Guild Wars 2

Straegen.2938:

Banzie.5248:

King Amadaeus.8619:

All classes are easy to play, starter MMO is starter MMO.

This. Spend literally one day on a class and its not hard to master.

*Roll and level Class
*Find Cheese Build
*Win

Then run into player that has actually mastered their class and get stomped into the ground. It takes time to master most classes including the warrior… especially the warrior. It is quick to be decent but once you run up against a skilled player that knows the warrior timing winning with one is an entirely different league. There is a reason warriors do not fare very well in organized WvW duels despite being good roamers… same with thieves.

Not really an issue because the average WvW is pretty novice, good players/solid players are about 1/10 in ratio.

If we learned one thing from Bloodlust, its the Gw2 players don’t want anymore gimmicks.

Cactus.2710:

The incongruity for me is that ANet has done almost everything imaginable, whether for PvE (most Living World activities are zerg fests) or WvW and whether intentionally or not, to promote a zerg play style even though their game doesn’t handle it very well.

Quoted for posterity.

Touch Ranger or SS/Backfire Mesmer.

No one ever say how bear in water, Nornbearman not go in water I notice….

All classes are easy to play, starter MMO is starter MMO.

Last night I was taking advice, found a HUGE norn male ranger, he really fat. He did not have Bear so I felt safe, and knew I had skills from reading this page to help me.

First part he sends Moa at me, try daze, I use the dodge but I hit the key 2 instead of 1 time. Now no dodge roll but I think still ok, Moa is fierce but not letting that stop I begin to lay own PAIN ANGUISH AND TORMENT on Moa pet: DEAD, I got it. \

Now I realize that ranger just gonna swap pets, probably bear this time so I decide: GOING FOR RANGER.

All of the sudden big fat norn guy turn into HUGE NORN BEAR at this point I am in terror never seen Bear only Leopard and he use some skill like a signet next thing I know nornbear thing charge me and I oneshotted, downstate, try to heal, try to rally…NO, 10ft BearNornManThing just wailing away on me. Then NORNBEAR /laugh and jump on me….

Yeah well like I said, they have bluntly stated they were dead against it….But then again they felt the same about WXP being account based or EUvsNA resets being tied together, and ended up changing their minds in those situations…

Something needs to be done, Zergwars 2 is pretty boring, there is no penalty to zerging….Only penalty to run into one.

ANET have stated several times they would be dead against it, because it would cause griefing…

IE groups telling the random pug casuals to “get away you are giving us the debuff”, which goes against the casual non-combative nature of this game.

One thing people like me have suggested is buffing player stats based on how few they had around them, which would encourage playing in smaller groups. So to steal your example, maybe roaming solo you had the full buff, and at 20 people you were just at your base stats (no buff left). But it really just creates another set of problems.

One of my big suggestions is implementing a defensive AoE cap, to promote smaller group play and give them a tool to use against zergs. As it stands now, 30 people can hit 1 person all at once, while the 1 person can only hit 5 (at a time) of the 30. Not very balanced.

I wouldn’t worry too much SoR, many servers fall….The bigger problem is that many players that have been playing since launch are tired of this game.

I see it more and more every week, people are just fed up, burnt out, or ready for something newer and improved.

I think over the next year this game will change drastically, people will be leaving a newer crowd will steadily be streamed in lured by the “no subscription”. There will always be people to play against, but the days of Gw2 being the only WvW/RvR in the sunlight are coming to an end.

Why is server stacking encouraged?

Because like everything else in this game: More people = better results.

Can’t win a fight? bring moar people…. Can’t beat a server? recruit moar people.

Coverage Wars 2 is no longer a joke in these forums, it is a typical phrase that accurately describes this game.

The only thing worse than being highly controversial is being largely insignificant.

“Major WvW Update”

Diehard.1432:

Fools! How can you easily fall for this troll?

Why people keep saying trolls, I say I have no issue with trolls, I kill them 100% PVE = no prob. Trolls not make you fall only have knockdown, but it not 1/2 as annoying as Drakehound! You must be new player, think trolls fall……Pls trolls not in WvW only ogres. Ogres have pets not trolls.

Drakehound, Wolf, Hyena, dog pets all dog knockdown when I try to heal. Wolf scare me make me run away interupt my skills.

