In the end all you need is dodge, ress and auto attack and keep moving. So in large lines I agree with the OP.
But my problem with the combat system is that a lot of bosses just need you to move, dodge and ress and use skill 1 and 6. As much as the OP has a point, it also underlines for me why a number of people find the skill bar uninteresting. Not that all the other skills are pointless or useless….you just really don’t need em. And this means that creating a build isn’t as interesting as it could be.
Have you done Dungoens? Or Solo Champions or Solo group events yourself?
I have, and I can tell you, all the utility skills and weapon skills I have used where all needed because if I didnt use Control/Support skills and do damage while moving and dodging, I would of been dead.
Control skills have saved me a lot, and so have support skills while I was fighting in tight situations. =) It’s exciting when you know what all your skills do and when and how to use them. Specially with weapon swaping in mind since when ur soloing tough fights where you have a huge possibility of dying if not played right, You want to have access to what ever skills you need at the right time and place.
To me, that alone makes the combat exciting.
However, zerging is never fun in my honest opinion. =(
For people like me, I try to avoid them cause they ruin the combat in any games really.
The devs said their going to add custom servers, but they’re going to add matchmaking and rankings first. Or something like that. Go find Xeph’s thread about the live stream. It should have an link to an hour long recording of representatives from the top teams discussing the game with Johnathan Sharp.
Ohhhhhh!!
So they are going to add this feature then?
Can u possible give me a link? =( Im bad at finding stuff
That’s funny, because what you are asking for is exactly what the a duel system would look like.
Not what I mean.
I want it sPvP feature so I can do it with friends however I like.For example:
If I want to do 1 v 1, I can.
If I want to do 2 v 5, I can.
With friends only.I like it to be sPvP because
#1: I enjoy the Maps
#2: I enjoy the fact that we all get max armor, all traits and weapon skills utilities unlocked!But yeah. That’s what im saying.
taylor said the truth.
what u are saying is a part of what can be done with pvt servers
I tried Player Vs Tournament Servers….
It wont let my friend and I to go 1v1.
It auto-groups us till we are full 8/8 team which is what I dont want. =(
Am I doing something wrong?
Any reason why I cant edit my Topic anymore?
I want to bold certain words because Apathy’s feedback but now I cant?
ugh…
That’s funny, because what you are asking for is exactly what the a duel system would look like.
Not what I mean.
I want it sPvP feature so I can do it with friends however I like.
For example:
If I want to do 1 v 1, I can.
If I want to do 2 v 5, I can.
With friends only.
I like it to be sPvP because
#1: I enjoy the Maps
#2: I enjoy the fact that we all get max armor, all traits and weapon skills utilities unlocked!
But yeah. That’s what im saying.
Control isn’t dodging…
Control is snares, walls, stuns, blocks, blind, etc.
I already mentioned some examples of “Control” Skills. =)
The reason Movement and Dodge is Considered “Control” because it helps you stay in Control over the enemy while in combat. The moment you take 1 hit, you lost control. So your goal is to stay in control while dealing Damage at the enemy. Making it difficult for the enemy to attk you while you are dealing Damage.
Also, “Block” is a Support Skill. Not Control. It’s used when you need to support yourself in combat. It doesnt effect the enemy’s movement, or alter it’s attks. It’s best used when you lost control over the fight and you need to quickly use it to “Support” yourself to buy time to think of ur next skill to use that can be under cooldown or what not.
Seriously!
My friend and I both did sPvP and wanted to make our own Private Match and setup our own password so no outsiders can join.
I wanted to 1v1 with my friend.
But this feature still doesnt exist?
I was an Engineer and my friend was a Warrior. We both joined Empty Server Match and had LOTS OF FUN!!! It was just us doing 1v1 until, while we where in the middle of the fight, one or a few random players joined the match and started killing one of us.
Everytime a random player joins the server match that my friend and I are trying to play 1v1 together, we end up leaving to join another empty server match again.
It’s getting annoying how I cant enjoy sPvP 1v1 mode with a friend because this feature doesnt exist yet.
Please ArenaNet, make a feature where we can host our own sPvP matches so we can do 1v1 for fun! I dont care about rewards. PvP itself for me is the reward!
I am Not asking for a "Duel’. Only asking if we can host our own private matches so it can be possible for us to be able to enjoy 1v1 or what ever with friends only. Thanks!
What are other people’s thoughts on this?
Bumping this thread so people can actually see it’s existant. lol
There are no Tank Roles or Healer Roles.
I have wrote an artical regarding the Combat System and Mechanics.
I recomend you guys to check it out:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/players/GW2-Combat-system-101/first#post896756
I’m really glad this helps you out.
=) I might update it though cause I feel as some information is missing. But this is the Basic Core of the combat system.
It’s really fun! Specially when you are doing Dungoens with a good Team.
Hello Joote!
I have wrote a forum Post for new players to help them get indepth in Combat System of the game.
I would recomend you check it out:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/players/GW2-Combat-system-101/first#post892295
Also, I’m a huge fan of Angry Joe myself. His very fun and entertaining when he reviews good and bad games. Movies too lately lol.
If tanking is viable, arenanet failed. That is all.
One person should not be able to hold hate on a mob for the entire encounter, and live to tell about it.
One person should not have the cooldowns and abilities to heal the entire group from standing in badfloors all the time.
Even though there are builds that lean one way or another, why do people feel the need to fight against the system, against the way the game was designed? Surely people heard that this game had no trinity, before they bought it. Yet, they buy it and try to make it into a WoW clone-tank,healer/dps?
It is not how this game was meant to be played.
How can you say the game was not meant to be played that way? Just because ANet renamed the roles in the group does not change anything. We just went from Tank, Healer, DPS, to Control, Support, Damage.
I do not think anyone is under the illusions that aggro has changed significantly and a “tank” can no longer spam a threat ability and save the group .. this type of thinking no longer applies in this game. The same can be said about the “healing” role. Just because someone has traited and geared for +healing and group support does not mean they just stand in the back and play whack-a-mole with health bars. This game is far more technical than that. But to say these roles are useless, or were nto meant to be in this game is just down right ignorant.
Just because your group of 5 DPS can do challenging content, does not mean it is the ONLY way to do that content. It also does not mean that if you take a well played control (tank) class into your group that you would not have a MUCH eaiser time with said content.
I dont think he is saying “DPS groups are the only way to go”.
In fact, I doubt his even encouraging DPS as a role.
