Guild Wars 2

@Dub, yeah, guess why I decided to try CoE solo. As soon as I saw this thread, I grabbed my thief. And now I’ll watch the video

paleeshi.1924:

Molch.2078:

Nobody said anything about sticking to one attunement. Its about using the most effective the most of the time. Why you need water when there is no need for heal? Why use Earth/Air when there is no need for cc?

Just because you have 20 Skills doesn’t mean you have to use them, when Fire 1 is more usefull.

How is fire 1 most useful? (I admit I didn’t read the 2nd build but I believe it was a hammer build, not a Fire build). I said more usefull then eg. water 5, when no condition remove is necesscary.

The OP never even said Fire was most useful, he/she posted an Earth attunement condition based build, where he wrote “spending 80% of the time” in one attuenment.

You don’t seem to have understood what I meant. If you play condition build with staff, then yes, you’ll be spending most of your time in Earth since thats where most of your condition damage comes from. But that makes about 3/4 of the staff and thus you will not use it to it’s full potential. Therefore I feel that a power based build works better with staff. Yes. I agree.

Earth, Water and Air is not only CC, heal and bleed, since they also have strong power based attacks. For example? Ice Spike, thats all. That is why you’d want to rotate through the other attunements, even if you just going to deal damage. I really don’t know where you get that Fire 1 is most useful. never said most usefull in general.

uh… after a few more runs with P/P I had the feeling that this weaponset is not that awesome, but that’s just sad.
One question, how many stacks of vulnerability can you maintain on a boss?

@SpaceCowboy: Since the autohit on Warrior-Rifle is almost as bad as Thief-Pistole, I dont think Warrior can deal good rangeDPS, too. But a comparison to other classes would be interesting.

And thank you for credits, now I feel really bad about me not looking at that sheet a while ago.

Nobody said anything about sticking to one attunement. Its about using the most effective the most of the time. Why you need water when there is no need for heal? Why use Earth/Air when there is no need for cc?

Just because you have 20 Skills doesn’t mean you have to use them, when Fire 1 is more usefull.

Good post. Really good post. I’m tired of all those 30 in Arkane Staff Elementarists who swap attunements on CD and use every AoE and Combofield just because they can, while im dying with my poor Thief because I CAN’T SEE ANYTHING.

And while your Lightnung Hammer Build is awesome,

As a PvE-Thief its less about the Damage Nerf. Yes, it’s a pitty, but hey at least we deal still more DPS then a Ranger.

But x/Dagger Gameplay feels so sticky and not smooth right now and thats just stupid.

This was not the nerf Thieves needed.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Tactician_Deathstrider

Exotic cavalier trinkets, 42k karma each. I have no idea bout armor/weapon, sry.

swinsk.6410:

Quit your thief and make a warrior. Thieves suck at PVE. I have a thief and a warrior. I will never pve on the thief unless I have to now. Warrior hitting bosses for 30k on just last hit of HB.

If you are going for PVE only I would probably do P/D condition build. Thieves DPS sucks.

Buffed Warrior gets outdps’ed from buffed Thief (25 Might/Fury). The problem is, Thief needs two Warriors and a Mesmer to get those buffs. And the Thief is harder to play (12k HP, 1900 Armor)

Did you know that HB’s damage sums up? its not the last hit that deals 30k but the whole 3.5 Second HB.

Blacksarevok.8104:

Just wondering, how did you come up with 3.25 secs for BS/CnD combo? That seems long to me.

I think he means the whole rotation including the autotack chain.

Critical Damage: 109% You have by default 50% Critical Damage. 100 Dmg +109% CritDMG = 259 Dmg on Crit.

But lets ignore that for a moment. I am not sure if your/my Dmg-Formula is correct, I’m unable to reproduce your numbers with your stats.

In any given amount of time T [in sec] I’ll regenrate Tx1.212 initiative. Thus, I am able to use Unload Tx1.121/5 times. Unload has a channeling time of 2.25 seconds. That means it will take T x 1.121/5 × 2.25 seconds to channel all the Unloads
-> T – T x 1.121/5 × 2.25 Sec left to use Vital shot. Vital shot has a channel Time of 0.88 sec, so I’ll use (T – T x 1.121/5 × 2.25) / 0.88 times VS.

According to your Calculations, VS deals 339 × 3.15 = 1068 damage, Unload deals 2032 × 3.41 = 6929 damage.