Then theres the dog one, Murallow or somting, its like a furless dog….Spraying poison everywhere, but then its like BEAR and goes in water after me when I run away….

How bear and furless dog go in water?

Bear too strong look at pic, it ridic.

I full zerk, got cool cultural armor, I hit bear for only 369!?

Look at pic, after bear run down toward water, no ranger, in stealth (stealth OP). Bear try to get away in water but I died to yellow mobz.

HOW BEAR IN WATER?

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

Should call them something else to match how OP they are, something like “Gigantic Killer Bear with No Fear and Lots of Health” or something close to that.

Stuff of nightmares…

Dog, ranger, hyena(x2), BEAR, shark, jellyfish, pets….
Ruin my WvW, kill me much, so much armor repair, so much anguish.

DiamondMeteor.8345:

Maybe you should be smarter with your siege deployment, instead of spouting ridiculous nonsense rooted from your lack of experience in the game.

Many rangers experienced in rooting.

PookieDaWombat.6209:

Worse than them though are those hyena and them calling for back up. Its like hello, free pet!

This here. Freaking hyena not one pet BUT TWO PET BOOOM all in my face. Even ogres know Hyena OP.

Two pets now cripple, knockdown, ranger still wailing away, arrows, pain, anguish, hurt.

DiamondMeteor.8345:

Really? Bears are OP now? Apart from the 0 fight contribution, low DPS and horrible sporadic skill use, am I missing something?

What an outstanding level of idiocy in these forums. So awkward being surrounded by horrible players.

More awkward being surrounding by Bear in water. If Bear die ranger just sends Wolf or Drakehound, still 1200 wailing away with arrows of fury, pain, anguish, much hurt.

ardasica.4531:

Osu.6307:

Any post that argues rangers are overpowered in any aspect of the game, is trolling. If you seriously think rangers are overpowered compared to other proffs, I really have to wonder how much time you have been in wvw.

Well I’ve done ranger in WvW quite a bit and have the battle scars to prove it. Or I did. Being Sylvari means that things grow back just fine. Still bitter about the big dude with the big sword that chopped off my head branches. My pet fixed him right up.

Was that you King?

Bear in water, how was bear in water??? Shark rez better than Ele, ele just die to AoE, not shark…Shark rez from the grave…Then BEAR COMES BACK…..How was bear in teh water?!

Ranger pet a different story.

Osu.6307:

Any post that argues rangers are overpowered in any aspect of the game, is trolling. If you seriously think rangers are overpowered compared to other proffs, I really have to wonder how much time you have been in wvw.

No I kill trolls fine (cave bridge w.e), Ranger Pet killing me, needs fix/.

Jocksy.3415:

Yep, I say!
Spider will not get to immob you if you’re not staying at one point. Time for it to launch a competency is enough for one player to be well away from the point of impact…
Pet never realizes that the target is no more where it aimed 2 seconds ago… (1 second cast time, plus the time for a very slow projectile to reach its target…)

Then 10s later like other guy say pet get might!

I try to hide from ranger in zerg, but I am 8ft tall norn and fat. Ranger pet always stalking, panther in stealth BAM outta no where….Drake spewing colored cloud of something at me, Moa…do not get me started on moa, whole zerg dazed – ranger rapid fire wailing away.

Yesterday I finally able to root ranger pet, I hit ranger HE MELTING, I hit again, HE ON FIRE, ranger backing away but still relentless with arrows…back back he goes, HES HEADING FOR WATER. But I used root on pet, now pet coming back and I can’t stop ranger…

He in water, on fire somehow, he downstate! new waterpet spawn, its a shark, SHARK starts healing ranger! I kill shark, ranger still getting healed!

Ranger revive and wipe me, /laugh on me in water, and then pet swapped to rub it in my face…2nd was Bear…HOW BEAR IN WATER?

I want to talk about the AoE cap…

No not raising or removing it. I want to know why I am standing on wall and I drop AoE on a zerg and I can hit 5 people. Then 30 of the zerg drop AoE on me and I take 30 peoples AoE….Why is that balanced?

Why can’t we have a defensively capped AoE code in place to make it more fair?

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

But you are safe, don’t you dance in the middle of combat for fun anyways?

Don’t you go clouding my complaining with facts sir….

