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This will not end well....in my view

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

But is there an OFFICIAL CLARIFICATION on this issue thus far? I afraid not. But no worry, the complaints will die down sooner than later (which I believe its the delay tactics Anet is using to tide them over this ‘crisis’) because those who complains but still cannot find closure to the issue would have left the game. I believe many of these players are having a fun time playing PlanetSide 2 now. Its a sad day for GW2.

The problem with an official clarification in my opinion is this issue has been so overblown and every single thing said has been jumped on analysed in detail and twisted to mean something negativite never intended that you’re not going to get an official reply before it has been vetted by a ton of people! No one is going to risk posting something that might be misinterpretted!

Really no.

if i ask you:
there will be a new tier after the ascended one?

if you reply:
no im not going to release a new tier every 3 months
you let the road open to misinformation

but if you reply
no, this is the last tier we release
or
yes this is only the beginning
How this can be misinterpreted?

Bet not even the CEO can take such a definitive position much less someone posting a clarrification that hasnt been vetted by god knows how many suits.

Things might also change in the future you cant really exclude anything! That to me is a no but at the same time reserving the right to change direction if needed. And yes I know what you’re going to say thats exactly what you dont want to hear but you have to understand its the best any business can do!

And dont get me wrong I dont want to see a new tier just as much as you if not more! But I understand there is a limit of how much any business can promise.

This will not end well....in my view

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

But is there an OFFICIAL CLARIFICATION on this issue thus far? I afraid not. But no worry, the complaints will die down sooner than later (which I believe its the delay tactics Anet is using to tide them over this ‘crisis’) because those who complains but still cannot find closure to the issue would have left the game. I believe many of these players are having a fun time playing PlanetSide 2 now. Its a sad day for GW2.

The problem with an official clarification in my opinion is this issue has been so overblown and every single thing said has been jumped on analysed in detail and twisted to mean something negativite never intended that you’re not going to get an official reply before it has been vetted by a ton of people! No one is going to risk posting something that might be misinterpretted!

The issue hasn’t been overblown. The only thing I can suggest to help you understand the issue is to read the manifesto and the introduction of the Ascended gear piece side-by-side. If the non-sequitur doesn’t smack you in the face it’s probably best to just accept that some people get it rather than continuing to misrepresent the community’s reaction to the violation of the manifesto.

To me personally Ascended gear doesnt break anything about the manifesto! but I understand this is a personal thing! some people feel they have to have ascended gear as in to them its something thats required! personally I dont even want it, I like to play all Gw2 world from level 1 zone to level 80 zones and they’re all too easy as it is even though I dont even have a full exotic gear! So how does Ascended gear contradict statements like no grinding? or no gated content? or Play long term just for cosmetics?

As long as all content is playable without having Ascended gear and till today it is including FoTM! I personally dont feel they did something against the spirit of the manifesto!

This will not end well....in my view

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

But is there an OFFICIAL CLARIFICATION on this issue thus far? I afraid not. But no worry, the complaints will die down sooner than later (which I believe its the delay tactics Anet is using to tide them over this ‘crisis’) because those who complains but still cannot find closure to the issue would have left the game. I believe many of these players are having a fun time playing PlanetSide 2 now. Its a sad day for GW2.

The problem with an official clarification in my opinion is this issue has been so overblown and every single thing said has been jumped on analysed in detail and twisted to mean something negativite never intended that you’re not going to get an official reply before it has been vetted by a ton of people! No one is going to risk posting something that might be misinterpretted!

That is the inexperience of Anet on handling such issue. If there is an issue, the number one thing to do in PR is to issue a statement to ACKNOWLEDGE the matter. The statement need not go into detail (which you said need more brain work to draft) but just a confirmation that a more detail clarification will be released in due course. Even if it requires a tonne of people to draft and vet through such statement release, it has to be done and it has to be done 24 by 7 asap if Anet really appreciate the importance of addressing the customer concern. I think Anet has missed the “golden hour” for such clarification. Its only damage control at best from this point onwards.

But if Anet don’t think this is an important issue, then it is another matter totally.

Are you sure its that simple? Cause to me Chris Whiteside post tried to do just that but instead cause bigger outlash because of say this:
Our goal is to ensure we have a proper progression for players from exotic up to legendary without a massive jump in reward

People attacked him because they said there is no gap between exotic and legendary as they have the same stats (which is obviously true) though to me he didnt mean a power gap, to me he meant an effort to aquire gap!

End result his clarrification resulted in people calling them liars and manipulators just because the wording of a single sentence wasnt perfectly clear!

This will not end well....in my view

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

“Our goal is to ensure we have a proper progression for players from exotic up to legendary without a massive jump in reward between the two.”

This was written in Linsey Murdock’s announcment here:
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/
before ANet thought it was a good idea to change it a bit. With some google skills, you may find the original though.

Yes and that progression was sticking ascended items in the middle! I hope its clear to you as it is to me that the progression Linsey was talking about there is about the amount of effort required! (exotic has same stats as legendary so there was no progression gab in terms of power, the progression gab is only in terms of effort required).

do you feel that ascended armor isnt enough to fill that gap?

But if exotic and legendary items had the same stats only the latter were much more difficult to get, why wouldn’t they just introduce a new tier with the same stats that was harder to get than exotics but not as hard as legendaries.

Why introducing stronger gear, why updating the legendaries, why all the fuzz if not for creating a gear-treatmill? Call it progression as long as you want, if it ends in a grind for better gear (and well, running FotM 20 times is a fair grind) it is nothing else.

Ah, my bad on the qoute, but you got the point. ^^

exotic and legendary did have the same stats, thats a fact. The reason why they introduced ascended in between because you could get a full exotic gear in days! while it takes months to get a legendary! So what happened was people got exotic set, took one look at a legendary and 1 of 2 things happened (btw again all of this is my speculation not really fact so there is a chance I might be wrong). Some said I dont care about legendaries but I already have my exotic set so what do I do next? (this set of people split into different directions, some worked towards named exotics, some went WvW, and some quit complaining there is no endgame). Those who decided to go legendary were again split into two groups. 1 group said hmm this is a long term goal, I will play the game in a way I have fun and get the legendary when ever! but the other group went Wow there are some many requirements…. grind grind grind… this game is all about grind and not fun at all!

Ascended armor is intended in my opinion to in part address these issues. People who have nothing to do now will have something to work for in the next few months as the various parts of ascended armors are introduced to the game. People who where overwhelmed with the extreme requirements for a legendary have something that takes a lot less effort to get.

Now why did the gear have to be stronger? I suspect thats intended towards players who once that got exotics said there is no end game and quit. Truth is there was plenty of nice cosmetic stuff to get for these people but they didnt see the point. So if ascended armor had the same stats as exotic but just looked better these people would still have ignored it and stuck to the “there is no end game issue”

I believe this was a way in the middle to address this issue!

but again thats just my personal theory.

no problem with the misquote… I just put out a clarrification so I dont risk starting a rumor that Arenanet are trying to change history to cover themselves or something

This will not end well....in my view

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

But is there an OFFICIAL CLARIFICATION on this issue thus far? I afraid not. But no worry, the complaints will die down sooner than later (which I believe its the delay tactics Anet is using to tide them over this ‘crisis’) because those who complains but still cannot find closure to the issue would have left the game. I believe many of these players are having a fun time playing PlanetSide 2 now. Its a sad day for GW2.

The problem with an official clarification in my opinion is this issue has been so overblown and every single thing said has been jumped on analysed in detail and twisted to mean something negativite never intended that you’re not going to get an official reply before it has been vetted by a ton of people! No one is going to risk posting something that might be misinterpretted!

This will not end well....in my view

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

“Our goal is to ensure we have a proper progression for players from exotic up to legendary without a massive jump in reward between the two.”

This was written in Linsey Murdock’s announcment here:
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/
before ANet thought it was a good idea to change it a bit. With some google skills, you may find the original though.

Also you made a little mistake, The statement you quoted didnt come from Linsey’s announcement but from Chris Whiteside’s clarrifcation
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/A-message-from-our-Studio-Design-Director-Chris-Whiteside/first#post721451

This will not end well....in my view

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

“Our goal is to ensure we have a proper progression for players from exotic up to legendary without a massive jump in reward between the two.”

This was written in Linsey Murdock’s announcment here:
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/
before ANet thought it was a good idea to change it a bit. With some google skills, you may find the original though.

Yes and that progression was sticking ascended items in the middle! I hope its clear to you as it is to me that the progression Linsey was talking about there is about the amount of effort required! (exotic has same stats as legendary so there was no progression gab in terms of power, the progression gab is only in terms of effort required).

do you feel that ascended armor isnt enough to fill that gap?

