Tbh good sd\d thief have upper hand vs hambow. Good use of usual 1-2 stunbreakers, interrupting steal (rip stability), bunch of dodges helps. Though can be time consuming deal.
I think on some dungeon mobs encounters pretty easy to keep 3 phantasms up.
I don’t count CoF p1 as high end PvE.
Arah, fractal 50 are better examples. In Arah every boss has an aoe that instantly destroys them. In fractal 50 you got archdiviner on first floor IF his spinning projectiles are not hitting the phantasms. Svanir shaman maybe higher uptime, but he still kills your phantasms with autoattack swings. That’s about it.
Even at some Arah encounters possible to keep 3 phantasms up most time and soloing it. Final p1 boss e.g. For Lupi DE more pref cause reflect OP damage and his mechanics.
Or for example Lvl 50 Thaumanova Fractal Mesmer Solo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYfyggu8QRY&t=419
A much smaller buff, but one people would be pleased with would be if litany was instant cast like all the meditations now are. That alone may prompt more to use it.
Pls no-no-no. I am already lacking of interruptable enemy healing skills on my lockdown mesmer. Only mesmer, ranger, and necros prone to use interruptable healing skills
I think such type (active – clone spawning) of traits should be selectable/major. MB just swap it with blade training (make BT master trait like other mesm weapons CD triats) or other adept trait?
EDIT. I thoight again – your suggestion is better. Anyway illusion line goes for shatters
EDIT 2. And again – mine still better
Block:
heal 4 616
cast time 1.25s
CD 30s
HP per second ~148hp/s
additional feat block 2 second
Litany of wrath (traited Meditation Mastery, Monk Focus):
heal 3 657
cast time 0.75s
CD 24s
HP per second ~148hp/s
additional feat heals 25% damage dealt in next 6s
So same base hp/s. Different feats only. Shelter has defensive use, litany – offensive.
If enemy team have many cc and boon ripping shelter seems better for me. Many keep shelter just to negate incoming burst.
Not experienced with guard though. Just thoughts.
Is this change bad for teefs? Yes. Is this good for classes that lack teleports? Yes. It’s not OK to have only 2 classes (MediGuard) dominating the Zerker spot of a team.
I think u can be right that this fix can move thieves ltl out of meta and free spot because of less map mobility. But you are not right for fight situation IMO. Thieves can loose some initial burst positioning advantage, but still keep same chasing ability. So probably still pretty hardcounter to mesmer and other zerks in battle meaning (except medi guard ofc and we assume thief is for +1 to fight). But now zerk mesmer (zerk ele,..) could be chased by any class with some gap closers (or even usual range attack is enuf to finish lows cause harder to LOS now), what devaluate zerk mesmer more.
So mb ltl less danger from thief, but more from all other classes.
Necro port could be broken too btw.
Phantasm too vulnarable to AOE in group fights. Even in 1×1 ppl try to kill these phantasms (if they know ur build) at chance. PU phantasm more annoying, though not designed for tpvp.
1. The right build. Do not aquire a build from metabattle. I don’t know what genius put those there, but they’re terrible builds. Find something on YouTube perhaps.
Dude…
As Fay already said phantasm builds are somehow effective in 1vs1 against many builds (not against all). But spvp isn’t about 1vs1. I think you feel it better soon
I think PB just should additionally “eat” 2-3 ini (or some ini percentage) on interrupt (except autos). For example: thief with 3 ini left is doing heartseeker and got intterupted = 3 ini left -3 ini spent on HS -2 because of PB trait = -2. I.e. freezed at 0 ini for 2 sec (time to regen ini from -2 to 0). But even this does not make PB GM trait worthwhile. Mb move to adept trait. Or give to it some additional feats: like make dazes (diversion, MoD) unblockable or smth else.
Yep, staff blink is good disengage tool, but not even close to usual utility blink (consider of liability and area of use). Distance, no choice of direction when rooted/ stunned/ knocked. That s why blink and decoy almost are “must have” utility skills to survive.
I only note current state of game from my position (zerk mesmer expirience). So can be biased too. But try to understand me. Even 1 jail-free card on 40(32) sec CD given to mesmer now not doing this class desirable. Mesmer squishines, low sustain, mostly predictable burst, lack of ability to hold point/ stay in spot fight, necessity in team care\peeling, etc. That blink doesn’t make mesm OP in tpvp any way. It’s part of hit-and-run tactic. And now this… Hit-and-die?
As I said buffs only supposed. And even if anet will implement some buffs – don’t this result in less play styles? IDK.
I admit I can be wrong, but don’t like removing such tweak from “swift” playstyle.
Warrs incoming! Non-teleport classes hate as expected, not much unbiased discussion.
Not intended, bug, glitch, exploit. the devs (), broken, needless, l2p.