Jocksy.3415:

Lol, I so have no idea of what is serious and what’s not in this post…
just go me laughing out loud in my office, with my coworkers looking at me weirdly…

Just keep moving, pet is unable to hit moving targets :p

JUST KEEP MOVING HE SAYS????

You never seen spider ranger pet? Immobilize and then spew poison all on my armor. Now my heals 33% less effective!

Then ranger swap to drakehound, drakehound pounce on me….Poison, rooted, pounced, I lay…flailing in the mysts, ranger still wailing away on me.

BOOM downstate, ranger /dance on my body. Corpse jump me, make waterfield on me, pet running around like devilspawn taunting me.

Keep moving he say….

@OP

I agree, if any class should have fear it should be the mindbender class…

Here is how that would go:

“Mesmers now have fear”
“NERF FEAR”
“Fear gets nerfed”

Straegen.2938:

It goes something like this: F2 – “Wonder Twin powers activate!”, the Pet Skill Activate button starts blinking, some random time up to 10s later the pet skill MIGHT go off.

You tellin me pet skills bugged pets giving MIGHT NOW after 10s?!

Too strong….Too strong, I want might too!

styx.7294:

King Amadaeus.8619:

styx.7294:

King Amadaeus.8619:

styx.7294:

Agreed, there should be a long cooldown between bringing out a pet after it gets killed. Realistically, after a pet dies the ranger should have to dig a hole and bury the pet in a cardboard box then morn it for 5-10 weeks before buying a new one from the pet store.

It’s not going to keep rangers from being overpowered but it’s a place to start.

I like that:

“Mourning”
You are in Mourning over the loss of your companion.
Invulnerable to Damage, may still place waterfields.

Salty waterfields.

Gold…

healing reduced 33%, vigor obtained from salt for 5s.

Warriors will literally be sustained by ranger tears.

Beautiful irony.

You think immoblock is bad…wait til you get the Blink/Lightning Flash bug and can’t move at all for no reason…

Only way to break it is /dance….which is always fun to do during combat…

styx.7294:

King Amadaeus.8619:

styx.7294:

Agreed, there should be a long cooldown between bringing out a pet after it gets killed. Realistically, after a pet dies the ranger should have to dig a hole and bury the pet in a cardboard box then morn it for 5-10 weeks before buying a new one from the pet store.

It’s not going to keep rangers from being overpowered but it’s a place to start.

I like that:

“Mourning”
You are in Mourning over the loss of your companion.
Invulnerable to Damage, may still place waterfields.

Salty waterfields.

Gold…

healing reduced 33%, vigor obtained from salt for 5s.

styx.7294:

Agreed, there should be a long cooldown between bringing out a pet after it gets killed. Realistically, after a pet dies the ranger should have to dig a hole and bury the pet in a cardboard box then morn it for 5-10 weeks before buying a new one from the pet store.

It’s not going to keep rangers from being overpowered but it’s a place to start.

I like that:

“Mourning”
You are in Mourning over the loss of your companion.
Invulnerable to Damage, may still place waterfields.

styx.7294:

King Amadaeus.8619:

jojojoon.8607:

King Amadaeus.8619:

Baladir.2736:

Vol.7601:

SoR died before EotM, stop blaming things for the sake of blaming.

Are we going to blame LA rescue for SoR dying as well?

Point taken. Still, look at the SoR commanders post just above. Nothing but stress. “sustain the coverage to remain competitive” “split mainly between the hardcore players and the non-hardcore players. It has since been resolved mainly by the guilds leaving” “population’s recruiting pool has became very poor” “very large amount of numbers, time, and energy required to maintain hardcore competitiveness” “unsustainable” an on and on.

The WvW meta has one 15 minute break once a week. The rest of the time the game and scoring are on. I’ve never seen anything like it. Granted I do have only played a handful of games, but hardcore raiding was never like this. This simply burns people out. I’ve never seen so much rage quitting. Players quitting guilds. Guilds splitting or collapsing. Guilds quitting servers. Just for the sake of the score. We have to get the score. We have to be top scorer. Never mind that fights and the fun don’t change regardless of the score. It’s simply crazy how people buy into all this.

