Guild Wars 2

Kraggy.4169:

Rayden.3695:

yeah, the instanced maps with a ~150 player cap does create an illusion of not so many people playing. Also that might count also the asian region(China) which is separate from NA and EU and probs has atleast as many players.

The number of times I’m plagued with “this map is closing” crap every day I don’t think it’s an illusion.

I don’t think you understand how the mega-server works. Basically as more and more people log into a specific map, more and more copies of that map are created. In order for all those maps to have emptied out, they have to have been created in the first place.

So you’re on a map, say something like Brisban Wildands, and some guilds are doing missions. As soon as they finish their bounty on that map, they leave en masse. That means there are far fewer people on that map. But the map might not have existed before that guild went there.

You dont’ see them, maybe because they’re on the other side of the map, but it doesn’t mean they weren’t there.

One guy in my guild told me this week that he was in an empty zone in VB. That no one else was in the whole zone.

So I popped a tag at a champ and in a very very short amount of time, there were 20 people there. The zone wasn’t empty. It was perceived as empty.

Now there wasn’t just one champ on this map. It was nighttime and five champs were all up.

If there were 20 people at each of those, that’s 100 people on the map. We didn’t see 100 people though, only the people who were on my tag.

To add to that, there were probably also people flax farming, or just trying to get hero points, or just trying to unlock waypoints that weren’t at any of the boss locations.

Maps can’t close if there aren’t enough people to create them in the first place.

Kraggy.4169:

Rayden.3695:

yeah, the instanced maps with a ~150 player cap does create an illusion of not so many people playing. Also that might count also the asian region(China) which is separate from NA and EU and probs has atleast as many players.

The number of times I’m plagued with “this map is closing” crap every day I don’t think it’s an illusion.

You clearly don’t understand how the system works. People move maps all the time. Plenty of maps have an event on them or a guild mission people do, and the guild moves to the next mission moves maps. They didn’t necessarily stop playing they’re simply on a different map.

So if you get that a map is closing that means there were enough people to spawn that extra map in the first place.

You don’t just whip up a few dungeons. Creating a dungeon is a major undertaking. Anet is focusing on fractals, not dungeons for the future five man content. They said so. I wouldn’t expect new dungeons.

AWACS.6537:

Gathslan.1870:

You need to be out of your mind to expect an expansion to be as big as the core game..

Guild wars 2 is the only game where people complain about a reasonably priced expansion, the only MMO i have ever seen where people compare an expansions size to the original game(news flash, the original game took MANY MORE YEARS TO MAKE)

This community is out of its frigging mind. Compared to other fully priced expansions in other games HOT is just fine, especially if you consider how many patches and more content we will get for the price we spent.

WOD has less content than HOT has for example and recieved only a few kittenty patches, now everyone is stuck there waiting for the next expansion.

YOU DID NOT ONLY PAY FOR THE NEW ZONES, YOU ALSO PAID FOR ALL THE PATCHES TO COME. New living world seasons, new zones. New raids and who knows what else.

So are you telling me that I bought a season pass instead of an expansion?

Well if they continue doing what they did with Guild Wars 1’s core game, sure. You bought a season pass as well as the core game, because that’s how it worked out. Indications seem to be they’re going with a hybrid living story/expansion model. Which would make this true.

Swift.1930:

Vayne.8563:

Yes there was more content in the core game than there is in the “expansion”. I put expansion in quotes, because so many people seem to think of this as a standard expansion. It’s not. It’s added stuff to the game that goes far beyond what a normal expansion adds. Not in more maps, but in a roadmap for the game ahead. It’s almost like Guild Wars 2 2.0 or something. Specializations and elite specializations are a complete rewrite of the trait system. Masteries are a complete rewrite of the post 80 progression system. Guilds now have a form of progress as well, and guild halls are entire maps.

Pretty sure Age of Empires 2 expansions are still counted as expansions… and they add mechanics, civilizations, units, functions, maps, storylines, and tons of other things that in some cases go beyond the original vision for the game. Check out the latest one (released ~two weeks ago?) if you don’t believe me. =P

I’m pretty sure Age of Empires isn’t an MMO and can’t really be compared to an MMORPG. You have to look at what MMORPGs are, not what other games are. I’ve been playing baseball my whole life, but they’ve yet ot release an expansion.

You’re clearly just arguing here to argue.

morrolan.9608:

Vayne.8563:

Yes there was more content in the core game than there is in the “expansion”. I put expansion in quotes, because so many people seem to think of this as a standard expansion. It’s not. It’s added stuff to the game that goes far beyond what a normal expansion adds. Not in more maps, but in a roadmap for the game ahead. It’s almost like Guild Wars 2 2.0 or something. Specializations and elite specializations are a complete rewrite of the trait system. Masteries are a complete rewrite of the post 80 progression system. Guilds now have a form of progress as well, and guild halls are entire maps.

Funny swtor’s xpac has done exactly that as well and has added a great new story and revised every system in the game to provide a platform to move forward, significantly more than in HOT and did it for 1 months subscription.

And you know what if HOT is the future for GW2 then its not a good thing, there are significant rumblings about the increase in the grind across every aspect of the game. The player unfriendly systems have moved closer to the toxic systems of free to play games and more and more players are put off by such systems.

SWToR with it’s “optional” sub, because you can’t get a second bar for skills, and you can’t hide your helm without paying a sub. You pay a lot more for your expansions in SWToR. If you want to compare, compare everything.

I don’t know a single person that plays SWToR that doesn’t sub. If you’re playing for free, you play the story and stop. After that you’re subbing. So yeah, they get $15 a month from those players and still sell them an expansion. People call Anet greedy. If only they knew.

I think you’d have to give some leeway to the numbers, since Anet hasn’t announced numbers. Anyway it certainly doesn’t look like the doom and gloom some forum goers are trying to push.

Vavume.8065:

Vayne.8563:

Vavume.8065:

PyrateSilly.4710:

You expect an MMO to NOT change? You haven’t played many MMO’s if you expect it stay the same.

The problem is GW2 changed to become the same as other MMO’s, that’s the point the OP is making and I agree, GW2 used to be very unique as an MMO, not so anymore, other than dodge its now pretty much a standard cookie cutter MMO.

You find stuff like the jungle in other MMOs. Which are those, might I ask. You know a lot of other MMOs that don’t raise the level cap with expansions or come out with new tiers of gear?

Can you list these?

What do you think legendary armor is?, that is basically a new tier of gear, sure the stats are the same, but its more desireable than ascended gear, which is more desirable than exotic gear, you see the tiers yet? This game launched with just exotic armor… clearly they have added new tiers of gear….

P.S are you actually asking me to list MMO’s with jungle? like its some new concept? world of Warcraft has jungle https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aFGyx0_AWI

If the stats are the same, then yes, it’s not a new tier. Stop making up definitions to suit your argument.

Disingenuous post is disingenuous. Jungles in WoW are NOTHING like the kind of jungle area you see in HoT. The closest I’ve seen in any game would be something like Scarlet Gorge in Rift and it’s still just a flat zone with verticality. The whole design of the jungle, not the jungle itself, is like nothing I’ve seen in any other MMO.

If you have, point it out. Not the “jungle” in WoW, which is nothing like this.

Yes there was more content in the core game than there is in the “expansion”. I put expansion in quotes, because so many people seem to think of this as a standard expansion. It’s not. It’s added stuff to the game that goes far beyond what a normal expansion adds. Not in more maps, but in a roadmap for the game ahead. It’s almost like Guild Wars 2 2.0 or something. Specializations and elite specializations are a complete rewrite of the trait system. Masteries are a complete rewrite of the post 80 progression system. Guilds now have a form of progress as well, and guild halls are entire maps.

The four maps introduced in HoT are far more complex than any previous maps in the game. Far, far more complex. They’re large, they have multiple levels and they introduce gliding and updrafts. You may not like those things but there’s evidence a lot of people do.

Anet also added raids, a combat mode and a lot of new collections, which you may or may not like. They added a boatload of new minigames (yes some of us like the adventures) they added new meta events, they added new AI, a new profession and new technology was implemented for skills of that profession.

Content is content, but the back end stuff is just as important if not more important because it changes the entire future of the game.

Some people don’t like that change and some people do. But HoT, in a lot of ways, really is a reboot of Guild Wars 2.

And once some of the bugs are worked out of that system, we’ll see just how popular it is.

And let’s not forget it’s also going to be a season pass for other changes coming. That’s part of the value too.

What’s funny is I can play half an hour on the new maps, get some events, open some chests, kill a few bosses and leave.

Only people who absolutely feel the need to maximize their achievements in each play cycle are forced to spend more than an hour.

I often log into the new maps for shorter periods of time, do a bit of stuff and leave. This whole having to stay the whole time is a bit silly, considering I’m always making progress.

Not everyone has to make progress at a record pace. I’m quite happy chipping away at things.

Qugi.2653:

Raziel.4216:

Qugi.2653:

Raziel.4216:

That’s exactly what I’d like to know, I wanna know the source for these claims. Forums are full of a bunch of posts that claim “lots of people” like/dislike specific parts of the game.

Are you going also ask Vayne for the source of the claim he make?

Vayne.8563:

there are a lot of people, even casuals, who like the new content.

