Guild Wars 2

teg.1340:

Do not overrate other classes option to swap between melee and range weapon sets. While it is nice to have both swappable in combat, you become a master of none.

For example take a look at the warrior. To be competitive in melee you are forced to equip 2 melee weapon sets.

greatsword + rifle/bow = no CC/interrupts, no block
hammer + rifle/bow = mediocre melee dmg, no mobility, no block
axe/shield + rifle/bow = no mobility, mediocre CC/interrupts
sword/shield + rifle/bow = no CC/interrupts, mediocre melee dmg
mace/shield + rifle/bow = no mobility, mediocre melee dmg

As you see swapping between melee + range weapon sets is a trade-off for warriors.

Ele is fine. We must decide between (near) melee and range. In turn we get 20 skills with all the goodies (CC/interrupts, burst damage, condition damage, heals, mobility) other professions can dream off.

The grass is always greener on the other side!

You’re quite bias on your write up so I fixed it for you. Please do not come here and tell us that there is no cc/interrupt with using a shield or rifle…

greatsword + rifle/bow = Great melee damage + an additional evade. Ranged cripple to catch target. Great mobility. Great range damaage with 1 additional cc if using rifle.

hammer + rifle/bow = Good melee damage and mobility and CC. Great range damage with 1 additional cc if using rifle.

axe/shield + rifle/bow = Good CC/Interrupts, good mobility. Awesome melee damage with axe 1 chain

sword/shield + rifle/bow = mediocre CC/interrupts, mediocre melee dmg. This is more for condition build…

mace/shield + rifle/bow = Low mobility however we have range kd to catch our target, mediocre melee dmg, awesome range damage

NAA.4370:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DyahdHO0WHk

This is the second time you post the same video about your ele. stroking your /kitten?

Report for spamming.

Jericho.4521:

I run a very similar build as well, but the trait selection is slightly different. In Shadow Arts I pick up Shadow Protector, Shadow’s Embrace, and Shadow Rejuv. All this regen allows me to weave in and out of fights with Infil strike and recover health when I’m in a bad situation.

I find its the perfect counter to P/D thieves, as they’ll be struggling to keep stacks on you while they’re constantly getting CC’d and you’re stealthing. And I think the poster above is right, as more P/D thieves figure out how ridiculous that build is, more will jump on the bandwagon and we’ll have lot’s of requests for how to beat that build.

Also, I used to do the Infil. Strike -> CnD -> Tac strike mini combo, but now I reserve that for when I get a target to around 50% health, so I can interrupt their healing spell. Before that, you’re better just using Infil Strike -> Crippling Strike -> Shadow Return and flank them. They typically can’t hit you while being forced to face forward and immobilized.

P/D fanboi here.

You can easily counter D/D + S/D with a pistol offhand. Most likely, the fight will end in a draw.

However, the build is very good vs others.

Good video. I enjoyed watching it. I really liked the 1v2 at the end. There are a lot of scrubs out there in WvW (like how the necro didn’t fear you out of Shadow Refuge…).

Good use of CnD, started attack just far enough to target without getting too close.
Good combat awareness since you stopped attacking when you had 3+ stack of confusion on you.
Good targeting since you went for the glass cannon mesmer first then the high HP pool of the necro.
And good positioning.

andy.7813:

Ok its ma bad on axe nr 5 thing but i did read about it on the forums. Yes i think that thievs are op because it is one clas in WvWvW that I simply cant kill 1v1. Is it because i am a noob like someone stated , or thievs do have better pvp skills than reangers? Someone stated in this post that we have better doened skills than thievs lol.
“LICK WOUNDS” 99% of the time when i am downed is on cd , and i cant simply use it. On the other hand mesmer elementalist and thievs downed skills let them escape or delay stomp almost every time.
Traps are our best friend , hmm maybe but dont forget that you can see were ranger set his trap if you have this option selected in settings.

Check the other thread where other rangers said they have no problem fighting thieves.

Also, watch the video a ranger just posted on 1v1 vs a thief in spvp where he owned that thief.

Not sure what your problem is…

Gungnir Grimm.7123:

as far as I know they still stack to three seconds outside of sPvP. the nerf was PvP only, so WvW and PvE it shouldn’t have changed unless the paralyzation sigil was a bug.

Tested in pve. Doesn’t stack and doesn’t work; one or the other.

tqhx.2190:

Have you guys ever heard of confusion?

So, to counter TW which is a MESMER elite, we need to counter it with confusion. I wonder what class uses confusion the most…omfg MESMER!!

andy.7813:

Thievs can steal skills from other classes. Is this true that when they steal from a ranger axe nr 5 WD and they use it thay can move? If yes how dumb is that?
WvWvW is the endgame, is this how it will be, godlike professioins with best skills and rest with whatever? Thievs are already Op as kitten and it does not look like they will be balanced anytime in the future. The more I play in gw2 pvp the more i see that its not about the skills of a player and all about class you pick :/

I love how this guy/girl claims thieves are OP yet shows lack of knowledgeof the thief class.