The problem is that the metric was asinine from the launch, but many fell for it because on the surface that is what it seems like WvW is “about”…It is compounded that the world is full of sheep (ever seen a tagged up karma train?), therefore people are/have/will run themselves ragged over chasing PPT which is (once again) still an asinine metric; without ever coming to the realization that PPT chasing only leads to heartbreak in the end.

I feel sad for the people that have played since launch and still think that PPT matters, or not that it matters, that it is relevant to anything remotely tied to their individual play or efforts.

Keep staying up til 4am to upgrade garri, keep calling into work, keep missing class, next week the cycle will start all over and you can do it all again. Then leagues will come and then it will “matter even more”….The sooner people come to the realization of the situation then we as players can hopefully start to change the landscape…Because God knows ANET seems to be helpless to do anything about it.

This attitude towards PPT is one of the main reasons why SOR imploded since it only accepts one type of play style in wvw. If it continues, the only people left on the server doing wvw are only the hardcore wvw players who plays for fights only.

I know people who likes to play wvw strategically like a chess match and playing for PPT allows this. They try to predict enemy movements and come up with counter moves. I also know some that plays wvw like sims/civilization where they try to “maintain” their homeland, and that involves upgrading structures, running yaks and making sure all structures get supplies. To these people, playing the way they think is fun indirectly affects ppt.

My comments are not directed at the handful of people that log in to this game and play PPT for the 2-3 hrs a day they play then log out and think nothing about it beyond that…My comments are aimed at the masses that obsess over it, and to some extent let it dictate how/when/why they play.

I am all for people playing for “fun”, the problem with that logic is when you talk to people that play for PPT they only have “fun” when they are “winning”.

The ones that don’t care typically have not been playing since launch. It may be worth it in T1, but short of there, everyone else will eventually realize that you only control (in terms of PPT) what your server-coverage allows.

I would say the ones who have been playing since launch are the ones who have found ways to lead with losing. If you lose your kitten while you’re losing then after a year and a half your kitten is totally gone. WvW involves hundreds of players. Much of it is beyond any one person’s control.

It’s like newer players who are like “Oh no! We’re losing by 20k points!” or “Oh no! We’re ticking at +20!” or “Oh no! We lost garrison while I was sleeping!”

Life goes on, guilds come and go, new people show up in WvW as old ones stop playing. WvW is such a long game, you can’t sweat the lil’ things. Don’t burn yourself out, don’t worry what tier you’re in. Your tier doesn’t say anything about you, your guild, or whatever. Tiers are nonsense. It’s not important. Do the best with what you got and only measure yourself against the person you were yesterday. I don’t care what servers are better than Gate of Madness, I only care whether I’m better than I was yesterday.

Whatever happens just remember the mantra: fight, kill, have fun.

Truth.

Straegen.2938:

King Amadaeus.8619:

Straegen.2938:

Until Ranger pets are as strong as Phantasms, they will continue to be a joke.

Phantasms are no problem for me, they have low HP pool, pets are too tanky…

One of them does upwards of 5k damage to hardened targets, the other can effectively be ignored the entire fight. One of them comes out every 20s or less even after being destroyed, the other requires a lot of traiting to make it even slightly effective. One of them often steals party boons the other doesn’t. One of them can deal damage when destroyed and synergizes with Clone skills, the other has almost no useful synergy with any traits.

There was a time when pets were dangerous but their damage has been significantly reduced. In their current state at best they generate an occasional knockdown.

I just set it all on fire, burn baby burn….

Bearbow says "Shake it off, and Defies Pain", then bam full health, ranger just whaling away on me from max range, HURT PAIN ANGUISH!

Now you tell who more OP Phantasm or BEAR?!

Straegen.2938:

Until Ranger pets are as strong as Phantasms, they will continue to be a joke.

Phantasms are no problem for me, they have low HP pool, pets are too tanky…

DevonCarver.5370:

I wanted to pivot to something that Luna mentioned early in the thread, the idea of a more complex fight for Stonemist.

Would it make Stonemist feel too difficult to capture if the assaulting team had to capture and hold 3 capture points? Here are some of the problems I see with it.

1) It would encourage everyone defending to just blob up on one point and hold out as a group.
2) It could be so difficult to actually accomplish that it becomes nearly impossible to flip Stonemist.

However, I think it would be an improvement to the current rush the middle of the room scenario.