I should not post that because people derail the thread topic me to because I post that. Thread topic is will you prepurchase next expansion. Many other thread for people to argue about if like current expansion or not. So please do not derail any more.

That post comes as a reply in a discussion where someone else talks about how casuals dislike the game.
IIRC Vayne has said mutiple times that we should wait at least 6 months for evidence.

Still wait for Vayne’s source that, “there are a lot of people, even casuals, who like the new content.” See how this work? I will wait for source.

Now do not derail thread. Topic is will you prepurchase next expansion? Yes or no. Not let us argue who like this expansion.

My source is a guild full of casuals who like the new zones. If I know even ten guys that like it (and I know a whole lot more), and I know these people to be casual, then what are the odds that they’re the only ten people who like it. It’s a ridiculous comment.

I run a casual guild. There are a couple of players in my guild you might consider hard core. But over 200 people in the guild aren’t. I have well over fifty people (closer to 100) logging in every day and playing. They’re enjoying themselves, leveling masteries, doing the story, learning the new zones.

In fact, my guild hasn’t touched the raid yet at all. Most of my guild probably doesn’t even know about the dungeon nerf, because they didn’t run dungeons.

But they’re enjoying the new zones.

Soon.5240:

warbignime.4610:

Anet never told people that it’s a cheap way, it’s a non RNG way to get precouser it doesn’t mean cheaper, easier or faster to get.

Anet also never told us that if we bang our heads against brick walls, it might hurt.

PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT:

Attention GW2 Players: Don’t bang your heads against a brick walls.

Not even close. Terrible analogy is terrible.

Some people can’t save 600 gold ever, period. It’s not in their blood. But they can tool away at a collection at a bit at time in smaller amounts.

For me, I enjoy the scavenger hunt feel more than buying it off the trading post, yes, even if it is more gold.

It’s more entertaining for me to get parts to a collection. Just because you don’t like it, doesn’t mean it’s banging your head against a brick wall. For some of us, it’s pretty cool.

Essentially it’s more fun for me to farm random stuff than it is to farm gold, which has far more limited channels.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Vayne.8563:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Vayne.8563:

Manasa Devi.7958:

warbignime.4610:

Addressing forum complain is not possible because forum literally complain about every single thing in GW2 and every changes no matter good or bad.

Yes Anet made design change and it’s good decision, old maps are boring and brainless. New maps are challenging and fun if you want casual content core tyria offers plenty.

So your advice to casual players is not to buy expansions?

Casual, solo players who don’t want content that’s challenging, yeah, I think they’d be disappointed with the expansion.

But not every casual player demands to be a solo player and not every casual player demands content you can beat while watching Game of Thrones on your other monitor.

But very few casual players would be clamouring for a game you have to synchronize your watch with and that demands you to play multiple straight hours to get anywhere.

When every aspect of the expansionis so extreme as to likely scare off some players, the totally of those aspects is likely to scare off many players.

That’s crap. First of all you don’t have to synchronize your watch for most things. I have a ton of casual players in my guild who haven’t even figured out there is a meta yet, and most of them are having a good time. They run some events, they get some loot. That’s what a lot of casual players do.

Hint, most casuals don’t haunt forums. They don’t follow development cycles. They run around and do stuff. That’s their game.

I have a guild filled with casual players. It’s a real education sometimes.

You appear to be talking about players who are casual about what happens in the game.

I’m talking about players who are casual about when they game, but who are very involved with the game when they do.

Well I’m not really the one who slings the word casual about. Me. I’m a hard core casual. And I’m happy with the game. I know casual casuals who are happy with the game. And yes, I’ve heard from some of the posts from other people who are casual who aren’t happy.

The problem is, this isn’t a one side issue because there are a lot of people, even casuals, who like the new content.

You’re talking about a group that’s very specific that you invented to support your hypothesis. Casuals don’t all fall into one box, so saying, as you said, that I said casuals shouldn’t be this expansion is wrong. Because some casuals should. But those who want to have very easy, soloable content, probably shouldn’t.

On that note, quite a few casuals that I’ve taken into those zones who didn’t like it before I took them in, because they didn’t really get what had to be done, liked it a lot better after.

Some people just give up very easily and that’s it. They walk away and never look back. Probably quite a few people.

But I wouldn’t want to design a game around them.

No one is saying the expansion doesn’t have flaws. But then, some of us allow time to work out those flaws. And some of us don’t.

eldrin.6471:

so people you ask in games opinions matter more to you than the thousands of posts on these forums?well each to there own.

There are not a thosuand people complaining on the forums. There are likely less than a hundred. Several of them complain constantly in every thread, so you don’t have hundreds of people actually complaining.

And in most complaint threads, not all but most, half the posts are saying something other than what the thread is saying. Saying there are thousands of people complaining on the forums is very likely inaccurate.

Inoki.6048:

Definitely not.

I’ll never understand how can anybody like the mess ANet created that is becoming Star Wars by the day, with perhaps the exception of those playing a Guardian, Revenant or Necromancer who obviously don’t have a reason to complain about their already OP classes, because they didn’t lose anything with the “expansion”, they only gained, while others (Rangers are a perfect example but not the only ones) either lost a lot or didn’t gain anything to counter the might the before mentioned gained; and then there are people with abundance of money to waste on the gem store and support ANet in their wrongdoing.

I’m still hoping for the day to come, when Thieves won’t be able to teleport from lower ground up to upper levels (like rooftops), teleport through walls or from under a bridge on top of it and virtually anywhere they like… When one won’t become a snail just for entering combat, and a lot of the ridiculous mechanics removed. Maybe at the age of 60 it might happen.

Overall, there’s a lot of inconsistency/imbalance in this game, not worth the time, money, energy and definitely not worth the aggravation.

Instead of spending money here I’ll gladly spend it with competition.

I main a ranger and I’m very happy with the changes to the profession. I don’t know about you, but my pets stay alive for a lot longer. And yeah, I like the druid as well.

I agree with most of this post, but a couple of things, I don’t agree with, or at least I"m not sure I agree with.

Not 100% sure about increased rewards. I’m not against it, I’m just not necessarily sure it’s necessary. Sure everyone wants more rewards, but that doesn’t make it necessarily something that should be done.

The Tangled Depths map is not going to be redone and it’s a really cool map. I hope it’s not redone, actually.

Also high point masteries should be less useful than low point ones. Because you don’t want to make something so useful that people feel they have to grind for it. The most useful masteries should be those easy to get. Which means the later ones can be done at a much more leisurely pace, People are complaining about grinding already. Making really cool stuff for the highest level masteries just makes that problem worse.

Other than those comments, good post OP. I hope Anet takes note of it.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Vayne.8563:

Manasa Devi.7958:

warbignime.4610:

Addressing forum complain is not possible because forum literally complain about every single thing in GW2 and every changes no matter good or bad.

Yes Anet made design change and it’s good decision, old maps are boring and brainless. New maps are challenging and fun if you want casual content core tyria offers plenty.

So your advice to casual players is not to buy expansions?

Casual, solo players who don’t want content that’s challenging, yeah, I think they’d be disappointed with the expansion.

But not every casual player demands to be a solo player and not every casual player demands content you can beat while watching Game of Thrones on your other monitor.

But very few casual players would be clamouring for a game you have to synchronize your watch with and that demands you to play multiple straight hours to get anywhere.

When every aspect of the expansionis so extreme as to likely scare off some players, the totally of those aspects is likely to scare off many players.

That’s crap. First of all you don’t have to synchronize your watch for most things. I have a ton of casual players in my guild who haven’t even figured out there is a meta yet, and most of them are having a good time. They run some events, they get some loot. That’s what a lot of casual players do.

Hint, most casuals don’t haunt forums. They don’t follow development cycles. They run around and do stuff. That’s their game.

I have a guild filled with casual players. It’s a real education sometimes.

I play from Australia too and sometimes the ping is frustrating. Not much we can do about it. Servers here are pretty kitten ed expensive to run. It’s not worth it for most companies to do so.

saturn.4810:

Bull kitty indeed. You shouldn’t lose participation when volunteering, or when the map closes.

I think actually, you should get bonus participation for volunteering.

Unfortunately, this is just another example of how little Anet thought before releasing HoT, and how little they care after releasing it.

And this post is another example of how little the player base understands the creation of a major software title, and how fixing bugs takes time. It’s like some of you have never played an MMO before.

The complaints on forums of virtually every MMO after a major update pretty much look like this forum. Maybe there’s a reason for that.

Saying Anet doesn’t care because a bug hasn’t been fixed yet (when other issues have been dealt with) is just not on.

Manasa Devi.7958:

warbignime.4610:

Addressing forum complain is not possible because forum literally complain about every single thing in GW2 and every changes no matter good or bad.

Yes Anet made design change and it’s good decision, old maps are boring and brainless. New maps are challenging and fun if you want casual content core tyria offers plenty.

So your advice to casual players is not to buy expansions?

Casual, solo players who don’t want content that’s challenging, yeah, I think they’d be disappointed with the expansion.

But not every casual player demands to be a solo player and not every casual player demands content you can beat while watching Game of Thrones on your other monitor.

If you like more challenging content, yes, it’s worth coming back. I’m enjoying the jungle immensely. Some people don’t like it, though. They think it’s too hard or they just like to solo and they’re having trouble.

