Guild Wars 2

Dano.5298:

DAoC remains my favorite video game of all time.

That said, Gw2 WvW blows it out of the water. WvW on gw2 actually works for one thing. Balance is superb and bugs limited. All I play is WvW and I think its great.

The biggest thing that holds back Gw2 WvW is lack of updates and the community. All you fools who transfer off servers kill the entire point of the bloody game which is to have a team and a community. Having such an easy transfer process and absurd number differences from tier 1 to t8 kills WvW. By and large the game isn’t the problem, its the players who play it.

Exactly! By FAR the biggest problem WvW has comes from the players. And the transfers only made things worst.

moi.4398:

I can understand why tpvp players feel superior . Although this attitude disgusts me, they have some truth in their claims . 1 or 2 average player can take a upgraded camp , 5 people can take a tower . But what do you see in WvW ? A zerg taking a sentry .
20 players for kill a veteran * facepalm *

-A roamer with a bad english

I do both tpvp and WvW (all roles) and I never understood the perceived superiority. I still don’t. In fact, WvW has, by FAR, provided me with my highest challenges yet and most proudest victories. Nowhere will you have to face 1 vs 10 and prove to be able to hold your own. Claiming that WvW is only zergs is ridiculous. It’s what you make of it and decide to do in it. If you only see zergs, I’m inclined to think it’s because you play in them too much for your own good. Some people need to stop smelling their own flatulence. Maybe a break from the game might help…

peanut.3916:

id say SoR its A FAMILY FRIENDLY ENVIRONMENT AND WE ALWAYS HAVE FUN NO MATTER THE SITUATION COME JOIN US

If what you say is true I’m tempted because where I am right now, T2, we are plagued with elitists guilds that just won’t play a game they deem below them. Many are actually behaving like complete @$$holes. I just want a place where the community act like a community and where all roles are appreciated. Mag was always somehow elitist, but we have reached a very unhealthy level of this kitten that I can n longer stand. I really think this attitude will destroy the server.

Long story short, I’ll consider any server where the atmosphere is better.

MrFluffy.9307:

the first step would be to remove arrow carts

Uh, no. Just no. WvW is a war with structures and sieges. Beside, sieges, such as arrow cart, let you offset huge disadvantages when you try to defend any objectives. Removing them would truly make WvW a number game.

What you want is to push the icon with crossed swords on top of your screen not change the icon with a fortification.

Dee Jay.2460:

It seems like roaming solo is a dying art. I can’t recall the last time I actually met an enemy player roaming around the battlefield by himself.

I see plenty of roamers though…in packs of 2, 3…5. It seems like everyone has given up on fair fights and prefers either running or completely overwhelming their enemies.

A shame really since solo-roaming used to be kind of fun. But now it feels like nobody dares leave the house without an easy backup.

I do so all the time as a staff ele of all thing.

warriorjrd.8695:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

grifflyman.8102:

WvW is a joke, it’s in such a sad state. It’s all karma trians and jumping from one map to the next because most servers can’t field the numbers to have more than one map defended.

So if you see numbers on the map, you flip to a map without them and fight NPC’s. BORING, BORING, BORING.

Fix you’re kittening game Anet.

Funny because I just had 2 hours of mostly epic fights today and I did a lot of roaming too. Very little karma train at all.

As a side note: may the spy working for FA, that destroyed most of our Omegas on FA BL, get what he deserve. Pretty shameful way to play. Specially when your team is leading and have FAR superior numbers.

With all due respect, was it just those two hours where there was remotely even numbers? I noticed you said how one of your enemy servers is outnumbering you and how SOS has a very healthy lead on the third day. Sure you have some fun fights, and so do I in uneven fights, but there is no denying that on the third day of your match, you already have a winner (Unless SOS decides to leave for the week).

We were overall badly outnumbered most of the day. However, we had a decent group on FA BL that was able to do more than very well despite them being significantly more in the same zone without being outnumbered there. Biggest loot fest in a while to be honest. I know full well we will loose the week, but that doesn’t prevent me from enjoying and play as if I wanted to win anyway.

grifflyman.8102:

WvW is a joke, it’s in such a sad state. It’s all karma trians and jumping from one map to the next because most servers can’t field the numbers to have more than one map defended.

So if you see numbers on the map, you flip to a map without them and fight NPC’s. BORING, BORING, BORING.

Fix you’re kittening game Anet.

Funny because I just had 2 hours of mostly epic fights today and I did a lot of roaming too. Very little karma train at all.

As a side note: may the spy working for FA, that destroyed most of our Omegas on FA BL, get what he deserve. Pretty shameful way to play. Specially when your team is leading and have FAR superior numbers.

GOSU.9574:

Since the begining of this game’s release I have been an avid player but a staunch critic. Like most who felt the game did not come remotely close to the "manifesto"’s objectives (primarily power creep/vertical progression) a lot has changed in the nearly 2 years the game has been out.

Having taken 2 long breaks during this game’s existence, a 6 month followed shortly by the more recent 8 month departure, I missed a lot of the changes as they happened. Having returned I am somewhat lost, but as I find the changes that have taken place they have all been, overall, a huge improvement over the original launch and the first few months of the game’s growing pains.

While in many ways the game still doesn’t met my preferences, I have to give the development team, art team, and all those who work on this game the kudos they deserve.

Well done.

I also agree that the guys are working very hard and are obviously very talented. It’s good sometimes to say these things in an otherwise sea of troll comments and negativity.

Rococo.8347:

Thanks for the contributions so far but I need to bust some urban myths that have developed on this thread.

1. My friend wasn’t following a ‘closed guild raid’ at no point was she told it was one, the commander icon was on, a fair amount of people not from that guild were in the group – I was clear about all of this folks.
2. to the commenters saying not to play at ‘peak time’ if it was truly peak time she would have hit a que and there would have been more than one commander on the map.
3. Deso as I have previously pointed out was BUILT on PUG’s doing messy anarchic land grabs, it was fun and relaxed, all welcome – I don’t know why things have massively changed here – there should be at least one server in GW2 where people can go do wvw without a guild or with a casual grouping of casual guilds without someone clutching their pearls – Deso being the biggest population of mixed nationalities was that server – Deso when I was regularly playing had pretty much at one point NO guilds – we managed and yes it does irk me that I return to have some new upstart guildy get nasty with my newcomer friend – its not only put her off – its put me off.

Actually, it’s the other way around. All WvW servers are opened to all players of any levels guild or not. The guilds that want to do anything strictly “guild” related are the ones who should be begging for a server, not the opposite.

