Guild Wars 2

Ithilwen.1529:

The divisions are locked because the stomping and exploitation would otherwise keep many players in Amber. Those players very likely wouldn’t come back.

It’s all well and good to have a psuedo objectivist attitude ( ala’ Ayn Rand.) But it’s not going to work in actual practice.

uh huh….so instead they get stomped in ruby just for the sake of preventing the notation that they aren’t as good of a player as they think they are. Only then to complain how “match making flaws” are the reason they can’t progress further.

geekilo.8512:

In Gw2, from amber to ruby, there is no skill involved, it’s just a grind fest. Giving enough time, those amber players will grind themselves to ruby, then ruby will just turn into amber.

I couldn’t agree more. I don’t really understand why they bother making a ladder system to “test” your abilities…..Only to safe lock the first half of divisions? Might as well be “Get 100 overall wins and get a gold star!!!”

I know all to well though the reason to the safelock is because of those silly wings >_>

mazut.4296:

@Crimson Shi. Ok I can agree with what you say, but them the following happened to me few times already. After winning series of 8-12 games I lost 5-7 in a row. Not close games, but games where my team lost with 100, 150 to 500.
Can you explain to me why is this happening? And how is this a mirror to what I showed the day before?! There is something very wrong in the matchmaking system. If this loses were with very close points I can say I my team played bad or we got outplayed, but every one of this game feels like playing against pro league teams. And then all of a sudden I start winning again and the table turn 180 degree.
Its flawed.

Were you solo and running with a premade team? If solo thats the risk. There isn’t always going to be a perfect pool of 9 other players exactly at your skill level – end result the system has to take player from below and above to fill in gaps. We already have terribly long queue times ( have you watch supcuties late streams? 30+ mins, he is lucky to spend all day to do daily) do you really want to stand by waiting for longer just for potitenally equal matchs ( nothing is definite by merely looking at stats)

If team – focus on areas where you can improve.

The last bit you kind of fell off on a tangent. Do you want a system where your always granted a win or do you want a system to test your abilities until you hit a ceiling with your current abilities? If the latter then I’d say the system is working and its just feelings of inflated egos over last seasons mess.

kitten that is terrible to look at, Good thing I stopped at “except for warrior physical skills”.

Vayne.8563:

It would be better of we didn’t feel we were missing particularly story. That’s a big thing for some of us. I play for story. Story is my progression, more than anything else.

Locking story behind the raids, unless it’s something like Fractals where the stories don’t pertain to the world, disenfranchises me.

And not being able to get the ability to change stats on armor bother me some too. It’s not like it’s something you can show off. Why not make a super cool amazing raid skin for raiders and not deny others that functionality.

I mean a guy who does nothing but WvW is going to perhaps want legendary armor. Making someone raid to get it seems excessive.

Provide skins, minis, titles to raiders, not items that give them an actual benefit that others could benefit from as well.

So you’ve never ever in your gw2 career partied up with other players to do story/living story? Because that really is what gw2 raid is.

Legendary armor stat switch is most laughable moot point – " But it improves quality of life becuase I don’t have to carry around armor sets" – no instead you have to buy and carry around stacks of runes everytime you switch stats or else have substandard damage- power runes with condi armor or condi runes with power armor.

I got the serious case of the giggles with the opening to this thread

Riku.1093:

Before the expansion, I used to consider myself a pro player.

Pro player -just over 500 ranked games played

Riku.1093:

I won almost every match with my guardian.

Favorite profession – warrior

Call yourself whatever you want if it helps you sleep at night I guess. At least use the crop feature.

Pictures 1 and 2 teammates are saying the same thing. Rather than banking on being teamed up with someone that will carry, try actually learning tactics

Interpret Interrupt.3824:

rchu.8945:

Interpret Interrupt.3824:

Mesmer
1) Continuum Split Moa- Let’s take on of the best skills in the game, and cut the cd in half. And Half is a rough estimate, considering the alacrity production.
Why does continuum split still affect elite skills anyway. Let’s just chop the cd of every elite in the game in half. What kind of balance does that generate?
2) Moa- Casting this skill behind you is strong. I have definitely been moa’ed by mesmers facing the wrong way.

