Guild Wars 2

Everyone keeps saying that players who crave challenge are the minority even though there are no hard facts to support this. The complainers are always the most vocal.

However, even if we are the minority let me ask you this;

How much of GuildWars 2 content is challenging? The minority?

Croatoan.8426:

^ What he said and I am one of those people posting. And my guildies live,breath, and eat dungeons for 8 hours straight… They won’t even run with me unless I am running my 80 everytime I ask I get an ehh answer but ANYWAY pro dungeon team that is use to running together agrees they messed up AC and far as I know my guild now refuses to run it. They tried it,said it was easy,rage quit 10 mins later. So all the people that say this dungeon is to hard to be “ENJOYABLE” are bad? And I find it hard to belive you find groups so quickly… New people tend not to know what to eat,how to trait,and what stats to stack on so they get a insta kick so I have to agree with Aegis on that one because 98% of the time the good groups will “BOOM” you because they want you to help there group not the whole group help you.. If you have had a good experince I hope you have a 1000 more but everyones point of view is differnt and people have different “expectations” of what a dungeon should be.

So your pro guild team rage quits a dungeon after 10 minutes and calls it too hard? You are just proving my point for me.

I didn’t call anyone bad. I didn’t call anyone anything, I will say this though, there are groups completing this dungeon, there are groups not using all 80’s completing this dungeon and there are groups having fun doing it.

You may have different expectations of what a dungeon should be, and I say it sounds like you already have those dungeons in explorer mode. If you want better gear you can still get that through crafting or other means.

You have easier content yet you still ask to make the harder content easier. Why should all of the content be geared towards players who want it easier? Or people that rage quit after 10 minutes because they don’t they don’t want to learn something new?

Well it shouldn’t. And at least right now Anet agrees.

lcpdragonslayer.7895:

The only things I’ve been complaining about AC are the bugs, like in path 3; Grast not summoning bubbles or summoning bubbles after the rocks have fallen. I’ve never spoken on behalf of a new player or anything.

Having said that, you should also understand that while you are a new player, you are not necessarily representative of all new players. I’m a regular ACer and FotMer, and I purposely stress in gw2lfg.com that all first timers and people still getting their bearings around these dungeons are welcome in my party. I want to guide people through dungeons so that everyone gets to give it a go, not just the elitists. As such I usually get at least two first-timers because of my open attitude.

The thing is, you and the parties that didn’t ragequit were willing to keep trying even after numerous wipes. You were willing to step back after a couple of failed tries and go “Okay, this strategy isn’t working guys – should we try something else?” and your party was very adaptable. And this is a sign of a really great party even if it was a PuG.

The new players I run with are not like you. They’re so used to facerolling in their PvE, running around killing everything so easily. They’re not used to dying. They’re not used to seeing repair bills that actually cost in silvers, not coppers. They’re used to doing whatever they like in PvE because it’s not as challenging of an environment, so they run on ahead and get themselves killed even though the other party members said to wait. They’re used to doing things on their own in PvE so they don’t bother resurrecting people until they’re the only one standing, and then they come to the forums and go “I’m a new level 35 but my whole party died and I survived – what’s with all this elitist attitudes when I’m clearly better?”

Don’t get me wrong. I think it’s awesome that you had such a great dungeon experience and I hope that there are others who are equally keen to give dungeons a go. But do understand that just because you are one new player who has enjoyed doing what you do doesn’t mean that every single new player will find dungeons just as fun.

That’s my point. It is about attitude. It has nothing to do with being new, or being casual or even being experienced.

It is about knowing what you are getting yourself into, we are trying explorer mode here, you should at least know this is the harder version of the dungeon, you are going to die, level 80’s die.

It shouldn’t be as easy as leveling outside of dungeons. If explorer dungeons were the same thing as open world leveling, what would be the point?

These new players that you are speaking with that can’t handle dying because they are used to face-rolling the rest of the PvE content, should we make the dungeons as easy as the rest of the content for these players?

You are right, I am a certain type of new player that is up to the challenge. I’m not a better player, I’m not a more skilled player, I’m just ready to fight tooth and nail for the prestige of completing the more challenging content.

I find that fun, I find the trail and error, the problem solving fun. I enjoy the team work it takes to see your party mate fall and rush to his side because you need him for the rest of the fight. You don’t see someone die and keeping hitting 1 like people do in the big group events. You get that guy up because even though you all may have just met, you are now part of a cohesive team that needs each other to survive.

You’re not holding hands, skipping down the path and picking daises. That’s for when you are sight seeing vistas and collecting points of interest on the world map.

In a dungeon, you’re trudging through the mud, slipping in each others blood, gritting your teeth and trying your best to make it look like a grin.