“Spice must flow!”
If you want to play glass, take the risk involved.
We are talking about classes, that have not ability to stay or hold point (not about medi guardian). But they have some mobility in exchange. And they are not too meta state (mb 1 thief because of map mobility, but much less mesm). Some kind of bruisers take 3-4 slots in team. Now by loosing this advantage (= more risk, less reward?) we are all coming to drab battles of sumo fighters on the spot? Or total drop stealth like classes in favor sword warrs (or other classes with remaining mobility)?
Ok, it’ just grumbling.
I’m saying there is not a row of only nerfs, but some buffs too. And thief still outstanding zerk user. Dunno would it be after fix. Zerk without mobility fades in comparison with bruisers imo.
that is why thief players are not happy with the change, after 2+ years of constant nerfing they all know very well that there will be nothing good comming thieves way
Tbh it’s not true. Thief (as mesmer) got not only nerfs, but worthy buffs too. Initiative regen regen buff e.g.
Because it is. Stand in a non-key spot and try to teleport to a higher ledge, it doesn’t work. Very specific spots have been mapped out and learned~ hence, they’re exploited areas. Vertical teleporting is generally not accepted in the game, but in certain maps you can find spots that allow it, and it gives an unintended advantage. They also can’t over buff classes that can exploit this bug because if they do without fixing v-teleporting they’d have very OP roamers that essentially couldn’t die if they played their cards right. It also ruins “average travel time” between nodes and creates huge swings from a class without teleports versus one with.
It’s not about some places can be used for v-port. It’s about how port works (pathfinding through net of nodes). I found some not very well-known port spots (not comfortable though) cause I know how it works. You assume this unintended. I m not so sure. It creates “huge” difference in roaming mobility mostly for thief and mb for mesmer in lesser degree. Both classes that can’t hold point. And can’t stay in long lasting group fight (mesmer esp). So removing tool that is base for mesm sustain and play style. Curious to see how mesm will handle these fight.
Nobody said they weren’t fine. What we said is bandaiding them with having to use hopscotch teleport mechanics to be useful is 1) Not fixing the real problem 2) broken to play against and unfair mechanics
They are nerfing portals, so if its really that big a deal, how bad these 2 classes are supposedly doing(since someone said thiefs are bad lol) will stand out more and warrant anet buffing them. You want mesmers to be buffed in useful areas, not by being able to break los mechanics and hit and run at the touch of a button
What I m afraid of anet make all equal and difference between play styles will be diminished. It is still capture a point game and allowing some1 to run away whilst he can’t hold point is not that bad . Should to see supposed buff though.
But at at this moment we can see nerf for some classes definitely through this fix, meanwhile buffs only supposed.
" i shouldn’t have"
Again, who define what I should or what I shouldn’t have? You?
“Anyone who was somewhat competent with their class will be fine”
Form of l2p?
Many good mesmers already admit mesm is not fine in tpvp. Believe me they are competent. And now depriving one of the best sustain tool. They are only hoping this change hits thieves more then mesmers ))
Wanna all jump to bruiser meta?
But mb I am really overdramatic. Will see
Ok, then “escape”, “retreat” or “disengage” from mass fight. The already can’t survive inside long-lasting mass fight (with some exceptions).
" Not being able to teleport up a cliff doesn’t make a teleport magically useless"
Ofc, but much less useful. This ability helps my mesmer to disengage (or reposition) lost mass fights many times. And now Shoutbow with low CD leap could cut me down?
Also, if you build PURE GLASS CANNON, and complain when you have trouble taking on most builds that aren’t able to be bursted down because they were smart enough to take defensive utilities, then that’s YOUR fault, not the games, not balance.
Dude, blink (port) IS this best defensive utility now…. And I wasn’t talking about ability to burst down cele builds (that issue is here though). I was talking about survivability of zerker builds and thier fight style.
teleport like blink and shadowstep are only meant to take you to places where you can walk to (within the specified range). It was never meant to get you from the ground to the freaking rooftop (caugh battle of khylo caugh). This is how it always should have been. There’s a reason why we have “portal” and “shadowstep”.
it will kitten mes and, on a bigger extent, thief but this change makes the mechanic what it should have been in the first place. let’s just hope that they improve teleport pathing in the process.
It’s already “take you to places where you can walk to (within the specified range)”. Search for some WoodenPotato video that shows how it works.
And who define “what it should have been in the first place”? In 1st place should be thing that works. And ports already works for fight style diversity from my standpoint.
Most zerkers mesm and thief builds can’t stand on the point. If u remove ability to disengage mass fights and make big(!) buff for sustain for such zerkers (need some buff is already), someone would ask for damage nerf or something similar for these builds. Fights of balanced(?) all-round bruisers on a spot are boring for me anyway. I’m playing mesmer because of his playstyle. Now it could be broken. MB too pessimistic. Will see.
