Guild Wars 2

Sleuth.7964:

Vayne.8563:

Sleuth.7964:

Hoyvin.3241:

Sleuth.7964:

It’s absolutely necessary for a MMO to have it.

No, it’s not.

Ok, ok, let me word it differently. Its absolutely necessary for an MMO to have it if it wan’ts to be taken seriously. Because many people don’t take this game seriously for reasons such as this.

The very people who don’t take this game seriously because it doesn’t have dueling are the very people we don’t need in this community.

I think it is because they stop crazy fan boys from ruining this game

Hey, that’s pretty funny. Good job!

Tumbero.3945:

Really , so if gw2 add pk style u all have a special heart attack?

The pve players , are only a base of hellokity games nothing more.

1) all u do is pve , cause u cant pvp another one, why? u are afraid and a terrible pvp player.

2) The pve players never want to do pvp , cause they skill play is terrible they only want to figths mobs , cause mobs cant think really and vs another player they fell inferior.

Precisely the attitude I’m trying to avoid. Thank you, graciously, for completely illustrating my point.

Aeonblade.8709:

Vayne.8563:

Sovta.4719:

Warruz.8096:

Perhaps I just havnt seen it but why are duels such a no?

Cause most of the players are scared they will get destroyed by experienced players. And that fps will be less then 5 in LA.

Actually I’m not scared of that at all. I’m just thinking of the general player type that enjoys dueling, compared to the general player type who plays games that I like to play. It’s a thought process.

People who like to challenge people randomly, for no reason, just for lulz aren’t my demographic of game player. I’m not interested, particularly, in playing with those people. It’s not the game I play.

I think if people were dueling in the streets, the Lionguard would come and arrest them. It’s immersion breaking on that level.

The costume brawl, on the other hand, is obviously a celebration. A free for all. Something that doesn’t just feed someone’s ego.

So yeah, it’s not about not being able to. It’s about the kind of player that kind of thing attracts.

You are worried about people fighting in a game that want’s to turn it’s PvP into an eSport, but dueling for practice is right out? Maybe that’s how sPvP ended up so kittenty, the player’s giving Anet “advice”.

Like I said earlier, I don’t care about duels at all, but I still haven’t seen a good reason not to have them for those that want them.

No. Because those people are in the mists. The WvW people. They’re in the mists. The PvE world was designed to be a cooperative experience. With the exception of the costume brawl, which no one can take seriously, and can’t be done where there are creatures anyway because you get kicked out of it, those people are segregated from others.

You do realize that PVPers don’t like carebears and vice/versa. Not all of course, but enough to cause problems. I’m happy for PvPers to have their own game in their own area. I’d love for them to have dueling there as well. That’s fine. Because I don’t have to deal with the stupidity in map chat because of it. Or players whispering me why don’t I accept their duel request.

The bottom line is, Anet has done a great job of segregating two groups of players, some of which want completely different things. To keep the peace, it’s better if these groups stay separated.

And when I want to beat up some other players, which does happen from time to time, I’ll go into SPvP, or more like WvW.

Sleuth.7964:

Hoyvin.3241:

Sleuth.7964:

It’s absolutely necessary for a MMO to have it.

No, it’s not.

Ok, ok, let me word it differently. Its absolutely necessary for an MMO to have it if it wan’ts to be taken seriously. Because many people don’t take this game seriously for reasons such as this.

The very people who don’t take this game seriously because it doesn’t have dueling are the very people we don’t need in this community.

Sovta.4719:

Warruz.8096:

Perhaps I just havnt seen it but why are duels such a no?

Cause most of the players are scared they will get destroyed by experienced players. And that fps will be less then 5 in LA.

Actually I’m not scared of that at all. I’m just thinking of the general player type that enjoys dueling, compared to the general player type who plays games that I like to play. It’s a thought process.

People who like to challenge people randomly, for no reason, just for lulz aren’t my demographic of game player. I’m not interested, particularly, in playing with those people. It’s not the game I play.

I think if people were dueling in the streets, the Lionguard would come and arrest them. It’s immersion breaking on that level.

The costume brawl, on the other hand, is obviously a celebration. A free for all. Something that doesn’t just feed someone’s ego.

So yeah, it’s not about not being able to. It’s about the kind of player that kind of thing attracts.

Ravager.9628:

Id like to add to this thread that I rolled a warrior from day one, not knowing how powerfull they are, infact the only taste i had of the warrior class, was in beta when I got one-two shotted in most events and was forced to constantly use ranged because melee was well, death.

So before starting threads like these, think of people who rolled warrior because they like being a kitten armored guy charging into things. I also have a ele and engineer alt, I do think ele is underpowered in PVE but engineer is extremly powerfull if played corectly as support, and makes up for the lack of DPS, by a lot!

You should read the whole thread, instead of just the OP. I started this thread is more of a protest against the kind of player who actually insists you be X profession. It wasn’t a serious suggestion. It was an illustration of how stupid I think the whole thing is.

You don’t even have to transfer to check out other servers. Try guesting over to Tarnished Coast or Sea of Sorrows. You’ll see plenty of people.

Yeah, that seems kind of weird. Of course, legendaries themselves are quite visible, but there still should be a title.