I’m not telling you you have to like what I like, and the Dev’s are not telling you that you have to do what I do. There is plenty stress free content out there that will earn you equivalent rewards.

But I don’t think it is right that you are asking the Dev’s to put daisies in my trench because because you think it stinks.

I mean think about it people, on the world map you’re earning hearts, in AC I’m collecting the tears of my enemies…

Levistis.8356:

We (I’m one of the people in Maestros dungeon group) must handicap ourselves because if we do not, people will claim we are not legitimate, and we agreed to it willingly, accepting the challenge. I personally have no issue, but I hope there is not something else that will be added on; like we used utilities to our advantage and that doesn’t count etc etc.

I agree with you though.

Yes and I understood why you were doing it and I support the challenge, obviously you are players like me who enjoy a challenge.

I just wanted to make a point to the people who were dictating the stipulations of the challenge to you that they are indeed creating an under dog challenge, not the typical or average scenario.

As to players under 60 getting kicked from AC exp, I did it with my level 44-45 the day of the changes, so people didn’t quite know what they were getting themselves into.

Although I am not sure what server you are on, I am on Tarnished Coast and people seem more then willing to handi cap their group in order to include me on their runs.

I do agree their are some valid complaints about rumblus, although I did try him before you could interrupt his boulder shout.

There is a lot of luck dependent on if the npc will preform or not and because one mistake = wipe it can be a frustrating event. That being said I don’t think it’s hard, I think it can be tedious, which IMO is worse. So I think that event should be looked at again.

The npc bugs need to be fixed, but that isn’t what is being complained about here. But that is part of the problem I mentioned, most of the people complaining are not being specific, they are just saying it is too hard.

Sounds to me most of them tried one run and then came to the forums.

I guess as a new player I expected to have to put more effort in to succeed so I did, and I did.

Also, ask me anything. If you want to know how I felt about a specific encounter, or specific mechanics, I’m happy to share my experience.

I keep hearing players say that “new players are going to quit because of this..”, or “what type of game experience is this for a new player?”

Well please ask me while I am still new, because from what I see on this forum, many of you forget what it is like to be a new player, and we don’t need or want to be babied as much as you think we do.

Dungeoning in GuildWars 2 compared to world leveling was an intense experience that required me to follow direction, be on my toes and use my skills, or hit the floor.

I did a few runs after that, and let me tell you, not all of them were successful. Thing is level 80’s or not, I could call the ones that were not going to go well after the first few pulls. It was the ones with out leadership, with out co-operation.

As soon as the group pulls that group of gravelings in the trap hall and no one singles a focus target, right there I know the chances of us making it through this dungeon just halved.

After patch, no a whole lot changed to be honest. There was more trial and error because of the little changes, I was about level 43-44 at the time, same gear though, I had stopped buying it at this point because I was paying repair bills, lol.

The groups that had one or two good leaders and the rest following directions made it through, and the ones that didn’t quit and gave up after 3 or 4 wipes.

Here is an important point though. The amount of wipes didn’t really change, the only thing that changed was the unorganized groups giving up.

The first group I went with post patch wiped 4 times on Kholer before we figured out we couldn’t just ignore the adds anymore. No one said a negative word. We problem solved it, made a battle plan for the next go, repaired up and went to it.

So here is my point. As a NEW player, and LOW level player, I’ve been having a blast figuring these dungeons out.

To the people saying that new or low level groups can’t do it, you’re wrong. Anytime a fresh group steps into a new dungeon, they need to expect they will wipe at least 3 or 4 times on each major encounter. That is what dungeons have always been. The fights and mechanics are learned through trail and error, through death.

So yes, if you take a brand new group which is at the minimum level for the dungeon they will die a lot until they learn it. And then guess what, they are now experienced, lol.

That being said, if that is not your cup of tea, there is really no reason to go into any dungeon in this game with a fresh group if you don’t want to. There are always 80’s looking for groups, or making groups themselves.

Stop whining the dungeons are hard, step up to the challenge! People are doing them right? Me! I’ve done them! This guy who has been playing for 3 weeks and doesn’t have a single max level character.

New doesn’t matter, casual.. doesn’t matter. You need to use your skills and if you don’t have those skills, you need to practice the ones you have until they are the ones you need, and if you are unwilling to do that, then you are undeserving of the rewards doing so would gain you.

Well I decided to finally write this, I was going to keep quiet but then I keep reading through these AC threads and I am starting to think that a lot of people are speaking for us ‘new players’ that are not new players at all.