But even if it was a close guild raid and there was no tag it absolutely doesn’t change a kitten thing at all. It’s all in your head. What is truly sad is the apparent unwillingness to simply ask nicely if you want to do your “close guild raid”. Nobody is asking you to teach anyone or do anything you don’t want to do. All that is said is WvW is a bad place to behave the way you want to. You can’t do anything “closed” unless you have others consent and to get it your best bet is to be nice.

Jarrix.8234:

TyPin.9860:

bad game design
Did a part of the game force those players to be rude? Did someone demand it or does it give a reward? No it doesn’t.

Yes, the rally mechanic does force those players to be rude.

Uplevels dying and rallying the enemy ruins their experience. They have to be rude to get her to go away. They’re already running untagged so they made an attempt to be polite. She choose to follow them anyway. Being polite did not work so they were forced to be rude. That is terrible game design, I am sorry you can’t see that.

I’m sorry but this is BS. I face the same mechanic and I sure as hell feel more urges to be rude to the kitten who behave like barely evolved simians than toward those who just try their best to play even if they aren’t to my level. It’s an attitude problem and some need to look at themselves in a mirror.

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

I think you just don’t want to accept the fact that WvW is a competition that is opened to ALL. This isn’t the Olympic were there was pre-selection by your kitten raidleader.

Strange, I thought a raid was a preselected party of guild/alliance members.

If only there was some sort of system that allowed anyone to become… lets call it a “leader”… a focus point for random people to form some kind of blob around and join or follow at will instead of just having these closed raids.

But surely such a thing does not exist in GW2?!

I see you just don’t care how many time I repeat it to you that WvW is a SERVER thing, not a guild thing. You can refuse reality all you want, but that won’t change it. You want to force something you don’t have the power to enforce is the problem. At any rate, your best chance to still get your desired result (to be left alone) would be to ask nicely.I never refused anyone such a request when they asked even just half decently. Do wannabe “elitist” players have to be such kitten all the time? You can be “elite” and still be nice or at least try.

Using lvl 80 character serves that common goal a lot more than playing with a lowbie. Just saying.

Yes, but what if you are new and you still want to play? The game not only not prohibit that but it actually took that situation in consideration.

CrimsonNeonite.1048:

IF they were running tagged she is free to follow otherwise I wouldn’t advise anyone who doesn’t know what they’re doing or has a lvl 80 at the very least, no matter if it’s socially acceptable or not.

Anyway many of Guilds run Open Tagged Raids on here, you are free to tag along and learn, or you could ask any one of our Guilds if you could follow them.

Plenty of people follow me anywhere just because they feel they can accomplish more than if they are alone. There can be plenty of legitimate reasons why someone decide to follow you tag or no tag. There isn’t always a tag somewhere and even if there is, the fact is it’s their choice and not yours. You have no power over who can follow you other than removing yourself from the server… it’s your choice to do so. Of course, I never ever saw anyone refusing a nicely asked request instead of a quite mean spirited “go away”.

I never said there was ONE goal only. I said there sure as hell was a common one. That being said, Anet realized the JP puzzle could be a problem and they moved the long one on EBG away. You also can’t stay iddle more than 10 min before being kicked. Crafting and access to storage is a necessary part of a war as it provides the equimement you might need. Only the Grub and the likes remains aberrations that have fallen into a joke almost nobody ever does anyway. I wouldn’t be surprised if they eventually got removed in time.

Let’s be clear here. Nothing prevents anyone from adding more goals on top of the main and common one. However, making do without the common goal is a bad joke. If it’s your goal to do that, go play elsewhere. Enrolling on a hockey team while not wanting to play the puck is despicable.

Ragnar.4257:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Ragnar.4257:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

So basicly what you’re saying is that you can do whatever you want and have every right to play with whomever you want whether they want to play with you or not, but other players dont have that right.

I… dont really think I argue with that.

I think you have quite a loaded answer here. Nobody forces you to be best buddies and take them in your party. However, yes, they sure as hell can run where they want the same way you also can. The way WvW matches are done are based on servers, not pre-selections. Anyway, just think about it for one whole second. What can you do to prevent someone from following you? You can try to loose them by using wp, but it’s nothing like a guarantee of anything even in the short run. It’s the same reality as when you go to the public swimming pool. You can go there with friends, but you won’t be alone and you can’t say to others what to do as long as they behave within the frame of the context they are. It’s the same for them. Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying. Again, you team is the server, not your guild.

BTW for the one above saying that being tagless or not is relevant, well, it’s not. It doesn’t change a kitten thing about all that I’ve said above.

Imagine you go to a public swimming pool, and someone you don’t know follows right behind you the entire time. Like, 2ft/50cm away, almost on top of you. For over an hour. You don’t know them. They’re just staring at you. Its really quite creepy.

Can you still not ask them to respect your space?

But they have just as much right to be in the swimming pool yeah?

And they’re allowed to go where they want in the swimming pool right?

So why can’t they follow right behind you for hours and hours?

Just because something is “allowed” doesn’t make it socially acceptable.

The problem is you are ridding the analogy beyond it’s capability to be used in this context. At the public swimming pool you aren’t in the same team, riding toward a common goal and in a hostile environment where numbers = safety. Specially when you are an uplevel might I add.

I totally agree that something allowed is not necessary acceptable. However, I STRONGLY question, based on several past experiences, who is socially unacceptable most of the time. Let’s be honest here. A lot of wannabe “elitist” guilds who are in love with their own hype are less than friendly, polite and/or respectful toward those they perceive as lower then them and think they can do WTF they want specially because it isn’t formally interdicted. So, from my perspective at least, there is a reversal of role here.

This is where your problem is. You are assuming everyone in WvW has a common goal, a unified target.

This simply isn’t the case. Some want fights, some want PPT, some want karma, some want map-completion, some want socializing, some want roleplay.

If you assume everyone on the map is 100% focused on the score, then what you’re saying makes sense.

But they aren’t.

I think ‘public swimming pool’ is actually a very good comparison for WvW.

It is not MY problem. The game has included a common goal whether you like it or not. It is built in the game. That you decided to play hockey while ignoring the puck is your choice, but the goal is there nonetheless. I will also add that if you are not playing the puck and the uplevel is, the problem isn’t the uplevel but you. No wonder ANet doesn’t seem to like GvG people… I can well see why by reading a lot of comments.

As for the swimming pool being a good analogy it is. Heck, “I” used/made it. However, like a lot of analogies they have limits that you must respect otherwise it becomes a complete joke.

Ragnar.4257:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

So basicly what you’re saying is that you can do whatever you want and have every right to play with whomever you want whether they want to play with you or not, but other players dont have that right.

I… dont really think I argue with that.

