Guild Wars 2

I don’t sPvP because it is stagnant and not dynamic and I have been doing endless scenario styles fights across several games for years. Since I only WvWvW these days, I cant call myself a d/d ele or a staff ele. I am both depending on the situation.

Staff owns zergs around structure. D/D owns open field.

I magnetic grasped a player last night near garrison and shot through him and off the cliff to my death. Bug, yeah …but at least it was hilarious.

I am D/D open field and Staff in a siege. I can break a siege with my staff….

Moral of the story, use the appropriate weapon for the appropriate situation.

@TC people last night in their homeland. Taking your hoard on a tour of your borderland last night was some of the most fun I have had in a long time. Hope you enjoyed the trip around the map.

Tajz.9826:

Despite some of the negative comments from some SoR forum warriors, i gotta say SoR is a true fighter who keep fighting with us for more than 6 weeks without given up. Prop to them to be able to push us as hard as they could during any timezone.

See, now this is a respectful post.

Nice fights man. I played during the day yesterday for the first time really during a weekday because I am off of work and you all really are a juggernaught during oceanic hours. Wish we had the people to give you a good go at it.

Liquid.9672:

Wow. SoR NA guilds throwing in the towel this week? In 2 months this may be the lowest PPT I’ve seen SoR with at 9pm EST, and the first time I’ve any sort of surrender from their NA guys. I wonder if they’re intentionally trying to push BG out of the tier heh. Nah … that’s not SoR’s style. Then again, Wednesdays are historically one of BG’s strongest nights.

Huh? We were at 400pt when I logged last night. Reality check bud.

Unfortunately it takes longer to accumlate ppt when you are fighting actual people instead of doors.

JaredKincade.9761:

The double team (not complaining, its a fair tactic and is used effectively) was in full effect on BGs paper gates, and ownage did ensue.

We get double teamed every night too. Why? Because we are fighting two enemies. This too isn’t unique to you. Get over it man.

Xirin.8593:

My favorite logical fallacy is how BG gets “outplayed” by SoR in NA primetime. Nevermind the fact that SoR has possibly the strongest NA force across all servers. But somehow that doesn’t equate to SoR zerging.

Who ever said SoR doesnt zerg NA prime time. Of course they do.

There is a difference in the evening though NA, Zergs are fighting zergs instead of doors. Huge difference.

Personally, it is far more fun for me to fight actual players. Win or Lose.

JaredKincade.9761:

The difference between what I say and (some not all) sor say, is that I dont call your server trash, or mindless zerg, or say how you are outmanuvered. In fact, ive repeatedly complimented choo and several TC guilds on their organization and effectiveness.

What I dont do, is allow posters to make untrue statements unchallenged. Is coverage a major factor in our score? Of course, I see no one denying this.

What I have an issue with is the assumption that we do not deserve our wins because of it, or it is somehow cheap tricks. SoR has just as much opportunity to recruit and build their guilds into multiple timeslot coverage.

Jared, you repeatedly point at the scoreboard. Then you repeatedly try to justify it by explaining that your server is magically doing something the other servers are not. When you do that, you are not only being fallacious, but demeaning. Your server isn’t doing anything the others arent. SoR cultivates its people too, you arent alone in that. Stop trying to pretend you are.

Put yourself in your opponents shoes and how do you expect them to react to that nonsense. Of course you are going to get flamed bro.

Liquid.9672:

The fact is, this is competitive PvP, and logic and good sportsmanship doesn’t always prevail. When you win my a little you lack skill and don’t have what it takes. When you win by a lot you’re nothing but a huge mindless zerg and only win because of greater numbers (duh). There’s always a reason that seeks to make your team look better than your opponent. It’s human nature. The ugly side of it.

I am not so sure that is fair when it comes to this game. I honestly have no idea if BG is a mindless zerg or skilled players outside of my play time. Aside from a couple of guilds, being frank, the BG I do fight typically get outmanuvered and seem to fold under hard pushes, BUT they are competitive and good opponents.