It also seems like players defending the changes to AC are being asked to be very technical, very specific and are asked to follow very strict guidelines when supplying evidence to support their claims and the same is not being asked of the players who are against the changes.

Those against the changes are throwing around multiple terms like, ‘new player’, ‘casual player’, ‘average group’ with no real definition for these terms or constancy in their context.

If you care to read on I will share with you the experience and perspective of a brand new GuildWars 2 player.

My previous game experience includes World of Warcraft (Vanilla to Wrath of the LichKing), before that I played Asheron’s Call (Vanilla for about 3 years.). Recently I have played Diablo III and League of Legends.

I started GuildWars 2 about 3 weeks or so ago now. I played all the classes except engineer and ranger till about 20 before deciding to stick to my Mesmer who is now level 62 with 2 crafting professions maxed. So that should tell you I don’t have a whole lot of experience.

My first experience with AC was pre-patch explorer mode because no one was running story mode. I was between 36 and 38. I had mis-match gear stat wise because I was just putting on whatever I thought was better. I did figure out real quick though that I could sell the blues I didn’t want on the trading post and buy greens that I did want for mere coppers. So it wasn’t hard even has a brand new player to have gear appropriate for my level. I traited and skilled whatever I wanted.

My first run was with 2 level 80’s, and the rest of us were in our 30’s. (( Let me just say right here that this experiment that Meastro is running with all 35’s is cool and interesting, but this far into the game there is no reason any group wouldn’t have a couple of 80’s. I think I would actually have a harder time building a group with out including level 80’s. So while I understand Meastro is trying to prove a point, and I respect that, he is handicapping himself because that is far from the typical or average group.))

I explained to the group right away this was my first ever dungeon run, the two 80’s took the lead explaining the content for me. Every pull was explained before it happened.

I was told how to assist targeted mobs, I jumped where they jumped, I went where they went I targeted what they targeted. I still died a lot. I died every time Kholer spun and pulled me in with out exception. We continued on, we got through it and I learned a whole hell of a lot, but I had fun.

(Continued)

Thanks a lot, this was really helpful and I appreciate the time you took to help out a new player. I’ll take a look at your phantasum build and your leveling guide right away.

I’m leveling a Mesmer, currently level 15, I am wondering if it is viable to level a little bit more tanky. I see build posts about ‘bunker’ and ‘immortal’ and it leads me to believe we can get a little more tanky if we want.

I also went into the chaos traits first.

I am wondering if I start choosing vitality and toughness over power, if I will suffer greatly or if it is viable. Obviously I will do less damage, but will the tankiness net for longer sustained damage?

Please tell me your thoughts.

I’ll have to try it again then, I really hope it is fixed, but this problem was only occurring on isolated computers.

Mine worked fine right way, my girlfriends did not. I’ll go there after work again today and try it out.

Yes please do. It is quite frustrating.

So I made sure the Java was updated on my girlfriends comp. I don’t know if that has anything to do with this launcher but I figured it couldn’t hurt. That had no effect.

This is not a router issue So don’t let them tell you that. I had my girlfriend unplug the router in her home and go directly through her modem and we got the same result.

The first initial download, and then when the splash screen comes up for the second time it sits at zero for about 1 second then disappears with out an error message or anything.

I didn’t have time tonight to create a test report in order to create a ticket which I will. I just can’t understand what is causing this on her computer and not on mine.

I also turned her windows fire wall back on after my other tests failed and I would like to point out that the program does not even ask permission from the fire wall before it disappears. I had to ‘allow’ two separate times for mine to go through the fire wall, this doesn’t even ask permission. I don’t know how relevant this is considering it doesn’t work if the fire wall is up or down.

Thanks for your reply. Is your flash player fully updated? That is one thing I have not tested yet.

Are you using a router or are you connected directly to your modem? If not, try directly connecting to your modem and let me know if that does anything.

I also remember that her flash player was asking for an update, I’m thinking this might be another factor in the problem. My client has a minimize button and everything, hers had none of that, and the ‘X’ button didn’t work, I would have to task manager it to close it.

I don’t know. I’m her boyfriend, I just did the same thing on my computer. The big difference is that after the first splash screen disapears you get the big red ‘Install Guild Wars’ button.

That never happens with hers as it is just sitting at zero. So you never get to pick an install folder or anything. On hers the .dat file is getting bigger, but on mine it is installing in a whole different folder selected by the installer.

I don’t understand what the difference could be, we are running the same OS (Windows 7). I even have my fire wall up and it asked me for permission, I had to ‘click’ allow. Her firewall is disabled.

I guess my only option at this point is to download the whole thing on my rig and copy it over to hers, but I am still not sure how to get the thing to actually ‘install’ once the files are there.