Mesmer got overnerfed compare to all the classes, alacrity got butchered, u want to nerf them even more, you better start coming up compensations.

See response to above quote. Again, this is intended to show strength. Not compare to currently over powered items. There are many threads suggesting the skill be reduced to 5 secs with half the cd. I think the solution is to make chronomancer not affect elite skills.

And in all those threads they fail to realize there is another class that can insta cast aoe moa and have the same general cd ( for the suggested new cd of mesmer moa) for mere cost of a 2 sec shorter duration. Which one would you rather pick 5 sec single target 2 sec cast time or aoe 1/2 sec cast 3 sec duration?

Removing effects of Continuum Split on elites would overnerf the speicalization without any compensation. For example: Remove effects of Continuum Split on elites, lower recharge of Continuum Split to 45 secs

Patrick.2987:

This is not the thread about ele, scrapper, necro and rev need a nerf aswell it is about a broken mechanic. Sure on engi it is strong aswell but at least duration is short.

LOL but of course what better way to claim a skill is broken than to remove anything that would make this seem silly. " We are going to remove numbers above 1, Therefore 1 is the highest number in the world – go ahead and prove me wrong"

Shouldn’t the main class an elite is for be more powerful than a class copy version?

Leeto.1570:

System actually works, just got myself off a 2 week ban for talking smack in map chat.
Its beutiful world you live in where biggest problems you have is people beeing mean in a video game, i can give you some likes on facebook if that will make you feel better.

lol preach it!!! I envy the lifestyle where the only worry is ensuring that every random person likes me over the interweb.

Seems rather odd to get upset over a conversation that didn’t even involve you. what if it was two friends busting each others balls waiting for the hell that is the pvp queue game. Usually more serious trash talk is taken to pms.

I’m more worried about the common sense issue, If you were told to “jump off a bridge” and you view that as a valid choice….. the last thing you should be doing is playing videogames ( especially participating in competetive pvp) instead of seeking help

Vex.9437:

i love how people say that moa is blockable, dodgeable and has a ridiculously long cast and you can t see the mesmer casting that because of the visual spamfest.

So the issue really is trouble seeing tells due to particle effects…….clearly should nerf skills rather than taking down particle effects…. cuz logic

dominik.9721:

I also like it when people say that sth. which is broken doesn’t deserve a nerf because there is sth. which is even more broken.

Non-sense-logic 100%

It even better when you see players complain about every class that kills them.

so what really happened is op went against a team that had a mesmer – got catfished into a perfectly executed moa combo and now going full tilt in an attempt to weaken that team in case of potential future match ups.

Blackjack.5621:

you cant dodge moa when the mesmer uses shield 5 and sword 3 to lock you down

Thats a shame – too bad there wasn’t a skill that breaks stun and unable to dodge sword clone or cleanse….

All hope is lost quick abadon your ship

Hendrix.9763:

FirehawkDAR.9021:

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Reaper, scrapper and a number of other specs are broken beyond help and your problem is moa? Lemme guess, you play necro and can’t stomach that mesmers still have one actually effective skill left.

Tbh, moa might as well be a 5 second daze. You don’t see anybody else with this ability.

You mean like engi’s Toss exlir x ? Whoosppiiiee!!!!!!!!!

L2Dodge.

style.6173:

So, why is ANET going down this path? There is nothing wrong with adding raid wings. the problem is when it is the ONLY content being released.

For the last 3 years they’ve been focusing on pve casuals – End result they have nothing to do 2-3 days after drop. Clearly creating zero resistance pve is not the correct route either, it isn’t logical from a business point either when they are trying to keep things realtively free but working nonestop. Other areas of the game have been complete neglected for years.

In the end though there is only one question that needs to be answered – R U Jelly that we got the best 5 devs of the team working on our content over yours? XDD

IndigoSundown.5419:

echo.2053:

The sheer number of players remove any need to adapt.