His just saying that its important for everyone to focus on playing the Combat System for what it is. Which is actually based on the mechanics of Damage/Control/Support.
Every class is designed specificlly to be self-effeciant so not only can they solo but they can all be reliable in a group play such as Dungoens.
An Example;
I partied with players who want to mainly focus on Support and Tank. But we always end up losing cause the so called “Tank” keeps dying since he refuses to move and dodge since his build has high defense and health. He could of avoided taking damage, helping with Control, and contributing in Damage. Not just Support. While an Elementalist who only uses Water attunments, could of helps with Control/Damage instead of just healing and sticking with 1 set of skills.
Now I had also partied with players who where actually good. They actually Coordinate Control & Support while contributing in Damage in the dungoens. Which was good because We usually always succeed much more smoothly since we try to help by contributing in the fight.
With that example and experiences I have had, I can bet that the OP is also feels the same to the point he feels it has to be addressed.
Its not about DPS.
It’s about contributing effectivly as a team in the fight.
I have made a new Thread Regarding GW2’s Combat system.
Check it out:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/players/GW2-Combat-system-101/first#post892295
=)
Oh there are healers and tanks, but they are not the type of healers and tanks other mmo’s have. Someone trying to facetank something will most likely end up dead and any “healer” will not be able to keep up with the damage. Optimally, everyone will adding in on the healing and tanking in whatever way they can.
Tanking is more about soaking damage.
The point is to not soak damage but to evade it and keep control on enemy while dealing damage at enemy and being able to support urself and allies around you while in combat.
Anyone trying to tank will only be a liability. Not an asset to the group.
As for “Healers”. They dont exist. Sure everyone can “Support” each other and themselves some how, but its based on playstyle prefferences.
There are No Tanks, and No Healers to Babysitt you to make you Feel Safe in combat while you focus on Fully doing DPS on your favorite class. Just… No.
Because of this, there are no “Holy Trinity”.
Damage/Control/Support are not “Roles”. They are “Combat Mechanics” that the Combat System is based on.
Because of this: Everyclass must coordinate Control & Support, while contributing in Damage. This is what ArenaNet did.
A “Trinity” is more based on having a Class for a specific Role.
This isnt a new Trinity. Its a new Combat System.
The best build or strategies when playing a class is being able to do good on
Damage/control/Support skills.
But only You can figure out what works well by experimenting it. Or observing good players playing the class.
If this game was based heavily on Armor/Stats then I could just tell u to go get <Armor Name> but thats the thing, Its mainly heavily focused on Skills and strategies thay you must experiment and observe other players to see what works for you best in PvE and PvP.
I play in Borlis Pass server. I could show you some of my combat strategies if you play there. If not, idk. lol
Engineer is extremely fun!
I dont use Gernades though. I use tons of other skills but Gernades just doesnt fit my playstyle. It doesnt have the skills I need, specially for Solos when fighting multiple enemies.
Anyways, Your not looking for high DPS for any class. You are looking for skills that can help u with “Control” & “Support” while dealing a decent amount of “Damage”.
=)
They did indeed remove the “holy trinity”, trouble is they replaced it with just one class….DPS…..anything else and you are just fooling yourself….healing ele’s are a waste of a slot, “tanks” are absolutely worthless as they cannot hold aggro.
This game is solely about DPS and how much you can inflict that DPS on mobs.
You play too much World-of-Warcraft. Or games similiar for that matter.
This game’s combat system isnt about inflicting DPS. If all you think about is DPS then you’ll just die and be worthless. You cant play this game in the same way as you do in other traditional mmos.
There are NO:
DPS roles.
Tank roles.
Healer roles.
The Combat System is based of 3 mechanics:
Damage/Control/Support
which all class must deal “Damage”, stay in “Control” and “Support” themselves to stay self-effeciant.
And when TeamPlay is involved, Stuff like dungoens, You need to coordinate Control & Support skills while contributing in Damage.
This combat system requires a lot of teamwork and player skills.
So no, it’s not about doing the most Damage. It’s about staying alive by staying in “Control” and being able to “Support” yourself and work well coordinating with a team to overcome serious challenges.
If all you think about is DPS… You’ll become a huge liability… You wont be an Asset to the party.
My warrior i built, Healing power/ Toughness/ vit/ power in mind (using my jewerly and armour). The goal of my warrior is to draw the hate of the enemy and make it focus on me while my ally takes it down. I also do a fair amount of a damage. Im tanky but not a full fledged tank in the regards that i just dont stand there and take it. I move around the enemy and ensure some of its attacks miss. I also use a shield to block potentially deadly attacks.
And how do you make the mob hit you, when a thief with a backstab/crit build is tripling/quadrupling your DPS, since you are focusing on “tanking”. I guarantee your dps is no where near that of a glass cannon thief, or elementalist.
Unlikely. If you have 50% crit chance, and 200% crit damage, thats 50% more damage. Significant? Yes. Quadruple? Not even close.
Not to mention the only way that a greatsword warrior could sit there doing that is if someone else had aggro and didn’t move (tank) in the first place, otherwise they would have to stop hundred blades prematurely.
The backstab thief would end up botching some backstabs and CnD’s due to the mob’s erratic movement.
Erradic movement…say…because he switches his focus to someone else other than the would be tank?
I find that mobs tend to just fixate on one character for a really long time, then switch. If that character happens to be able to eat all the auto-attacks and never move, its beneficial to everybody.
Try landing a dragon tooth when a champion is chasing a kiter.
Those are called “Army Fodders”
I dont revive people who just stand still soak damage and then die. If they die, I’ll revive them later after the fight is over. I wont risk my life for someone like that.But if I see someone who is moving, dodging, doing Damage/Control/Support skills, and actually TRYING to do something in combat, I’ll happily revive him/her… Because I know that player is actually worth the risk. If I die, I’ll be revived and we can both coordinate together.
But reviving someone who is just going to die again, is worthless… Too risky
I’ve been able to do it as a Guardian in power/precision gear on the way up, I didn’t switch to tanky stats until level 60. Champion just can’t get past all the healing/blocks of scepter/focus.
Gear doesnt matter bro… I’ve done Dynamic Events with crappy armor and Naked.
It helps but its not as important as knowing how and when to use your skills.
Skills such dealing “Damage”,
Skills such as “Control”
and “Support”.
Build your character with whatever stats you like. But dont rely on your Armor/Traits. People who do end up lacking “Player skills” because they expect the “Stats” to do the rest. lol
People just need to focus more on building Skills based on the Combat mechanics, not based on stats. Stats are fine but how you use your skills will ultimatly matter the most.
