Guild Wars 2

Allie Murdock.8152:

You guys should hop into the Ranger CDI and say this stuff. Most of the Rangers feel that pets are actually not very helpful. It’s interesting how the feedback differs so greatly between this thread and that one!

Allie, this is a total troll post. Bearbow is the GW2 equivalent of the term ‘huntard’ from WoW.

Fluffball.8307:

Prysin.8542:

A good tip, is to use sword against NPC’s with oneshot/heavy burst abilities. Because these abilities are generally super telegraphed, and as such, you get more time to learn the timing of when you can and when you cannot dodge.

There is some other NPC’s you can train yourself on. Like giant wurms (especially the one in WvW Borderlands) as the stone it throws is very well telegraphed, and easy to dodge. Yet you will not get one-shot by it.

I’ll toss out ettins as the perfect enemy to learn the sword with. They have several really big, telegraphed attacks. Especially the AoE knockdown one they do is perfect for floating like a butterfly, stinging like a hornet. It’s not at all dissimilar to dodging a warrior with a hammer or an ele with churning earth.

You can also fight the Warrior NPC in the mists and if you want something a bit tougher, try the Svanir beasts.

I would be interested to see some of the more adept theorycrafters compare a min/maxed Sword build (probably 30/25/0/15/0) to a min/maxed GS build (25/25/0/20/0) that has both Spotter and talented Frost Spirit.

Death and Taxes players on GW2Guru have pretty much agreed that Sw/W is higher DPS than Greatsword, but I haven’t seen all the details behind that consensus.

Chrispy: I see your point about scaling, but there’s still a big difference between the stats of a ranger by themself and a ranger using full food buffs, stacked bloodlust, and in a group that can keep 25x might, fury, banners, etc. up. Also, Hunter’s Call or Bonfire should probably be taken into since they will increase the DPS of a sword-user.

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

Dahkeus.8243:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Dahkeus.8243:

Dude, you really didn’t need to necro your post.

No one plays Diamond Skin.

There’s really no point in mucking up all this conversation all over again.

Diamond Skin was a badly designed trait. We get it. However, it’s a trait in a terrible spot on the talent tree and it’s on a profession that’s in a terrible spot in sPvP, so it doesn’t matter.

They could delete this talent from the game and it wouldn’t make an ounce of difference.

Right now, but as ele gets buffed this trait could easily become a major problem. And if you haven’t played as a necro or engi vs a diamond skin ele then you wouldn’t understand just how much it makes you want to quit the game.

So…you’re saying it’s a good idea to bump a 3+ month old thread because you think that this trait that’s 30 points into the Earth tree will be overpowered after the ele gets some as of yet unspecified buffs from a balance patch that we know almost nothing about?

These forums are filled with threads beating dead horses. We really don’t need another dragged out of the graveyard right now.

It’s actually one of the most important things that have to change in this game: hardcounters. It’s not fun to play against and it doesn’t promote skillfull play. It doesn’t matter if it is overpowered or not.
So I don’t get why you bring up a sentence like “we really don’t need another thread dragged out of the graveyard”.

Poor balance is one of the top reasons why this game died pvp-wise. Why ignore it?

Because no one uses Diamond Skin. If you want to argue balance, then argue the skills that are breaking balance. Otherwise, we might as well start up threads about why we don’t like the design of something like Back Fighting.

Besides, the point about Diamond Skin being a bad design has been made…

over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.

The point about Diamond Skin was made. Diamond Skin is not causing any problems in the current meta. There’s no reason to keep making the same complaints that were all made months ago.

skullmount.1758:

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ll go into more detail soon, just to re-iterate so it’s clear:

“The next round of major features will be bundled together into a large “feature only” release that will come after the first season of the Living World 2014 has finished.”

A feature release is not an expansion, it’s a release focused on game features. Examples of game features we’ve done in the past would be: guild missions, account achievement system, spectator mode, new pvp maps, daily world boss chests, removing culling and giving visibility options, the WvW WxP system, etc.

