Guild Wars 2

MrIllusion.5304:

I want mounts. Why?

Because compromising my build to include perma 25% run speed is stupid.

Because paying through the nose for Traveler’s Runes, which provide little benefit other than perma 25% run speed, is stupid.

Because sacrificing a slot on my skill bar for perma 25% run speed is stupid.

This isn’t about having more maneuverability. People are doing this to move around faster.

Comments about not putting mounts in, what are they?

Takes up resources? Dumb. All content takes resources. Designing minis and tonics take resources. Is there a large scale protest against new minis?

Unnecessary because of waypoints? Dumb. People are already using builds with 25% perma boost. If speed boosts are unnecessary then replace signet of air and traveler’s runes and signet of locust speed boost with something else.

Because GW2 shouldn’t have mounts and players should go play other games that have it? This takes the Darwin prize. GW2 doesn’t have other pvp modes or duels or GvG or raids or “challenging content” or precursor crafting. Should this stop people from asking for them?

I like mounts and I’m prepared to support my argument with my wallet. More than RNG tickets or town clothes or more boosters or MORE BACKPIECES.

If you’re opposed to mounts let your wallet speak.

From what you have said, it appears this game is Not for you. maybe you should play another game, maybe one with mounts? I can recommend World of Warcraft highly. That game has plenty of mounts, and they come in different colors.

PS: How exactly would one show they oppose mounts with their wallet? I am very curious.

Use their Money to NOT Buy a Mount? I am doing that now.

runeblade.7514:

Nerelith.7360:

derowyn.9871:

You dont know what is compelling to Anet, in fact the more people that voice their want for them, or even indifference, are the only reasons needed,

Anet are game developers, they constantly add and attempt to create a fun and enjoyable experience for their players as well as entice new ones.

Did they not impose Ascended gear? and with the waypoint system that this game has, it makes it PERFECT for mounts , because they would be truly optional at every level of the game.

You don’t know the workflow of Anet or how it would impact other content, could only mean less cosmetic updates for a while who knows? either way which content is more important than another is purely subjective. There are many things now, that people would rather have had that dev time spent towards mounts.

You are asking for us to compel you which is unnecessary.

If mounts would significantly increase the playerbase , barring tech difficulties, i think Anet would be compelled.

There is a fool-proof way to tell what is compelling for Anet. You make a compelling argument. And see if Anet provides mounts.

In 2 years, there have been maybe 3 cosmetics only mounts. That tells me the arguments provided have not been compelling.

And saying " you have no idea what anet might find compelling" is a cop-out.

You need to make a compelling argument for mounts and hope it’s good enough for Anet to put resources Into it, while overcoming player objection to same. Anet needs to be compelled, in spite of the fact that objection to mounts is passionately felt.

Hey if your argument is good enough, and Anet decides that we will have mounts, then the shoe is on the other foot, and we need to live with their decision, or find another game to play if we find it THAT odious.

But saying " Hey we don’t know what they may find compelling" is not a compelling argument.

Until your side makes them, they will simply see all the arguments made by the anti-mount side, even when we didn’t have to make any other than:

" we agree with Anet’s current and consistent decision to not provide speed boost mounts, and we have reasons for not even wanting cosmetics only mounts."

This " Speed boost mounts with waypoints would make speed boost mounts trully optional." is disingenuous.

ANY type of speed boost will make mounts mandatory, even for those that do not want them, and cannot bare to look at them.

Try again….

Compelling reasons… Compelling enough for Anet.

Unless…. your only reasons are…

1. I think they would be cool.
2. I want it.

By the way, we have heard these before, so has Anet. and … still no mounts.

( waits for compelling reasons )

PS: We are not asking you to compel US. We are asking you to compel ANET. and no..simply saying “a lot of us want it” is Not compelling Anet.

I Know this because this has been a constant refrain for 2 years, and yet, there are still No speed boost mounts, and Only 3 cosmetics only mounts.

( sits back, and waits for compelling reasons so Anet can review them, and ….. more than likely continue their policy of not providing speed boost mounts with approval. )

PPS: Both Guild Wars and Gw2 have been known forever to not have speed boost mounts. It has become a part of its brand, and it is a part of its LORE. Suddenly deciding to go against the lore, and the brand they have evolved, is supposed to suddenly swell the player-base?

Fact… maybe In another game mounts added 2 years In may lead to a swelling of the player-base. But For Gw2? What will they do? Take out ads in websites for video games, and magazines " New Gw2….Now with 100 % more mounts!!! Oooh all that Mounty goodness…come Now and get a free chicken mount."

And this will lead to a throng of players rushing to play???

Seriously? Or are you simply tossing this against a wall hoping it sticks?

Anet put minis/bobblehead/finishers/cosmetic armor/ Total Makeover Kit/Name Change Contract/musical instrument in the gem shop because:

• It is cool
• I want it.

The reasoning almost sounds like Mounts!

The difference is, they did Not have to overcome such passionately felt opposition.
and

Still no mounts.

People have been saying

1. it would be cool.
2. I want it.

for 2 years.

If that were enough for mounts…why isn’t tyria crawling with them?

Where are the mounts?

If those reasons are compelling for mounts , why wasn’t Anet compelled?

One reason is waypoints. Another is, each class already has a speed boost mechanic. it’s Not Anet’s fault if people don’t wish to use it, that reason sounds personal.

jheryn.8390:

By the way, the comparisons to WoW are old and stale. This isn’t WoW (thank goodness). I don’t want it to be WoW. It will never be WoW. Who cares what WoW did? Who cares about WoW’s implementations and timelines? If I wanted the things in WoW, I would play WoW.

To this all I would Like to add is. When I want a mounted experience, … I play WoW. I have a 500 tailor that made a Frosty Flying Carpet, so I do enjoy having a flying mount…On World of Warcraft. I do not want mounts here, because they are unnecessary we have waypoints.

The developers have put thought into what classes get a speed boost skill, which get more than one, and which can give their speed boost to allies around them. Which will be unbalanced by a universal speed boost.

Mount Models have a tendency to have bad weapon clipping into the mount …

Griefers have a tendency to use the mounts to cover up npc’s so they cannot be selected easily,…. Unless the player knows it’s there.

Speed boost mount riders have a tendency when they draw agro, to kite their mobs behind them, and outrun them, but not before dragging the mobs to some hapless player that has his hands full already, suddenly he has 3 or 4 other mobs to fight… as the rider just… races off without a care in the word…

etc,etc,etc,….

THESE are compelling reasons to NOT add mounts.

And yet, the ONLY reason I need is…

" Anet has continued to NOT provide speed boost mounts and I agree with their decision."

When we ask the pro-mount to provide compelling reasons all we get are " they would be cool" " we want them." " other games have them." or .." I do not wish to either swap weapons or use up a utility slot..it’s a bother."

None of these are compelling.

derowyn.9871:

Nerelith.7360:

Ashen.2907:

Nerelith.7360:

Ashen.2907:

Nothing wrong, in my opinion, with a customer expressing a desire for an addition to a product they use. The fact that the company has already expressed a willingness to add similar elements to the game (for a price) seems to encourage the requests. There is no reason more appropriate, again in my opinion, for making a request of a service provider than, “this is something that I as a customer am willing to pay for.” Of course any company has the right to say no.

Nothing wrong, in my opinion, with other customers saying that they would not like to see the requested addition made. They don’t need any more reason than, “This is something that would bother me as a paying customer.” Of course any company has the right to say yes to the request despite these protests.

And they also have the right to either say no…. or ignore it.

They seem to be ignoring it.

I completely agree that they have the right to say no. I said as much in the post you quoted.

As to ignoring it, of course such would be their right, are they doing so ?…that remains to be seen. Anet has added mount-like (mechanically) things to the game in the past.

Anything that is not added to the game until next month, or the month after, or the month after that is something that is not in the game right now. That doesn’t mean that it is being ignored now or that it is purposefully being excluded from the game.

Of course One can ay that about anything, but is it likely? I can speculate, and say that Anet is planning and working On having Pokemon type battle pets, and Rideable Tank type mecha-warriors in open word for Open world PvP.

And Just because they haven’t said that they aren’t doesn’t mean they aren’t. Just because it’s not in this month, or next, or the month after that, doesn’t mean it won’t be added.

Like Mounts.

It just seems to me that 2 years after launch, 3 cosmetics only mounts…. How likely is it?

The only reason I pick a bone here is, that while you appear to present both sides, you really are pushing for mounts In a subtle way.

Instead of saying " they can choose to say yes, or no." you subtly finish with with

Of course any company has the right to say yes to the request despite these protests.

Just feels as if you want to focus on the possibility however remote, however unlikely, that Anet would say yes, in-spite of player objections, when Anet has done nothing to encourage these thoughts.

The thing is…it’s not that unlikely, especially considering Anet has not come out and said NO mounts ever.

You are just touting the fact that they have not been added yet as some measure that they will never be added.

In the genre that GW2 is in, and the type of game it is, that is a kittenumption as these games evolve over time. It took WOW how many years to give flight to their playerbase?

and by the way those mecha tank thingies for World pvp are Golems…

and like many have expressed in other games mounts were pretty much required to play the game in a timely fashion/keep up with your peers, in GW2 they would actually be optional (which i like) so only those that would enjoy them would be compelled to get them

Not wanting to SEE mounts is a personal desire/grievance akin to suffering brightly pink norn warriors…this is a multi-player game is it not?