I keep reading threads on “is this tanking build viable?” , “is this healing build viable?”
I run dungeons and when I see someone try to tank, after a few seconds the boss either locks on someone else or rofl stomps the would-be tank. After all of your cooldowns are wasted staying alive, are you really helping the group?
I know people can try to steer themselves in the direction of tank/heals, but do true tanks and healers exist? Do you think that by being a complete support build / heal build you are 100% helping the group? Shouldn’t you have some offensive capabilities and not just focus on your support cooldowns?
I grow weary of people saying they are a tank, because this game isn’t meant to have tanks.
I also understand that some fights prefer ranged, but when someone tells me to go ranged all the time on my thief, I get annoyed…the game isn’t meant for all ranged weapons. Shouldn’t I be able to run the dungeon the way I want, if I play it correctly?So… what you’re saying is, the only viable role is DPS. And you’d be right. How is this a good thing? This is terrible, and a gross oversimplification of the genre.
WHat are you talking about!?
DPS role? There is no DPS role!
It’s Combat system is based off “Damage/Control/Support”
Which means not only do you have to contribute in doing “Damage” but you must use coordinate using “Control” skills to stay in “Control” while being able to “Supporting” yourself and others in combat. This clearly takes a lot of teamwork, Movement and Dodging and staying on your toes.
The fact that you and your team work together, specially in 5 man dungoens, in coordinationg skills and staying on your feet, MAKES this game More complicated than Simple which takes Skills.
Because there are no Tank/Healer and DPS roles, It’s a lot more challenging.
Because you dont have any Babysitters healing you so you’ll be safe.
Because you dont have any Tank to keep Hate, so you feel safe.
There is no Safety, You have to me on the move.
People who just focus on DPS… are pointless.
Play the combat system for what it is so you
PS. This isnt a direct rely to you, this is kinda more towards people in General who think other wise.
My warrior i built, Healing power/ Toughness/ vit/ power in mind (using my jewerly and armour). The goal of my warrior is to draw the hate of the enemy and make it focus on me while my ally takes it down. I also do a fair amount of a damage. Im tanky but not a full fledged tank in the regards that i just dont stand there and take it. I move around the enemy and ensure some of its attacks miss. I also use a shield to block potentially deadly attacks.
And how do you make the mob hit you, when a thief with a backstab/crit build is tripling/quadrupling your DPS, since you are focusing on “tanking”. I guarantee your dps is no where near that of a glass cannon thief, or elementalist.
Unlikely. If you have 50% crit chance, and 200% crit damage, thats 50% more damage. Significant? Yes. Quadruple? Not even close.
Not to mention the only way that a greatsword warrior could sit there doing that is if someone else had aggro and didn’t move (tank) in the first place, otherwise they would have to stop hundred blades prematurely.
The backstab thief would end up botching some backstabs and CnD’s due to the mob’s erratic movement.
Erradic movement…say…because he switches his focus to someone else other than the would be tank?
I find that mobs tend to just fixate on one character for a really long time, then switch. If that character happens to be able to eat all the auto-attacks and never move, its beneficial to everybody.
Try landing a dragon tooth when a champion is chasing a kiter.
Those are called “Army Fodders”
I dont revive people who just stand still soak damage and then die. If they die, I’ll revive them later after the fight is over. I wont risk my life for someone like that.
But if I see someone who is moving, dodging, doing Damage/Control/Support skills, and actually TRYING to do something in combat, I’ll happily revive him/her… Because I know that player is actually worth the risk. If I die, I’ll be revived and we can both coordinate together.
But reviving someone who is just going to die again, is worthless… Too risky
People make support roles because dead dps means no dps.
Don’t know how much time I spend in runs rezing glass cannon pure dps people…. warriors and thieves are especially known for this crap….. ya sure they hit for alot but as soon as they miss a dodge and get hit its GG now the group is kittened trying to res you.
While tank and heal builds aren’t used in the traditional sense they are still needed to support the group, doesn’t mean they can’t dps at the same time.
Well, I am in a downed state as much as the next guy, but that doesnt mean I am standing in the fire like a noob, or I am specced as glass cannon. I work in survivability into my traits.
I’m sorry but, when ever I run a dungoen with someone claiming to be build for Tanking or Support, we always end up dying.
But whenever I party with friends who know how to coordinate Control and Support skills while contributing in Damage with me, We Always end up pulling it off well as a team.
Jee… I wonder why?
my guild group and i had been doing AC for a while, and we had gotten pretty good at it, then during one of the runs we had a missing fifth, so we took a random pug who was an ele and claimed to be a “healer ele”, who focused only on just…using water ele spells.
that run felt like it was just a 4 man run, me and another guildie kept whispering each other, and we both agreed that we did not felt at all that the “healer ele” contributed much to the team, if at all.
its an anectodal experience and thus your mileage can vary, but thats how i felt having a “healer” in our team, and would rather have a random balanced or different
I think its OK that he uses water spells to throw out SOME dps and heal simultaneously. It is how I plan to play my ele when I level it. But builds where you purely try to do ONE thing like tank or heal..sometimes are a detriment unless you are dpsing at the same time.
If people disapprove of an elementalist running with water attunment, why is it in the game?
As an Elementalist myself, You should NEVER stay with 1 attunment.
Always need to switch constantly because you need to use the skills the attunments have for the situation you need to adapt to.
For example:
Fire attunment is excellent for Damage.
Water attunment is excellent for Support
Lightning attument is excellent for Control/Support
Earth is excellent for excellent for Control/Damage
“Also depending on weapon set you use”
But you’ll need to switch to the skills you need based on weapon choice and skills they have. You’ll be running, dodging, and using a bunch of attunment skills and utilities.
Good luck. =) It’s fun though.
There are NO BABYSITTERS to Heal you, or Take Hits for you. You have to be on the MOVE+DODGE and contribute in Control/Support and Damage!!
I always found it pretty hilarious when guildies would say that the Vine boss in TA was a joke. The moment I screw up and my Guardian goes down for the count, or I need to step out of combat for some out of combat healing (due to all defensive cool downs being off), all the glass cannons in the party instantly die mere moments after I do.
To be fair, after seeing that happen a couple times, my party would listen to me whenever I said I was in trouble in that fight, and the spider boss.
lol… That’s funny. Hopefully they LEARN from you.
I keep reading threads on “is this tanking build viable?” , “is this healing build viable?”