DPS = 1/T x [ T x 1.121/5 × 6929 + (T – T x 1.121/5 × 2.25)/0.88 × 1068]
= 1.121/5 × 6929 + (1 – 1.121/5 × 2.25)/0.88 × 1068
= 2105 Damage/Second

instead of 3133 DPS

That’s a huge gap. Your number is bigger, please find a mistake in my calcs

Under 25% Health:

• one 1658 HS every 2.28 Sec = 727 DPS from Heart Seeker.
• one (1989+1232)*1.2=3865 C&D BS Combo every 4 Seconds = 966.3 Dmg from C&D+HS

Never spam HS in PvE. And play 25/30/10/0/5. You won’t be able to spam C&D every 4 Seconds if you don’t. Fury and might from Tric Trait is usually not needed and +3 max initiative is 100% useless.

I’ll look at the Math later but looks fine on the first look.

Edit: How do you name your spoilers?

You do look like a spider karka lightning orb of hell after consuming this Potion. I love it!!!

What about a elite-signet that grants as a passive effect permastealth while out of combat?
It would be fun in open PvE and imho not to OP in Dungeons and WvW. You already can travel untouched in this areas w. SB and stealth.
Dunno about s/tPvP but hey, you can nerf it there.

Damage formula according to Wiki: Power * Average WeaponDMG * Skillcoefficient/Armor.

Look at the tooltip for Killshot, that number was calculated with 2600 Armor.

Afaik its 2.5 or sth.

As far as I know, grubs don’t spawn on pets, illus and NPC’s anymore.

Oglaf.1074:

How do you melee the Guardian boss in CM path 2? Bridgette I believe her name is.

Yeah Yeah maybe that was an exaggeration. But I do use Axe/Shield + GS most of the time.

So lets remove that last sentence. There are still some bosses left. But you can melee the majority.

Edit: Well, you can. This guy is just too OP, nerf him!

Naekuh.7925:

Molch.2078:

Use HB for Might-Stacking and good DPS. Switch to Axe/Any. Eviscerate and Autohit with 15-10 Might. Switch to GS and repeat.

why not both?

Cuz when u got something which can 4 shot you…. there is no way ur gonna go in there with a Axe or a melee weapon.

You can melee every single trashmob and 95% of the bossmobs in this game. For the last 5% I carry a Rifle in my bag.
Oh, and you can melee that last 5%, too. It’s just kinda hard.

Codo.2860:

The problem with the formula lies in the fact that with OLD DAMAGE I meant the damage without taking critics into account. So when you add 1050 and then 1050 again you get a 50+50 damage increase, that is correct.

In your link sadly I can’t see the graphic but the formula is surely right.

Ah ofc, that makes sense. So you could say OLD DAMAGE ~ Power.

The link can’t provide any graphics. You substitute AAA and CCC with your own numbers, click “=” and get (x , y)=(… , …) Thats the perfect distribution for Power and Precision.

Use HB for Might-Stacking and good DPS. Switch to Axe/Any. Eviscerate and Autohit with 15-10 Might. Switch to GS and repeat.

foofad.5162:

First of all you’re making it WAY too complicated, and in the end it’s causing you to make some pretty large errors.

Your “coefficient” for power increasing tooltip damage isn’t the actual skill coefficient. You’re better off looking up the real skill coefficients and then comparing power versus precision on a skill by skill basis. I’ve posted a list of the Guardian coefficients on this forum, it’s probably around the second page.

Most skills have a coefficient between .6 and 1.5, for example. The true damage formula is Damage = Power * Average Weapon Damage * Skill Coefficient / Armor. Once you know the skill coefficient you can plug everything else in, multiply by critical hits, and actually compare precision versus power.

Damage without Crit = Power * Average Weapon Damage * Skill Coefficient / Armor
Damage with crit = Damage without crit * (1 + Critical Hit Chanche * Critical Hit Bonusdamage)
= Power * Average Weapon Damage * Skill Coefficient / Armor * (1 + Critical Hit Chanche * Critical Hit Bonusdamage)
= Skill Coefficient * [Power * Average Weapon Damage / Armor * (1 + Critical Hit Chanche * Critical Hit Bonusdamage)]

Damage is proportional to Power * (1 + Critical Hit Chanche * Critical Hit Bonusdamage), therefore the Coefficient is irrelevant for maximum damage. Same goes for Average Weapon Damage and Armor.