Maybe try to learn the thief class to counter them? Is that too much to ask for?

Esrever.8613:

I think pets need this. They are so useless against anything that cloaks. Even the AIs.

Maybe make it a trait or something.

Yeah! They should also give thieves a skill called 1-800 Animal Control which takes away Ranger’s pet for 5 mins.

T1 is like an abusive GF that JQ and SBI want to hold on to because she is hot. They both know it will not work out in the end and that they should let it go.

No matter how many times she beats the living kitten out of JQ/SBI, they keep crawling back trying to hold on to her. It’s time to let go – it’s not good fit.

It’s time to move on and find a better GF. Maybe T2 or T3?

Scarn.6810:

Krakah.3582:

2 – Should be moot the the vast majority of users are on broadband circuits, very few are playing on dial-up. Hell cell phone data plans are faster than dial-up.

3 – Note this is a personal preference, if I had a mid to low end rig, I’d trade hands down the overwhelming amount of particle effects to have player models drawn, even if it’s just colored Gumby avatars. I would love to see options to lower or selectively disable enemy or friendly particle effects to some super base level or not show some at all.

I just checked the min specs, and it lists “Broadband Internet connection” so they aren’t designing this for dial up speeds. Unfortunately they don’t list what the minimum speed to be considered “broadband” is.

In case you’re interested, the min specs on the website are as follows:

Windows® XP Service Pack 2 or better
Intel® Core™ 2 Duo 2.0 GHz, Core i3, AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 or better
2 GB RAM
NVIDIA® GeForce® 7800, ATI Radeon™ X1800, Intel HD 3000 or better (256MB of video RAM and shader model 3.0 or better)
25 GB available HDD space
Broadband Internet connection
Keyboard and mouse

You forgot the fine print which says…

“Note: Due to potential changes, system requirements may change over time and you may be required to upgrade your current system (or obtain a new system) to continue to play the game.”

They can change what the kitten they want…

Habib Loew.6239:

Thank you, Grit, for posting that link. It points to a post in which I describe the culling issue in some detail and discuss a few of the issues involved with changing culling. An even more in depth explanation of what culling is can be found here https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/The-real-problem-here-is-invisible-enemies-Give-their-algorithms-time-to-match-servers-properly/page/4#post356817 (be sure to read both that post and the next – my description exceeded the post size limit).

As you know we’ve been working on this problem for a while but what I think we haven’t ever said before is that our goal is to remove culling completely from WvW. In order to remove culling completely we have to address three issues:

1) Bandwidth out of our servers/datacenter (traffic would increase without culling)
2) Bandwidth in to each client (traffic to each client would also increase without culling)
3) Client performance issues related to rendering (potentially) all the players on a map at once. (Note that we base our performance requirements in this case on min-spec clients. We don’t want to stop anybody being able to play the game after all.)

Until all three of those issues have been dealt with we can’t turn culling off because doing so would cause something to break or perform poorly.

Ok, now let’s talk about what progress we’ve made!

Issue #1 was the easiest to deal with because we can basically just throw money at the problem. When we first started down the road toward removing culling from WvW I took a bunch of bandwidth measurements and then went to the executives and said, essentially, “Hey, if we disable culling our network traffic will increase by X%. Are we ok with that?”. The answer I got was a clear and unambiguous “yes!” So issue #1 isn’t a problem after all.

Issue #2 is a little harder. We need to ensure that folks with a min-spec network connection won’t be overwhelmed by the data we send them and we obviously can’t just buy a better connection for all of our players. So we put our heads together and came up with a plan to reduce the bandwidth required for WvW (and Gw2 in general) as much as possible. Those changes are in testing now and will be rolled out as soon as we’re convinced that they’re solid. Assuming we’re able to get everything working the way we’d like (and I’m fairly confident that we will) then this will address issue #2.

So that leaves us with issue #3: client performance. Some time ago the WvW team acquired an engine programmer who is focused 100% on this issue (and he is being assisted by another engine programmer who isn’t officially on the WvW team). They’re working on some really fantastic optimizations and engine modifications which we hope will allow even min-spec clients to render all the players on a WvW map. We’ll be talking in more detail about the specific changes they’re making when things get just a little more nailed down, but I can say right now that I’m very impressed with the work they’ve done already.

So that’s where we are. Engine programmers are working their magic even now and we’re testing the networking changes that will be required. I believe that our goal of removing culling from WvW is achievable and I’m looking forward to the day that I can announce to you all that we’ve pulled it off!

Culling is fine. Please keep culling.

From your friendly thief player.

Sifu.6527:

Mighty Ice Arrow.9268:

Musty.3148:

irishhaf.1692:

Ive asked this in every one of these threads Ive seen… my main is a Ranger… WHAT can I do to extend a fight let alone win a fight 1 on 1 with a thief?

For every single move I have to gain distance thieves have a move to close the gap almost instantly… on and if its an unload spamming monkey I just die…
So give me a clue here.