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

It’s not good to see a game just in the view of PvE only. And that’s what you did. If you would have played PvP from launch till now, you would see that the playerbase in gerneal is decreasing heavily. In PvE it’s pretty stabile. But that’s not the whole game.

You mean SPvP…because WvW is PvP too. Guild Wars 2 has a strong WvW playerbase. Ergo it has a strong PvP playerbase.

But yes, SPvP probably needs a lot of help. On the other hand, I’m thinking they’re starting to work on that now, and I do believe it can be revitalized.

Simon.3106:

You love Vayne’s post? Yea go love his post to death for all I care. I don’t care if no one love my posts. I prefer to not be noticed anyways -_-

I love this post, Simon. There, there.

lothefallen.7081:

Jski.6180:

Im Mudbone.1437:

Uruz Six.6594:

The Eternal Grace.3157:

Wake up Anet, your game is starting to die.

Unfounded claims of the game dying: Check.
Claims that GW2 isn’t as good as GW1: Check.

Its like a pattern in every kitten ‘complaint’ thread. All I’m missing is ‘whar trinity whar’.

I love playing GW2, but, GW1 DOES HAVE better game-play, GW2 just looks better.

How is it better game play? I must say being able to MOVE out of the way of attk is very nice being able to do combo is amassing for team work the ability to switch your ability and changeable skills in the tratle lines just out side of combat is very nice and adds a lot being able to switch weapons IN COMBAT is a god sent. So what could you do in GW1 that was “better game-play” the turn base like combat?

TwoBit.5903:

Not sure if this is anecdotal or not, but April saw the departure of at least four well-known gaming communities from GW2 as dedicated communities.

I think that falls under slander if you cant back it up well agent Anet.

It’s not about the illusion of choice and hyper balanced options, it’s about the system depth and level of teamwork / skill involved. In the case of PvE, it requires neither of these in GW2, while it did in GW1. In GW2 PvP it slightly requires 1, but not the other, unlike GW1. GW1 may be a bit more archaic, but the gameplay was more strategic, deep, and engaging. Team composition doesn’t matter in GW2, no trinity to design content around so its all health pool pinatas and faceroll 1111111 spamming with no distinctual, gratifying roles and a few classes completely outclassing others.

GW1, from the skill system, to the story, to the instances, all much, much better than GW2 because GW2 had to appeal to the way of the casual and the kitten gamer that can’t handle complexity. Oh and also so that the designers could entwine a more appealing, RNG based, shady cash shop with tons of gold sinks, TP-funneled economy with no player trading, etc. I’m more inclined to say that the developers are playing GW2 players as a game just as much as GW2 players play GW2 as one.

Yep, Guild Wars 1 was better. Practically a household name. 7 million copies sold over 7 years and probably never had the traffic Guild Wars 2 has had already.

It’s a nice dream, but it’s just a dream. Guild Wars 1 had more than it’s share of problems. And while I loved the game, the rose-colored glasses through which you view are are just that—-rose colored.

Holy smokes, a reasonable post! Good job. Expect backlash, though. lol

StinVec.3621:

So far the top three people on these forums whose opinions I respect are Vayne, tolunart and Tengu. I don’t agree with everything each of them says, but they offer insight and logic with the majority of their comments they make, and their opinions are of value to me. Thank you for that.

As for the topic.
I do not to PvP.
I do not do WvW.
I do not do dungeons.
I am strictly and open world PvE player; I level, I gear, I develop my appearance, I participate in events, I walk around Divinity’s Reach and the world taking pics and appreciating the gorgeous landscapes and atmosphere. I’ve enjoyed doing all of that and have non-stop over my 1,416 hours and 31 minutes of play time with my many characters. However, long ago I lost interest in leveling my Elementalist as it just seemed to play differently one day. A few months later I returned to her and it still felt really awful and I just couldn’t function completely solo with her anymore as I just seemed to be extremely weak.

I will give her another go and adjust to whatever changes may affect her abilities after this patch. If I can’t adjust, then back to one of the others for a while, it’s not a big deal to me.

Well hey there. You’re one of the people I keep talking about. People who prefer open world content and just enjoy the journey. There are so many more of us than dungeon runners and farmers think. We really are legion. We just don’t talk on forums much, so thanks for speaking up.

Out of curiousity, have you ever tried playing in the world with your map markers off?

Anonymous.6935:

Yeah, I stopped playing around 2 months after release of the game as Ele’s were very “squishy”….right before everyone started using this so called “OP” build.

Came back around 3 weeks ago, found and tried the build, loved it, was actually reasonable at the game and started to enjoy it lol…

Now, it seems that fun was short lived ha.

Eles are one of the hardest professions to play well. And games need hard professions to play to keep some types of players more challenged. We have a guy in my guild who can do pretty much anything in the game on his ele and he never uses a bunker build. I’m amazed when I watch him play.

He doesn’t go down on Lupi. He WvW’s and SPvPs. He’s really good…on a non-bunker ele.

But you know, that’s the trade off for that kind of profession. Me, I prefer my mesmer and my ranger, both of which are very survivable. I hate dying lol

Anonymous.6935:

Vayne.8563:

Gestankfaust.4216:

Yer wife plays?

