Guild Wars 2

Just use Antitoxin Spray.

You’re welcome.

Sylentir.8913:

Obsidian.1328:

^

Well “or” doesn’t just mean a link to an alternative, it also means “introducing a synonym or explanation of a preceding word or phrase.” Which is how you used it there.

No, I used it as “this or that”. Which is a link to an alternative.

Regardless, I think you’re now clear on what I meant, and we can stop arguing semantics.

But you didn’t.

It was about how everyone seems to have an idea about how GW2 is so awful, and could be better by making it like GW1 or WoW or another popular game.

The way you worded it with “or another popular game” implies that gw1 and wow share a common characteristic, namely being popular. You used them both as synonymous for popular games, not alternatives between each other.

Just sayin…

I read in some forum once that men and women in a pre-modern setting exert their power in different ways. Men display raw strength and might, women display their power through physical desire and beauty.

I have no idea if this is true, but it seems a common theme in these games. :/

Bloodstealer.5978:

…we all want the achievements done so blaming one side of the game is just lame.. have you got yours yet?

This is where you’re wrong. Most W3’ers don’t care for the achievements at all.

I actually go out of my way to not do them.

I just want a pet that gives AoE stabo.

Even if it’s like a 60 sec CD.

Ricky

I never said T1 servers are the best pvper’s, my stance was simply that lower tier servers aren’t better simply because they have a lower population…which is something you seemed to imply. :/ I have no idea who is better, that’s something only a GvG style match can decide.

But really, as soon as everyone realized coverage was the single largest factor in determining PPT, and therefore the #1 spot, the migration to the top tier servers was a foregone conclusion. I would have been ecstatic to remain a mid-tier server(in terms of population) if it meant we could still vie for the #1 spot, but we can’t. No one can. The inertia of ANet’s scoring system made this lopsidedness an inevitability.

Meh, I never said our way is the best, only that yours isn’t either necessarily. It’s not T1 server’s fault that guilds migrated towards us, it’s ANet’s fault for setting up the rules in such a way where coverage becomes the #1 determinant factor of PPT. That’s a no-brainer.

Oh and simply following the dorito around only wins you fights when you have a clear advantage in numbers. I’ve seen plenty of 20-man zergs beat 20-30, or even 50, -man zergs due to superior tactics. It’s actually quite normal. It’s a common misconception zergs just Forrest Gump their way around the map.

Ricky.4706:

yes, exactly another reason I don’t find t1 fun….It’s a game. our server is way more fun and still have their hardcore qualities – we promote thinkers.

You just confirmed the claim I made about t1 being mindless. – Do as you are told or you will be screamed at .

In our server – try it ..let’s see if it works … and if it does….it becomes part of a new strategy. You are free to be yourself and play as you want on lower tier servers so there is more teamwork with people who learned by getting facerolled lol – but didn’t quit.

Lol, nice try, but you’re putting words in my mouth. I said they they act when they need to. Everyone gets a chance to prove themselves. That being said, there are certain ways to go about it.

For one thing, zerging simply requires a high degree of teamwork. Running around doing your own thing in a zerg = lose. Everyone knows that. The fact that you don’t have enough people to field large zergs isn’t evidence of courage, it’s just evidence of demographics.

For another, playing for points requires you to maintain a certain PPT on your off hours and on hours in order to win. If people don’t work together as a team to accomplish this they lose. You act like following a commander’s orders makes you a sheep or something. There are good and bad commanders on any server. You suck it up to follow a bad one because you care about your server and you can’t afford chaos in the ranks. You follow the good ones out of pure respect. Sorry to say this to you, but you’re dead wrong if you think everyone in T1 can just act independently of one another and still win. /rollseyes

Now if you’re talking about straight-up brawls where no one cares about PPT, that’s an entirely different ballgame. I actually prefer that over this PPT crap because coverage wouldn’t be an issue. But it’s not like that, is it.

It’s nice you have more intimate fights on your tier. I envy you I really do. But don’t badmouth another server just because you think the way you play is superior to everyone else’s.

zwierz.9012:

Krytan’s didn’t even know they are slaves. It’s at best arguable if slavery with a master that wants NOTHING from you, and takes care of you is better than freedom where your life expectancy is similar to mayflies. Just saying.

The mayfly life would still be better.

Ricky.4706:

our new players learn quick or quit – so it’s pretty clean cut down here. You either have the courage to face the odds or you leave. so once again…..no.