Tigaseye.2047:

Vayne.8563:

Tigaseye.2047:

Vayne.8563:

Grim West.3194:

Vayne.8563:

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

Anet has gone silent again? You must live in a bubble. Let’s talk about the “silence” of Anet for a second.

People complained about 400 points needed for elite specializations and Anet fixed that, by reducing it to 250, which very few people complain about.

People complained about high level mastery gating in the story and Anet removed some of it, so that people could get through the story with only a few basic masteries that are easy to level.

People complained about some hero points, and so Anet changed some of them to make them easier.

They came out with the commander UI, the new legendaries and the raids, just as they said they would and most people seem to be enjoying the raids, at least those that like that sort of thing.

People complained about Fractal rewards and Anet posted they’re working on them and that they’d be fixed/changed in December.

Anet hasn’t been silent in any way, shape or form and only someone deliberately ignoring what’s being said would say so.

Raiding is for serious players who invest time and energy into the game. The few people who think ascended gear is too hard or expensive to get that leave the game, they’ll be a tiny percent of the hard core community.

Actually the biggest “crisis” area of the game right now is WvW and Anet communicated about that too and said it’s simply too big a problem to have addressed yet, but they are working on it and will continue to work on it.

Anet hasn’t be silent and by saying so, you make me question everything else you’ve said.

white knight at its finest here. as you are in many other posts. sorry but arenanet is whispering only, which equals to many people as silence, we are working on it or changes will come next month (promises promises) are not really things that people want to hear. I think what people trying to say is that they want MORE communication from arenanet other then a simpe blogpost. where are all the devs that usually post on the forums? many are used that on a regular base devs reply to topics, SPECIALLY when there are so many “complaints” ( I rather say worries about the future of this game). I do get your point of view. but it seems you are blindly following every single word arenanet is telling you. ´this makes you look like a white knight.

There’s being a white knight and there’s ignoring fact. Which thing did I say wasn’t a fact?

Did Anet change the hero point total needed to unlocked elite specializations. Yes.
Did Anet change some of the hero points, turning them into either communes or veterans? Yes.
Did Anet post about fixing fractal rewards next month? Yes.
Did Anet release the raids and new commander UI yes.

And through all of it they’ve been talking to us. Now talking to us doesn’t mean they’re going to tell you what you want to hear, but saying they’re not talking to us is demonstrably false.

And using terms like White Knight to try to make what I say look untrue is pointless, because what I’ve said is factually true and can be checked.

I’m sorry you have some kind of problem with the game, but that doesn’t mean Anet isn’t talking to us. Saying they’re not is simply wrong.

It’s one thing to complain about something you like. It’s another thing to try to contradict fact. It’s a pointless exercise.

You are white knighting ANET. Those changes were minor and just bandaids on a very horrible expansion.

Actually HoT is more of a “contraction” for many players. WvW has been decimated, small guilds have been kicked to the curb, all their hard work taken away. Dungeons abandonded and huge grind / pay wall set up for everyone to “enjoy”.

HoT is garbage.

Absolutely your opinion and you’re entitled to it. Having a different opinion, however, doesn’t make me a white knight. I’ll always call out BS wherever I see it, not just here, but everywhere.

I didn’t address the OP’s complaints in total. I address something I consider to be a factual fallacy. And that’s ALL I did.

If you have something to say that addresses what I actually said, by all means, quote me. But if you’re just going to call me a white knight because I have a different opinion than you, well, I guess that pretty much says it all right there.

Have a great night.

Vayne, I have noticed that many people call you a white knight, on here and it’s pretty obvious that that is simply because you always seem to defend Anet, in your posts.

You may be calling out “factual fallacies”, as you see them, but these corrections always seem to be in Anet’s favour, for some reason.

If you criticised them, even 20% of the time, people probably wouldn’t call you that.

I’m, genuinely, glad for you if your opinion just happens to coincide with Anet’s, all the time, even when they make seemingly contradictory, or confusing, moves.

But, of course, that seemingly constant support will look unusual to people who see you post regularly, on here.

Most people come to the forum because they have an issue with one, or more, things in the game and if someone is always on here and always appearing to toe the company line, of course it will look odd and/or suspicious to most of them.

At the end of the day, I’m sure Anet can defend themselves perfectly well, if they ever feel the need.

It’s not your job to have to do it.

Or, I assume it’s not, anyway.

I come from a different generation than many posters and I’m not as free with words like lazy and hate and disaster. My problems with hyperbole isn’t limited to Guild Wars 2. In fact, it’s not limited at all. I’ve been through a couple of pretty distressing legal cases where language was used to make things seem a lot worse than they actually were. It’s left be quite sensitive to people accusing other people of something. So this isn’t really a Guild Wars 2 fan boy thing, so much as I stop making personal attacks type thing. I’ve done it in other forums in the past as well, and I do it in real life, even if Guild Wars 2 isn’t involved.

I have no problem with the OP saying HoT is lackluster and I never said anything against it. He’s expressing an opinion, which is his right.

But anytime anyone accuses someone of something that they may not have done, yes, I’m going to take issue with it. If people want to see me as Lancelot, that’s okay. I don’t really have an issue with it. Since when is fighting for something you believe in a bad thing.

And no, Anet really can’t defend themselves. They can’t afford to. They can’t come out and call someone out for getting stuff wrong because it would actually make them look bad.

Where as I don’t personally care if I look bad on a forum. It’s not really an issue for me.

I see.

I don’t think you look bad, Vayne.

You’re just, probably completely unintentionally (from the sound of it), frustrating already frustrated people further!

Sometimes, I think it’s better to just say “I know how you feel…” or “I understand…”, rather than worrying about every little detail they have said being factually correct.

Or, even if you are going to put someone right, factually speaking (which I also feel the need to do, sometimes), to try to sandwich that information between an “I understand how you feel…” and a “Having said that, as I say, I do get what you mean.”, or whatever.

This is just about someone’s personal opinions about a game and/or a games company’s communication levels/venues, after all.

Fortunately, it’s not really that important, in the scheme of things.

I say that too sometimes. I do say to a lot of people I understand why you’d feel this way, and I can sympathize. However, someone saying smething is utter crap or a disaster or whatever, nope. I can’t say that I’d going to sympathize with that person.

However, I can point to lots of times when I actually understand why people feel as they do. I understand why small guilds feel done over. I get that completely.

I understand why some solo players feel that the game is now not soloable (even though a lot of it is).

I understand why people who play WwW feel disenfranchised, or even why people who play Fractals feel done over by the rewards.

But I think HoT is a lot better than a lot of people give it credit for two. The zone design is my favorite part. I find HoT more immersive than the core game, because I’m fighting for me life and involved in a war. That, to me, is immersive.

In the core world I never really felt like I was in danger and that was becoming a problem for me.

Grim West.3194:

And apparently a huge portion of HoT players don’t think it is fun… hence the empty maps and endless complaints.

A huge portion of the players do think it’s fun. See how easy that is. I get on full maps. Not sure what your problem is. And I’m not grinding. I’m having fun. Yes, I enjoy the events on the maps. I enjoy some of the adventures. I enjoy protecting camps from Modrem. I enjoy gliding and trying to discover stuff in the canopy. I enjoy playing story missions. I enjoy learning how to use different character’s in the jungle.

So yeah, HoT is fun FOR me. Now how much exactly is a huge portion? Because frankly I think that, while there are people who hate hot, there are plenty of people having fun in game.

Tigaseye.2047:

Vayne.8563:

Grim West.3194:

Vayne.8563:

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

Anet has gone silent again? You must live in a bubble. Let’s talk about the “silence” of Anet for a second.

People complained about 400 points needed for elite specializations and Anet fixed that, by reducing it to 250, which very few people complain about.

People complained about high level mastery gating in the story and Anet removed some of it, so that people could get through the story with only a few basic masteries that are easy to level.

People complained about some hero points, and so Anet changed some of them to make them easier.

They came out with the commander UI, the new legendaries and the raids, just as they said they would and most people seem to be enjoying the raids, at least those that like that sort of thing.

People complained about Fractal rewards and Anet posted they’re working on them and that they’d be fixed/changed in December.

Anet hasn’t been silent in any way, shape or form and only someone deliberately ignoring what’s being said would say so.

Raiding is for serious players who invest time and energy into the game. The few people who think ascended gear is too hard or expensive to get that leave the game, they’ll be a tiny percent of the hard core community.

Actually the biggest “crisis” area of the game right now is WvW and Anet communicated about that too and said it’s simply too big a problem to have addressed yet, but they are working on it and will continue to work on it.

Anet hasn’t be silent and by saying so, you make me question everything else you’ve said.

white knight at its finest here. as you are in many other posts. sorry but arenanet is whispering only, which equals to many people as silence, we are working on it or changes will come next month (promises promises) are not really things that people want to hear. I think what people trying to say is that they want MORE communication from arenanet other then a simpe blogpost. where are all the devs that usually post on the forums? many are used that on a regular base devs reply to topics, SPECIALLY when there are so many “complaints” ( I rather say worries about the future of this game). I do get your point of view. but it seems you are blindly following every single word arenanet is telling you. ´this makes you look like a white knight.