This will not end well....in my view

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

So nope dont feel at all like the game has suddenly changed into a tradational MMO its still entirely viable to play any content with any armor you like!

To me they are just trying to provide content to diverse groups. The ascended gear are intended for people who found exotics too easy to get and legendaries too hard to get. The FotM dungeon is intended for people who want some form of progression. Ignoring all of that will not penalize you in any way really!

The evidence you giving is based on the old GW2. The consequences of the changes have not been fully implemented yet. It will feel different when a team of people have all ascended gear and legendary weapon and your team doesn’t. Let me ask you a question. When will it be enough for these people “who want some form of progression”? You think they will be satisfied after they reach full ascended gear and legendary?

Are you sure there is an old and a new GW2? So far at least Gw2 is still not a gear progression based game! maybe time will prove you right, I really hope not! But right today it still isnt.

Are you sure it will be different? Ascended gear is only 50% better then Exotic (when comparing rare → exotic) and yet I am only geared 33% in exotics myself and have no problem in WvW. Actually I would say that my kill ratio is better then 5:1 and I am not a pvper by any strech of the imagination! Do you really think Ascended gear will so drastically change WvW balance? I personally do not!

I dont know if it will be enough or not, I am not a player who goes for progression. Like I said didnt even feel I had to finish my exotic set even though I am sitting on 25g and could just finish it in like 5 minutes (takes less then 1g to craft it and I can craft it myself) Cant speak for such players but I think its pretty clear that people who hate progression are far greater then those who want it ! just looking at the forum of the size of threads that asked for it and compare that to the size of the thread just being afraid the game might be heading that way gives a clear indication of that!

so why would you be afraid that Arenanet will decide to sacrifce the bulk of its players for a small number of players?

There was a reason why they locked progression to a single dungeon! they could have easily applied the agony mechanic to southern cove if they wanted too yet they didnt! I personally dont think they’re trying to drive the game towards progression, I just think they wanted to offer some progression content to people who like that sort of thing same like they have crafting, jumping puzzles, Dynamic Events, Dungeons etc… Its just all different content targeted at different people who like different things!

This will not end well....in my view

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

My god people.. they added one tier of gear as a one-time gameplay improvement, why the kitten is everyone acting like this is the apocolypse?

The term “slippery slope” comes to mind. Many players here have years of MMO playing experience and they can smell rats from a distance. And they are sounding a warning.

And thats exactly the problem! people measuring Gw2 like any other MMO even though its not! Then you get statements like At max level there are only 2 zones to play in or to get everything in this game is a massive grind!

I bet one of the reasons why they created ascended armor / FoTM was because of such people who are now complaining about it saying it will deprive them of all the content they themselves chose to ignore anyway!

There’s absolutely no reason why they needed to increase statistically superior gear and attach that to new content only 3 months out of the gate. None. They could have added the infusion mechanic to exotics, could have released ascended into the MF set with new looks and made it much more expensive than exotics.

They didn’t. They chose the lazy, cheap and easy way out that also alienated a kittenton of their playerbase. There’s also other forms of progression they could have added to the game vs gear increases. The fact they chose to go with gear grinds just speaks of uncreativity and potential to completely disregard what their game (used to) stood for.

I completely agree with you, I was honestly puzzled about why they did it myself. The only thing I could think of is they designed FoTM to allure to people who seek progression and thus they wanted to jump start the whole process by making the new ascended gear 50% better then a regular tier! At the same time they might have thought the other people who didnt much care about a progression based dungeon which I guess they probably know is the majority of the people could still be enticed to play the content a little bit by providing a little bit of an advantage!

After all armor is tricky, trincets such as rings, rings, amulates etc dont even show so thats 5 slots out of the window. Armor could be made enticing through skins but its hard to create something so desireable that people would be willing to make an effort to get! my Idea is that wanted everyone included so they decided with a 50% better stats just so if you decided you didnt want to go for them you would not be penalised much if anything at all and at the same time still made them a little desirable. Only they underestimated how much their player base wants to have the best gear I guess!

anyhow thats just my theory might be all wrong who knows!

This will not end well....in my view

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

It has already started, and it will continue as more items of the new level will be introduced. “To fill the gap between exotic and legendary items”, the upcoming new legendary items will have to be better again. If this does not sound like a gear-treadmill…

Get the picture?

Honestly no I dont personally dont get the picture. I might misunderstood something along the way but as far as I can tell what they will be introducing is new levels of infusions not new levels of gear! And the only progression they talked about so far happens in the FoTM dungeon which has infinite levels with infinitely increasing difficulty levels which is in turn gated by your skill added together with the level of infision and the resistance it provides.

No where I read did they state they intend to introduce new legendary items that require far more work to get and then filling in the gab between the old legendaries and the new legenderies with yet another gear tier!

This will not end well....in my view

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

My god people.. they added one tier of gear as a one-time gameplay improvement, why the kitten is everyone acting like this is the apocolypse?

The term “slippery slope” comes to mind. Many players here have years of MMO playing experience and they can smell rats from a distance. And they are sounding a warning.

And thats exactly the problem! people measuring Gw2 like any other MMO even though its not! Then you get statements like At max level there are only 2 zones to play in or to get everything in this game is a massive grind!

I bet one of the reasons why they created ascended armor / FoTM was because of such people who are now complaining about it saying it will deprive them of all the content they themselves chose to ignore anyway!

This will not end well....in my view

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Is this really the case or is it actually players who really are pushing for power?

Thing is for me personally I was too busy being distracted by everything that I havent even finished my exotic armor set, do I feel at a disadvantage in any way? not in the least! Actually more of the opposite even with less then 33% of my armor set as exotic I feel overpowered ! I am the type of player who plays for fun and not to get the best gear. In other MMOs that means I am cut off PvP, I honetly felt like really bad at PvP in any game until I gave it a try in GW2. sPvP I have a good track record, I kill some I die some but it feels balanced. In WvW even with my bad set I still feel over powered, kill a lot more then I die ! And mind you not because I would have a bigger zerg with me but also in small skirmishes. Just last month there was a case where our numbers were less then 1/2 theirs in one particular engagement that I was surprised how we managed to push them back (in open field!)

So nope dont feel at all like the game has suddenly changed into a tradational MMO its still entirely viable to play any content with any armor you like!

To me they are just trying to provide content to diverse groups. The ascended gear are intended for people who found exotics too easy to get and legendaries too hard to get. The FotM dungeon is intended for people who want some form of progression. Ignoring all of that will not penalize you in any way really!

Is GW2 A Different MMO Now

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Gw2 is definitely not a different MMO now then it was last week unfortunitely some people percieve it as such and I think thats the biggest problem!

I get side tracked so much I still only have 3 exotic parts to my armor set (am including accessories here) so I got 3 exotic and 8 rare parts on my armor set which is a much bigger gap then a full set of exotic → a full set of ascended armor yet even with me not being a PvP player I can still get my monthly 50 WvW kills in a couple of hours and die no more then 5 – 10 times doing it!

sure better gear gives you a small edge on paper but is that edge so big to have any impact on the game? no really in my opinion!

people are afraid this change will introduce progression / power creep but at least for me I dont see what the ascended gear is needed for except for the FoTM dungeon where the whole thing is centered and thats only after at least level 10 so as such you’re not even bared from that.

And as regards power creep the only thing so far I’ve seen introduce power creep are the people who are afraid of power creep themselves. If you’re the sort of player who just has to have the best stuff, if you’re the sort of player who just has to be 100% efficient all of the time you’re not going to do level 1 – 79 content because it just doesnt pay as much as farming with a zerg level 80 content. Such a person is the one making older content irellevant not the game! Ascended armor or not ascended armor for me personally its still fun playing the whole game! so at least for me, absolutely nothing changed, except there is more fun content to play!

Play the Game for FUN!

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

The patch implicitly changed the old content.

Part of what made Orr fun for me (other than playing an overpowered, unbalanced warrior in dire need of being nerfed) what the fact that there were so many players, that there was so much going on. Orr seemed pretty empty yesterday. Most waypoints were contested.

Orr hasn’t changed?

You started great, I agree that even with rares you feel over powered even in Orr!
but then you said something that I cannot agree with, you suggested that no new content should ever be released so players stick in Orr and dont move on? the new zone is much better balanced and I no longer feel overpowered for the most part and thats a good thing. We need more such stuff not less!

