Guild Wars 2

End the zerk meta, create a new meta. People who don’t want to use the optimal build cry about the new meta. And so it goes on and on and all the while those who have bothered to get ascended get the shaft each time.

If we suddenly arrive at a mixed group optimal meta (trinity style group) then people moan that their causal five man ranger group can’t do stuff and clamour for a change because they “can’t play how I want to play”.

I also gather that we will be nerfing/ending the PVT meta in W3 at the same time? Not only does it dominate the bulk of W3, it is also relatively strong in PVE. Quick nerf it into the ground, it’s just not fair!

None of the above.

Name in use already.7294:

Cat Has Ducks.1982:

Frostpyro.5942:

Rezz.8019:

Zerker = high risk and high reward (timewise)
Defensive stuff = low risk and low reward (timewise)

Working as intended.

The problem with it is that Zerker doesn’t really offer high risk atm in GW2. Everything is able to be dodged, blocked, or reflected. If they actually had instances where you couldn’t avoid taking at least a few auto attacks I would agree.

For most pugs it seems to be high enough risk to scare them away from using it. I wished most people used zerker gear…. Its just not the case.

This proves the point everyones try to make. This should not be how it is, zerker should not be the ONLY build, hence why it needs changing in some way.

It isn’t the only build. It is the go to build for those players and groups capable of using it.

You can make a non zerk group and run the content. Someone can make a zerk group and do the content faster. I’m not sure why another group clearing content faster then you in your non dps set up is such a massive issue.

There will always be a most effective build and group comp. If zerker gets the chop, some other set up will become optimal and everyone will start crying about that build.

haviz.1340:

oZii.2864:

I take away from the discussion that people want to basically hop out of WvW in their full PVT armor open LFG and get a group without being called out that they aren’t zerker.

I’m not going to claim it’s the truth since we lack any kind of a proof but I would assume that there are a lot of people like that.

It is quite likely that there is some truth to that.

If and when the meta changes, the same people moaning about zerkers will simply moan about the new optimal set up. The cycle will never end.

Richo.3081:

Bright.9160:

Shadoekin.3928:

Nike Porphyrogenita.8137:

People who say “there is no control” in this game are absolutely idiotic. Control is the thing that allows DPS to work as well as it does. All members of the party bring control elements in a successful speed run group, working as intended by design.

What you DON’T have is a dedicate “control player” who sits there and CC-locks bosses the whole fight to allow people to beat down bosses Bjarl fruit style.

I suspect that the desire for “pure control” comes from disgruntled pvt WvW stunlock zerg hammer warriors who are told they arent so hot in pve and cant fathom the idea of not using a different build for a different game mode.

I believe the “control” that is being discussed is on disabling effects, and not kiting conditions (crippled/chilled) or mitigators (blinds/weakness).

And exactly, there should be no reason why a hammer warrior should not be as useful as a GS/Axe+X warrior. Just as why a condition player should not be rendered useless when there is already a condition player in the party.

This entire thread is about balance and ensuring everyone is welcomed to play how they want, when they want.

“Play how you want” doesn’t mean that every build and every profession should be equally effective at every aspect of the game. This was even stated at some point by a dev.

“Play how you want” means that any team setup with any set of builds should be able to finish content. The ease and comfort of the completion however, is subject to which build and team setup you’re running.

The fact that someone would honestly think that any setup should be just as effective as a full zerker team truly shows the delusions some people have to deal with.

This x10000

Yep.

The “play however I want” crowd is great. The “play however I want and it must always be just as effective as groups of people who have totally optimized their set ups in order to speed run content” crowd which seems to be the most vocal about zerker gear though, is rather daft.

Amiron.1067:

Something I see people saying a lot of around this thread is that ANet is about to nerf zerker gear. They never said that. Jon Peters stated they’re going to address the dominance of zerker/DPS builds in PvE. This does not mean they’re nerfing Zerkers, so put down your torches and pitch forks, everyone. Could they nerf it? Possibly. Could they have something else in mind? Also possible.