I run dungeons and when I see someone try to tank, after a few seconds the boss either locks on someone else or rofl stomps the would-be tank. After all of your cooldowns are wasted staying alive, are you really helping the group?
I know people can try to steer themselves in the direction of tank/heals, but do true tanks and healers exist? Do you think that by being a complete support build / heal build you are 100% helping the group? Shouldn’t you have some offensive capabilities and not just focus on your support cooldowns?
I grow weary of people saying they are a tank, because this game isn’t meant to have tanks.
I also understand that some fights prefer ranged, but when someone tells me to go ranged all the time on my thief, I get annoyed…the game isn’t meant for all ranged weapons. Shouldn’t I be able to run the dungeon the way I want, if I play it correctly?
I 100% Agree and feel your pain man!
I’m getting annoyed with people who want to main tank or main heal in GW2
They dont understand that this combat system has no Holy Trinity!
GW2 Combat system is based off:
Damage/Control/Support.
Every Class must learn to deal “Damage” while mentaining “Control” and being able to “Support” themselves to be self-effeciant.
In a 5 man dungoen, everyone must coordinate “Control & Support” while contributing in “Damage” to successfully overcome a challenging Dungoen.
There are NO BABYSITTERS to Heal you, or Take Hits for you. You have to be on the MOVE+DODGE and contribute in Control/Support and Damage!!
Dont be upset about it though. It’s always best to help and teach new players what you know so they can improve with their skills so you can run better with them for future contents. Dont expect people to know GW2’s combat mechanics. people are used to MMORPGs with Tank/Healer/DPS roles so that is all what they can think about..
This style of combat system is new to the genre.
(edited by DreamyAbaddon.3265)
…The box of nails is pretty fine, though; it does exactly what it should do, which is provide a field of caltrops. If there’s one change I’d make, it’d be to make it activate a little faster. You’re throwing a box of nails into the air, not meticulously spreading them around you!
Well, I think the shield should also activate faster, I see no reason for it to take so much time to activate.
hmmm.. I must be missing something then.
The Shield skill seems to activate the same speed as my warrior’s shield skill, heck, You might be experiencing some kinda weird lag?I always use my shield skill to block on Engineer and Warrior on time without taking hits. Not entirely sure if it’s a recent bug or just a lag in your end. I’ll probably find out. If I dont rely to this, then it’s probably lag in your end. =)
I have 1281 healing power, making ticks of ~660 with elixir gun and something around 300 with any regeneration. Rune of water in my pistol is healing for 518 (I don’t like this number :<). I removed almost all condition damage, leaving only rampager pistols and +300 from traits. I’m blinding and crippling whatever I can, keeping permapoison and/or permaweakness when needed. The only problem might be people escaping from my heals, no matter how I’m aiming, it’s landing next to them because they suddenly decide to run away/dodge when I’m trying to catch everyone in my range. Most of people are better at dodging heals/boons than their enemies -.-
Dont worry about healing people much. Just try to heal yourself and whoever near you. All classes are all self-effeciant. With that said in mind, You are nobody’s babysitter. If your team keeps dying, and you are not, its most probably because your team isn’t doing well.
Even if you do a good job, if your team is not working with you as for coordination in Control/Support, and all they do is spam random skills for DPS, then you might want to consider finding a new team who are willing to actually coop with you.
=) Other than that, I wouldnt worry about healing people much. If you can, Great! But dont worry if you miss it, dont let that be main focus.
Remember, there are no main healers, we are No babysitters.
I think as somebody mentioned.. do not rely on your pet. To me they are there for bonus damage and that’s it, they are fairly useless at holding any aggro. It doesn’t matter if I send the pet in to attack first or not.. the mobs always run to me.
With that being said, I start with the LB, nail them with skill 3, then proceed with rapid fire. This takes them down to about 20% health, combine that with the knock back, they are usually dead before they reach me. If they are not dead by this point, i swap to SB, cripple them and kite till they are dead.
If I’m running around by myself, the only trap I use is the elite skill root trap (for when I encounter large mobs), root them and AoE them down. If I’m in groups, I replace the root trap with whatever that stability fury elite skill is. I have really no problem with soloing any mobs in the game (except champions of course lol)
I only have a ranger though so far so I’m unfamiliar with exactly how much better a warrior is, but I will be rolling a warrior next.
The changes I’d like to see for the Ranger are:
- The obstructed problem addressed (happens far to often despite nothing in the way)
- Rangers theoretically should be doing more overall damage with bows than every other class, whether it be doing more damage per hit or just over attack speed increase
- Less damage reliance on pets, and pets given more survivability with a little bit better aggro control
Looks like you’re doing well. =)
Pet is nice for bonus damage and Bonus agro control. Even though you’ll still get agro, it helps a lot. As a Warrior using Bow, you dont have that, so you’ll be more on a constant run while shooting. Still fun though.
I enjoy both Ranger and Warrior.
If I wanted DPS, I would’ve rolled a Thief or something.
All classes must deal “Damage”,
All Classes must coordinate “Control & Support”
Honestly, playing a different class is just playstyle prefferences in how you enjoy executing them incombat. If all you focus on is DPS, you’ll be in trouble.
How about this:
“Try to actually avoid taking Damage!”
There is a reason Movement+Dodge evades attks. So we can try to avoid them in combat with any class we play. It’s nice to have more vits for health, more defense and more dps rates, but what is the point if you’re going to stand there and soak damage for NO REASON?
Honestly, you shouldnt be standing still soaking damage with any classes.
Warriors, just like every other classes, have to deal “Damage”, stay in “Control” and “Support” themselfs to stay useful and self-effeciant, just like everyone else.
Build your character however you want, But for god sakes, don’t tank… Move out of the way of attks and stay active with meele and ranged weapons. Coordinate Control/Support with ur team and do some damage.
There are no Healers to babysitt you. And it’s nobody’s job to do that for you either.
But i am playing ele since BWE1.
i am too.
I havnt found 1 skill that is useless in Elementalist.
!
I can actually name a few that are -_-
Really? Cause I was able to find all Utility and Weapon skills useful in different situations in mid-combat.
I said this before, but I’ll say it again for this thread:
“The usefulness of the Skills and Utilities are determined on how you use them’
So yeah, Make sure you learn what the skills do, and challenge urself into making strategies that works with them.The more strategies you learn using different combos, the better you are when it comes to different situations that calls for it. =) I dont stick with 1 weapon and utility set. I change it up a lot. It’s really fun.
