Guild Wars 2

Nilanil.4721:

I think I’m done arguing the point. I’ve also been too tempted to cross into ad hominem territory. Rather than derail, how about refocusing on the one bit worth some discussion. Do Engi’s need a long range option? My personal feeling is no. However, my engi’s only 32 and my opinion might change as I get more experience.

That’s a fair attempt to salvage this thread.

I think, when it really comes down to it, the Engineer has no long range specific weapons. Granted the Rifled Barrels trait can work us up to a 1200 range on our Rifles and Elixir Guns, but the majority of these skills are close proximity use (Blunderbuss, Overcharged, Jump Shot, Fumigate, Acid Bomb, Super Elixir) and as such emphasize being close to your target despite improved range.

My thoughts here are more towards the removal of everyones favorite elite skill to hate, Mortar, and replace it with a “Sniper Kit”. Let it lock you in place still but give you stealth instead of stability, but have really high damage 1500 range abilities on really long cool downs. Make each skill a target zone of the body that applies a condition based on it’s selected area, like the an Disarming Shot that causes lots of weakness, a Knee Shot that causes immobilize, a Body Shot that causes bleeding and vulnerability, and a Head Shot that has a long warm up time like Kill Shot and does big damage. The fifth skill could be a party support skill that grants might or fury.

Simply put, Engineers have ranged options, but even as the exclusively ranged weapon class it is, it lacks any real stopping power at (or beyond) 900 range.

Conan.8046:

Thanks for validating my statement.

I find it’s better not to argue with people who are fully capable of providing evidence of their incompetence without my assistance.

Funny coming from a person that can’t actually type sentences that make sense half the time.
My incompetence eh? clearly don’t know what that means either seeing your using it wrongly. Thanks for making an idiot of yourself.

I won’t argue with an idiot you like you anymore, you will drag me down to your idiotic level and beat me with experience.

…and now I know why some species eat their young…

Nilanil.4721:

Obscure One.4357:

Thanks for validating my statement.

I find it’s better not to argue with people who are fully capable of providing evidence of their incompetence without my assistance.

Or, to use one of my favorite quotes: “I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed person.”.

Or, “Never argue with an Idiot. They’ll just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

Seriously tempted to just derail this thread with these types of quotes until it gets locked or deleted by a mod.

Clearly there’s nothing of value to be gleaned by the community from this thread, lol.

Conan.8046:

You either need to learn the concept of fantasy, or your ability to assimilate complex concepts is about at sharp as a soggy biscuit.

If there’s a weapon who’s projectiles are magical rainbow unicorns and you’re paying no mind at all to it being called a shortbow or longbow, yet are insistent upon a purely semantic argument about rifles, perhaps you chose the placement of your soap box poorly…Crazy Town is a block over, you’ll know it by the posters of Twilight and the Jonas Brothers, and the blaring sound track to the High School Musical…I’m certain they’ll hear you out.

Where as this forum has people too dumb to understand the meaning of a word. Just because some people don’t know what a rifle is that doesn’t make it right.

However you bring up thakittens fantasy, fair enough lets go there shall we, you assume in a fantasy game if it says armour it refers to protective clothing and not a spade or perhaps in you world you don’t because you haven’t read anything more complex than Hello Kitty.

Thanks for validating my statement.

I find it’s better not to argue with people who are fully capable of providing evidence of their incompetence without my assistance.

Conan.8046:

Obscure One.4357:

seriously…

…glittery bows…

…that shoot magical rainbow unicorns…

…and you start a thread about realism in projectile weapons HERE!?

…I’m facepalming so hard I can reach the part of my brain that forced me to respond to this thread and choke it to death…

You had a facepalm too many because you seriously need to learn to read.

You either need to learn the concept of fantasy, or your ability to assimilate complex concepts is about at sharp as a soggy biscuit.

If there’s a weapon who’s projectiles are magical rainbow unicorns and you’re paying no mind at all to it being called a shortbow or longbow, yet are insistent upon a purely semantic argument about rifles, perhaps you chose the placement of your soap box poorly…Crazy Town is a block over, you’ll know it by the posters of Twilight and the Jonas Brothers, and the blaring sound track to the High School Musical…I’m certain they’ll hear you out.

seriously…

…glittery bows…

…that shoot magical rainbow unicorns…

…and you start a thread about realism in projectile weapons HERE!?

…I’m facepalming so hard I can reach the part of my brain that forced me to respond to this thread and choke it to death…

Forestnator.6298:

These 2 seconds aren’t equal to the 5 sec tool belt skill. Furthermore, these 2 second also do not break stuns.

It appears it no longer breaks stun. When I tested this on patch day it did in fact brake stun, though I just tested it now and it does not.

Looks like I wont be using that option in future builds.

Edit:
Just slid around the YouTubes to make sure I wasn’t horribly mistaken, but it appears I’m not the only one that noted this: http://youtu.be/4re8YqmOhuU?t=2m30s

Terrahero.9358:

Ignore Elixir U and Thumper Turret as Stunbreakers. These abilities are simply not designed to actually facilitate that effect. This has nothing to do with trying to work around their broken mechanics, but simply poor design.

If you happen to be using either of these two abilities, or even both, you will still want to get a viable Stunbreaker.

On the contrary. Elixir U and Rumble are not only good choices for the right build, but also have great synergy in the right build.

Adrenaline Pump + Protection Injection + Elixir U = a net of 16% less direct damage in a Frenzy proc. and the ability to restore 10% of Endurance on tool belt activation in a Haste proc.; tool belt skills you can activate 50% faster thanks to Quickness.

Rumble is a blast finisher attached to two other blast finishers. If used in conjunction with the Elixir U combo field you can stack up Retaliation off a Wall of Reflection proc. or Stealth off of a Smoke Screen proc. Used in a Bomb Kit Rifle Build it becomes even more potent.

Technical comprehension along with practice turns what some see as bad skills into practical combat strategies few have seen often enough to defend against. This is what makes the Engineer a very entertaining class to try to master.