I’m interested in seeing what they’ll come up with.

It’s ANet, it will be a nerf.

You are right, it’s not a problem.

Omg people who bother to spec dps, dodge and form dedicated speed clear groups are doing content faster than me on my full clerics support toon. Nerf them, nerf them all!

It would require a combat mechanic and mob attack pattern overhaul in order to change the current situation. Something unlikely to happen.

We are more likely to see a nerf which will only make things worse.

Daerian.6523:

Then you shouldn’t choose Tequatl, one of the few places of the game when Zerker is more than suboptimal, as point of your anegdote/example.

Yes, i’ll readily admit it was a god awful example.

Daerian.6523:

Fenrir.3609:

Daerian.6523:

Fenrir.3609:

It will be somwhat amusing if zerk gets nerfed and then everyone starts moaning that everything is taking to long to kill.

“Omg do more damage to Teq you nubs we are running out of time!!”.

Expecially because you can’t crit Tequal, so Berserker is useless against him. I would seriously laught if any berserker would call Soldier gear user “noob” at Tequal.

If only zerkers had power.

If only Zerkers could take more than one hit Tequatl or dodge everthing in this mass of people…
If we are talking about using only Zerker in dungeons because it’s “optimal” and calling everybody “noob” if they are not, you should do the same to people using Zerker at Tequatl, because it’s far from optimal. Or you are just duplicitous.

There was no mention whatsoever about dungeons in that post.

There was no mention whatsoever about anyone who ever enters a dungeon in non zerk gear being a noob in that post.

There was no mention that anyone who ever entered a dungeon or pve’d should be “zerk” in that post.

I didn’t even comment on soldiers gear in the post.

The post reflects on a period in the future which may see non zerk players calling others nubs or otherwise getting upset because they bemoan the lack of damage due to a zerk nerf, not visa versa.

Zerkers can survive just fine doing the Teq encounter should they know what they are doing. If they get dropped then wearing PVT or any other gear is unlikely to have saved them due to the nature of their death (i.e. massive damage).

At no point at all have I been duplicitous. The general point of the post was obvious, if they nerf glass cannons then it would not be a surpise if many of those calling for the nerf subsequently get upset that the content is taking longer because there is less dps going about.

If you want to wear PVT et al in pve, you go for it. Not sure why you should complain that those in more glass damage gear can run faster groups, clear content quicker if they know what they are doing mind you.

Daerian.6523:

Fenrir.3609:

It will be somwhat amusing if zerk gets nerfed and then everyone starts moaning that everything is taking to long to kill.

“Omg do more damage to Teq you nubs we are running out of time!!”.

Expecially because you can’t crit Tequal, so Berserker is useless against him. I would seriously laught if any berserker would call Soldier gear user “noob” at Tequal.

If only zerkers had power.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

thefantasticg.3984:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

If I had to back off occasionally it’ll make it all the more important that I do as much damage as I can as fast as I can. It doesn’t lessen that because I don’t want encounters to last longer. I mean really. After the 10,000th Frozen Maw fight I want it to go as fast as possible.

True, however right now, Berserker-geared people don’t ever need to back off. Thus, their DPS is high all the time. If they did have to back off, then the killing time goes up, bringing Zerker gear more in line with other gear sets.

You do not have to back off, so long as everyone is running the optimal set up and knows exactly what they are doing. Hence why speed run zerk groups are so picky, if the group composition breaks down or the group doesn’t know what it is doing, then it is a fiasco.

Watch an encounter which contains nub zerkers or zerkers mixed within a non optimal pug composition and see how well they do without “backing off”.

If people are talking about open world boss fights, then for the main part that is face roll passive crud regardless as to what gear you are speccing and people should be somewhat pleased others are stacking damage in order to make said boring fights as fast as possible.

It will be somwhat amusing if zerk gets nerfed and then everyone starts moaning that everything is taking to long to kill.