Edit: as it stands I do not see a single downside to a thief in WvW, if there is please let me know for curiosity sake.

Well, in all honesty, I have (see below) toons. Unfortunately Rangers are walking pinatas of crests for each of them.

You guys need some love.

Mate you nailed !!! I keep playing Ranger because my ojective in WWW ins’t 1v1 and it’s my main since the start of GW1.
Arena listen to this guy!!!
We need your love, please fix us a bit:)

If you’re fighting vs a GS thief and you can’t win, L2P.

If you’re fighting a p/d condition thief then just run away with swoop and laugh.

What’s so kittening hard?

The answer is too many scrub rangers packing LB as main weapon and SB as secondary weapon. They think barrage and rapid fire are the answer to their problem even when the the thief is dagger storming….

Mighty Ice Arrow.9268:

Musty.3148:

irishhaf.1692:

Ive asked this in every one of these threads Ive seen… my main is a Ranger… WHAT can I do to extend a fight let alone win a fight 1 on 1 with a thief?

For every single move I have to gain distance thieves have a move to close the gap almost instantly… on and if its an unload spamming monkey I just die…
So give me a clue here.

Edit: as it stands I do not see a single downside to a thief in WvW, if there is please let me know for curiosity sake.

Well, in all honesty, I have (see below) toons. Unfortunately Rangers are walking pinatas of crests for each of them.

You guys need some love.

Mate you nailed !!! I keep playing Ranger because my ojective in WWW ins’t 1v1 and it’s my main since the start of GW1.
Arena listen to this guy!!!
We need your love, please fix us a bit:)

If you’re fighting vs a GS thief and you can’t win, L2P.

If you’re fighting a p/d condition thief then just run away with swoop and laugh.

What’s so kittening hard?

Kerithlan.1659:

Daecollo.9578:

Nate Rush.6970:

Are you going to increase guardian symbols or necro marks while you are at it? Or is this post specifically for another “thing” the thief needs to beat all classes.

There are already traits that double the size of marks and symbols…

Writ of Exaltation – Symbols are larger.
Greater Marks – Increases area of marks and marks become unblockable.

They double the size of the area pretty much…

I’m tired of this crap, I’m asking for something thats not overpowered, infact very underpowered in pvp and in some cases pve to be buffed to be reasonable, Black Powder isn’t overpowered, its a very fair attack, infact its a bit underpowered, the reason is, you can stand out of it and still hit people with melee attacks, which is stupid.

Asking it to be buffed to 240 meter field is completely reasonable.

It’s not a mark or a symbol, however. It is a combo field. Please direct me to any other profession that enjoys the ability to trait for larger combo fields.

Were it a trap, then I might understand the request (as rangers can trait to improve trap size). However it is not — I’m unable to trait Purging Flame to have a larger area. I can, however, cause it to recharge 20% faster, last longer and use ground targeting. You can trait Black Powder to bounce to additional targets, deal 10% more damage and cripple foes.

Do you not see how it is silly to compare Black Powder to Seals and Marks?

Ele’s can trait to increase their staff aoe’s (healing rain, frozen ground, geyser, lava front, static field, are combo fields…). What was the point of your post again?

autoduck.2837:

Today, for the first time I dueled a Pistol/Dagger thief. The fight lasted for 5+ minutes and ended in a stalemate. It was so hard for each of us to get the other down because I had my constant heals and he had his constant stealths. I tried spamming aoe but he wasnt glass cannon making aoe spam quite ineffective. I tried keeping my distance to avoid his cloak and dagger, but that made it easy for him to kite me.

Im not a pro but I say I am pretty decent at pvp and I generally have no problem winning duels against other classes. Any advice?

If this happened in WvW, just RTL out and just leave. It is a waste of time because in the long run, you will lose. There is absolutely nothing you can do vs a good p/d thief. You can’t keep your distance because he will continue to pew pew you. You can’t go into melee range because he will just CnD you. You’re basically kittened. (I lied, if you’re super glass cannon and get the jump on him/her first, then maybe….)

While a Secpter/Focus or even Secpter/Dagger works very well agaisnt p/d thieves, you’re kittened because you cannot weapon swap. Inherent limitation of our class mechanic.

Zenith.7301:

Simple PvE fix:

Confusion lasts 100% longer on NPC’s or hits for 100% more. WvW and effects against players would be unaffected.

Illusions and other minions have 50% more HP and a 70% resistance to AoE, in PvE.

They will have to split skills or this class will continue to languish in PvE due to being strong in sPvP.

Confusion already hit for 100% more in WvW/PvE….

You’re basically asking for a 300% damage buff over Spvp. People will explode after 1 or 2 ticks in WvW with 10+ stack of confusion on them. (430 per tick* 12 stacks = 5160. + the 100% you’re asking for is 10320 a tick…)

Jamaz.9837:

In either tPvP or WvW 1v1 without a control point. I always felt Elementalists are obscenely strong due to their boons, healing, mobility, cc, and small trade-offs for damage. They also wipe whatever conditions you place on them and it seems you can only fight them to a stalement using a bunker build. Do elementalists actually fear any class besides a backstab thief that kills them while they’re reading the forums?