Not saying about thief, but Z-axix ports is vry big part of zerker (as ‘shatter is tpvp meta) mesmer sustain. It’s part of mesmer attack flow> rare burst and escape. Now – very hard to escape. Not only thieves (they still afford to stick to mesmer), but any classes with jumps and leaps can stick to mesmer…
This comes to me as quite a surprise, as a person who mains a mesmer and has never lost to a thief I don’t understand why mesmers would hate on this kind of an easy kill
For me I find it insanely easy to predict thief movement which is probably why I pretty much always block/dodge backstabs and steals.
Whut?? :O
Can we see some of your fights from “king of the hill” map (at eu prime time) as ’shatter (standard mesmer build for tpvp) against standard sw\d or even d\p thief (standard thief builds for tpvp)?
Biggest issue with azura is pvp. As mentioned ppl choose asuras because of badly readable (for enemies) animations of their skills. Though as mesmer u can prefer “biggest” races to obstacle enemy vision
Those reasons were clones despawning phantasms, which is no longer the case
It is still issue in some builds, when you already have 3 phantasms up (easier with new healing signet). And I’m more about idea then such “active” trait should selectable, not minor trait.
Mb you are right. I personally prefer to DE be minor trait (same as PB works on autos ) because of playing shatter builds mostly. Just not sure that would be healthy.
I’m wary to go full zerk. Thieves are main reason. 1 unexpected combo burst of glass canon thief can one shot you (up to ~18k in 0.5-0.7 s). It less hurdle in teamfights (when teammates can peel / ress you), but for solo I would think twice.
We are talking about not condi and not pu mesmers. So left some type of bunkers, phantasms, shatters, lockdowns. Last 2 ones pretty much mostly go berserker (it’s how these builds are works). And don’t see problems with 1st 2 bilds too. Though there are some anti thief mesmer builds, usually they do not contribute in teamplay as much as usual shatterer.
No, I consider randomly spamming autos to be spam. If you randomly spam skills (and this includes autos) vs a CI interrupt mesmer, you will get punished for it. Autos can be interrupted and they will proc CI hits. You simply have to not be skilllessly spamming your autoattack all the time against an interrupt mesmer. Against a power block mesmer, instead of getting immobilized, you should be worried about getting that skill disabled.
If CI interrupt mesmer wasted intterupt on auto then, in most cases, he isn’t very good at this build (imho). I wouldn’t be upset if CI lockdown mesm spent his MoD or else for my auto, except some situations. Mb even glad to it. There are different story with PB.
No, it doesn’t give us too much room to breath or force the enemy to blow CDs. It forces the enemy to actually use their head and not spam their autoattack. The only players that would simply get scared of using their autoattack altogether are bad players. Good players will watch the mesmer, note when interrupts are available, when they’re not, and how to attack into that. Good players already do that vs CI interrupt mesmers, why should it be any different for power block?
Ok what good axe/x warr should to do? How u suggest him to damage PB mesmer?
Mesmer can allow himself to spend 5sec refilling dodges, BF, blinks, other saves, controls(!) for some nondesirable war offensive skills, or just eat them, while easily negate his chained dangerous auto? What such warr supposed to do? Be punching bag? How he fill adrenaline? By eating incoming damage? Even worse situation in group fight when enemies often already spent their offensive CDs. You can cut very big part of their dps with some CC.
This is how it should be. An awful player should get demolished by a good power block interrupt mesmer.
I’m trying to say, that it can be more complicated. Probably even good players can be harshly punished with such trait. Admit I can be wrong, but still standing at starting point.
I think nobody should be able to stop autos for 10 sec. You consider using autos like a spam, but I’m not so sure. AAs are basis and significant part of dps of many clasess/builds (mb with some exceptions like multikit engies, eles, etc). Ability to fear enemy (axe/x warr for example) to use autos is too strong. It gives u too much room to breath or forces enemy to blow his CDs. Or enemy already used all offensive CDs and has nothing except AA to dps…. It is even deeper problem in group fight. This ability drastically changes fight flow and not in enemies favor.
Trait needs rework for sure, but nerf was required.
Perhaps other classes have their easy buttons, but for me, give me an experienced Mesmer group any day and watch us cause hell n’ havoc. And that goes for PvP/WvW/tPvP alike.
I’m almost crying when my match team composed of only mesmers\thieves
I’m not big fun of masterfull reflection. Don’t wanna waste precious invuln skill for reflect. I think any half-decent enemy would’n let be hit with reflected projectiles more then split second and I can’t remember right now any 1-shot nukes except warr rifle burst. If someone can be killed with reflect in most case they can be easy killed with usual ways. That’s why I don’t like any reflection at pvp (at pve it’s great). Can be using for some fun situation imo.
