Guild Wars 2

Acelerion.6820:

Careful Tuluum, I dont want to have to get the mods involved

nono, nononono. its ok man, dont do that. lets all just calm down, and not make any rash decisions. no one needs to get hurt.

It was a kitten peace offering. (drum in background: buh bum tish!)

Acelerion.6820:

Dude Im vegan

Im not.

And, a preemptive gift to you for making the daring feat of speaking with me:

@Ace;

I said to you:

My stock of bacon is starting to run low. Can I have some from you?

OINK

@Pixie (mind if I call you that?);

hahahaha!

I didnt even notice the name until I read through the entire post! That made it even better.

I know not everyone got to read what I wrote about them, which makes me sad

It is now apparently a dangerous game to communicate with me. Beware!

edit: And seriously, what is up with the whole Trahearne thing? It seemed really jarring to me as part of the story. Literally everything about the character bothers me.

pixieish.9627:

Eh, after putting up with annoyances as SWTOR and Planetside 2, everything (aside from Trahearne) in GW2 is pretty agreeable with me, even up to putting up with Kaineg gobbling up everything in sight thanks to some overhyped guild that couldn’t handle tier one, and minced down to Tier 8 for some odd reason.

(It just doesn’t put me into a venomous rage that cheap lightassault bouncing around in a huge barely defended base, a pvp system that thinks a preformed group full of jedi should be matched against a group of pugs full of newbies, or datacrons did. Frelling datacrons.)

I wanted to like Planetside 2.. I really did. I just couldnt get into it though. And after playing in all of the betas for SWTOR, I knew it wasnt for me. I wanted it to be, since KOTOR is one of my favorite games of all time, but.. SWTOR just felt wrong to me. For whatever sense that may make.

Oh, and pixie, I said to you:

Please stop being reasonable and easy to deal with on messageboards. This is the internet, after all.

Or, basically that. :P

Alright, alright! Im calling uncle! Please stop beating me up big bro!

Anyone know the limits on infractions?

I hope someone got to read what I wrote.

It was fun writing it.

Darn buggy forums, gettin all up in mah formattin >:(

Thats an awesome picture melodey! Kudos

Attic.1562:

Tuluum.9638:

One time, I fought off the Jabberwocky, Zhaitan, 300 risen, bigfoot, 3.5 yetis, a chicken, a six foot tall midget, and a werecar for 30 years straight.

True story.

A 3.5 yeti is only CR 3 man. That’s not very impressive. Hell, even the werecar probably maxes out at CR 7.

Well, I will admit they were the easiest. It was the teamwork and coordination between them all that was so brutal. That chicken… devastating.

hyjaxxx.1584:

ok ! clearly shenanigans! Bigfoot and Yeti are the same thing! your illusion has been shattered! hehe.

…and i have a fraps to prove it! 8P

To the layman, they may appear to be the same.. but environmental differences are truly profound. Itd be like calling a Korean, Japanese. The Large Ape Nation would be offended by your lack of sensitivity and ignorance.

:D

Gab Superstar.4059:

We held IoJ Hills for 20+ hours, twice, while fully upgrading it and being outmanned 50% of the time.

I think you should work on your defense.

One time, I fought off the Jabberwocky, Zhaitan, 300 risen, bigfoot, 3.5 yetis, a chicken, a six foot tall midget, and a werecar for 30 years straight.

True story.

@Lepew;

Simply put, I would much rather Anets resources be put into fixing it than exploring and verifying which reports are valid or not.

We can argue for eternity on what we feel is more effective, but in the end, its all situational anyway. For me, I like diversity and utilizing every tool and option at my disposal. For others, it is using what they perceive as the “best” every single time. Different strokes, and all that. I never look for “sure things,” because I dont feel it exists really. I look at things in terms of percentages and ways to increase those percentages in my teams favor. Not everyone does though, and thats certainly fine.

Ill report if I know a hack/exploit is currently happening.

I have only leveled six classes to 80, but I have stuck with the ranger at this point.

Yes, I am weird. It just works for me better than other classes.

@Lepew;

Really, my point was just that reporting because of siege placement that might be indicative of an exploit isnt exactly what we should be doing. It also wasnt necessarily referring to the overall efficacy of the placement.