I think you have quite a loaded answer here. Nobody forces you to be best buddies and take them in your party. However, yes, they sure as hell can run where they want the same way you also can. The way WvW matches are done are based on servers, not pre-selections. Anyway, just think about it for one whole second. What can you do to prevent someone from following you? You can try to loose them by using wp, but it’s nothing like a guarantee of anything even in the short run. It’s the same reality as when you go to the public swimming pool. You can go there with friends, but you won’t be alone and you can’t say to others what to do as long as they behave within the frame of the context they are. It’s the same for them. Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying. Again, you team is the server, not your guild.

BTW for the one above saying that being tagless or not is relevant, well, it’s not. It doesn’t change a kitten thing about all that I’ve said above.

Imagine you go to a public swimming pool, and someone you don’t know follows right behind you the entire time. Like, 2ft/50cm away, almost on top of you. For over an hour. You don’t know them. They’re just staring at you. Its really quite creepy.

Can you still not ask them to respect your space?

But they have just as much right to be in the swimming pool yeah?

And they’re allowed to go where they want in the swimming pool right?

So why can’t they follow right behind you for hours and hours?

Just because something is “allowed” doesn’t make it socially acceptable.

The problem is you are ridding the analogy beyond it’s capability to be used in this context. At the public swimming pool you aren’t in the same team, riding toward a common goal and in a hostile environment where numbers = safety. Specially when you are an uplevel might I add.

I totally agree that something allowed is not necessary acceptable. However, I STRONGLY question, based on several past experiences, who is socially unacceptable most of the time. Let’s be honest here. A lot of wannabe “elitist” guilds who are in love with their own hype are less than friendly, polite and/or respectful toward those they perceive as lower then them and think they can do WTF they want specially because it isn’t formally interdicted. So, from my perspective at least, there is a reversal of role here.

Linghy.2031:

People are idiots. “Uplevels are a liability”, kitten . Genuine lunacy. They’re a ranged asset, and they’re certainly not going to get to the point where they can get more involved after this sort of toxicity. I do understand an untagged guild group being worried about a sub-60 being targeted and rallying any downed, but as above “they better be kittening polite about it”.

Sadly, quite a few are not polite at all when they “ask”, if we can even call it that. Too often it sounds more like: “go away”.

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying.

And now we’re just kittening.

If that swimming pool happen to be the scene of a swimming competition, would you still just go “Cannonball!!!” and jump in?

I dont know what the guild was doing, nor do I care. A raid is a raid and pugging is pugging. The two only mix if the raidleader want them to.

I think you just don’t want to accept the fact that WvW is a competition that is opened to ALL. This isn’t the Olympic were there was pre-selection by your kitten raidleader. You are at war with 2 other servers, and just like in the army you didn’t chose the huge majority of your fellow soldiers. You fight beside them and you die beside them. Nothing prevent you from being a lot closer to your buddies though. What is this control freak mentality anyway. Go do SPvP if it annoys you so much! You can chose who you want to fight with there. Yeah, I know you are limited to teams of 5 but that still doesn’t make it legitimate to behave like a kitten to others and try to hijack the game.

Dawdler.8521:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

So basicly what you’re saying is that you can do whatever you want and have every right to play with whomever you want whether they want to play with you or not, but other players dont have that right.

I… dont really think I argue with that.

I think you have quite a loaded answer here. Nobody forces you to be best buddies and take them in your party. However, yes, they sure as hell can run where they want the same way you also can. The way WvW matches are done are based on servers, not pre-selections. Anyway, just think about it for one whole second. What can you do to prevent someone from following you? You can try to loose them by using wp, but it’s nothing like a guarantee of anything even in the short run. It’s the same reality as when you go to the public swimming pool. You can go there with friends, but you won’t be alone and you can’t say to others what to do as long as they behave within the frame of the context they are. It’s the same for them. Maybe WvW isn’t for you if you find that unjust or annoying. Again, you team is the server, not your guild.

BTW for the one above saying that being tagless or not is relevant, well, it’s not. It doesn’t change a kitten thing about all that I’ve said above.

Deathcon.5903:

Xyonon.3987:

I hope they increase it’s damage overall, but fix that godkitten FGS. Really, An Ele is nothing more than a FGS delivery right now.

Try playing Mesmer then and you would never say soemthing so silly. Elementist are much more than a FGS delivery system, they have a role in every game mode.

Very true. This is also why I like Ele so much. No matter the setting, you are always relevant and useful. Also, the play style is very rewarding. I personally don’t use the FGS all that often myself to be honest and my presence is definitely not trivial far from it.

You can choose who’s on your team in sPvP now?! Last time I checked, a majority of the matches where randoms being played.

I play at least once or twice in tournament mode each week and we choose our 5 team members…

You must not live a good life if you can’t do the same.

Anyway, the “reality of the matter” is that anyone that isnt 80 in full exotic (or better) is a serious liability to an organized group. It doesnt matter what server you play on. Upscaling in GW2 is not good enough to allow sub 80 to be played in any kind of competetive manner. Sure you can pug zerg – anyone can pug zerg. Hell you can even roam and hope to face equal upscales (or just very bad players of course). If you want that, go to EB and join the chaos. Borders are often where guilds raid and want to stay organized. Not that having pug zerg too hurt, its just that its always in EB but not always in borders due to coverage.

Yes, not everybody are equal. It’s to be expected and it is the same reality for all servers. It is part of WvW reality and the game permit it. There is even a mechanic to “adapt” characters below 80. They could have prevent anybody not lvl 80 to participate, yet, they chose the other option. Why do you think? The uplevel is legitimate, you not wanting him in that setting is not.

If you ask a guild group and they say “no, we dont want you following us” then kitten respect that. If you still follow them then YOU are being unfriendly, not them. You are literally trolling them. They do not owe you any kind of “help”. You can cry all you want about the big mean boys not letting you play with them, it wont change the fact that organized raiding happen in this game and they generally dont want pugs following them. With the way the downed system works, the difference between victory and defeat in a 20vs20 slugfest can be a single player going down at the wrong time. The age old quote that a chain is no stronger than the weakest link apply to GW2 as well.

If a guild ask me to not follow them, and it has happen again this week, I will usually respect that. However, they better be kittening polite about it or else I’m going to enjoy trolling their shadow till next Christmas and actively seeking them on all maps just for the principle of it.

They are not in their right to ask such a thing PERIOD. Them obtaining such a grace is all on the other player’s good will. And even so, that group shows little respect to begin with by wanting to exclude itself from other players while strongly implying that player is a nuisance to their team. IMO, they are in a pretty bad spot to ask for respect in the first place. The point in WvW that some Guild seem to conveniently forget is that their team is not their guild, but their server.

Its not even a WvW thing. If you got 4 Warriors asking for a 5th member in mapchat to run CoF with them and a level 60 Ranger goes “Me me me me I want to learn this Cough thing!!”… uh… no.