Do any of you think this version of Stonemist would be an improvement or does it not really make any positive changes in your mind?

1) It would encourage everyone defending to just blob up on one point and hold out as a group.

Which due to several reasons, sadly is the answer to 90% of the questions in this game.

kingkillar.6714:

King Amadaeus.8619:

kingkillar.6714:

King Amadaeus.8619:

Not sure if this has came up in the past, but I have been super frustrated with Ranger Pets.

I feel as though Ranger pets are overpowered, their skills always hit me, and when I kill the pet the Ranger just send another after me LEAVE ME ALONE.

I feel as though pets should be made to be more inconsequential in WvW.

No they are not overpowered they work just fine and are a major part of the class and when your fighting a ranger try killing the ranger instead of the pet cause when the ranger dies so does the pet

How can I when the pet is constantly harassing me, fearing me, pouncing on me, spraying toxic poison gas clouds, etc?!

If the pets really cause you that much trouble then you should probably run everytime you see a ranger, i have had no issues killing rangers solo in WvW

I will try running, not sure what else to do, my build/gear = solid…

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fUAQRArf5elYgKCnEyJEm4Ei1DBygKoqHxj+4hXFUIA-jUCB4gDimEAm4Ai6AkOAI/sIas1gFRjVLjIqWvETKgJ1VB-w

I call it the “Searing Shaman”™

kingkillar.6714:

King Amadaeus.8619:

Not sure if this has came up in the past, but I have been super frustrated with Ranger Pets.

I feel as though Ranger pets are overpowered, their skills always hit me, and when I kill the pet the Ranger just send another after me LEAVE ME ALONE.

I feel as though pets should be made to be more inconsequential in WvW.

No they are not overpowered they work just fine and are a major part of the class and when your fighting a ranger try killing the ranger instead of the pet cause when the ranger dies so does the pet

How can I when the pet is constantly harassing me, fearing me, pouncing on me, spraying toxic poison gas clouds, etc?!

Nerf BEARBOW plox.

PookieDaWombat.6209:

Or they speed built an AC near the tower edge and someone and hitting him with that.

So you are saying I obviously gave him too much credit….Noted.

I feel like this guy is seeing the AoE circle for Barrage, but missing the likely Meteors (no AoE circle) falling around him.

Ranger pets are the biggest problem in this game.

Not sure if this has came up in the past, but I have been super frustrated with Ranger Pets.

I feel as though Ranger pets are overpowered, their skills always hit me, and when I kill the pet the Ranger just send another after me LEAVE ME ALONE.

I feel as though pets should be made to be more inconsequential in WvW.

jojojoon.8607:

King Amadaeus.8619:

Baladir.2736:

Vol.7601:

SoR died before EotM, stop blaming things for the sake of blaming.

Are we going to blame LA rescue for SoR dying as well?

Point taken. Still, look at the SoR commanders post just above. Nothing but stress. “sustain the coverage to remain competitive” “split mainly between the hardcore players and the non-hardcore players. It has since been resolved mainly by the guilds leaving” “population’s recruiting pool has became very poor” “very large amount of numbers, time, and energy required to maintain hardcore competitiveness” “unsustainable” an on and on.

The WvW meta has one 15 minute break once a week. The rest of the time the game and scoring are on. I’ve never seen anything like it. Granted I do have only played a handful of games, but hardcore raiding was never like this. This simply burns people out. I’ve never seen so much rage quitting. Players quitting guilds. Guilds splitting or collapsing. Guilds quitting servers. Just for the sake of the score. We have to get the score. We have to be top scorer. Never mind that fights and the fun don’t change regardless of the score. It’s simply crazy how people buy into all this.

The problem is that the metric was asinine from the launch, but many fell for it because on the surface that is what it seems like WvW is “about”…It is compounded that the world is full of sheep (ever seen a tagged up karma train?), therefore people are/have/will run themselves ragged over chasing PPT which is (once again) still an asinine metric; without ever coming to the realization that PPT chasing only leads to heartbreak in the end.

I feel sad for the people that have played since launch and still think that PPT matters, or not that it matters, that it is relevant to anything remotely tied to their individual play or efforts.