I dont find them particularly useful on walls, but gates. I also wouldnt be using them to cover catas, as catas arent all that great on gates. Normally, range is better for catas when hitting a gate. Nor do I think it is particularly useful for taking care of siege (though it does work for it to an extent). I also did not suggest placing it in the same area as any other siege, only that it is up against the wall.

The idea is more to control the flow in and out of the portal (specifically on objectives that only have one) as well as hitting people trying to repair the gate since it can cover the area at the same time. Its about diversification. You have one leg specialist traited warrior on an AC right along the wall, but also have some covering other areas. I wouldnt really suggest solely using a bunch of arrow carts in the same spot. Its about diversification of placement for the reasons you mention. It just allows for another placement that can make use of LoS, regardless of whether or not people will look for it.

Obviously, defenders will be looking to locate any and all siege. Think of it more like bait that can bite, and you have a better idea of what I am getting at. It can absolutely, 100% go unseen in some circumstances. But, if it isnt, you know exactly where people will be trying to get to first. In this way, you can cover the placement from afar with balis, etc with the idea that defenders will be going after it. These same balis can take care of those locked down with immobilize that are trying to get back inside. At the same time, it provides cover and control around the portal/gate area and is easily defendable by anyone near the gate.

I also tend to think that if you only use the “best” placement every single time, you become far, far too predictable and countering predictability is pretty easy.

Edit: Feel free to use it, not use it, whatever. My point wasnt about preference or efficacy, it was pointing out that it has completely legitimate uses beyond an exploit. So, reporting someone solely for legitimate siege placement is based on what may very well be false assumptions.

Lepew.7890:

So if you see someone in your zerg build one there, take their name please and report. I will do the same if I see anyone on my side doing it.

I cant say I agree with that.

It is a valid placement, hacks not included. A leg specialist traited warrior with one arrow cart can essentially lock down movement in and out of the gate, as well as damage anyone who tries to repair the gate. It allows the siege to be placed directly near the mass of people, making it easier to defend, and it also takes advantage of LoS to the extent that it can even go unseen by the defenders (though it doesnt happen much). Beyond that, it also forces defenders to jump up on the lip of the wall to hit it, making it easier to pull them off and then be consequently locked down so they cant re-enter. Its efficacy in these regards is situational, but there are valid reasons to use such placement beyond hacks.

By giving the entitlement generation generalization claim attention, I think we do nothing but perpetuate the cycle we are criticizing.

It has little to do with the topic at hand, or how the OP can either grow to love PvP in the form of WvW, or decide it simply is not for him. There are undoubtedly plenty of options to go with.

I think the best suggestion is to give it some time and patience. Skill does play a pretty darn big role in this games PvP, and that comes with experience and practice. Hope you find what you are looking for Paul.

Fallout.1798:

A response from Anet about this arrow cart problem would be a great help. Or even better, a fix. :/

I hope a fix is in the works as well. I looked into it a bit on youtube and was pretty surprised at just how easy it is to do everything from zoomhacks to map teleporting to flying to being able to go directly through walls. In a modern MMO, I find it to be pretty disappointing honestly.

But, to say it paints the entire server as cheaters is a huge generalization. You will find many that do not support this knowingly. I have seen questionable things from every single server DH has gone up against, but I dont go so far as to think it sullies the rep of the guild tag I see, much less the entire server. Thats just me though, and thats all any of us does; communicate our own perspective.

Oozo.7856:

Well, some people on DH are doing it. It won’t change the outcome of the match, but it ruins the fun for those who have invested time and effort into building defensive siege only to have it taken out by cheaters.

I agree, something like that is downright frustrating. I just wanted to communicate that I see valid reasons for such placement, but it certainly doesnt mean that there arent those who exploit in various different ways including zoomhacks, teleporting, etc. I suspect that I may have even helped build some of those ACs that were exploited, but like I said, I also see valid reasoning behind the positioning of such siege as well. Its impossible to determine if another is using an exploit like this unless they come right out and say it, and I prefer to give others the benefit of the doubt if I have no proof. Even pictures and videos can be doctored (DRed? :P) to suit someones personal agenda, so I question the validity of them as well. I have experienced some very interesting things in my life, and have learned that the extent to which some will go to prove their point and agenda truly knows no bounds.

