Guild Wars 2

u forgot the champion pirate captain

im having the same problem , but mine isnt even getting to the point where i can log in, its givng up and getting stuck long before that, i cant play at all =(

Nurgle.6597:

I don’t like it, I rarely ever saw anyone running around with fused gauntlets, after this patch everyone has them. Might as well give everyone every skin and make us all look the same

THIS ! this is why u dont re release skins, you are ruining the rarity of our hard work…..ur supposed to do this after 10 years of an mmo existing not 1.5 years…..

the OP is dead right, anet needs to stop re releasing items its hurting the player base, its already bad enough that most things in this game are cosmetic only, its even worse that i have no way to show my skill or how long iv been playing

they wud not be stupid enough to make them untradable, they make alot of money off black lion chests EXCLUSIVLEY so ppl can sell them to the ppl who dont wana buy them directly with their real money…..to take that away would leave only the ppl who actually want the skins buying chests….and i have a funny feeling thats less than they think it is

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Ryan.9387:

What happrns when the good guy lists his item 1c below the lowest WTS. Will you just buy from the big bad tp trader because he lists higher price?

I think some people consider anyone who undercuts by 1c to be evil by default. But it doesn’t matter, since nothing in this thread will ever be implemented by Anet or the players.

i do consider the undercutter to be unfavorable, and i find your confidence in nothing getting done laughable

wait so i AM supposed to get my wvw chest? i thought it didnt end til the 30th!

i didnt get one and i have not transfered servers (this season)

Wanze.8410:

Duke Nukem.6783:

Wanze.8410:

And how do you stop Real Money Traders to exploit this feature for funneling gold through the tp?

they can mail it to people….why would they need to?

Anet monitors large gold sums being sent by mail.

if they can monitor that then they can monitor the TP, dont worry about the gold sellers they have plenty of ways to catch them and the TP is already a way to transfer money, honestly i see “oooh what about the gold sellers” as the excuse of TP bosses who dont want this done because they thrive on destoying the economy.

Wanze.8410:

And how do you stop Real Money Traders to exploit this feature for funneling gold through the tp?

they can mail it to people….why would they need to?

i completed all 10 acheivments a LONG time ago and i think the tournament was supposed to end this week? wheres my reward chest?

Realist.5812:

Why would you support real money RNG gambling in games anyway…

Gambling is designed for you to lose. That’s not to say I don’t enjoy roulette tables every now and again.
Computerized gambling even more so. Stay away. At all costs.

It’s amazing how games are allowed to run these gambling practices whilst still allowing children to play the game. And the new gen cash hungry “developers” are loving it.

Sorry to hear though.

a bit too cynical pal….the OP just handed his money and time poorly and then complained when he didnt have good luck, u make it sound like some big conspiracy of every negative aspect of mankind imaginable

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Duke Nukem.6783:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I’m all for the idea that Sellers have 100% freedom to post items for whatever prices they want. Tis how capitalism works.

#Yayifications!

sooooo do u aggree that the BUYER should have total freedom of choice aswell?

I can guarantee you that if a buyer had the ability to pick and choose whatever priced item he wanted, he’d still end up buying one of my listings. Because I could make it that the first 10 items you see on the list will be all mine. That’s not to say that people already do this.

another one who is awful sure of himself, but your unrealistic like the rest of the career traders, you selectivley ignore all the times when trades get around you, and even so this has little to do with my post other than to suggest that you think that people like you will always control the market no matter what changes we make. which is another way of saying that deep down you dont think my changes are enough and we should do even more to stop people from bossing around the TP. well said friend =)

my character “pennywise” would put this to good use….

there is no counter to stealth, not really, it needs a mega nerf

u can still buy them, they are not in short supply,

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

People do all sorts of hard-to-explain things on the TP:

• People still sell items in massive quantities at less than 10% above vendor value, even though the projected profit is clearly posted on the screen (yes, they really shouldn’t sell for less than 15+% above vendor, but that second amount isn’t as obvious).
• People buy items with a unique name for crazy amounts. Compare Sam to Opal Orichalcum Earring of Opal — the generic has the same function and offers the same outward appearance, yet trades at 70-90% less.
• People pay a premium for items with unique names, but common skins.

So, sure, if you offer people the opportunity to pay more than the lowest sale offer or sell for less than the highest buy offer, some people will do that.

