated healing/support play style. You are still expected to keep yourself alive and bring some sort of damage or control to the table. Guardian is about as close as you can get to heal/support but they can still pack a punch.

First thing I would do is learn about blast finishers, the previous posters have talked about them, so learn how they function. If you are on a server that uses TS jump on and follow the commander and watch when and why he calls for water fields. Also check the class forums for specific builds.

As for the 3 classes you listed here is briefly what I know about them playing support.

Warrior: Shout healer, brings good offense and healing to zerg, banners are also a good option. Shouts are getting buffed today as well.

Ranger: Has a really great water field and support pets if you can keep them alive. Spirits are getting a health boost so maybe they will be viable in WvW as well.

Thief: Mostly through blind and AoE stealth. I am not sure the best way to play support as a thief in a zerg, they seem to fit better in small fights and skirmishes.

Health boost does not apply in wvw, sadly.

Regarding OPs question, in theory, ranger’s have good traits for healing but in practice they are clunky and underwhelming. Healer’s celerity is decent, I guess, but would be better if it applied stealth to the ranger upon resurrection. The spirit elite, of course, is good for this, and trapper’s defense has some potential. Obviously, search and rescue. In reality, ranger could be a medic type profession, or played that way.

In practice, thieves, I think, are really good. They can lay shadow refuge and safely get people out of danger.

As far as guardians go, they are very good as well and I often see them doing a great job. But usually they are busy on the front lines making sure warriors have boon duration and stability among other things. So I’d say the best healers in practice are thieves and to a much lesser extent rangers.

Substance E.4852:

Chopps.5047:

Kolisch.4691:

Spike trap no longer immobilizes?

I believe it immobilizes when you use trap potency but trappers defense does not ever immobilize for some reason according to the tooltip. Or is the tooltip incorrect? This is one I meant to point out earlier but forgot, thanks for reminding me.

Trapper’s Expertise adds the immobilize effect to Spike Trap.

What about the skirmishing adept trait Trappers Defense?

The Mexican Cookie.3690:

What does Brazil have to do with that video? Am I Brazil now?

Apparently not

LMFAO YES!!!! Hahaha I love you

Holland.9351:

Chopps.5047:

Ryan.8367:

I like how with every other class, PvE also includes WvW , but for rangers it doesn’t. We also always usually get nerfed in PvE/WvW based on dominating PvP builds too. Classy anet, real classy.

Rangers always get all the drawbacks of having a pet but few of the benefits. If a reader thinks this is baseless QQ, go play ranger for a month or two. You’ll start to see what I mean. I completely agree with you, Ryan.

You’re completely right Chopps. The go-to-phrase seems to be “but the Ranger has a pet”. Besides that, I’m starting to worry your account was hacked.

Holland, you have been throwing me random jabs all day. What’s your problem? Did I defeat your warrior in WvW?

I was never a cheerleader or a fan boi. I was always a reasonable player. And all I point out are reasonable bugs and proposals for reasonable changes. Do you take issue with that? Or do you just not like the way I write?

Awesome write up, xsorus. Excellent points. I really make the same gameplay decisions for the same reasons.

Ryan.8367:

I like how with every other class, PvE also includes WvW , but for rangers it doesn’t. We also always usually get nerfed in PvE/WvW based on dominating PvP builds too. Classy anet, real classy.

Rangers always get all the drawbacks of having a pet but few of the benefits. If a reader thinks this is baseless QQ, go play ranger for a month or two. You’ll start to see what I mean. I completely agree with you, Ryan.

Kolisch.4691:

Spike trap no longer immobilizes?

I believe it immobilizes when you use trap potency but trappers defense does not ever immobilize for some reason according to the tooltip. Or is the tooltip incorrect? This is one I meant to point out earlier but forgot, thanks for reminding me.

Serraphin Storm.2369:

baseballguy.4865:

“Protect me” prevent capture point contribution what is this

All skills that allow invulnerability are suppose to prevent you from capturing. The same with stealth.

“Protect Me” isn’t a true invulnerability. Here’s why:

You’re in combat, suddenly you notice the pet took damage and you need to swap. So you swap, fine.

Pet swap cooldown is now up but now you’re getting focused and you trigger protect me. Pet dies. Now you still have a few seconds of being extremely vulnerable before you can swap.

Just my opinion though.

Any chance that chaos storm trick works on lupi? Will I see a sub 10s lupi video using this ability? ofc its a bug and will get patched. Would be funny to watch though.

No griffon. Why?

1) it does not fly. Birds don’t fly. They “hover”. If they could fly they could scale wvw walls.

2) weak pet idea. Basilisk is much much better (stun ray)

I don’t care about looks. I want powerful, functional pets.

ilr.9675:

talk about Anet missing the point….