Arcane blast. Completely awful. I cant think of a single realistic scenerio it would be worthwhile. (Maybe if you were 1500 away and didnt want to get closer because it had some awesome 1 hit kill attack that couldnt be dodged, and it only had 500 hp left)
The conjure _ skills just kinda suck, but you might be able to think of a time the axe/hammer could help. Though I cant, so consider that a challenge.
Arcane Blast isnt that bad. Actually I can use Arcane Shield if enemy gets too close to me and I dont have enough endurance to dodge, Use Arcane Blast for extra damage then Dodge back quickly when endurance is rechanrged. Or If my Endurance is still low, switch to Fire attument, use Skill3 to Dodge with Burning effect if I’m using Staff.
actually its not bad when ur using daggers. since Some skills with daggers require you to be up close. Attking enemy’s blind sides is well done and I do close range spells as well.
It depends on what utilities and weapon skills/attunemnt you use.
If for example: You just use Arcane Blast just for the extra damage when ur using a Staff, “Which means u have to get closer for more damage”, then that would be pointless, I agree. But when u cant dodge,
Again; You can use “Arcane Shield” when enemy is close to you, and “Arcane Blast” to help Completment each other during that situation if it occurs.
I have to experiment with tons of different Utility and weapon attument combos and test them out in action to see better ways to use em.
Edit: I test out all the skills and enjoy building different strategies for different senarios for every skills I get for all my classes. =) I find it really fun.
(edited by DreamyAbaddon.3265)
I want to back things up a bit. Way back. Back before launch, before the betas, back to when the Guild Wars 2 elementalist was nothing but a concept to us. You there? Okay. So here’s my question.
What did you want it to be?
We see plenty of talking back and forth regarding what the elementalist is and what people expect of it. Usually I hear things like “it’s the mage archetype” and a response to the effect of “then this isn’t the class for you.” Constant accusations of L2P issues, despite equally frequent acknowledgement of simple concepts (dodging, attunement swapping/etc.) as necessities. These are all questions that address the reality of the elmentalist. But ultimately, is this what people wanted?
I like lightning, I think it’s cool. The idea of an element-specific spellcaster is appealing to me. The use of daggers as a magical instrument also sounded extremely cool. Considering Guild Wars, it made sense that what we could expect was a caster that could specialize in elements, and each element offered something different, or make use of all of them at once.
What we have now is a profession which requires the use of all four elements to be effective. All elementalist players probably learned this lesson around level 40 if not earlier. This is mostly a product of weak individual skills and longer-than-average cooldowns. I accept this. Everyone who plays an elementalist consistently has to accept this. However, is this what everyone wanted? Ignoring whether or not the elementalist is underpowered or not, how effective it can be, or anything else, are people happy with what it is?
I bring this up because I want to understand what players wanted from the elementalist. For the sake of this discussion, please forget for a moment the reality of the elementalist, and share what you wanted from the profession.
Yes, Yes I am very very happy with Elementalist.
I love this class soo freakin Much!
It’s exactly what I expected. A Magic Class that kicks kitten while on the move+Dodge.
I havnt played any mmorpgs that made a Mage type class this fun and engaging.
I would like to see what other skills Arenanet might give us for the future.
Ranger is really a good and fun class to play.
If you enjoy using mainly bows, then you’ll LOVE the skills the LongBow and SHortBow combos give u. Specially with epic Traps that can slow down ur enemies and damage them well.
With the pet mechanic, You’ll be a bit overpowered since if ur doing 1v1 on PvE monster, You’ll most likely not even get touched.
But if ur fighting multiple enemies, Yeah! Your going to move and dodge a lot and use all ur bows full capabilities and traps to keep urself alive and kill the enemy as much as u can.
It’s fun! I recomend it. specially if u love using Bows as much as I do!
Just dont rely on your pet if it dies… You gotta learn how to take effect with ur weapons and traps while moving and dodging to stay alive and kill enemies.
Hope this helps. =) And if u play in Borliss Pass Server, PM me so I can show you the ropes with Ranger. I love the class and im always happy to show people some new tricks and such.
Dear Players who have issues with Ranger.
Stop relying on your pet. That’s a start.Pets can help you take agro. you can set traps and tell your pet to come to you, luring enemies to your traps. That’s just 1 example. But seriously there are tons of other strategies that I can come up with, including yourself, if you just read the skills your weapons give you, including your utilities.
I’ll give you 1 example with LongBow and ShortBow with Utility skills combo:
You can start off with LongBow Skill5 to cripple/damage enemy. Then when enemy gets closer, you can Knowckback enemy by using Skill4. Then you can take enemy’s Defense down with Skill3, Giving you the opening to use Skill2 for Lots of damage.
If your pet has agro, You can do this and help your pet take less damage while dealing damage yourself.Now you can Weapon Swap to ShortBow and use Skill1 for Auto-attks to do damage quicker. If enemy is attking pet, use Skill5 to daze it for a short time. But if enemy is chasing you, Use skill4 to Cripple Enemy and Dodge as your moving. If you run out of stamina and u still have agro, use Skill3 to dodge again, which will also give you Swiftness for quicker movement speed to evade attks with movement. If your pet dies, use F4 to swap your pet.
If enemy is still chasing you after you summoned New pet, Set a Spike Trap and Flaming trap to Damage/Cripple enemy, then swap to LongBow and Knowck enemy back, Take down it’s defense, Deal tons of damage with skill2 and stay on ur toes.
You can use a Utility skill “Forgot name” that helps you get Endurance quicker to dodge faster and it will also roll your backwards. Pretty neat.
This is just 1 example. 1 Strategy. 1 Set.
Sorry if I didnt Name any skills… I cant remember the Skill names by heart. But Only remember the icons and skill#s.. lol
This post is getting too long… Sorry about that!
Or you can roll warrior and oneshot the mob with hundred blades…..
Hundred Blades dont always oneshot.
Also, Problem with that skill is it takes “Control” away from you. Meaning you’ll take damage. That’s a risk depending on the combat situation. Specially in dungoens and champions. But I like to use “Endure Pain” which allows me to take No Damage for 5 seconds when using Hundred Blades. But Normally I try to only use it when I dont have agro so I can evade and dodge while using the other skills for damage.
Again, it takes skills and timing. Spamming skills on normal monsters? Sure!
But in Dungoens? Noo… Just No…
Again, its all based on fast pace strategy. Thinking and using the right skills on the fly for any class. Not all about DPS.