More validation than Anonymous.6935 can give

Have fun actually playing…

My wife and I both have GWAMM from GW 1 and 50/50 in our HoM. This is what we do together. We’re both active in our guild. We’re like the guild “parents”. lol

Ok, you genuinely sound nice, so i’m sorry again if I offended you!

Nah I grew up in NYC. It’s really really hard to offend me. lol

Anonymous.6935:

Vayne.8563:

I’m just hanging out here, waiting for my wife to get ready to play. You haven’t taken any of my time, and in fact you couldn’t. Have fun!

Oh, that’s nice. Be sure you both take plenty of breaks from infront of those screens and head out for some fresh air and sunshine!….Just caring is all! Thanks.

Oh we do. We go out with the dogs several times a day, throw the ball around the yard. Actually I’ve been playing backyard cricket with my dog lately. Unfortunately she only plays on position, silly mid on, and I have to try to kick the ball by her, but I’m getting much better at making fours. lol

Gestankfaust.4216:

Yer wife plays?

More validation than Anonymous.6935 can give

Have fun actually playing…

My wife and I both have GWAMM from GW 1 and 50/50 in our HoM. This is what we do together. We’re both active in our guild. We’re like the guild “parents”. lol

The Eternal Grace.3157:

Vayne.8563:

Fernling.1729:

The games population has been declining since Nov-ish. Not a surprise considering thats the route most mmos take.

Games population took a big hit in November and it’s been increasing ever since. Servers were expanded recently to deal with an influx of people. How is that decreasing?

Just because the number of players is increasing does not mean the number of active players is increasing. Many ignorant people tend to neglect the fact that activity is different than the number of players. There could be 10,000,000 players, but if they only log in once every week for an hour, that’s different than having 1,000,000 who play several hours every day.

Many people seem to ignore the fact that if people weren’t playing, I’d never be on an overflow. The other day on my server, a shiverpeaks event day, went to Wayfarer Foothills, off peak even, and ended up on an overflow. That doesn’t just happen.

There are plenty of people playing. Some are in SAB, so you won’t see them. Some are in Fractals, you won’t see them. There are queues for WvW at least on my server.

I’m not sure what evidence you have for a declining population but I’ll be interested to know. In fact, since they removed culling from WvW, there are more queues and more people playing.

Sarie.1630:

Vayne.8563:

Want to run SE Path 1…warriors need not apply!

I’ve already been doing this. Well, a few months ago, a few friends and I. Since I’ve just started playing the game properly for the first time in a couple of months now the pain from a torrent of molten freaking stupidity that comes hand-in-hand with many Warrior players has dissipated a bit.

They didn’t appreciate it, honestly – but hey, if they want to “check gear on apply” when people join their CoF groups then I want to “check profession on apply” when people join mine. We don’t want you Warriors, there are plenty of other groups for you.

Eh, this subject gets me riled. This isn’t to say all Warriors are imbeciles.

Just most.

Jordan.6157:

Does it matter? Not like this game has any structure to dungeons.

That is such a shame, because it really really should.

Well before release I was lead to believe Dungeons would be epic adventures with minor events, cool loot, dangerous foes. Ascalonian Catacombs in Beta showed promise, then after release it got nerfed, and transpired it was actually one of the harder dungeons (at the time)…they just got easier and substantially less epic.

Have you tried it since they redid it? AC I mean.

I’m just hanging out here, waiting for my wife to get ready to play. You haven’t taken any of my time, and in fact you couldn’t. Have fun!

Anonymous.6935:

Vayne.8563:

Anonymous.6935:

Vayne.8563:

People who leave over nerfs to a profession probably aren’t worth trying to save. Just saying.

People like you should perhaps spend time enjoying this “great game” rather than typing to strangers in the game’s forum? Or maybe spending time with family and/or become involved with real life situations? Your forum history quite frankly speaks for itself, so i’ll leave it there! Thank you.

People like me? You mean retired people with a hobby who have enough free time to play the game and spend time with family (most of which would be my wife, who also plays the game). Whatever you think you know about me, you’re probably wrong.

My forum history is about responding to hyperbole, and ridiculous, unfounded statements. ZOMG, someone nerfed my build…I’m taking my ball and going home. Okay…bye.

You think this is something original and only gets posted on Guild Wars 2 forums. That no other MMORPG has posts like this? In fact, maybe you should spend less time trying to psychoanalyze someone who’s quite happy and entertained by this, and go do something productive with your life. Because making personalish comments about someone you know nothing about isn’t a good look. The Amazing Karnak you’re not.

Have a good day.

Oh dear, sorry for hitting a soft spot with you there! You sound rather annoyed to be honest.

I cannot really agree with you intensively playing this game and participating in the forums every single day as a “hobby”, but guess your opinion is something you’d like to share. Most people would call it obsessive behaviour however…

I wish you all the best in your retirement, and truely hope it becomes more exciting – rather than wasting away playing a MMO game.

Take care!

Well, golf is more expensive. You know, people that have lived productive lives, the kids are grown up, everything is nice financially…they do in fact get involved in things. Some people play chess all day. Some do gardening and ‘obsess’ over their gardens.