Still no actual examples of stuff we will get? Nothings done/nearly done enough to give us some kind of taste of whats going to be in the feature build?

What about the maintenance patch next Tuesday, any info on that one?

Yea, I wish we would hear something, but I get the impression that things are a bit behind schedule right now and I’m guessing that they’re still not sure what they can have ready by next Tues or are at least nor prepared to release as much as they initially expected.

If that’s the case, I’m fine with it, but I kinda wish we could get a bit more insight.

I applaud GW2 for being better than most games out there in terms of offering non-sex object armors for female characters, but I would definitely like to see more.

My female norn ranger is using a combination of the WvW chest, Duelist pants/boots, Leather gloves, and Rawhide shoulders, which I’m pretty happy with. I’d post a pic, but I’m at work and don’t have access to the game.

Narcin Roc.3018:

really… all these legitimate bugs and issues on these forums, and THIS is the thread we see a response to… i give up

The dev just asked for additional needed info. This isn’t exactly the kind of thing that’s needed on an issue that’s well documented and reported by multiple sources.

The problem’s not as much an issue with people not running DPS builds as it is that certain classes (warrior) can run DPS builds while also being incredibly tanky.

If I were dev for a day, I’d nerfbat warrior DPS and boost their stun/CC capabilities. This would keep them viable as team players that could set up burst or shut down enemies for a burn without being a bunker and DPS rolled into one.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Dahkeus.8243:

Dude, you really didn’t need to necro your post.

No one plays Diamond Skin.

There’s really no point in mucking up all this conversation all over again.

Diamond Skin was a badly designed trait. We get it. However, it’s a trait in a terrible spot on the talent tree and it’s on a profession that’s in a terrible spot in sPvP, so it doesn’t matter.

They could delete this talent from the game and it wouldn’t make an ounce of difference.

Right now, but as ele gets buffed this trait could easily become a major problem. And if you haven’t played as a necro or engi vs a diamond skin ele then you wouldn’t understand just how much it makes you want to quit the game.

So…you’re saying it’s a good idea to bump a 3+ month old thread because you think that this trait that’s 30 points into the Earth tree will be overpowered after the ele gets some as of yet unspecified buffs from a balance patch that we know almost nothing about?

These forums are filled with threads beating dead horses. We really don’t need another dragged out of the graveyard right now.

Dude, you really didn’t need to necro your post.

No one plays Diamond Skin.

There’s really no point in mucking up all this conversation all over again.

Diamond Skin was a badly designed trait. We get it. However, it’s a trait in a terrible spot on the talent tree and it’s on a profession that’s in a terrible spot in sPvP, so it doesn’t matter.

They could delete this talent from the game and it wouldn’t make an ounce of difference.

HolySylent.8160:

We all do. If the AA was interruptable, and maybe pets dodged with you, I’d be content with ranger.

^ Agreed 100%.

@ OP: The only way to really stop the mechanic of the sword mid-animation to dodge is by weapon swapping.

Yes, this does mean that Ranger is the only class in the game that needs to weapon swap to dodge during the bread-and-butter #1 attack.

bri.2359:

Ranger GS is so disappointing, particularly in PvE, because it is primarily a defensive weapon.

Take a GS on any other class that uses one (guardian, warrior, mesmer, etc) and then try ranger GS again. You will want to salvage it afterwards. I stopped using a GS on my ranger over a year ago .

Sword/xx is the only viable PvE melee option for rangers.

I actually like Ranger GS skill design better than the Guardian GS. If the Ranger GS actually did DPS close to the Guardian GS, it would be my clear favorite.

Also, if I was a ANet dev, I would make the GS a higher DPS weapon than the 1h sword since the 1h sword gives so much open utility by allowing the player to mix it with the offhand of their choice. Also, I’m generally not a big fan of a weapon being able to give max DPS with the auto attack alone.

@ OP: Awesome constructive post that raises some good points.