Warrior and guardians are awesome class, but i will be honest they have a huge drawback in my book for pve, you need to go tanky spec if you really want to go wuper good with them and if you want to maintain a high dps, you’ll need to stay out of mf gear.
I disagree with this.
I can go Naked with no armor/traits and be freakin GOOD at Warrior.
Cant speak for Guardians since I dont have that class, But I do play 5 other classes and I have proven that Armor/Traits are not required to be fully effectiant playng the class.
tank spect? Do you expect to take hits? I evade all attks from simple “Movement” and “Dodge” 90% of the time, if not., More.
In this game, u want to rely on Weapon Skills and Utility Skills.
Not spam it up for DPS. Remember ur not a damage dealer or a tank. You are playing the combat based on Damage/Control/Support which all Classes do.
People need to
Stop relying on Armor/Traits.
Stop focusing on Damage all the kitten time.
This isnt a class with Tank/Healer and Damage Dealer classes.
This game focuses on Damage/Control/Support.
You got skills to deal “Damage”.
You got skills to help you stay in “Control”
You got skills to help you “Support” yourself.
All these help you be self-effeciant.
And in Party Play, Coordination of Control/Support while dealing “damage” is important.
If all you think about is “Damage” then ur a liability in the party, not an asset.
Team Play is important when it comes to coordination of “Control” and “Support”
Elementalist, just like the other 4 classes I have played, are all equally good and effective in Damage/Control/Support.
As long as you are on the Move+Dodge… You seriously shouldnt be taking damage.
Specially with excellent Support and Control utilities that helps you reduce or stop an enemy from hitting you when u got agro.
@ the OP:
I recomend you play Elementalist and see what u think. Its really fun if your into Magic using type classes. But be warned, You’ll need to do lots of Attunment changings to use skills you need. And you’ll need to be on the Move and Dodge a lot to evade tons of attks. If your up for it, you just might like it. =)
A warrior has a simple task – spam the hell out of the enemy with his sword
A Ranger has a simple task – spam the hell out of the enemy with his bowThe other classes I won’t commnet since players tend to compare an elementalist to the above – always talking about DPS/damge/etc.
An elementalist is more versatile and requires more thinking, rather, than spamming one attack style only – thats what a warrior or ranger is for.
I disagree with what you said with Ranger and Warrior examples.
You dont just “Spamm attks” with Warrior or Ranger for DPS!
That’s what horrible players do.
I play Warrior and Ranger as well as Elementalist, and those classes require lots of thinking and are all versatile. I play 5 classes as my main and I know when and how to use my skills in combat, When and how to weapon swap with my other classes to adapt to the situation. I dont just spam DPS. I use Cripple, Stun, Chill, endurance regain, Swiftness, Knowckdown, Knowckback, etc etc with all my classes.
As a Warrior, I hardly take hits since Im on constant Move+Dodge as I use Meele and Ranged weapons. DPS is good but should never be only focus with any class.
I havnt found 1 skill that is useless in Elementalist.
!
I can actually name a few that are -_-
Really? Cause I was able to find all Utility and Weapon skills useful in different situations in mid-combat.
I said this before, but I’ll say it again for this thread:
“The usefulness of the Skills and Utilities are determined on how you use them’
So yeah, Make sure you learn what the skills do, and challenge urself into making strategies that works with them.
The more strategies you learn using different combos, the better you are when it comes to different situations that calls for it. =) I dont stick with 1 weapon and utility set. I change it up a lot. It’s really fun.
So it seems like Arena Net doesn’t want to make any major changes to the Engineer Class, even after we’ve voiced our complaints, opinions, and ideas, repeatedly time and time again.
Hell, it would seem like they don’t WANT us to be happy. Alot of the medium gear seems more appropriate for Assassins or Rangers really, and I’m not seeing to many nice looking options in terms of pistols or rifles for us.
And let’s be honest here, we TOTALLY use our kits way more often then we do with our Pistols or Rifles. It’s not like STATS or nothin affect our damage output with our kits.
I realized this…and I decided to go all Stamina and Toughness originally on my Engineer. But then one day while puggin it in a dungeon, and dying repeatedly and wasting money on repairs, I realized that if I was just to use my kits and turrets at all times, I didn’t even really need armor!
So I stopped my pug, and took the time to explain to them what I was going to do, and that I wasn’t trolling. And surprise surprise! They accepted what I was going to do and went along with it.
So I stripped down to my boxer shorts and started Grenade Lobbin and Bomb Layin away. And to my surprise, I didn’t go down as much as I thought I would, and I was still doing the same amount of damage, though with a bit more running around for the comedic effect. We finished the dungeon in no time, and I took this outdoors.
I found out PvEing outdoors naked was pretty much the same thing. Sure I had to retrait to be a bit more sturdier, but I was STILL killing mobs at the same efficiency as I was before WITH armor. And I barely ever actually went into a downed state.
So I realized, Arena Net just wants Engineers to play naked. Because it works. Seriously, give it a shot, trait into Inventions and Alchemy, be a bit creative, go into Explosives a little bit. Playing has never been so hilarious, and efficient and money saving.
And I love the haters that yell at me for playing naked in dungeons. Cause I’m still doing just as well with or without armor.
WHO’S WITH ME! PLAY NAKED!
Dude… I played Engineer, Warrior, mesmer, Ranger, and Elementalist NAKED!
As long as you are a good player. You are on the Move+Dodge and using the right skills effectivly, You’ll ALWAYS be a Winner!
This is skill based baby! Armor/Traits help but not really that important compaired to Knowing how to use your weapon skills and Utility skills! This goes for all classes! =D
But yeah, I use my weapons and Kits a lot as Engineer. mainly because of the skills they have and the skills I need. It’s all about using the skills at the right time and place. =)
FINALLY, an MMORPG that doesnt rely on armor/stats.
But with Skills! =P
Extremly powerfull Ya say Dreamy? Explain me then why there is SO FEW engii builds over the internet GW2 sites?
Why there is SO FEW engiiners every PvP match i played, every RvR i ve saw so far?
i can’t say its useless class- it’s just low in everything compared to other dps classes/builds.Because majority of players I have seen dont know how Engineer works.
Actually, most dont really know the combat system or mechanics by much from what I see in both PvP and PvE.I sPvP with Engineer a lot before. And PvEd ever so much before no adays.
I have tons of Stratagies using engineer. I use tons of utility skills and weapons for different possible situations. I enjoy getting in depth with all my classes and learn it’s full capabilities. Engineer is no exception.