No, we do not have a counter at the moment in WvW.

For tPvP, the control point is our counter.

Ralloff.7359:

So, I recently switched from a primary staff ele to primary dagger/dagger ele. I also switched from a rabid build to a knight build. And everything is going quite fine. Killing things is a breeze. Except for you pesky mesmers. I never had a particular problem dealing with them. But recently I’ve been having more trouble than ever before. Is it my build? Are all the mesmers getting better?

Well to get to the point; what kills your builds? What is the weakness to a good shatter mesmer? Is it conditions? Is it shear power? And more specifically what types of ele do you hate fighting? I’d be most grateful for any replies.

If it is 1v1, the first thing I do (D/D ele here) is engage but play defensively and save my utilities. I want to test the water first before I fully engage. I want to see what build they are. Use RTL and get out of combat and heal up then re-engage once you have found out what build they are. If they are power, I slot armor of earth. If they are condition, I slot cleansing flame. Either way, I always engage them aggressively. This is for WvW of course.

KirinDave.6451:

Sifu.6527:

I want the same 42% DPS increase the ranger and warrior got.

You can have it if you’re willing to close to melee distance, it seems.

I didn’t know rangers long bow and short bow was 130 range.

I want the same 42% DPS increase the ranger and warrior got.

Dardamaniac.1295:

let me understand this..Ranger didnt get any major dmg buff,just some fixes so that he can do the dmg more reliable and dont miss a lot.Both at his bows and meele pets…So hes OP now just because he can actually hit and miss less…….seems legit…

They fixed the “miss” bug and increase dps by 42% on some skills.

When I’m running away, I like to put my “house” at a random place and watch the kitten aoe it or swing blindly in it while I infil arrow the opposite away. Lol. Just because we cast it doesn’t mean we’re in it.

Hint* we can cast the house anywhere we want (within the given range of course).

stof.9341:

Israel.7056:

And what is the supposed counter for Cloak and Dagger spamming condition thieves?

You got two dodges. Two C&D and the thief is all out of initiative. Seems obvious to me.

If he is a condition p/d thief then he will have 4-5 init after the first two CnD. Anything but “all out of initiative.”

At least know what you’re talking about before giving advice. If you don’t know, then I suggest you keep your mouth zipped.

Simonoly.4352:

That a well placed moa morph would have ended it all.

Moa morph can be easily counter by spamming #5 which charges you out of combat faster than RTL. It’s basically a free RTL but with a greater range. Only noobs die to moa morph, unless they are in a confine environment.

Pendragon.8735:

The player is obviously very skilled, and I talked to him after I got sick of seeing a helpless mob chase him around and went to help and we finally downed him. (after I had first tried to get them to just stop engaging). What I gathered its clear he was just there to have fun, drag out as many people (victims) as he could and have them be props for his videos.

That’s fine, but the topic should really be about what the title suggests. Should a build be able to do this, no matter how good the player? I really don’t care for these bunker and endless escape specs coming into WvW just disrupting the natural design, for no other reason than that such things like the video are possible, and its more fun to run around like a demi-god than just be a grunt in the army.

A build should be able to be either very survivable OR have great mobility and escape, not both things together. As a Necro I can build to be very survivable, but I can never build to have great mobility. This was the tradeoff designed on purpose as explained by Jon Peters. What is the trade-off here in this video? You don’t have to make one. Can say maybe that they hit like a wet noodle, but obviously you can still get kills as in the video and are virtually assured to eventually win any 1v1 if you are pretty good.

I guess you missed the part where Ele is the only class to have the lowest armor and vit…this is what they get in exchange.

The Master.2893:

Mozley.7056:

The Master.2893:

First of all I never stated I used AltF4… wasn’t even aware that worked until today (I assumed countdown timer was in effect like other MMORPGs)… Please don’t jump to conclusions.

Furthermore if this is indeed a problem then simply introduce a countdown timer.

First off, you wrote a several paragraph defending the use of alt+f4 then stated you will stop playing WvW when they implement this fix. This very strongly insinuates that you use alt+4 each time to avoid death. I think that the fix they are implementing is a great idea.

Meow

From the ArenaNet Post:

“Alt+F4 is no escape”
“If someone that you’re fighting disconnects during combat (via Alt+F4, killing the client process, etc.) their character will be instantly killed, death penalties will be applied, and XP & loot will be handed out as usual.”

Do I agree Alt+F4 is an exploit? Yes. However AltF4 isn’t the only way to break an Internet Connection thus causing the game to log out. Therefore if ArenaNet makes ALL disconnects as suggested in this post subject to this rule this will make both exploit-based and true disconnects as a result of various internet problems (this IS an online game) lethal to Permadeath play.