Personally, I would be ok if professions were a bit more restricted in terms of what their range of strengths could be. I.e. if guardians were always very tanky, but never as high dps and if necros always had high condition damage, but never had high power, etc. However, the I don’t think many people are as open to having professions as restricted to niche roles as I am. Also, this would probably cause huge issues for PvE. =P

geist.3980:

spirits are bad. the % is all luck on your part and your guaranteed nothing for the cost of the traits and skill slot….well almost nothing, I guarantee the spirits following you will die in aoe or from bouncing weapons long before your opponent does.

The top DPS PvE spec endorsed by Death and Taxes uses Frost Spirit.

The top sPvP build is a spirit build, which uses spirits in all utility slots as well as for the elite.

The mechanics of spirits can be frustrating, especially in PvE since spirits die so easily, but you don’t really have a leg to stand on if you want to say that they are “bad”.

Yea, sword is the clear winner in PvE.

Sword advantages over GS:
– Higher DPS
– Scales better with quickness since DPS is entirely from auto attack
– Stacks might on pet
– Allows ranger to keep up Fury (warhorn + red moa)
– Flexible utility due to ability to swap offhand
– Active evade
– Isn’t reliant on condition damage to make up DPS
– Poison counters enemy healing

GS advantages over Sword:
– Passive evade from auto attack
– Projectile block
– No wonky mechanics that prevent dodge rolls
– Stun
– Better gap closer
– Larger cleave
– Slightly better burst due to maul

The GS isn’t without it’s advantages, but those unfortunately advantages rarely really matter in most PvE situations. Even in PvP, the sword often pulls ahead due to the combat mobility, poison, and flexibility with the choice of offhand.

Moshari.8570:

Warrior fastests in PVE, Thief fastest in WvW. Theif can do both but will need help in Orr and frostgorge. Warrior can do both but you will have to run with the zerg or take your chances in WvW.

Got map complete on my thief and I have no idea where in Orr you think a thief may need ‘help’. Since there’s no heart quests, you can just run past stuff and anything difficult to kill can just be stealthed past.

Profession doesn’t make much difference for map complete, but thief is definitely the easiest since you can stealth and grab so much stuff without having to tangle with mobs.

For example: Stealthing to get the skill point guarded by the champion mob in Orr.

That thread is a clusterkitten of misinformation, but considering how bad the grammar is, I’m not surprised.

The bottom line, however, is that condition builds are still hindered in effectiveness against targets that have conditions maxed against them:

When a target has 25 stacks of bleeding, no other bleeds stack on top to deal damage until one of the 25 falls off. You may be able to fit in a bleed as one rolls off and see bleeding damage against a 25 stacked target, but that doesn’t mean that all your bleeds are applying normally.

When a target has 25 stacks of vulnerability, the vulnerability of that target cannot be increased any further. If every player could still stack vuln, even when a target had 25 stacks, then you could have a group dealing up to 125% increased damage if they all could apply 25 stacks themselves (such as if you had a full engi group or something).

It would be wonderful if conditions weren’t so inherently hindered, but as it stands now, they are. This is why conditions can be great when solo or in PvP, but are so weak in dungeons/large groups.

I think you’re really lacking some direction with this build.

You’re wearing mostly berserker gear, but you’re using a torch, which is almost entirely a condition weapon. You’re also using two condition stat accessories.

I get that you’re stacking crit for the axe, but the axe is also still largely a condition weapon. I know this is more the fault of the design of the weapon than your build itself, but since you have no condition damage, split blade is very weak, particularly if you already have people getting bleeding to 25 stacks in your group.

As others have mentioned, this is a build that will be great on AoE, but pretty lackluster in single target fights and since most of the toughest encounters are single target, it’s hard to get behind taking this direction.

Finally, you’re focusing really kitten precision, but the only place it’s really doing anything out of the ordinary for you is with Honed Axes and that’s just a 10% DPS increase in a best case scenario. I’m not arguing with taking berserker gear, but you may want to take a closer look at your numbers as I doubt Accuracy sigils will outperform something like Force or Sigil of Fire.