Im not sure about the damage increase with Prec, Codo, can you explain this formula? Let’s say old damage = 100 and crtical damage =0.5. I’ll put 2100 points into Prec., damage increase =100. Now I’ll put 1050 points into Prec, damage increase = 50, new damage = 150. Now i’ll put another 1050 points into Prec, damage increase = 75. I have 225 damage now instead of 200.

Another possibility:
Wolfram Alpha for the win
CCC is your Critical Damage ([The number in your Herointerface +50]/100)
AAA are the attributpoints you want to spent for power and precision in total.

x = the amount of points you have to put into Power, y into Precision.

Edit: The link can’t provide any graphics. You substitute AAA and CCC with your own numbers, click “=” and get (x , y)=(… , …) Thats the perfect distribution for Power and Precision.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Endure_Pain
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_Stance
They have…

I agree, but I think the problem is that Warriors are OP. GS + Axe/any Warrior deals more AoE then a Thief can deal on one target. With 18k+ HP. Something is wrong…

Leo G.4501:

Whereas I can stack 10-12 stacks of might on melees with dagger, I can easily keep 25 stacks on them with scepter.

2 Blastfinisher from Fire, one from Earth and one Arcane Utility. And one Combofield Fire. Please, how do you stack 25 times Might?

Depends on the Guardian:
P/V/T wannabe Tank without Support = horrible.
Sharing boons and healing like candy = I like.

btw, this thread belongs to the dungeon forum. It’s not about Guardians, it’s about feelings for Guardians in Dungeons.

Poison isn’ a good damage-dealing condition, it’s worth ~2 bleeds. The -33% heal is the strong point. And 3 bleeds for 4 sec from cluster is not much if compared to the huge direct damage it’s able to deliver. The Autoattack is not weak either and no conditiondmg here.

Spliting the bomb increases the damage of both the direct damage and the bleed damage. (look it up if you don’t believe this) If there is no combofield for the blastfinisher, always split.

Power/Vitality/Toughness

• Ring: 16 points stats or 1%+kritdmg

• Jewel: 5 points stats or 1% kritdmg

easy choice^^

dont forget: in mixed builds, use rings, helm and trousers for PVT first and jewels für +%kritdmg first.

As long there are player who run full berserk in fotm/Arah/CoE and are able to survive without any problem there is no arguing about Berserk>P/V/T. You’ll start with P/V/T and swich to Berserk as soon as you’re experienced enought. If you play since release and are still not able to go full GC in PvE-content, then your playstyle is bad and you should feel bad.

@Topic:

I actually kick MF geared people from my PuG.
Go make your gold digging on someone else’s expense >.>

/sign

I don’t like this Build… wouldn’t it be a better idea to buff the venoms instead of the aura?

Which venoms are used in this build for dungeons? They seem kinda useless to me compared to the effort they need.

To clear things up: 20% chance doesnt mean 100% with 5 trys, thats correct. BUT when you throw huge numbers of GS into the MT, lets say 1000×4 you will get 200 upgrades on average. I can use Wiki, too!

SO, in theory, you put maybe 8×4 swords in the toilet (i kinda like this name), get one exotic, then put 2×4 swords in and get another one.

When a huge number of player throws a huge number of swords into that thing and get a huge number of NOT exotics, then the chance isnt 20%.

eisberg.2379:

It it very possible to go through 1000 tries and never get a success, but you still had a 20% chance every time to get a success, you just got unlucky and hit the 80% failure every time.

Chance for exo after 1000 trys, when chance for a single try=20%: 1-(1-0.2)^1000 =… well my calculator says 100%. And its a good calculator. So its sth like 99.999999999999%

OP is right, if you do this for a long time and the Sell and Buy Numbers are correct and the chance for upgrade is 20% and you have enought money to support this long enought, then its for free.

Skybreaker.3264:

But chances are not all 3 splits will crit, so it ends up with slightly lesser damage. as its easier to get 1 big crit than 3 smaller ones.

Sometimes your big cluster wont crit either, then you lose a bunch of Damage. You can also say “as its easier to get 1 non big crit than 3 small non big crits” Both statements are wrong.