So do ours. If new players refuse to act when they need to, they either leave on their own, or they get yelled at lol. Odds are odds.

zwierz.9012:

Come to think of it, Kryta without the Mantle and Mursaat was (and IS now since they’re gone) a boiling cauldron of war, banditry and so on. Hundreds, or even thousands die on daily basis while Jenna and royalty feast and spend giant sums of gold on festivals and idle gestures of power (Queens Festival, anyone? Royalty and “heroes” fighting made up enemies while soldiers and common folks die out there to their real foes)…

On the other hand, theocratic Kryta under the Mantle was a peaceful, orderly land where people were generally safe, only a handful (7 a month ((or even a year)), in the WHOLE kingdom of Kryta, if I remember right, but double check me, writing this without checking sources) died as a price.

Seems like a fair deal to me, from the perspective of the average citicen of Kryta.

PLUS the Mursaat, still being alive, could be a powerful force against Abaddon’s plans, they might not be our allies, but they are certainly Abaddon’s enemies.

And in fact, the whole Factions/NIghtfall stories might go really different, or not happen at all if the door of Komalie was still closed, we can’t know that.

But no! kitten EVIL Mursaat, sacrificing the few, so that many (including themselves) may live, and otherwise letting things unfold without imposing their rule on the populace. Those kittenS, right?

Problem is you’re saying life is more important than liberty…

Slavery, even if it saves lives, is unacceptable.

Ricky.4706:

unfortunately, 95.353200% of statistics are made up on the spot. you could actually be great pvp’rs – but it’s been a while since you went head to head with hard core players – less the fluff. my condolences to your bragging rights.

Unfortunately, 95.353200% of statistics are made up on the spot. You could actually be great pvp’rs – but it’s been a while since you went head to head with hard core players – less the fluff. My condolences to your bragging rights.

I don’t brag. But more importantly, your statement can be used universally. Everyone has fluff.

I can’t speak for other servers, but the bandwagoners do not make up most of our population. They are there, of course, but not in the majority.

Squeesidhe.4761:

But then that raise the question of why there are so many people loitering around on the forums of a game they dislike.

Think of it like the Classic Coke fiasco of the 80’s…a bunch of diehard pop jockeys yelling at passersby. Most people just felt sorry for them. :P

Ricky.4706:

It’s very discouraging to get overwhelmed to a point that you can’t raise up the numbers to fight back….it takes courage to fight back anyway ….and even win sometimes.

We deal with that on a daily basis too. You’re talking about simple ratios, with that in mind 10v20 is the same as 50v100. The gameplay is different, but the guts to persevere is the same.

Ricky.4706:

the difference is the lower tiers don’t have enough to do both offense and defense when they are attacking your keep and both your towers. Much more decision making and compromising. a group of 40 can defend a keep vs a 100 man zerg- but when your map has a population of 50 …..and they have to constantly travel back and forth to empty borders – it changes the strategy. There is a difference …a big one. Lower tier servers have to hit harder, move faster and make more compromises because we don’t have enough people to watch our backs. this is also with a pug style population too – so it’s not like we have 50 man guilds working tightly in unison – so on that aspect alone – we have more of a rule of thumb approach as a server

True, it makes you different…not necessarily better.

I can do that too: T1 servers have to work harder and are more courageous because of the sheer number of players we have to deal with. We don’t have the luxury of an empty BL to run through without worry of being steamrolled out of nowhere.

Ricky.4706:

if you haven’t played for a while on lower tier servers, there is no possible way you can understand the difference. I’ve played on higher tier servers, I saw the difference clearly – and it’s simply a different style of play. You need more strategy in lower tier servers to compensate for the lack of manpower. You need more courage and character to be outmanned and still claim all your stuff back – and even though we are facing balanced fights ….we are constantly getting 2v1’d in our own leagues. why ? because when they don’t , we take their stuff. And I’m not even being specific about my server – when a 3rd server is losing because they haven’t enough players, they fight for 2nd leaving 1st and 3rd attacking the server in the middle. The first server is trying to keep 2nd place server from grabbing first, the 3rd server is working with first server to avoid getting smashed by 1 and 2 , and the 2nd server is fighting everyone trying to get points to take 1st.