I don’t want to rain on your parade on this build and force the meta Sw/W down your throat since I think that meta builds tend to be overhyped for the difficulty level of most dungeons, but you may want to at least consider swapping Axe offhand instead of Torch offhand and swapping out some sigils.

Well, the haters are out in full force, but it seems like they’re only able to find problems with your opponents to complain about, which is a good sign, lol.

Personally, I really enjoyed the vid. PvP from a staff ele is definitely a nice change of pace. Keep up the awesome vids.

I will throw my support in on every thread like this I see.

+1

Dahkeus.8243:

I like stars. Please +1 this post so I can have a star. If you +1 this post enough, I will be happy.

You people are awesome.

Yea…this is just one of the many reasons I hate this zone.

I think they aimed to make Orr be ‘difficult’ content, but they just made it annoying.

I loved the SAB, but I would really rather see other areas of the game fleshed out better: New zones opened, guild halls, new skills, new PvP game modes, new PvP maps, new dungeons, etc.

It’s not exactly something new for someone to over-hype a build. I don’t think everyone needs to get so up in arms over him putting “perfect” in the title. Do a YouTube search for “GW2 Build” and you’ll see more builds with stuff like “BEST” or “PERFECT” or “OP” used in titles for videos showing off builds that are usually pretty mediocre at best.

If you take the teleport, you don’t have to fight through the stuff in LA. If you don’t use this port, you have to fight the Knights to get attuned, then go into a separate section where you fight the hologram. Once that finishes, you can port into the area that the shortcut place takes you.

You don’t really miss a lot of story by skipping forward since all the cutscenes and stuff come afterwards.

I like stars. Please +1 this post so I can have a star. If you +1 this post enough, I will be happy.

For the people who are against housing, what are your thoughts on Guild Halls? (assuming it’s somewhat like the Guild Halls of GW1)

Junkpile.7439:

Why they would waste time that kind of kitten? Idea is play game not sit inside some house. Weird thing is that people are interest some houses. In Russian game allods you could buy own ship and sail on special zones with party. Well system was total kitten, but at least it was more interesting than some housing system.

It really depends on how it’s implemented. If they did something remotely like GW1, then it would be awesome:

In GW1, you had halls that all guild mates could port to. In these halls, you could purchase NPCs to make your hall pretty much like a main town. This really helped build community and was a great place for holding guild meetings.

On top of this, the guild hall served as a map for GvG games, so you could work out strategies in your guild hall for the next patch. The maps were also interesting since they had their own unique set of traps/obstacles. For example, there was a fiery volcano-like hall that had molten lava pits, in others there were spike traps, etc.

Technically, we have player housing now…but it’s just an instanced area that has some nodes you can mine. So yea, if that’s all housing ends up being, then it is lame. However, it can be something great if done right.

EpicBanHammer.7521:

Dahkeus.8243:

Well…if you want to maximize DPS, then you’ll probably want to run the current meta build. Here’s a good guide for that one: http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/84268-the-perfect-dps-ranger-guide-for-real/

However, if you’re new to the class, you may not want something that glassy. If you modify your current build, I would recommend dropping at least Spike Trap for Quickening Zephyr since the condition damage from that trap won’t do much for a power build.

Okay, thanks. The only problem is I want some CC and the cripple was very nice for that. But I guess I can work around that.

Well, if you stick with your current trait investment, you could swap IV in WS for VI (reduce CD of Survival skills), then replace Spike Trap with Muddy Terrain and swap Flame Trap with Quickening Zephyr.

If you’re not investing in a condition build (which is generally pretty weak for PvE anyways), then the flame trap is really only good for being a fire field where a group can use blast finishers on it to stack might. If you’re not using a warhorn offhand (blast finisher on #5), then it’s really not that helpful.

Well…if you want to maximize DPS, then you’ll probably want to run the current meta build. Here’s a good guide for that one: http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/84268-the-perfect-dps-ranger-guide-for-real/

However, if you’re new to the class, you may not want something that glassy. If you modify your current build, I would recommend dropping at least Spike Trap for Quickening Zephyr since the condition damage from that trap won’t do much for a power build.