What I don’t get is the need to chest thump about the scoreboard when the reality is that at 10am eastern time in the morning on most days, there are a whopping 15 people across all the WvW zones from SoR. That is why I log out at night with a large PPT advantage and by midday the next day BG is ticking away at over 500.

It isn’t the fact that you have better coverage that is getting you hate on the boards. It is the chest beating that is done because of that better coverage. Of course people are going to get defensive about it and point it out to you, because it is the reality of the situation. We all know it.

Liquid.9672:

covenn.7165:

Smokee.1754:

We head out there to have some fun.

If this was really the case, some of your oceanic guilds would transfer off. For the life of me, I don’t understand how PvDoor can be fun for anyone.

Because that coverage is necessary to compete in T1, and most are willing to PvDoor while keeping their sights on the big picture. I see some people missing this point in the BG recruitment thread as well. BG isn’t recruiting for T2.

So you admit it isn’t about fun then? That is the only point I was making.

What is up with this post, I cant edit it.

JaredKincade.9761:

I get it, sure. Words like stomp may have been in poor taste. Maybe Im just sick and tired of the weeks and weeks of constant hate. Its good to see us show it in the score.

Part of the hate you get on the boards are due to the chest thumping you do when you constantly point to the score board. Then the complaining you do when people respond by telling you its coverage.

Just something for you to think about.

JaredKincade.9761:

I dont think its bravado to point out we are ready for tier 1, especially after so many week after week posts calling us out as weak, or that if we truly deserved to be there we wouldnt allow SoR to keep it close. Then this week, people start telling us we are winning wrong, not being patient, not knowing how the glicko system works, winning by too much. Pointing out the hypocracy is all Im after.

Hypocrisy. Before pointing it out in others, you should be free of it yourself. Its good advice to follow.

Smokee.1754:

We head out there to have some fun.

If this was really the case, some of your oceanic guilds would transfer off. For the life of me, I don’t understand how PvDoor can be fun for anyone.

All that hard work killing players from BG just got reversed by people from BG killing doors and npcs.

Happy New Years

pot.6805:

As if D/D eles don’t run off every single time they are about to lose.

Sounds like thieves too. heh

Jeknar.6184:

rhyein.6172:

Peetee.9406:

Jayne.9251:

Peetee.9406:

SoR competes in WvW the way it was intended. We fight two fronts, one against each server. We are fighting TC in TCs BL and we are fighting BG in SoRs BL.

We are not going to pull out of TC BL and fight BG on two fronts. That would be a disservice to a quality opponent. If BG blows us out so be it, they earned their shot at Tier 1 weeks ago.

Lol what?!

I’m not trying to be rude at all, but did you read what you wrote?

In essence you’re saying you won’t go into bgbl because it might hinder them,

We’ll fight them in BG BL if we can get them out of our own BL which we have not been able to do all week. We’re not going to abandon our own BL for them to take so we can go fight doors in their BL.

We are not a bunch of roleplaying pansies

Here’s another map update, just for you.

SoR is most likely desperate this week, since BG had the upperhand at the weekend, and TC is getting rating from SoR (Although most of SoR loss of rating is comming from BG). So i’d say they will focus on TC to try stay alive, otherwise they will problably drop to 6th place…

You arent making any sense. You do realize alot of people travel over the holidays right? I wouldnt put stock into any of your theories until things return to normal.

Thrashbarg.9820:

As such, forum complaints of “double teaming” and “playing for second” will remain par for the course.

It is kind of short sighted and old to be honest. Everyone always thinks they are getting double teamed? Why? Because everyone is ALWAYS getting double teamed. It is always 1v2 regardless of the server you are on.

Lanthrudar.1437:

covenn.7165:

Lanthrudar.1437:

Dao.8156:

BG still holding strong for as late as it is.

Not sure what SoR is doing. Playing for second place perhaps? Dunno, the strategy does not make much sense to me. It seems SoR has a chance at first if they push BG down during their off hours.

Looks like SoR is content in trying to play for second and keep TC down. And this when BG has almost double the score of TC and SoR already have…

A hint for all the SoR folks.. Why exactly are you continually not hitting on BG when they are so far ahead? You’re making it easy on them by antagonizing your potential partners and letting BG bend us both over.