Maybe I am just jaded at this point, but I have come to expect it in any online game. That does NOT mean I condone it, but all I can do is choose not to do it myself. I just dont like the generalizations that take place that accuse every DH player of doing this, whether directly or by insinuation. But, I do suppose that is supported by the system in GW2, where it is pretty much “faceless” opponents.

If you have serious issues with dying a lot, then PvP is not the droid you are looking for. In any game, really.

If you can get past it though, it provides an extremely dynamic experience. Some great advice has been given here. I have no doubt someone on your server can help show you the ropes. You cant expect to jump right into something in life and win without effort 100% of the time. Just takes time and patience to learn, but if you learn the concepts, they are transferable to pretty much any PvP experience. To be blunt, you might be overestimating your skill level.

Partunu.9845:

@Tuluum – Same here. Been in mmo’ish games since Meridian 59 beta ( not counting BBS or muds ), and have been going ever since. And, for the record, I did ask if you were on, but they didn’t know your user account name, and I didn’t know what your in game toon name was, so it was a missed opportunity for massive fun. I had a very long fight with Swindler, who beat us all, but won every thing else ( Nerf mesmers, buff me! )

Hey, I appreciate the thought Partunu!

You can see my account name to the right <- Though I know you know that! I am unclear if private messages can be sent cross server still. All I know is that I cant talk to some of my friends on TC anymore, but I dont know if thats a bug specific to me or if they clamped down on it due to abuse or whatever. I tend to keep to myself at this point, so most have no idea who I am. No one logs into my guild anymore, and I have been bugged from joining any others (though I did recently get a random invite, so maybe thats fixed).

For future reference, the character I run pretty much exclusively now is Sengularadi (Ranger). Though, my other characters are Tuluumen (ele), Oerbidal (engi), Hunivirs (necro), Kwaeczar (mes). Only one that isnt 80 is the mes. Seng used to be my thiefs name, but deleted that.

Oozo.7856:

As far as the arrow cart thing. I’ve seen arrow carts placed flush up against an outer wall (dead giveaway for exploiting a zoom hack or bug). I’ve also seen an arrow cart placed inside a wall and used for defense. Both I’ve seen this week, but not in earlier weeks. It has been someone or some people from DH that have been doing it.

It might be indicative of a hack/exploit, but I am not convinced it is a dead giveaway. Ill explain my reasoning;

If you place an AC in a position that can attack people trying to repair the gate, as well as defend against any rushes, it can be very effective. By placing it RIGHT by the wall, it minimizes LoS from defenders on the wall and can even go completely unseen sometimes while still providing damage and CC (especially with a leg specialist warrior at the controls). Placing it inside the wall might be viewed as exploitative as a leg specialist warrior that can lay down immobilize repeatedly with zero CD (at least when viewing each pulse of the AC attack), especially if you have a few of them. Both are not explicitly stated to be “cheating,” but it could be said they both take advantage of game mechanics in a way that developers might not have foreseen.

If you place a bali at distance, you can also defend the AC against any who try to melee it, though thats not particularly relevant to the discussion I suppose.

Partunu.9845:

Crazy and Gab are talking about 2 different fights, not the same one. I was at hills for 1 of those fights and it was as he stated. There were several screen shots, from different fights, showing the exploit in action, but Mods removed them, as they should. It just made a fun situation bad, and that’s all I have to say about it.

As far as ques, DH had no que for DRBL, but you did have a que for EB. So those on DH, that wanted to play in wvw, could come to our BL since it was available. We had a blast with people coming to our BL that were there to fight and actually play. My earlier post was about our mini fight club with Swindler and Co. People playing with other people, from all over the world ( Canada, US, Asia ), and it was AWESOME.

There is a very small minority, on every server I’d bet, that uses an unfair, read hack/exploit, advantage. Sooner or later Anet will weed them out and the game will be all the better for everyone. Anyone who favors hacks/exploits/bots has no place in an online game imho.

I was pretty sure they were My intent was to show how selective “listening” can allow ourselves to hear exactly what we want.

I agree about the hacking/exploits. Its too bad GW2 seems so easily hacked too. I know they say they do bans, etc, but have not seen evidence of this. Given that I have been playing these types of games since Ultima though, you kind of grow to grudgingly accept it as part and parcel of the experience. Same with unfair fights, numbers advantages, juvenile behavior, etc.