“Omg do more damage to Teq you nubs we are running out of time!!”.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Fenrir.3609:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

There is a differnce in nerfing a set of gear (which they won’t do, that throws off the stat calculations) and making the play environments less favorable to said gear setup. This is apparent in PvP where Zerker amulet is nowhere close to dominant (though it does get used). The difference in the attack frequency and comparative unpredictablility of players is the main cause for this.

Which is down to the combat mechanics. If they are going to promote diversity by altering the combat mechanics, then they have a chance of making it work… but it is a hell of an overhaul.

Wrong. Combat mechanics would remain the same. All that would change is NPC attack routines. Frequent, low damage attacks could not all be avoided (the current NPC attack style of slow, big attacks can), and the damage would add up, forcing Zerker players to back off occasionally.

Well no, it’s not wrong at all really. NPC attack routines are all part of the pve combat mechanics. Hence I have mentioned telegraphed spike attacks from npcs in the past.

Perhaps you didn’t see those posts or perhaps I hadn’t explained it well enough.

The way the npcs actually engage in combat falls under the jurisdiction of pve combat mechanics as far as I am concerned. You need to alter that if you are going to promote build diversity, simply reducing the damage output on zerk will do fk all to promote build diversity.

Which is why we see such a marked difference in gear set ups between pve and w3/pvp.

AntiGw.9367:

mahariel.4981:

It’s entirely wrong. People don’t play pvt because they “can’t actively mitigate”.

Then please give an alternate reason.

They want a different type of experience from the game, obviously.

Such as?

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

There is a differnce in nerfing a set of gear (which they won’t do, that throws off the stat calculations) and making the play environments less favorable to said gear setup. This is apparent in PvP where Zerker amulet is nowhere close to dominant (though it does get used). The difference in the attack frequency and comparative unpredictablility of players is the main cause for this.

Which is down to the combat mechanics. If they are going to promote diversity by altering the combat mechanics, then they have a chance of making it work… but it is a hell of an overhaul.

If they just nerf zerk gear, then they will simply make the next highest dps set up the new king of the hill for pve.

The impression is that some simply hate the fact that those in zerk gear can clear content faster than they can and as such they want a nerf, regardless as to the actual merits of that nerf.

Robert.4197:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

Because it divides the community. I run PVT guardian and ran HOW P1, ended up with all zerkers. At the end boss, everyone kept going down and 1 guy died next to an NPC, when I went to rez him, I ended up rezzing the NPC instead. This guy calls me out on it and I apologize. Then he proceeds to say that the reason we are having trouble is because I can’t do enough damage and that the NPC probably does more damage then I do. Well, the other party members didn’t like that comment and actually decided to kick him. We got another party member and finished the dungeon.

I decide to do SE path 1 and everyone decides to stack in the corner for the 3 golems, everyone goes down in a matter of a few seconds. I could tell they were zerkers. After 3 tries we finally got it. After finishing that path, went on to p3. Well, group decided to run past all the mobs right before the first boss and all the enemies got aggroed, followed and wiped everyone out 2 times. After everyone was already downed the 3rd time within a matter of seconds, I just decided to call it quits today. Next time I’m in a dungeon, I’m almost thinking about posting “No Zerkers” I mean maybe I can’t kill enemies as fast as the other people but if people are going down after 1 or 2 hits, how much faster can it be to have to start over and over and over again because the whole party wipes?

So you run a couple of dungeons with some nubs and that is enough reason to want a nerf on zerk which will in itself do absolutely fk all in promoting gear diversity?

If anything your examples demonstrate that it is not easy to run in zerk gear unless you know what you are doing. Which is why they can and should be able to clear stuff faster if they do actually know what they are doing.

No, I should be allowed to stack toughness and healing power and simply facetank all the enemies without having to think about dodging, moving and situational awareness.