This isn’t what is happening. Unfortunately your perspective gets skewed when the only person responding to your actions in game is SoR. I guarantee you SoR spends as much time fighting BG as they do TC.

Point being, why? Take the effort you’re expending against TC and use it against BG and what happens? BG goes down. Sor, by fighting against TC when we’re both down almost 1/2 in points against BG, guarantee’s that BG will win again.

So yes, in essence, SoR is fighting for second place because the only way they stand a chance to close the gap on BG and actually win, is to not fight the only other group that is also fighting BG.

I guess if SoR is happy with always being the brides-maid and never the bride they can keep right on doing what they are now.

You are still missing the point that SoR would rather kill BG than worry about TC. How about TC focus entirely on BG if you are worried about it, cause SoR is firmly fighting two fronts non stop.

Kujo.3678:

(This is during late oceanic prime time btw, so don’t u SoR dare say anything about having no forces during this hour since you managed to push us out of garrison)

Dude, its the weekend. A holiday weekend actually for most.

rchu.8945:

pot.6805:

Where is SoR? lol Practically nonexistent in their strongest timezone.

A lot of SoR people were wondering too, perhaps the prediction of SoR sliding to 3rd will happen sooner than later…

I wouldnt jump to conclusions during the holidays. In fact, status quo probably wont return until the next reset.

Lanthrudar.1437:

Dao.8156:

BG still holding strong for as late as it is.

Not sure what SoR is doing. Playing for second place perhaps? Dunno, the strategy does not make much sense to me. It seems SoR has a chance at first if they push BG down during their off hours.

Looks like SoR is content in trying to play for second and keep TC down. And this when BG has almost double the score of TC and SoR already have…

A hint for all the SoR folks.. Why exactly are you continually not hitting on BG when they are so far ahead? You’re making it easy on them by antagonizing your potential partners and letting BG bend us both over.

This isn’t what is happening. Unfortunately your perspective gets skewed when the only person responding to your actions in game is SoR. I guarantee you SoR spends as much time fighting BG as they do TC.

Indo.8629:

That’s a very unambitious attitude.

That’s like the guy who wants to be the biggest fish in the pond instead of fighting for his place in the ocean.

I guess to each their own, but that type of mentality explains a lot.

Well at least ND went somewhere will they will fit in better.

Vodka.3958:

Winning in this tier is still winning in my eyes… Hahah and even if we do stay in T2 then I don’t mind; as long as we are in first place then I’m satisfied.

Coverage is awesome isn’t it.

Don’t kid yourself. Why is it so hard for other thieves to be honest with themselves. It is culling/rendering combined with a general low skill bar requirement. It is boring how easy it is for me to the point I dont even play mine anymore.

Vodka.3958:

Well that’s not true, coverage gets you into a higher tier… That’s like saying if you only had full-time NA coverage and little to no Oceanic/Euro coverage then you can still get into T1 against servers that have 24/7 coverage. With the guilds that recently transferred over from other servers into Blackgate it can only help us advance into a higher tier and adds to our WvW presence.

It takes coverage sure, but it has to be quality coverage. You are still lacking that and the guilds you picked up from us at least definitely don’t provide it. As it stands now, you cant even rack up enough points against servers with almost no coverage outside of NA, what makes you think you stand a chance in T1?

JaredKincade.9761:

covenn.7165:

JaredKincade.9761:

Is this what you guys do in tier 3? End it in some cool way?

Pshh, BG ends it with doing pve, jump puzzles and saving up gold because we’re so far ahead.

There goes the scoreboard posturing. So sad.

Look who’s turn it is to relax, it was a joke. Or could you not tell from “Pshh” and the smiley face. I appreciate TC’s in general, light attitude.

After 5 pages of SOR “scoreboard posturing” I’d think you’d be able to recognize it by now. But in case you haven’t this is it:

---

BG comes back from behind for the how many weeks in a row now? Its alright guys, there’s always next week!

Pay attention. That was sarcastic, dry humor.