Well, the party search tool let you the option to be picky, the WvW offers you no such thing. That is about all you have to know… Beside, I’m among those who feel it’s their responsibility to play the role of teacher some times. How often did I accompany a pure PUG group in all 4 paths of Arah just to give them a chance to do it once. You of course don’t have to do such a thing, but don’T assume everybody is a kitten.

I too hope for better reasons not to go full arcane and water. It could be a good change to have more viable fire magic builds that are as attractive as arcane and water.

It is indeed the same on all servers, but it doesn’t make it any more ok. The “rallybot” excuse to “justify” the exclusion of someone is just pathetic to me. The reality of the matter is, you can’t choose who is in your team like you could in PvP. Live with it or go away yourselves instead of trying to repel all others when you can’t do such a thing anyway.

The good news is not everybody playing WvW is a complete kitten who think he is the next best thing since slice bread. You simply have to learn who they are and play with them while learning to use your middle fingers for those who can only understand this level of interaction. Don’t let these bad experiences deter you from the game. Anyway, even if the poor imbecile who told you and your friend to not follow them was to shout non-stop at you fact is he can’T do squat about it save wp and hope to be be left alone. These people don’t belong in WvW, they belong in GW1 GvG. They forget that it is a server effort, not a guild only effort. The moment you want to exclude someone on your server you should seriously think about quitting yourself.

Not always apparently since we were blue and despite finishing last for 2 weeks we ended-up being green this week. But yeah, usually it’s like you said.

To help the mechanic being less unfair and ultimately more competitive maybe loosing objectives while being “outnumbered” wouldn’t reset the upgrades on it. So once you take it back it is claimed just as it was before being taken.

Also, they could easily modify the formula to calculate the score at each thick so that it would award only a proportional % of the usual points for each servers. This way low hours for your server would be far less damaging to the overall score.

The easiest I can think of would be siege weapon skin that you can activate in a similar way you activate/deactivate a finisher. They already have some skins in uses for Dolyack and catapult throwing gifts for Christmas. They could just go wild with the idea…

That being said, there isn’t that much that is exclusive to PVE in the store anyway. A lot of what is sold is just as viable in all part of the game. If WvW is successful in keeping their players, it mean it keep them as possible customers too. We see a lot of people in WvW who use skins that were on sale in the store. Boosters are also just as good.

But, yeah, they could add more specific stuff to WvW.

Another idea I just thought of would be NPC skins to claimed resources. Why not have garden gnomes to build your tower’s walls?

displayname.8315:

nearlight.3064:

Sometimes, my guild will have GvG practice nights in EBG, where we only run with 15 people that are on the GvG team or backups for it and we work on basic strategies like movement, recovery, and coordinating bombs and whatnot. During these nights, which are only once or twice per week, we fight other guilds we come across in open field and don’t actively siege other structures, unless theres a lot of guilds in SM trying to take it, we might go there to fight them. Do you view this as a problem too? And typically its on weeknights where little to no queue exists on SoS NA for EBG anyway.

And also OP, what would you suggest that guilds do when the OS is in use? Just wait until its available? And considering we’re in T2 servers where most GvGs happen, thats unrealistic as 30 people (15 each side) can’t really be available for GvGs all night waiting their “turn” at the OS.

It’s been said a few times on this thread. The 2 servers that are doing the GvG should go to server # 3’s borderland. Windmill is a good spot.. south island is pretty nice. There the will not troll their own server by preventing play in their homeland.

And if possible avoid rush hours… but even if just doing what you suggested here and before, it would show a modicum of respect and thinking.

Valdemas.4960:

How on earth did this old topic get 4 pages in this short time is beyond me. Well played OP.

For one, I’m rather new on the forum so what is old to you doesn’t really feel old to me. Also, if this topic still come to haunt you today chances are it’s because the problem hasn’t been resolved and trying to avoid tackling it won’t make it disappear.

gennyt.3428:

displayname.8315:

gennyt.3428:

@Sirbeaumerdier

Slap on the false dichotomy label if you want since there’s always the option to whine. But since we’re talking facts and reality and such, it remains that you cannot do anything to morph the priorities of others to match your own hence my suggestion of getting in where you fit in. Negative impact on what exactly? Let me guess, PPT. You’re operating under the assumption that everybody should care about it and those who do are somehow more important and non PPT related activities are somehow less than. That’s your main gripe. I’m saying it again, it’s selfish and short of breaking the TOS, people can do whatever they want, you are no more important than the guys doing the Dolyak parade or the twelve people hanging around a box of fun while others duel nearby, please deal with that.

So your ok with a servers guild (some are 40+ raiding force guilds) hosting these PvP events on their own servers home map thus blocking the rest of the server from being able to play? Who’s being selfish now? I’m sure this was not the intention when this event occured and they probably would try it elsewhere if they could next time but who’s the one really being selfish?

I thought I made that clear. Yes, queues aren’t fun but why get upset about it, it’s first come, first served just wait your turn to play. They paid like everybody else and they don’t owe anybody anything. The very second you start thinking people are taking up space or “blocking” anyone simply because they are on the map and have removed themselves from your approved activities is the moment that you’ve just face planted into the entitled zone. And arguing semantics about WvWvW not being a PvP zone just looks foolish as it’s a low grade derailment.

@Sirbeaumerdier

We’re comparing WvWvW to an actual sport now, with rules, regulations, controlled teams and arenas and /drumroll …balance? Please don’t. And then you go on to compare people actively sabotaging other players’ activities to players simply being on 24/7 opened map? Come on now.

1)Speaking of entitlements, paying for something, anything, doesn’t entitle anyone the right to do what the hell they want no matter the context. I’ve paid for my car and driver’s licence and I’m expected to stay on the road with my car not drive through your home with it just because I can.

2)It’s not because an analogy is imperfect that you can cast aside all that still apply to it. I think you got the point already. You don’t like it and are not very open to it, but you get it.

I’ll repeat it hopefully for the last time, I don’t want you guys to stop managing yourself a spot where you can have fun. I just want you to do so using your head and your heart. Doing GvG in prime time on any WvW map, for example, is not really respectful and well thought of.

gennyt.3428:

@Sirbeaumerdier

Slap on the false dichotomy label if you want since there’s always the option to whine. But since we’re talking facts and reality and such, it remains that you cannot do anything to morph the priorities of others to match your own hence my suggestion of getting in where you fit in. Negative impact on what exactly? Let me guess, PPT. You’re operating under the assumption that everybody should care about it and those who do are somehow more important and non PPT related activities are somehow less than. That’s your main gripe. I’m saying it again, it’s selfish and short of breaking the TOS, people can do whatever they want, you are no more important than the guys doing the Dolyak parade or the twelve people hanging around a box of fun while others duel nearby, please deal with that.