There’s being a white knight and there’s ignoring fact. Which thing did I say wasn’t a fact?

Did Anet change the hero point total needed to unlocked elite specializations. Yes.
Did Anet change some of the hero points, turning them into either communes or veterans? Yes.
Did Anet post about fixing fractal rewards next month? Yes.
Did Anet release the raids and new commander UI yes.

And through all of it they’ve been talking to us. Now talking to us doesn’t mean they’re going to tell you what you want to hear, but saying they’re not talking to us is demonstrably false.

And using terms like White Knight to try to make what I say look untrue is pointless, because what I’ve said is factually true and can be checked.

I’m sorry you have some kind of problem with the game, but that doesn’t mean Anet isn’t talking to us. Saying they’re not is simply wrong.

It’s one thing to complain about something you like. It’s another thing to try to contradict fact. It’s a pointless exercise.

You are white knighting ANET. Those changes were minor and just bandaids on a very horrible expansion.

Actually HoT is more of a “contraction” for many players. WvW has been decimated, small guilds have been kicked to the curb, all their hard work taken away. Dungeons abandonded and huge grind / pay wall set up for everyone to “enjoy”.

HoT is garbage.

Absolutely your opinion and you’re entitled to it. Having a different opinion, however, doesn’t make me a white knight. I’ll always call out BS wherever I see it, not just here, but everywhere.

I didn’t address the OP’s complaints in total. I address something I consider to be a factual fallacy. And that’s ALL I did.

If you have something to say that addresses what I actually said, by all means, quote me. But if you’re just going to call me a white knight because I have a different opinion than you, well, I guess that pretty much says it all right there.

Have a great night.

Vayne, I have noticed that many people call you a white knight, on here and it’s pretty obvious that that is simply because you always seem to defend Anet, in your posts.

You may be calling out “factual fallacies”, as you see them, but these corrections always seem to be in Anet’s favour, for some reason.

If you criticised them, even 20% of the time, people probably wouldn’t call you that.

I’m, genuinely, glad for you if your opinion just happens to coincide with Anet’s, all the time, even when they make seemingly contradictory, or confusing, moves.

But, of course, that seemingly constant support will look unusual to people who see you post regularly, on here.

Most people come to the forum because they have an issue with one, or more, things in the game and if someone is always on here and always appearing to toe the company line, of course it will look odd and/or suspicious to most of them.

At the end of the day, I’m sure Anet can defend themselves perfectly well, if they ever feel the need.

It’s not your job to have to do it.

Or, I assume it’s not, anyway.

I come from a different generation than many posters and I’m not as free with words like lazy and hate and disaster. My problems with hyperbole isn’t limited to Guild Wars 2. In fact, it’s not limited at all. I’ve been through a couple of pretty distressing legal cases where language was used to make things seem a lot worse than they actually were. It’s left be quite sensitive to people accusing other people of something. So this isn’t really a Guild Wars 2 fan boy thing, so much as I stop making personal attacks type thing. I’ve done it in other forums in the past as well, and I do it in real life, even if Guild Wars 2 isn’t involved.

I have no problem with the OP saying HoT is lackluster and I never said anything against it. He’s expressing an opinion, which is his right.

But anytime anyone accuses someone of something that they may not have done, yes, I’m going to take issue with it. If people want to see me as Lancelot, that’s okay. I don’t really have an issue with it. Since when is fighting for something you believe in a bad thing.

And no, Anet really can’t defend themselves. They can’t afford to. They can’t come out and call someone out for getting stuff wrong because it would actually make them look bad.

Where as I don’t personally care if I look bad on a forum. It’s not really an issue for me.

nobleroar.2078:

Vayne.8563:

I responded to someone else who was slinging their opinion around as if it were some kind of fact. It’s not.

Rofls

anyways, being able to adapt is one thing but being able to identify problems is another.

While loyal fans are defending anet, loyal fans are also coming out and pointing out the issues with the design decisions. Anet should take notes of what going on in the forum as issue raised can be crucial for them to retain their player base. #justsaying

I agree with you. I think Anet should (and does) pay attention to what’s said on the forum. For example, I don’t believe that mastery points should be tied into adventures. I think that’s a mistake.

I think that having the raid entrance in a zone that needs people for the meta is a mistake. I think that having some collections depend on doing events that only spawn after another event fails is a mistake. I believe that break bar changes made to certain foes in the open world have screwed up certain encounters, like Sotz the Scallywag, needed for certain guild missions.

And I don’t think small guilds should lose functionality and have to earn stuff over again. I think that was a mistake.

Which doesn’t mean I’m not a loyal fan. It just means that the problems some people have are different than the problems i have.

Manasa Devi.7958:

I’m sorry, I left out an important part. I’ve edited my post accordingly.

You claim to be pretty sure of something. You use your own tiny little experience to illustrate. And then you patronize someone about comfirmation bias.

Priceless.

I’m pretty sure of something, and I said it as a response to someone stating their opinion as fact. Yep. That’s right. I’m pretty sure of something based on my experience, not just with this game, but over the course of many years, with many different games.

But I didn’t come to the forums slinging that opinion around. I responded to someone else who was slinging their opinion around as if it were some kind of fact. It’s not.

I’m quite happy to wait to see what six months brings. What’s priceless is your seemingly endless attempts to make a reasonable point of view seem unreasonable.

It’s very entertaining. It’s also not working. The people who have already judged me a white knight aren’t listening to what I say anyway, but plenty of other people are. They can see the difference between someone making a hard and fast statement, and someone saying they don’t believe it’s so.

Since neither of us will have proof until time passes, I’m going to leave it at that. Have fun.

Grim West.3194:

You have blinders on. HoT is a disaster, white knighting it will not bring me or anyone else back to the game. GW2 isn’t the game it use to be and most of the changes HoT brought to the table are garbage.

We’ll see in six month as I say. Hot is fun as hell. Not a little fun. It’s a lot fun. And as time goes on, one of us will be proved right.

Now it’s true YOU might not like it, but that doesn’t make it a disaster. You can file that under hyperbole. HoT has certainly received a mixed reaction, but I’m relatively sure it’s not anything remotely resembling a disaster. It’s probably shifted audiences to some degree though.

Vavume.8065:

PyrateSilly.4710:

You expect an MMO to NOT change? You haven’t played many MMO’s if you expect it stay the same.

The problem is GW2 changed to become the same as other MMO’s, that’s the point the OP is making and I agree, GW2 used to be very unique as an MMO, not so anymore, other than dodge its now pretty much a standard cookie cutter MMO.

You find stuff like the jungle in other MMOs. Which are those, might I ask. You know a lot of other MMOs that don’t raise the level cap with expansions or come out with new tiers of gear?

Can you list these?

Grim West.3194:

Small guilds lost everything they worked for and are being made to redo all the work they did before. Work that can’t be done by small guilds anymore. And making people redo the work they did before is not an expansion, it is a rip off.

WvW has had zero comunication.

There are a ton of issues with HoT, the empty maps and endless complaints should give you a clue.

I have a clue. You’ve listed two complaints, one of which Anet has commented on. I listed three complaints Anet has commented on and dealt with. So of the Five complaints we listed, four of them have received communication.

Some would say that’s like 80%.

Manasa Devi.7958:

This made my day.

Vayne.8563:

In my guild, more people came back, and no one has left, so this whole people are leaving claim? Meaningless.

<snip>

You should look up confirmation bias.

Oh, the irony.

In my guild, no one came back, by the way.

It’s not irony because I never made a claim in the first place. That is to say, I didn’t come to the forums and say the game was dead or no one was playing or the zones were empty. I responded to someone else’s claim. You should learn the difference.

My claim is that in six moths, you’ll see the game is doing fine. We’ll see that in black and white and then what will you say?

For now, it’s enough to point out that saying something is dead doesn’t make it dead. In fact, I can point to threads about the game being dead that go back 3 years.

Ergo, claiming it is meaningless. When you have some actual data to prove it get back to me.

Now, had I posted a my own thread or something in another thread talking about how health they game was, that would indeed be hypocritical. However, I’m happy to wait to see sales figures before I make snap judgements.

Grim West.3194:

What have they said about small guilds being kicked to the curb?

What have they said about WvW being decimated.

In fact what have they said about any of the major complaints about HoT?….. ZERO.

Minor bandaids and raids are not communication.

Okay they said, directly that WvW had major issues. They were aware of those issues and working on them. They’ve not gone into detail about it, but surely acknoweldgement that there’s a problem and it’s being worked on is communication.

Small guilds being “kicked to the curb” is a matter of opinion. Not all small guilds feel this way, and not all small guilds care about a guild hall. In fact, though this is a very loud problem, I don’t feel there’s much to say on it. They’re not talking about it, because they’ve already said what they feel a guild is. They communicated about the size of a small guild before the game even launched. What do you want them to say now.

But now you claim they haven’t said anything about any major problem.

Did or did not ANet say something about the point total for the unlocking elite specializations. Some say that was a major problem and that major problem was fixed.

Did or did not people complain about hero points and some of those have been fixed. Not all, but Anet made some changes.

Did or did not some people complain about the story being gated by some of the higher level masteries. Did or did not Anet fix that major problem. That was a huge problem for some people.