I would like to know how mounts would adversely affect those that are against them

As far as lore, there are already npcs in the game that use animals to transport goods. Apparently GW2 has not progressed fully passed the beasts of burden as some of you claim, and I’ve not seen anyone advocate mounts be solely animal.

One way that Mounts could be optional is if they are cosmetics only. Another way is if all they do is replace a utility skill that already has a speed boost with the very same duration and cooldown, affected by the same exact traits, but have a mount animation, and Model without crappy clipping.

The main issue for me is, that I have to look at these mounts. I do not wish to. I think Mounts add to screen clutter, and they may cause FPS decay, as the server then needs to render them.

Another point. Yes there are NPC’s that use Dolyaks to transport Goods, Now many of them ride the dolyaks?

PS Mecha – tank thingy for OPEN WORLD PvP does Not exist. A Golem is Just a nice word for a Battle suit. Not quite what I had in mind, i was thinking more along the Lines of an Abrams.

Godzzila.3752:

This post sums everything up. Everything about this game is well explained by this post and the following Karla posts.
At this point this topic just turned into an infinite loop of searching for possible arguments to extend this discussion. Everything that had to be said has been said. At this point is just another fanboys vs haters discussion with little to no-point to it.
So I’m just abandoning this discussion, everything I wanted to say has been said, only thing being done is points being recycled over and over again.
As of the last year (and based on Glass Door reviews) Anet has been going downhill with more and more unsatisfied workers, and this is reflecting on the game also going downhill with barely any content to support it.
That being said I’m abandoning this discussion, since I’m not backing off and for I don’t expect the opposite side to back off. This game seems to be cursed to forever be in this loop where 50% wants something, the other 50% doesn’t, also the fact that every post seems to be ignored by Anet doesn’t help.

Agreeing to disagree is always a good thing when someone realizes that positions are entrenched.

I do have to quibble about a couple of things. fanboy vs haters is a bit… offensive, especially when there are people on BOTH sides that were trying to have a reasoned discourse. I would Not call anyone either a fanboy or a hater. it assumes too much, and all it does is push away someone that might have come to understand your position better …given the chance.

Another is Glass Door Reviews. Not sure How those work, but it is My experience that when a worker is discontented, they have a tendency to be biased. Their opinions are not always fair to the employer. And especially if they have left the employ… they cannot help but shout from the rooftops what crap their old Boss was.

So I tend to take those reviews with a lb of salt.

Lastly as to the game going downhill. This is purely opinion. One person’s trash is another’s treasure.

While I can quibble about how some changes were implemented. level 36 traits requiring nigh impossible accomplishments to unlock for example… the lateness of the traits, so Players have to hit level 36, before they have any optional traits to personalize their character for example….

I think the changes On average are good ones. I fail to detect this…. " going downhill."

Maybe some of this is " I no longer like the game, therefore it MUST suck." ? hard to tell since you have a habit of proclaiming your opinions as if they were facts.

In parting:

I do hope you find the game with the endgame you find enjoyable.

Might I reccomend World of Warcraft, since you have brought it up more than any other, as an indicator of Good endgame design?

Vayne.8563:

Nerelith.7360:

Amere.9607:

stupid thread.

is there an endgame? no.
are we, as community going to create a discussion and extract points from that? no, we just going to whine, and blame each other for stuff.
can we, as community do something? nope, we are to busy arguing with vayne at forums, because, uknow, that’s how things work

lots of kittening, very little sence. thats kinda ok theese times?

I’m not arguing with Vayne, I think he makes sense. I used to argue with Vayne, until I stopped myself from responding one day, and actually listened to what he had to say.

I barely know how to respond to this. lol

I had to give you props. I felt that when someone says " we all argue with Vayne." it’s Just an example of Argumentum ad populum.

For me any time someone needs to find a group to agree with his or her positions, it’s a sign of lack of confidence in their argument. A sign they fear that it cannot stand On it’s own.

Oh don’t get me wrong, you still say things i don’t agree with, but of late…i find I agree with more than I disagree with.

On Topic. Depending on how you look at it, either Gw2 has no endgame, or the entire game is endgame.

There are those to whom this game appeals, and those to whom it doesn’t.

As much as I can understand the desire of players to want to make this into a game they like, it IS selff-centered, self-absorbed, egotistical, and arrogant.

A lot of what I hear is.." if we leave you’ll be sorry." Nonsense.

This game is what it is. Players need to learn to like it for what it is. Or find something else to play.

Godzzila.3752:

Nerelith.7360:

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

I think you are missing the point of core cooperation rather than competitiveness. It is more ‘social’ to cooperate or, at least, not have to compete to get mats from nodes, or XP and drops from mobs. It fosters a friendlier environment, where you may make a friend, rather than an enemy because no one is irritated that you ‘stole’ his/her kill or material or whatever.

That’s all. Geez!

OT – I enjoy what this game offers, and I don’t feel the need for any of the OP’s proposed ‘endgame’. There are, of course, things I would like added to the game, but I’m sure most would not consider them their definition of ‘endgame’.

I have to agree. I find that this game is more social, because In other games I have played (cough) WoW ( cough)…if someone is fighting something and dieing, and I jump in to help, there have been times I got yelled at.

Here, I can Jump in and help, and people actually thank me.

rly? did you even bother to read my explanation of why comparing this game to WoW doesn’t make this game “social”?

Cooperative, MAYBE (even tho that’s arguable), but by far NOT-social.

\

You keep comparing this game to wow, maybe you’d be happier playing wow, rather than trying to turn Gw2 into WoW?

WoW is less social than Gw2. It’s community can be extremely toxic at times.

" is this Barrens chat?" How many here understand the reference?

Enforced Grouping does not make a game social, it just forces people to play with others that if given the choice they might prefer to not play with at all.

Gw2 in My opinion is better, because grouping is 100 % totally optional.
You do not have to group, to benefit someone nearby.

The issue as I see it is… lazy thinking. Many players have gotten used to looking at an MMO and saying " an mmo has this… an mmo has that… and the other.." then gw2 comes along tosses some of those pre-conceptions out the window.

Now there are players that refuse to adapt. They want this MMO to look Like traditonal MMO’s. Maybe it’s best for them to go play one of those traditional MMO’s and leave our GW2 alone?

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

I think you are missing the point of core cooperation rather than competitiveness. It is more ‘social’ to cooperate or, at least, not have to compete to get mats from nodes, or XP and drops from mobs. It fosters a friendlier environment, where you may make a friend, rather than an enemy because no one is irritated that you ‘stole’ his/her kill or material or whatever.

That’s all. Geez!

OT – I enjoy what this game offers, and I don’t feel the need for any of the OP’s proposed ‘endgame’. There are, of course, things I would like added to the game, but I’m sure most would not consider them their definition of ‘endgame’.

I have to agree. I find that this game is more social, because In other games I have played (cough) WoW ( cough)…if someone is fighting something and dieing, and I jump in to help, there have been times I got yelled at.

Here, I can Jump in and help, and people actually thank me.

Amere.9607:

stupid thread.

is there an endgame? no.
are we, as community going to create a discussion and extract points from that? no, we just going to whine, and blame each other for stuff.
can we, as community do something? nope, we are to busy arguing with vayne at forums, because, uknow, that’s how things work

lots of kittening, very little sence. thats kinda ok theese times?

I’m not arguing with Vayne, I think he makes sense. I used to argue with Vayne, until I stopped myself from responding one day, and actually listened to what he had to say.

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

Gear grind doesn’t bring “new” content. All it does is give the developers an easy way out. They recycle old encounters, old mechanics, slap on a new paint scheme and up the numbers involved. More hp and more defense does not make for a “new” more interesting encounter.

I’m not against having more skins added to the game, just the addition of more stat tiers. I know some people enjoy the hunt for rare, elusive looks and I’m perfectly ok with that. As long as that rare exclusive look is limited to the cosmetic aspect.

They don’t have gear grind but still they are doing everything you say they usually do:
Recyle Old Encounters: CHECK;
Recycle Old Mechanics: CHECK;

The only thing they are missing right now is slapping new paint scheme, but I honestly think that they shouldn’t be far away from that

As I’ve pointed out there is NEW content. You’re saying it’s recycled and I’ve pointed out to you differences. You choose to ignore those differences, saying they’re not different enough. Which is fine. but that’s not what you’re saying.

Anyone saying Dry Top is recycled is being disingenuous. It shows a distinct lack of respect for the amount of thought and energy that went into putting it together.

Dry Top it IS being recycled tho…
You have no new mechanics what so ever in any of the events, the events are diffrent but nevertheless the same. “Dodge this or you fall / die!” / “Clear this zone!” / “Hit this champion!”

What is so diffrent about every other event-based maps?

Oh and by the way, while I was here notice what just happen (attachment), nobody cares, they just farm whatever they want because the kittenty reward system rewards you for that…

So how is the clearing the mine recycled? How is rescuing the 12 people from south mine recycled? How is the light bridge event recycled?

And the whole theme of the zone is new, including the sand storm.

Vaybe, what he is saying is, that if you find a new type of cake you never had before, and you love the taste, and find it unique and Interesting….it cannot be a nrew type of cake, and cannot be unique, because he’s seen the same ingredients before…. Just not all together… some In One type of cake, some In another… and maybe In different quantities.

ya..see Choclate Fudge swirl marble cake is the same as Vanilla Custard, because Both contain milk, flour, baking powder, eggs and sugar. Don’t even try to say they are different.