To get around that, you have to go where the people are not. That generally means going where the rewards aren’t. It’s still possible to get into an engaging fight, even in core. I got a condi necro into a fight with ~8 Sons of Svanir and ~4 griffons in DHC a couple of days ago. It reminded me of old times, before mega-server. Much rarer to find that opportunity now.

1+1+1+1+1+1+1 – it’s good to hear from a similar mindset. Rewards are the same becuase they are univerisal but at a much slower pace. But you are 100% right its not so much about the reward as it is about the fight. Once you own everything you want, rewards generally become pointless, at least for me becuase I don’t want to be in that position where if something new is released I can instantly buy it.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Raxzor.5946:

After your your experiences with HoT (positive or negative) will you be pre-ordering the next expansion?

Sure. If I’m playing at all, I plan start the expansion when it launches and so I’d prefer to have the advantages of early purchase.

HoT definitely has its annoyances, but then so did the core game at launch. Lest we forget:

echo.2053:

Strawman arugement spotted!!!!!

On the contrary, my point is that launches are always rough. I’m not deciding how to spend my money based on the stuff that didn’t go well; I’m deciding based on what I do like.

I like what I’ve seen to-date, I’m willing to live through HoT’s temporary issues for a few months.

I understand why others disagree and I respect their decisions to not pre-order next time.

Nah my comment was geared toward the the bugs issue, that sort of stuff is going to occur regardless. They are pretty deceant for bug fixes ( except skill bugs…..they are terrible at that- mesmer bugs for years horror :O)

It was geared at the comparison of HoT to core…. You can’t with a straight face compare them due to immense difference in content but yet eerily similar launch prices. I’m prolly taking slightly out of context – but a lot of disconnect occurs when they release an expac and then months down the road say they are adding more giving off the appaearace of an unfinished product. Some players have had receant bad expriences with receant kickstarter games.

Overall agree with whatever people decide to do – it’s their money. I do promote against pre-ordering though, there was a time where it was getting the game early and then getting a bonus – Now it seems enticement by flashy freebie skins while skimping out of game, because once they get your money it doesn’t matter anymore.

Beldin.5498:

Dyroth.5063:

Beldin.5498:

When people cry for “harder” content normally the following things happen :
- mobs get more HPs
- mobs make more damage, often one-shots
- mobs get more CCs so that you are often more often disabled / stunlocked then you could fight.

And that does not only happen in GW2 but in ALL MMOs. Personally i’m not a fan
of one-shots and lying on the floor until i’m dead, thats why i’m always against it
when people cry for “harder” content.

I think one shots can be done right to make content harder without making it cheap. A one shot that just happens because the boss looked at you is bad, but if there is a mechanic to it that makes it avoidable or makes a counter for it is fun. If say you had to ensure a break bar was done every few mins or else the party would wipe, or hiding behind a shield to avoid a massive attack are one shots done more correctly.

One shots are never fun .. especially if you always make builds that re not totally
glascannons, and still are one shotted because mobs deal something like 100 times
more damage than what is possible as health on the most tanky build.

In my eyes at least one shots are just a cheap way of pseudo diffuculty to make
those people happy that never played diablo hardcore, and think a game is just
to easy if they don’t die at least 50 times a day.

Diablo hardcore was more about battleing potiental lag spikes. Thats a different issue but the difficulty was fun. I love one shots, think they are fun and funny. Don’t really understand how you guys can play 4-5+ hours everyday knowing no matter how many times you kitten up there is little to no chance of you dieing.

The sheer number of players remove any need to adapt.

You can blame telegraphs if you want but even if a giant message saying " dodge now" blinked on the screen 90% of the player population would still not dodge.

Shylock.4653:

Beldin.5498:

Hell no .. HoT made me quit the game.

So, you quit the game but still read the game forum and write in it?
It seems that you haven’t found anything better.

The forums are funnier than the game, hence why people are here rather than playing the game. XD

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Raxzor.5946:

After your your experiences with HoT (positive or negative) will you be pre-ordering the next expansion?

Sure. If I’m playing at all, I plan start the expansion when it launches and so I’d prefer to have the advantages of early purchase.