I have yet to take part in a fight club, might try it out sometime. Like I said before, Im not some elite player or anything. I have always expected everyone there would very likely beat me. Still might be fun though if I run across them.

Oozo.7856:

Tuluum.9638:

To the ranger from Baltimore Style, nice fight outside of SM. I lost pretty badly, but was also in the middle of eating, lol. I still would probably lose, but Id enjoy doing a few 1v1 if someone could pass the message along, or if you read the boards. Could learn a lot from you. You were using two canines, I believe. Dont remember what weapons though.

Most likely Rez On. I think he has an 80 of every class. You can see his movies (including Ranger) movies below.

http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXRV4qHPY5nBpN7k8O4FNpA

Thank you very much Oozo! Ill check it out.

Attic.1562:

fost.9167:

And OI Attic, Im still playing warrior, despite most people leaving!

Without soul or purpose does the warrior wander aimlessly through the WvW.

Unbidden, unwanted, fearful of both zergs and soloers it shambles forever in twilight, knowing nothing, learning nothing, killing nothing, being nothing.

Gab Superstar.4059:

He was talking about when Zoomhaven came back and took hills, not the time we smashed your 70 man zerg and pushed you out of DRBL.

Like I said, I could have gotten the nights mixed up or the “moments.” Its easy to talk about being outmanned if you are very, very selective in your perspective.

Still have yet to see a 70 man zerg on DH. Pics?

Remember too, if you “smashed our 70 man zerg” while you had the map queued and we didnt, what numbers was your zerg running at?

Gab Superstar.4059:

Tuluum.9638:

Gab Superstar.4059:

We lost bay but made one hell of a stand at Hills, queuing our BL and eventually completely pushed DH out of it.

(bolded for emphasis) There was never a queue for us, as far as I know, on your BL. Anyone from DH, please feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

So? You were hardly short on people or outmanned, and we did push you out of the BL. Not quite seeing what point you are trying to make here.

Aww, we are talking again!

It was in response to your team mate, who said we outnumbered you 3:1. I question the veracity of that claim, given game mechanics.

CrazyCanuck.4265:

Obviously they have never seen losing weeks like DR or IoJ, or they would not care so much about winning silly T6.

The force is.. something.. with this one! XD

CrazyCanuck.4265:

I did actually try and defend all of DRBL last night, but as usual the zoom hack came by and wiped all of the inner siege, and then DH still decided to treb inner walls for another 2 hours before taking the keep with 3:1 number advantage.

You defended it all on your lonesome? Give your team mates some credit! I didnt count individual players, but seeing as how Gab said:

Gab Superstar.4059:

We lost bay but made one hell of a stand at Hills, queuing our BL and eventually completely pushed DH out of it.

(bolded for emphasis) There was never a queue for us, as far as I know, on your BL. Anyone from DH, please feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

I have been going to DRBL the last few nights because it has been fun. Holding east keep was a blast, even though we had 15-20 players against an apparently full queue. The nights might be mixed up, but we didnt have a queue at any point any night, afaik.

And about the hacks.. I am still waiting for more evidence as I am being accused of it by the massive generalizations used by others (typical, so not unexpected, mind you). Placing an AC right outside of a wall is actually quite useful even without an exploit, though I would call someone out if I knew they were intentionally using an exploit. As it stands, just sounds like more excuses.

To the ranger from Baltimore Style, nice fight outside of SM. I lost pretty badly, but was also in the middle of eating, lol. I still would probably lose, but Id enjoy doing a few 1v1 if someone could pass the message along, or if you read the boards. Could learn a lot from you. You were using two canines, I believe. Dont remember what weapons though.

DH has zergs of 70+?

Wow.. Where am I when this happens?

Wow.. Where am I when this happens?Oh, and leg specialist warriors on ACs are really, really annoying.

@pixieish;

Dude, that is freaking perfect! Along with charrcat, you are two of my newest heroes.

On a sad note, kinda, the pig ranger is no more :\ I am still a member of the Self-Appointed Pig Advocacy Group, but they just wont forage me up weapons anymore.. They just go attack. QQ

Anyone want some bacon?

Alright, I have just been having a blast in DRBL tonight!

Thanks to those who have played along.

Acelerion.6820:

3. auto attack siegerazers from inside a keep.

That kitten hits me for 60k, you bet I attack him from inside the keep, hahaha.

Fun night tonight anyway. Good fights all ’round.