Zardul.3952:

Beldin.5498:

Zardul.3952:

Then i wish you never get bored of doing the same thing everyday.. like millions of past and gone GW2 players have experienced.

If that is SOOOOO much fun .. why are you here then ? Why don’t you play any of
the games out there with those feature instead of trying to destroy GW2 for all
player who love the game for what it actually is ?

I just can’t understand why people that seem to hate this game so much and love
other games sooo much more .. simply don’t play those other games.

i dont hate Gw2.
i love it, but i can feel the creeping feeling of Bordem knockin at my door as soon as i log on.

i would love to say theres something fun to look forward to on this game but REALISTICALLY there isnt.

im a hardcore gamer i played pretty much every MMO out there. and currently GW2 is my main one. but i know when something is dying out and what of.
WoW – 7 years

Still being played. I still play it.

Runescape – 2 years

Still being played.

Gw1 – 3 years

Still being played. I still play it.

Skyrim – 2 years ( if you count that)

No I don’t but, still being played.

and currently Gw2- 2 years

Still being played.

Experience has taught me when things need to change.

Your list shows a bunch of games that are still in existence, and have a playerbase that plays them. You kind of shot yourself In the foot there.

The ONLY thing you proved is that when you get bored of games, you get bored of games, and because you have the tastes you have, the games you mentioned no longer challenge you, so you play them less and less til you stop.

Not sure what you feel that has to do with trends in game consumption by everyone else.

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

remember what i have said, and i gaurentee in a year or 2 when you feel the same you will think back to this.

and be like " ahhhh he was right.. why have i wasted my time?"

Don’t guarantee it. I’m from a generation of people who make their own fun. It’s a very different thought process. I don’t really need to be spoonfed stuff. If I like the world and I like the setup and I like the mechanics, I’ll find things to entertain myself.

Feel free to talk for yourself. Try not to talk for me.

(wrinkles her eyebrows Ina thoughtful frown)

Vayne, the More I hear what you have to say, the more I find Myself agreeing with you.

Should I be concerned? (just teasing)

Taygus.4571:

SkiTz.4590:

Vayne.8563:

Nick.6972:

Compare the open world content to high level Fractals.
Which gets more frequent updates and new content.
Now. Which gets played more often? Which one doesn’t because of the lack of updates and repetitiveness?

FOTM alone is makes less than 1% of the whole the available PvE content hence gets played far less.

And I’ve never heard of Lord Of The Rings online.
Provide the same info with Wildstar.

It’s been provided for Guild Wars 1 and WoW. Can’t give you info on Wildstar, but I’d bet that if the game doesn’t attract and hold casuals the game will end up with a very small player base.

Do you guys not listen to what devs have said from different games over the years?

You think GW2 has a massive player base? (not including china) I would be shocked if theres even close to 50k concurrent players at peak times in EU+NA

Regardless, the point I think is that there is MORE THAN ENOUGH casual content in this game already.
What on earth could possibly drive away more players than it already has to add just something remotely challenging content or revamp dungs to add a harder mode with better rewards? even if everyone can’t do it, its something to progress towards. compared to other terrible forms of progression this game has.

Right..
how often id lv50 fractals completed?
Do you play lv50 fracs? in zerk ascended gear?

How often does arah get completed? (can you solo arah? )
or TA aetherblade path?

The majority of the community don’t want to even aim to be able to complete them.

And most importantly, for the hardcore players, how long do these dungeons stay challenging?

I completed Arah. I had an awesome time, then again, I was with an awesome group. The funny thing is, this was Like close to a year ago.

I don’t begrudge people wanting casual content. I am liking the feeling of Just roleplaying now, I Like PvE, and I agree with vayne… the Only people that think that Hardcore raiders are the majority are hardcore raiders.

casual players deserve to have a game that accomodates them as well. This game doesn’t have " endgame" as the OP defines Endgame. Instead of demanding it in such petulant patronizing arrogant tones, maybe he should Just go play something that gives him what he wants, he won’t find it hear.

Not if I have anything to say about it.

(stands up for her fellow casuals, with balled fists)

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Nick.6972:

Compare the open world content to high level Fractals.
Which gets more frequent updates and new content.
Now. Which gets played more often? Which one doesn’t because of the lack of updates and repetitiveness?

FOTM alone is makes less than 1% of the whole the available PvE content hence gets played far less.

And I’ve never heard of Lord Of The Rings online.
Provide the same info with Wildstar.

It’s been provided for Guild Wars 1 and WoW. Can’t give you info on Wildstar, but I’d bet that if the game doesn’t attract and hold casuals the game will end up with a very small player base.

Do you guys not listen to what devs have said from different games over the years?

Casuals are a REALLY small portion of gamers.
Also WoW prooves you wrong, it had the greatest online community any game ever had and even though its not at its peak anymore, it’s still pretty high.

I believe there is a Bit of a disconnect between you and reality.
This sort of proves it. There used to be a time when games were made for hardcore players. Those days are long gone and far away.

Since the launch of WoW, and the " simplification" of MMO’s the largest segment of the playerbase….and the fastest growing…is the casual market.

One reason is, that as the hardcore players age, they have other responsibilities. ( Gotta work to pay the internet bill..or they can’t be hardcore or casual.)

I for one USED to be hardcore. Now i consider myself casual, I have embraced my inner carebear bunny slippers wearing Plushy backpack wearing asura… and I have to say , I have never been more content.

casuals are the growing demographic in MMO’s today. casuals are the largest demographic in MMO’s today.

You saying " casuals are a small minority…" well it tells me why you can be so wrong. There is a Bit of a disconnect between your mind-space, and reality.

Godzzila.3752:

Behellagh.1468:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Danikat.8537:

I never really understood the whole “end game” concept.

End game is the part of the game that gets the least attention during development, and also the part of the game many players race to get to, spending as little time as possible going through the parts of the game that get the most work pre-launch.

MMO players have become trained to level up ASAP to get to the “endgame” and are confused when a game is all about the journey and not the final destination. This is what generates a lot of the dislike about this game as voiced on the forums (another source are disgruntled GW PvP players). Because the tropes that they’ve been trained to accept aren’t here, the triad, mounts, vertical progression, structured raids, etc. It’s like being raised on FPS and then playing a stealth FPS. It’s only natural to be confused.

About the journey… I could agree with you if it didn’t take you around 3 maybe 4 days to reach leval cap from level 1. The first time you ever play this game it can take a few weeks but after that you can easily hit cap in a weekend or so… So, where is this journey? And it’s not like you would be rushing or anything is just that you already know what happned and because this game was made to be so easy to level that it raises the question: “Why?”

Only games that know that their content is focused on late game do this kind of stuff, for example: WoW gives you already level 80 chars, makes you level twice as fast when playing with friends… But that’s because they know that their content is late game. So why does it make that this game is so flipping easy to level just so that after a couple of days you are stuck with nothing to do?
And it’s not like it has any replay value, and aNet does know that (they keep giving insta level 20 for a reason) the story is always the same and most of the decisions are just to simulate choice. They give you no diffrence in the plot what so ever, just create the illusion of choice (other than that time you pick what order to follow, every decision is pretty much like this).
Don’t get me wrong the story is pretty interesting (having in count what MMO’s story usually is), the first time i did it with my warrior was amazing! But after having to do it all over again for my thief and then later to my guadian… It kinda lost it’s charm…
A game that rushes you to level 80 like this should have something up its sleeve to hit you in the face once you hit lvl cap, instead it just says: “I hope you had all the fun reaching level 80, now go ahead and collect skins.”

Me and the wife take our time, and we don’t hit level 80 in a weekend. Then again, we never tried. What we enjoy doing is hunting down skill points, doing story quests, hearts, and map completions. We also Like Looking for veterans and champions.

I Like playing WoW, but I don’t compare WoW to gw2 anymore. I can appreciate each game for what it is. I can enjoy what make both fun to play for me.

It seems to me that you like playing WoW.

This is not WoW. And I for one, speaking only for myself, do not want it turned into WoW, because a Player that liks WoW wants this game to be a WoW clone.

Maybe you made a mistake buying this game? … maybe you need to accept that Gw2 will not have what you enjoy in WoW. Maybe you just need to look for what you want in a game that has what you want…. Like WoW.

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Because some of us want to play a multiplayer game with that kind of sensibility and that was lacking in MMO space. That’s why. That’s exactly why.

Are you saying someone who enjoys that KIND of experience can’t also be social and want to play with other people? I bet there are a lot more of us out here than you think their are.

I’m a social guy. I like being in my guild. I like playing with friends. And I like not having to sit there and plan a raid for an hour before I jump in and attempt to run it so I might or might not get gear I need to go to the next raid. I don’t want an instanced game. I want to play in the open world.

I’m happy to trade Skyrim’s solitude for a social MMO that centers around stuff I enjoy.

There are dozens of MMOs for people who like other stuff. Can’t we just have one?

Nope, that makes no sense. This game as no “Social Features”. You have chat and that’s it. You can Play with your friends and like your guild in a game that’s well made

You’ve got to be joking. You don’t need social features to play with people. Want to hear a social feature? Mumble. That’s a social feature.

We do our guild missions together, run dungeons together, clear zones together. I can’t do that in Skyrim.

I’m not sure why you don’t understand this.

So… when exactly does “Start Having End-Game Features” start overidding “Being Able to Play With Friends and/or Guild”?

It’s changing the game, that’s what it has to do with it. You asked the question, I answered. This is how the conversation went.