Furthermore from a logic view I don’t know why anyone cares. Someone running away is just as good as killing them… when they reconnect they will have to run back anyways. Thus one less player stopping you from your seige/seige defense. And as stated a simple logout timer of at least 20s would end this debate.

Your post makes no sense at all.

You’re playing on /dealth mode…wtf is that? Who give a kitten, I guess you do. Anyways, let me explain why your logic is flawed.

If Anet implement a 20-30s logout timer, guess what….you’re gonna die anyways. You’re at 50% health and some invaders are chasing you. You crash due to crappy internet. Your character stays in game for 20-30s and the invaders are still beating on your character, down you, then stomp you. What is your point? Just say away from WvW would be my recommendation.

I read your post and it doesn’t make any sense. Particularly this statement: “What? I never put a time on it, but you did apparently. You also cited me wrong. Fire with staff, then earth and fire with D/D, then air and earth with staff again.”

I think you’re confusing weapon swapping cool down with attunement cool down. Just because you swap to a different weapon set it does not mean the attunement cool down will reset. We’re not asking for a seperate attunement cool down on weapon swap – just the ability to swap weapon sets. Attunement will remain the same.

Using your example, if you’re using staff and cast MS then go to earth and switch to D/D, you cannot go back to fire for 15s (base recharge rate).

I think some of these arguement can be solved by better defining the perimetesr or restrictions that come with weapon swapping.

I.E.
Weapon swapping on 10-30 sec cool down. Does not reset attunement cool downs on weapon swap.

are thieves immune to this effect? Speaking strictly weapon abilities.

Eduardo.4675:

Sifu.6527:

Krathalos.3461:

rchu.8945:

same can be said of D/D thief players

Except shutting down a thief is a ton easier. They carry around, at most, one break stun, have 2k armor, and rely on stealth as an escape. If you can survive or dodge their burst, they’re very easy to shut down and kill. D/D Eles, on the other hand, have AoE Damage, a ton of heals and condition removal, three break stuns, and more escape abilities than a D/D thief. Killing thieves that try to burst me is one of my favorite things to do. Having to fight a D/D Ele is the most annoying thing in the game. They take like 3 minutes to kill, and they will almost always get away if you can’t kill them fast enough. As for a thief, it’s a lot easier to keep them shut down since they rarely build for raw defense.

The two aren’t comparable. One is a tanky DPS with a ton of heals, condition removals and break stuns. The other is a glass cannon thief with one break stun and an over-reliance on stealth as an escape mechanism. Hit a thief with CC and he either has to run away or die.

Bunzy.8674:

This is how you kill a D/D ele. You run pure glass cannon.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0Zw8vNJVvg

There’s no way a D/D Ele built properly (Power/Tough/Vit) is going to get hit anywhere near 12k by Backstab.

Are you sure about that? L2Backstab

12K Backstab = (3052 dmage * 981 wpn * 2.4 Skill) = 7185629/ 2500 (average P/T/V ele armor) = 2874.25 * 2.5 crit dmage = 7185 * 78% damage increase from traits/sigil/rune/etc = 12790 Backstab

If the Ele has 2900 armor, it would be 11K Backstab. If the Ele has 1980 armor, then the BS would’ve been 21k.

Im pretty sure you have been reading my posts and maths, that’s all my maths for a post i made last night. But its 100% true, nonetheless

^Yes, thanks for doing the math. I didn’t know the coef of BS was 2.4.

Krathalos.3461:

rchu.8945:

same can be said of D/D thief players

Except shutting down a thief is a ton easier. They carry around, at most, one break stun, have 2k armor, and rely on stealth as an escape. If you can survive or dodge their burst, they’re very easy to shut down and kill. D/D Eles, on the other hand, have AoE Damage, a ton of heals and condition removal, three break stuns, and more escape abilities than a D/D thief. Killing thieves that try to burst me is one of my favorite things to do. Having to fight a D/D Ele is the most annoying thing in the game. They take like 3 minutes to kill, and they will almost always get away if you can’t kill them fast enough. As for a thief, it’s a lot easier to keep them shut down since they rarely build for raw defense.

The two aren’t comparable. One is a tanky DPS with a ton of heals, condition removals and break stuns. The other is a glass cannon thief with one break stun and an over-reliance on stealth as an escape mechanism. Hit a thief with CC and he either has to run away or die.

Bunzy.8674:

This is how you kill a D/D ele. You run pure glass cannon.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0Zw8vNJVvg

There’s no way a D/D Ele built properly (Power/Tough/Vit) is going to get hit anywhere near 12k by Backstab.

Are you sure about that? L2Backstab

12K Backstab = (3052 dmage * 981 wpn * 2.4 Skill) = 7185629/ 2500 (average P/T/V ele armor) = 2874.25 * 2.5 crit dmage = 7185 * 78% damage increase from traits/sigil/rune/etc = 12790 Backstab

If the Ele has 2900 armor, it would be 11K Backstab. If the Ele has 1980 armor, then the BS would’ve been 21k.