Actually, the 2v1 thing is standard practice in T1 right now. And it switches partners every time you get up to grab another beer. Before this Achievement fiasco we were outmanned on a daily basis at certain times. Small-man guilds like mine had to sometimes manage an entire BL on their own, we’re no stranger to strategy. As for your courage comment…that might be the most asinine and insulting comment I’ve heard in awhile on here.

GS traited gets you an 1100 leap every 9.5 seconds…that’s pretty darn good. Add the Sword’s turnaround leap thingy(6.5 sec CD with same trait) and warhorns speed on weapon swap and it’s very hard to match if you’re good at the 180 flip.

Ricky.4706:

Aurust.8961:

You have no clue what ur talking about….

actually, it is you that has no idea what I’m talking about – being from an all warrior blob server

in smaller fights you actually have to think. you guys would be so wrecked vs the smaller thinking servers that replace blobs with strategy if we got your numbers. We don’t just say duh and hit empty doors like the t1’rs with skill lag do. Your skill lag wouldn’t even let you do such things. the lower tier servers had to actually learn how to fight to stand a chance of even playing wvw with the outnumbered buff. Something t1’s have zero experience in.

blob players need not respond -the hand-

It’s easy to label a T1 server a total blobfest I guess. You’re wrong about it of course, but something tells me there’s no convincing you of that. There’s a good amount of small-man groups actually.

For myself, out of my 3k+ hours played, 90% of that is in W3, and 95% of that is small-man. I hate blobs…but they are necessary in T1. You shouldn’t assume T1 are a bunch of mindless robots. :/

Like GW1.

^

Well “or” doesn’t just mean a link to an alternative, it also means “introducing a synonym or explanation of a preceding word or phrase.” Which is how you used it there.

Sylentir.8913:

It was about how everyone seems to have an idea about how GW2 is so awful, and could be better by making it like GW1 or WoW or another popular game

This line really grabbed my attention. I find it very humorous you associate GW1 and WoW together. GW2 is, relatively speaking, a lot more like WoW than GW1 that you’d have to be blind not to see that.

I have no idea how you came to that conclusion.

Verdelet Arconia.6987:

Some of the WVW Elitist that are posting in this thread have to realize that just because they are not capable of clearing the achievements efficiently in less than 3 days does not mean that others cannot do it.

sigh…

Ya still don’t get it.

The regular W3’ers aren’t doing the achievements. We don’t care about them.

doomfodder.2906:

For the most part (except jp & MAYBE defense), ALL contributions of the season 1 acheivement points have SOME positive impact on the servers matchup performance.

Yeah they have some positive impact, but those little positives don’t make up for the glaring negatives they cause. Most W3 strategies are coordinated down to the minute or second. For instance, killing a sentry when not wanted can mean the difference between taking their keep or losing your own. Or taking supply from a camp we are trying to upgrade so an incoming zerg can’t use it means they don’t have to spend time finding it somewhere else and can attack now instead of later. Or putting 1 single siege engine in the wrong spot can mean your tower is flipped.

Your theory that all the random things you do make up for the little losses is wrong, it just doesn’t work that way. Every single little thing matters, they all have a domino effect that usually magnifies towards the end. That’s what most don’t realize.

Chris.3290:

For sale, for a short-time only in the BLTC gem store: The Season 1 “I WvW all the time, so I’m entitled” booster.
This one day booster will cut your queue times by up to 33%. Only 1200 gems!

What’s really sad is I know some players who would buy that.

gimmethegepgun.1284:

Cactus.2710:

Check out the advance information from the ESO devs … they see what’s going on here and are clearly targeting GW2’s inability to properly handle mass battles.

Unfortunately they failed to learn from everyone else’s mistakes and have already killed their own game by making it P2P.

Every pay model has their pro’s and con’s, whether that be P2P, B2P, or F2P. The Guild Wars franchise in unique in the Buy to Play model. It’s not easy to implement with modern games that are only getting pricier to make. Subs and Cash-shop models have their own problems as well.

There point is, there is no “best pay model” out there, it’s all in how you implement it.

note: I know zilch about ESO

Kincaidia.3192:

Then let’s do the opposite – log in, clog the heck out of the servers, and tick off the PvE’ers who are AP hunting :P Valid form of protest?

Better yet, lets all send 5 man parties to camp every champ location on Tyria.

For a week.

Krakah.3582:

Especially when you consider half of most large project budgets for these games are for marketing.

I know right! I mean, remember how epic this trailer was? I still don’t know what the heck is going on, but it rocks right!?