Did or did not Anet talk about the problem Fractal players have with rewards, and did or did not Anet say rewards would be altered in December?

Are you saying these aren’t major problems that didn’t have people complaining about them? Because if you are, you aren’t paying attention.

Pezz.4758:

i swear if vaynes name was oliver, kitten was cupcake, you could take these forums and replace wildstars 9 months ago with them and no one would be able to tell the difference, does no one see this? does anet not see this? its the same bleeding company!

This forum has been a nightmare for years. It’s not just recently. The fan base has been disenfranchised before. THere are people who don’t even play the game who come back to post and malign it.

This game isn’t like Wildstar for a lot of reasons. Wildstar had no existing fan base to begin with. It had a very bad launch. You can say anything you want, but most MMO forums are this bad.

Two years ago, people said the same kind of stuff. I guess we’ll see in six months, after the dust settles just how the game is doing.

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

Anet has gone silent again? You must live in a bubble. Let’s talk about the “silence” of Anet for a second.

People complained about 400 points needed for elite specializations and Anet fixed that, by reducing it to 250, which very few people complain about.

People complained about high level mastery gating in the story and Anet removed some of it, so that people could get through the story with only a few basic masteries that are easy to level.

People complained about some hero points, and so Anet changed some of them to make them easier.

They came out with the commander UI, the new legendaries and the raids, just as they said they would and most people seem to be enjoying the raids, at least those that like that sort of thing.

People complained about Fractal rewards and Anet posted they’re working on them and that they’d be fixed/changed in December.

Anet hasn’t been silent in any way, shape or form and only someone deliberately ignoring what’s being said would say so.

Raiding is for serious players who invest time and energy into the game. The few people who think ascended gear is too hard or expensive to get that leave the game, they’ll be a tiny percent of the hard core community.

Actually the biggest “crisis” area of the game right now is WvW and Anet communicated about that too and said it’s simply too big a problem to have addressed yet, but they are working on it and will continue to work on it.

Anet hasn’t be silent and by saying so, you make me question everything else you’ve said.

white knight at its finest here. as you are in many other posts. sorry but arenanet is whispering only, which equals to many people as silence, we are working on it or changes will come next month (promises promises) are not really things that people want to hear. I think what people trying to say is that they want MORE communication from arenanet other then a simpe blogpost. where are all the devs that usually post on the forums? many are used that on a regular base devs reply to topics, SPECIALLY when there are so many “complaints” ( I rather say worries about the future of this game). I do get your point of view. but it seems you are blindly following every single word arenanet is telling you. ´this makes you look like a white knight.

There’s being a white knight and there’s ignoring fact. Which thing did I say wasn’t a fact?

Did Anet change the hero point total needed to unlocked elite specializations. Yes.
Did Anet change some of the hero points, turning them into either communes or veterans? Yes.
Did Anet post about fixing fractal rewards next month? Yes.
Did Anet release the raids and new commander UI yes.

And through all of it they’ve been talking to us. Now talking to us doesn’t mean they’re going to tell you what you want to hear, but saying they’re not talking to us is demonstrably false.

And using terms like White Knight to try to make what I say look untrue is pointless, because what I’ve said is factually true and can be checked.

I’m sorry you have some kind of problem with the game, but that doesn’t mean Anet isn’t talking to us. Saying they’re not is simply wrong.

It’s one thing to complain about something you like. It’s another thing to try to contradict fact. It’s a pointless exercise.

I never said you said anything untrue or false, I never said they do not communicate, but it is a bare minimum they do, they are not being transparent about the things they do (anymore).
and I call you a white knight yes, could have called you a fanboi also.

I do not have a problem with the game itself, I have a problem with the future of the game as it stands NOW! It took a step forward but also a step backwards. I play since day one (gw1) and i seen this happen several times, I always followed everything, but HoT was a wobbly step, I have concerns about the game, and I voice this.

And no one is telling you not to voice it. If I see something that I feel is false, of course I’ll point it out. I wasn’t replying to you, I was answering the OP who talked about Anet’s silence.

You have a right to complain, I have a right to point out inaccuracies. Since I wasn’t talking to you, calling me a white knight to try to discredit me doesn’t really help the argument.

As you said, what I said was true. Therefore it doesn’t matter if I’m a white knight or not. Or is it impossible for white knights to state facts in your world?

it does not matter if you are talking to me or not this is an open forum so I can do that. To me you are being a fanboi or a white knight or whatever you want to call it, I seen your posts around on the forums and you are always acting like this, I never said you are being bad or what ever.

What i write i write and I do not mean anything else with the words i write, you can try and convince me to change my mind but it is most likely i will not, All i did was point out that for many people, the what you call communicating, is a mere whisper from 100 meters away. and you got to be honest with yourself and admit this is true for a great group of players that are more casual then you are. not everyone reads the blogposts every day or week. not everyone has time for that. rather just hop into the game and play. so yeah when those whispers do not reach everyone at once there will be complaints, arenanet not vocally adressing this on the forums is in my eyes not a good move.

personally, when i come home i just throw on the launcher and it will log it self in, I do not even see the “frontpage” of the launcher. I do not care things are for the long term, it is fine with me, I do not care things got “somewhat” harder. What I do care about is that arenanet curretly looked at the shortterm and not the long term except for putting stuff behind a giant grindfest, and in my opinion this is not good for the health of the “current” pre hot playerbase.

They are not being silent, which is what the OP claims. They are talking. If you want to say it’s not enough, go ahead, but anyone that’s actually paying attention will have a good laugh over it.

What you people want is capitulation not communication and frankly, it doesn’t matter what you think. No reasonable person can insist Anet has been silent. They’ve acknowledged problems and made changes. Major changes.

There’s nothing silent about that.

these “you people” wanting to change the whole thing is so wrong. at least from my point of view, we want things to be adjusted so ALSO those who are feeling currently left out will BE ABLE to get what “you people” got at once, I for one do not ask to get everything mailed to me, I am willing to work for things, but as it currently stand by the time i get it all there will be a new expansion out and it starts all over again, no time to actually enjoy what we have gotten…. so these whispers being thrown around by the devs are clearly not enough for many, not for me anyways personally.

If you’re claiming Anet is silence when they’re demonstrably not silent, then you must want them to say something other than you’re hearing.

Pezz.4758:

Vayne.8563:

Pezz.4758:

Vayne.8563:

Doam.8305:

Straylight.7529:

Ashen.2907:

In general the expectation is that products be designed and adapted to meet the needs and desires of consumers, not the other way around.

That might be true for a kickstarter project. HoT however is not a kickstarter project.

Besides, you can’t please everyone.

What is wrong with today’s world and youth what country could you possibly come from where that isn’t true for every product.

This is capitalism and there isn’t a single instance in this type of system where the consumer is forced to adapt to the wims of the salesman. The burden is on them it isn’t true for a kickstarter but everything this isn’t some socialistic society where people care that a business stays afloat. If they can’t meet the demands of the consumer then it will fail and it in MMO’s that’s an all to common occurrence even now the number one complaint on these forums are empty maps and empty modes because people continue to use there rights to find a product that suits there needs.

Others see this and know it will happen and complain to see if changes will be made because this game requires people and if Anet continues to drop people there won’t be enough people left playing for the rest of us to enjoy the game exactly like those posts complaining about empty, maps, dungeons, events, wvw, and even something as simple as a LFR tool to l shrink the amount of afk raiders waiting for a raid in VB.

Actually this isn’t really true at all. Consumers adapt all the time. Of course there are cases when they don’t also. But don’t fool yourself.

Selling in part, is convincing people to change their minds. Anet has done a bad job of selling a lot of the changes to the game. They’re devs, not sales people. But that doesn’t make the changes bad. Sometimes people are forced to adapt and end up better for it.

Tell me in ANYWAY why i should adapt. Dont tell me that people do tell me why i should? First people said WvW was dead coz HoT maps, now HoT maps and fractals and dungeons are dead because raids and Fallout 4. PEOPLE ARE NOT ADAPTING. They are leaving. This is the EXACT thing that happened to wildstar. The posts are almost word for word, even down to the euphemism for swearing, except there is was cupcake and here it is kitten.

Alot of people arent happy. That is not subjective, nearly all game forms have seen a drop and the forums are filled with complaints. There is a white knight crew telling people to adapt, or dont like it leave, or get good or get out. Its the exact thing that happened with wildstar. Where is wildstar now? Struggling to survive even as a comlete free to play game.

And to think i came here for the very REASON i didnt want to adapt to wildstar. Blaming the player for a bad or poorly recieved game is the first step of denial.

I voted with my wallet with wildstar, i voted with my wallet for WoD. I sure as hell have no problem voting with my wallet here. GW2 isnt a life necessity. There is 0 absolutely 0 reason to adapt to any form of entertainment product. OF ALL products on any market in the world entertainment is the WORST one to expect people to adapt to.

to A-net, email me when this crap gets figured out, i already stopped playing the game a week ago and ive seen this forum argument play out before. Guess who lost? Carbine, the makers of wildstar. NO ONE ELSE.

I’m pretty sure as many people came back as those that are leaving. In my guild, more people came back, and no one has left, so this whole people are leaving claim? Meaningless.

Yes, some people are playing Fall Out 4, like my son, but he’s almost done with it and he’ll be coming back to Guild Wars 2 very soon. He returned to play HoT and he’s enjoying it.