Firstly, Elixir U is a great skill and very worthwhile as a stun break (hint: vigor & protection), the problems folks have with it are “learning to play” issues they’ll eventually outgrow. Elixir U is simply a more advanced skill requiring more advanced knowledge of the class.

Secondly, even in its severely weakened state, Kit Refinement gives you the option to use Tool Kit equipping as a stun break since it procs Super Speed which is in fact a stun breaker. Just one extra option for a stun break even if the traits other benefits are few and far between.

Edit: Note – if you only use one kit, and that kit is Tool Kit, proper play style will render a stun break every 20 second via Kit Refinement.

lunyboy.8672:

TheOneNOnlyGeneralBama.9586:

Lol whats “run” in all instances lately is the lackluster PBR , rocket turret , rocket boots , and i even seen a guy running a random Elix B in his SD build lmao ….seems no one knows how to properly set one up let alone utilize it…such a sad sight to see and quite tiresome.

Not all of us are building for the LOLPWNZDPS!!1!

Some of us are playing for fun, and having some versatility instead of slotting a utility that you basically never use (the rifle turret) we would rather have the knockback, the range, or combat movement, etc.

If you find it tiresome that others don’t play the way you want, then don’t look at their builds.

The point of Static Discharge is to increase DPS. The trait literally only serves the purpose of doing more damage. The metagame isn’t going to change because you have a different playstyle. If you are not using the shortest possible CD’s or the hardest hitting tool belt skills you aren’t built for SD. I don’t presume to know what your playstyle is or is not, but slotting an Elixir and also slotting Static Discharge is just a poor decision (with one exception for the Static Discharge + Acidic Elixirs “boon hater” build 10/0/10/20/30).

Everyone is free to play as they like, but keep in mind “Bad” is a playstyle few respect.

BoyLer.9732:

If you want a good stun breaker related to an elixir than its the elixir guns tool belt skill. with 30% TBRR it has 30 sec cd.
Elixir U is a bad joke. Its TB has some use but else i dont know why they exactly put the stun breaker onto it…..rtaher elxir c…..

Base Reason Why Elixir U is a Stunbreaker:

-Thief: Haste: -50% Endurance Regeneration, +50% activation speed, BREAKS STUN.

-Warrior: Frenzy: +25% incoming damage, +50% activation speed, BREAKS STUN.

-Ranger: Quickening Zephyr: -50% Endurance Regeneration, +50% activation speed, BREAKS STUN.

Kamahl.3621:

Because this is how the guardian and warrior traits behave. Buff one, buff all 3. Or potentially diversify them.

The numerical values, because of signet passives for both Guardians and Warriors, was a +90 advantage over the Engineer, which is a fair balance for a heavy armor class. However the adjustment gives them a +180 passive advantage which is not compensated for within the Engineers class, I.E. no higher damage coefficients, hp gain, or direct toughness to toughness equality. This means they’ve reduced comparative survivability by not differentiating trait bonuses between the medium armor class with no access to signers, and heavy armor classes with signets.

Even if using a 50% scaling the Engineer trait should give a minimum +135 bonus to toughness.

The only other way to balance this would be to select a skill type (Gadgets would be good) and give them all passive abilities to mirror signet passives. This however would require much more development time and effort than changing a single integer in a single line. I would prefer this method as it would better match options given to literally every other class, but that’s a discussion for a different thread.

That’s all not to say I don’t see where you come from as the traits all reflect one another for shields. The problem is that when the Signet got improved, Engineers got nothing to compensate and what was once numerically balanced now isn’t.

Shadowtech.5071:

Obscure One.4357:

Shadowtech.5071:

Can this tread get any bigger just cause A-net replied in it -.-?

Ironic that your condescension makes the thread larger. The interested parties thank you for the thread bump.

it was already bumped when i replied in it so what did it matter?

Your continued support of this thread is appreciated. On behalf of everyone interested in inflating this topic to ensure the devs know it’s important to us, I thank you.

One in particular game element seems to have been skipped over when Signets received their numeric buff effectively doubling their effectiveness a patch or two ago, and that one would be Reinforced Shield. This trait was once scaled directly against the attribute gain granted by the Warrior’s Dolyak Signet in terms of toughness granted at maximum level. However this is no longer the case and renders the option, as good as it may be, improperly balanced within the meta numbers game. As numerical fixes are relatively easy to do for the development team I imagine something could be done about this is the next round of patches. Here’s what it looks like:

Current: +90 toughness while holding a shield…
Adjustment: +180 toughness while holding a shield… OR Grants a bonus to toughness = 2 x (10 + level) while holding a shield…

I genuinely cannot think of a single reason why this shouldn’t be implemented. Anyone out there have any insight or convincing arguments that might enlighten me as to why they should keep Reinforced Shield at +90?

Reacting to a stealth enemy is a “learn to play” issue. I know this from experience as I was once a person who would rage over these perma-stealthing thieves, but now I find stealth to be a nearly balanced gameplay element. The only thing I would do with stealth is remove it’s ability to stack and just make it refresh (like Immobilize), forcing skilled usage of stealth and end talentless spamming for duration.

I actually think that Stealth should be improved for classes other than Thief, since as it stands the thief gains a profession unique ability while stealthed that no other class does. This is the primary reason why when people talk about stealth, they’re actually just talking about how Thieves use stealth and not how a Mesmer or Engineer or any other class uses it.

For just a moment imagine there’s no Thief class, but stealth is still very much a part of the game, and I’m fairly certain in that moment you’ll have no complaints. You really just need to learn to out play Thieves, which has a whole lot to do with CC of the AoE variety, then when they use dagger storm out of frustration/desperation, just block/reflect/dodge until it’s over…unless you play necro in which case you rip stability and fear them…preferably off a cliff for optimal effect.