I play this game and like it, without a traditional end game. Traditional end games tend to make the community more competive rather than cooperative. I wanted a cooperative non-competitive PvE experience to enjoy with friends. This game offers that.

Traditional end games creates haves and have nots. That’s not what the devs are trying to do here. You suggest that many of the things I like would be better in single player games and you’re right about that. But you’re leaving out the social aspect.

People have come on these forums asking for things like dueling, dps meters, gear check, all the things that come with the end game you want. And every time someone posts for stuff like this, there’s a bunch of people who shout it down. Not one or two. A bunch of people. Why?

Because those things ruin the type of game we want to play. Adding the types of things you’re asking for will inevitably lead to the kind of game I don’t want to play.

And because there are dozens of games made for you and only one game (so far) made for us, it would be nice if it remained a game for us.

Vayne I have to agree. I Like this game as it is. I am sure the game might be better if it had some features from Guild Wars (cought) Sub-classes (cough)… But I have learned to stop being resentful of what I wasn’t given, and learned to actually enjoy what I have.

Started playing Not 1…but 2 engineers. a Norn, and an Asura. I happen to Like asuras now.

Ok, I went off On a tangent. This game is Unique. There are 30 or 40 games out there that already have what the OP wants. Maybe the OP needs to just accept that this game is not for him, and doesn’t have what he wants.

It would be More fun for him to play a game that has what he wants already in it. Coming here and demanding WoW type endgame makes as much sense as me going to the WoW forums and demanding they do away with mounts and put waypoints In instead.

Godzzila.3752:

Maybe because the WoW system actually works? It keeps people interested and comming back, gives a sense of progression and reward, makes you feel useful in a group and overall just gives you something to do…
It worked for years, it still works, and maybe there is a reason for that…

Maybe you should play WoW instead? I happen to play both. There are things in WoW that i Like, and things in Gw2 that I like.

But maybe Instead of trying to turn Gw2 into WoW, you should just play WoW.

No one does WoW type gameplay better than WoW does.

Vayne.8563:

Vespero.6180:

Romek.4201:

to make it simple

a game need to be PLAYED not WATCHED like a movie

THIS^

I’m playing the game.

I’m confused. I thought I was Playing a game too. Where is this Gw2 Movie that Romek is talking about? I Might want to hunt it down when I take a break from playing the game

Godzzila.3752:

This game as 0 sense of reward. Nothing you do feels rewardful. You have no point in doing anything after getting lvl 80, the journey to lvl 80 is awesome, but you get there REALLY quickly. After that everything is just for cosmetic purposes, it’s like playing Sims where creating your charecter takes a long time… Doesn’t matter the stats. You won’t need them for anything. There is no “higher tier gear zones” and lower tier. And this is NOT a game decision. This was NOT something they sit and thought: “Lets make it so that you don’t have to keep seeking for better gear” this is a game design flaw. People play games not because they like looking at stuff but because of the experience-reward balance. If you have a lot of great maps and no reward for that the game becomes boring and pointless. If you have a lot of rewards for a bad expirience you get a really frustrating game. So saying that this game is just seeking the Not Need To Work For Anything expirience, im sorry but that’s bs.

The lack of a gear treadmill was a game decision. As to

People play games not because they like looking at stuff but because of the experience-reward balance. If you have a lot of great maps and no reward for that the game becomes boring and pointless.

This is only your opinion, not fact. I happen to enjoy the vistas. For me sometimes seeing a new map is reward enough.

Gear makes it easier to handle certain types of combat, but it’s Not Like you are going to get this awesome drop that suddenly makes you feel more uber.

Speaking for myself , I happen to like not having a gear treadmill. As for ascended, I have no idea How to even get my hands On ascended gear, nor do I care, me and the wife are content to duo level 20 norns one day, and then level 10 asuras the next,..sometimes we play our level 80 humans for fun…

For fun..Not for gear grind.

As I said, you have a Lot of opinions, but you seem to feel they are facts.

Godzzila.3752:

You can level really fast in this game which is why I think this becomes an even bigger issue… When the game was first released I got in with 3 other friends, we started playing at a steady (not speedruning or anything like that, just normal) pace and we got to lv 80 WAAY before 2 weeks of playtime, so we thought: “Cool! If we level that fast they sure must have a late game to play now!” Nope… Just sitting around…
In the end even before the first month of release all of my 3 friends just stoped playing it (so did I) but then I keep coming back ‘cause I know how much potential this game has, but 1 year in and I don’t see much progress towards solving this “issue”

Has it occurred to you that since this game is comprised mostly of casual players with an interest in just doing as they wish, that for that type of player, there is no issue to solve?

Ashen.2907:

Nerelith.7360:

Ashen.2907:

Nothing wrong, in my opinion, with a customer expressing a desire for an addition to a product they use. The fact that the company has already expressed a willingness to add similar elements to the game (for a price) seems to encourage the requests. There is no reason more appropriate, again in my opinion, for making a request of a service provider than, “this is something that I as a customer am willing to pay for.” Of course any company has the right to say no.

Nothing wrong, in my opinion, with other customers saying that they would not like to see the requested addition made. They don’t need any more reason than, “This is something that would bother me as a paying customer.” Of course any company has the right to say yes to the request despite these protests.

And they also have the right to either say no…. or ignore it.

They seem to be ignoring it.

I completely agree that they have the right to say no. I said as much in the post you quoted.

As to ignoring it, of course such would be their right, are they doing so ?…that remains to be seen. Anet has added mount-like (mechanically) things to the game in the past.

Anything that is not added to the game until next month, or the month after, or the month after that is something that is not in the game right now. That doesn’t mean that it is being ignored now or that it is purposefully being excluded from the game.

Of course One can ay that about anything, but is it likely? I can speculate, and say that Anet is planning and working On having Pokemon type battle pets, and Rideable Tank type mecha-warriors in open word for Open world PvP.

And Just because they haven’t said that they aren’t doesn’t mean they aren’t. Just because it’s not in this month, or next, or the month after that, doesn’t mean it won’t be added.

Like Mounts.

It just seems to me that 2 years after launch, 3 cosmetics only mounts…. How likely is it?

The only reason I pick a bone here is, that while you appear to present both sides, you really are pushing for mounts In a subtle way.

Instead of saying " they can choose to say yes, or no." you subtly finish with with

Of course any company has the right to say yes to the request despite these protests.

Just feels as if you want to focus on the possibility however remote, however unlikely, that Anet would say yes, in-spite of player objections, when Anet has done nothing to encourage these thoughts.

Ashen.2907:

Nothing wrong, in my opinion, with a customer expressing a desire for an addition to a product they use. The fact that the company has already expressed a willingness to add similar elements to the game (for a price) seems to encourage the requests. There is no reason more appropriate, again in my opinion, for making a request of a service provider than, “this is something that I as a customer am willing to pay for.” Of course any company has the right to say no.

Nothing wrong, in my opinion, with other customers saying that they would not like to see the requested addition made. They don’t need any more reason than, “This is something that would bother me as a paying customer.” Of course any company has the right to say yes to the request despite these protests.

And they also have the right to either say no…. or ignore it.

They seem to be ignoring it.

fellyn.5083:

Nerelith.7360:

Brother Grimm.5176:

Leo.2641:

I WANT mount, I don’t care what you want or need. Anet says “play how you want to play” whenever mount come because they will come and they will CREATE revenue guess what I going to get the mount because that is what I WANT, and if YOU don’t want it then DON’T get it. capiche

Wow….thank you for the very well thought out self-centered, immature and demanding verbal tantrum. It completely slipped all our minds that Anet’s every effort should be to provide what YOU WANT. Please forgive us.

What the poster above you fails to understand is that when Anet said " Play how you want to play" the implication was " with the tools we provide."

That kind of is supposed to go without saying. it’s Not Like i can demand to be given a Blimp that drops Bombs on the enemy forts… just because " hey, they said " Play how you want to play" and I want a Blimp"

Nor can I demand a " Fort Crusher Bomb" that I place at the gates and Just click the fuse, and run then 20 seconds later…everyone in the fort is dead.

Then again.." play How you want to play" means I am not Playing How I want to play if I cannot fly a Blimp to drop fort crusher bombs from them.

I want a personal Blimp!!!!! I want Fort Crusher Bombs!!!! Anet said " Play How you want to play!!!" and this is how I want to play!

Oh yes, and whenever the enemy gets near me… all their weapons turn into balloons and all they can do is point it at me, and let the air out, and all it does is go pphhhrrmmmfhhttttttttttttttttttt.

because…"Anet said " Play How you want to play!" and that is How I want to play!!!"

Unreal. Just….. unreal.

To be fair at one point in time we were supposed to have air ships in wvwvw.

Or so I remember hearing anyways.

No no. Not airships, I want My own BLIMP… with Fort Buster Bombs…all mine.. that only I get… No one else can use it, or get it… because…." they said " Play How you want to play!!!" and that is how I want to play!!!"

This is reductio ad absurdum.

Showing how ridiculous a proposition is, by carrying it to a totally ridiculous and absurd yet logical extreme if the proposition is accepted to be true.

Proposition:

When Anet said I could “Play How I want to play!” that meant I could make any ridiculous demand and they have to provide it, or they failed On their promise.

Absurd extreme:

Any player can demand anything.

Devata.6589:

Fyrebrand.4859:

1) Your use of the term “excuse” only concedes that mounts are unnecessary and redundant, but you have an irrational personal compulsion to shoehorn them in anyway. The only way to trick people into thinking they are a good thing is to come up with a contrived plot device that removes alternatives.