I agree 100%. Lightning Reflexes has needed to cleanse immobilize since release.

I think in earlier times, they were worried about there being too many escapes, but the state ranger is in now definitely isn’t in danger of being overpowered, particularly since the only strong ranger build in the PvP meta is the spirit build, which generally doesn’t take LR anyways.

Apparently even SWTOR is getting it now.

I’m fine if GW2 doesn’t do individual player housing, but I really wish we could at least have guild halls again. =/

candlecan.9827:

First off, as many have stated already, the initiative buff last patch is the largest factor responsible for thieves causing balance issues.

If I were to change pistol whip this is how I would do it.

Split the skill into 2 parts and invert the order.
Part one: Slash repeatedly with your sword and evade attacks

Part two: Whip the enemy with your pistol stunning them (1/2 second stun)

This ensures that if you want to use the skill offensively, you must actively CC your target before hand. If you want to use your PW defensively for an evade, its still accessible on the first activation of the skill.

Have the skill act just as Flanking Strike/ Larceonous Strike do as well. Once you use the first activation, flip to the second for x amount of seconds. If you use the 2nd skill it rotates back to the first, if you dont you have to wait out the duration until the 1st skill is available again. This helps to negate spamming evade frames.

I think this is the cleanest way to help negate the issues plaguing this skill.

If you split the skill this way, I can’t think of a single reason to ever use the second part. The only reason a 1/2 second stun works on Pistol Whip now is because it immediately chains into a heavy hit. Without this, it’s a tiny stun where you can only really land the first attack of an AA chain. The only real advantage of having a stun this short if you can’t get a burst in is to interrupt, which can already be accomplished at range with Headshot. Either that or they would just use the ability once, then use the second portion and chain immediately into the first step of the skill again to get the effect of the current Pistol Whip.

style.6173:

Azukas.1426:

“Bunker” is pretty much why sPvP is a skilless joke of a game. Bring back GvG and let’s get a real game.

or just go to WvW and GvG all you want. The nice thing is that there is more strategy there since there are a lot more combinations of armor, trinkets, runes, food, etc.

of course, if you haven’t geared a character outside of PvP, this doesn’t apply to you.

GvG in WvW isn’t the GvG he’s talking about. Having two groups of people fight each other in some big open field with only the goal of killing each other is nothing like the GvG in GW1 where there were multiple objectives that often involved splitting your group up to cover several areas.

Durzlla.6295:

Dahkeus.8243:

According to the Wiki, the Attack of Opportunity doesn’t trigger on any interrupt your pet deals, but from what people say here, the lengthened stun/daze duration is applied to what pets deal?

It’s really a shame that they couldn’t just have this apply to the pet 100%. I think it could potentially make a viable sPvP build if you used something like a S/A and longbow while using Wolf/Hyena or something.

No, the trait doesn’t affect your pets interrupts in ANY way, the only reason it works with Boars F2 is because all pigs F2 spawns 1 of 3 environmental weapons (varies on which pig), all the boars weapons apply a CC that benefits from MoC, and since you are picking up the weapon and using the skill it gives you the bonus.

Ahh, ok. That makes sense.

@ Forzani: Yea, the Boar has those, but the Warthog also has the Fear as a possible Forage: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Forage

According to the Wiki, the Attack of Opportunity doesn’t trigger on any interrupt your pet deals, but from what people say here, the lengthened stun/daze duration is applied to what pets deal?

It’s really a shame that they couldn’t just have this apply to the pet 100%. I think it could potentially make a viable sPvP build if you used something like a S/A and longbow while using Wolf/Hyena or something.

nyqwist.2360:

Dahkeus.8243:

Thief seems to be the flavor of the month for the forums to complain about. Some of these complaints are based on legitimate concerns, but there’s also a lot of random complaint threads that are really just riding that wave of dissent with nonsense like this one.

Oh, so you feel like my post was nothing but nonsense? It’s simply the truth, thieves are not even close to as affected by interrupts as the other professions are.