Long and short of it is stealth is very nearly balanced and it just needs to require skillful play from it’s most notorious users/abusers, the Thief, by no longer stacking in duration. Perhaps providing an extra buff to other professions who become stealthed (Guardians blind with their next attack, Rangers gain Attack of Opportunity for their next attack, and so on) would even out the disparity as well.

Conditions are capped due to technical limitations. Each stack of a condition is independently tracked by the server. Without a cap, the server would bottleneck and result in unplayable lag, server request time-outs (disconnects), and possibly server crashes which can result in data corruption and server roll-backs.

Changing this would be a programming nightmare I wouldn’t wish on those soulless husks over at EA.

Guess it comes down to base mathematics with this. Out of 8 classes only 1 is discouraged from getting a Legendary weapon and buying backpack skins off of the gem store. Of players of that class only a certain percentage play only a single character. Of that group only a certain percentage are gem store shoppers.

Now if the amount of potential development cost to fix the issue is more than the potential income it would generate then the fix to this issue is not likely to see the light of day anytime soon. That’s not to say ANet is a buncha money hungry sellouts, not at all, but rather they want to implement things that the largest portion of the fan base who support this game will get to enjoy. It’s a Catch 22. ANet didn’t put in a way for engineers to customize the look of their weapon substitutes so some people decided against playing it. And since so many people decided against playing it ANet hasn’t got around to changing it since its a minority problem that doesn’t hurt anything but the feelings of a minority of players in the games minority class.

The recent love thrown my favored classes way gives me hope they’ll implement the change, but at almost a year there are still bugs floating around that I know I personally reported back in the BWE’s which should be the #1 priority, and that’s not to mention the dev team’s zealous devotion to spamming us with content via the living story.

I only call it spam cuz it’s unsolicited…it’s like the postman giving you a free subscription to good magazine you never signed up for when all you asked him for was a patch for the holes in your mailbox. Sure thanks for the magazine, it really great, but how’s about them holes?

I’ll just put this here…

Head: Leather
Shoulders: Rubicon
Chest: Falconers
Gloves: Assassin’s Gloves
Legs: Rubicon
Boots: Rubicon

Dyes: Mudmetal, Sand, Antique Gold, Midnight Rust, Orange Shade

Seras.5702:

I always think Frenzy is double damage. Not the first time I’ve written that. I may learn eventually.

Never thought of using U with X. That sounds like something fun to try out.

It’s great fun, and if you don’t mind a bit of guidance on build choice, go for Potent Elixirs and Fast Acting Elixirs. You get U on a 40 second CD and have a longer quickness duration as well as X on an 84 second CD also with a noticeably longer duration (around 4 or 5 seconds). If you don’t want that many points in Alchemy just pick up Fast Acting Elicits for the shorter CD’s and snag Elite Supplies off the inventions line for longer X duration.

I personally run 20 in inventions and 10 in alchemy for this combination as I prefer having the minor trait that recharges my heal skill over a minor trait that converts conditions to boons with a horrible 8% proc rate (wish they’d make it like 25% on a 5 second CD after proc, but that’s talk for a different thread).

Shadowtech.5071:

Can this tread get any bigger just cause A-net replied in it -.-?

Ironic that your condescension makes the thread larger. The interested parties thank you for the thread bump.

There’s an easy way to fix hobo packs by just adding a toggle for it in the inventory beside, below, or above the show backpack checkbox. I can do it for helmet shoulders gloves and backslot, why not that eye sore of a kit sack? That would take little to no time to pull off and most of that time would be just making it UI friendly.

As for kit skinning, that should be easy provided the dev team ever puts any effort into it. Multiple living story events with new weapon skins, and multiple missed opportunities to just toss in one that reskins kits. Fused kits, Jade Kits, or even Halloween or Wintersday kits. Just requires the devs to put in a UI change that equips the chosen kit skin pack that reskins all kits in the inventory where other classes put a second weapon set.

So, ANet, seriously, listen up. Next event all you have to do is make a few more skins: Elixir Gun, Flamethrower, and Wrench. Grenades and Bombs are simple backslot reskins, and if I could make a suggestion, I’d go with belts and bandoleers, we all already have cool backpacks…as you should already know since you still have the receipt.

Seras.5702:

@Obscure: That made me laugh. You’re right though. Elixir U is an offensive weapon. People see “stun break” and think defensively, but it can be used offensively.

The problem though, is that after you stun break and start rocking out some damage, you’re either out of endurance (no biggie if you’re unleashing the pain) or taking double damage (kind of a big deal). I don’t want to break a thief’s initial stun, unleash my combo, only to take double his post-opener damage. RNG is killer in this case.

I’m just going to point out that Frenzy causes one to take 25% more damage, and the Protection boon reduces incoming direct damage by 33%. Protection Injection thus goes with Elixir U like pizza goes with beer. I personally prefer using Lyssa runes so when I activate Elixir U I also activate another extremely underrated skill by my fellow Engineers, Elixir X. Tornado and Brute (once you get used to how each of them are effective) are both gross with Quickness up, and every boon (including Protection and Vigor) for the duration of Frenzy or Haste off of the Lyssa runes helps reduce the negative effects of U (notably also Lyssa runes are a condition clear).

At any rate when I pop Elixir U I’m focused on spending those few seconds hitting back as hard and fast as I can regardless of Haste or Frenzy. The buff lasts a very short time, and I dare say to short to care which one you got. Use boons to dull down the negative effects of Elixir U passively, so you can focus on being aggressive.

The only thing I’m not sure about is if it ends up being 25% more of 33% less damage or 33% less of 25% more damage…

Edit: @ Aberrant

- Nothing on there about X -

(X)enomorphic: [zen-uh-mawr-fik] (adj.)