However

1. I still don’t see that anyone has established why undercutting is a problem for game’s overall economy or
2. (for those who believe this as an article of faith) how this particular solution would help resolve the stated concern.

Currently, the game already offers me the ability to adjust my offer: if I think the sell offers are too high (and I usually do), I put in a custom buy order that makes sense for me. Similarly, as I generally think people are offering too little for items I want to sell, I am able to ask for more.

alright those are two productive questions and il answer them
1. currently you can undercut by 1c, this hurts both the previous seller (who might never get his offer looked at again if undercutting continues) and the buyer who isnt really getting a better deal. the result of this is TP sellers have to sell low for fear of being undercut by 1c which drives prices down in every category, eventually making the economy unusable (remember when green items could be sold on the top? now we just sell them to vendor or salvage them) lastly it isnt fair, why give so much power to the person who comes second and offers nothing? there is no incentive to sell at same value as lowest bidder

2. this resolves the moral issue because it allows people who are concerned with undercutters to take action, but doesnt force anyone into it who doesnt care.

Aidan Savage.2078:

There is no logic in wasting money buying at a higher price than the lowest sale order. So why would you bother doing it? Because you dont like people who undercut? Well guess how the market got to those prices in the first place. There is no conceivable reason that is well-founded in logic and thought for someone to waste money. So anet’s not going to introduce what amounts to a waste of time, money, and effort. Expecting them to, or even continuing to suggest it, is beating your head against a brick wall that will not budge.

your awful sure of yourself, but you put no value in integrity and thats a character flaw i just dont respect, its not a waist of time if we want it, and as it has already beend emonstrated that people do want it, it should be done, case closed, just because you dont see the “logic” in it doesnt mean there isnt any.

these items were not invented for collectors like you, they were made for a once in a lifetime chance for the average player to get them with blind luck from a reward…..i sympathize cuz i want the sunless weps too but sorry the rates must stay the same

i want each profession to have its own unique weapon that noone else can use

warrior: great axe (2 handed)

engineer: shotgun (very slow and short range but wide coneshot)

ranger: whip: (mostly pet modifying skills)

theif: bo staff (a really short staff, remember when they used staffs in gw1 for entangling asp builds and shadow form?)

casters: (sorry for lumping u all together but ur just so similar) orb and rod, each can be wielded seperatley for a full list of skills but together they provide a new list

slightly off topic but although its more expensive i really do like that i can buy it piece by piece, aslong as the full set can still be purchased for the 800-1000 pice range

Aidan Savage.2078:

Duke Nukem.6783:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I’m all for the idea that Sellers have 100% freedom to post items for whatever prices they want. Tis how capitalism works.

#Yayifications!

sooooo do u aggree that the BUYER should have total freedom of choice aswell?

For what ungodly reason would a buyer willingly choose to pay more for an item? And buyers HAVE THAT FREEDOM already. It’s called “list a buy order.” Items do not vary in quality, so there’s no reason to be able to choose higher than the lowest sale price. If you cant understand that, there’s no helping.

your post is very unhelpful and repetative as i have already listed the reasons many times. also we do not have that freedom as we cannot buy the more expensive option if we want to (and dont ask why, you have already demonstrated that you didnt read my first post completly

i would enjoy a hardcore mode but there are the changes i would make

experience scrolls cannot be used BUT can be forged into a hardcore experience scroll to level up (this would be expensive and help the economy use up items)

you can us the TP, if u want to buy an item, die and lose it, thats more than ok by me its good for the game as a whole as it uses up items

however your dye and wardrobe DO NOT transfer over , so u gata unlock things on this character seperatley

there has to be unique rewards for this mode, like rare items only available from this mode that DO transfer over

you should have access to your bank, again, losing items you buy is good for the economy

i want all champion trains nerfed (i kno they did….but MORE) it is letting ppl stay in a boring cycle

Tranc.6780:

Forgive me if this point has already been mentioned (as I stopped reading 100% of the posts after page 4) but while a 1c undercut may be insignificant to the buyer if it only happens once, it becomes more significant if many sellers start undercutting by 1c (or more than 1c each, but less than 1%).