Keep staying up til 4am to upgrade garri, keep calling into work, keep missing class, next week the cycle will start all over and you can do it all again. Then leagues will come and then it will “matter even more”….The sooner people come to the realization of the situation then we as players can hopefully start to change the landscape…Because God knows ANET seems to be helpless to do anything about it.

This attitude towards PPT is one of the main reasons why SOR imploded since it only accepts one type of play style in wvw. If it continues, the only people left on the server doing wvw are only the hardcore wvw players who plays for fights only.

I know people who likes to play wvw strategically like a chess match and playing for PPT allows this. They try to predict enemy movements and come up with counter moves. I also know some that plays wvw like sims/civilization where they try to “maintain” their homeland, and that involves upgrading structures, running yaks and making sure all structures get supplies. To these people, playing the way they think is fun indirectly affects ppt.

My comments are not directed at the handful of people that log in to this game and play PPT for the 2-3 hrs a day they play then log out and think nothing about it beyond that…My comments are aimed at the masses that obsess over it, and to some extent let it dictate how/when/why they play.

I am all for people playing for “fun”, the problem with that logic is when you talk to people that play for PPT they only have “fun” when they are “winning”.

The ones that don’t care typically have not been playing since launch. It may be worth it in T1, but short of there, everyone else will eventually realize that you only control (in terms of PPT) what your server-coverage allows.

Baladir.2736:

Vol.7601:

SoR died before EotM, stop blaming things for the sake of blaming.

Are we going to blame LA rescue for SoR dying as well?

Point taken. Still, look at the SoR commanders post just above. Nothing but stress. “sustain the coverage to remain competitive” “split mainly between the hardcore players and the non-hardcore players. It has since been resolved mainly by the guilds leaving” “population’s recruiting pool has became very poor” “very large amount of numbers, time, and energy required to maintain hardcore competitiveness” “unsustainable” an on and on.

The WvW meta has one 15 minute break once a week. The rest of the time the game and scoring are on. I’ve never seen anything like it. Granted I do have only played a handful of games, but hardcore raiding was never like this. This simply burns people out. I’ve never seen so much rage quitting. Players quitting guilds. Guilds splitting or collapsing. Guilds quitting servers. Just for the sake of the score. We have to get the score. We have to be top scorer. Never mind that fights and the fun don’t change regardless of the score. It’s simply crazy how people buy into all this.

The problem is that the metric was asinine from the launch, but many fell for it because on the surface that is what it seems like WvW is “about”…It is compounded that the world is full of sheep (ever seen a tagged up karma train?), therefore people are/have/will run themselves ragged over chasing PPT which is (once again) still an asinine metric; without ever coming to the realization that PPT chasing only leads to heartbreak in the end.

I feel sad for the people that have played since launch and still think that PPT matters, or not that it matters, that it is relevant to anything remotely tied to their individual play or efforts.

Keep staying up til 4am to upgrade garri, keep calling into work, keep missing class, next week the cycle will start all over and you can do it all again. Then leagues will come and then it will “matter even more”….The sooner people come to the realization of the situation then we as players can hopefully start to change the landscape…Because God knows ANET seems to be helpless to do anything about it.

Actually the biggest reason for “stacking” (beyond buffs) is to mitigate AoE dmg by manipulating the AoE cap.

Even a roamer like me knows that….You ball up to mitigate dmg during a fight. (Assuming you are running enough, wouldn’t work so well with a 5man) It is a flaw in the design of this game, ANET can’t (Read: says they can’t) change it due to technical limitations on their end.

It will not change, hell it has become so entrenched in the style of play in this game half the people can’t even remember why they do it, just that “it’s how it’s done”.

Arius.7031:

King Amadaeus.8619:

Arius.7031:

I’ll have to disagree with your friend. I don’t think it’s overexaggerated, and I don’t think the examples he lists are particularly good either (save for P/D thief). Engi is hard countered by condis, easily controlled by CC spam (lack of stability/stun breaks in general), and has exceedingly weak condi application outside of grenades/bombs/toolkit.

But what if I do not have any condis or CC spam??? Are you telling me I have to build for that to beat the engis?

And if you run the right runes (no not perplexity) and trait engis can pretty much spam condis and that is just running tool kit with P/S. I would take my engi over my PU burst mes any day in a 1v1.