1. noting or pertaining to a mineral grain that does not have its characteristic crystalline form but has a form impressed on it by surrounding grains; anhedral 2. in an unusual form; having a strange form

Uses for Elixir U:
-Rapid Fire Tool Belt Skills + Static Discharge whilst unloading on the target with Tool Kit Attacks. In full zerker gear I’ve pulled off 6.1k on Thwak and 6.4 with Crowbar, add that to Surprise Shot, Throw Wrench, and Rocket Kick, and that Frenzy everyone says is a waste of time just destroyed someone who thought he had the jump on you.

- Breaking an enemy CC opener (like Basalisk Venom) and taking the offensive. Want to survive the spike? Stop running and @!#$%ing hit ‘em! That enemy HP bar isn’t going to drain itself! If they’re hitting hard chances are they can’t take much in return, and Elixir U gives you that opportunity to show them what’s up.

In short if you just want to run away and hide when the other kid pushes you off the swing, then sure Elixir S is a better slot choice. But if you want to get up and immediately punch that kid in the teeth then, my friend, Elixir U is for U.

I too experience this bug from time to time and it actually taught me an interesting combo on accident. I was notably rooted when the Rocket Boots animation ended whilst chasing down a GS Sword/Warhorn Warrior (used to be impossible for me pre-patch), but my Rifle Jump Shot had just come off of CD so I used it to amazing effect by breaking the animation lock, hitting the Warrior for 3.4k and downing him, and realizing that the Rifle Jump Shot had become smooth as silk allowing me to rapidly toss Elixir U on my warrior prey and stomp him without resistance in a smooth transition.

So for now my temp fix is to use Jump Shot to clear the animation locking (pretty sure that the E Gun acid leap would also do it, though I haven’t tested it) when it occurs on occasion. An actual permanent fix should go into this problem even if I can chain it with Jump Shot for an awesomesauce gap closer, the bug can get you stuck in a nasty situation should the AoE’s start raining in and you can’t break the movement animation lock.

Self-Regulating Defenses is a rare gem among traits and when used properly in a build can get you out of trouble rapidly. Notably you should only run it if you also have 15 or more points in Inventions for the Heal skill automatic recharge which will trigger at the same time as your Self-Regulating Defenses. Granted this does nothing for the conditions from which you are suffering when you go into Elixir S, but it gives you back your heal as you come out.

Presently the best combo is when you go into Elixir S just start spamming the Healing Turret so as soon as you come out of the form you can get the Heal, area heal, then F1 blast finish in it, and repeat the blast finish by using the new and improved Rocket Boots that will also create some breathing room. If this doesn’t save you, the fight wasn’t winnable for you to begin with and you should learn not to bite off more than you can chew rather than be angry at a trait that worked as intended. “But he was heartseeker spamming! I can beat that!” You say? Trait Protective Shield and watch the idiot wear out his #2 key whilst you negate 33% of his no talent having spam damage (rune of the Forge are excellent thief repellant as well, and can even trait Protection Injection for when they use Basilisk venom. That 3 seconds of protection when crit, 5 seconds when disabled, and 10 seconds at 50% health, all of which will be at least 30% longer.) This combination extends the usefulness of Elixir S tremendously to have protection as you come out of invulnerability.

That being said Elixir S could stand to be improved if it just removed bleeding and burning when activated, or even could be traited to do so (much as I do already with Lyssa runes on Elixir X). Ever since utilities became disabled in this form, the survivability of the option has notably declined, but with a clever player who keeps an eye out for that 25% trigger, it can win fights you otherwise should have lost.

Lodius.5392:

I say don’t…. especially if it is:

A) Cross console … I don’t want to play with a group of people playing on their iphones or something. It will greatly ruin the game
B) Independent Game – NO NO NO, this would cause our PC player base to diminish and a few players go to that console type.

“cross console” concepts aren’t really what I’m getting at here, I’m discussing a GW2 application for mobile platforms. I’m interested in seeing mini pets, turned into a CCG format for a mobile platform mini game that integrates with players both inside the game and out. I would agree entirely that playing the actual game via mobile device would be a negative experience, but that notion is also a concept I’m not getting at here. Furthermore I too do not want anything that would be fully independent since (as fun as Rytlocks Rampage was) it doesn’t draw players into one fan-base but rather segregates them and tends to alienate one or the other. But again that too is also not a concept that I’m getting at here.

The concept is:
- Mini Game both mobile and pc users can play together.
- Rewards using existing systems such as rare crafting materials, minipets, titles, and a daily/monthly achievement tracks.
- Expanding the Guild Wars IP to the mobile gaming market so that it could still be enjoyed by exclusively mobile users in a stand-alone minipet mini game.

Ideally you’d be able to chat, use the trading post, and even access crafting with the current aspirations of the presently indefinitely delayed Extended Experience, and what I’d like to see in addition to it is mini game interactivity to bridge the PC to mobile OS platform.

Downed State equality has been a problem since launch. The simple fact is toe for toe if you fight someone on equal footing, and you both get downed simultaneously, who will win. Engineer will always lose…always. Now, even in teamwork environments, allies have to play beat the stomp with a rez since the Engi felt the overwhelming masochistic urge to distribute a gap closer to his aggressor.

…meanwhile your Elementalist team mate who went down right next to you mist forms into the safety of the keep leaving you out in enemy fire like you’re going to magically quit being flammable…

Elentalist gets invulnerability, Mesmer gets teleport and stealth, Necro gets fear, Rangers get a stun AND a heal, Thieves get stealth AND teleport, Warriors get a knockdown and they can get back up (and can stay up with a kill 100% if traited), and Guardians get an AoE knockback that casts INSTANTLY and they get a symbol that heals (something that can be highly traited for btw).

Engineer gets a pull to politely provide a gap closer to enemies that may not have brought one, and a AoE knockback that is ready to activate right about the same time you get that revive at waypoint pop-up.

Its no secret mobile gaming development sector is becoming a bigger and bigger player in the gaming industry as a whole. With projections expecting the industry to clear the $12,000,000,000 mark ( source) its rapidly becoming apparent larger studios can benefit from expanding their IP into the mobile market to snag a piece of that twelve billion dollar pie.