But you haven’t offended me, mate. You haven’t even annoyed me. I thought it was funny that you think you know what it’s like to be retired, and that you’d judge someone based on your narrow evidence of psychological health.

Don’t quit your day job. lol

Anonymous.6935:

Vayne.8563:

People who leave over nerfs to a profession probably aren’t worth trying to save. Just saying.

People like you should perhaps spend time enjoying this “great game” rather than typing to strangers in the game’s forum? Or maybe spending time with family and/or become involved with real life situations? Your forum history quite frankly speaks for itself, so i’ll leave it there! Thank you.

People like me? You mean retired people with a hobby who have enough free time to play the game and spend time with family (most of which would be my wife, who also plays the game). Whatever you think you know about me, you’re probably wrong.

My forum history is about responding to hyperbole, and ridiculous, unfounded statements. ZOMG, someone nerfed my build…I’m taking my ball and going home. Okay…bye.

You think this is something original and only gets posted on Guild Wars 2 forums. That no other MMORPG has posts like this? In fact, maybe you should spend less time trying to psychoanalyze someone who’s quite happy and entertained by this, and go do something productive with your life. Because making personalish comments about someone you know nothing about isn’t a good look. The Amazing Karnak you’re not.

Have a good day.

Fernling.1729:

The games population has been declining since Nov-ish. Not a surprise considering thats the route most mmos take.

Games population took a big hit in November and it’s been increasing ever since. Servers were expanded recently to deal with an influx of people. How is that decreasing?

People who leave over nerfs to a profession probably aren’t worth trying to save. Just saying.

I don’t know, my guild, which isn’t a super large guild, is getting new people all the time. We’re up to about 90 now. And we have plenty of active members. Maybe your guild is just bad. Hey it happens. It’s nobody’s fault.

The game has plenty of people playing it. If you can’t see them, you’re either blind or experiencing culling. More maybe playing on a low pop server at off peak hours. That’s possible too.

The game has plenty going for it. It will have more going for it over time.

But this is the kind of short-sighted sort of thing I expect from people who believe I think/feel this ways so everyone else must too.

There are enough people enjoying this game to keep this game going a long time. More people come in from sales and word of mouth. Some leave, some stay.

Even if most leave, if some stay, the core population grows. We’re not losing players faster than we’re getting new ones.

Another baseless claim of dying by someone who doesn’t get it.

And the China version is just going into beta in May. You keep using that word. I don’t think it means what you think it means.

Dante.1508:

Rofl Vayne getting in before the flames start, funny as…

I don’t think anything you type will make a scrap of difference to what the player base does, that said really glad i never play my Ele and Engi…

I can’t wait to read the player bases “thoughts” on these “latest changes” to their game..

Right because being reasonable is something most people can’t do. I agree. Thanks for pointing it out.

Baeyne.9584:

Vayne.8563:

This is a great post. I think a lot more people would enjoy Guild Wars 2 if they hadn’t played games like WoW and the gazillion WoW clones that have popped up over the years. It’s a very different mindset.

As for cosmetic options, more will come in time, just like they do in every MMO. It’s just a matter of patience.

Anyway, for what it’s worth, welcome to the dark side. lol

It’s actually the reverse for me, Vayne.

Coming into GW2 from WoW and a bajillion other WoW clones can make you appreciate GW2 more. You have a basis for comparison, although that in itself is a two-edged sword. There is a lot of stuff in GW2 that when you compare it to the other games you have played will make you appreciate GW2 more.

And the other good thing is that the devs are learning from past experience and improving this game more.

People are just too impatient to wait.

Well, yeah, people are impatient. I mean, WoW has bugs and imbalance issues that went on for years too. But no one remembers those. lol

Yay, another postive post. We need more of them!

Waaaaah. I can’t be OP anymore.

And somehow, life goes on.

This game was designed to minimize the loot stress that you’ll find in other games. The design is intentional. It doesn’t appeal to griefers, as a rule, because it’s hard to grief her by comparison. It can happen but it’s not easy.

Some design elements that make this my MMO of choice:

1. No tagging. Do you know how many times in WoW I waited for a boss to spawn only to have some guy who came later tag it before I could, so I had to wait for him to spawn again to get my quest reward?

2. Everyone has their own nodes. In Rift I used to use knockbacks to mine nodes while fighting, in fear the guy two feet away was going to steal it from me, even though he saw I was fighting the guy on top of it. Can’t happen here.

3. Everyone gets their own roll on loot tables from mobs, from vets, from champions, from chests. No rolling for stuff, You’re not taking anyone else’s rewards.

4. No one can steal your experience. You all get credit for killing stuff, so it’s not usually a bad thing if someone shows up to help. In fact, running with people, which I do frequently with my guild increases your loot and experience gain, because you take things down faster. Farming in a group, if you do farm (which I seldom do) is amazing in this game.

5. The community is much much nicer than other games. You know that guy you mentioned OP? The one who wanted to help new people. That’s me sometimes in Guild Wars 2, just standing around in an early zone, waiting for the Maw to spawn, or just chilling and offering help to new people. I do it several times a week. To me, it’s all about community.

Welcome back, OP. There really is no game like Guild Wars 2.