Yeah, sorry for my super naivety of somehow believing that a game designed with points would attract people who would be willing to pay attention to the score in the same way people playing hockey and being handed sticks would care about the puck and the goal. How silly of me of seeing a problem with people doing figure skating in the middle of an ongoing hockey game… How selfish of me to want to play hockey in a hockey match and whining about the harmless figure skaters sometimes taking up to 80% of the ice…

If people can do whatever they want I don’t want to see you whine if some decide trolling GvG becomes funnier all of a sudden. The “anything goes” argument goes both way. Reality is, you are hijacking a part of the game for something that was never intended since day 1 and we all knew it. I wish it would be different, but it is not. THAT is reality too. May A-Net give you guys your own arena. I myself would be glad to do GvG but as of right now it’s a delicate proposition that need to take care of others needs if you want them to care about yours. Now if you are tired of this thread let’s all stop replying and let it die for good.

My example was giving you a perspective you would understand to show that your request was selfish, and yes had I actually meant it, it would have been a selfish request from me as well. If you’re going to keep using the game mode as your main argument that GvGers are in the wrong I might as well play along, considering you are incapable of using any other argument. When a GvG guild is not GvGing they are a very valuable asset on the battlefield when it comes to PPT. They can fight better than pug blobs meaning they have an easier time defending and taking things. They often succeed where others fail. So let’s allow your “sharpest sword” to have some fun once in a while, because they make up for your small inconvenience by playing the PPT game the rest of the time.

Selfishness was not your initial point it was my logic and argument that you said fell flat. Also, I already told you that “I wasn’t telling you to go to another server. I was merely opening your dichotomic world a bit”.

As for your GvGers being a valuable asset, I fear you have missed the entire point of it all. It never was about winning or loosing at the end of the week, but about not putting others in a position were they can’t play or help when they could and would otherwise have. Can we please stop with the straw man already? What do I care that your “leet” guild save the day in the long run if it can mean we can’t play when there is GvG? I want to participate into my server’s efforts. If I win because of it it’s great, but I prefer loosing while being able to try helping than not being able to play and being saved in extremist by our so called “sharpest swords” (by whose standard btw?).

warriorjrd.8695:

Zetsumei.4975:

lol warriorjrd I feel for you man, can’t imagine how frustrating the lack of intelligence in this thread is for you

The frustration is quickly turning to pity as I realize these people lack and ability to understand common sense.

Wow, the irony…

warriorjrd.8695:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

warriorjrd.8695:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

gennyt.3428:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

snip
…

Is it something in the water?

I don’t mind them playing how the hell they want as long as they play for the kitten puck (war score). What is so kitten confusing about it that it has to be told and retold in every possible ways?

Aaaand this is where you’re whole argument falls flat. You keep going on about logic but are unable to see the direct contradiction in what you’re touting. You have a choice, transfer to a server where PPT is the utmost goal or deal with the fact that you can’t change what people care about. Trying to act like others are “taking up space” and deliberately obstructing your fun by doing their own thing that does not-does not, let me say it again, does not involve you and and likening it to situations where people directly set out to interfere in others’ activities(via a gvg troll guild) is self important to say the least.

I’m sorry but what kind of false dichotomy is this? My choices are a lot more than what you pretend and you also have these options too. One of these options was to discuss the matter, and I did. Another that was used to illustrate just how absurd the “anything goes” argument was is also another choice that I of course won’t use…

I’m not “trying to act like others are taking up space”, I state a fact. They are taking server space that can sometimes have a negative impact Like it or not it is a fact. I also can’t talked about how others view all this, I can only speak for myself. Sorry if that sounds too self-important. btw I never said it was anyone’s goal to have a negative impact on the “other” way to play the game. I know it’s a collateral impact of the GvG popularity. But it doesn’t change a kitten thing about anything that has been discussed.

I will also point out that none of what you say above explain how my argument falls flat. Beside, like I said before, wouldn’t it be FAR more intelligent to move GvG to a low pop server? Wouldn’t it minimize the risk of stepping on anybodies toes?

See there you go again with suggestions that don’t involve you because you’re selfish. Suggesting GvG guilds transfer to a low pop server is just like me telling you to transfer to a server with no queues so that you will always be able to defend your precious objectives. GvG guilds don’t only GvG, they want your pug blobs to farm as well, otherwise how else will we pay for all the bling bling and hip new fashions?

Now I’m selfish… I was expecting you to explain what part of my argument fell flat. I guess I won’t hold my breath. BTW. I wasn’t telling you to go to another server. I was merely opening your dichotomic world a bit. Also, if I’m selfish for saying the exact same thing you told me, what does that make you?

I gave that as an example, do you even read before you post? And yes it’s selfish to expect those who don’t play the same way as you to just leave, when they have just as much right as you do to be there.

My point, since you missed it, was that your “example” is not supporting what you say it does. There are no contradiction in what I’ve said. I only add a frame to that freedom. A frame that is there anyway at that and that is called WvW and is won with points and uses structures and sieges. In other words, the game as a puck included in it whether you like it or not. As for me being selfish, you therefore agree that you were selfish too to tell me to go somewhere where PPT was king right? Right?

warriorjrd.8695:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

gennyt.3428:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

snip
…

Is it something in the water?

I don’t mind them playing how the hell they want as long as they play for the kitten puck (war score). What is so kitten confusing about it that it has to be told and retold in every possible ways?

Aaaand this is where you’re whole argument falls flat. You keep going on about logic but are unable to see the direct contradiction in what you’re touting. You have a choice, transfer to a server where PPT is the utmost goal or deal with the fact that you can’t change what people care about. Trying to act like others are “taking up space” and deliberately obstructing your fun by doing their own thing that does not-does not, let me say it again, does not involve you and and likening it to situations where people directly set out to interfere in others’ activities(via a gvg troll guild) is self important to say the least.

I’m sorry but what kind of false dichotomy is this? My choices are a lot more than what you pretend and you also have these options too. One of these options was to discuss the matter, and I did. Another that was used to illustrate just how absurd the “anything goes” argument was is also another choice that I of course won’t use…

I’m not “trying to act like others are taking up space”, I state a fact. They are taking server space that can sometimes have a negative impact Like it or not it is a fact. I also can’t talked about how others view all this, I can only speak for myself. Sorry if that sounds too self-important. btw I never said it was anyone’s goal to have a negative impact on the “other” way to play the game. I know it’s a collateral impact of the GvG popularity. But it doesn’t change a kitten thing about anything that has been discussed.

I will also point out that none of what you say above explain how my argument falls flat. Beside, like I said before, wouldn’t it be FAR more intelligent to move GvG to a low pop server? Wouldn’t it minimize the risk of stepping on anybodies toes?