How does this apply to the Guild Wars IP? Simple, resume development on an existing project, the “Extended Experience” ( source Massively.com) with an added mini game to bridge the gap between the PC and mobile users. Notably when the E.E. for GW2 was announced they mentioned a very interesting advancement in the technology of their server architecture: the ability to push data from inside the game to outside of the game in real time. This may not seem like a huge deal to some, but if you think about the plethora of options that this creates for a developer the possibilities are limitless. Hence my suggestion for a mini game for GW2 designed for use on a mobile platform: Mini Mobile.

In both GW1 and GW2 there are little cosmetic items called minipets that basically don’t do much but follow your character around and look interesting. Mini Mobile would allow for these little previously exclusively cosmetic items to be used in a mobile game made in the likeness of a collectible card game (CCG). In this CCG players could use any of their unlocked mini pets to build a deck of 10, and battle other players or AI enemies for rewards. Rewards that would be beneficial to both the mobile game and the actual game, such as crafting materials, more minipets, laurel daily rewards, and so on.

Now why a CCG you ask? Production cost, pure and simple. Arena Net has a huge amount of extremely high quality concept art done by some of the most talented artists in the industry such as Daniel Dociu and Kekai Kotaki. This library of art is what we call a sunk cost; you already spent the money for it and its already paid for itself, so future usage is essentially free. With this aspect out of the way, a potential developer would need to figure out how to create a fun, balanced, and rewarding game experience that appeals to not only its existing fan base, but also to a target audience that may have never even heard of Guild Wars, or MMOs at all for that matter.

Expanding the IP in this manner into the mobile industry means more money for NCSoft and greater justification for a larger development budget for Arena Net, which translates to a richer game. Happy parent company + happy development company = better product, and better products make happy consumers. I like being happy, and I happen to be a consumer, so it seems like a great idea to me.

With this in mind, what kinda mobile gaming options do you crazy kids out there in the webernet think would be a good fit for expanding the GW2 IP into the mobile frontier?

4/10

Berzerker’s Might is done, Leg Specialist is moot, and my backup GS build which went through a nerf already with Frenzy is now even worse thanks to moving Berzerker’s Strength to Grandmaster. I’ve got no ideas on new builds yet, and I’m genuinely discouraged in even bothering with all the much needed buffs going into other classes I play. I’ve got two other 80’s and a couple 30-somethings so I’ll just let my Warrior gather dust while I play with something else.

Winning this big is boring…

ColinJohanson.2394:

We’ll have a blog post going out before the release that walks you through every detail of how it works with examples. The goal is to get you more variety in match ups, while avoiding match ups against worlds way outside of your current tier so it’s not too crazy.

Either you guys missed the “goal” or you have a very unorthodox definition of the word “crazy”…I’m not sure it means what you think it means…

Complex formulas are not required to produce varied match-up systems. Is there a complex formula to determine who my favorite football team plays next? Do the Mets roll the dice after every series before they find out who they play next?

Of course not, because that would be exactly what this new WvW system is, F***ING STUPID.

Simplify the system and toss out your garbage formula that is clearly a heartless algorithm that is either a self-aware entity intent on the destruction of the world (vWorld), or is so poorly designed without thought to the existing game meta that it borders on incompetence.

Matchmaking systems haven’t been this arbitrary or unnecessarily complicated in the history of game design. There are 24 servers, 24! That’s 8 groups of 3, and basically 4 clusters of somewhat relative skill levels: Tier 1-2, Tier 3-4, Tier 5-6, Tier 7-8. Wanna provide variety? Keep to those clusters. Any match up that includes a server from a different cluster will be a bad match-up…period. You put a Tier 3-4 into a Tier 1-2 match up, and the result is no fun for anyone. A Tier 2 barely has what it takes to compete with a Tier 1, toss in a Tier 3 or 4 into the mix and it’s basically a Tier 1 vs a Tier 2 with an innocent bystander getting torn apart in the cross fire.

Here’s a really really really really really really simple matchmaking system:

1st Place: 5 points
2nd Place: 3 points
3rd Place: 1 point

Servers with the highest point totals fight each other. No delta, no RNG bulls***, no ridiculously imbalanced match-ups. “But then there’s no variety!” Yeah, your absolutely right! If you don’t have the ability to win matches within your server tier you have absolutely no business in a higher tier, and if you win matches in your own server you have no business in a lower tier.

“Improving” server match-ups by putting tier 1, 2, and 4 into the same match up and calling it good is basically flipping the whole WvW community a big fat “f*** you, have a nice day!”

Hadan.2841:

@ rawr, BT smashed every single guild in this tier and if anyone tries to say otherwise is a fool. They would 1v3 different guild grpkittenting them from all sides at the same time. They did run different tags because ppl did avoid them, zergs that rolled 20+ more than BT ran from them because they knew the dmg they left. Ppl will be bitter towards them for whatever reasons but facts are still facts, they smashed everyone in this tier.

Pound for pound, player for player [Agg] presents more of a threat than [BT], especially in open field ZvZ. That’s not to say [BT] can’t be dangerous, but if I’m nestled among equal numbers of my own Guildies, I’d expect a win against them more often than against [Agg]. Perhaps against less organized zergs of randoms they’re potentially a steamroller, but that can be said for any organized guild group against any rabble of talented amateurs they encounter. Smart zergs are vastly stronger than dumb ones three times their size.

I genuinely don’t care to whom belongs the kitten I’m jamming my boot up, so long as it’s entertaining for me to do so. If my server steam rolls the lesser servers they won’t even bother showing up while we tick every borderland and battleground tower and keep with an off chance to flip a camp some try-hard PUG decided to take. Low tier servers, from what I can tell from forum posts, barely grasp the meta of the game mode which has more to do with sheer numbers and coverage than literally anything else…except maybe these OP arrow carts, I swear it feels like I’m cheating sometimes…

I distinctly recall BWE’S where my server owned literally everything and as such it was literally no fun at all. I think ANet has no idea the vast difference in how the game is played on the different tiers, and this may make some matchups so painfully one sided it’ll turn newcomers off to the game mode, and bore the veterans into playing a different game.