At the same time I should be able to clear the content just as fast as those people who go full glass in order to maximise damage and take the time to learn to dodge and learn the encounters.

nagymbear.5280:

Fenrir.3609:

nagymbear.5280:

Just to be clear. You buy a car and after 1 day of use you cannot sell it at the same price. There is nothing new here (at least for me). You level a prof, patch comes out, you rage and roll something else. An MMO changin all the time due to its very nature. If you don’t like wasting your time, don’t play an MMO.

It’s time gated, end game, BiS gear that requires a massive grind. The introduction of stuff like ascended was always going to be an issue if they decided to make significant alterations to the combat meta outside of the spvp scope.

If you can’t see the issue after it has been repeatedly pointed out then there is little point in going over it again.

You keep talking about that nerf. Is something already announced? And I totally get it. Something is the best thing now, so you go for it, put in a lot of effort and gets not so great anymore. Do you see condition builds being the meta in PVE? How? Your ascended berserker gear (which IMO you didn’t even need) will be just as good. Trust me. Its not like fill zerker warriors will become extinct overnight. If you have problems with some part of the game being changed (not on a whim mind you), than don’t play an MMO, you’ll be off better for it.

People expect change in an mmo, I don’t need you to tell me to change gaming genre thanks.

Your comment alluding to the fact that people can simply go out and buy exotics so they shouldn’t complain about their ascended getting potentially nerfed was somewhat ridiculous.

nagymbear.5280:

Just to be clear. You buy a car and after 1 day of use you cannot sell it at the same price. There is nothing new here (at least for me). You level a prof, patch comes out, you rage and roll something else. An MMO changin all the time due to its very nature. If you don’t like wasting your time, don’t play an MMO.

It’s time gated, end game, BiS gear that requires a massive grind. The introduction of stuff like ascended was always going to be an issue if they decided to make significant alterations to the combat meta outside of the spvp scope.

By selling things, preferably for more then I bought them for.

nagymbear.5280:

Fenrir.3609:

nagymbear.5280:

Meglobob.8620:

All those players who grinded there kitten off for ascended with berserker stats are going to be so happy now…

All that wasted gold, laurels, time etc…

Anet snap there fingers and ‘poof’ your back to where you started…

Because you cannot do content in exotics… riiight.

That’s a joke right?

Well why exactly did you craf ascended? Don’t tell me for the looks.

It’s crafted for the stat advantage, that is not the point though is it.

Having all that grind/time/gold potentially invalidated due to a nerf is not all of a sudden made okay simply because I can go out and spend gold an a crappy exotic set.

It is even less okay when simply nerfing zerker gear would have zero positive impact in terms of promoting build diversity in pve as that will only be achieved by altering the fundamental combat and encounter mechanics and promoting a trinity system. Things which seem highly unlikely to happen.

So no, being able to buy exotics does not make it okay that peoples ascended gear possibly gets turned to crud due to a nerf which is both ineffectual and also seemingly only done to appease a bunch of whiners who complain that people able to use zerkers are clearing content faster then them in there “I want to use my lol play how I wantz random zet up”.

nagymbear.5280:

Meglobob.8620:

All those players who grinded there kitten off for ascended with berserker stats are going to be so happy now…

All that wasted gold, laurels, time etc…

Anet snap there fingers and ‘poof’ your back to where you started…

Because you cannot do content in exotics… riiight.

That’s a joke right?

fellyn.5083:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

Zerker gear gives power, perc and crit damage, the high power and crit chance/damage make it the viable option for dps. The downside of it should be the lack of survivability but that’s not the case. There are alternatives to zerker anyway like assassins only with less power.

edit: and for the ppl with ascended gear already zerker, If you had magic find gear before then know that its possible to change gear stats to whatever you want.

You didn’t address the question. Why would a nerf on zerker be good?

You would need a total overhaul of the combat system/mechanics in order not to favour pure dmg and the ability to move/time/stack correctly over some guy stacking toughness.

A nerf to damage for the zerk set would do nothing for the game without the above. Which let’s face it, isn’t going to happen.