2) A lot of people are already strongly against mounts, even with waypoints intact. You aren’t going to win any favour by telling people that getting mounts means disabling waypoints.

Why would you need a ‘excuse’ for way-points, or even need to ‘trick people’. You put in mounts simply because it’s fun and it’s a game so should be about fun.

For the people who are against them if you really try to find the real reason why they are so strongly against it it’s in most cases “Because WoW”. Well hate and / or jealousy are not good advisors.

Devata, I was there at 7 of the last 10 Mount threads. Those of us not wanting mounts have given plenty of reasons for Not Liking them. Most of the reasons have nothing to do with WoW.

Secondly, you only assume. Watch that, you remember what they say about assuming.

Thirdly, The game would be fun for some, and NOT fun for others. Just because it would be fun for you, is Not compelling enough for Anet to redesign the game to include what others In the player base find odious.

Lastly, The Only reason we that dislike Mounts for this game need is…

" we are in agreement with Anet’s continuing and consistent decision to not provide speed boost mounts"

derowyn.9871:

You dont know what is compelling to Anet, in fact the more people that voice their want for them, or even indifference, are the only reasons needed,

Anet are game developers, they constantly add and attempt to create a fun and enjoyable experience for their players as well as entice new ones.

Did they not impose Ascended gear? and with the waypoint system that this game has, it makes it PERFECT for mounts , because they would be truly optional at every level of the game.

You don’t know the workflow of Anet or how it would impact other content, could only mean less cosmetic updates for a while who knows? either way which content is more important than another is purely subjective. There are many things now, that people would rather have had that dev time spent towards mounts.

You are asking for us to compel you which is unnecessary.

If mounts would significantly increase the playerbase , barring tech difficulties, i think Anet would be compelled.

There is a fool-proof way to tell what is compelling for Anet. You make a compelling argument. And see if Anet provides mounts.

In 2 years, there have been maybe 3 cosmetics only mounts. That tells me the arguments provided have not been compelling.

And saying " you have no idea what anet might find compelling" is a cop-out.

You need to make a compelling argument for mounts and hope it’s good enough for Anet to put resources Into it, while overcoming player objection to same. Anet needs to be compelled, in spite of the fact that objection to mounts is passionately felt.

Hey if your argument is good enough, and Anet decides that we will have mounts, then the shoe is on the other foot, and we need to live with their decision, or find another game to play if we find it THAT odious.

But saying " Hey we don’t know what they may find compelling" is not a compelling argument.

Until your side makes them, they will simply see all the arguments made by the anti-mount side, even when we didn’t have to make any other than:

" we agree with Anet’s current and consistent decision to not provide speed boost mounts, and we have reasons for not even wanting cosmetics only mounts."

This " Speed boost mounts with waypoints would make speed boost mounts trully optional." is disingenuous.

ANY type of speed boost will make mounts mandatory, even for those that do not want them, and cannot bare to look at them.

Try again….

Compelling reasons… Compelling enough for Anet.

Unless…. your only reasons are…

1. I think they would be cool.
2. I want it.

By the way, we have heard these before, so has Anet. and … still no mounts.

( waits for compelling reasons )

PS: We are not asking you to compel US. We are asking you to compel ANET. and no..simply saying “a lot of us want it” is Not compelling Anet.

I Know this because this has been a constant refrain for 2 years, and yet, there are still No speed boost mounts, and Only 3 cosmetics only mounts.

( sits back, and waits for compelling reasons so Anet can review them, and ….. more than likely continue their policy of not providing speed boost mounts with approval. )

PPS: Both Guild Wars and Gw2 have been known forever to not have speed boost mounts. It has become a part of its brand, and it is a part of its LORE. Suddenly deciding to go against the lore, and the brand they have evolved, is supposed to suddenly swell the player-base?

Fact… maybe In another game mounts added 2 years In may lead to a swelling of the player-base. But For Gw2? What will they do? Take out ads in websites for video games, and magazines " New Gw2….Now with 100 % more mounts!!! Oooh all that Mounty goodness…come Now and get a free chicken mount."

And this will lead to a throng of players rushing to play???

Seriously? Or are you simply tossing this against a wall hoping it sticks?

derowyn.9871:

jheryn.8390:

derowyn.9871:

in other words “I dont want” simply doesnt beat “I want” in a forum, people are just posting up personal grievances vs personal desires instead of having a real dialog about the best way to do mounts IF/when Anet decided to add them

Neither does “I want” beat “I don’t want”. Not wanting something in a game is as pertinent and viable as those things some people want.

Those that don’t want mounts in the game have no reason or motivation to have any kind of dialog about if/or when they may appear in the game because the don’t freakin’ want them. That sort of dialog is counterproductive to what they want which is to not have mounts.

It is also pretty pretentious and rude to claim that those that do not want mounts are airing their personal grievances while those who want them are expressing their personal desires. I have no “grievance” against mounts in games. It is just my personal desire to not want them in GW1 where I feel they have no place.

Pretty sure pretentious doesnt mean what you think it mean, as i clearly stated each side was on the same ground, sorry if my word choice was confusing.

I also clearly stated it was up to Anet, not either side having more clout than the other

Not wanting mounts is just as fine as wanting them, asserting your opinion as fact is the problem, and atleast personally, ive seen more people in favor of mounts be honest at the fact that they are indeed unnecessary and something they would enjoy if added to the game, and not standing behind scenarios of server stability or class travel balance etc…things that Anet would have surely resolved before implementation of mounts anyway

The Only reason we need is that we are perfectly content with Anet’s decision to not provide mounts.

The reason we do not have a dialogue about How best to go about having mounts is, because we do not want mounts under any set of circumstances.

No way, No how. It is our preference.

You say that we have equal clout. But, we do not.

You want Anet to use resources to give you what you want. All we want is the status-quo.

All it takes for us to get what we want is for Anet to just keep doing what it is doing.

For you to get mounts they need to take resources off One thing to put them On mounts, …and then impose it on a game population that is dead set against mounts.

For this to even be a considered,…you need to provide compelling reasons. And considering that in 2 years , we do not have a plethora of mounts…that kinda tells me that Anet has not seen compelling reasons for providing them.

So provide compelling reasons for mounts.

Fyrebrand.4859:

It’s not just about waypoints, either. MMOs with mounts have gameplay that is designed around them.

• Quests require you to run back and forth across the zone to find mobs or talk to NPCs.
• Getting new skills requires you to ride back to a major city and speak to your class trainer, on a regular basis.
• If you want to get rested XP, you have to log out at an inn. There may not even be one, in the zone you’re questing in.
• You have to keep your “gathering skill” at an appropriate level, so you must repeatedly farm gathering nodes by riding circles around the zone, even if you don’t need these particular materials. And the nodes will disappear as soon as anyone gathers from them, which means even more riding around the map, hoping to find an untapped node.

Mounts seem like a good thing in these types of MMOs, because playing without a mount is unbearable. But GW2 isn’t built on mandatory fetch quests, competing for mobs and gathering nodes, or running back and forth arbitrarily just to waste time. Mounts would not be a good thing, or serve any purpose, in this game.

In fact, unless the mount had a movement speed buff built-in, they would actually be a burden. On foot, we can use skills that grant swiftness, or which shoot our character forward quickly — things which would not be possible while mounted. Being on a mount would actually be slower than running around on foot. Even the people who say they would like mounts for purely cosmetic reasons: I don’t think you would actually use them for travel on a regular basis. They would be like a transformation tonic, that you only use while standing around waiting for an event to start.

Logic?? Reason?? This is the Internet man…. Heresy!!!!!

calyx.9086:

I just wanted to voice my support for mounts.

50,000 gems in the gem store, cosmetic only, cannot use in cities/dungeons/wvw/pvp.

All signets/boons/anything that applies swiftness does not apply to someone who is mounted – so anyone with swiftness will leave those mounted in the dust.

And of course combat dismounts you.

The game is what the game is. After two years we need to accept that it is how it is gonna be, if it were gonna be different, it would have been by now.

I myself wanted subclasses. Not gonna happen. I also wanted weapon skills to be unlocked from weapons so that players can pick and choose what 5 skills they wanted On the 1-5 slot.

Not gonna happen.

I have made my piece with that.

Time for the Mount people to Just accept, No mounts. That’s just what game we are playing. I Just Hope that the pro-mount people can just accept what it is, and find some fun in spite of Not having mounts.

If they are waiting for mounts, as things seem at the moment, they have a LONG wait ahead.

spoj.9672:

Except 4 eles brings a lot of support.

hahahaha .. so true!!!!

JustTrogdor.7892:

The funny thing about these mount threads is that it seems the anti-mount crowd keeps them alive by posting. If these threads were just ignored by those that don’t want mounts they would just fall off the page.

One can say the same thing about the people starting them, if they stopped starting them, there would be no reason to respond at all.

Eigenstate…. Unknown, I am in BOTH Until observed.

I have taken the attitude that they keep me entertained. Sometimes i Like reasing their self-centered egotistical entitled arguments Just to see what “Generation Me” looks Like.

we went from the generation that fought and won WW II to the “generation Me”

I sometimes wondered what would have happened if THAT generation thought like THIS one.

jheryn.8390:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Nerelith.7360:

3. Anet said they can play anyway they want… and they want to play with mounts so if Anet doesn’t give them Mounts… Not sure what happens but it is bad for Anet.

Oh give me a break.