See there you go again with suggestions that don’t involve you because you’re selfish. Suggesting GvG guilds transfer to a low pop server is just like me telling you to transfer to a server with no queues so that you will always be able to defend your precious objectives. GvG guilds don’t only GvG, they want your pug blobs to farm as well, otherwise how else will we pay for all the bling bling and hip new fashions?

Now I’m selfish… I was expecting you to explain what part of my argument fell flat. I guess I won’t hold my breath. BTW. I wasn’t telling you to go to another server. I was merely opening your dichotomic world a bit. Also, if I’m selfish for saying the exact same thing you told me, what does that make you?

gennyt.3428:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

snip
…

Is it something in the water?

I don’t mind them playing how the hell they want as long as they play for the kitten puck (war score). What is so kitten confusing about it that it has to be told and retold in every possible ways?

Aaaand this is where you’re whole argument falls flat. You keep going on about logic but are unable to see the direct contradiction in what you’re touting. You have a choice, transfer to a server where PPT is the utmost goal or deal with the fact that you can’t change what people care about. Trying to act like others are “taking up space” and deliberately obstructing your fun by doing their own thing that does not-does not, let me say it again, does not involve you and and likening it to situations where people directly set out to interfere in others’ activities(via a gvg troll guild) is self important to say the least.

I’m sorry but what kind of false dichotomy is this? My choices are a lot more than what you pretend and you also have these options too. One of these options was to discuss the matter, and I did. Another that was used to illustrate just how absurd the “anything goes” argument was is also another choice that I of course won’t use…

I’m not “trying to act like others are taking up space”, I state a fact. They are taking server space that can sometimes have a negative impact Like it or not it is a fact. I also can’t talked about how others view all this, I can only speak for myself. Sorry if that sounds too self-important. btw I never said it was anyone’s goal to have a negative impact on the “other” way to play the game. I know it’s a collateral impact of the GvG popularity. But it doesn’t change a kitten thing about anything that has been discussed.

I will also point out that none of what you say above explain how my argument falls flat. Beside, like I said before, wouldn’t it be FAR more intelligent to move GvG to a low pop server? Wouldn’t it minimize the risk of stepping on anybodies toes?

warriorjrd.8695:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

warriorjrd.8695:

displayname.8315:

Tibstrike.2974:

If you are really worried about the war score lost over an hour or two during the week then your sever is already going to lose.

Servers that play to win don’t let you just re upgrade everything after its lost. You have to be quick and fight hard after a loss like that.

If you can’t defend a waypointed objective with the remaining players in a queued map, that’s you doing something wrong, not the guilds fault. I have watched waypointed things be held with 10 people again zone blobs, so I think it’s time to brush up on your arrow cart skills, and practice your aim with the treb shots.

Great logic again! Because all fights are played the same way each times and your opponents never adapt. Yeah, I too have held huge zergs at bay with well placed sieges and good cooperation. But you know what? There is a lot of things you don’t control in this chaos and I also experimented the opposite of being part of the larger force being wiped by the better playing opponent.

Stop minimizing all your opponent is saying and start being honest with yourself a bit.

Dude… just leave the topic already, you bring nothing logical forward, only constant babbling. A GvG doesn’t even take up half of the map population, and if it’s queued that give you more than 50% to deal with. If you cant defend a waypointed objective with that force, you probably wouldn’t do any better even if that guild wasn’t GvGing. You’re supposed to be able to defend T3 objective outnumbered, so do it and stop crying.

And can you all stop pretending this happens every 10 minutes. GvG’s happen somewhat frequently depending where you play, yet there aren’t complaints every time somebody GvG’s. Mostly because when they do happen they are in OS. Having a proper GvG in a bl in an anomaly these days, i’ve already explained that to you but you seem to ignore that fact.

I’m going to say it one last time. Guilds always try and GvG in OS. If they don’t GvG there, it’s because they CAN’T. So unfortunately, on the rare chance two GvG’s are happening simultaneously, you are going to be slightly shorthanded on 1 border, for less than 2 hours. One time, one border, less than two hours, in a matchup that lasts 168 hours. 0.8% of the matchup time is affected by this GvG that lasts less than two hours. And because "im not in T2 NA’ it’s 2% when this GvG lasts 4 hours.

So tell me again how big of an issue this is.

Speaking of irony… why don’t you follow your own advice? The “logic” you bring forward is that having 20, 50, or 80% more potential people is irrelevant to repelling attacks to defend important objectives… I’m still trying to figure that one out.

Beside, WHO and WHEN has ANYBODY ever said it was happening all the time? Take your time and quote me (or someone else in thread) plz. I even explicitly said the opposite of what you say we have said. I will repeat it again, it has happened (not always far from it) and with the trend I see on T2 it won’t get better soon.

If I have sometimes felt the need to be vocal on the topic it’s because we were, SOMETIMES, needlessly left with a way shorter end of the stick than what you try to paint.

Chaba.5410:

pdavis.8031:

I was pulling arbitrary numbers for an illustration. Even so You can’t count those not logged in, or engaged in GvG. You can only count the number of people you have that are on the map, AND are not invloved in GvG. So whatever number that would be is the only number of people you can count on and plan accordingly for.

OK. Well it sounded like an arbitrary number not reflective of the T2 NA Prime experience. A better number would be 80% “at the fights” and 20% the rest on the map.

BTW, It is extremely ironic that the OP is from the server that zerged FABL when it was queued.

Irony is a universal constant :P

warriorjrd.8695:

displayname.8315:

Tibstrike.2974:

If you are really worried about the war score lost over an hour or two during the week then your sever is already going to lose.

Servers that play to win don’t let you just re upgrade everything after its lost. You have to be quick and fight hard after a loss like that.

If you can’t defend a waypointed objective with the remaining players in a queued map, that’s you doing something wrong, not the guilds fault. I have watched waypointed things be held with 10 people again zone blobs, so I think it’s time to brush up on your arrow cart skills, and practice your aim with the treb shots.

Great logic again! Because all fights are played the same way each times and your opponents never adapt. Yeah, I too have held huge zergs at bay with well placed sieges and good cooperation. But you know what? There is a lot of things you don’t control in this chaos and I also experimented the opposite of being part of the larger force being wiped by the better playing opponent.

Stop minimizing all your opponent is saying and start being honest with yourself a bit.

nearlight.3064:

Okay this thread is getting a little out of hand. At first the OP was nice and polite, but now hes gotten quite agressive about this. Plus he ignored my last post on this thread that frames this situation quite nicely.

But whatever, people don’t like their beliefs to be argued with. Anyway OP, this thread will accomplish nothing because nothing you ever say or do will be enough to sway those like myself that are in favor of GvGs.