If you are going to move away from mobs with telegraphed massive spike damage attacks, move away from action/dodge combat and move towards a trinity system with dedicated healers et al. Then nerfing dps gear makes sense but becomes redundant anyway.

If you are just going to nerf the damage output of the glass cannon set up and err, that’s it. Then you are going to make things worse frankly.

As for “go assassins”, and? Kill stuff a bit slower? Awesome, that’s a step forward right there. That is, until people wearing PVT start moaning that those in assassins are clearing dungeons faster than them and we get another cry for nerfs.

they don’t really need to over haul the game’s combat mechanic just because they went and nerfed zerker, that would be an over reaction because the ability to move/time/stack correctly is not connected with zerker gear.

Nerfing zerker gear isn’t just so you kill stuff slower, the gear setup often provides high power and damage and high crit chance/damage which together just burns everything too fast with no downside. Bosses cant react because they’re dead after a few seconds, If anything it encourages boss design with high hp pools. A nerf would really benefit build diversity.

And they should also nerf PVT specially to deter zerging, but that’s for another day.

You’re pretty clueless. If they nerf berserker the people who stay around after that will just move onto the next highest dps set and then the next and so on. And the cycle will repeat.

The only way that doesn’t happen is like the guy said, if you rework the entire combat mechanic from the ground up to encourage the use of other gear sets.

Take away the reasons why berserker gear is good and lo and behold, berserker gear isn’t a problem anymore.

As it is right now there is no reason to stack toughness or health in PvE because bosses are going to 1 shot you no matter what you do it. And that is why people like berserker. Killing stuff faster means you don’t have to worry about getting 1 shot as much.

Berserker gear is a symptom of the problem much like a cough is a symptom of a cold. Getting rid of berserker gear isn’t going to fix the main problem.

you can try posting here, maybe they’ll hear you better.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/PvE-Zerkers/page/2#post3480565

Unless you just like calling me clueless then be my guest.

I don’t know the post in which I quoted shows that you don’t understand the core issue and why people use berserker gear to begin with.

keep going.

You’re having trouble reading the rest of the posts on this page?

go on.

Go on what?

Instead of trying to refute the points I made above he just referred me to another thread. Which I find odd because he was posting in this thread too. If he didn’t want to have a discussion in this thread he perhaps shouldn’t have posted in it.

In fairness he had already referenced my post and also stated him/herself why your points on the subject seem incorrect and why a nerf on zerk is ludicrous as it is a fundamental combat mechanic/encounter issue.

You nerf zerker and you don’t suddenly make the likes of clerics an amazing dungeon set up, instead you simply promote the next highest damage set up to “alpha” for those able to actually move out of the way of getting hit.

The combat system is set up in such a way as to promote dodging attacks and dealing as much damage as possible. Unless you are going to overhaul/change the combat mechanics and the way combat scenarios work (reduce telegraphed spike attacks, introduce condi weak mobs et al), then you are simply going to make things worse by nerfing zerk.

The only people this will appease is the people who get bent out of shape because those able to wear zerk and use it correctly can clear content faster than they can whilst they are using a more crutch set up.

Again, the only way of effectively reducing the dps meta is to overhaul the combat system and changing the way encounters work, not simply by nerfing zerk.

Furthermore, even when that is done, people will still min/max, there will still always be an optimal set up and group composition, there will always be the so called “elite” (i.e. good players) who run speed groups and look for specific group compositions. That will always be the case, are those people who are currently whining about zerk at the moment going to start whining about the next “pro set up” in the future? Yes, yes they will, and so it goes on.

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

Zerker gear gives power, perc and crit damage, the high power and crit chance/damage make it the viable option for dps. The downside of it should be the lack of survivability but that’s not the case. There are alternatives to zerker anyway like assassins only with less power.

edit: and for the ppl with ascended gear already zerker, If you had magic find gear before then know that its possible to change gear stats to whatever you want.

You didn’t address the question. Why would a nerf on zerker be good?