Lets say you shoot 10 Bombs at a 60% crit Ratio. Lets take the numbers from the picture. Split: Crit 314 (~pi*100, btw); No Crit 168 and No Split: Crit 885 -> No Split and No Crit: 474

No Split: 10 Bombs, 6 crit, 4 No crit -> 7206 Dmg
Split: 30 Bombs, 18 Crit, 12 No Crit -> 7668 Dmg

The topic was about the P/P build. There is little sense to comparing it to SB since Scootabuser uses a SB anyway as a sec. weapon.

You get 3 small bombs… 3×314=942>885.
And the tooltip says it has one sec activation time. Nothing about cost.

I did that before I looked it up at the wiki. Detonate Cluster costs 0 initiative. The tooltip for the dmg is also correct, but obviously higher. And one bomb deals 1 stack of bleed.

Edit: Screens added

Dee Jay.2460:

Detonating Clusterbomb manually = More spread, less direct damage, 3 Bleeds, 4 Initiative

Not Detonating Clusterbomb = Less spread, more direct damage, no bleeds, Blast finisher, 3 Imitative.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cluster_Bomb

Im not sure which game you’re playing…

Detonating Clusterbomb manually = More spread, more direct damage, 3 Bleeds, 3 Initiative

Not Detonating Clusterbomb = Less spread, less direct damage, 1 Bleed, Blast finisher, 3 Initiative.

Unload has a higer chanche to trigger Opportunist. And if you hit that thief with 6k Bomb, you’ll hit him with 11k Unload. (Okay Ensign, 10k, but that changes nothing)

Okay… the discussion SB vs. P/P is kinda funny since Scootabuser uses them both…

So, I hope you dont mind if I try to discuss the OP-P/P build instead. My favourite P/P Build: http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mMkMMc9dpx0f0oaVsqM08khT7kie7kiQ7070M7kGL70V7ofD70m

The main difference: DA instead of Acro and Trickery. Whenever you said sth like “Why do many player skip Fluid strike” I was like “wtf, exposed weakness is even better”
The vulnerability from sundering strikes and sigill of frailty lasts half the time for bosses but the duration is 25% longer with DA. It’s not imba, but its something.

250 Power and +5% Dmg from combined training > +one Unload every 25 sec from quick recovery

There are still 15 points in Acrobatics left, so the loss of survivability is small.

The +3 initiative from preparedness is one big joke. One 3/5 unload more in a bossfight that lasts about 5 min? I think not. Kleptomanic increases your ini-reg for 3 Points/40 sec. Thats another Unload every minute. + you cant use it on every Cooldown since it teleports you to the big bad boss – you need to use it carefull.
The group support with 10 sec might and fury every ~40 sec is maybe a bit better than the group support with vulnerability, but thats it.

Even the bleed-dmg from vital shot profits more from +25% conditionduration then from +150 Conditiondmg.

Since your OP looks expierienced and well-conceived, maybe I am missing a huge point here.
And sorry for the probably terrible language, I am not a native speaker, but im sure you figuered that out

I got the first point. Vulnerability isn’t affected by conditiondmg, thats true. But might is, and with earthsigill and opportunist-trait, furry is, too. Leapfinnisher + firefield equals fire aura → burn. Ofc direct dmg is better under that aspect, but conditions ain’t that bad.

Your second point starts with “conditiondamage is smaller than direct damage”. Proof? I’d like to see the math behind this statement. Srsly I’d love to see it, because im a big fan of direct dmg myself.

And thats the point I dont understand. Thief uses utility slot, elite slot, F1, all his endurance and a bit initiative, enemy uses one stunbreaker, done. Counter’d by pressing one button.

And if your stunbreak is on cd, the previously mentioned GCwarri/BS Thief can kill you even faster.

Out dps condition builds by a lot? 1 death blossom ~ 6k AoE dmg, ignoring armor. And in a structured team you are the only one with bleed. 25 stacks just for you.

What was the big deal with phistol whip anyway? Everybody and their mom uses a stunbreaker nowadays. Even backstab glasscannon thief or greatsword warri with bullcharge, speed and 100b can kill you without one.

Very entertaining. Good music, epic gameplay.
BUT
Could you do this with any class? Or at least imagine to do this? Almost 300k dmg against the final boss, thief BS krits for 90k max, I am jealous. You took half her HP even before the first wave spawned.

Don’t get me wrong. As I said, epic play and I’m sure not every warrior can do this just because his class is op, but imho Warrior is op in PvE.

btw, how much practice was necessary to achieve this?