Rata Sum got busy because of the Super adventure box, but I agree about the rest of them…except LA of course.

evo.8640:

maddoctor.2738:

Yes it does. You get loot/experience for your level not lower level, you don’t just go to old zones to gather lower level materials. You go there to explore the zone if you want to do a 100% of the world, do some of the lower level boss events, there are many even in the lower zones and they offer max rewards, were there bosses in the first zone after the tutorial in WoW that had bosses that offered near-max quality loot?

Since anyone can choose how they play while leveling up, they can obviously quit working on a particular zones completion and move onto another. Here’s what you’re not getting.

You’ve out-leveled Queensdale, but didn’t finish it. You eventually return at level 25. You will have less trouble dealing with any content there than you would have at levels 1-17. You come back to Queensdale at level 80. Congratulations, you’re level 1-17 again, but the content has now been reduced to a spam-button-1 fest. Again, this is semantics. The content is still the same as it was. It’s truly not any more relevant than it was when you first encountered it. You have no practical reason to be there if you’re not there to complete something you’ve unfinished. That’s precisely the same as a game without downscaling. The semantic being precisely how more powerful you are to the content from one game to another. After all, there are repeatable quests in low level zones. Returning to do them is no different than returning to Queensdale to repeat an event.

Now you can say because of select key special event bosses that people do indeed return. Keep in mind, that’s only after they made changes to allow chest rewards to be balanced off true character level – hence the welfare loot train. Before this change was implemented, these very same DE’s were only being touched by people actually leveling up in that zone.

Also, do lower level dungeons in WoW offer max stat gear? You have the same reasons for running all dungeons and doing all events in GW2, you can’t say the same for any game without downscaling, that’s a simple fact.

Low level dungeons in GW2 offering level 80 exo’s has absolutely nothing to do with downscaling. It has everything to do with horizontal gear progression based on a hand-me-out token model. If GW2 didn’t have that, you certainly wouldn’t be running AC/CM for max level gear. What happens when you collect all the gear from AC/CM? You have no real reason to return. Again no different than a low level dungeon in a game without downscaling. So I can say the same.

At least people are all over world and are getting rewarded for it, and not doing just one end-game dungeon Shouldn’t be hard to wrap your head around.

But people are pretty much just doing one end-game dungeon. Hell, even on JQ, there are less people collectively in any non-80 zone than there are people doing sPvP. And that’s only a few hundred people.

As I said before I didn’t play WoW at launch so I can’t write a list of what was available to WoW. Maybe someone with more experience can write it.

I had played WoW from day 1. It’d be relatively pointless to do so only to satisfy a kitten contest with Vayne based on his own admittance that he didn’t play from day 1.[/quote]

You miss an important point in this diatribe.

Queensdale is a level 1-15 zone. But 40 and 50 and 60 and 70 level zones are all viable too, and some of them can be quite challenging.

Jumping puzzles don’t get any easier no matter what level you are either.

Just because you’re stuck in a mindset that can’t see it, doesn’t make anything that’s been said false.

gfox.6501:

Vayne.8563:

gfox.6501:

Amount of content really isn’t as important as content replayability, if you guys are talking about game longevity.

Which ends up being a matter of taste.

Yeah, so why are you guys counting content as if it means something, I mean, while you guys are at it, why not count the number of varying textures per mesh as content, eh? :p

The amount of content is the amount of content, quite different from the amount of textures. The number of zones, the size of the zones, the amount of “quests” in the zones, whether traditional, hearts or DEs is ALL content.

If you don’t like it, it’s not content FOR YOU. Which changes nothing.

Jordan.6157:

What? In WoW I felt my character develop. Become stronger as I progressed with gear. This game I have no connection to my character at all. Craft full gear and afk. And the reason I stopped this game wasn’t because it’s bug ridden but because it’s boring.

Plus they already running beta tests and they are not planning to release the game for a long while.

Don’t jump to conclusions about this game. I am not jumping to conclusions about guild wars 2. I have played it therefore I know the facts.

Right in Wow, you were a coatrack for greatness. Yay you.

That’s why different games offer different experiences for different people. I don’t go onto the WoW forums and say the game isn’t working. It works for some people. It didn’t work for me.

On the other hand, this game works for me, and clearly not for you.

Maybe if you’d talk for you, instead of speaking in absolutes that only apply to your opinion, it would be easier to be sympathetic to you. As it is, you’re just a guy who doesn’t like what this game offers…fair enough.

Doesn’t change that fact that a lot of people do.

gfox.6501:

Amount of content really isn’t as important as content replayability, if you guys are talking about game longevity.

Which ends up being a matter of taste.

Peanut gallery aside, we’ll know in a short while. The patch isn’t that far away.

Jordan.6157:

Vayne.8563:

Jordan.6157:

Vayne.8563:

Jordan.6157:

Vayne.8563:

It’s because some people like leveling. It’s a chore to you. It’s the whole game a lot of people.

OH GET THE kitten OUT OF HERE PLEASE! Hearts and events are just quests without the NPC interaction. Don’t kid me noone likes questing. In WoW noone liked it, in any game noone liked it. Its all the same. If the WHOLE kittenING GAME is questing then WoW offers alot kittening more. Please don’t say this games endgame is from level 1 because if that’s the case the endgame is just questing, bit of crafting and PvP and I wonder why the kitten IS EVERYONE PLAYING THIS PILE OF kitten?