It’d be so much better if it were treated like, you know, a sport. Where every team has to play each other and eventually there’s a play off to determine the finalists, and a championship game between the best ones…oh if only there was some kind of “observer mode” that allowed one to watch recorded matchups and a streaming live event for the championship chalk full of ads from sponsors…but I think that kind of technology and concept is clearly to difficult for any development team to achieve…

…oh wait what?
…seriously?
…ANet did something similar to that in GW1?

…why do I even bother…

When it comes down to it the best skill to use for an Engineer on downed is #4. You’re not likely to interrupt the stomp so do your best to get back up. Having run engineer for quite some time, I know the best way to get the stomp on them is to wait until you get pulled to them, pop your stability on the rare chance they get the detonate off. The only time I ever use the pull is if they are already performing a stomp, and only after I’ve thrown enough junk to clear an aegis or blind, even then the casting time tends to be about 1/4 second too late in the event I’m clearing aegis and blind for the interrupt. Even still if they have stability there’s literally no point in pressing anything other than #4.

That being said, downed states are heavily imbalanced across the board with elementalists at the top and engineers at the bottom. Giving one class the ability to instantly become invulnerable and move away in a downed state yet give another a long casting time just to pull the enemy in close bares not even a remote semblance of balance. The elementalist just needs to go down near enough to a friendly keep/tower entrance to be immune to stomps entirely. Meanwhile the engineer is a guaranteed stomp.

Wanna fix it? #2 skill becomes the current #3 detonate, and the #3 skill becomes “Elixir D” which randomly produces either Mist Form, or Vengeance.

Firstly I’d like so say there should be changes to the Power Wrench kit to make it more viable as a melee set. Such as a faster activation time to the #1 skill chain, a daze added to the effect of crowbar with a stun effect if hitting from the side or behind, and a shortened if not removed activation time on Box of Nails.

That being out of the way, Power Gloves sounds like a great kit and it should replace the current “Mine” utility which has been notoriously underwhelming since launch. The tool belt skill of mine kit could be reskinned for a Power Gloves kit, and be an array of floating electrical orbs that look like smaller versions of the air elemental skin, and have the exact same functional mechanic as the current mine tool belt skill.

In short, a great concept I would love to see in the game.

Leo G.4501:

Daecollo.9578:

Warriors need a lot of help removing conditions. As well as healing.

Warriors are not special. Elementalist needs healing and help removing conditions. So they pick a trait that does it, they use a utility that removes them and pick gear that helps them heal.

Just because you don’t have your ‘remove a condition every 10 seconds’ doesn’t mean you don’t have good condition removal…nor does that mean it’s the only worthwhile method of dealing with conditions!

This is as self-evident as it is irrelevant to furthering the dialog in improving Healing Signet. Whereas removing conditions from your Warrior is clearly a Learn to Play issue, Healing Signet is really lackluster standing between Healing Surge and Mending, no matter how skilled one becomes in its use.

The passive effect needs to be improved, but my thoughts are towards making it more viable among builds focused on healing power, just as Mending is a clear choice for my builds high volume of condition mitigation, and Healing Surge is optimal for my adrenaline building weapon swapper. Ideally a boost to healing power, making it more responsive to healing power, reducing the cooldown and activation times would give it more of an impact.

Daecollo.9578:

Obscure One.4357:

@ Daecollo

Signet of Stamina: condition clear
Mending: two condition removal
Restorative Strength: Immobilize, chill, cripple, and weaken removal
Shake It Off: one condition removal

Gear Options
Runes of Lyssa: elite skill condition clear
Soldier Runes: all shouts remove a condition

Warriors aren’t great in tPvP for VASTLY different reasons…

One of the biggest ones is they cannot stay in the fight, they don’t have good condition removal. That is BURST condition removal. It helps for running away. Not staying and fighting.

I find no need to argue, your doing a find job of disproving your credibility without my assistance.

This however has absolutely nothing to do with the viability or lack thereof of Healing Signet, as if condition management is an issue, Mending provides that incredibly well especially when Restorative Strength is traited.

@ Daecollo

Signet of Stamina: condition clear
Mending: two condition removal
Restorative Strength: Immobilize, chill, cripple, and weaken removal
Shake It Off: one condition removal

Gear Options
Runes of Lyssa: elite skill condition clear
Soldier Runes: all shouts remove a condition

Warriors aren’t great in tPvP for VASTLY different reasons…

Daecollo.9578:

Obscure One.4357:

Daecollo.9578:

Obscure One.4357:

Healing Signet update concept:
-Cooldown reduced from 20 seconds to 15 seconds.
-Activation time reduced from 1 1/4 seconds to 1/2 second.
-Passive healing now scales at .05 and also increases healing power by 180.

Dip dat Signet in yo Signets!

So basicly it goes from 200 to 209. That will really improve Warriors in SPVP!

How about we improve the passive to 400-450 and make it scale 0.1 with HP (like Signet of Malice), then make Activation time reduced from 1 1/4 seconds to 1/2 second. No active change.

We need good healing and condition (conversion or removal, I prefer conversion.)

Edit: 0.5 not .05, math typos.

Brings the passive heal up to the “meh” range. With banner build perma-regen it’d be to much to pile it up to .1 on a heavy armor class. But a shorter cool down, shorter activation time, and a boost to healing power and it becomes viable.

…for both condition management and healing just run Restorative Strength and Mending…

That would make it -a little to good- for HP builds, and meh and for Sentinels/Soldiers/Berserkers/Knights/Carrions/Rabid builds.

I edited my edit for editing it incorrectly. The initial coefficient of 0.05 is what I meant. I.E. the scaling from healing power will change the passive value the 250 range (not 209 as Daecollo is stating). When it comes down to other builds, the skill isn’t a viable choice for glass cannons over bigger heals from surge or condition management off of Mending.