…

Laurelinde.4395:

Obsidian.1328:

Laurelinde.4395:

If you want to control all the variables and units in a game, then you’re going to have to play a single-player game. In an MMO you are always going to be at the mercy of other people and there will inevitably be some that you don’t like/aren’t good/clash with your ideas.

Anyone who paid for the game and is not actively griefing (and no, being clueless or disorganised or not speaking your language is not griefing) has as much a right to be there as anyone else, like it or lump it.

You’re talking about PvE. In which case I would totally agree with you.

PvP is a different ballgame. Those that want to try to win should be there, and Team synergy and cooperation are arguably the most important factors in a match. Why bother with having PvP at all if you can’t coordinate anything? It doesn’t make any sense to say you can’t form teams in a competitive environment…

I’m talking about WvW. You are free to try to form teams but ultimately it’s not a team, it’s a world (server.) There’s no signups, there’s no tryouts, you get who you get. My overall point stands: we do not control the parameters of GW2 or WvW no matter how invested we are (or aren’t) in it. PUGs are a fact of life. The only way around it is to leave the open MMO environment and move into something where players can set more of the parameters.

Eh…it’s not really an open environment though. I’d agree it was ANet’s intention with W3 to be a casual PvP game-mode, but that’s not how it turned out. The reality is that W3 is primarily controlled by the various guilds that have put the time and effort into creating a competitive server. Most, including my own server, welcome new players who are interested in large-scale PvP. But we do so with the agreement that cooperation and planning supercede individual interests in the Borderlands. It’s not because we want to control you, it’s because that’s how you win: teamwork. Any team-based professional athlete would agree to that.

Our “team” as you put, isn’t just everyone on the server, but rather those on the server that actively participate and cooperate in W3 together. Why would someone who’s never set foot in W3 before this week expect to have the same rights and respect as someone who’s been doing it over a year?

When I first set foot in W3 I was a nobody. I didn’t expect to just walk in and be on par with all the other Rallians. It took me months to earn the trust of everyone else in there. That’s how team-based PvP works. And quite frankly, that’s how it should be. Otherwise, your server, or team, would never succeed.

^

Which is why they need a new map or two in tandem with reducing map cap.

Last night in EB we killed this solo ranger in front of Bravost. I thought it was odd we didn’t see his pet anywhere.

So we go to flip Umber camp, which took like 10 minutes because of the lag(5 players vs all npc’s lol), and as soon as we flip the camp guess what we saw?

That ranger we killed 10 minutes ago, his pet bird was bobbing up and down on the road, frantically trying to catch up to his dead(and probably WP’d) master.

That…is some crazy lag.

There are really just 2 issues here: lag and achievements. The lag may never go away, which is incredibly unfortunate, but the achievements can simply be removed. Anyone who wants to PvP can stay, and the farmers can go back to PvE. Easy.

As far as the high tier queues go, they were bearable before this week. Reset night sucks, but it always does and we’re used to it. We don’t mind having queues, it’s an acceptable inconvenience for getting coverage. It’s the incredible length of the queues now that irk us. Some are nearly 5 times as long…we need to sleep sometime.

The Ascalonian ghosts were meant to symbolize the GW1 playerbase and gameplay. It’s ANet’s way of “putting them out to pasture.”

styx.7294:

Obsidian.1328:

Laurelinde.4395:

If you want to control all the variables and units in a game, then you’re going to have to play a single-player game. In an MMO you are always going to be at the mercy of other people and there will inevitably be some that you don’t like/aren’t good/clash with your ideas.

Anyone who paid for the game and is not actively griefing (and no, being clueless or disorganised or not speaking your language is not griefing) has as much a right to be there as anyone else, like it or lump it.

You’re talking about PvE. In which case I would totally agree with you.

PvP is a different ballgame. Team synergy and cooperation are arguably the most important factors in a match. Why bother with having PvP at all if you can’t coordinate anything? It doesn’t make any sense to say you can’t form teams in a competitive environment…

sPvP is a ballgame. WvW is a pub brawl.

Not really. Granted the zergfests can boil down to 1spamming, but that’s because of lag which is a separate issue. GW2 professions and skills exist in such a way that cross-class interaction is the most effective means of beating your opponent. While sPvP is more individual or very small-man oriented, W3 is simply large scale PvP. It’s only a brawl if you let it be(current stunwar meta notwithstanding!)…which, by the way, is what introducing PvE into the mix does. It dilutes the gameplay to random and meaningless fights with no purpose.