Equinox.4195:

Thanks! We certainly try. It was a lot of laughs watching all of your people fail consecutively to stop us and hearing about all the raging we caused in your team and map chats. I’m sorry we’re not up to your standards of taking on an entire zerg with only 6 of us, but we’re just trying to have fun

We only pulled 10-15 of your people to camp our bodies and they still continued to fail, so I can certainly understand and appreciate your sarcasm.

Good luck with your zergfests. Sincerely, EP.

That wasn’t a very nice response to someone giving you a shout out. j/k No I understand, really I do.

Fade.7658:

@covenn.7165: Is this the same Covenn the nightshade from Hibernia Guinevere, from DAoC?

Maybe. Is this the same Fade the ranger from Hib Guin ?

urzen.7096:

So what if a guild leaves? There is no reason to be loyal to any server. Play the game for yourself first, then your guild, then your server if that makes you happy. Its not like you get anything for winning WvW anyway.

Agreed.

Though its not as much fun unless they make a big drawn out post rife with excuses drawing attention to it.

Flawed Victory.4321:

covenn.7165:

Flawed Victory.4321:

covenn.7165:

Esoteric.5490:

Let’s not defame ND here.

They don’t need anyone to defame them as they did quite a good job of it themselves. Jumping ship to an enemy server in a time slot where it already has superior coverage is the very definition of bandwagoning.

Anyways, we need guilds with the drive to keep fighting on SoR, and not guilds that turn and run when things get tough. They will fit in well on BG. I for one am glad they are gone.

A guild is not obliged to stay in a server where no one appreciated their effort. Choo has enough smart commanders to lead sor to success, by calling oceanic commander (cough) a**hole on ts.

No idea what you are talking about. Regardless, people get heated in TS all the time and this has been true on both servers I have played on. Are you saying that the ND commander got so upset about being called a name in a heated moment that he took his ball and went home? Wow, talk about losing even more respect for them. Geesh, grow some skin.

Edit: I am really glad they are gone now if this is the case. wow

I did not imply anything. Troll likes to troll. Gotcha

Well played sir /salute

JaredKincade.9761:

Is this what you guys do in tier 3? End it in some cool way?

Pshh, BG ends it with doing pve, jump puzzles and saving up gold because we’re so far ahead.

There goes the scoreboard posturing. So sad.

Mif.3471:

Did you even stop to wonder how IoJ stayed in T2 for so long despite being outmatched?

I’ll give you the answer: IoJ understands the Glicko rating system and tried to reduce BG’s overall weekly points so IoJ would either gain rating or minimize the loss.

In fact the only time IoJ actively targeted SoR on any notable scale was the week IoJ beat SoR.

You have no clue what you are talking about. The entire match up we were constantly being pulled off of fights with BG to stop IOJ from taking our towers and stuff.

Really, stop posting such nonsense.

spartanx.1364:

Its no surprise Europe is better than America at WvW. They have tons more real life Siege Warfare under their belt. They are used to taking towers and building trebuchets.

That doesnt explain the need for the bail out in WW2. :p

Jayne.9251:

covenn.7165:

Jayne.9251:

Ok guys. Everyone views life and its priorities differently. To mock someone for their views, particularly if they’re different from your own world view is a bit unseemly.

Back to the thread at hand …. Anyone have a score update?

In all fairness though, you should expect criticism if you publicly state them…. regardless of what they may be.

Yes. But when a number of players are piling on in personal attacks it can only lead to a flame war. And what’s the point of that, other than creating drama?

Save the attacks for the borderlands. It’s a much better use of your time

Of course you do realize the same can be said for the original post, especially given the holiday it was said on. Why say it except to create drama or get attention

Binafus.8153:

Every class thinks the game would be better without thiefs, but the thiefs will tell you it is a culling issue, becuase they can kill you before you know they are attacking.

Yes I have a geared level 80 Thief it is not even a challenge to kill anyone any thief that says otherwise is either bad or they do not want to get nerfed.

Calling everyone a bad player that disagrees with you means you are arguing from a position of weakness. You can scream for class nerfs without first fixing the issue rendering (pun intended) the most complaints.