I didn’t say my list was exhaustive, but virtually every class/build has access to SOME cc via their utilities. Condi damage that’s a correct point, I’m was merely listing some counters to plex condi engi, not all counters.

As to spamming condis with p/s and tool kit, you have access to only a few condis… poison on pistol 2, confusion/blind of pistol 3, bleed/cripple (that’s exceedingly hard to land I might add, unless you lure people into it with tool kit 5) on tool kit 2, and tool kit 3 confusion. Most engis will passively proc burning from a master trait in explosives, and lots use rune of torment. Even then, that is exceedingly WEAK condi application for a condi applying class. The auto attack bleed from scepter lasts 3 seconds longer at base (2 vs 5 seconds) and isn’t a projectile that can be intercepted… a condi necro will literally apply more damage condis by auto attack/signet of spite.

You came close to naming everything but missed a few key items. And yeah Necros are King of conditions no disputing that. My engi melts people by the second rotation usually.

The thing about it is that mesmers do have inherit access to more condis, but the engi can strangely enough spam them faster (again if built/traited/runed/sigiled correctly). Also with mesmer you are counting on block to trigger your torment, RNG (Chaos storm) and clones to build condis, a channel skill (Confusing Images) with a huge tell, and probably the worst skill in the game: Phantasmal Mage which hits probably 30% of the time.

Let me be clear about one thing for sure, this is in no way saying condi mesmer isn’t viable…It is full of cheese and effective, however it is just to say that condi engis seem to drop conditions on enemies in a much faster burst than Mesmers with fewer restrictions on which conditions get placed in what order. (Which is VERY important when you are trying to burn up an enemy’s cleanse).

SniffyCube.6107:

Really what you guys should do is open transfers to lower tier servers and get some variety… after all, getting some variety in the match ups and some new faces would really keep people interested in the short term …it would allow some servers to get a bit of a boost and keep things interesting

it’s a good idea for a short term bandaid

As someone who has spent a lot of time on a lower tier (like you), I can tell you that there is much less talk/intent on players on higher tiers to EVER transfer to lower ones now than even 1 year ago. Opening free transfers might get a few small guild groups and some random PUGs, but nothing significant enough to fix any of the lower tier issues.

With the lowered WvW populations (even in T2-T4) people are just flat out terrified it would be a ghostland in T6-8.

That all said, I would be behind them implementing free transfers, any help is better than none down there.

Handin.4032:

Fuzzion.2504:

Even mesmers are now worried that PU mesmers are giving the class a bad name.

Im sure they are on the chopping board for nerfs.

I fully agree with this. I’ve been playing mesmer as my main since the game came out, and since they changed PU to its current form, I noticed one main thing: So many new mesmers suddenly started blindly using 20/20/30 just for PU. I’ve had to explain so many times why a phantasm build doesn’t work well with 20/20/30, and have had that mesmer say stuff like “but how do you live without PU!” PU is mostly used as a crutch, and they all tend to use the SAME 3 utilities (at least they use blink/decoy+MI). It makes it very easy to predict, and they tend to not delve deeper into knowing the class. The reason, imo, that it is starting to give the profession a bad name is because there are plenty of mesmers who say stuff like “But we NEED PU to survive!” Which is entirely not true.

In the end, I don’t dislike the trait itself, however the fact it is fairly unbalanced makes newer mesmers just blindly use one trait set and then claim they need it to survive and depend entirely on using PU to be competitive. It makes mesmer seem like a shallow class. However, there are still many great mesmers (some who use PU, some who don’t) despite this who endure the nerfs mesmer takes and adapt.

Well if we start throwing out nerfs everytime noobs say noobish things, then warrior and thief are absolutely kittenED.

Arius.7031:

I’ll have to disagree with your friend. I don’t think it’s overexaggerated, and I don’t think the examples he lists are particularly good either (save for P/D thief). Engi is hard countered by condis, easily controlled by CC spam (lack of stability/stun breaks in general), and has exceedingly weak condi application outside of grenades/bombs/toolkit.

But what if I do not have any condis or CC spam??? Are you telling me I have to build for that to beat the engis?

And if you run the right runes (no not perplexity) and trait engis can pretty much spam condis and that is just running tool kit with P/S. I would take my engi over my PU burst mes any day in a 1v1.