Laurelinde.4395:

If you want to control all the variables and units in a game, then you’re going to have to play a single-player game. In an MMO you are always going to be at the mercy of other people and there will inevitably be some that you don’t like/aren’t good/clash with your ideas.

Anyone who paid for the game and is not actively griefing (and no, being clueless or disorganised or not speaking your language is not griefing) has as much a right to be there as anyone else, like it or lump it.

You’re talking about PvE. In which case I would totally agree with you.

PvP is a different ballgame. Those that want to try to win should be there, and Team synergy and cooperation are arguably the most important factors in a match. Why bother with having PvP at all if you can’t coordinate anything? It doesn’t make any sense to say you can’t form teams in a competitive environment…

A better solution is twofold:

1: reduce map population capacity

2: create 1-2 new maps

Trying to force transfers to other servers because of long queue times is a backhanded way of handling the issue.

Ahlen.7591:

Khallis.5708:

my biggest problem with WvW is there is little to no strategy its whoever brings the biggest Zerg wins there is no way for a smaller group to outplay a larger group.

AND the only viable strat in WvW is Stacking and moving together as a giant clusterf*** of crap through a fight. in every other MMORPG that offers massive WvW type fights, a group doing that would get cursed at and told “stop being noob zerglings and spread out!”

but in GW2 is perfectly viable and infact the dominant tactic.

This is really mostly due to downstate.

Downstate means that blobbing/zerging is the most effective, because either you rally from all the crazyness, or your zerg resses you afterward.

If they removed downstate it would be less swingy, and the greater skilled group could actually beat the outnumbering group.

+1

ozmaniandevil.6805:

If the achievements don’t matter to all you WvW MEGA PLAYERS then why discuss them? Just go about your business and ignore it all together.

Do NOT assume players are PvE whiners because they don’t agree with how aNet sets up this garbage. I already mentioned that I don’t care if I get the meta. I’m going to play WvW because I enjoy it. I am a casual player. aNet craps on casual players. I’m used to it.

WvW “leets” apparently also need to crap on casual players even when they want to WvW. Much appreciated, and the reason why so many probably stay out of WvW.

The achievements have forced us to deal with players who don’t care for actually PvPing, that’s why we care.

ANet craps on casual players? Since when?

Also, “casual” and “W3” don’t really go together. You don’t see people playing cards out in the middle of a baseball game. Hey I love playing cards with my buds on a Saturday night, but I don’t pretend that we are in an intense competition. W3 is just that.

styx.7294:

Obsidian.1328:

styx.7294:

Obsidian.1328:

styx.7294:

Obsidian.1328:

Verdelet Arconia.6987:

Crystal desert is mainly a PVE server. Attached is the score taken a few minutes prior this post. Achievement hunters seem to be helping alot with the score.

Once the achievement hunting has tone down after a few weeks since most would have cleared it by then,we’ll take a look at the score for CD again, if its significantly poorer than this than we can safely say its not the achievement hunters fault that the server is losing.

All that means is your server has a lot larger PvE population than the other two servers. Numbers and coverage is a very large factor in W3. 50 players randomly attacking anything on the map actually wins out against 20 players using sound strategy. It’s just the way it is.

These new achievements may help out PvE servers win a match, but they have the opposite effect on higher tier servers. Now the obvious question is: why should ANet cater to higher tier servers at all? Well, possibly because they have a lot more invested into it. By the same token, it would be wrong for W3ers to try and tell the PvE crowd how to best run fractals or dungeons.

We understand ANet is trying to get more players involved in W3, but adding achievements as an enticement is the wrong way to do it.

Higher tier servers don’t have more invested in WvW. All servers are equal and bandwagoners shouldn’t at all be favoured.

Well that was rude. :/

I have been on SoR since beta, so I don’t know how that applies.

In terms of only raw numbers, higher tier servers actually do have more invested in W3. That’s not a pro or con against server populations, that’s just a fact. I’m sure there are plenty or lower tier servers that kick kitten on the field, but that’s not the issue here. The issue is the PvE meta is eclipsing W3 gameplay, which is a problem. Especially since this league just started…frankly it blows my mind that they would do both at the same time.

I think the issue that affects WvW health is that people keep transferrin up tiers and fixin queues and skill lag on overpopulated servers is not only gonna waste resources because people will keep filling it up but also exasperate the issue because you’re not fixin the transfer problem.