I like the old dungeons. Well, if they’re not bugged. I like to play with guildies. However, it’s becoming harder and harder to make them to go to AC for the tokens for the sword. And understandably so. SO, if I want to go to AC, I have to resort to PUGing it, which is far less fun for me.

Old dungeons have not changed?

Think again. Some things are changed if the context in which they exist is changed.

Why do they refuse to go back to AC? is it because they just want to do FOTM now? And if so do you think its a permanent situation or just something temporary as they explore the new content? AC was just the first dungeon of 8 why did they feel it was okey to go back to it when there were newer dungeon they experianced and why cant the same be true now?

In any case its not the content that change in your example its the people you play with! you cant get your sword from FOTM, AC is still the only place where you can get your skin! the new patch didnt make it any less revelant in any way ! same Goes for Orr, Orr isnt any less rewarding, Orr isnt any worst then it was before and the new zone isnt any better in any way other then in its experiance (good ot have a little challenge finally) Should we deny ourselves a better experiance to protect the status quo? and if so what happens when people start getting fed up repeating the same content?

If you find the added stuff unfun whats the problem with ignoring it?
do you think without ascended items you’ll fail at PvE?

Eventually, the new gear will be needed. It’s been stated that at a certain point, progression through FotM is impossible without it. In case you want to join your friends who go there, you have to farm it, too.

True enough but if you’re doing FotM, you’re doing it for the ascended items so why would it be a problem farming the very thing you’re essentially farming? Thats not to mention that you should be playing FotM multiple times because you want progression, if you want a non progressive dungeon you should be playing the other content! I mean If I like PvE why should be a problem for me that sPvP has no PvE in it? its not something I like so I dont do it!

do you think without ascended items everyone will kill you in WvW?

I like to know that I’m doing the best I can in order to help my team. Not anymore. I’m not doing the best I can. Others are farming for better gear to win in WvW but I don’t, because I hate grind. I feel like letting my team down (a little bit). Bad emotion tied to the game.

The best you can do is relative! WvW is an open ended experiance which means everyone in it can essentially always do better! You could for example spend all night grindng with no sleep to get the gold necessary to buy siege weapons the next day! But like said you dont find grinding fun so it wouldnt be a good idea to do that, but still should you feel bad that you’re not doing the best you can do ? no! because the best you can do is relative! likewise why is it a problem if you’re not dressed in anscended armor on day one? (in the future ascended armor will drop in WvW too so in time you can still be at your best!)

whats the real issue why this patch made what was fun before suddenly be unfun?

As stated above, it’s all about context.

I will go a step further and say its all about perception! You mentioned doing the best you can do and thats obviously a moving target! I could for example spend $100 a day buying gems, selling them and supply my WvW group with an endless supply of golems. I am sure you will not feel bad about not doing that though and you definitely shouldnt! You also mentioned grinding and said you’re not willing to do that cause you dont enjoy it. Nor should you and you dont feel bad about which is good! but why is this armor any different then any other grind? answer it isnt, its just perception!

Play the Game for FUN!

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I play the game, I am having fun, and I don’t need convincing otherwise.

Just because some of you don’t appear to be having fun, doesn’t mean that you have a moral obligation to convince me to share your opinion.

We aren’t trying to convince you. We are trying to convince ANET that they messed up. If you play MMOs for gear treadmill and progression then I have to ask, why did you buy GW2 in the first place?

There is no content that is off-limits to you as a fresh 80 with nearly free rares from the trader.

There isn’t any YET. New content will require you to be geared in agony resistance to do it.

We dont know that yet! I suspect and hope it will be just be required for more difficult levels of the fractal dungeon only!

Play the Game for FUN!

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Can someone just clarify this for me: What changed?

People are saying the game is no longer fun, but the game that existed before the patch is still here. They simply added new content.

If the old content was fun, why are you trying to do things that are un-fun? Why not stick to the stuff you find to be fun? (I personally hate sPvP so I don’t sPvP. Problem solved, if you don’t like fractals or the karka, don’t do them)

To use the analogue already posted here some times: people who are not happy with the new tier of items are vegetarians. They come to a restaurant who promised them 100% veg food, ordered some meal, started to enjoy the soja steaks and tofu rolls.

But now the chief began to cook meat in the same kitchen. So all the so tasty veg things have this hated meat flavor on them.

Nothing disappeared, all the great things a still there. But the new smell ruins all the fun nevertheless.

I understand what you’re saying and you do have a point! I would just disagree on one thing, the dishes dont really taste of meat, the progression is total segregated to the fractals of the mists so far, if you do Pve you dont need to touch it at all, if you do any other dungeon you dont need to touch it at all and while there might be some cross contamination in WvW to be fair its sooooo small I would say its more a smell rather then an actual taste!

But you’re on to something I would say its more like vegiterains just hating the idea their favorite restaurant is serving meat even though it doesnt really affect them!

Play the Game for FUN!

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Players who are talking about a grind or treadmill are referring to what the game will become.

You cant talk about the future, for all we know they might scrap the idea and never take it any further then this too!

Play the Game for FUN!

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

People who play WvW can’t just ignore the new tier. Other players WILL bring it in to the maps, and it WILL affect them negatively if their opponents have the upper hand in stats. Yeah they’ll “eventually” add ascended gear to WvW, but people might be fed up with losing a disproportionate amount of their battles by that point.

I also did the math on my back piece (which I upgraded from rare + exotic jewel to ascended) and it was a 22% increase in the relevant stats. Nothing was lost to magic find or other stats I wouldn’t use. One piece isn’t a huge deal (I gained ~7 toughness and 1% crit) but it adds up very quickly.

but sorry you cheated you jumped 2 tiers

forget the back item because currently there is no exotic back item, check it with an exotic ring → ascended ring the jump is 7% not 22%
then check the jump from rare → exotic, the jump is 12% so really this is just 1/2 a tier better!

Play the Game for FUN!

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I’m not doing it, but not playing the game anymore. The game is no longer fun, to me, with the introduction of this patch. Is that so hard to understand?

honestly yes! provided you found the game fun before this patch that is. This patch didnt change any of the content that was there before (okey some class balances here and there) just added new stuff.

If you find the added stuff unfun whats the problem with ignoring it?
do you think without ascended items you’ll fail at PvE?
do you think without ascended items everyone will kill you in WvW?
whats the real issue why this patch made what was fun before suddenly be unfun?

Hopefully my break down for why its not longer fun for me helps you understand this

1) I don’t like like being required to grind for gear
2) This new patch requires me to grind for gear now and in the future because not only does this gear have better stats (and so will the next pieces), but Agony will be required to participate in future content, ANET said it will be used in the future, you don’t get progression. This means, if I want to experience new content and be the best I can be in WvW I’m required to grind
3) MMORPGs are an overall process of character development and exploration. Its also a social. Thats why I prefer MMORPGs over single player games, even games like Skyrim. If I don’t like what the future holds, because it involves things I don’t like (vertical gear progression tied to RNG) I lose my desire to play.

Thing is as far as we know and there is 0 reason to think it will be any different the agony mechanic which is the only thing you really need ascended gear for is in the fractals of the mists dungeon. This to me was created to provided content for people who like gear grinds, threadmills and stuff like that. If you dont enjoy that sort of thing then you’re not going to play fotm which means agony is a non issue for you which means you dont really need ascended armor.

You don’t get progression if the gear isn’t required for future content. If its only limited to fractals, why bother adding it? This doesn’t satisfy the people who like character progression tied to gear and it only pisses everyone else off. And ANET already said that they’ll use Agony mechanics in future updates. It doesn’t matter if Agony mechanics are only limited to dungeons, or certain dungeons in the future. The point is that the gear still has the best stats, and to do those future dungeons I have to go through an insane amount of grind to even participate in the new content (progression doesn’t exist if you don’t require previous pieces to get new ones). Content gating is simply bad (outside buying new content, which is understandable).

They said they will continue updating fractals of the mists and not that they’ll be introducing Agony to all future dungeons. Not that I can exclude it ofcourse but its equally an assumption thinking they will!

The way I am seeing is they did this to provide progression in this one place, the fractals of the mists thats all!

Its pretty clever really (apart from they really shouldnt have made the base stats better, dont think that was a particularly good idea). The open world remains uneffected as long as agony gets restricted to that one dungeon. Its designed in such a way that it can be expanded upon so people who like progression can get fresh content and still get progression through improved infusions! why people who hate that sort of thing just steer clear away from that one dungeon! yet if they feel they want to experiance it they still can for the first 10 levels of difficulty! Its really a win win for everyone in a way! (or well would have been had ascended had the same base stats)

I agree, totally against content gating but I ask you once again what content is being gated right now? The answer is none! The only thing that progression is gating is the difficulty level of this one dungeon! They can keep it as is, having higher difficulty levels of that dungeon requiring better agony protection and better infusions recipes, infusions themselves or better looking agony armor dropping from higher level difficulties.