So if some people took a break because a bunch of new games came out, well that’s not that unusual. Many of them will be back.

WvW, I agree, is in a bad place. The rest of the game isn’t suffering though. Even if you think it is. You should look up confirmation bias.

sorry where is the confirmation bias in needing taxis to do 3 week old maps?
where is my personal bias of the dozens of threads of “maps are dead” that i have never posted in?

People were posting here that Silverwaste maps were dead when they weren’t dead, because they didn’t know how to use LFG tool.

I’m doing metas on the second map almost every day. It cant’ be that dead. And we almost got the meta a couple of times in VB today.

Confirmation bias is a funny thing. People are playing the content.

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

Anet has gone silent again? You must live in a bubble. Let’s talk about the “silence” of Anet for a second.

People complained about 400 points needed for elite specializations and Anet fixed that, by reducing it to 250, which very few people complain about.

People complained about high level mastery gating in the story and Anet removed some of it, so that people could get through the story with only a few basic masteries that are easy to level.

People complained about some hero points, and so Anet changed some of them to make them easier.

They came out with the commander UI, the new legendaries and the raids, just as they said they would and most people seem to be enjoying the raids, at least those that like that sort of thing.

People complained about Fractal rewards and Anet posted they’re working on them and that they’d be fixed/changed in December.

Anet hasn’t been silent in any way, shape or form and only someone deliberately ignoring what’s being said would say so.

Raiding is for serious players who invest time and energy into the game. The few people who think ascended gear is too hard or expensive to get that leave the game, they’ll be a tiny percent of the hard core community.

Actually the biggest “crisis” area of the game right now is WvW and Anet communicated about that too and said it’s simply too big a problem to have addressed yet, but they are working on it and will continue to work on it.

Anet hasn’t be silent and by saying so, you make me question everything else you’ve said.

white knight at its finest here. as you are in many other posts. sorry but arenanet is whispering only, which equals to many people as silence, we are working on it or changes will come next month (promises promises) are not really things that people want to hear. I think what people trying to say is that they want MORE communication from arenanet other then a simpe blogpost. where are all the devs that usually post on the forums? many are used that on a regular base devs reply to topics, SPECIALLY when there are so many “complaints” ( I rather say worries about the future of this game). I do get your point of view. but it seems you are blindly following every single word arenanet is telling you. ´this makes you look like a white knight.

There’s being a white knight and there’s ignoring fact. Which thing did I say wasn’t a fact?

Did Anet change the hero point total needed to unlocked elite specializations. Yes.
Did Anet change some of the hero points, turning them into either communes or veterans? Yes.
Did Anet post about fixing fractal rewards next month? Yes.
Did Anet release the raids and new commander UI yes.

And through all of it they’ve been talking to us. Now talking to us doesn’t mean they’re going to tell you what you want to hear, but saying they’re not talking to us is demonstrably false.

And using terms like White Knight to try to make what I say look untrue is pointless, because what I’ve said is factually true and can be checked.

I’m sorry you have some kind of problem with the game, but that doesn’t mean Anet isn’t talking to us. Saying they’re not is simply wrong.

It’s one thing to complain about something you like. It’s another thing to try to contradict fact. It’s a pointless exercise.

I never said you said anything untrue or false, I never said they do not communicate, but it is a bare minimum they do, they are not being transparent about the things they do (anymore).
and I call you a white knight yes, could have called you a fanboi also.

I do not have a problem with the game itself, I have a problem with the future of the game as it stands NOW! It took a step forward but also a step backwards. I play since day one (gw1) and i seen this happen several times, I always followed everything, but HoT was a wobbly step, I have concerns about the game, and I voice this.

And no one is telling you not to voice it. If I see something that I feel is false, of course I’ll point it out. I wasn’t replying to you, I was answering the OP who talked about Anet’s silence.

You have a right to complain, I have a right to point out inaccuracies. Since I wasn’t talking to you, calling me a white knight to try to discredit me doesn’t really help the argument.

As you said, what I said was true. Therefore it doesn’t matter if I’m a white knight or not. Or is it impossible for white knights to state facts in your world?

it does not matter if you are talking to me or not this is an open forum so I can do that. To me you are being a fanboi or a white knight or whatever you want to call it, I seen your posts around on the forums and you are always acting like this, I never said you are being bad or what ever.

What i write i write and I do not mean anything else with the words i write, you can try and convince me to change my mind but it is most likely i will not, All i did was point out that for many people, the what you call communicating, is a mere whisper from 100 meters away. and you got to be honest with yourself and admit this is true for a great group of players that are more casual then you are. not everyone reads the blogposts every day or week. not everyone has time for that. rather just hop into the game and play. so yeah when those whispers do not reach everyone at once there will be complaints, arenanet not vocally adressing this on the forums is in my eyes not a good move.

personally, when i come home i just throw on the launcher and it will log it self in, I do not even see the “frontpage” of the launcher. I do not care things are for the long term, it is fine with me, I do not care things got “somewhat” harder. What I do care about is that arenanet curretly looked at the shortterm and not the long term except for putting stuff behind a giant grindfest, and in my opinion this is not good for the health of the “current” pre hot playerbase.

They are not being silent, which is what the OP claims. They are talking. If you want to say it’s not enough, go ahead, but anyone that’s actually paying attention will have a good laugh over it.

What you people want is capitulation not communication and frankly, it doesn’t matter what you think. No reasonable person can insist Anet has been silent. They’ve acknowledged problems and made changes. Major changes.

There’s nothing silent about that.

Pezz.4758:

Vayne.8563:

Doam.8305:

Straylight.7529:

Ashen.2907:

In general the expectation is that products be designed and adapted to meet the needs and desires of consumers, not the other way around.

That might be true for a kickstarter project. HoT however is not a kickstarter project.

Besides, you can’t please everyone.

What is wrong with today’s world and youth what country could you possibly come from where that isn’t true for every product.

This is capitalism and there isn’t a single instance in this type of system where the consumer is forced to adapt to the wims of the salesman. The burden is on them it isn’t true for a kickstarter but everything this isn’t some socialistic society where people care that a business stays afloat. If they can’t meet the demands of the consumer then it will fail and it in MMO’s that’s an all to common occurrence even now the number one complaint on these forums are empty maps and empty modes because people continue to use there rights to find a product that suits there needs.

Others see this and know it will happen and complain to see if changes will be made because this game requires people and if Anet continues to drop people there won’t be enough people left playing for the rest of us to enjoy the game exactly like those posts complaining about empty, maps, dungeons, events, wvw, and even something as simple as a LFR tool to l shrink the amount of afk raiders waiting for a raid in VB.

Actually this isn’t really true at all. Consumers adapt all the time. Of course there are cases when they don’t also. But don’t fool yourself.

Selling in part, is convincing people to change their minds. Anet has done a bad job of selling a lot of the changes to the game. They’re devs, not sales people. But that doesn’t make the changes bad. Sometimes people are forced to adapt and end up better for it.

Tell me in ANYWAY why i should adapt. Dont tell me that people do tell me why i should? First people said WvW was dead coz HoT maps, now HoT maps and fractals and dungeons are dead because raids and Fallout 4. PEOPLE ARE NOT ADAPTING. They are leaving. This is the EXACT thing that happened to wildstar. The posts are almost word for word, even down to the euphemism for swearing, except there is was cupcake and here it is kitten.

Alot of people arent happy. That is not subjective, nearly all game forms have seen a drop and the forums are filled with complaints. There is a white knight crew telling people to adapt, or dont like it leave, or get good or get out. Its the exact thing that happened with wildstar. Where is wildstar now? Struggling to survive even as a comlete free to play game.

And to think i came here for the very REASON i didnt want to adapt to wildstar. Blaming the player for a bad or poorly recieved game is the first step of denial.

I voted with my wallet with wildstar, i voted with my wallet for WoD. I sure as hell have no problem voting with my wallet here. GW2 isnt a life necessity. There is 0 absolutely 0 reason to adapt to any form of entertainment product. OF ALL products on any market in the world entertainment is the WORST one to expect people to adapt to.

to A-net, email me when this crap gets figured out, i already stopped playing the game a week ago and ive seen this forum argument play out before. Guess who lost? Carbine, the makers of wildstar. NO ONE ELSE.

I’m pretty sure as many people came back as those that are leaving. In my guild, more people came back, and no one has left, so this whole people are leaving claim? Meaningless.

Yes, some people are playing Fall Out 4, like my son, but he’s almost done with it and he’ll be coming back to Guild Wars 2 very soon. He returned to play HoT and he’s enjoying it.

So if some people took a break because a bunch of new games came out, well that’s not that unusual. Many of them will be back.

WvW, I agree, is in a bad place. The rest of the game isn’t suffering though. Even if you think it is. You should look up confirmation bias.

I mostly play Guild Wars 2 these days, but ocassionally I’ll take a break to play other games. Shadow of Mordor, Tombraider, than sort of thing. I enjoyed the Witcher series, but didn’t get the most recent one, because I tend not to get my money’s worth out of most games. 15-20 hours for the price those games charge is a lot of money.

I’ve tried most of the new MMOs, and I still plan to try Wildstar again, when I get the itch to take a break…but obviously with the new expansion, it’ll be a while.