E.g., suppose an item is listed at 1g, and 50 sellers view that 99s is lower than what they want to sell at (maybe it eats too much into their margin, whatever), the result is that you get 51 listings at 1g. Now if each seller is allowed to undercut the previous by 1c, the result is that a buyer can purchase the item @ 99s 50c. The net result is a lower price for the buyer(s) that eventually may become significant because all those 1c’s add up.

this is an unrealistic and insignificant point as on most expensive items it would take thousands of ppl undercutting by 1c to make even the tinyest of difference to the buyer and that just never happens. when someone undercuts by 1 copper it hurts the previous seller and the buyer. nobody is benefitting but the one abusing the system and undercutting by such a small amount

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I’m all for the idea that Sellers have 100% freedom to post items for whatever prices they want. Tis how capitalism works.

#Yayifications!

sooooo do u aggree that the BUYER should have total freedom of choice aswell?

there is nothing wrong with a buisness wanting to make money, u people act like its sickening to you that they should engadge in a little capitalism

im so glad i sold my windcatcher 2 weeks ago I FINALLY GOT IT SPOT O N! i never hit hte mark perfectly like that!

lol this thread quickly declined into an “i hate gemstore” thread….i personaly love it, its there when i want it, its out of my way when i dont, you people who feel it is “forced” on you just dont kno how to turn away and go about your buisnesss

yea this is a terrible idea, although i do think they need more uses u cant just fix everything but letting the market have them. this will make ascended items too easy to get and that ruins high level content

Zaxares.5419:

Sooo… You want to pay MORE for your goods? O.o

yes i do, to some this might seem strange but i assure you in the long run the entire economy is healthier and happier , the bottom teir of the economy (the players who gather the resources themselves) are gaining more money and thus spending mroe money which helps the higher teir of sellers who want more money for their product

so im paying more, but we are ALL getting more

linuxotaku.4731:

Aidan Savage.2078:

linuxotaku.4731:

If it improved efficiency (specifically, I’m thinking about moderately active markets which never converge toward a spread of a little over 15%), it would benefit buyers more than the slight discount of a few copper on hundreds of gold.

I strongly doubt it would increase efficiency of the markets. If anything, it would make them less efficient. The only way markets can increase in efficiency is if there’s supply to match. That’s why ectos usually have a 2-3 silver gap, even when prices shift up and down by +/-3 silver.
Markets like precursors have extremely low supply, thus are inefficient. Markets like crafting materials have high supply, which allows them to be extremely efficient.

For high volume markets, pricing is already efficient, and this wouldn’t matter. Precursors are actually high volume enough (and closely watched) so that their pricing is efficient — there’s not a lot of gain to be made from flipping; conversely, a 0.5% price gap wouldn’t affect most of the listings that I see.

When I looked previously, I saw more inefficiency in exotic weapons … someof that is gone. Kevin illustrates a little of what remains:

http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/25985

The low sell offers are:

20954
20955
20958
20959
20960
20963
20964
21515
24480
24495
24497
24999
25487
25489
25490

A 0.5% gap would have required a minimum difference of 125 — 1s25c at 2g50s — so it would have spread out the underbids somewhat more. I think it’s interesting to look at what the last set of 1c underbids would have become:

20964
20963 -> 20859
20960 -> 20754
20959 -> 20651
20958 -> 20547
20955 -> 20445
20954 -> 20342

I would prefer this pricing: it would force sellers to actually think about their listings, though, since at some point it would be better to list at the current sell offer rather than 0.5% lower than the current sell offer. If you like selling on autopilot always 1c under the current sell offer, then this is less appealing … but I’d rather ask sellers to also think about the price they can get, rather than always using the strategy of listing at essentially the current sell price, but under by 1-2c so your sale happens first.

The result from the above would remove a little more of the inefficiency in pricing this item — since the current buy offer is 16320, and 85% of the above is 17291 (rather than 17810 — not a huge difference, but IMO an improvement).

this is another good idea but im more in favor of the total free market concept of letting the seller AND the buyer make their 100% own choice

Killface.1896:

Just sell to buy orders and you will never be undercut

this is about me not wanting to buy from undercutters not what i am selling…..as the OP says

Smooth Penguin.5294:

The reason why you’re getting pushback is because you’re advocating solutions to problems that don’t exist. It’s more along the lines of making suggestions to satisfy personal preferences IMO.

the very first response to my post was another thread 100s of posts long wehre people argued for both sides on the same thing….im pretty sure thats proof that the problem exists or their would be no prior discussion on it….ok?