If they do it like this no one will really be negatively effected ! and since they plan to make ascended armor available through at least WvW the minor statistical disadvantage will only be temporary!

Play the Game for FUN!

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I’m not doing it, but not playing the game anymore. The game is no longer fun, to me, with the introduction of this patch. Is that so hard to understand?

honestly yes! provided you found the game fun before this patch that is. This patch didnt change any of the content that was there before (okey some class balances here and there) just added new stuff.

If you find the added stuff unfun whats the problem with ignoring it?
do you think without ascended items you’ll fail at PvE?
do you think without ascended items everyone will kill you in WvW?
whats the real issue why this patch made what was fun before suddenly be unfun?

Hopefully my break down for why its not longer fun for me helps you understand this

1) I don’t like like being required to grind for gear
2) This new patch requires me to grind for gear now and in the future because not only does this gear have better stats (and so will the next pieces), but Agony will be required to participate in future content, ANET said it will be used in the future, you don’t get progression. This means, if I want to experience new content and be the best I can be in WvW I’m required to grind
3) MMORPGs are an overall process of character development and exploration. Its also a social. Thats why I prefer MMORPGs over single player games, even games like Skyrim. If I don’t like what the future holds, because it involves things I don’t like (vertical gear progression tied to RNG) I lose my desire to play.

Thing is as far as we know and there is 0 reason to think it will be any different the agony mechanic which is the only thing you really need ascended gear for is in the fractals of the mists dungeon. This to me was created to provided content for people who like gear grinds, threadmills and stuff like that. If you dont enjoy that sort of thing then you’re not going to play fotm which means agony is a non issue for you which means you dont really need ascended armor.

What new content are you bared from without ascended gear? Southern cove certainly not, not even the fractals of the mists dungeon since Agony doesnt even kick in before you get to level 10!

As for being the best you can be in WvW.. okey you have a very small point there but in my opinion its negligable it will not make any difference in the grand scheme of things! You’re not going to have an easy time or a hard time in WvW based on what gear rarity your wearing! there are many more factors with far greater effect then this miniscule thing!

but well its up to you! I cant tell you how you feel! I can only tell you some issues you’re seeing arent really there from where I am standing!

Play the Game for FUN!

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Galen Grey.4709

Please find me the person who thinks it is fun to be ineffective in groups, to be useless in dungeons, and to get stomped repeatedly in WvW? Find me the person who enjoys sitting for hours trying to find a group? In what way is it fun to get left out of new content or the best rewards?

Part of having fun in a game is being effective and useful and sometimes successful. You can’t do any of those things if you are left far behind by the stat treadmill. You won’t get groups and you will be largely ineffective in PvE content. You won’t be useful and will constantly get defeated in WvW. This game requires gear and stats in order to be effective and successful…and ArenaNet just added a huge grind to that requirement with their new tiers of gear and infusions.

I’m sorry you don’t understand what’s happening, how the game works, or what other people are saying, and that it causes you to be annoyed.

We’re TRYING to play the game for fun. ArenaNet is requiring a stat grind of ever-growing proportions in order to reach that fun.

None of that is true provided you know how to play your character properly! I started crafting my exotic armor about a month ago, finished the chest and legs then saw the corrupted staff and really liked it, dropped the exotic armor set and started working towards that.

That means I missing 3 / 5 exotic armor parts and all my accessories short for the amulate which I got from a drop (had the right stats too )… anyhow thats far bigger gap then having exotics instead of ascended rare → exotic = 12% stats gap, exotic → ascended is 7% gap unless I am mistaken, feel free to correct me.

I get groups, I am overly effective in PvE, which btw I even remove the only 2 exotics I have when pveing and the rest of the gear replacing it with a set focused on MF and still everything except for southern cove is just too easy!
I can dungeons just fine, most of the time without dieing once.
I can WvW just fine, never felt I was underpowered when I went against someone 1 on 1. Even won some engagements with higher odds ! And this me, I dont do PvP, I dont consider myself good at it! I just play my build well nothing else!

the game doesnt require stats and gear at all, it requires player skill!

Seriously not having the best gear will not make you useless in the least! if you dont like the fractals of the mists dont worry about it, enjoy the game you dont need ascended gear!

Play the Game for FUN!

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I’m not doing it, but not playing the game anymore. The game is no longer fun, to me, with the introduction of this patch. Is that so hard to understand?

honestly yes! provided you found the game fun before this patch that is. This patch didnt change any of the content that was there before (okey some class balances here and there) just added new stuff.

If you find the added stuff unfun whats the problem with ignoring it?
do you think without ascended items you’ll fail at PvE?
do you think without ascended items everyone will kill you in WvW?
whats the real issue why this patch made what was fun before suddenly be unfun?

I have never grinded as much in any MMO

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Question what is the goal you’re trying to reach, Cause I am having the opposite experiance. Goal take a long time to reach but can be achieved withotu any grind what so ever!

Example I am currently crafting a Corrupted Staff. Takes 30 corrupted lodestones, the drop rate is attrocious so if one had to farm the components directly and do nothing else it will feel grindy but since you can buy them off TP I just play the game, explore stuff, do the occational dungeon, do some WvW and occationally farm a little!

so far 1 I had, also I got 5 from farming and have amassed enough money to buy the rest (though didnt do it yet, want to get another 5g before spending all I have)

Some of the legendary weapons require 100 lodestones that cost 2+ gold each (not counting the 1000 gold in other mats). If you are content to casually farm your goal over the span of 10 years then more power to you … some of us don’t have that kind of patience. Legendary doesn’t happen without sheer force of will or a credit card on fire.

For those about to say you don’t have to get a legendary weapon … feel free to show me that new and exciting end game. MMOs are about getting gear and those trying to get a legendary are the ones actually falling into the MMO target audience. Claw of Jormag looks cool but can you honestly say you would take the time to kill it without a chance of reward?

Again, grind is to be expected … being slammed with DR and Farmcode is just ridiculous. My 2 copper your mileage will no doubt vary.

10 years is an exageration took me less then a month to get the 30 lodestones of course the lodestones are just a fraction of what you need to achieve to craft a legendary but like I said I got the bulk of the lodestones while doing other content. I also did gathering, dungeons daily achievements, monthly achievements etc.. That will also account for a good amount of materials, a good amount of karma .. with boosters about 400k – 500k. I cant say for sure but I think it would take me somewhere around 8m – a year to casually get all thats required for a legendary!

I will not tell you that you don’t need a legendary because well its good to have something to work towards without a doubt, you need some goal in any case but what I will tell you is you dont need a legendary tomorrow! does it matter that it might take you 1 year to get it? you’ll not be less effective, you will not be cut out of any content. There is really not rush, its a lot better to enjoy the game and take a long time to get your legendary then grind, dislike every second and get the legendary in a fraction of the time! what are you going to do once you get the legendary anyway? work towards another and once again hate every second of it?

I love jumping puzzles though not particulary good at them. Spend 3 days doing the new one in southern cove. That didnt get me closer to my corrupted staff for sure And I will spend another few days trying it again cause they’re just fun! Then again corrupted staff will not make me any more powerful and I am getting it so I enjoy the look of my character in the end! its all about having fun! my recommendation is dont turn the game in a job! play to have fun and make rewards such as legendaries as just a goal you plan to work towards while playing in a way you enjoy nothing more!

I have never grinded as much in any MMO

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Question what is the goal you’re trying to reach, Cause I am having the opposite experiance. Goal take a long time to reach but can be achieved withotu any grind what so ever!

Example I am currently crafting a Corrupted Staff. Takes 30 corrupted lodestones, the drop rate is attrocious so if one had to farm the components directly and do nothing else it will feel grindy but since you can buy them off TP I just play the game, explore stuff, do the occational dungeon, do some WvW and occationally farm a little!

so far 1 I had, also I got 5 from farming and have amassed enough money to buy the rest (though didnt do it yet, want to get another 5g before spending all I have)

Lack of story content?

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I recently just finished the level 11 charr story quest. After it was completed they told me to level another “3” more levels just to continue it?

Why do they do this? I can’t see why they don’t just throw in some quests that don’t even have decent story to fill that hole?

They’re forcing gathering, crafting and dynamic/heart things on me.
Thing is atleast maybe WvWvW Xp gain semi-decent.