Oh and a bar you have to fill up by killing kitten, collecting kitten or w/e is kittening questing. Bar or number makes no difference. Oh and we get variety in what we do with hearts because we can choose to collect/blah or blah??? Yeh but only because there is sooo few hearts that 10 hearts = 30 quests in WoW so essentially you are completely 3 quests with 1 heart… so obviously they will give you variety to compensate.

Plenty of people liked questing in WoW. There are a whole lot of people that keep rolling alts, because they don’t like end game and they just like questing.

Your problem is, you can’t acknowledge that other people might like something other than what you like. But they do.

I’d rather be questing than playing an “end game”, even though I’m quite good at end game. I just find end game silly.

Well done. So you’re basically saying this game that was out to try and beat WoW is actually dedicated to the lowest percentage of MMORPG players on the planet. Well done. About 1% of everyone who plays MMORPGs probably likes questing more than endgame content, pvp etc. And since guild wars 2 offers no endgame.. and just questing (covered it up calling it endgame confusing all the intelligent fans) I see they properly kittened up.

And also they lied through their teeth in their manifesto.

1. They weren’t trying to compete with WoW, because there’s no monthly fee. They were trying to make THEIR OWN GAME! Not just another WoW 2.0.

2. The lowest percentage of MMORPG players on the planet? Where do you get your information? Last I heard, no stastics were published on this. I believe you’ll find a greater number of people like the open world and questing and even solo than you’d ever believe. Many don’t join guilds. Some never run an instance at all. And there are a ton of these people out there. Scott Hartsman of Trion said any developer ignores solo players at their own risk. Maybe he knows more than you do?

3. Skyrim offers no end game, but it’s very popular and keeps tons of people playing for hundreds and hundreds of hours.

Skyrim isn’t an MMORPG. Every cavern and cave offers a reward. You don’t have to do them more than once to recieve the reward. It’s a massively different game and concept. Noone focuses on the level because there is no level restricted zones, gear etc. You can explore or do the story and neither causes you to miss out.

Just… just don’t compare them. Wait for ESO. Smash guild wars to kitten!

ESO won’t smash anything. It’ll be bug ridden, and take a year or two to develop and people with your level of patience will leave it for the same reasons you’ll leave this game. Just wait till Bethesda has to deal with the MMO crowd. It’s going to be hilarious to watch.

And yes, you can compare an RPG with an mmoRPG. Note the similarity in letters. There are many MANY people who play MMOs as RPGs. More to the point, there are many MANY people who wanted more RPG in their MMOs than older games gave them. WoW was great at giving you the MMO bit, but not so great at giving you the RPG bit. Sucks to be them.

Essentially WoW motivated players, but not characters. Games like Guild Wars 2 motivate characters. My character has reasons to do what he does. I didn’t really feel that way in WoW.

evo.8640:

maddoctor.2738:

Nope, in games without downscaling you get far fewer -relevant- content than in GW2. Once you outlevel a zone there is absolutely no reason to go back, once you outlevel a dungeon there is no reason to go back and do it, none at all. In GW2 you can do it, so the best way to compare content between other games and GW2 is to compare the WHOLE GAME of GW2 to just the end-game (max level) of the other games.

I didn’t play WoW at launch so I will leave to someoen who did to make this comparisson, that is what you can actually compare, FULL GAME vs just max-level content, nothing more nothing less.

I think GW2 will win this one easily.

And some how downscaling makes this different? You out-level a zone in GW2 by way of character level & crafting materials. Guess what? You have absolutely no reason to go back there again. It’s no different than a game that doesn’t feature downscaling.

You can argue faulty points and say how that there are events and you’re scaled to it’s level, but that doesn’t change anything about the content. It doesn’t even make it more valid. It’s really no different than if some max level in WoW wants to go kill stuff in the starting areas. The result is the same. The amount of content is the same. Arguing that because of downscaling that content becomes relevant is really semantics. And it still doesn’t provide more content. After all, if it was really “more” content, then I’d see more people doing more outside of Frostgorge/Orr areas instead of only frequenting teleport points for key zone bosses. In other words, multitudes people would be enjoying all of this “relevant” content instead of jumping in line for the welfare train. But, they’re not.

This shouldn’t be a hard concept to wrap your head around.

Someone can say that there might be slightly more variety of content the full GW2 experience to the full vanilla WoW experience offers (be it, that it only really comes in the form of jump puzzles), but it cannot be said with a shred of facts that there was more content in GW2’s launch to WoW’s launch.

I have a reason to go back there. Several maybe. I could just like the zone or like certain events in the zone (such as Hirathi Hinterlands). I want to do that event chain again because I like it.

I can go back to zones to look for stuff I missed, like mini dungeons and jumping puzzles.

I can go back to zones to, get this, play with a friend without rerolling a new toon every time a friend starts playing.

There are a lot of reasons people revisit zones. If you don’t have those reasons, don’t go. I know that I like to go just to get some variety in what I’m doing.

And of course, certain things like the Living World appear in zones I’ve already been to.

Edit: Oh yeah, Guild Missions too.