Yes, Anet did say that we could play how we wanted to play; however anyone with any common sense what so ever would realize that there would be limitations to “play as you please.” They should not have to say " you can play as you please so long as it remains within the scope and boundaries of the game as we choose to develop it" in order for people to comprehend.

I think he was being sarcastic Lanfear. His reply to mine made me crack up.

She… I am a she. And yes, it was total, and pure 100 % sarcasm.

Lanfear read the whole post, you skimmed past the part where I said" " With the tools we provide" should go without saying."

See after 1,000,000 iterations of the same non-compelling reasons, i am starting to sway back and forth between two different states.

1. Semi-well reasoned if slightly argumentative but hopefully productive discourse

and

2. Total jocularity and sarcasm.

It is getting hard to take these threads and posts seriously anymore…

round and round she goes when she’ll stop nobody knows.

“Suggestion: Mounts?” presented over and over as if it were a new idea No one has ever considered. And the reasons boil down to " I want to play my charr charging down the street on my chicken mount, with my two hand sword clipping into the poor bird’s ribs because then I feel heroic… and… a lot of other games also have mounts. "

Sorry, I am In My silly phase. Sarcasm, Pure sarcasm.

Beldin.5498:

I wonder sometimes what would happen if we go to other MMO forums and start
each few days a new thread that we want WPs and that they should instead remove
those ugly mounts ..

They would tell us all to " hey, go play Gw2!" kind of the way some say to the mount people " go play WoW!!!"

Me I would never tell anyone go play WoW. Although I Play WoW , and Love mounts there, then again…they don’t have waypoints, and to be honest I hope they never do… I Love My flying carpet on WoW, I love my WP system here.

I can like each for what it offers, and accept that each does Not offer everything I might want, and that that is alright because….

Not every game has to provide me with everything I want. I can be content with what i have.

jheryn.8390:

Ugh. I know that some of you want mounts and that is fine, but I don’t think ANY time is the right time for them.

Personally, I don’t want them. I think our waypoint system is efficient and much better than having mounts whether they be cosmetic or not.

I could be wrong, but I don’t see mounts happening with the waypoint system.

What I don’t understand are things like Leo.2641’s post that Brother Grimm replied to. I’ve never seen any pro-mount people that can actually say where it would be greatly beneficial to the game as a whole. What purpose it can serve that waypoints cannot.

Also, I don’t think many understand the sheer amount of programming mounts would entail. Not just adding them to the game but all new movements and placement of every race, gender and leg/boot armor worn by any character. Mounting, sitting, dismounting, falling off, movement while riding the mount on and on. I can’t fathom why Anet would want to give themselves that kind of headache.

Aren’t you paying attention? Because:

1. it would be cool.
2. they want them.

and Now:

3. Anet said they can play anyway they want… and they want to play with mounts so if Anet doesn’t give them Mounts… Not sure what happens but it is bad for Anet.

Brother Grimm.5176:

Leo.2641:

I WANT mount, I don’t care what you want or need. Anet says “play how you want to play” whenever mount come because they will come and they will CREATE revenue guess what I going to get the mount because that is what I WANT, and if YOU don’t want it then DON’T get it. capiche

Wow….thank you for the very well thought out self-centered, immature and demanding verbal tantrum. It completely slipped all our minds that Anet’s every effort should be to provide what YOU WANT. Please forgive us.

What the poster above you fails to understand is that when Anet said " Play how you want to play" the implication was " with the tools we provide."

That kind of is supposed to go without saying. it’s Not Like i can demand to be given a Blimp that drops Bombs on the enemy forts… just because " hey, they said " Play how you want to play" and I want a Blimp"

Nor can I demand a " Fort Crusher Bomb" that I place at the gates and Just click the fuse, and run then 20 seconds later…everyone in the fort is dead.

Then again.." play How you want to play" means I am not Playing How I want to play if I cannot fly a Blimp to drop fort crusher bombs from them.

I want a personal Blimp!!!!! I want Fort Crusher Bombs!!!! Anet said " Play How you want to play!!!" and this is how I want to play!

Oh yes, and whenever the enemy gets near me… all their weapons turn into balloons and all they can do is point it at me, and let the air out, and all it does is go pphhhrrmmmfhhttttttttttttttttttt.

because…"Anet said " Play How you want to play!" and that is How I want to play!!!"

Unreal. Just….. unreal.

Whether most want mounts, or most want the status quo is ultimately irrelevant.

Those that want it, still have to give compelling arguments for Anet to put limited resources into providing mounts.

1. it would be cool
2. I want them.

That is what we see a lot of. lately someone said.

3. I know I can get a temporary speed boost by either swapping in a weapon that has it, or use a utility, but that is something I rather not do. I rather just have a mount.

None of these arguments are compelling.

Those of us that do not want the mounts, even if we are not the majority, need no other reason than:

" We agree with Anet’s continued decision to not provide mounts."

Even if the number of mount vs non-mount is equal, when one half wants change, and the other wants the status-quo, those that wish change have to come up with compelling arguments.

So far I haven’t seen any.

Leo.2641:

Nerelith.7360:

sorudo.9054:

Nerelith.7360:

sorudo.9054:

so i can buy a dolyak as a mount from the gem store?

The culture of Tyria has evolved beyond the need to make beasts suffer to transport us from place to place.

This is ethical.

To force beasts to suffer to transport us, when other means are readily available is to be cruel and egocentric. This is from a Lore perspective.

From a Non-lore perspective. Just because you want a Dolyak to ride, doesn’t mean that Anet needs to redesign the game to provide one.

Before you can expect them to do so, you need to provide compelling reasons for them to devote the resources, time, and energy to provide it while many others in the community feel those resources could be used better elsewhere.

Neither:

1. It would be cool.

nor

2. I want it.

are compelling.

it gives them a sizable profit, something they are more then eager to put time and resources in.
oh and nether:
i don’t want it
nor:
it is not needed
are reasons not to add them, it is, in fact, needed for a big enough group.

It is wanted Not Needed. And the reasons need to be compelling for ANET, not the players that want them.

The way I know that those reasons are not compelling for Anet is, we have been seeing them on the forums for the past 2 years. We know Anet has read them, and we … 2 years later, neither have mounts, nor heard from Anet that they have decided to provide mounts.

Giving the same reasons over and over, and not getting mounts should tell you Anet remains unconvinced by those reasons, and you need to come up with others, to get the mounts you want.

PS: we do not need those reasons to explain why they should not be added.

The only reason we need is …

“We are content with Anet’s decision to not provide mounts.”

You do not speak for Anet, Anet will say if mount will be implanted in the game or not. An according to your scenario when they do it get implanted, you can go to another that doesn’t have mount. Like I said it goes both way, double standard. From a third person point of you that bakery just lost potential market that wanted that product that why you see some bakery that last a long time due their variety and others for their taste. Guild wars 2 hmm you tell me which one it has the variety or the taste? CASE CLOSED

Anet closes cases Not you. That " bakery" Entenmann’s has been In Operation now for over 100 years.

And they still only provide 3 types of doughnuts.

1. Plain
2. Chocolate covered
3. Cinnamon covered.

oops forgot…

4. Powdered.

They made a calculation and they are still here. They haven’t gone out of business cause some shoppers want more variety.

Anet has similarly made a decision, and continues to make that decision.

Lastly, I do not speak for Anet, and never thought I did, this is a strawman argument. I never said I spoke for Anet, nor pretended to.

Anet speaks for Anet. and since 2 years later, we do not have a plethora of speed boost mounts… Anet has spoken.

PS: Our positions are not equal. You want Anet to use up its resources to provide something they are not providing. I want the status quo.

That means the burden is on you to provide compelling reasons for Anet to provide mounts and

1. I think they are cool
2. I want them.

Are not compelling enough it seems, judging from the lack of mounts In Gw2.

The only reason we need is.

“We are content with Anet’s decision to not provide mounts.”

And lastly…since this game does not, and has not provided mounts in 2 years…. i sincerely doubt that its " When Anet provides…" and more than likely " If…On the remotest of chances that Anet provides….."

If…on the remotest of chances that day ever arrives, I’ll decide then…and only then…. whether gw2 is worth playing. Until then… those that want mounts , have other games they can play that provide mounts.

sorudo.9054:

Nerelith.7360:

sorudo.9054:

so i can buy a dolyak as a mount from the gem store?

The culture of Tyria has evolved beyond the need to make beasts suffer to transport us from place to place.

This is ethical.

To force beasts to suffer to transport us, when other means are readily available is to be cruel and egocentric. This is from a Lore perspective.

From a Non-lore perspective. Just because you want a Dolyak to ride, doesn’t mean that Anet needs to redesign the game to provide one.

Before you can expect them to do so, you need to provide compelling reasons for them to devote the resources, time, and energy to provide it while many others in the community feel those resources could be used better elsewhere.

Neither:

1. It would be cool.

nor

2. I want it.

are compelling.

it gives them a sizable profit, something they are more then eager to put time and resources in.
oh and nether:
i don’t want it
nor:
it is not needed
are reasons not to add them, it is, in fact, needed for a big enough group.

Firstly, It is wanted not needed. And the reasons need to be compelling for ANET, not the players that want them.

Secondly, whether the group that wants mounts is “big enough” is debatable if it were “big enough” Anet would have provided mounts by now, they have been hearing this now for 2 years. It seems they have decided that the group is not “big enough”.