I hate walking around looking for vista’s or dynamic content! It’s just a big time waster.

Edit: And what makes it worse is the lack of players in the content if a fresh players jump in. Most dyanamic events require a group, I can’t even find some players to help me, and when I do. They never, ever help!

Sadly you wont have fun in this game. It just turned to a grindfest with the last patch.

must be playing a different game cause mine has 100% the same content it had before with some new addition that if you dont like you can safely ignore!

Lack of story content?

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

You are missing the point. Anet’s fault for not being clearer.

You are not supposed to beeline from Story to Story. You are supposed to do the content around you as you make your way to the Story. You are exploring and helping the world. You are a hero in need being pulled all over, and end up gaining experience by the time you find yourself at your Story.

The problem is, it can break immersion for those looking for that. You are told to “immediately” go somewhere, so the urgency makes it feel wrong to go romping off killing centaurs or ghosts. That was bad Story writing, to not make the gaps in levels suggest that the player should be exploring on their way to the next part.

Also, the Human story, you aren’t expected to fight dragons as a level 1. You don’t even know you are going to be a big shot hero. So it makes sense that you are doing personal life issues as you grow.

Thats the thing though you’re not a super hero central to the story, you’re just like any other person to NPCs for the most part. You’re not really central to anything (except your own story) Its up to you to decide if you help out or not, things will happen just the same!

I do agree with you that placing urgency on the story as is doesnt work well. Its not so much that you need to side track yourself thats at issue in my opinion but more of that the urgency is fake! you could wait a year before tackling the urgent issue and still your lateness will have 0 negative effect. This can be resolved in my view by having a an in game timer. Say you got 6 hours of in game time to tackle the urgent issue or it fails and story branches accordingly. Being sidetracked in itself is okey. I mean lets say you’re asked in your story to save some children that where just kidnapped before they’re sold to slavery or whatever. In going there you come across a mother desperate because she lost her son while on the run from bandits. Technically the mother event is much more urgent then the children event even if the children even is on a timer. Even in events when you’re underleveled, just cause something is urgent it doesnt mean you shouldnt prepare yourself for it and that leveling up could be your character training up to tackle what s/he knows will be a paritcularly difficult encounter. Getting the knowledge and the skill necessary for it!

So yeah personally I agree that urgency could be done better but just dont think the problem is the delay between action per-se!

Personally I like the personal story doesnt urge you to do the exploration itself. Dont think it can even be done really as the game wants itself to be as open ended as possible. If you want your character to be an explorer you can progress by going off the beaten path looking for hidden secrets. If you’re an adventurer then you can go around helping people. If you see your character more of a craftsman then you can engage in such activities. etc.. If the game came up with a story mission such as, there is distress in village X go there lend a hand to anyone who needs you you’ll be funneling everyone towards an advanturer playstyle and locking them to one particular geographical area as well! dont think that would be ideal!

I feel there is "RNG" for essence and I disagree with it

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Too bad its bind on acquire. I don’t care if you don’t need it until level 99. The point is RNG is bad game design.

And how many games have you designed? How many classes have you taught on the subject? How many books have you had published on game design?

Every MMo, Rpg, A-Rpg, several popular RTS and FPS, and most kittening board games rely heavily on random number generation or random procedural occurrence.

You may want to educate yourself a bit on games, game theory, design principles, standard practices, and even historical evolution of game design.

Because something isn’t to your liking doesn’t mean it’s bad design, especially when that particular mechanic is so prevalent to core game design itself that there are workshops during programming and design conventions to discuss the best way to make random more random.

RNG based loot, that is required for future content, is bad game design. That’s why most games got rid of it. And don’t come to me with your pseudo intellectual BS.

Why was the title changed? It wasn’t offensive and its true that RNG exist for essences.

Huh most games got rid of RNG based loot? like which? dont know a single MMO that doesnt have RNG based loot! can you give some examples please?

Most games don’t have RNG based gear progression. My bad for not being clear. You know, they give you tokens instead of random based drops? Even if this wasn’t true, it would still be bad game design because it leads to wasted time. I quit AoC because I got the same Raid belt 3 time when what I need was a helm

Ahh okey thought that was a bit of wierd statement.

Still think its a mistake to consider ascended gear as any kind of progression outside the fractal of the mists itself. You really dont need it!

For starters there is a real issue with lack of customizability. I run my build on power, vitality and conditional damage. There is currently not one single ascended item that provides that combination. I could live if there was something that replaced vitality with toughness but there too there is nothing of the sort.

Now granted there is a sever lack of options of back items and even though not perfectly suitable the tome of rubicon would be a good upgrade for me personally but for any other armor including rings exotics would provide better stats!

Not only that but for longest time I didnt have anything better then masterworks and had no problems in WvW then I had rares for a while and still had not problems in WvW right now I have a mix of rares and exotics and still have no problem in WvW. And worst of all dont even consider myself a good pvp player, doubt I am even average for PvP isnt really my thing! yet there were times where with my sub par gear I manage to come victors when facing even 3 players at the same time! This game is without a doubt a skill based game. Knowing how to use your skills at the right time to give you an edge is way more important then a small statistical advantage given by gear!

I feel there is "RNG" for essence and I disagree with it

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Too bad its bind on acquire. I don’t care if you don’t need it until level 99. The point is RNG is bad game design.

And how many games have you designed? How many classes have you taught on the subject? How many books have you had published on game design?

Every MMo, Rpg, A-Rpg, several popular RTS and FPS, and most kittening board games rely heavily on random number generation or random procedural occurrence.

You may want to educate yourself a bit on games, game theory, design principles, standard practices, and even historical evolution of game design.

Because something isn’t to your liking doesn’t mean it’s bad design, especially when that particular mechanic is so prevalent to core game design itself that there are workshops during programming and design conventions to discuss the best way to make random more random.

RNG based loot, that is required for future content, is bad game design. That’s why most games got rid of it. And don’t come to me with your pseudo intellectual BS.

Why was the title changed? It wasn’t offensive and its true that RNG exist for essences.

Huh most games got rid of RNG based loot? like which? dont know a single MMO that doesnt have RNG based loot! can you give some examples please?

Lack of story content?

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

There is story all around in guild wars 2. The dynamic events when played in their entirety (ie start of the chain to the end of the chain which is generally 3 – 4 events that build on top of each other) tell their own story in a visual manner but speaking to the individual NPC will also give you more back story. Scouts tell the story of the zone. Hearts tell a story of the individual. Secret events generally tell story about the lore, in most cases that bridges guild wars 1 with 2.

Areas are also built in such a way that tell their own story.


Take Queensdale there’s the bandit issue and while no NPC explains it to you directly if you take the time to investigate the issue yourself you’ll notice that the bandits are trying to take control of the food supply most likely to cause a famine and then sell food at high price. (they try to destroy / poison the irigation that will cause a draught. They try to take over the mill and the store house underneat it and they try to steal the livestock off the farms in the vicinity.)

even just walking around hearing to NPC conversations you will get stories about many different things, from the gods to the political stituations to even professions

There are also books and scrolls scattered all around that also have lots of stories generally about the lore.

I am not kidding story is everywhere in GW2 the main storyline is just a very small part of it.

@lonko

The bulk of the content in GW2 is not marked on the map. Doing just whats marked on the map will leave you underleveled but there would be a ton of dynamic events, areas to discover off the beaten part that are not marked, secret events and jumping puzzles. Gw2 is heavy on the exploration side, to get the most out of it you need to talk to NPCs see which ones have issues, for example if an NPC says something like say he is worries about the sons of svanir teaching the grawl about jormag you can be sure there will be a dynamic event chain to explore that story. Hang around the area so when the event triggers you can do the whole chain from start to finish!

I cant say this enough talking to NPCs is key ! listen to what they have to say their not there just for show!

Anyhow if you really do everything in a zone I assure you you’ll be way over leveled. I tried to do all dynamic events and find all the secrets before moving to the next zone and always found myself at least 3 levels overleveled. I was level 80 when I was still starting level 60 content!

Lost Shores: Creating Winners vs. Losers

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I don’t see where people think you got min of 30gold worth of stuff. I checked the sword and dagger I got and it’s worth 4 total. The sword is a level 76 exotic? what’s up with that? I was a bit annoyed even some people in my guild got precursers that go for 300. I don’t think they should have been included in the loot table tbh. The scale between 5 gold and 300 is a bit much to swallow.

you forgot about the 20slot bag, the rune to craft a 20 slot bag on its own costs 10g

Lost Shores: Creating Winners vs. Losers

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Heres a thought. Drop the whole RNG system for everything.