I played: Engineer, Elementalist, Ranger, Warrior, and Mesmer.
I dont read up “Builds” online to play my class. I work on my own and experiment and challenge myself in combat to learn what works and what doesnt depending on those different possible situations.
Its a skill based game. And that’s the way I like it. =)
I am on BP, and I WvW fairly often. I’d love to talk to you about it (unless you are in TRI, in which case we already have!)
It was fun showing you my engineer strategies.
Sadly I wish I could show you more but you had to go so soon. =(
We have lots to learn from each other. =) keep it up.
My only problem with the Tool Kit is that the #1 skill and the toolbelt skill are redundant. Why do they both have to be wrenches?
I like how every other skill is a separate tool.The #1 Skill should change to a hammer and a mallet and then have its dmg and timing adjusted to fit.
just imo.
Not bad idea actually =)
RANGER:
PvE and PvP Leveling: Really fun. Fast. and has really good “Control/Support” skills such as Knowckback, Swiftness, Cripple, Stun/daze and such. Damage is decent but thats mainly because this class has excellent with “Controls” though when ur pet is dead, it requires lots of movements. The pet makes it easy for staying in “Control” without taking damage but there are times you’ll end up agro with more than 1 so the pet cant help u forever. The LongBow and ShortBow happens to be my favorite Combo with some nice utility traps to slow enemies down.
Dungoens:
Pretty darn good!! Again, the Pet helps with extra damage and tanking while ur in a distance, but since ur fighting more enemies at once, this helps reduce the trouble a lot. The weapon Skills+ Utilities make up for Control when pet dies. With a good team to help you coordinate Control and Support, you’ll always succeed regardless of class setup.
ENGINEER:
PvE/PvP leveling: A
OMG… Super fun! I enjoy the Utility Skills and the 3 weapon choices you get when building different strategies. It has a good Damage rate but like, Amazing “Control” and “Support” skills. I love this class to death. They have amazing Net Skills, Push Skills, Knowckback skills, for Control and some really sick Support skills that compliments them. The Damage again is decent like Ranger, but a bit stronger than Ranger. Still fun though. =)
Dungoens: A
Well, This class seems to have the right tools for the right job! After all, its how you use the kits that determines their usefulness!
MESMER:
PvE/PvP lvling: A
We all know how Mesmer is kick kitten when it comes to PvP. But I find it super fun in PvE as well. as a mesmer in PvE, The enemy has a hard time fighting me since the skills I get really messes them up a lot. I have used tons of different weapon combos and utility combos to build verias different strategies for different PvE situations. and I gotta say, Mesmer never gets boring. Very effective class when played right.
As for the “Damage”, it’s not a powerful class with regarding “Damage” rate, but the clones and skills it has to build solid strategies makes up for this. I recomend it for those who are into it.
Dungoens: “A”
Its just purely freakin good. It’s an asset when played right by the right players.
But its a NIGHTMARE when playing with players who just spam skills and expect their clones to take agro alone. Doesnt work that way. It’s again, how you use your weapon skills and utilities that determines it’s usefulness. Anyone can spam skills, not everyone can learn how and when to use them while on the Move+dodge.
WARRIOR: A
THis class has some seriously well thought out “Damage/Control/Support” skills.
Well, some of it’s “Support” skills could use some work, like “Shake it Off” should at least allow u to cure 3 conditions under 10 or 20 seconds instead of 1 Condition. But still, pretty darn well.
The thing with Warrior is, Specially with Meele class, You need to be more on your toes to evade attks while fighting. Its tough but once u master it, you’ll be in good hands.
Dungoens: A or F
Depends on the Player… If a Player is good and the Dungoen is not soo scramped, you’ll be fine. If the player is new, and you are fighting in small areas, you’ll die a lot wondering “WHY!?” lol
ELEMENTALIST:
PvE/PvP lvling:
The BEST Magic class I have ever played in an MMORPG PERIOD!
Always on the Move+Dodge. Having the right skills for the right attunoments.
Hardly taking damage. Seriously well thought out “Support/Control” skills. I’m being dead serious!!!
This Class is diffuclt to master but super fun once mastered. There hasnt been 1 skill I dislike about the Elementalist. The “Damage” rate is decent. But the entire Control/Support skills really makes up for it in combat.
Dungoens: A
… Yeah. Call me a fanboy but this just happens to be one of the main classes I enjoy playing for a Dungoen. But don’t think of yourself as a “Healer”. Hellz no!
Sure you got skills to help you heal and Support, But you are nobodies Babysitter.
If people in ur team dont coordinate Control/Support. If people dont support and contribute in Control and damage then get a new party. Play as a team, but dont do all the work for people because they are lazy to do the work themselves.
Well, those are all 5 of my main classes and my take on them.
=) dont have experience in the other 3.
First of all, only heal / support sucks. Don’t go only Dmg, only heal/support, only tankness or what ever “only” in GW2. U will not be worth your place in party. Better go power/Heal/x and take some dmg with u. Ingi can stack up to 20-25 vulnerability with greandes for example – here is your dmg for the team.
Second point, healing sucks in scaling. It doesn’t matter which class, a pure heal character heals about double compared with 0 healpower. That’s not worth the healpower.
Since last patch superelixier (Elixier Gun) is bugged. They misschanged impact heal and pulse heal, means u heal one time the puls heal and every second the impact heal. This is realy strong at the moment, but a bug. As long as they don’t fix it, you will do very well with heal-engi. But after fix u will suck with heal ingi.
I have to agree with this guy’s post.
I play Engineer alot, along side with my other 4 Classes.
This game doesnt work the same way as other mmos you are used to.
You want to focus on dealing “Damage”, staying in “Control” and being able to “Support” youself.
Support isnt all about “healing”, its many other factors. Same goes with Control.
If you dont coordinate Control/Support with ur team while contributing in “Damage” then you are only a liability. Not an asset to the Party.
To the OP:
I play in “Borlis Pass” server, if you play on that server, PM me and I’ll be happy to show u some stuff if you want. =)
There are no DPS class bro…
This combat system is focused on Strategies based on Damage/Control/Support.You need to deal “damage” just like every other class.
You need to stay in “Control” just like every other class.
You need to “Support” yourself/others just like every other class.It boils down to playstyle prefferences.
If only thing you focus on is DPS… Yeah, You’ll be in trouble.Then most of the warrior are in trouble~~
That is entirely true but if your doing enough damage they who cares. Engineer has a lot of control and buffs for others to use and most have low cool downs.
engineer can constantly stack vigor swiftness. he can apply stealth or stabilize on stunned allies. He can turn in to a tank for about 30 seconds.
i find he has more options and lower cool downs than most other classes.