Jinks.2057:

They live the burst they’ll run as far as they can. Last one i just fought literally blew all his get aways. Ran past my ability to render him.

Bad players succeed on D/D eles..

The irony in this comment…

Running away for cool downs to come back up to try again. Hm…sounds familiar.

Aveneo.2068:

Tell me something… How can a thief stay invisible for up to 14-18 seconds?

I’m asking this because a few days ago a group of ~8 people fought 1 thief who managed to remain invisible for a very long time (my video showed up to 14-18 seconds at two points during the fight) and we simply couldn’t kill him at all.

Not only that, afterwards he was seen at ~20% health and shooting himself to the bridge, did his stealth-heal, and he had full health again 3-4 seconds later.

How do you fight something like that?

Sorry, but there are some serious issues going on and in my opinion it is not a ‘QQ moar n00bs L2P’ issue as clearly this ‘Revealed’ debuff isn’t working.

Clearly a L2P issue here. I bet you don’t even know what revealed does or how it is trigger.

Hint – Just b/c someone is stealthed doesn’t mean they will get the releaved debuff after coming out of stealth. /wink /wink

Elmuerto.9840:

I saw something similar last night. The thief took down a group of maybe 5 – I was around, ressing, and being focused at times and I legged it when too many others drifted over from his team. It was the group not really knowing what was going on and culling.

The thief really didn’t appear for any more than 1 second unless attacking, and even then it wasn’t for anymore than a couple of seconds. I know I was watching for him like a hawk and wasn’t even able to get an arrow shot off in short range to immobilise him from stealth he was popping so fast, but ey. I’m sure this annoys players no end, it is a bug however and does occur and its the reason why this can happen. Experienced players can deal with it but it don’t make it right.

First, it is not bug – it is a learn to play issue. I’m not going to tell you how to counter it since there are countless number of topics on that.

Experienced players don’t deal with it, they counter it. As said above, a learn to play issue.

- From a non-thief player.

Hm…interesting.

So, you’re saying, one could technically kill many noobs in WvW just by dodging around them and placing down caltrops. I’m going to re-roll for the lolz.

Highlet.8039:

Churning earth most likely. AOE ability with a 3 1/4 s. cast time, large area of effect, applies bleed stacks as well as direct damage and is typically initiated outside of combat and then the ele uses lightening flash to teleport in to the target area.

If he hit you that hard, one or both of you must be glass.

He said jump in the air so I’m assuming earthquake + LF + CF + Fire grab.

CE doesn’t hit for 15K but fire grab can.

This guy got owned in pvp and is QQing and trolling. His combat log would clearly tell him which ability hit for 15k.

Nothing to see here, move along.

STRanger.5120:

Eodwen.2613:

Piedplat.3597:

the stealth mode is a joke, more time on the “cant-be-stealth” debuff . (sorry cant remember the name I cant see it, the time is short on it…)

http://youtu.be/7799to8aGcQ

I dont know if he’s hacking or not. But if is not, seriously that class and any class with stealth is really OP…

The revealed debuff is 3 seconds and the stealth can go up to 3 seconds if you trait it. WvsWvsW is known to have the issue of not showing the target player right away. That is in fact a wvsw issue and not a class issue.

^^This

Seriously ppl, don´t post this complain over and over again, it has been told a thousand times before, that this is not Stealth problem, but the server/rendering issue. Therefore it has nothing to do with the class or any other class with stealth abilities, got it?
Thanks for finally understanding this.

Acutally, the server/rendering issue is only 1/2 of the problem.

It is a stealth mechanic problem, or at least in my opinion. The reveal debuff only applies if the thief attacks from stealth regardless if the thief is in combat or not. You can CnD for 3 sec of stealth or 4 sec if traited, wait for stealth to end and CnD again for another 3-4 sec, then you can use Hide in the shadow for another 3-4 sec. By this time you have enough init for another CnD. (this is just an example as there are different combinations for extending stealth).

You add in server/rendering issue in WvW which gives thieves a .5-1 sec delay coming out of stealth…now you can see how frustrating it is to fight a thief.

Is it working as intend? Probably but I can’t say for certain. Maybe they will fix it where all stealth triggers reveal once it ends. Who knows. In the meantime, deal with it.

ThiBash.5634:

If you combine Elemental Surge with Arcane Power and Water Magic, you can get up to 15 seconds of chill on your target. If you use it with earth, you can immobilize them for 5 seconds with the same combo.

Too bad Immobilize is bug and does not stack in duration ;P

You could use it with air attunement to blind mesmer and drive them into insanity. hahah

magicthighs.5372:

Sifu.6527:

Kinda like P/D thief where most of the damage is comming from spamming 1 and sneak attack that uses no init at all?

Yes, they should nerf those kitten OP builds where their auto-attack deals the most damage.

I never said they should nerf it. Just pointing out that you really don’t use init that much in certain builds.