RNG=Random Number Generator

do you have any idea how boring a game would be without RNG? think about it.. you kill a boar you always get a chunk of meat. you have to remove 90% of the crafting ingredients You’re not going to have a separate rock for each jewel and now with now RNG you can have one of them drop randomly now and then with every gathering action on a mineral and its unfeasible to have so many rock types. Everything would need to be pumped up in terms of requirements. You can no longer have a named exotic crafted using just 30 corrupted lodestones, it would be way too quick just kill 30 corrupted elemental so instead you’d require something like 500 of them. You’d also have to remove all cool drops from the game. You cant have a boss drop that named exotic you like else it would take 1/2 a day and you’d get all the gear you like and then what? why would you play the game?

Dropping rng might seem like a nice fix but I dont think it is, I think it would make the game worst not better personally!

So grinding for hour’s end to farm mats are a fun game design? No thanks. Working towards legendary is good, but some of the requirements are just so ridiculous. I’m playing for fun, not to work inside a game. Grinding is a decade old concept to keep customers in games, and it’s a concept for subscription based game. It shouldn’t apply to games like GW, where you only pay for the box price. I think time has changed and Anet do away with this cheap concept. They got the core of the game right, so I do hope they iterate on it.

RNG has its place, but I don’t think they should apply for epic gears. In Ultima Online, they implemented a guaranteed drop system (I think that’s what it was called). It’s basically an RNG that keeps improving the chances every time you kill a boss. So say, the 1st round you have like 5% chance for loot. Next time you kill the boss, your chance for loot is increased to 10%, and so on so forth, that eventually you will be guaranteed a drop (and at such time, your chance for loot will get reset). The point of this system is to keep the RNG, but reward players still for playing the content if they didn’t get the drop. It’s a bummer not to get the drop, but you didn’t feel bad because you knew your effort wasn’t wasted. Just a thought…

Oh, and as for the epic loot in an one time event? Don’t do it…

Thing is they already addressed this issue but essentially allowing you to gain what ever you need in multiple ways! going with the same example I gave corrupted lodestones. I can farm them off different mobs, I can also buy them using money which I can get doing Dynamic events from level 1 up to level 80 all earn me good money, WvW, Dungeons, Crafting, Playing the market etc… You dont have to grind to get the materials you need you just have to play the game which you’re going to do anyway right?

Even taking a legendary as an example it requires a bit of everything and like they said a billion times a legendary is a long term project yet people take it as something to start and finish ASAP, thats the problem in my opinion! If people dont get so fixed on the goal and simply enjoy the game and get the reward once they organically afford it there wouldnt be so much complaint about grinding! but if you focus on single items at a time such as say 2m karma that will seem like a big grind if done at a stretch. you can see that as 5000 level 80 events! totally a grind! but if on the other hand you forget about the goal and just play the game you’re going to finish daily achievements and than if you collect them you’ll need 260 of them to get those same 2m karma (collecting them because of karma boost) that in itself is 8 months! I played gw1 for years whats 8 months! and thats if you completely ignore the monthly achievement, which if you dont you can cut at least another 2 months of that! and at the same time you’re collecting the crafting materials needed, you can do the occasional dungeon etc… So at least for me the game becomes a grind if you make it a grind, I just play what I like and dont worry about how long its going to take me, corrupted staff looks better then my pearl stuff but its not any better anyway so whats the rush?

That being said I do like you’re idea of ever improving odds, nothing wrong with that

Lost Shores: Creating Winners vs. Losers

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Heres a thought. Drop the whole RNG system for everything.

RNG=Random Number Generator

do you have any idea how boring a game would be without RNG? think about it.. you kill a boar you always get a chunk of meat. you have to remove 90% of the crafting ingredients You’re not going to have a separate rock for each jewel and now with now RNG you can have one of them drop randomly now and then with every gathering action on a mineral and its unfeasible to have so many rock types. Everything would need to be pumped up in terms of requirements. You can no longer have a named exotic crafted using just 30 corrupted lodestones, it would be way too quick just kill 30 corrupted elemental so instead you’d require something like 500 of them. You’d also have to remove all cool drops from the game. You cant have a boss drop that named exotic you like else it would take 1/2 a day and you’d get all the gear you like and then what? why would you play the game?

Dropping rng might seem like a nice fix but I dont think it is, I think it would make the game worst not better personally!

Lost Shores: Creating Winners vs. Losers

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I dont agree, never mind that calling those who didnt get a precurser a loser is wrong. What did these people loose exactly?

but even beyond that, if anything I think they were far too generous though I can understand it as the market really needed a good precurser infusion to bring prices down. This was a really good way to do that! But giving one to everyone isnt a good way as it would kill the whole prestige of the thing making it meaningless.

Also you can never have something in which everyone wins. At least not with what people consider a win. There are many things in gw2 in which absolutely everyone wins. Such as taking part in a dynamic event, even if you fail you’re rewarded with multiple things. XP, Karma, Gold, Loot! You dont see anyone really happy about that do you? thats because it isnt special if it isnt different! Take said event, obviously not everyone got precursors, I for one didnt ! yet I got exotics, even named exotics and as far as I can tell everyone who got the chest got exotics which is unprecidented yet you’re calling such people loosers even though each and everyone of them got more then any other other event ever in the game! ask yourself why is that? If everyone got a precursor are you sure you would consider it a win? especially when the price would plunge down drastically as 100,000s of people compete with each other to make sure their precursor sells so they can buy the one they really need?

Being ambitious does not pay of after all?

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

yep fully agree with you OP!

Lost Shores Feedback Thread

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Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

free?… i clearly remember paying for this game….
also… they can take this kind of content and shove it.

You’re kidding right? short for eve online dont know of any other MMO that gives this amount of content without specifically charging for it as an expansion and in case of eve you’re paying the subscription for that!

But hey if the bugs bother you so much why dont you ignore the content for a week or two until its ironed out! guess what you’d still be getting more then you get in other MMOs!

Lol so kitten cute. Ignoring the content for a week or two until bugs are ironed out? You do know that this content was an “once in a life time” event that only spawned over 3 days right? And it seems like Phase 1 is still bugged out. As if Anet’s going to take care of the bug either way. They just closed it so they don’t have to work on a fix anymore. How the hell are we supposed to wait till bugs are ironed out? Those who were unlucky can’t finish the content anymore. Not that we have the desire to do so anymore after this debacle.

Happy player voices actually means nothing. Anet should be listening to the frustrated group so they can improve on what went wrong. There were many unhappy players from the Halloween event, and it just seems Anet haven’t listened well from how this event turned out.

Appreciations are given where it’s due. Despite being bug ridden, GW2 is a great game so props for that. As for this event? Not so much. Props to the art team for bringing great visuals. Who ever wrote the event authoring tool needs a boot however, as well as the kitten buggy overflow servers. It’s just driving your player base mad. I’m safe to say that the player base is happy with GW2, but when it comes to events, I think the majority of the player base is just disappointed and frustrated. Something needs to be done. 2 failed events in a row only in a 3 months span is not a good way to start a budding MMO.

Then just dont ignore it! you’re free to do as you please! Cant say for your server but for mine I managed to do all 3 phases with some persistance!

There is a reason why no one does all this content this fast! its hard to do, things of these scale probably require a month just to test everything properly! I am sure for them is all a learning process but it can only be a learning process if they actually get to do it in the first place!

I like everyone else would love if everything works perfectly and I too hope we’ll get there at some point and I am sure they will as they iron out the issues but yes I think its unfair to label these events a complete failure or an utter disappointement when there is so much great value to be had from them! I personally enjoyed both halloween and this event very much! Yes had issues, couldnt complete phase 1 on the first day! Yes undoubtly experiance would have been much better had all went smooth on the first go but overall it still many times better then having no content at all dont you think ?

if your going to complain..

in The Lost Shores

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

What are you talking about free content?
Dont you know that ppl constantly throw money at ANets face though the gem store. They are making probably more money than they would with subscription model (thats why they introduced this model in the first place).

So no, this content is not free, its payed for by the players.

nice try but as long as such content isnt made only available to people who pay x amount at the gem store then this content is still free !

Obviously this game like any other game is a business, obviously the more content they make to keep people engaged playing the game the more likely they make money. None of that changes the fact that if someone doesnt want to pay a single cent s/he will still get all of this content just like anyone else. So yes the content is still free even if some people decide to spend money!

Tyria changed?

in The Lost Shores

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

light house destoryed, asura krew finds way to get to stabilize parts of the mists giving us access to the fractals of the mist. New enemy assaults lion’s arch. We discover a new island, we establish travel routes between lion’s arch and this new island. We get to know about the consortium! We investigate and discover they’re willing to do nasty things for self profit. We go about and kill an ancient karka which in itself is a big deal!