Grim West.3194:

Vayne.8563:

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

Anet has gone silent again? You must live in a bubble. Let’s talk about the “silence” of Anet for a second.

People complained about 400 points needed for elite specializations and Anet fixed that, by reducing it to 250, which very few people complain about.

People complained about high level mastery gating in the story and Anet removed some of it, so that people could get through the story with only a few basic masteries that are easy to level.

People complained about some hero points, and so Anet changed some of them to make them easier.

They came out with the commander UI, the new legendaries and the raids, just as they said they would and most people seem to be enjoying the raids, at least those that like that sort of thing.

People complained about Fractal rewards and Anet posted they’re working on them and that they’d be fixed/changed in December.

Anet hasn’t been silent in any way, shape or form and only someone deliberately ignoring what’s being said would say so.

Raiding is for serious players who invest time and energy into the game. The few people who think ascended gear is too hard or expensive to get that leave the game, they’ll be a tiny percent of the hard core community.

Actually the biggest “crisis” area of the game right now is WvW and Anet communicated about that too and said it’s simply too big a problem to have addressed yet, but they are working on it and will continue to work on it.

Anet hasn’t be silent and by saying so, you make me question everything else you’ve said.

white knight at its finest here. as you are in many other posts. sorry but arenanet is whispering only, which equals to many people as silence, we are working on it or changes will come next month (promises promises) are not really things that people want to hear. I think what people trying to say is that they want MORE communication from arenanet other then a simpe blogpost. where are all the devs that usually post on the forums? many are used that on a regular base devs reply to topics, SPECIALLY when there are so many “complaints” ( I rather say worries about the future of this game). I do get your point of view. but it seems you are blindly following every single word arenanet is telling you. ´this makes you look like a white knight.

There’s being a white knight and there’s ignoring fact. Which thing did I say wasn’t a fact?

Did Anet change the hero point total needed to unlocked elite specializations. Yes.
Did Anet change some of the hero points, turning them into either communes or veterans? Yes.
Did Anet post about fixing fractal rewards next month? Yes.
Did Anet release the raids and new commander UI yes.

And through all of it they’ve been talking to us. Now talking to us doesn’t mean they’re going to tell you what you want to hear, but saying they’re not talking to us is demonstrably false.

And using terms like White Knight to try to make what I say look untrue is pointless, because what I’ve said is factually true and can be checked.

I’m sorry you have some kind of problem with the game, but that doesn’t mean Anet isn’t talking to us. Saying they’re not is simply wrong.

It’s one thing to complain about something you like. It’s another thing to try to contradict fact. It’s a pointless exercise.

You are white knighting ANET. Those changes were minor and just bandaids on a very horrible expansion.

Actually HoT is more of a “contraction” for many players. WvW has been decimated, small guilds have been kicked to the curb, all their hard work taken away. Dungeons abandonded and huge grind / pay wall set up for everyone to “enjoy”.

HoT is garbage.

Absolutely your opinion and you’re entitled to it. Having a different opinion, however, doesn’t make me a white knight. I’ll always call out BS wherever I see it, not just here, but everywhere.

I didn’t address the OP’s complaints in total. I address something I consider to be a factual fallacy. And that’s ALL I did.

If you have something to say that addresses what I actually said, by all means, quote me. But if you’re just going to call me a white knight because I have a different opinion than you, well, I guess that pretty much says it all right there.

Have a great night.

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

Anet has gone silent again? You must live in a bubble. Let’s talk about the “silence” of Anet for a second.

People complained about 400 points needed for elite specializations and Anet fixed that, by reducing it to 250, which very few people complain about.

People complained about high level mastery gating in the story and Anet removed some of it, so that people could get through the story with only a few basic masteries that are easy to level.

People complained about some hero points, and so Anet changed some of them to make them easier.

They came out with the commander UI, the new legendaries and the raids, just as they said they would and most people seem to be enjoying the raids, at least those that like that sort of thing.

People complained about Fractal rewards and Anet posted they’re working on them and that they’d be fixed/changed in December.

Anet hasn’t been silent in any way, shape or form and only someone deliberately ignoring what’s being said would say so.

Raiding is for serious players who invest time and energy into the game. The few people who think ascended gear is too hard or expensive to get that leave the game, they’ll be a tiny percent of the hard core community.

Actually the biggest “crisis” area of the game right now is WvW and Anet communicated about that too and said it’s simply too big a problem to have addressed yet, but they are working on it and will continue to work on it.

Anet hasn’t be silent and by saying so, you make me question everything else you’ve said.

white knight at its finest here. as you are in many other posts. sorry but arenanet is whispering only, which equals to many people as silence, we are working on it or changes will come next month (promises promises) are not really things that people want to hear. I think what people trying to say is that they want MORE communication from arenanet other then a simpe blogpost. where are all the devs that usually post on the forums? many are used that on a regular base devs reply to topics, SPECIALLY when there are so many “complaints” ( I rather say worries about the future of this game). I do get your point of view. but it seems you are blindly following every single word arenanet is telling you. ´this makes you look like a white knight.

There’s being a white knight and there’s ignoring fact. Which thing did I say wasn’t a fact?

Did Anet change the hero point total needed to unlocked elite specializations. Yes.
Did Anet change some of the hero points, turning them into either communes or veterans? Yes.
Did Anet post about fixing fractal rewards next month? Yes.
Did Anet release the raids and new commander UI yes.

And through all of it they’ve been talking to us. Now talking to us doesn’t mean they’re going to tell you what you want to hear, but saying they’re not talking to us is demonstrably false.

And using terms like White Knight to try to make what I say look untrue is pointless, because what I’ve said is factually true and can be checked.

I’m sorry you have some kind of problem with the game, but that doesn’t mean Anet isn’t talking to us. Saying they’re not is simply wrong.

It’s one thing to complain about something you like. It’s another thing to try to contradict fact. It’s a pointless exercise.

I never said you said anything untrue or false, I never said they do not communicate, but it is a bare minimum they do, they are not being transparent about the things they do (anymore).
and I call you a white knight yes, could have called you a fanboi also.

I do not have a problem with the game itself, I have a problem with the future of the game as it stands NOW! It took a step forward but also a step backwards. I play since day one (gw1) and i seen this happen several times, I always followed everything, but HoT was a wobbly step, I have concerns about the game, and I voice this.

And no one is telling you not to voice it. If I see something that I feel is false, of course I’ll point it out. I wasn’t replying to you, I was answering the OP who talked about Anet’s silence.

You have a right to complain, I have a right to point out inaccuracies. Since I wasn’t talking to you, calling me a white knight to try to discredit me doesn’t really help the argument.

As you said, what I said was true. Therefore it doesn’t matter if I’m a white knight or not. Or is it impossible for white knights to state facts in your world?

Ish.2846:

I can’t even see the targets. I’m starting to think something is bugged here because I’m shooting in the exact same spot as everyone else and nothing..

The targets are blue dummies tied to stakes. Sort of like scarecrows. They’re usually below the markers.

Pezz.4758:

Doam.8305:

The forums were filled with legit complaints

Now the forums are filled with complaints about complaints and complaints about people leaving and how the maps are drying up and finding people has become so much harder.

The complaints at launch were legit and after weeks of voicing there concern those people merely left this is capitalism after all and it’s not there job to support a product they don’t find appealing. Problem is it’s become so much of an issue with people leaving we now have these empty map complaints which will just cause more people to leave down the road who even wished to stay and play.

can you believe people are calling unhappy customers bad people because the wont “adapt” to a completely option time wasting only for enjoyment entertainment product? at this point the forums are turning me off the game more than the game did, and i stopped playing it a week ago

But there’s different kinds of adapting.

I knew people that refused to use word processors and continued to use typewriters long after word processors became available. They refused to adapt. It doesn’t make them heroes.

I know people who don’t like computers and refuse to use them period. Or smart phones. Or ipods. They refuse to adapt.

Sometimes refusing to adapt means you’ll be left behind. Suppose you bought a beta max back in the day and hated VHS? Well you’d be screwed, because eventually, no one had or made movies on beta. You had to adapt, even if you liked beta better.

In this game, ascended gear wasn’t in the game and some people couldn’t adapt to it’s addition and left the game. Does that mean the game is worse with ascended gear? I think it is…but I adapted.

Adapting is a normal part of playing games, in fact. If you play baseball and everyone starts using fastballs, you adapt, because the game changes. Games always have new tactics that people have to adapt to. Adapt isn’t a dirty word.

If you go into a dungeon and you keep dying, and you’re dying because you insist on meleeing something that has a huge circle of fire around it, then you’re refusing to adapt. Again, it doesn’t make you a hero. Sometimes, you have to switch to range, which is why you have a weapon swap. You don’t have to love range, but there are fights that it makes sense to use it on. I don’t see a whole lot of melee players meleeing the fire ele. Presumably they adapted.

When harder content comes in, some people will learn and adapt to that content, thus making the content not as hard. I know several people in my guild who day one thought the new zones were horribly hard and confusing and now they’ve adapted and they’re in those zones playing.

A game that doesn’t ask people to adapt will eventually become boring to at least some players, perhaps most players.