No kidding! The OP was nice at first… I wonder why he ’s starting to loose his cool and barely manage to answer everybody… (where is the sarcasm EMote plz)

pdavis.8031:

@Sirbeaumerdier

I never stated it doesn’t have an impact. In fact I’ve shown it DOES have an impact. Also I never said I do GvG. And if you have a portion of the group unwilling to participate, the only thing they do is take up space so you cannot consider them in any of the “war efforts”. You can effectivly remove them from any calculations/strategies because they are null. If you have 100 people, and 20 people are not invloved, you effectily have 80 people to work with, and must plan accordingly.

I’m not trying to rationalize GvGers in BLs. I am trying to point out that there are ways to work around the GvGers, and with the GvGers, without enforcing or prefering one playstyle over another. I am trying to offer solutions to a percieved problem.

I think you have understood the position I’ve presented at this point. I leave the rest to you. See you all on the battle field hopefully in better disposition toward each others.

geekanerd.4123:

As a brief aside to some comments I saw earlier: It only takes a handful of dedicated trolls to ruin a gvg. I know, because a few gvgs I’ve been in have been targets. A large group that was bent on interrupting a gvg? kitten, I don’t care how much posturing anybody does or how good they think their guild is, ya’ll just better relocate because the fight isn’t going to happen at its current local. Besides, it’s not the red trolls you have to worry about; it’s the green ones. And I’ve yet to see even the best skill groups wipe people on their own server. That would be kitten ed impressive, though.

That was my point too. Half the people wouldn’t even be able to lay a finger on their rebellious “allies”. Still, me saying the things I’ve said wasn’t meant as a threat, but as a way to forcefully help some to get their head out of the @$$.

pdavis.8031:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

pdavis.8031:

Yes, and it would appear that GvG in a BL map, while the others are doing stuff isn’t really an issue, as the others are helping increase the world score. And the GvGers are temporary, so it’s a minor set back, but nothing that I would consider game breaking, or should be stopped.

I’m sorry but people who play GvG have no intentions of increasing the world score. They couldn’t care less about it. Many are quite vocal, and proud, about it actually.

Beside, what you say doesn’t make a lot of sense. GvG not being an issue because “others” do the job you won’t is plain nonsensical. If 2 servers bring 20 people plus friends + random spectators the third server has that BL served on a plate and any possible reinforcements are being given the middle finger.

I’m not saying it’s an issue all the time, but it has and if the trend grows, it will again. Denial is not a solution.

So my argument is nonsensical? How? If you have a group of people, and say 20% are not participating in an activity, and some feel that they should, there is still 80% of the group willing to participate. The job is still getting done. Does it make it more difficult for the 80%? Sure. Can it still be done? Of course. Also throw in another group who sole function is to destroy what the 80% is working on does make it harder. But that means the 80% needs to change its strategy to compensate. Thus the 20% don’t really matter because they have no desire to participate. It’s similar to having to carry a semi AFK bearbow ranger in blues and greens in Arah. They are pretty much useless. You can still do the full dungeon, but it’s going to be a bit harder. (of course this is not considering the kick ability)

Yes it is nonsensical. From the go you voluntarily remove yourself from the war efforts and pretend it has no significant impact for others. It’s absurd. It has an impact and it can get much higher than 20% some times. But even if we do leave it at 20% the idea remain unchanged. Claiming, or implying, it changes nothing is pure nonsense. Math 101 disagree with you a lot.

Look, it’s one thing to say you will GvG no matter what, but it’s quite another to try and rationalize the thing the way you do to feel better about it. All I ask is you use your head, and heart, when you want to organize these events.

As a side note, wouldn’t it be FAR preferable to all transfer to very low pop servers instead of shoehorning yourselves into a T2 environments? The probability of disturbing WvW activities would be FAR less no? My 2 cents.

pdavis.8031:

Yes, and it would appear that GvG in a BL map, while the others are doing stuff isn’t really an issue, as the others are helping increase the world score. And the GvGers are temporary, so it’s a minor set back, but nothing that I would consider game breaking, or should be stopped.

I’m sorry but people who play GvG have no intentions of increasing the world score. They couldn’t care less about it. Many are quite vocal, and proud, about it actually.

Beside, what you say doesn’t make a lot of sense. GvG not being an issue because “others” do the job you won’t is plain nonsensical. If 2 servers bring 20 people plus friends + random spectators the third server has that BL served on a plate and any possible reinforcements are being given the middle finger.

I’m not saying it’s an issue all the time, but it has and if the trend grows, it will again. Denial is not a solution.

pdavis.8031:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

pdavis.8031:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Wait, I’m confused. You don’t mind that people are playing how they want, you don’t mind they are having fun, but their way of having fun is interfering with your fun and would like them to take it elsewhere because of queing issues? I’m just trying to understand your point…

Is it something in the water?

I don’t mind them playing how the hell they want as long as they play for the kitten puck (war score). What is so kitten confusing about it that it has to be told and retold in every possible ways?

However I would say that GvG even in BLs would actually be helpful. They are specially quipped and trained to deal with zergs. So instead why not work WITH them? If they are intercepting zergs, other guilds or not, you can go and take points. Gather a point capturing group and go cap points while the GvGers deal with the other zergs/GvGers? If the enemy zerg is occupied, they aren’t capping points, or defending, making it easier for your group to capture them. It seems that in general you are upset, not about server ques, but that others aren’t playing how you expect them to. Go get a commander tag, and organize WITH the GvGers and go do what you have fun doing. And in the end everyone wins.

Oh for crying out loud will you ppl learn to read…

The point is they won’t try to intercept any zerg at all. In fact if you so much as approach the sacred zone where GvG is “hosted” you will swiftly be told to go away and mind your own business. Woe to anyone who would drop a meteor in the middle of it… As if the enemy being a hitable target with capping potential was not “my business” in that context.

I bolded the part wherein the confusion lies. You don’t mind how people play how they want as long as they play for the score. It’s a major contradiction. You’re saying (my intreptation) that you can do whatever, BUT it must be according to how you believe it should be done.

Also as far as guilds telling you off, it may have been your approach. Based on this thread, I can only assume it came across as hostile. Something along the lines of “If you aren’t going to cap points, then take your GvG elsewhere.” I would suggest, again, maybe working with them instead of against them. Maybe something like “Hey, I get you are doing your GvG thing, and thats fine, but would you consider also running zerg interferance when you are finished? It would really help our server out and maybe we can win this one.” Out of the larger guilds I’ve encountered, the leaders (who would likely be heading up such events anyway) aren’t general kittens, and are actually very reasonable people who might respond in kind.

Well, to retake my hockey game analogy, as long as you play the puck and ultimately help it get closer to the goal in a respectful way I don’t mind if you choose to escort Dolyak, repair stuff, zerg, roam or whatever new innovative, but in line with the spirit of the game, way you think of. It’s when the number of ppl who refuse to play the puck become so great that I’m starting to feel like the game is being hijacked.