Isnt all that change in the world? A world changing event doesnt always need to be of Cataclysmic proportions! Considering this was just a “little” monthly update not a full on expansion I think that was quite a lot of change personally!

Lost Shores Feedback Thread

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

No, just no.

After spending 3+ hours on the final event, defeating the ancient karka, suffering the final cinematic where he falls into lava while we had 30 seconds left on the reboot timer, then having 6 seconds to run to the chest, and getting booted just before we could reach the chest, no, I really cannot find any appreciation for such a major slap in the face.

We now get a very clear picture of the appreciation that Anet gives its customers.

WvW’ers have already many times suffered this complete lack of professionalism from Anet with full resets with no more than 30 seconds of warning. Just dumped all your gold on trebs and golems? C’est la vie.

You really were joking about making an appreciation thread, yes?

ohh you mean like how unprofessional Anet are that when something happens out of their control like say a crash due to server load they go yet again out their way to make it right ? such as it shows here:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Disconnect-at-the-end-of-Lost-Shores-Event-Read-this
?

maybe they’re not as unprofessional as you think?

Lost Shores Feedback Thread

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

free?… i clearly remember paying for this game….
also… they can take this kind of content and shove it.

You’re kidding right? short for eve online dont know of any other MMO that gives this amount of content without specifically charging for it as an expansion and in case of eve you’re paying the subscription for that!

But hey if the bugs bother you so much why dont you ignore the content for a week or two until its ironed out! guess what you’d still be getting more then you get in other MMOs!

Lost Shores Feedback Thread

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I appreciate all the hard work that must go to develop something of this scale! sure there were a few issues but man that amount of content they developed in just a month is literally incredible! I think a lot of people must really have no idea what it means to build such a zone!

you need to model everything, rig, animate, create the AI necessary to handle the new skills they get, create sound effects, create the attacks, the particle effects, the new shaders, voice overs, develop story, create the dynamic events that in itself involves again creating npcs, the paths they have to move, the actions they have to do with their respective triggers that need to be tested, designing the jumping puzzles and ensure they work as intended, then adding the effects like the tons of flowing water all over the place, model the new loot drops, test the map for stuff like falling off unexpected ledges doesn’t get you stuck and if you did the jumping puzzle that alone should be an eye opener on how much of difficult job that must be!

And they dont even need to do this! no other MMO that I have played or am aware of be it free to play or pay to play releases this much content every single month! They could have done this as well, if they just redirected all these resources towards an expansion in 6 months they’d have one to sell for sure! yet instead they do these events which keeps the world feeling alive with things happening and evolving!

I wish people who appreciate more what they get as opposed to mud sling over every single issue experienced!

In any case good job Arenanet! this has to be the most beautiful zone yet! love all the water flow everywhere!

Thoughts on Ascended Gear? [Merged threads]

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I hear so many people complain that Orr is boring, you point out to them that even in a level 2 zone you can earn money and karma probably on the same level as Orr if you factor in time / risk to the rewards but they’d never contemplate leaving Orr cause they’re convinced its way more profitable.

Lower level zones, AFAIK, do not drop the rarity of loot that drops in Orr.

Sure, you can go to Queensdale and farm for Karma and coin super fast … but you’re only getting white, blues and greens (and many of them will be zone-leveled … so you’re level 80 getting level 5 blues).

Scaling for loot is funky.

Not all of it is level appropriate but you certainly get level 80 loot drops.

Though keep in mind my whole point was to avoid farming altogether. Instead of farming just play the game, people doing what they enjoy rather then what earns them most money! No doubt you’ll make less money, simply because like you said not all drops will be level 80 but is that so bad? lets say it takes you twice the time to make the same amount of money (dont really think its really that bad but anyhow) whats the problem if you’re having fun? That’s the beauty of having gear thats not required to enjoy the game! yet while many people seems to want to ensure really hard that remains true very few seem willing to take advantage of it! honestly I dont understand this whole thing!

Thoughts on Ascended Gear? [Merged threads]

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

You know what the irony is in all of this, in my opinion of course, I hear so many people complain about grind, insisting they want only the best equipement/rewards and how this update is going to be the end of the world as its the start of a gear threadmill etc.. They argue how Arenanet could make such a collossal mistake! the irony in my opinion is that Arenanet took this step to try to help out these same people! let me explain why I came to this conclusion.

I hear so many people complain that Orr is boring, you point out to them that even in a level 2 zone you can earn money and karma probably on the same level as Orr if you factor in time / risk to the rewards but they’d never contemplate leaving Orr cause they’re convinced its way more profitable. 25 amazing zones, full of detail and stories to experiance, hidden secrets to uncover and just for a little more profit they stay 24/7 in Orr even though there is absolutely 0 hurry to reach any goal in Gw2. You can comfortably play any content in rare armor, actually probably even regular armor is enough! does it really matter if it takes double the time to get the money required to get that item you’re farming for? No! yet these people grind to get there as quickly as possible. These same people then obviously get burned out and complain how there is nothing to do. So how can Arenanet solve such a problem? They needed to do something that scales as much as possible, releasing a new zone just wouldn’t have worked in my view because it would be Orr all over again. Not to mention that if the reward were identical I wouldnt be surprised people would still stick with Orr just cause they know it better and don’t have to relearn it!

So a Dungeon which gets progressively harder with better rewards was a good idea in this aspect! Its also funny to read about people cautioning about powercreep. Everyone of you who decided to to stick in Orr to make more money emulated the issues of powercreep even though the game has the most brilliant design to make powercreep completely a none issue, Downleveling! No other MMO including Gw1 makes it as feasable to play in a low level zone at max level! though that wasnt enough for many of you so why is this suddenly such a huge deal?

I know not everyone sticks in Orr because there is always players around no matter what zone I play in so this will obviously not apply to everyone but to people like me who are content with playing for the fun and let things take as much time as they want to take are ascended armor such a big deal? The only effect they have is the new dungeon and WvW, WvW I really didnt notice a different from when I was playing with rare+masterworks to when I switched to exotics and sometimes still play with rare as I forget to switch over from my MF gear! it happened a few times and it didnt make such a difference that it alerted me to the issue and ascended armor is actually 1/2 a tier higher not a full tier like rare→exotics are!

I honestly think people are massively over reacting! Pretty sure this is actually quite a good thing for people who just want to grind best rewards and keeping it fresh (though still has to be seen how it will play out!)

just give it a chance and decide after you have all the facts in your hands rather then going on a witch hunt in many cases with wrong information as well!

Maybe we were hasty to jump at "progression."

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Not only what OP said but everyone is ignoring one crucial statement Linsey made:
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

As we introduce the new high-level content, we’ll also roll out complimentary Ascended and Legendary items (to say nothing of the other rewards you can earn by playing the content).

So far we don’t know what this means obviously so it could be nothing but it could also be there will be single events that give away a basic version of ascended armor as it is introduced much like the back item given away at halloween!

What if people are worried this is going to create a threadmill for them when in fact it will make getting a basic version (basic as in skin wise) of an ascended item much easier then getting an exotic simply to solve the issue so many people are worried about?

I personally think there are way to many unknowns to judge the situation objectively as is. Is it such a problem to just wait 3 days to see how the whole events play out, see first hand what infusions are all about (something we know nothing about as of now) and then react objectively when we have all the facts in our hands rather then being absolutely sure based on nothing more then guesses and gutfeelings that they decided to throw in the bin all the core design phylosofies for the game? which personally I find very hard to believe!

Thoughts on Ascended Gear? [Merged threads]

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

The new additions in November are just the start of our item progression initiative. We’re going to add tons of new high-level content to Guild Wars 2 in the future. As we introduce the new high-level content, we’ll also roll out complimentary Ascended and Legendary items (to say nothing of the other rewards you can earn by playing the content).

Yes I did notice the statement “complimentary Ascended and Legendary items” but its really puzzling to me. I mean It is entirely possible they forsaw the WvW issue and planned to give a basic Ascended set to everyone (though then why legendary items?)

I really would love a clarification on this. unfortuntely with this level of panic I am afraid we’ll have to wait a bit before we hear statements on this

Thoughts on Ascended Gear? [Merged threads]

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey, if they wanted to keep the progression for dungeons only, they should have have kept the stats on Ascended the same as on Exotic apart from the infusion slot. That infusion slot would then be used for infusions that reduce the effect of agony, still giving a feeling of progression through the dungeon, without ever affecting anything else.