You would need a total overhaul of the combat system/mechanics in order not to favour pure dmg and the ability to move/time/stack correctly over some guy stacking toughness.

A nerf to damage for the zerk set would do nothing for the game without the above. Which let’s face it, isn’t going to happen.

If you are going to move away from mobs with telegraphed massive spike damage attacks, move away from action/dodge combat and move towards a trinity system with dedicated healers et al. Then nerfing dps gear makes sense but becomes redundant anyway.

If you are just going to nerf the damage output of the glass cannon set up and err, that’s it. Then you are going to make things worse frankly.

As for “go assassins”, and? Kill stuff a bit slower? Awesome, that’s a step forward right there. That is, until people wearing PVT start moaning that those in assassins are clearing dungeons faster than them and we get another cry for nerfs.

they don’t really need to over haul the game’s combat mechanic just because they went and nerfed zerker, that would be an over reaction because the ability to move/time/stack correctly is not connected with zerker gear.

Nerfing zerker gear isn’t just so you kill stuff slower, the gear setup often provides high power and damage and high crit chance/damage which together just burns everything too fast with no downside. Bosses cant react because they’re dead after a few seconds, If anything it encourages boss design with high hp pools. A nerf would really benefit build diversity.

And they should also nerf PVT specially to deter zerging, but that’s for another day.

You’re pretty clueless. If they nerf berserker the people who stay around after that will just move onto the next highest dps set and then the next and so on. And the cycle will repeat.

The only way that doesn’t happen is like the guy said, if you rework the entire combat mechanic from the ground up to encourage the use of other gear sets.

Take away the reasons why berserker gear is good and lo and behold, berserker gear isn’t a problem anymore.

As it is right now there is no reason to stack toughness or health in PvE because bosses are going to 1 shot you no matter what you do it. And that is why people like berserker. Killing stuff faster means you don’t have to worry about getting 1 shot as much.

Berserker gear is a symptom of the problem much like a cough is a symptom of a cold. Getting rid of berserker gear isn’t going to fix the main problem.

you can try posting here, maybe they’ll hear you better.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/PvE-Zerkers/page/2#post3480565

Unless you just like calling me clueless then be my guest.

I don’t know the post in which I quoted shows that you don’t understand the core issue and why people use berserker gear to begin with.

keep going.

You’re having trouble reading the rest of the posts on this page?

go on.

Go on what?

Sirendor.1394:

mahariel.4981:

Because zerker is keyboard roll most of the time. Spamming as much dmg as you can.

Is it really?

Or is that just playing zerker badly?

I know when I play I make every button press with intent.

It’s still a hell of a lot easier than anything else. Support and utility roles require you to know what you’re doing. Zerker requires you to know 2 things: dodging and mashing all your damage buttons.

Yeah, that’s a load of rubbish in all honesty.

Doggie.3184:

Fenrir.3609:

Doggie.3184:

Fenrir.3609:

Doggie.3184:

Just finished making my 6th Berserker piece of Ascended armor.
Nice news to see. /sarcasm Hope it’s not something that makes me regret crafting the only armor viable on Thief. :o

Didn’t you know, nerfing zerker will suddenly make all the other armour types viable for you. Awesome right, get working on that clerics gear!

Have you been around long enough to understand how awkward some of our patches are?

I think you may have missed the sarcasm there.

I think you misunderstood my question. >.>

Probably, it is rather late.

I’ll just answer “yes”.

Doggie.3184:

Fenrir.3609:

Doggie.3184:

Just finished making my 6th Berserker piece of Ascended armor.
Nice news to see. /sarcasm Hope it’s not something that makes me regret crafting the only armor viable on Thief. :o

Didn’t you know, nerfing zerker will suddenly make all the other armour types viable for you. Awesome right, get working on that clerics gear!

Have you been around long enough to understand how awkward some of our patches are?

I think you may have missed the sarcasm there.