Your not suppose to Tank with any class… But I can keep Agro with any class without taking much hit. There are times I dont even take damage when I have full agro. It’s just the matter of staying in “Control” with ur Control skills while on the Move+Dodge and “Supporting” yourself with Swiftness and such as you mentioned while dealing “Damage”.
To be honest, I can do this with any of my 5 classes just as effectivly as an Engineer can. Really, it’s all Playstyle prefferences in “How” you enjoy doing Damage/Control/Support.
I enjoy doing it with: Engineer, Elementalist, Warrior, Ranger, and Mesmer.
I pretty much can Keep agro with multiple enemies and even champions with No-to-Crap armor/weapons. All I need is the Weapon Skills and Utility Skills and I’m all set.
I really do enjoy Engineer though. It’s super fun if you know how to play it right. =)
EDIT: It’s not your job to Babysitt others. If your team mate cannot keep “Control” and “Support” themselves, they become a liability, not an asset to the Party.
Not saying “Dont help your team out”, just saying "Make sure you’re not babysitting those who dont understand those Mechanics. Instead, helping them learn it would be a better way to go so you and your team can coordinate Control/Support while dealing damage as a team effectivly.’
(edited by DreamyAbaddon.3265)
Mesmer is historically hard in PvE and often slaughters in WvW and sPvP. While there are still many successful Mesmers in PvE, they specialize in confusing players (which is far easier than confusing a computer AI program) and locking down an opponent while they mercilessly kill them. As a result, the class naturally lends itself towards hunting down other players and isn’t the easiest choice for dealing with hordes of PvE mobs.
Mesmers are actually pretty easy to play in PvE.
I fight hordes of enemies without dying. The weapon choices are well designed and AI monsters are easy to confuse just as much as Real Players in PvP.
Have you tried swaping weapons and kiting while making clones and such? You’ll be pretty much unstoppable in PvE
a old thread. but one that Anet could read and use.
for now though it just more proof that this issue has been around for a long time and Anet has been slow about fixing it.
There is no issue. The issue is people rely on their pet and want to do DPS all day hoping their pets can stay alive long enough before they take agro themself.
People should learn to use their pets and not rely on them all the time. you got useful Weapon skills and Utilities to do well while kiting without pet. I feel making pets stronger will only make Ranger way to over powered in PvE.
There are 3k + people that seen the post so far with 70+ replies. Apparently, we care for this ‘kitten’ class, along with its issues. Please respect our time and effort here and go troll somewhere else.
Thank you
I’m not the one Trolling.
I’m being entirly serious.
You on Borlis Pass Server? If so I can show you. Tawalaya Miyake is my name.
I care for Ranger as well, and I dont want Ranger to be this mindless DPS spamming class all because of pets having the ability to tank and spank and deal tons of damage while we stay safe in distance. Hellz no.
If you guys played on my server… I could show you some strategies on elementalist that can give you ideas.
=)
I don’t see anything there that isn’t evident just from the skill descriptions. Whoa, skill 4 on LB is a knockback? Use that when an enemy gets close – yes, none of us ever figured that out. You don’t think I have my set of skill use patterns I’ve developed based on what I’ve observed seems most effective? Everyone does.
Just because there is a way to maximize the skills given, doesn’t mean that maximization is good compared to other classes.
Also – you can’t ignore your pet. Its the class mechanic. How many other classes ignore their class mechanic? How many of our skills are tied into our pets? Some are even pet-only effects.
Its not the matter of “Ignoring your pet” its the fact of knowing how to effectivly play the class with and without the pet. If you rely on ur pet when ur pets are dead and F4 is under cooldown, You are done for!
Pets already make us Over powered in PvE because we can have them Tank for us. They dont last long against stronger vets or champions so we can swap them with F4, which again, helps us with holding the monster. But what if your pet dies and F4 is cooldown? Then what?
Part of the class mechanics are the utility and wepaon skills you get that helps you deal “Damage”, helps you stay in “Control” and helps you “Support” yourself to be self effeciant.
so im not saying “Ignore your pet”, Im saying “Learn Not rely on pet. Learn to rely on Weapon skills and utilities as well” because to be honest. The Ranger has some seriously good skills that does the job right.
I know this because I dont just read my skills, but I actually take the time to practise them in different combinations and challenge myself through different strategies with what I got.
Ranger does very well in Damage/Control/Support.
Just as well as other classes I have played.
I have played Warrior, Mesmer, Ranger, Engineer, and Elementalist.
It all boils down to personal playstyle prefferences in how you enjoy playing since all classes are flexable from my experience of playing them.
I played Guardian and Necro and Theif durring Beta events but I cannot comment on those because i dont remember them fully. Nor do I have those lvled as main. So those 3 classes I cannot say about.
I love my Ranger. Love the class and the style. Yes it can use some improvements but as of right now, with how pets work, people just dont play the class to it’s fully capabilities. =(
And that’s a problem
(edited by DreamyAbaddon.3265)
I highly disagree. I use both LongBow and ShortBow on my Ranger.
I swap between them very offten and i have tons of different strategies playing them.Its not about DPS its about how the skills deal Damage, Control, and Support.
Ranger has one of the most well thought out Skills planned.I swap a lot between LongBow and ShortBow. Why not just use both? Pretty darn effective.
That isnt the problem, and you arent reading what people are saying. Longbow as some good points such as barrage and point blank shot and even rapid fire at times. But the problem is every other weapon can be used as a primary weapon except for longbow. Longbow from 900+ range is so easy to sidestep its not funny, gets obstruction bug messages like crazy, and with opening strikes being bugged its currently only able to do damage during barrage and rapid fire, not to mention when enemies get close ur damage drops massively.
People are saying they want it to be a primary weapon, useable as one. Id love to be able to snipe with my longbow, but when I fire at someone and they move arrow completely misses, you dont have that problem with guns, the bullets move too fast and even hones in like with engineers hip shot.
Ohh I think I see what you are saying.
Honestly, all ranged weapons should be dodgable with the right movement/positioning. Moving evades attks. Positioning is key. Dodging helps evade bigger attks also. Kinda the key dont you think?
But yeah.. I dont use LongBow as Main weapon only because Its best situational weapon I like using to swap between with my ShortBow. I mean both ShortBow and LongBow do their jobs. Arrows or any long ranged should miss when enemies move.