I can login now too. Right after I post, haha.

Someone tripped over a cable is my guess.

Same here, started with not being able to access BLTC. I relogged thinking it would fix it.. was wrong on that one!

Forums were really strange about logging in as well.

Wanze.8410:

Sarevok.2638:

1. WvW server and it’s given a free ticket to just about anyone wanting carried to t1.

Free ticket to t1? I thought free transfers to medium populated servers where only available until April 1st?
Did that change?

I agree with the OP in general, though. They should have excluded top tier servers from that.

I just checked, and it said it would cost me 500 gems.. so not sure what the OP is referring to. Might have changed though.

While I definitely find it inconvenient at times..

We would miss out on all of those fantastically entertaining deaths, as well as the ability to knock people off a cliff to their demise. I am not so sure I want to lose that.

Awesome stuff as per usual Sebrent.

Thanks for the research! I agree on gw2buildcraft.com being far and away the best site for build needs.

This comes at a perfect time, as I have been thinking about trying a healing power oriented build soon.

Gab Superstar.4059:

2:20 is a black screen. But it’s okay, I know you didn’t watch the second video. (The one the guy you replied to was talking about).

Ignorance is bliss I guess.

I said:

“around the 2:20 mark.” Like I said, I dont care too much about it, I just get a kick out of your reaction. “Around” means something specific. It means “roughly,” or “not precisely” in this context.

And you are correct, I didnt watch the second video which I explicitly stated. I have been talking about the first video all along. If you wish to show me, in this first video, where it is a small number of DR surrounded by DH, I would love to see the screen caps.

I can take plenty of footage to make it appear any way I want. So can you, or anyone. Our overall perspective will be determined by our personal bias. The best part is, I agreed with the initial portrayal from Oozo all along. In that video, DH was definitely not outnumbered.

Keep on keepin on though. You are certainly the most entertaining to interact with so far. Do keep in mind, I really dont take any of this seriously. That should imply something about my intentions behind my interactions. Its even one of the most overused accusations on message boards nowadays. I am sure you can figure it out.

Gab Superstar.4059:

No, it was claimed that later during that night, there was a small number of DR surrounded by DH. If you watch the videos Oozo stated at the end that DH’s numbers kept increasing where DR’s stayed the same.

I was talking about this:

Almostfaceman.1804:

Pretty even numbers? Yeah you should have watched the video before saying anything like that. smh It’s a small number of DR surrounded by DH

Gab, the only thing like that I see is possibly at around the 2:20 mark, for a half of a second at best, but that is pretty much where the video ends. And, I dont care enough to go through frame by frame or anything. Feel free to take screen caps of what you are talking about though. I will freely admit if I am wrong.

Tuluum.9638:

I think I clearly stated that this is NOT indicative of other scenarios where it was claimed DR was “massively outnumbered”.

You wouldnt be in a position to objectively state that. Nor would I. Which is why I said “if.”

I love the attention, btw.

edit: Yes, in those two videos I would agree you were massively outnumbered. I fail to see your point as far as my conversation with your fellow DRian though. Would you mind clarifying? And, just to add, I was saying the people from my server seemed to be incorrect of their assessment. Yet, you go after me instead of them. Makes me feel special, keep it up! Though, please talk a bit more slowly. I can only grasp every third word or so of a conversation.

Gab Superstar.4059:

No one called it massively outnumbered. I am starting to think you are a little dim. Oh wait, you are just putting words in other people’s mouths to feed your own argument.

Oozo said he trashes this sort of footage for a reason. Maybe if you watched some of his other stuff you would realize what massively outnumbered actually mean.

I am happy to see you still have a thing for me, makes me feel loved.

I wasnt referring to this specific video when I was talking about “massively outnumbered,” nor did I mean to imply it towards any specific circumstance. It was claimed that in that specific video, DR was “a small number of DR surrounded by DH,” but that just doesnt appear to be true when I did a count.

It was a general statement towards the general attitude. Like I said, if engagements like that, and the perspectives precipitated by them, are indicative of other scenarios where it was claimed DR was “massively outnumbered,” then it makes a lot more sense. Probably just a language barrier thing again. I see the same thing from every server.

And yes, I am pretty dim. You just have to talk.. really… slow….. Thanks for your cooperation.