Doggie.3184:

Just finished making my 6th Berserker piece of Ascended armor.
Nice news to see. /sarcasm Hope it’s not something that makes me regret crafting the only armor viable on Thief. :o

Didn’t you know, nerfing zerker will suddenly make all the other armour types viable for you. Awesome right, get working on that clerics gear!

BeoErgon.9107:

spoj.9672:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Are people, like, not aware that you can just made another set of gear if Anet actually does nerf zerk? It’s not like you’re limited to one set of gear per character or anything like that.

After spending 1000g on ascended gear I dont think ill be too pleased about that.

This is part of the mess I was talking about. Their super idea of ascended that stuck people more or less to one role is coming to haunt Anet and limit their actions.

I will sit down and see how they are going to do it.

PS : I think they can’t really do much, but we will see.

Make ascended like legendaries in that you can switch stats as and when you like “outside of combat” and you resolve the issue.

Ofc that doesn’t detract from the fact that a nerf to zerk without some kind of combat mechanics alteration makes zero sense.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Are people, like, not aware that you can just made another set of gear if Anet actually does nerf zerk? It’s not like you’re limited to one set of gear per character or anything like that.

Yes because crafting a new full set of ascended armour, weapons and grabing new ascended trinkets takes no time at all.

they don’t really need to over haul the game’s combat mechanic just because they went and nerfed zerker, that would be an over reaction because the ability to move/time/stack correctly is not connected with zerker gear.

Nerfing zerker gear isn’t just so you kill stuff slower, the gear setup often provides high power and damage and high crit chance/damage which together just burns everything too fast with no downside. Bosses cant react because they’re dead after a few seconds, If anything it encourages boss design with high hp pools. A nerf would really benefit build diversity.

And they should also nerf PVT specially to deter zerging, but that’s for another day.

The reason zerker is the go to for people able to use it, is exactly because of the combat mechanics. Simply nerfing dps on zerker is not going to change how people play, instead all it will do is see people migrate to the next highest damage set up. So we have exactly the same scenario only everything is dying a bit slower and everyone is getting a bit more peeved off.

To remove dps as the go to for the people able to dodge, and to promote other set ups, then you need to alter the combat mechanics and not simply nerf zerker.

A base nerf to zerker would not improve diversity at all.

AntiGw.9367:

About time they did something about zerkers.

Again, why?

If there is any issue, it is with the way the general combat mechanics work, not with zerker gear.

It is as clear as day why people able to dodge and coordinate a group are going to squeeze more potential out of damage gear in a spike heavy, dodge based, highly telegraphed combat system.

If they are going to overhaul the combat mechanics, or add in mobs/encounters which are direct damage resistant and remove all the 1 shot kill attacks et al. Then they have a chance of making the combat system more rounded and in turn promoting other gear choices in pve.

If they just nerf zerk gear on the back of people whining about speed clear groups, well then it is going to be a monumental fk up.

Adam.4103:

Because they don’t have a particularly good record when it comes to balancing.

Richo.3081:

In this thread:

• People who put on zerker gear and die every 3 seconds
• People who can’t use the dodge function AS INTENDED (holy **** you can EVADE an ENTIRE attack?!)
• People who can’t complete dungeons in less than 4 hours and feel bad others can do it in 4 minutes
• People who think the meta for old MMO’s should be the same for all MMO’s

Sadly this probably isn’t far from the truth.

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

Zerker gear gives power, perc and crit damage, the high power and crit chance/damage make it the viable option for dps. The downside of it should be the lack of survivability but that’s not the case. There are alternatives to zerker anyway like assassins only with less power.

edit: and for the ppl with ascended gear already zerker, If you had magic find gear before then know that its possible to change gear stats to whatever you want.

You didn’t address the question. Why would a nerf on zerker be good?

You would need a total overhaul of the combat system/mechanics in order not to favour pure dmg and the ability to move/time/stack correctly over some guy stacking toughness.

A nerf to damage for the zerk set would do nothing for the game without the above. Which let’s face it, isn’t going to happen.