Bottom servers need to get their PvE players involved to build up population and incentives for those players to stay in those tiers to help build up organization. Tier 1 servers sayin “we’re what’s important” is the bandwagon attitude that is part the problem.

Lots of rude people on the forums, due to population differences, most of them are in the higher tiers.

1. Skill lag is a game engine problem, not a W3 problem. The same thing happens at huge world events like Teq.

2. “We’re what’s important” is not what we’re really saying. We’re saying “the PvP spirit is what’s important.” Introducing achievements into W3 attracts exactly the wrong kind of players to it. W3 needs players who value real competition and teamwork, not titles and cosmetics. I’m not saying anyone is wrong for wanting the latter, just that it’s not what W3 is about.

3. Since the PvE crowd is larger, by your logic there are more rude people there. :/

1. In 14 months of playtime (90% WvW), I’ve had skill lag maybe 3 times, each time in Stonemist. The only comment I can make on it is somehow it’s only a problem I hear about from people in top tier. Even on a queued map we don’t have guilds big enough to pull everyone together in one giant zerg (bronze league might have a handful of guilds that field 20-30).

2. Lots of people and guilds have the “PvP spirit” here. What gets in our way is paid transfers to tier 1 and the game incentives that move people to higher tiers.

It does sound dreamy that the higher tiers are where people go to be super serious but from the quality of people I see transfer, it’s the quitters, the people who burn out, the ones who want to do somethin easy somewhere where they don’t have to try very hard, the ones who think a change of scenery will help their under performing guild, the ones who wanna win. And after a year of that, it is eventually the ones who just want more people around.

3. Possibly!

1. You’re very, very lucky. And I envy you. But SoR is my home and I won’t leave her, no matter how many bandwagoners come and go.

2. I agree transfers exacerbate the problems, but achievements aren’t the solution. No matter how many people they bring in.

RedStar.4218:

Obsidian.1328:

pulls hair out

We
don’t
want
to
do
them
.

At the risk of making you bald, why do you even care about the JP ? You don’t need to do them to get your key (if you care about that).
And don’t even say “PvErs are taking all the spots to do them !!” because it’s been 4 days. All those PvErs would have to be pretty terrible to not have completed those JP yet.

Like it has already been mentioned, capping 50 ruins is a more annoying problem.

/shrug

Every spot counts, even 1.

Verdelet Arconia.6987:

Why stop at just taking JP away from wvw. Might as well take away all gathering nodes so that no one can waste time gathering 20 items, more time can be focused on wvw instead of gathering.Take away all the wildlife too so that daily variety is also out. Since the argument is that potential achievement points is the cause of deviating the players from actual wvw. Remove all wvw achievements would be the best way including Map completion. There you go,perfect map for wvw elites. Enjoy your new map and permanent Outnumberred buff. Good luck maintaining a healthy player pool.

Actually, those are all good ideas.

Seriously.

styx.7294:

Obsidian.1328:

styx.7294:

Obsidian.1328:

Verdelet Arconia.6987:

Crystal desert is mainly a PVE server. Attached is the score taken a few minutes prior this post. Achievement hunters seem to be helping alot with the score.

Once the achievement hunting has tone down after a few weeks since most would have cleared it by then,we’ll take a look at the score for CD again, if its significantly poorer than this than we can safely say its not the achievement hunters fault that the server is losing.

All that means is your server has a lot larger PvE population than the other two servers. Numbers and coverage is a very large factor in W3. 50 players randomly attacking anything on the map actually wins out against 20 players using sound strategy. It’s just the way it is.

These new achievements may help out PvE servers win a match, but they have the opposite effect on higher tier servers. Now the obvious question is: why should ANet cater to higher tier servers at all? Well, possibly because they have a lot more invested into it. By the same token, it would be wrong for W3ers to try and tell the PvE crowd how to best run fractals or dungeons.

We understand ANet is trying to get more players involved in W3, but adding achievements as an enticement is the wrong way to do it.

Higher tier servers don’t have more invested in WvW. All servers are equal and bandwagoners shouldn’t at all be favoured.

Well that was rude. :/

I have been on SoR since beta, so I don’t know how that applies.