Jordan.6157:

Vayne.8563:

I was just thinking about this, and you know, I hardly ever run a dungeon WITH a warrior. Almost never. Oh, ocassionally here and there, but they’re the real exception to the rule. And then I thought about it….

Why not make dungeon groups and exclude warriors from them. Just post something on gw2lfg.com that looks like this.

Want to run SE Path 1…warriors need not apply!

First it would be funny to see how they like it, particularly if lots of people start doing it, but more, it would give everyone else a chance to get in their dungeon runs, without kowtowing to the efficiency slaves.

I think it’s a good move.

Does it matter? Not like this game has any structure to dungeons.

Or some people are just not able to see the structure of dungeons.

Jordan.6157:

Vayne.8563:

Jordan.6157:

Vayne.8563:

It’s because some people like leveling. It’s a chore to you. It’s the whole game a lot of people.

OH GET THE kitten OUT OF HERE PLEASE! Hearts and events are just quests without the NPC interaction. Don’t kid me noone likes questing. In WoW noone liked it, in any game noone liked it. Its all the same. If the WHOLE kittenING GAME is questing then WoW offers alot kittening more. Please don’t say this games endgame is from level 1 because if that’s the case the endgame is just questing, bit of crafting and PvP and I wonder why the kitten IS EVERYONE PLAYING THIS PILE OF kitten?

Oh and a bar you have to fill up by killing kitten, collecting kitten or w/e is kittening questing. Bar or number makes no difference. Oh and we get variety in what we do with hearts because we can choose to collect/blah or blah??? Yeh but only because there is sooo few hearts that 10 hearts = 30 quests in WoW so essentially you are completely 3 quests with 1 heart… so obviously they will give you variety to compensate.

Plenty of people liked questing in WoW. There are a whole lot of people that keep rolling alts, because they don’t like end game and they just like questing.

Your problem is, you can’t acknowledge that other people might like something other than what you like. But they do.

I’d rather be questing than playing an “end game”, even though I’m quite good at end game. I just find end game silly.

Well done. So you’re basically saying this game that was out to try and beat WoW is actually dedicated to the lowest percentage of MMORPG players on the planet. Well done. About 1% of everyone who plays MMORPGs probably likes questing more than endgame content, pvp etc. And since guild wars 2 offers no endgame.. and just questing (covered it up calling it endgame confusing all the intelligent fans) I see they properly kittened up.

And also they lied through their teeth in their manifesto.

1. They weren’t trying to compete with WoW, because there’s no monthly fee. They were trying to make THEIR OWN GAME! Not just another WoW 2.0.

2. The lowest percentage of MMORPG players on the planet? Where do you get your information? Last I heard, no stastics were published on this. I believe you’ll find a greater number of people like the open world and questing and even solo than you’d ever believe. Many don’t join guilds. Some never run an instance at all. And there are a ton of these people out there. Scott Hartsman of Trion said any developer ignores solo players at their own risk. Maybe he knows more than you do?

3. Skyrim offers no end game, but it’s very popular and keeps tons of people playing for hundreds and hundreds of hours.

Jordan.6157:

Vayne.8563:

It’s because some people like leveling. It’s a chore to you. It’s the whole game a lot of people.

OH GET THE kitten OUT OF HERE PLEASE! Hearts and events are just quests without the NPC interaction. Don’t kid me noone likes questing. In WoW noone liked it, in any game noone liked it. Its all the same. If the WHOLE kittenING GAME is questing then WoW offers alot kittening more. Please don’t say this games endgame is from level 1 because if that’s the case the endgame is just questing, bit of crafting and PvP and I wonder why the kitten IS EVERYONE PLAYING THIS PILE OF kitten?

Oh and a bar you have to fill up by killing kitten, collecting kitten or w/e is kittening questing. Bar or number makes no difference. Oh and we get variety in what we do with hearts because we can choose to collect/blah or blah??? Yeh but only because there is sooo few hearts that 10 hearts = 30 quests in WoW so essentially you are completely 3 quests with 1 heart… so obviously they will give you variety to compensate.

Plenty of people liked questing in WoW. There are a whole lot of people that keep rolling alts, because they don’t like end game and they just like questing.

Your problem is, you can’t acknowledge that other people might like something other than what you like. But they do.

I’d rather be questing than playing an “end game”, even though I’m quite good at end game. I just find end game silly.

Nope, no such thing. Content is viable to me because I ENJOY it. I’m still doing stuff I find fun. There are always some harder DEs in zones I can try to solo, for example (and not on a zerker warrior). With my build of choice, based on what my character would like to do.

And I was referring to the difficulty of the dungeons, which are difficult for lots of people. If not for you, congrats. You’re uber. We all bow to you.

nexxe.7081:

Vayne.8563:

I was just thinking about this, and you know, I hardly ever run a dungeon WITH a warrior. Almost never. Oh, ocassionally here and there, but they’re the real exception to the rule. And then I thought about it….

Why not make dungeon groups and exclude warriors from them. Just post something on gw2lfg.com that looks like this.

Want to run SE Path 1…warriors need not apply!

First it would be funny to see how they like it, particularly if lots of people start doing it, but more, it would give everyone else a chance to get in their dungeon runs, without kowtowing to the efficiency slaves.