If you are going to move away from mobs with telegraphed massive spike damage attacks, move away from action/dodge combat and move towards a trinity system with dedicated healers et al. Then nerfing dps gear makes sense but becomes redundant anyway.

If you are just going to nerf the damage output of the glass cannon set up and err, that’s it. Then you are going to make things worse frankly.

As for “go assassins”, and? Kill stuff a bit slower? Awesome, that’s a step forward right there. That is, until people wearing PVT start moaning that those in assassins are clearing dungeons faster than them and we get another cry for nerfs.

Aza.2105:

haviz.1340:

Aza.2105:

Its funny because in traditional mmorpgs dps players are considered the bottom tier out of the holy trinity. The problem was that it was always difficult to find healer and tank, you have to question why that is.

I never played any mmo but I would assume that it’s because of utter boredom, at least the case of healers.

Maybe also because it’s harder to play get gold by farming solo. Just making assumptions.

Well for solo healer/tank would just spec into a dps oriented build, so it wasn’t the problem. The biggest problem was the responsibility those two archetypes carry. If the group wipes the tank and healer would be blamed. So in short not many people wanted to carry the responsibility.

DPS classes in comparison didn’t have much responsibility other than killing the target. There was much more micromanaging on healer and tanks, thus requiring a higher skill cap to play them.

In my experience in other mmos, it was only ever an issue (getting dedicated healers) when you ran pug groups (shudder), and even then it wasn’t that hard tbh. Most good pvp guilds in particular had a morass of dedicated healers.

Faranox.4217:

Do you find this surprising?

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

This is probably going to end badly.

Manuhell.2759:

Fenrir.3609:

“Glass cannons who know how to move out of the way of damage and know how to stack effectively can do more damage than me when I’m wearing defensive gear and trying to facetank, it’s not fair!!!”.

The problem is that not only they do more damage, but it is also more safe to wear zerk and kill quickly than to wear defensive items and slug it on. Because defensive items don’t defend much anyway – maybe you resist one or two more hits – and stats like healing power have very small benefits.

Also, zerkers have stats that are all multiplicative between them in the damage calculations. And that’s why it works so well – the effect ends being exponential.
Unlike the other gear types.

Zerkers/dps does that if the person/group knows what they are doing. In a more action based combat system (which this is meant to be in comparison to your typical mmo) that makes perfect sense.

In order to effectively overhaul the system without making a “lets just nerf x” screw up of it, then you have to overhaul the entire emphasis of the combat system and take it away from the “no trinity, action combat” style.

“Glass cannons who know how to move out of the way of damage and know how to stack effectively can do more damage than me when I’m wearing defensive gear and trying to facetank, it’s not fair!!!”.

Will you be giving free changes for ascended gear when you make changes to the meta, given you decided on time gating BiS items?

Why do I get the feeling you are going to totally f*** this up.

Some of the comments in this thread are quite cringeworthy. Anyway thanks for the video OP.

In no particular order.

1. Lack of balance.
2. Lack of build diversity.
3. Lack of alternative game modes.
4. An ever worsening meta.
5. An ever worsening gameplay experience.
6. The sheer amount of low skill based cheese play.
7. Too much AI clutter.
8. Subpar targeting system.
9. Non normalized character size models.
10. Subpar matchmaking and ranking.
11. Lack of seasonal leagues/tournaments.
12. Lack of direction and/or ability on the part of the developer team. Might be harsh, maybe they have their hands tied, same net result though.
13. Kitten poor PR/comments.
14. Car crash forum moderation and terrible communication.

waka.9826:

kitten s.7421:

I wish they put the same amount of effort in pvp as they do in living story.

they should rename pvp to dead story.

Ha! Well played.

It’s not the champ farm, it’s the recent T7 changes (Dragontie etc). The champ farm was posing zero issue in terms of overflow prior to the ascended update patches.

So no, don’t nerf the champ farms thanks.