Not every skill should be viable on every build, but every build should be viable within the scope of skill options.

Daecollo.9578:

Obscure One.4357:

Healing Signet update concept:
-Cooldown reduced from 20 seconds to 15 seconds.
-Activation time reduced from 1 1/4 seconds to 1/2 second.
-Passive healing now scales at .05 and also increases healing power by 180.

Dip dat Signet in yo Signets!

So basicly it goes from 200 to 209. That will really improve Warriors in SPVP!

How about we improve the passive to 400-450 and make it scale 0.1 with HP (like Signet of Malice), then make Activation time reduced from 1 1/4 seconds to 1/2 second. No active change.

We need good healing and condition (conversion or removal, I prefer conversion.)

0.05 Brings the passive heal up to the “meh” range. With banner build perma-regen it’d be to much to pile it up to .1 on a heavy armor class. But a shorter cool down, shorter activation time, and a boost to healing power and it becomes viable.

…for both condition management and healing just run Restorative Strength and Mending…

Healing Signet update concept:
-Cooldown reduced from 20 seconds to 15 seconds.
-Activation time reduced from 1 1/4 seconds to 1/2 second.
-Passive healing now scales at .05 and also increases healing power by 180.

Dip dat Signet in yo Signets!

Phineas I feel as though you may have misunderstood my assessment. The FT is a very solid build choice, and putting up to 20 points in that Explosives trait line is plenty worth it (my FT build is 20/30/0/10/10) to boost it’s effectiveness from Incendiary. My point was if I’m trying to squeeze out damage my thoughts are why am I not just hucking grenades on a zerk build? Spam tastic mind numbing DPS that it may be, there’s no more damaging option for the class. With a FT I’m better off ignoring boosting DPS for survivability options granted by the toughness or inventions trait lines with a spare 10 points, as even with the compounding impact of gaining 100 power and burning which gives my FT 10% more damage on Flame Jet, it doesn’t hit anywhere near the damage numbers of my grenades. It’s mostly out of a sense of personal choice in seeing mid range damage and sort of letting it be mid range while I focus on just staying alive long enough for the condition damage to take it’s toll. That being said I did my due diligence in making the FT a hard hitter with my FT build and with as much might I could pump into it with Enhance Performance and Juggernaut (which takes a fair amount of practice to master the rotation), it was bested by just swallowing my pride, putting those last 10 points in Explosives instead of Alchemy (30/30/0/0/10) and spamming grenades.

I fully enjoy my FT, but from where I stand, specing it for more damage is < Grenades in the current state of the game, hence my comments.

Phineas Poe.3018:

Jay.4837:

Incendiary Powder is really not necessary at all. Flame Jet burns once at the end of the cycle. If you follow flame jet with Air Blast, you’ll burn for another 3 seconds. I see too few engineers using Napalm, which is really your burn bread and butter, and even with mobile mobs will probably proc more burns than IP will.

The problem is that targets move.

If you’re dealing with bosses, Napalm and Air Blast is not enough. Try sustain burning on that guy in Arah exp without Incendiary Powder and see what happens.

Hence the heavy synergy with Rifle. High volumes of Immobilize from a net turret and Rifle will help keep things still while you hit them with flame jet. Though I must say that sort of build style makes the voice in my head scream “just Roll 30/30/0/0/10, put on your zerker set, and spam grenades!”. Honestly I can’t really say the FT is much use outside of might stacking off Enhance Performance (or H.G.H.) and Juggernaut and using it to tank damage lika bauwse.

Here are my thoughts on updates for the Engineer Tool Kit to improve it’s usability beyond the main attraction to the kit, Gear Shield, as well as my thoughts on improving turret viability, particularly in WvW.

Tool Kit:
*increased attack speed of Smack & Whack by 15%.
*Thwack now causes 2 stacks of Confusion (2 seconds).
*Box of Nails is now instant when activated with no animation and indicates the affected area with an AoE ring.
*Pry Bar cool down increased from 15 seconds to 20 seconds and now causes 1 second of daze, or 1 second of stun if you hit the target from the side or from behind.
*Gear Shield block duration decreased from 3 seconds to 2 seconds and has a new activated skill “Fling Gears” which is a whirl finisher spinning attack (2 seconds) that blocks projectiles, hits enemy targets (0.59 damage coefficient) in 600 range with projectiles, and repairs friendly turrets in range.
*Magnet now removes a boon from the target every second while in range when activated until the skills pull effect occurs.

Turrets:
All offensive turrets will now attack a called target if it is within range. BUG FIX/PATCH players can now call target when not in a party
*Deployable Turrets trait functionally changed to not only allow ground targeting but also Rifle, Flame, and Thumper turrets can now be picked up by allies as environmental weapons which are considered “bundles”. A picked up turret cannot be replanted. While wielded turrets can still be detonated as normal, returning the wielder to their normal weapon set.
-Rifle turret can be picked up by allies granting them Warrior rifle (aquatic Warrior harpoon gun) skills for 120 seconds. The Automatic Fire skill cooldown is increased from 30 seconds to 40 seconds and grants a turret wielder quickness and haste for 5 seconds.
-Thumper turret can be picked up by allies granting them Warrior hammer (aquatic Warrior spear) skills for 120 seconds. The Thump skill causes the same effect, though triggers instantly centered on the wielder.
-Flame turret can be picked up by allies granting them Flamethrower skills for 120 seconds. The Smoke Screen skill causes the same effect, though triggers instantly centered on the wielder.
*Net turret range increased from 600 to 900.
*Rocket turret rockets are now projectiles that track to the target and are considered an explosion in respect to traits that effect explosions.
*Healing turret also repairs turrets within its range.

And there you have it. More viability with Tool Kit, more utility with turrets. Though the update for Deployable Turrets would require some pretty major work to implement, and the added skill to Gear Shield would require slightly less, the rest are minor and mostly numerical changes that would be more reasonable candidates for implementation.