In terms of only raw numbers, higher tier servers actually do have more invested in W3. That’s not a pro or con against server populations, that’s just a fact. I’m sure there are plenty or lower tier servers that kick kitten on the field, but that’s not the issue here. The issue is the PvE meta is eclipsing W3 gameplay, which is a problem. Especially since this league just started…frankly it blows my mind that they would do both at the same time.

I think the issue that affects WvW health is that people keep transferrin up tiers and fixin queues and skill lag on overpopulated servers is not only gonna waste resources because people will keep filling it up but also exasperate the issue because you’re not fixin the transfer problem.

Bottom servers need to get their PvE players involved to build up population and incentives for those players to stay in those tiers to help build up organization. Tier 1 servers sayin “we’re what’s important” is the bandwagon attitude that is part the problem.

Lots of rude people on the forums, due to population differences, most of them are in the higher tiers.

1. Skill lag is a game engine problem, not a W3 problem. The same thing happens at huge world events like Teq.

2. “We’re what’s important” is not what we’re really saying. We’re saying “the PvP spirit is what’s important.” Introducing achievements into W3 attracts exactly the wrong kind of players to it. W3 needs players who value real competition and teamwork, not titles and cosmetics. I’m not saying anyone is wrong for wanting the latter, just that it’s not what W3 is about.

3. Since the PvE crowd is larger, by your logic there are more rude people there. :/

Gibson.4036:

Hule.8794:

Even if you are on server with queues from day 1, that dont approve you to blame Anet for queues. Blame players not Anet.

There’s blame to go around.

If my hometown decides to prioritize planting pretty flowers by the streets to make them beautiful over installing traffic signals, and obnoxious drivers blow through intersections without looking, causing accidents, who deserves blame?

It’s a lot more possible for the people in charge to implement things to curb the stupidity and selfishness of people, than to expect that people en masse will start acting intelligently, nobly, and with the long-term consequences of their actions in mind.

Good god man, if this was twitter I’d already be following you.

Bottles of PvE tears have you guys filled in the last year due to farming nerfs?

styx.7294:

Obsidian.1328:

styx.7294:

Obsidian.1328:

styx.7294:

Take the hour it takes to do the jump puzzles. Call it a guild event. Try something new.

Or have an Eternal Battleground night. We try to do that at least once a week just to shake things up (I’m not much on Eternal Battleground myself, only have 4 Stonemist caps since launch).

I can’t believe that for 49 days straight you guys refuse to deviate from your daily routine.

It’s not that we refuse to deviate, it’s that sometimes we can’t afford too. Right now, the competition on our match-up is so intense that even a small group shirking their duties for the night has a substantive negative impact. Last week we had it easier, and could afford to take some time off. But right now, at the start of this league, almost every second counts. It’s crazy, but we love it.

Well, don’t need the achievements right away, still nearly 7 weeks to go =)

I don’t think you get it. Even if we weren’t busy, most of us wouldn’t be doing the JP’s for the achievement points. Most simply don’t care about them. If we were to do the JP’s it would be for a relaxing break from the routine, not to check off a box.

So it during your relaxing break.

I mean, my guild would never relax in a jump puzzle or PvE. That’s why I had to fight them to get through the jump puzzle but we got a mesmer that could do it and it was easy and quick and not even close to the biggest problem WvW has.

pulls hair out

We
don’t
want
to
do
them
.

Verdelet Arconia.6987:

Obsidian.1328:

Verdelet Arconia.6987:

Crystal desert is mainly a PVE server. Attached is the score taken a few minutes prior this post. Achievement hunters seem to be helping alot with the score.

Once the achievement hunting has tone down after a few weeks since most would have cleared it by then,we’ll take a look at the score for CD again, if its significantly poorer than this than we can safely say its not the achievement hunters fault that the server is losing.

All that means is your server has a lot larger PvE population than the other two servers. Numbers and coverage is a very large factor in W3. 50 players randomly attacking anything on the map actually wins out against 20 players using sound strategy. It’s just the way it is.

These new achievements may help out PvE servers win a match, but they have the opposite effect on higher tier servers. Now the obvious question is: why should ANet cater to higher tier servers at all? Well, possibly because they have a lot more invested into it. By the same token, it would be wrong for W3ers to try and tell the PvE crowd how to best run fractals or dungeons.

We understand ANet is trying to get more players involved in W3, but adding achievements as an enticement is the wrong way to do it.

Understand your concerns,however no one solution can truly make everyone happy.
And i don’t think Anet can or should implement different mechanics to different tiers, thus a one size fits all solution should cater to the majority. They have the data to work with.Better to have crowded maps than empty ghost towns i guess.