yea they r fine the way they are they are not too hard i do them every day

i have no idea why this is bothering you……u HATE new items? or u think it slows down content? i assure u it does not. they are hard at work on another season of living story and it will arive soon!

i hope we do, its fair, its just that alot of people dont understand the difference between the words fair and equal, they are not the same

U assume gw2 needs saving?

tolunart.2095:

The TP is FIFO – First In, First Out. That means if I list an item for sale at 10s and ten minutes later you list the same item also at 10s, mine will sell first.

very true, but WHAT does that have to do with anything =p, im not suggesting a change to the way items of identical value are purchased only items of different values

Wanze.8410:

Facepunch.5710:

A major problem associated with letting the buyer pick which price/seller to buy from is that you allow gold sellers to use the TP to deliver gold purchases.

This is how it worked in a previous game I played. In that game, I would sometimes do as you’d like to do, OP, and I would buy from someone who was clearly undercut by a small amount, when it was obvious that they were undercut. I don’t know why, since i don’t really have a problem with undercutting. Anyway, that was nice to be able to do now and then, but I wouldn’t trade it for what we have now, which IMO just works better.

Thats actually quite a good point against, which I havent thought about.
As i said earlier, i didnt mind this feature being implemented because i didnt see why not, except that i would rather see dev time being used somewhere else but your point is a good one not to implement it.

it really does not matter actually as they can mail eachother gold without any concern at all (and dont say anet can track the mail easier cuz they can watch everything with equal ease)

mtpelion.4562:

If you get undercut by 1c and your item never sells, then you priced your sell listing too high by 1c.

That’s the nature of the game.

no it is not the nature of the game, its how the game is now, dont assume things cant be changed, also as i said in my OP (which u clearly didnt heed) i am NOT the seller in this scenario

i have 2 computers and this only happens on my laptop so i know its me and not something with the game itself.

sometimes (not always)after i select a champ and finish loading the map im on the game will freeze and il have to restart my computer, i cant minimize or ctr alt del. its always wihin the first minute after logging in, if i can go that long and not freeze then im good to go for hours

also and this might be just my imagination but i think the sound sometimes fails before the freeze

its probally a much smaller change than u think as previously people woudl not be buying multiples anyways (maybe if its a pair of daggers but even then not a big deal) the system might even expand prices upwards as players want to unlock options to switch skins once a day or something, i know i have been buying rare skins from the TP lately just to have them

Kruhljak.2705:

Something else that makes the OP’s concept flawed, IMO is this:

Seller1 wants 950c for an item.
Seller2 wants 949c for an item.

OP wants to buy the item from Seller1 because he doesn’t want to “reward” the trivial undercutter.

In effect, the OP wants to reward the seller that’s the “greediest”. The fact that it’s 1c difference doesn’t degrade the notion that Seller2 is the more reasonable ‘vendor’.

Both sellers are out for money. One was just in line earlier and didn’t put their item up at a price that was attractive enough to move before someone else put their identical item up for less. Six of one, half dozen of the other. The net result is a buyer will save a copper, Seller1 will have to wait a tiny bit longer (unless their item plummets in value). This is what we in the real world term as “No Biggie”.

The devs have far more important and impactful things to work on (many of which have been on the burner for eons as it is); no need to waste time on trivialities.

i would say the person who wants it sooner is greedier, epsecially when you consider that the person selling for 1c higher didnt undercut someone by 1c (if they did then this is irrelivent cuz i would buy from the first person who left a big gap)

in any event i am sick of hearing the same illogical arguemnt over and over again, stop saying that just because it isnt a big deal we cant fix it. it can wait sure, but small fixes are what make our experiences better, much more than adding a new boss we might visit for a few mins once a day

im hearing alot of arguments of people explaining how they do things and assuming that that justifies the undercutting system because “i got used to it”

i am not however, hearing any arguments about why undercutting by 1c is better than what i suggested only “its what we have now”

things can get better

also, stop reffering to me as the seller. im not the 1 getting undercut in this scenario, im the one buying and i dont want to buy from undercutters

Cormac.3871:

There are 2 ways to ensure that people won’t ruin your sale by undercutting you by a copper. Use the sell now option or list at a fair price that the buy now listings will eventually return to. Putting an item up on the TP is inherently risky and if you are not prepared to just cut your losses on occasion you should just use sell now.