Phenn.5167:

The initiative system IS a cooldown system—just a “bigger picture” version.

Think about it: Whereas other classes have cool downs on individual skills (meaning there will always be skills coming off of CD’s for use), the thief has a cool down on all skills at the same time. If a thief burns through his initiative completely, he’s a sitting duck and can’t use ANY weapon skills. If any other class burns through his CD’s on one set, he can swap and use the other weapon set. Thief can swap all he wants, but once his initiative’s gone it’s pointless.

What seems to be disturbing people are thieves that know how to manage their massive CD. It’s a bigger weakness that can be (and is) a bigger strength when managed properly.

Kinda like P/D thief where most of the damage is comming from spamming 1 and sneak attack that uses no init at all? When they want to stealth they use CnD but by the time they re-enage (3-4 sec later) they almost regen all the init they lost?

How about BS build where BS doesnt even cost init. The total init cost of this burst is 6.

The advantages of the Init system far exceed that of every other classes cool down mechanic in this game. But I’m a realistic guy and I know this system will not change b/c they do not want to rebuild the class from the ground up. However, don’t come here and tell me it’s a “bigger picture cool down” when some builds basically counter the “weakness” of this system.

Warlord.9074:

It wont be nerfed. 1st of all that skill takes around 2 seconds to cast and it roots the warrior in place. So not only cant move at all but it can be dodged. 2ndly those are not average damage numbers. The target has got to be a glass cannon build or a low level with bad gear… 3rdly it requires full adrenaline to pull off decent damage and its only decent if it crits and the warrior has very high crit damage. So folk it wont change. Learn to play and stop calling for nerfs on skills that arn’t game breaking and require a lot of things to happen and a forgiving RNG to play.\

Lastly as always peoples damage calculations are way off.

You fail to mention that warrior can get 3 bars of adren with a click of a button, Kill Shot is 1500 range, and you can combine it with quickness for a total cast time of 1 sec. Kill Shot hits fully defensive 3,200 armor target for 10-15 K. Should everyone be a free kill for warrior every 60-90 sec? No..

From – Lvl 80 Warrior with 4,600 Attack (no orb needed) and 119 Crit damage built for cheesy kill shot.

Creslin.1758:

ThiBash.5634:

Yeroc.7516:

Other than that though, I can’t think of anything that would be OP.

The fact that you can’t think of anything right now doesn’t mean certain combinations couldn’t eventually arise. Even the added blast finishers you mentioned are essentially buffs.

The thing is really, you’re missing the bigger picture here. Sure, it would be cool, and sure, it would be useful. However, skills were separated by weapon for a reason. Guild Wars 1 was a nightmare to balance. Guild Wars 2 a lot less. Adding more complications to it is really something you should avoid, unless there’s no other way to fix it.

Seeing as how this weapon swap ‘issue’ can be solved by other means, I propose to do just that. As Jamie Hyneman would say: “Simpler is better.” And right now, simple fixes would be to either give the Frost Bow 1200 range, or reverse the direction on Magnetic Grasp. Neither of those will cause even half the balance headache your suggestion does.

Imagine how brutal focus would be with all its defensive skills if you could switch to D/D. Obsidian flesh + churning earth, drop swirling winds and then switch to D/D to melee while immune to projectiles. Oh and auramancers? Yeah that’s three auras you can cast now instead of just 2…the buffs would be ridiculous.

Drop an eruption with staff and magnetic aura, and then switch to D/D and lightning flash + churning earth for like 14 stacks of bleed on a group, and immunity to projectiles.

Those are just a few I can think of…

Obvisously, you didn’t read what the OP proposed. There will be a 12-15 sec cool down on all atunement when you swap weapon except for the atunement you’re in.

I’ll use your example to illustrate the restriction the OP is proposing.

“Obsidian flesh + churning earth, drop swirling winds and then switch to D/D to melee while immune to projectiles. "

In D/D Earth: Every atunement is off cool down. You cast Churning Earth, then switch to focus for Obsidian flesh. However all of your atunement is on a 12-15 cooldown. You cant switch to air for swirling wind. You’re stuck in Earth until other atune is off cooldown.

“Oh and auramancers? Yeah that’s three auras you can cast now instead of just 2…the buffs would be ridiculous.”

We always had 3 auras in D/D so I’m not seeing your point (1 is broken due to recent patch).

“Drop an eruption with staff and magnetic aura, and then switch to D/D and lightning flash + churning earth for like 14 stacks of bleed on a group, and immunity to projectiles.”

With just a staff I can do eruption + magnetic aura + lava font and or meteor shower on a group and be immune to projectiles…OMGZ it’s OP!!!! Even if you did it with Focus then switch to D/D + LF + CE into a group. How would you get out??? You’re stuck in a group of people in earth atunement and there’s still 10sec on atunement cd.

ThiBash.5634:

Yeroc.7516:

This would be a fun gameplay mechanic and would open the door to new builds.