I dont even think its dungeons more like this one specific dungeon which they said they plan to continue expanding upon but yes I totally agree with you like I said I would have rather they kept the same stats as exotics + perhaps a level appropriate upgrade and just added infusions.

I can only speculate they did it like this for perhaps 1 of two reasons I can think of.
1 to offset the fact ascended gear will not be 100% like everyone wishes (I dont think they’re going to have all the combination possible of all the different kinds of armor + all the possible upgrades since that would mean 1000s of ascended armor not really feasable) or perhaps they did this to jump start the whole progression thing since if it was exactly like exotic armor people who want progression might dismiss the whole update as meaningless since they’d still be working for something of equal power. Who knows!

Like I said its too early to say we just dont know enough!

Thoughts on Ascended Gear? [Merged threads]

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I think we’re taking this way too far now. From what I am seeing there is nothing to indicate they intended to introduce a global threadmill, seems to me they want to create a dungeon that has a “threadmill” for people who just love progression. That all depends on infusions, if infusions effect only the karka then the whole progression will be just limited to that right?

In conclusion I think they’re just trying to give something to everyone. If they focus the progression play on one dungeon.. is that really that bad?

Also something that really puzzled me was this statement:
As we introduce the new high-level content, we’ll also roll out complimentary Ascended and Legendary items (to say nothing of the other rewards you can earn by playing the content).

Does that mean they’re giving away ascended and legendary items with new content releases? Perhaps they want to allow everyone to have the basic ascended gear specifically so WvW players will not have to work for it while at the same time people looking for progression can play the dungeon for better skins and to improve infusions allowing them to tackle harder levels for perhaps even better skins and more infusions?

I dont know, there is so much we dont know yet I just dont see all the doom and gloom people are seeing even though I repeat I would have been a lot more happy had ascended gear carried the same stats as exotic!

Of course it would have been much better if they still gave ascended armor the same stats as exotics but if its a one time deal its not really that bad!

So what do I base my assumptions on?
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

Players who wish to delve deep into the Fractals will find that Agony makes progress increasingly difficult, until they reach the point where some defense against this condition is a must.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/A-message-from-our-Studio-Design-Director-Chris-Whiteside/first#post721451
Our goal is to ensure we have a proper progression for players from exotic up to legendary without a massive jump in reward between the two

I personally think this statement is being missinterpreted a lot.
People are taking this to mean that ascended armor was mean to fill the stats gab between exotic and legendary (which obviously doesnt event exist) but personally thats not what I understood. I understood that ascended armor is meant to fit in between exotic and legendary (thus bridging the huge gap between how much work is required to get an exotic and how much work is required to get legendary) WITHOUT making ascended armor a whole new tier on its own. And to me they dont seem to be a whole new tier they’re more like 1/2 a tier. Opal Orichalcum Ring + Exquisite Opal Jewel = 63 power and 63 precision while Opal Mithril Ring + Embellished Brilliant Opal Jewel (chose this because this is 375 skill level item which is what rare items to exotics are) 55 power and 55 precision which means exotic is 13% better while Ascended has 68 power and 68 precision making it only 7%-8% better

Of course I know the story is different if you consider magic find, but its hard to objectively calculate magic find since it doesnt follow the same point system and ultiamtely a state that reduces power not increases it, would have been better if they chose an example that didnt have a percentage attribute. But then again if we take such items, say rare invader ring to exotic invader ring. The large point attribute Power is 67 on exotic and 59 on rare which makes 12%, consistant with the other stats increases, no reason to really think that will be any different here.

All in all I would have prefered if ascended armor had the same stats as exotics but I do think people are now blowing this way too out of proportion. Even where WvW is concerned, I never really understood why people feel its so important to have the best armor. I really dont believe it makes that much of a difference. Player skill is way more important. I had instances when wearing rare armor I ended up in fights with odds such as 3:1 and still won, there was an instance in which 2 large groups came head to head, ours was at least 1/2 the size of our enemies and we won! cant believe it to this day and had also instances where my group outnumbered our enemies and they still won. From my experiance, supporting each other is a lot more important in WvW then personal power. having the best armor will obviously help a little but not having it will not really mean anything of note!

Thoughts on Ascended Gear? [Merged threads]

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I agree that people who dislike something should make themselves heard, did it myself in the massive thread but OP has a point, some of the posts go way too far in that regard. There is no need to resort to blackmail like tactics/ sensationalisim saying things like if you implement this I will quit, never spend another $1 or calling them liars etc.. To me thats uncalled for. Its enough to simply list conserns and what items of what they’re proposing you’re against and why!

People act like Arenanet are doing this with malicious intent! why would they do that? they’re simply trying to improve upon what people want. The problem is people complain about what they dont like and rarely praise what they like. How many posts did we see about how happy people were with there being no progression in gw2? not one, while there were several post stating this was something urgently needed due to there being nothing to do at endgame and several posts of people unhappy with gw2 having too much vertical progression as is!

Somethings unfortunitely you can’t really gauge what their outcome will be before you try them out for yourself!

Thoughts on Ascended Gear? [Merged threads]

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I understand the idea behind this, cant blame the game for trying to appeal to different preferences of game play including people who enjoy vertical progression but I am not happy with how this has been implemented for a few reasons: This is not about being resistant to change but rather about what I am seeing as existant problems being compounded by this update.

even if infusions themselves will not give benefits to people fighting anything but the karka the fact that ascended armor has better stats it will to some degree make all zones eaiser then they already are. That to me is a step in the wrong direction, I want to be less powerful in lower ended zone not more powerful! Unless I am mistaken taking part in this dungeon will end up improving your armor in the long run and thus making the bulk of the content (all the zones) easier and easier. This will take away the biggest strenght the game has, that is having all open world to replay at max level. (of course all this provided the only updatable part is the infusions and it will have 0 effect against anything but the karka.. if thats the case It would be nice if this is officially clarified)

While so far its not really an issue, that is provided we dont get any more tiers over and above ascended armor and that upgraded infusions are only useful against karka in that one dungeon / zone, I would also be a bit wiery about ending up with a possible gear treadmill system. Like others have expressed, a major positive point about this game is not the main major strenght of this game is it leaves you free to play as you like. If I want to focus on an activity like exploration, crafting, WvW, looking for jumping puzzles or even takening a break from the game to try some other game that seems interesting to me I can pick up right off where I started without being disadvantaged in any way. It would be bad for me should that change!

Thoughts on Ascended Gear? [Merged threads]

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I too dont think this is what it seems. I mean lets try to be objective, no gear treadmill is a core phylosofy of the game design dont see them going away from that lightly.

And if we take a look at all the facts, we got these Karka beings that are to start with immune to damage until we do something to counteract that (ascended armor perhaps that has some bonus damage against these beings?)

Then we have the new dungeon that according to massively: " In the Fractals of the Mists dungeon, you can go indefinitely farther in." ergo the challange will keep increasing and to solve that perhaps the armor can be also upgraded as the challange gets harder and harder but that upgrade might only apply against this Karka things only.

That would be a good middle ground in my opinion. While I dont want to see a gear threadmill I am okey with having it apply to just one dungeon and it will provide some content for people who like such things.

I think Arenanet have been honest and loyal enough to the game vision to have earned our trust. I dont like gear progression but at this stage even though those article seem to suggest it we dont know for sure thats what we’ll be getting here.

Loving the Endgame, Anyone Else?

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Galen Grey.4709

Galen Grey.4709

I am loving the game, have been meaning to start an alt and enjoying the story of the and exploration of the other zones (only fully did 7 so far) but I just can stop playing my main 400+ hours. There is always a goal to work toward. Right now I am focusing on the looks. Legendaries take way too much work so thats best left for the far futur while I earn the required stuff playing casually so in the meantime I am going for named exotics. Want to get Corrupted Staff, The Crossing (successfully farmed the halloween materials) and Royal Ascalonian Staff. Then its off to Armor.

What I love about endgame is that its not required first and formost, that means I can just play at my own pace if I get bored working towards an Item I can just switch to something else with no penality or without putting my guild at a disadvantage (when compared to games with gear progression) I also love that the game allows me to play any content I want to get the Items I want. If I need gold or Karma I can play in a starter zone if I want and still get them, I might get a little less then playing in a level 80 zone when everything is considered but if I end up having more fun why should that be an issue? I am not being put at a disadvantage and have no reason to hurry.

I also love how the game seem to be introducing new content each month. Such variety does a lot to keep the game fresh and provide long term replayablity for me.

Also looking forward in the future to guild halls and housing !