While I like some of the mini games, I really don’t like that mastery points are tied into them. It makes MMOs players have to be arcade game players and it’s not fair. For me, it’s not much of a problem. I grew up playing arcade games and like quite a few of them. But making people play an arcade game to get mastery points? That’s not a good solution to the problem.

Though someone in this thread said they’re needed for map completion and AFAIK that’s not true. You only need hero points for map completion not mastery points. And there are more mastery points in the game than you actually need, so you may be able to skip most of them, I haven’t done the math. You can skip at least some of them.

mcwurth.2081:

Vayne.8563:

Anet has gone silent again? You must live in a bubble. Let’s talk about the “silence” of Anet for a second.

People complained about 400 points needed for elite specializations and Anet fixed that, by reducing it to 250, which very few people complain about.

People complained about high level mastery gating in the story and Anet removed some of it, so that people could get through the story with only a few basic masteries that are easy to level.

People complained about some hero points, and so Anet changed some of them to make them easier.

They came out with the commander UI, the new legendaries and the raids, just as they said they would and most people seem to be enjoying the raids, at least those that like that sort of thing.

People complained about Fractal rewards and Anet posted they’re working on them and that they’d be fixed/changed in December.

Anet hasn’t been silent in any way, shape or form and only someone deliberately ignoring what’s being said would say so.

Raiding is for serious players who invest time and energy into the game. The few people who think ascended gear is too hard or expensive to get that leave the game, they’ll be a tiny percent of the hard core community.

Actually the biggest “crisis” area of the game right now is WvW and Anet communicated about that too and said it’s simply too big a problem to have addressed yet, but they are working on it and will continue to work on it.

Anet hasn’t be silent and by saying so, you make me question everything else you’ve said.

white knight at its finest here. as you are in many other posts. sorry but arenanet is whispering only, which equals to many people as silence, we are working on it or changes will come next month (promises promises) are not really things that people want to hear. I think what people trying to say is that they want MORE communication from arenanet other then a simpe blogpost. where are all the devs that usually post on the forums? many are used that on a regular base devs reply to topics, SPECIALLY when there are so many “complaints” ( I rather say worries about the future of this game). I do get your point of view. but it seems you are blindly following every single word arenanet is telling you. ´this makes you look like a white knight.

There’s being a white knight and there’s ignoring fact. Which thing did I say wasn’t a fact?

Did Anet change the hero point total needed to unlocked elite specializations. Yes.
Did Anet change some of the hero points, turning them into either communes or veterans? Yes.
Did Anet post about fixing fractal rewards next month? Yes.
Did Anet release the raids and new commander UI yes.

And through all of it they’ve been talking to us. Now talking to us doesn’t mean they’re going to tell you what you want to hear, but saying they’re not talking to us is demonstrably false.

And using terms like White Knight to try to make what I say look untrue is pointless, because what I’ve said is factually true and can be checked.

I’m sorry you have some kind of problem with the game, but that doesn’t mean Anet isn’t talking to us. Saying they’re not is simply wrong.

It’s one thing to complain about something you like. It’s another thing to try to contradict fact. It’s a pointless exercise.

Doam.8305:

Straylight.7529:

Ashen.2907:

In general the expectation is that products be designed and adapted to meet the needs and desires of consumers, not the other way around.

That might be true for a kickstarter project. HoT however is not a kickstarter project.

Besides, you can’t please everyone.

What is wrong with today’s world and youth what country could you possibly come from where that isn’t true for every product.

This is capitalism and there isn’t a single instance in this type of system where the consumer is forced to adapt to the wims of the salesman. The burden is on them it isn’t true for a kickstarter but everything this isn’t some socialistic society where people care that a business stays afloat. If they can’t meet the demands of the consumer then it will fail and it in MMO’s that’s an all to common occurrence even now the number one complaint on these forums are empty maps and empty modes because people continue to use there rights to find a product that suits there needs.

Others see this and know it will happen and complain to see if changes will be made because this game requires people and if Anet continues to drop people there won’t be enough people left playing for the rest of us to enjoy the game exactly like those posts complaining about empty, maps, dungeons, events, wvw, and even something as simple as a LFR tool to l shrink the amount of afk raiders waiting for a raid in VB.

Actually this isn’t really true at all. Consumers adapt all the time. Of course there are cases when they don’t also. But don’t fool yourself.

Selling in part, is convincing people to change their minds. Anet has done a bad job of selling a lot of the changes to the game. They’re devs, not sales people. But that doesn’t make the changes bad. Sometimes people are forced to adapt and end up better for it.

Aidenwolf.5964:

If people are unhappy en mass things get changed or the game dies. It’s a game, if it’s not fun, it fails.

If enough people are unhappy, you’re right. I don’t believe enough people are unhappy for that to happen here though.

Steel Courage.1250:

Vayne.8563:

Steel Courage.1250:

From reading all of your comments, yes i know i am complaining about complaining, but its given me much more view into all the problems. A lot of valid points are made as well for how they felt HoT was like it gave content but retracted old content.

And i know the forums are mostly filled with complaining, but they are more than ever with HoT. I just miss the little posts like “Screen Shots Halloween 2015!” vs “blah blah i hate this game”.

Its comforting to see this response and just reassures me of how sweet it will be when profession,map and various other problems will be balanced and fixed.

Reddit is far better than the forums for that sort of posting. The forums are partlly populated by disenfranchised people, partly populated by trolls, partly populated by people who want the game to be different and partly by a few people who love the game and think people are over-reacting. That’s the forums.

Reddit is a far better place, because posts that make no sense or are unnecessary or are not constructive tend to get downvoted pretty fast.

True, i just want the devs to see it

Many of the devs read and post on reddit as well. So they have seen it.

Anyway, even the complaining shows that fans are passionate about the game, even if they don’t like some changes.

And some of the complaints are well-founded. You can’t really stop people from complaining.

Anet has gone silent again? You must live in a bubble. Let’s talk about the “silence” of Anet for a second.

People complained about 400 points needed for elite specializations and Anet fixed that, by reducing it to 250, which very few people complain about.

People complained about high level mastery gating in the story and Anet removed some of it, so that people could get through the story with only a few basic masteries that are easy to level.

People complained about some hero points, and so Anet changed some of them to make them easier.

They came out with the commander UI, the new legendaries and the raids, just as they said they would and most people seem to be enjoying the raids, at least those that like that sort of thing.

People complained about Fractal rewards and Anet posted they’re working on them and that they’d be fixed/changed in December.

Anet hasn’t been silent in any way, shape or form and only someone deliberately ignoring what’s being said would say so.

Raiding is for serious players who invest time and energy into the game. The few people who think ascended gear is too hard or expensive to get that leave the game, they’ll be a tiny percent of the hard core community.

Actually the biggest “crisis” area of the game right now is WvW and Anet communicated about that too and said it’s simply too big a problem to have addressed yet, but they are working on it and will continue to work on it.

Anet hasn’t be silent and by saying so, you make me question everything else you’ve said.

Steel Courage.1250:

From reading all of your comments, yes i know i am complaining about complaining, but its given me much more view into all the problems. A lot of valid points are made as well for how they felt HoT was like it gave content but retracted old content.

And i know the forums are mostly filled with complaining, but they are more than ever with HoT. I just miss the little posts like “Screen Shots Halloween 2015!” vs “blah blah i hate this game”.

Its comforting to see this response and just reassures me of how sweet it will be when profession,map and various other problems will be balanced and fixed.

Reddit is far better than the forums for that sort of posting. The forums are partlly populated by disenfranchised people, partly populated by trolls, partly populated by people who want the game to be different and partly by a few people who love the game and think people are over-reacting. That’s the forums.

Reddit is a far better place, because posts that make no sense or are unnecessary or are not constructive tend to get downvoted pretty fast.

Molesworth.1684:

Well I’ve had a lot of fun playing HoT since it came out, but now I’ve hit the wall and realised I have no more realistic objectives to aim towards…..so maybe not pre-purchase so that I see what the shortcomings/merits are first. I’m not sure if enough people will be playing by then tho, to warrant another expansion. Unless Anet listen to people’s complaints and modify HoT before many people leave the game.

You’re kidding yourself if you think this will happen. Yes, some people will leave, and they’ll be replaced by other people. That’s the way the genre works. HoT may not fit certain groups of players. Maybe those who are in a guild of 2, who want to get a guild hall, will feel disenfranchised and leave. Maybe those who are so casual they feel the jungle will always be beyond them will leave. Maybe some who thing masteries are grinding will leave.

But all those groups together probably aren’t as large as the number of people who left when ascended gear was introduced.

And not all of the people who leave will stay gone forever either.

People start playing and people come back.

Especially now that free to play exists, and most people will try the game and some of those will buy HoT.

I have every reason to believe the player count will go up, now down, because Anet removed the barrier of purchasing the game to try it. It’s bound to get new players.

People who don’t like it will leave, just like in any game. But if just as many people start playing and some of those come back, the game will be fine.

People said the game would die when ascended gear was introduced. They were wrong. They said it would die when new games came out (Archeage, ESO, Wildstar, Neverwinter). They were wrong.

And your prediction that the game will fail because some people don’t like it…that’s likely to be wrong too.

I’ll preorder if I like what I see, which is what I did with HoT. I haven’t been disappointed so far.