I can speedrun AC, COE & Arah any day of the week and still keep all but Birds up in the dungeons already. It’s WvW and dungeon TRAPS where the pets died instantly and were completely worthless.

Yep, they’re quite literally 6 months behind on this one. No one has seriously complained about pets in dungeons since the meta shifted to drakes, moas, and devourers.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Rangers get giant buffs and everyone whines. Sounds about right.

I was about to log off until I read this. Honestly the pet HP buff only affects rangers in a few pve encounters. It really does, you can’t argue that it doesn’t. And it doesn’t even carry over to wvw (meaning shouts like protect me are still extremely underwhelming). In addition, vigorous training is broken, entangle is broken (only lasts 5 s), tooltips are broken, and sic em still overrides pet utilities.

Not to mention the healing spring changes (including vigorous renewal).

Anet has a lot of work to do, no doubt. And how you can say this is whining is beyond me. We paid a premium to play a AAA title that’s seeing no progress on year old bugs and frustrating issues with the profession.

I’m a follower of yours guanglai, but I politely disagree here about baseless whining. This is far from it.

Ya this is just a massively multiplayer online letdown. Maybe anet will figure it out someday. We can hope. Until then, I’ll see you guys. Been fun testing tonight but I feel like it came up quite a bit short. Gotta head out for today!

Stooperdale.3560:

I play thief and ranger. It baffles me when rangers go into paranoia that thieves who previous backstabbed them are now going to root and confuse as well to rule PvP. It just isn’t going to happen any more than rangers are going to use Sic ’em to eat every thief alive. Thieves got a downgrade this patch. Rangers got an upgrade. No need for petty class jealousy.

It’s not really petty jealousy. It’s reasonable expectations that year old bugs would be fixed and new abilities would be added. Sic Em had a low impact because everyone knew it was coming. But at the end of the day, it’s hard to blame this on “class jealousy”. ANET messed up, simple as that.

This was suspected recently in forums and now confirmed.

Source: dulfy and reddit:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/1oj3yo/pet_health_boost_71_does_not_apply_in_wvw/

Trap potency tooltip is incorrect **

Ya, I can’t even agree with you here Frostfang, sorry. It’s looking awfully disappointing.

ilr.9675:

Why would you run Bird in any group instance?

Even FernWolf makes more sense despite what a joke I find its “healing” to be.
Fury or Protection and especially Stalker might stacks just makes so much more sense…

Chill / burst—it all depends (I used snow owl against liadri…snow owl got off burst and died but at least it chilled, did some damage and well, did something. I beat her in less than a dozen tries so I had to be doing something right)

On a stationary boss it might be good in a party with lots of fury already

That being said, birds are highest burst ranger has access to. The reason is because they hit twice in a row.

Stalker is probably a good option though for sure

I like devourers in places where pets normally die (big aoe and stuff). Somehow they manage to live, it’s pretty decent.

If I’m playing with a lot of ele’s I like to bring drakes because there’s normally fields everywhere.

I dunno, I switch it up

If it does it’s not noticeable. I was testing today and saw little difference in performance.

I suppose dungeons will be a bit easier to use birds with

but thats the only good thing :/

Wayfinder.8452:

I hope someone actually does playtest rangers.

They play test rangers @ _ @

By the way, do you know where Companion’s Defense is?

Boomstin.3460:

That’s it Chopps! Keep fighting the good fight!

+1

lol good one

Many have said it before, so I’ll just recap: the issue with “Sic Em” is that it functions too much like a signet. yes, reveal, I know. But it should also buff allies in some meaningful way. For example, maybe it should also grant allies might stacks and fury.

The same goes for “Protect Me”. The pet health buff wasn’t enough for it to be worthwhile, really. The pet cooldown timer on swap and typical low pet health really negates it’s usefulness, although the stun break is sort of okay. The issue is that the way people chain stuns, one stun break doesn’t make a huge difference if you don’t have some other kind of escape handy. Realistically, “Protect Me” should grant aoe stability, regeneration, protection, and vigor for the ranger, pet and allies.

Changes like these would make shouts a lot more interesting.

Sic Em should be a normal shout that affects the pet and allies: allies should get fury and might stacks from it or something. The shouts act too much like weak versions of signets. Now, I get what you’re saying about how good reveal can be. I’m just saying, the shouts don’t function very well right now.

Realistically, Protect Me should give AoE stability and regeneration as well as clear 1 condition from allies. Stuff like that would make shouts a lot better and gameplay a lot more fun.

Right now rangers are bland in terms of utilities. The potential is there but the dev team failed to deliver on this patch. I give it a D+ for the inattention to detail and neglect of bug fixes.

Thief can apply 25 stack confusion pretty easily and repeated CC on a 3 second cooldown now:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/1oic60/thieferis_the_snare_king_thief_proof_of_concept/

Just a massive letdown