The way I know that those reasons are not compelling for Anet is, or that they feel the group is not “big enough” is, we have been seeing them on the forums for the past 2 years. We know Anet has read them, and we … 2 years later, neither have mounts, nor heard from Anet that they have decided to provide mounts.

Giving the same reasons over and over, and not getting mounts should tell you Anet remains unconvinced by those reasons, and you need to come up with others, to get the mounts you want.

PS: we do not need those reasons to explain why they should not be added.

The only reason we need is …

“We are content with Anet’s decision to not provide mounts.”

sorudo.9054:

so i can buy a dolyak as a mount from the gem store?

The culture of Tyria has evolved beyond the need to make beasts suffer to transport us from place to place.

This is ethical.

To force beasts to suffer to transport us, when other means are readily available is to be cruel and egocentric. This is from a Lore perspective.

From a Non-lore perspective. Just because you want a Dolyak to ride, doesn’t mean that Anet needs to redesign the game to provide one.

Before you can expect them to do so, you need to provide compelling reasons for them to devote the resources, time, and energy to provide it while many others in the community feel those resources could be used better elsewhere.

Neither:

1. It would be cool.

nor

2. I want it.

are compelling.

I go into a bakery. The bakery makes all types of cakes, but only has 3 kinds of doughnuts… Regular, chocolate covered, and Cinnamon. The bakery is called Entenmann’s. I go in talk to the owner. Say " you know, I dislike those three types of doughnuts, maybe you can make creuller’s or maybe cherry filled ?"

The Owner listens politely, and says " I’ll look into it."

For 2 years they don’t add any other type of doughnut. I have been talking to the owner for 2 years. week after week. Anyway, One of the other patrons comes and says to me… " You know… there is another bakery just down the block that has 40 different types of Doughnuts, maybe you should go there?"

You can see where I’m going?

Leo.2641:

Nerelith.7360:

Leo.2641:

Nerelith.7360:

sorudo.9054:

Nerelith.7360:

sorudo.9054:

i wonder, how does a mount, something that can only be used outside combat, isn’t allowed in cities and will be disabled around jumping puzzles, be in any way unbalanced?
do you ppl even know what balance entails or is it just an attempt on an excuse?

it is unbalancing when it comes with any type of speed boost. This is what many want from a mount.

someone said " 50 % to 200 % speed boost" simply because other games have that.

So when speed boost is balanced …. different for different classes. A speed boost mount is unbalancing. The only way I can see it as balanced is, if the Mount occupies a utility slot, and mearly duplicates the speed boost of one of it’s abilities.

Purely cosmetic mounts is not what many pro-mount people want.

As someone once said " I want my mount to DO SOMETHING" Does that sound purely cosmetic to you?

but why does it unbalance anything, all you say is that it gives someone the ability to move faster but if everyone has a mount then it’s still balanced.
i never asked what a mount does, i asked why is a mount unbalanced.
and before you use the utility excuse again, everyone can use the mount without using a utility slot, no one, not even you or i has any advantage above anyone.

In this game, we have temporary speed boost. And the developers decided that some professions have better access to speed Boost that others. They decided that some professions can do faster speed boost, or do it more often.

That is what Gw2 is.

To give everyone a universal non-utility speed boost that is exactly the same for all, and lasts the same time for all, undoes the balancing work the devs have put into each speed boost in each profession.

They also want that if you WANT the speed boost you need to either use a specific offhand weapon…..or…a specific utility. Which obviously means swapping out another weapon or utility that may be better in combat. This is kind of obvious.

If ALL professions Now get a speed boost that lasts equally, and for the same amount of time, without either being tied to their off-hand, or the utility slot, that undoes the work the devs put Into tieing speed boost to either the offhand skill, or the utility skill.

THIS is the Game we are playing as it is envisioned by the developers.

You wish this game to be another game. You don’t wish to play the game that the developers provide. It seems to me that you dislike the game that the developers are providing, but whether you like it or not… this is the game the developers are providing.

If a speed boost mount is a deal breaker for you, all I can suggest is maybe playing another game that has speed boost mounts?

So what you are saving is to remove all player opinion base content? could of sworn this was a community fan base game. or has it turn to a political stance?

Not at all. But you need to accept just because you have an opinion about speed boost mounts and your desires for them, doesn’t mean I don’t get to tell you why I feel that your desires are bad for this game.

I have never said you shouldn’t say " I want speed boost mounts"

My only problem is when players give a multitude of reasons why speed boost mounts are a bad idea and those that want them simply repeat over and over. either

1. I don’t understand.

or

2. I disagree.

especially when they do not engage, they just say " But I want it. and I should have it. Give me reasons why I shouldn’t have it." that they then ignore.

Here is the ONLY reason those that do not want speed boost NEED.

" We are content with the developer’s current and consistent choice to not provide mounts"

I never said speed boost mount. All I want is MOUNT, I don’t care if it had buff or not, a MOUNT, what it is consider a mount not this flying broom crap. I don’t care how much it cost or how it is obtain. And thank you for not saying anything bout player base opinion it only applied when you or whoever feel like using that in an argument which this is a double standard

While you may only want a mount. A cosmetic only mount, this is not a conversation with only you on one side, and others on the other.

This is a discussion forum with others on your side that want speed boost as well.

You cannot expect people to only engage you on " Cosmetic" only when there are 5 or 6 other posters that agree with you, that want more than just cosmetics.

If you want a cosmetics only mount there are mounts On the TP, maybe buy one of those ?

Leo.2641:

Nerelith.7360:

sorudo.9054:

Nerelith.7360:

sorudo.9054:

i wonder, how does a mount, something that can only be used outside combat, isn’t allowed in cities and will be disabled around jumping puzzles, be in any way unbalanced?
do you ppl even know what balance entails or is it just an attempt on an excuse?

it is unbalancing when it comes with any type of speed boost. This is what many want from a mount.

someone said " 50 % to 200 % speed boost" simply because other games have that.

So when speed boost is balanced …. different for different classes. A speed boost mount is unbalancing. The only way I can see it as balanced is, if the Mount occupies a utility slot, and mearly duplicates the speed boost of one of it’s abilities.

Purely cosmetic mounts is not what many pro-mount people want.

As someone once said " I want my mount to DO SOMETHING" Does that sound purely cosmetic to you?

but why does it unbalance anything, all you say is that it gives someone the ability to move faster but if everyone has a mount then it’s still balanced.
i never asked what a mount does, i asked why is a mount unbalanced.
and before you use the utility excuse again, everyone can use the mount without using a utility slot, no one, not even you or i has any advantage above anyone.

In this game, we have temporary speed boost. And the developers decided that some professions have better access to speed Boost that others. They decided that some professions can do faster speed boost, or do it more often.

That is what Gw2 is.

To give everyone a universal non-utility speed boost that is exactly the same for all, and lasts the same time for all, undoes the balancing work the devs have put into each speed boost in each profession.

They also want that if you WANT the speed boost you need to either use a specific offhand weapon…..or…a specific utility. Which obviously means swapping out another weapon or utility that may be better in combat. This is kind of obvious.

If ALL professions Now get a speed boost that lasts equally, and for the same amount of time, without either being tied to their off-hand, or the utility slot, that undoes the work the devs put Into tieing speed boost to either the offhand skill, or the utility skill.

THIS is the Game we are playing as it is envisioned by the developers.

You wish this game to be another game. You don’t wish to play the game that the developers provide. It seems to me that you dislike the game that the developers are providing, but whether you like it or not… this is the game the developers are providing.

If a speed boost mount is a deal breaker for you, all I can suggest is maybe playing another game that has speed boost mounts?

So what you are saving is to remove all player opinion base content? could of sworn this was a community fan base game. or has it turn to a political stance?

Not at all. But you need to accept just because you have an opinion about speed boost mounts and your desires for them, doesn’t mean I don’t get to tell you why I feel that your desires are bad for this game.

I have never said you shouldn’t say " I want speed boost mounts"

My only problem is when players give a multitude of reasons why speed boost mounts are a bad idea and those that want them simply repeat over and over. either

1. I don’t understand.

or

2. I disagree.

especially when they do not engage, they just say " But I want it. and I should have it. Give me reasons why I shouldn’t have it." that they then ignore.

Here is the ONLY reason those that do not want speed boost NEED.

" We are content with the developer’s current and consistent choice to not provide mounts"

sorudo.9054:

Nerelith.7360:

sorudo.9054:

i wonder, how does a mount, something that can only be used outside combat, isn’t allowed in cities and will be disabled around jumping puzzles, be in any way unbalanced?
do you ppl even know what balance entails or is it just an attempt on an excuse?

it is unbalancing when it comes with any type of speed boost. This is what many want from a mount.

someone said " 50 % to 200 % speed boost" simply because other games have that.

So when speed boost is balanced …. different for different classes. A speed boost mount is unbalancing. The only way I can see it as balanced is, if the Mount occupies a utility slot, and mearly duplicates the speed boost of one of it’s abilities.

Purely cosmetic mounts is not what many pro-mount people want.

As someone once said " I want my mount to DO SOMETHING" Does that sound purely cosmetic to you?

but why does it unbalance anything, all you say is that it gives someone the ability to move faster but if everyone has a mount then it’s still balanced.
i never asked what a mount does, i asked why is a mount unbalanced.
and before you use the utility excuse again, everyone can use the mount without using a utility slot, no one, not even you or i has any advantage above anyone.

In this game, we have temporary speed boost. And the developers decided that some professions have better access to speed Boost that others. They decided that some professions can do faster speed boost, or do it more often.