I’m a open minded person, if you’re going to throw out theese kind of things and actually do have some arguments or a bit of reason behind what you’re saying I can change my mind. The problem is that you don’t, at the moment atleast

Ok, here are my arguments:
1) Interrupting a weapon skill isn’t a big deal.
2) Interrupting a HS when a thief is stealthing for 5 seconds would be much, much, much more punishing than just kicking a regular attack skill of another profession for 5 seconds.
3) Reducing the ini pool of a thief is counterplay, even if you wish it was more penalizing than it is.

gesho.9468:

Dahkeus.8243:

Wasting a thief’s initiative is counterplay.

not so much. it’s barely a dent. gameplay (stealth, reset) is essentially intact. interrupts are precious, they are supposed to be one-or-two-per-engagement game changing skills. not so much against thieves.

Interrupts in GW1 were big and important. An interrupt on a heal or stomp can be clutch in GW2, but outside of that, they don’t matter nearly as much as just simply stunning or dazing.

Thief seems to be the flavor of the month for the forums to complain about. Some of these complaints are based on legitimate concerns, but there’s also a lot of random complaint threads that are really just riding that wave of dissent with nonsense like this one.

Going to signal boost this part of Allie’s post since a lot of people are ignoring parts of what she asked for:

Allie Murdock.8152:

Also, try to answer these questions:

• Do you main Thief?
• When do you feel that Pistol Whip is unbalanced? (scenarios would be great)
  • How does it feel unbalanced compared to other class mechanics?
• What would you do to change Pistol Whip to better fit the class/game?

Wasting a thief’s initiative is counterplay.

Playing an ele in sPvP is an uphill battle, but check out the videos by Kkildron. They give a pretty good breakdown of playing staff:

Part 1 – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDX7lo1xtak
Part 2 – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roANj4g0Skc

Evilek.5690:

style.6173:

The issue is that s/p is the OP spec for thief and needs to be nerfed along with the other OP specs including hambow, decap engi, spirit ranger, mm necro, bunker guardian, and pu mesmer.

Timeline

People cry D/D is OP – zero nerf
People cry S/P is OP – nerf 15% DMG now make same DPS as AA chain.(8. 10. 2012)
People cry D/P is OP – zero nerf
People cry S/D is OP – little nerf

Now Arenanet nerf PW stun (paralyze sigil) and People start cry S/P is OP ? Illogical.

The thief is the same as a warrior.Warrior/Thief is anti noobs class and no H/B warrior is not OP only unskilled noobs say “OMG Warrior is so OP !!”

I think you either came around recently or forgot about many of the nerfs to D/D and D/P:

HS’s damage has been nerfed pretty hard (which is ok since it should be a finisher, not a skill to spam).

Stealthing with D/P in SA specs also got nerfed through the Infusion of Shadow nerf.

Headshot also got nerfed a while back.

And S/D as a little nerf? The sword 2 used to break stun and teleport instantly while Larcenous Strike used to steal 2 boons for less initiative. Now the sword 2 doesn’t break stun or even teleport while stunned and #3 steals half as many boons for twice the cost.

The biggest reason people use S/P isn’t because it got some huge buff. Almost nothing has changed for S/P builds in a long, long time. People use it now because the other options thieves used to use got nerfed.

bhagwad.4281:

Dahkeus.8243:

I think it depends a bit on where you’re aiming to bunker. If you’re bunkering mid and assist in team fights a lot, then it’s hard to beat a good Guardian since they have so many tools to cleanse conditions, grant protection, and rez downed allies.

However, if you’re focusing on bunkering a node by yourself, then a bunker engi can be a pretty solid choice since they have so many knockbacks to decap or undo decaps.

Personally, I prefer Guard.

Actually the key to a node bunker is stability uptime – which the engi doesn’t have great access to. As a decap engi myself, I’m very susceptable to knockbacks. Luckily, I just need to get them off the point for 4 seconds which is easy.

Yea, stability is big for bunkers, but I think if you’re strong enough on one aspect of bunker, you can make up for what you lack on another (i.e. how engi knockback can offset lack of stab).