I think it’s a good move.

What about us new warriors that just want to have fun and experience the dungeon for the first time? Will you shun us because of the majority of players who use them for speed runs?

No, I’m not shunning anyone. Read the rest of the thread. This thread is basically making fun of the perceived problem of warriors.

My guild usually runs dungeons in guild and we don’t care what profession anyone is. lol

Camman.2984:

jesterscript.7493:

Vayne.8563:

Funny, I’ve had the same experience. I’ve leveled dozens of characters in many games over the years, and this is the first time I’ve ever really enjoyed the process all the way through…on all six of my characters.

The leveling process is simply a matter of personal taste. A lot of people really like it (and a lot don’t).

Is it? Really?

Of course it is. I’m a R1 in World of Warcraft (Best in my class in the country for about 6 months) and I have Max levels in WoW, SWTOR, LoTOR and more. This leveling I really didn’t like. I hated the lack of direction. Some times you get 2 levels in 30 minutes. Other times, you get 1 hour every level and a half.

I don’t get my feeling of fun from walking around. I’ll walk around when I feel powerful enough to. Which brings me to Max level and good gear. I like walking into a zone and feeling “I’m the strongest person in this entire area” it’s a great feeling. I hate the “I’m a level 6 in a Charr zone and my gear is ugly and my skills are weak”

See I’d never go back to a game without downleveling now. I don’t want to be stuck in a couple of end game zones for actual play. I want to play anywhere I feel like and feel like the content is at least a little viable.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Vayne.8563:

If you’d never played any game like any of these and you had Guild Wars 2 dungeons up front, they’d seem impossible.

Anyone recall when Ascalonian Catacombs was supposedly way too hard to be the first dungeon in the game, then it became one of the few which always had groups running it out front?

Well yeah, that too. But what I meant was, after years of playing so many MMOs, the entry level to difficulty goes up. People who have never played MMOs before find dungeons much harder than I do.

evo.8640:

Vayne.8563:

Snip

You’re accusing me for the very thing you’re promoting in your own post. Hypocrite much?

You’re the one who’s focusing on bosses. I’m simply stating a fact that within the dungeons, there were simply far more bosses to kill. On top of having far more dungeons over all. If you really knew anything about the original dungeons, you’d know they were more about pathing than GW2 is, lol. Just to tack on for kicks, they were much larger and there was far more to do in the dungeons. Hint: quests, and most not arbitrary ones in the 60’s.

I’d have to disagree with you if you think that anything within the current pve model of GW2 is hard. Skipping trash or not. That’s entirely subjective. I found them to be very easy and was running around with my title long before people were skipping trash. Also long before trash was removed/nerfed.

I’ll say it again. WoW had basically everything you’re mentioning upon it’s release in some form or another. But because it’s branded with some bright icon or what have you, you immediately come to the conclusion that it’s additional content. lol

Or how about that outdoor pvp GW2 has… oh wait. What about all the super deep crafting GW2 also has… oh wait. I can go on with multiple instances of content that WoW had, that GW2 doesn’t. Since you’re picking minor nuances that exist in both games.

The point is still holding strong despite your flawed definition of what content actually is, you’re very much way off the mark.

Nope. I’m not way off mark. Wow was okay. That’s it. It was buggy as hell at launch, far buggier than Guild Wars 2 was. The servers were down all the time.

And people finished the content slower because it was just grind. It wasn’t fun for me. It might have been fun for you. The dungeons were trash mobs and bosses. Mind you, when you were playing WoW, it was all new and you probably had less experience. If you’d never played any game like any of these and you had Guild Wars 2 dungeons up front, they’d seem impossible.

They’re only easy because we all have 87 years of MMOs behind us. I still like them better than WoW dungeons, but that’s another story.

Me, I prefer the open world. I find that more enjoyable. Guild Wars 2 has a big open world and, get this, due to downscaling, it’s not irrelevant as you level. That IS more content.

And you know, it’s really okay to like WoW better than you like Guild Wars 2. That’s fine.

But don’t say it had more content. Because that’s simply not true.

Jemmi.6058:

Ah sorry Vayne, the issues of loss of tone in text posts

Yeah, I was being somewhat flippant. I thought people would get that by now, particularly with my answers in all the threads about zerker warriors, and how some of us play without worrying about the extra five minutes a dungeon might take.

Just find a guild, and hang out with them while doing stuff. It makes the game so much better. Even if you’re not grouped with them, if you’re chatting on mumble, you can be having fun, while having fun. And you have built in people there for when you do need help with a hard event or a dungeon run, or whatever.

Having the right people to play with is part of what makes MMOs so much fun.

hahaha I never saw that. Thanks. lmao

Jemmi.6058:

Fight prejudice with prejudice?? Ridiculous.

I go out of my way to not join any group that excludes certain professions, newbies or asks for gear-pings.

Also, I just got my warrior to 80! Don’t exclude me! lol

It’s not a serious post…it’s a post made to illustrate the ridiculous of it all. As I said, I only run with guildies and I take any profession.

I’m just satirizing a ridiculous situation. I guess it didn’t come off that way. This is my protest against the efficiency crowd that’s all.