They are catering to the PvE majority though, and not the W3 majority. It’s a very important difference.

styx.7294:

Obsidian.1328:

Verdelet Arconia.6987:

Crystal desert is mainly a PVE server. Attached is the score taken a few minutes prior this post. Achievement hunters seem to be helping alot with the score.

Once the achievement hunting has tone down after a few weeks since most would have cleared it by then,we’ll take a look at the score for CD again, if its significantly poorer than this than we can safely say its not the achievement hunters fault that the server is losing.

All that means is your server has a lot larger PvE population than the other two servers. Numbers and coverage is a very large factor in W3. 50 players randomly attacking anything on the map actually wins out against 20 players using sound strategy. It’s just the way it is.

These new achievements may help out PvE servers win a match, but they have the opposite effect on higher tier servers. Now the obvious question is: why should ANet cater to higher tier servers at all? Well, possibly because they have a lot more invested into it. By the same token, it would be wrong for W3ers to try and tell the PvE crowd how to best run fractals or dungeons.

We understand ANet is trying to get more players involved in W3, but adding achievements as an enticement is the wrong way to do it.

Higher tier servers don’t have more invested in WvW. All servers are equal and bandwagoners shouldn’t at all be favoured.

Well that was rude. :/

I have been on SoR since beta, so I don’t know how that applies.

In terms of only raw numbers, higher tier servers actually do have more invested in W3. That’s not a pro or con against server populations, that’s just a fact. I’m sure there are plenty or lower tier servers that kick kitten on the field, but that’s not the issue here. The issue is the PvE meta is eclipsing W3 gameplay, which is a problem. Especially since this league just started…frankly it blows my mind that they would do both at the same time.

styx.7294:

Obsidian.1328:

styx.7294:

Take the hour it takes to do the jump puzzles. Call it a guild event. Try something new.

Or have an Eternal Battleground night. We try to do that at least once a week just to shake things up (I’m not much on Eternal Battleground myself, only have 4 Stonemist caps since launch).

I can’t believe that for 49 days straight you guys refuse to deviate from your daily routine.

It’s not that we refuse to deviate, it’s that sometimes we can’t afford too. Right now, the competition on our match-up is so intense that even a small group shirking their duties for the night has a substantive negative impact. Last week we had it easier, and could afford to take some time off. But right now, at the start of this league, almost every second counts. It’s crazy, but we love it.

Well, don’t need the achievements right away, still nearly 7 weeks to go =)

I don’t think you get it. Even if we weren’t busy, most of us wouldn’t be doing the JP’s for the achievement points. Most simply don’t care about them. If we were to do the JP’s it would be for a relaxing break from the routine, not to check off a box.

Verdelet Arconia.6987:

Crystal desert is mainly a PVE server. Attached is the score taken a few minutes prior this post. Achievement hunters seem to be helping alot with the score.

Once the achievement hunting has tone down after a few weeks since most would have cleared it by then,we’ll take a look at the score for CD again, if its significantly poorer than this than we can safely say its not the achievement hunters fault that the server is losing.

All that means is your server has a lot larger PvE population than the other two servers. Numbers and coverage is a very large factor in W3. 50 players randomly attacking anything on the map actually wins out against 20 players using sound strategy. It’s just the way it is.

These new achievements may help out PvE servers win a match, but they have the opposite effect on higher tier servers. Now the obvious question is: why should ANet cater to higher tier servers at all? Well, possibly because they have a lot more invested into it. By the same token, it would be wrong for W3ers to try and tell the PvE crowd how to best run fractals or dungeons.

We understand ANet is trying to get more players involved in W3, but adding achievements as an enticement is the wrong way to do it.

styx.7294:

Take the hour it takes to do the jump puzzles. Call it a guild event. Try something new.

Or have an Eternal Battleground night. We try to do that at least once a week just to shake things up (I’m not much on Eternal Battleground myself, only have 4 Stonemist caps since launch).

I can’t believe that for 49 days straight you guys refuse to deviate from your daily routine.

It’s not that we refuse to deviate, it’s that sometimes we can’t afford too. Right now, the competition on our match-up is so intense that even a small group shirking their duties for the night has a substantive negative impact. Last week we had it easier, and could afford to take some time off. But right now, at the start of this league, almost every second counts. It’s crazy, but we love it.