This is eaxactly the wrong reason to implement in combat weapon swapping. Adding new, potentially devastating new combinations is something you want to avoid for game balance’s sake. Dismissing the auto attacks for a moment, you now have 4*4*4=64 new skill combinations that have to be balanced relatively to eachother.

That’s exactly the thing they wanted to avoid coming from GW1.

They tried to avoid that with the thief so they gave them the ability to spam an attack. How’s that working out? Spam 2222 win!

Balance doesn’t matter if it’s 1 ability or 64 abilities – it’s how to implement it. I think the OP idea is creative and add restriction to weapon swapping which ties to attunements. With some tweak, I think it could work.

If you’re burst spec D/D, don’t open with your normal cheesy Steal+CnD+BS combo. Wear them down to about 60-75% of their health then do it. What so kittening hard????

Open with your short bow, they will RTL to you follow by an Updrift (dodge this). Keep shooting him but watch out for shocking aura…watch for his attunement swapping. If Earth, dodge the KD (he will probably try to Immo first then KD if there is some distance between you two. If Fire, dodge the burning speed and watch out for ROF. Water attunement is next for some healing/chill/etc/cleanse. This is the key moment. At this time, you probably did a decent amount of damage with your short bow if you’re glass cannon (should hit for 1K+ crit for about 4-5 hits the ele would have about 12K health left). Use your chessy combo to down them.

There you go, a ele D/D’s combo is as predictable as a 100B warrior.

Stiv.1820:

Mclovin.9702:

Stiv.1820:

It’s a counter to stealth which the masses say there are none of.

There’s a lot of counters to stealth, like warrior’s shield block (if theyre getting attacked), area CC by hammers, ANY area skill that necros and eles have, even auto attacking the air.

This is true but the mantra is repeated ad nauseum on these forums. “There is no counter to stealth”, “We need a counter to stealth”, “give us a consumable to see thru stealth” blah blah

Mindless aoe spamming and swinging in the air may work but is hardly considered a true counter to stealth.

Currently, the only counter to stealth is stealth itself….

The problem I see with thieves (I don’t play one):

1 – WvW – Culling issue. I can see the attack graphics but I still can’t target them until 1-2 secs later. ANET said this will be fixed so I’m fine for the time being.

2 – Ability Spam – This is tie to their init mechanic so there’s really no way around it unless they redo the class from the ground up. I’m fine with it for the most part. What I do have an issue with is spamming heart seeker. The damage is fine – it’s the range that bullkitten. No other class have a spammable gap closer like this.

warmonkey.8013:

Ditton.3149:

Columba.9730:

Danikat.8537:

Seriously?

The only reason you need Ascended gear is to do the higher levels of Fractals. And it really is only the higher levels. I’ve heard of people getting up to at least level 10, which is more than enough to have seen each fractal at least once, without ever needing Ascended gear.

If you don’t intend to try and reach the higher levels of that dungeon then you can completely ignore Ascended gear, and the only reason to try and reach the higher levels is to get Ascended gear more easily. So in other words it’s grind for the sake of grind for those who want it and everyone else can just ignore it and play as normal.

Wrong. The ascended gear is 20-50% more powerful than exotics.

show me a ring that is 50% stronger than the exotic version…

Well considering there’s stat distros on ascended that don’t exist for exotic, not too hard. let’s say you want cond+/crit/tough. can’t get that on an exotic! gotta get in that dungeon bro. and you’ll get one with more condition damage than an exotic cond+/x/x exotic, and with more stats to increase your damage, and and and oh gosh.

fact remains they knew they were going to alienate a lot of their players by introducing a new tier of gear, because they knew a lot of their players were here because we didn’t want to have a never-ending chase after new loot.

they mislead us for 5 years, basically. and knew it. and knew we’d be mad.

but i’m the bad guy here.

Kinda like how you have to grind WvW Badges or do HotW or AC for P/V/T stats right???? You got to get it in those dungeons bro!

nachtnebel.9168:

tkalamba.2541:

It hasn’t changed, the grind was always there….

Getting BiS gear was never a grind till the Lost Shore patch. The grindy parts of the game were completely optional, you didn’t have to do it just in order to keep up with the rest of the players. Grind is fine, as long as it is optional and doesn’t get you better gear.

They said FOTM was a mistake…and badly implemented. A mistake they hope to avoid in the future.

Same.4687:

IF Ascended gear will not be made available through any other means but dungeons. I will drop this game so fast the only thing you will see before it dropping the ground is a dustcloud.

There are some exceptions:
– Ascended gear is fully craftable via materials found OUTSIDE of dungeons
– Considering the last one this means you should be able to buy them on TP
– Via some sort of Karma/Badge payment

If they are going to try and make me run the Fractal thingy, I’m out.

-Not all of the Ascended gears are craftable and never will be (if they were, no one would run the dungeon).
-Everything is account bound!
-It will probably be for Badges. Maybe 1000+ per piece since the dungeon isn’t that easy…

Whats broken with WvW then?