So large scale battles as a guild, vs another guild, is not in the spirit of WvW? But zerging to a point, capping it, zerging to the next point, capping it, ad infinitfum, while an enemy zerg (or 2) follow behind and retake those same points is? While I can see why you would be frustrated while a GvG is going on and messing up the map que, you have to remember that the same thing is happening on the opposing server. If there is a guild fielding say 100 people for GvG, that leaves 50 others to do whatever. Same with the opposing server, if they are fielding 100 GvGers, then they only have 50 to do whatever. Why not take advantage of it? Theres a much smaller chance of running into a large zerg, so you can quietly and quickly take multiple camps/towers/etc. while the GvG is going on. Then when it’s finished, people come back on and Hey!! you already have half the map claimed! And now you can rain hurt upon the enemy.

Are your actions aimed at helping increase your world score? You have your answer.

pdavis.8031:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Wait, I’m confused. You don’t mind that people are playing how they want, you don’t mind they are having fun, but their way of having fun is interfering with your fun and would like them to take it elsewhere because of queing issues? I’m just trying to understand your point…

Is it something in the water?

I don’t mind them playing how the hell they want as long as they play for the kitten puck (war score). What is so kitten confusing about it that it has to be told and retold in every possible ways?

However I would say that GvG even in BLs would actually be helpful. They are specially quipped and trained to deal with zergs. So instead why not work WITH them? If they are intercepting zergs, other guilds or not, you can go and take points. Gather a point capturing group and go cap points while the GvGers deal with the other zergs/GvGers? If the enemy zerg is occupied, they aren’t capping points, or defending, making it easier for your group to capture them. It seems that in general you are upset, not about server ques, but that others aren’t playing how you expect them to. Go get a commander tag, and organize WITH the GvGers and go do what you have fun doing. And in the end everyone wins.

Oh for crying out loud will you ppl learn to read…

The point is they won’t try to intercept any zerg at all. In fact if you so much as approach the sacred zone where GvG is “hosted” you will swiftly be told to go away and mind your own business. Woe to anyone who would drop a meteor in the middle of it… As if the enemy being a hitable target with capping potential was not “my business” in that context.

I bolded the part wherein the confusion lies. You don’t mind how people play how they want as long as they play for the score. It’s a major contradiction. You’re saying (my intreptation) that you can do whatever, BUT it must be according to how you believe it should be done.

Also as far as guilds telling you off, it may have been your approach. Based on this thread, I can only assume it came across as hostile. Something along the lines of “If you aren’t going to cap points, then take your GvG elsewhere.” I would suggest, again, maybe working with them instead of against them. Maybe something like “Hey, I get you are doing your GvG thing, and thats fine, but would you consider also running zerg interferance when you are finished? It would really help our server out and maybe we can win this one.” Out of the larger guilds I’ve encountered, the leaders (who would likely be heading up such events anyway) aren’t general kittens, and are actually very reasonable people who might respond in kind.

Well, to retake my hockey game analogy, as long as you play the puck and ultimately help it get closer to the goal in a respectful way I don’t mind if you choose to escort Dolyak, repair stuff, zerg, roam or whatever new innovative, but in line with the spirit of the game, way you think of. It’s when the number of ppl who refuse to play the puck become so great that I’m starting to feel like the game is being hijacked.

Chaba.5410:

There’s a few different discussions going on here.

On FA the event was a map queue on FABL. Defenders were trying to respond to a 30-man zerg but there was a queue because of one or several GvGs and their audience was large. I wasn’t there, but according to the report, no one watching the GvG responded so it ended up being 10 defenders against a 30-man zerg (notice that the GvG guilds were not tying up this zerg?). Most GvG guilds are responsive to defense events like that because they love large fights. So some of the posts seen on this thread are about what happened on FABL and asking guilds to consider avoiding the home BL for GvG. That’s how it was done pre-OS during the golden days of GvG and is not an unreasonable request.

The OP though is not on FA and is talking about something that happened on his server in EBG. FA didn’t really have a problem with it since our concern is more about the home bl being queued.

What hasn’t been spoken about here yet is that there are a select few guilds, which I won’t name here, that have gone out of their way to be hostile towards those that are playing the PPT game. Everyone asks for respect for their preferred game mode and typically it works in a begrudging way but respect is also earned and goes both ways. Echoing nearlight, asking anything of these specific guilds will be pointless. The sandbox nature of WvW simply means that these trolls can and will be trolled back since talk with them is pointless. So please be aware that the majority of GvG guilds are not like that and do give some consideration for the rest of the players on their servers.

Rest assured that I’m fully aware that the huge majority of people playing, GvG or otherwise, are of good will and intentions. I appreciate a response like your here since it seeks to address the point and does so with respect rather than belittle the things that are said.

I don’t seek to banish GvG. Far from it. I only wish people to be considerate toward others and the consequences their presence in time and space can have on the WvW game. There is also a growing attitude problem though…

nearlight.3064:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Sorry but no, just no. Is straw man your only way to argue ppl? I NEVER EVER said anything remotely close to “everyone in the map has to be actively contributing towards PPT 24/7”. This is pure BS. I’m merely saying, be mindful of the impact your play style has on the game. It wasn’t particularly fun to be queue on EBG only to find out that several guilds were doing their little business without PPting at all.

So let me try to understand this, you may have never said that everyone has to contribute to PPT all the time, but you also feel despondent when you can’t get into a map when guilds aren’t PPTing? If we’re not supposed to PPT all the time, what else is there to do, run around in circles and have picnics with hylek in EBG?

That sounds like a direct contradiction to me.

And yeah your hypothetical GvG busting guild, even if it did get formed, wouldn’t amount to anything more than a single drop in a limitless ocean.

Unless you are in a WvW server 24/7 I don’t even see how your stance make any sense. If you play 20 min on WvW server do your best for the home team. Is it that hard to understand?

If I’m feeling the need to make a thread about it, it’s because the phenomenon is starting to take some hard to ignore proportion at times. At least iddle people will be kicked after 10 min… people hijacking the hockey match to do figure skating won’t.

warriorjrd.8695:

Jeez, this thread is still alive. I though it was pretty much finished yesterday, but I guess not. Wasn’t the OP “Done” now too, I recall him saying that maybe 3 or four times, yet he still thinks he can make a valid point by replying. Just end it. I though I summed it up quite nicely when I said “There is literally nothing you could ever do about it, so don’t waste your breath”, but I guess the message wasn’t received.

I’m done trying to change people’s mind about it all. However there are limit at letting others putting words in your mouth. It help to close the issue when others also let it go. But no, they had to fill my mouth with anything but what I actually said…