That is what Gw2 is.

To give everyone a universal non-utility speed boost that is exactly the same for all, and lasts the same time for all, undoes the balancing work the devs have put into each speed boost in each profession.

They also want that if you WANT the speed boost you need to either use a specific offhand weapon…..or…a specific utility. Which obviously means swapping out another weapon or utility that may be better in combat. This is kind of obvious.

If ALL professions Now get a speed boost that lasts equally, and for the same amount of time, without either being tied to their off-hand, or the utility slot, that undoes the work the devs put Into tieing speed boost to either the offhand skill, or the utility skill.

THIS is the Game we are playing as it is envisioned by the developers.

You wish this game to be another game. You don’t wish to play the game that the developers provide. It seems to me that you dislike the game that the developers are providing, but whether you like it or not… this is the game the developers are providing.

If a speed boost mount is a deal breaker for you, all I can suggest is maybe playing another game that has speed boost mounts?

Imagine the following. I believe everyone should be able to buy a stealth generator. it will provide anyone that buys it with 6 to 8 seconds of stealth, and have a 25 second cooldown. it will not occupy a utility slot. Anyone that has the cash should be able to buy it and use it.

Now. There are professions that have stealth, there are professions that do not.

Would this stealth generator be balanced? Since everyone can have it? How does this affect professions whose uniqueness derives from being able to stealth? mesmers? Thieves?

Would they say " hey..I don’t care if you take one of My skills that makes me different, for which I have to either equip specific weapons or utility slots, and give it to everyone…after all..now everyone can stealth just as Long as everyone else… it’s Not unbalancing at all."

Good Luck with that.

I believe you don’t Understand the concept of class balance.

PS: It seems to me that many people that want speed boost mounts are not interested in a discussion. Reasons are given for players objections, and they simply repeat over and over either.

1. I don’t understand that reason….

or…

2. That is not true….

then they just repeat how cool it would be. People can repeat and re-explain over and over and over. And these players will just say …

1. I don’t understand that reason….

or…

2. That is not true….

This seems to me to be the forum equivalent of * plugs her ears and says * " la la la la la la la laaaaa I can’t hear youuuuuuu!!!!!"

Brother Grimm.5176:

Nerelith.7360:

Look Up " WTF?? No Trinity?" On youtube. It describes the " Trinity" in Gw2. BY Gw2.

Searched this and only found videos by Woodenpotatoes. Not saying they are bad, but in no way are they valid promises by a GW2 employee. Again, post a link and I’ll buy your basket of “ANET BREAKS WORD!!!!!”, goods….other than that, you are just spreading FUD as a disgruntled player.

My bad, I assumed he was an employee of anet, he spoke with such authority in the video Not " these are my speculations…. " but " This will be in the game, and that will be in bla bla bla" My mistake.

To be honest I am not disgruntled at all. Fact is, I have been playing my engineer again. Someone suggested playing her past level 20…to see what she can do then, before giving up on engineer.

You really should not assume because someone made a mistake that they are " disgruntled employee full of madz.." or whatever.

Sometimes it’s a simple mistake. :-)

maha.7902:

Go take a glass cannon ele to dungeons. DPS gear isn’t a crutch at all, mobs just have to breathe on you and you explode.

He was being facetious, he is saying that if a player is wearing serker’s the rest of the group is his crutch. I disagree.

I cannot yet play in full serker, my dodges suck, and I cannot see the ’ tell-tales" others see. I have been away almost 18 months so..I Hope to improve.

I admire serker wearers, I acknowledge what they do is not easy. While I may wish it to be otherwise, I will not take that from them.

Serker wearers are like Trapeze artists that fly without a net. All I can do is admire, and hope to emulate.

But saying " wearing serker’s is also a crutch." sounds Like sour grapes to me.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Galen Grey.4709:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Being the “last man standing” on your non-DPS spec is nothing to brag about, it means you made a spec to do something other than DPS (i.e. tank, heal, CC, etc.) and FAILED because your party is now dead.

“My healer build was so amazing my entire party wiped” is basically what I see people saying whenenver they say “last man standing”.

we’re talking pugs, some of whom might be new to the game and I wouldnt consider it a failure if it didnt wipe.

what processing logic are you using to translate this “last man standing” to this “My healer build was so amazing my entire party wiped”

last man standing doesnt imply healer and if they’re standing it implies there is no wipe!

1) Not DPS = you were healer or tank or some other similar support role.
2) Last man standing = everyone else is dead.
3) Everyone else is dead = healer/tank/support didn’t do his job properly.

Have to agree here. As much as I don’t Like the " DPS trumps all" nature of the game, this is truth.

Saying " I am not DPS" = " I am either support or control"…" I am usually last man standing " = " I didn’t keep my group alive, as well as I did Not do my utmost to DPS"

This is NOT a reason to brag. This means that you suck at your chosen role. If you are not DPS, then your role is to keep the DPS characters alive. If everyone around you is dead, that means you suck. Now. This is Not meant for the person I am quoting, the reason I am quoting you personally is…I agree with you.

There are dozens of games where Healers are necessary. There are plenty of games where tanks are necessary. This is not one of those games.

We need to accept this, and Play the game for what it is…. or find another. But constantly wanting the game to be drastically altered to be what someone else envisions the game should be, is an exercise in futility.

I think the problem is… some people would Like to be support and control specialists. Not saying they do not wish to do damage, They simply wish to be able to specialize in one of the other two roles of the Anet trinity.

Saying " you can do support, and you can control." doesn’t mean that you can specialize. Some people want to specialize. Now this is Not the game for that…. this is a game for generalists that mostly do damage, and do support or control only sporadically.

Control think EQ Enchanter. Support Think EQ Druid.

None of that is in Gw2. Now asking for it is an exercise in futility. The game is what the game is.

We need to either enjoy it for what it is…. or find something else to play.

sorudo.9054:

i wonder, how does a mount, something that can only be used outside combat, isn’t allowed in cities and will be disabled around jumping puzzles, be in any way unbalanced?
do you ppl even know what balance entails or is it just an attempt on an excuse?

it is unbalancing when it comes with any type of speed boost. This is what many want from a mount.

someone said " 50 % to 200 % speed boost" simply because other games have that.

So when speed boost is balanced …. different for different classes. A speed boost mount is unbalancing. The only way I can see it as balanced is, if the Mount occupies a utility slot, and mearly duplicates the speed boost of one of it’s abilities.

Purely cosmetic mounts is not what many pro-mount people want.

As someone once said " I want my mount to DO SOMETHING" Does that sound purely cosmetic to you?

Serac.5691:

Brother Grimm.5176:

Mini-pets are ALREADY in the game….mounts are not.

So by your logic anything else that isn’t needed shouldn’t be added into game, another anti-mount genius here.

Nerelith.7360:

The following are not compelling:

2. I want them.

Not saying that the majority of the playerbase wants mounts but just in general if the majority of the playerbase wants something, it’s more than a compelling reason you don’t any thing else. Stupid.

ummmm

it’s more than a compelling reason you don’t any thing else. Stupid.

When one insults someone or something someone else says, its sort of shooting yourself in the foot, when your grammar or syntax is non-existent.

jus’ sayin.

Galen Grey.4709:

Nerelith.7360:

Brother Grimm.5176:

Nerelith.7360:

….
No I Just want the trinity Anet promised.

….I don’t recall this “promise”….please provide references.

As mentioned above, EVERY player is the source of Damage, Healing & Support/Control.

The only “enforced meta” is in Dungeon speed runs or Fractals. That is a small segment of the game so either learn to cope with the community “issues” or play another aspect of the game.

Look Up " WTF?? No Trinity?" On youtube. It describes the " Trinity" in Gw2. BY Gw2.

Didnt find it. do you have a link?

Notice the dude says " the supposed removal" 10 seconds In… and then describes the Trinity of the game.

The three legs the Gw2 stool is supposed to have is.. Combat, Support, Damage.

Two legs are kinda short and weak. We all know what happens when you sit On this type of stool.

I did find this though:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Combat

“Guild Wars 2 does not follow the “holy trinity” design found in other MMOs, where professions fall into tank, damage, and healing. Due to a diverse skill system allowing for a multitude of vastly different character builds, every profession in Guild Wars 2 is capable of fitting each of the combat roles (damage, support, control) or are sometimes even the result of a combination of them.

Every profession has the tools to survive on its own."

Exactly my point. We Agree. The Trinity was not removed, it was changed. And it is now set up so each class fits only one predetermined Trinity role… healing Priests, tanking paladins…etc… but all classes can fit any of the trinity roles.

I believe the problem is one where the game hyped up two roles, and yes, watch that video it IS hype. But then … trivialized two of the roles to be " Role-type skills".

Instead of a group needing any of the five in the dungeon to say " Ok, I’ll take the healer spot this time." what they did was gave everyone the skills to heal themselves. Instead of having one say " This run through I’ll do CC ( crowd control)"… they simply gave everyone the tools to CC.

This may be from where a lot of the disappointment for some players stems.

Brother Grimm.5176:

Nerelith.7360:

….
No I Just want the trinity Anet promised.

….I don’t recall this “promise”….please provide references.

As mentioned above, EVERY player is the source of Damage, Healing & Support/Control.

The only “enforced meta” is in Dungeon speed runs or Fractals. That is a small segment of the game so either learn to cope with the community “issues” or play another aspect of the game.

Look Up " WTF?? No Trinity?" On youtube. It describes the " Trinity" in Gw2. BY Gw2.