this seems like an argument increadibly biased in favor of the buyer, and for what reason? we can all make more money not using sell now (which would eventually drag all prices down to the point where the economy was not worth participating in (remember runescape) and do not attempt to justify one cupper undercutting as a neccesary form of risk, it serves no benefit, it doesnt even bring prices down for the buyer

tolunart.2095:

The only players who actually care about this issue are the ones who like to make threads about the evil TP undercutters who steal the hard earned play money from someone by pricing just under the current market price. It’s not a real magic sword and you’re not paying for it with real gold coins, the vast majority of players don’t even bother thinking about the moral implications of buying a virtual object that’s one imaginary penny cheaper.

The real issue is “I want to sell my stuff now and when someone undercuts me, then someone undercuts him it takes that much longer to get my play money so I can buy more virtual stuff. Make people buy my stuff instead!”

im not forcing any1 to buy my options so your argument is invalid , instead im giving everyone the choice, you can pick the cheaper one if you want, you dont have to

The issue will still exist whether it’s one fake penny or ten or a fake silver or 15 fake gold lower. You’ll still get undercut and have to wait for your fake money and the devs aren’t going to rearrange the game to suit you.

Aidan Savage.2078:

A copper saved is a copper earned. In short, no way in hell would an idea like this work. The only time it DOES work is when a given item can have various stat combinations (which functions as quality levels) and certain values are determined for various combinations. With GW2, you always get XYZ stats when you by item ABC.

i dont see any logical connections in your post at all. i dont even know what you are saying, are you saying that NOONE would do it cuz a copper is a copper? im living proof otherwise and i am not alone, and what do stat combinations have to do with any of these, please take the time to rethink and rephrase

Wanze.8410:

Duke Nukem.6783:

lets assume you are right and only a few people would do it (i think u sound a bit too confident in this regard but thats just me) it makes a difference to those people, without seriously affecting the economy, and without taking away from the people who dont want to do it, it literally helps everyone without hurting anyone, and its not a big or complex update that would eat up anet’s time if thats what your implying

the real question is, why dont YOU want it done (and keep in mind (“its not a big update” is not a valid answer to this question because not every update has to be big to be meaningful….helping someone is still helping)

I just the think the impact of this change would be so minimal that it shouldnt be a priority. There is nothing wrong with your idea, but in my opinion, it would affect so few people that its not worth the dev time. There have been many other QoL suggestions towards the functionality of the TP that presumingly take the same amount of dev time and would affect way more players in a positive way than yours.

i can admit and aggree to that, but that doesnt mean it should never be done

NonToxic.9185:

Because it solves a problem only you see. Without the greater causes of labour rights or such things to keep me from going to Walmart, their prices are lower because they have set them lower and I would shop there otherwise.

No moral complications exist in a game economy, undercutting is not a problem for me. One copper cheaper is one copper cheaper and I will take that deal every time, I have no greater respect for Seller 100G than seller 99.99G just because one made a listing first.

its probaly not a good idea to use walmart as your example as that hurts tens of millions of people and doesnt actually make things cheaper for u, it just punishes you with hidden costs you dont see (like getting paid less because the people who employ YOU have to compete with goods and services available cheaper)

second, yes a moral complication does exist, just because this isnt “real life” doesnt mean it doesnt matter and the feelings and concerns of other people are still present. there are studies that show that people who think otherwise and behave in an unsavory way in video games tend to develope signs of anti social personality disorder. in other words, your beliefs about other people in game can affect your beliefs about people in real life, dont let video games turn you into a rotten person

third, and while this is my own opinion i DO have more respect for that person who put in for 100g instead of 99g , if only for lack of respect for the under cutter, he could have chosen to put his offer in for the same offer, but fear of losing to ANOTHER undercutter forced him to undercut first. thats what this current system is, an economy of fear and paranoia, is that the economy you want?

lets assume you are right and only a few people would do it (i think u sound a bit too confident in this regard but thats just me) it makes a difference to those people, without seriously affecting the economy, and without taking away from the people who dont want to do it, it literally helps everyone without hurting anyone, and its not a big or complex update that would eat up anet’s time if thats what your implying

the real question is, why dont YOU want it done (and keep in mind (“its not a big update” is not a valid answer to this question because not every update has to be big to be meaningful….helping someone is still helping)