Adaneshade.2409:

Still don’t understand why they couldn’t make culling be client side like every other game has………at some point being different just to be different is foolish.

I suspect they are going to do just that. They are probably going to add an option to reduce player model detail significantly as well like DAOC had a decade ago and allowed hundred v hundred fights in RvR on old school graphic cards.

The problem is that this would be a core change to the game engine and is going to require alot of time to happen, but they HAVE to do it for the longevity of this game.

urzen.7096:

covenn.7165:

Looks normal to me for a work day.

Yep. Doesnt BG have jobs?

I am sure they do. They just have more people living in different time zones so their work hours are different.

I am ok with it either way as long as the progression is open ended and difficult to obtain. Last thing we want is people obtaining max rank and quitting again because they lack progression.

Of course if we don’t make progression by character, there will so be no options to track things by class easily. Trade offs either way.

However, it is no reason to nerf thieves but it IS an additional reason to expedite getting the biggest issue affecting everyone’s game play resolved.

Adaneshade.2409:

Glass cannon thieves are hands down the weakest builds we have in PvP. They are only capable of killing players who either lack understanding of their own class vs every other class on a class vs class basis (a L2P issue) or players who run builds that are simply not viable in PvP (inexperienced in MMO pvp builds)

You are both wrong and right at the same time. You are wrong in the current state of the game, but are correct if culling/rendering was dependable. The problem is when a victim can’t properly react for 1 to N extra seconds because we aren’t appearing on screen for them. At that point, we gain ‘extra’ durability that can allow us to go glass without repercussions.

I get your response, I really do. The thing is you need to account for the reality our victims face half the time due to the crappy game engine and network code. Simply pointing fingers and screaming at people that they need to L2P is quite unfair and disingenuous.

Looks normal to me for a work day.

Aberrant.6749:

killing people who are acting like grazing cattle…

I find that a lot of people I attack act like grazing cattle too. Sometimes I even kill people completely without taking a single point in damage. I would be willing to bet that in most cases its because I either rendered extremely late or didn’t render at all. If that gets fixed much of the complaints would go away.

Solori.6025:

covenn.7165:

The reason they are crying is:

2. Even a bad player can be successful with a thief

Against another bad player

I disagree completely as is, though admittedly you may be somewhat correct once rendering/culling stops skewing the problem

Causic.3798:

covenn.7165:

Thieves aren’t op at all. It just a low skill level bar combined with culling/rendering failure by anet

Funny how you stated exactly why they are OP :P

Well that isn’t the class itself though.

FourTwenty.4268:

covenn.7165:

Great counter argument. Maybe it’s just too easy for me

very possibly. you could be the uber god of thief pvp and no one would know. . .or care lol

http://www.gamebreaker.tv/video-game-shows/massive-dps/

is a video you can watch where they talk about the glass cannon backstab thief build, and say “This setup puts out MASSIVE amounts of DPS but takes a lot of skill execute properly”

but as i said before. you can continue to be delusional if you want, you’re only making yourself look bad

Not really. I am stating my opinion based off of my experience. You are attacking me for my opinion. I am not the one looking bad here bud.

The funny thing is, I am defending the class saying that it isn’t OP and you are still attacking me just because I say it has a very low bar in regards to skill level required to be successful. Sorry it upsets you so much, but it is the truth, especially with the culling/rendering the way it is.

SoR randomly builds rams in the middle of open field fights too. Top secret tactics.

Jayne.9251:

Ok guys. Everyone views life and its priorities differently. To mock someone for their views, particularly if they’re different from your own world view is a bit unseemly.

Back to the thread at hand …. Anyone have a score update?

In all fairness though, you should expect criticism if you publicly state them…. regardless of what they may be.

I preferred DAOC stealth myself of all the games I played

FourTwenty.4268:

covenn.7165:

Don’t kid yourself and keep it real. My thief is by far the easiest class for me in the game to play 1v1. The skill bar is extremely low to be successful. The actual thieves out there that are good, well we can do some amazing things.

false. but you can continue with your delusions if you want.

Great counter argument. Maybe it’s just too easy for me