With thief, I don’t think there is enough of any advantage to really offset the lack of stability, knockback, etc.

eleshazar.6902:

I think the problem (as a few others have stated) is simply the design of the class. Since the cool downs on skills are shared, you simply will spam your highest damage dealing skill until you come across a situation where you need the utility of some other skill.

I think this makes balance more difficult, but it doesn’t make it impossible.

D/P, for instance, is probably one of the most well-rounded weaponsets.

When skills are designed like Unload, where the damage comes from a straight button press, then it does promote spamming. However, when you make the damage situational, such as from backstab (requiring stealth), HS (requiring low HP), etc., then it makes gameplay much more engaging and well-rounded.

The problem with Pistol Whip is that the situational condition and damage ability are tied into a single button press (stun → damage).

Reikou.7068:

phys.7689:

problem is theives need a lot one skill, because main and offhand often dont synergize well.
if pistol whip didnt stun, no one would get hit by it, if it doesnt do dmg, no one would use it over AA (to which its already close) if it didnt evade it would essentially kill the user.
and if it sucks, sword pistol doesnt serve much purpose.

If PW didn’t stun, it would be like Blurred Frenzy, and blurred frenzy hits things all the time.

I think the stun can’t be taken out, not only because you would have to rename the skill, but also because it helps distinguish S/P as more of a control weaponset than an evade weaponset like S/D.

This is why I think that making it only a stun, then giving it a blast finish for stealth could work.

I just wanna say that GW2 put together a better love story in a few patches than Twilight did in 4 books. =P

Allie Murdock.8152:

FYI, we don’t think it’s balanced. That’s why we’re still balancing it.

The OP actually makes a good point, though. For this particular feature build, we have not shared much about what’s going on, we get that. Don’t mistake that with we’re not doing much, though.

Thanks for the feedback

Can I ask why everything with the next change has been so hush-hush? We had so much great communication before the Dec 10th patch, it’s kind of a shame to be left in the dark now…

phys.7689:

Evoneva Drakon.1754:

As a ele main, thief second

In my opinion on its own it is not over the top, however when coupled with a few things it becomes way over the top.

Shadowsteps remove the need for positioning or timing

Steal will strip stability if the thief is wise enough to save steal vs some classes.
this means skills like either renewal can’t be safely used without a very high chance of being interrupted.

then coupled with the evasion frames you can see why PW can become a extremely versatile skill,

need to interrupt a heal/skill? PW
to dangerous to stomp a foe? PW
need to stop people rezzing? PW
need a few seconds for heal to come up? PW

problem is theives need a lot one skill, because main and offhand often dont synergize well.
if pistol whip didnt stun, no one would get hit by it, if it doesnt do dmg, no one would use it over AA (to which its already close) if it didnt evade it would essentially kill the user.
and if it sucks, sword pistol doesnt serve much purpose.

^ I think that’s the core of why Pistol Whip is in such a bad spot. It’s really filling the gap created by a lot of skills that just don’t cover what the weaponset needs.

You can’t change Sw #2 without breaking S/D and you can’t change pistol OH skills without breaking D/P. Headshot you could maybe tweak, but it would be tough.

This means that Pistol Whip is the only spot left to address all the shortcomings of S/P.

- I main a thief, for the most part (been playing Guard a lot lately)

- I don’t think that Pistol Whip is as imbalanced as people make it out to be, but it is a rather awkward skill that makes balance inherently problematic.

If I was to redesign the skill, here’s what I would do:
– Pistol whip would only stun with a bit of damage (maybe on par with Slice), but would be a blast finisher.
– Lower ini cost to 4.

This would give Sword a stealth option (blast on blind field) to allow it to be a more control-oriented version of D/P. The burst is lower and the amount of stealth would also be lower since Black Powder -> Heartseeker costs 9 ini total and this would cost 10.

This would take away the DPS increase of Pistol Whip in PvE, but it would give thieves access to a blast finisher that’s not on short bow which would work for groups that aim to stack might