Edit:
Forgot to mention Power Wrench and Power Shoes traits should swap trait lines to better fit build specs.

The whole not knowing what to expect is as much of an advantage as it is a hindrance. Enemy players don’t anticipate the Engineer turning into a tornado, or a brute and steam rolling over them in that first few “pulled a rabbit out of a hat” moments. Though for the rest of a sPvP match, that trick is not going to fool them anymore. For WvW however it remains a useful method to cut through a door smacking zerg, but once your safely inside and it comes off CD it’s pretty much time to change it to literally anything else that can strike from the walls. In PvE your better off with the supply crate to be perfectly honest, predictability of Elixir X or not, it’s better for the party.

To be frank I don’t feel it’d make a difference to my use of the skill if it were random or a see-saw between the two as the O kitten uggesting.

Jon doubled the effectiveness of signets so now it’s like I run signets dipped in signets! But they missed healing signet!? Come on Jon, your slacking bro, dip my signet in more signet and plate that signet with signet homie! Then make that Yak signet bling bling me outta stun cuz I don’t like stances or shouting, they cramp my blingy signet style.

…painterly…stylized…aesthetic…

Mongo.2490:

Well, this topic got away from me. My gripe is the concept of a ranger doesn’t have to be pet-centric.. but it’s ANet’s call how they implement it and they’re not gonna change that. So.. whatever.

Simply because an argument is stubbornly resisted doesn’t make it any less valid. That being said the developers have committed themselves to the pet mechanic and if they are to succeed in its application there are obvious elements that must be addressed, elements you yourself are speaking of. It is therefore more constructive dialog to remedy the class woes within the parameters of a pet mechanic than it is to suggest doing away with it. My thoughts on the matter lean in a direction of establishing pets as integral to the play style and not an ignorable liability. A Mesmer cannot ignore its clones any more than an elementalist can neglect its attunements, yet a Ranger is uniquely forced to decide between augmenting itself or augmenting its pet when there should never be such a division. This division is at the heart of the argument, and it’s akin to a scenario in which the Warrior burst skill is, hypothetically, only good if the Warrior built for it and your suggestion to fix it is to remove it and buff the classes other skills to compensate. Insert Ranger and pets to the above statement and its an identical argument skirting the actual problem; the effectiveness of a core mechanic. In the current state of the game, Warrior burst skills are solid, and if built for they are amazing, but for Rangers pets, most are barely viable without being built for, yet when they are built for holy $%&# are they insanely powerful (cats can be straight gross). There’s little room for a middle ground in the meta so a Ranger is forced into one or the other when it only ever should be both at the same time.

Essentially what Virtues are to a Guardian, what Lifeforce is it a Necromancer, what a Toolbelt is to an Engineer so too should a Pet be to a Ranger…and it is the fact that it is not that inspires these threads from a place of logical deduction in an attempt to fix a foolish design choice.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

1: Stand on Wall
2: Throw grenades at Zerg
3: ???
4: Profit.

Bring your friends.

The unfortunate truth…

…one skill to rule them all is the result of a sad and pathetic class implementation….great concept, great design, epic failure on the delivery.

@OP: I’m not against petless options, but these suggestions are major reworks of the class that invalidate months of player practice in mastering a very difficult to master class. The trick to developing or redeveloping a class is subtlety not complexity.

Concerning the points you raise on pets they are in fact spot on accurate. Though the fixes should be directly aimed at the root cause, and not the symptoms. The root cause of the problem isn’t that the pet is invasive to the class design, but that it isn’t invasive enough. It’s far to external to the ranger and not integral to player control, hence why we can see the logic in a petless option. A mechanic that could do something as out of the ordinary as allowing you to swap AI control from pet to ranger would be an example of how heavily invasive the pet needs to be to the class in order for it to be as integral as say Mesmer clones or a Necros minions. They should represent varied tiers of pet control, where the Mesmer clone is the lowest, the necro minion is in the middle, and the Ranger pet is fully controlled. This is however not the case, and pet skills need superior AI to support that. Better yet, remove the pet controlled skills, make them all player controlled and turn that F2 skill into an “attunement”/“kit” style skill that equips modified versions of them that trigger both ranger and pet to perform them.

Basically what I’m getting at is a purely petless ranger will never happen as the developers have stood stubbornly in opposition to the concept, yet also neglect to improve the existing synergy failings of the class. Thus the only feasible solution is MORE integration of the currently “just happens be there” mechanics. Every Ranger skill should have a pet kicker attached to it, and control of that pets behavior should be a seamless aspect of the class.

It’s tough to run an Engi with all the nerfs being tossed our way, with no buffs in sight. I’ve resigned myself to a P/S, Gear Shield build and focused on conditions to stay relevant on the battlefield. The incredibly unfortunate part of it all is if you want to be effective in WvW you either use grenades (which I don’t like to use myself) or you simply bunker up. Turrets are too weak to be effective, elixir builds took a nerf with Elixir S, the Elixir gun doesn’t provide enough of anything to make a difference in zerg combat, mines have almost always been a bad skill choice, and bomb builds can’t defend from the top of a tower/keep/castle wall. Hence, Rifled Barrels, Piercing Bullets, and spam 1-3 to get loot bags. Use the Gear Shield magnet to pull a target into your zerg, and the AoE cripple to slow it’s retreat. Use the shield skills to interrupt and mitigate incoming damage and the Gear Shield block in combination to stay vertical long enough to escape ambushes. Despite the nerf to Elixir S it’s still effective to break stuns and with the trait that automatically casts it, you can be very unkillable for a short time if you chain the gear shield Block and elixir S in with the automatic elixir S proc.

Unfortunately this play style is complex, doesn’t always work out, and really doesn’t measure up against just dumping points in power and precision, going full zerk gear, and spamming nades… Eventually I see such heavy nerfs put into Engineer it will become the Paragon class of GW2…