Almostfaceman.1804:

Pretty even numbers? Yeah you should have watched the video before saying anything like that. smh It’s a small number of DR surrounded by DH, most of who seem to really really like the gate of Bay.

I did watch the video. My confusion came in when I incorrectly thought they were talking about DRBL, but I was wrong.

Either way, I still see roughly even numbers and DH lost that engagement. I see ~14 DH and ~12 DR around the 1:00 mark. There could be some miscounting, I really dont care that much about it. By the 2:00 mark, DH was losing folks fast.

It may explain a lot though, if that is what you guys keep calling “massively outnumbered.” It looked like a decent fight, regardless, and DR won. No idea how it went afterwards, I wasnt there.

Not 100% happy with him yet (still iffy on coat and pants), and I cant quite remember where I got all the gear (vigil shoulders, gloves, protean boots).. but:

@Oozo;

Yikes! That one just made me nauseous.

I think the biggest issue people are having when reporting numbers is the combination of the removal of culling, and addition of titles. I have noticed consistently incorrect reporting of numbers. I always find it a bit funny when someone says in /t or /m "30+ (insert random server name) at (insert random objective) only to find out there are 10 enemies at best.

Its really interesting to see how subjectivity and individual experience in a specific circumstance affects ability to report numbers though. Well, interesting to me anyway.

Either way, I see a pretty even fight there as it concerns numbers. At least in the first video.. I couldnt make it 30 seconds into the second one!

mfernandez.4172:

kicked out of a guild for doing this, absolutely stupid. you work hard days, and you come home to play some WvW. and this 20 year something year old acts all [HARD] on you for doing it.

thought it was funny that i had to message somebody to get a tribunal inquiry for it. just a bit fun, and its just a game :-) [HARD]en up guys !

You wouldnt happen to play a necro in game? (get it?!)

Anyway, I think its pretty darn juvenile to do these things, but they dont bother me. In fact, the more people dancing on my corpse, the more people that ARENT doing anything to help their team. In that way, I fully encourage it.

I find it endlessly humorous when a group dances/laughs/etc when they beat you 10:1. I guess if you set the bar low enough, you will always succeed.

Partunu.9845:

@Tuluum – I’m pretty sure Ozoo and co. were in your BL, and you were in ours. So that’s the numbers difference. I’m pretty sure I saw Stylii with us at some point. Or it could have been a bush. Trees all look the same to me.

Ahh, that makes a lot more sense! Thanks for clarifying. I thought it was odd considering I dont remember seeing many tags from that alliance (if any).

And yeah.. I cant tell the difference either. I figure if it starts hurting me, or me it, then we are on to something. That has lead to some interesting interactions with foliage though… If you see some Asura yelling at a bush, thats me!

Gab Superstar.4059:

Of course you are. But saying something like;

“Most of your crew seem pretty riled up all the time.”

Would imply the opposite. Silly me.

Right.. Which is why I said I would try to be more clear next time. All riled up, arentchya? :P

Gab Superstar.4059:

Most of our group never even post on the forums.

I would assume so.

Of course, I am talking about those that do post on the forums. I thought that would be obvious, but Ill try to be more clear next time.

@Zizanzi;

Most of your crew seem pretty riled up all the time. Many seem to enjoy forum PvP as much as in-game PvP.

I look forward to the videos

hyjaxxx.1584:

youve scared us off Gab! everyone is in lions arch with their toes on the portal..hesitating due to fear of being AoE bled on the boards! <3

I forgot to put on my condi removal skills too.. :\

Regardless, that finally explains the red at the top of every screen of the forums.

Gab Superstar.4059:

Where the hell is everyone? It seems that every map is a ghost town.

Forum PvP!

Or just.. jobs and such.

I feel exactly the same way. I have said before that I thought an offshoot of WvW would be what they were proposing as an e-sport. I was actually REALLY excited about this, and is one of the main reasons I decided to support the game. What I found was just another node cap game… Been There. Done That. A lot…

My only hope is that custom arenas will give a massive numbers of options in time (I dont expect it at launch). Including tons of different map sizes (maybe even player made maps), objectives to win (kills, objectives, node caps, specific amount of combo finishers), custom AoE caps, defend/attack modes (group gets the keep, while another needs to take it in X amount of time), and much more.

I have no idea what the population difference is, but I would be interested to see the actual numbers.