HoT definitely has its annoyances, but then so did the core game at launch. Lest we forget:

• Guild chat didn’t work for a week for some of us (and 2-3 days for most of us).
• The TP didn’t work at all for close to two weeks (due to the same volume issues it had during BETA).
• Dungeon rewards were weak unless you grinded them like crazy.
• Champs and World Bosses didn’t offer any substantive loot.
• Lots of mechanics were terrible at launch and have been replaced by the wardrobe, the wallet, etc.

Strawman arugement spotted!!!!!

Preorder anything = no no.

They barely lucked out this expac- gift card was going the expire the following day, tank was full of game, fridge full of beer and food, no coming bills. The chances of that occuring are just below the level of pulling a precursor out of mystic forge first try.

Serophous.9085:

Simple.

Remove timers as a failing mechanic and use it as a reward mechanic.

Example: “beat the boss in 2min or fail” changes to “defeat the boss in 2min and get bonus loot”.

Now people can go into the pve mode however they want and perhaps beat the boss, while more engaged players will think on comp and builds to synergize and beat the encounter for bonus loot.

Or add an optional event that happens during the main that if complete it, or prevent it from failing during the main event, bonus loot.

How would that make an event harder? o.0 the world bosses are already being completed within 3-4 mins without any need to pay attention.

moony.5780:

y i also agree this definition is wrong

This is why I stated first that it varies from player to player. A hardcord player has a different view of what casual is compared to a hardcore spvp so forth.

If you want the most definite definiton of what casual is: A player that can’t handle the idea of a high chance to fail an event. Their first reaction to failing an event is to either complain how overpowered said event is or come to the forum to post request for nerfs rather than to review what mistakes were made and work to improve.

This is why hot maps will be rolled back in the near future.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

As a casual player, I find this extremely offensive. I play solo most of the time, but by your definition I’m a mindless sheep. Not appreciated.

easily offended is another quality, I din’t give you that label though- When you make multiple mistakes, Does that have a major effect on success or failure of event? If your answer is no, sorry merely not grouping up does not qualify solo play.

Deedrick.4372:

Well, its one thing to choose not to play together, but who gets to decide the label on the account as casual or hardcore. Who decides the definition of hardcore for that matter. And how do you convince the hardcore, they need to be handicapped, so others can enjoy the game a bit more.

It varies from player to player mostly in areas where gameplay is boring so they force themselves where others would quit.

Generally speaking

Casuals – laid back game play, shy away and are easily intimidated by challanges. Follower mindset.

Hardcore parkour (not possible to not add that last bit lol) – Consatntlytrying to push the limits, often handicap themselves – such as solo gameplay, weaker gear or gearless runs.

moony.5780:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

All I see here is: “I want Hard Mode” a la GW1

The answer we’ve been given is that they don’t want to do that in GW2 for a myriad of reasons.

Beyond that, I honestly don’t think they’d be able to make it work in any feasible or enjoyable way.

really? why?….i loved the gw1 hardmode..it was super cool….

bcs people can start small..and once they mastered the game in normal mode…they can make the hardmode instead of leaving the game

and i dont think its impossible to just make another version of a map where downscaling is hared and 2 times more monster….in the past there were muuuuch more monster than now..so if they reduced it..they can also increase it

The current system is already requires heavy amount of resources. Doubling that cost when they need to use megaservers to fill maps wouldn’t be good business sense.

Bomber.3872:

Aidan Savage.2078:

Bomber.3872:

Raids need a normal mode! [

Why? They’re MEANT to be difficult. You want a “normal mode raid”? Go do fractals or a dungeon.

PvP needs to count only personal mmr (so you get enemys that are as good as yourself and not only teammates)

Actually, no, if anything it should take the AVERAGE of your team’s MMR and use it. It wont ever use an individual’s rating because the fights arent 1vs1, they’re 5vs5.

and wvw needs an overhaul or at least a wvw season.

You realize they ARE working on an overhaul for wvw as well, right?

That would resolve ALL hardcore-casual problems.

No it wouldnt. The only way to resolve those problems would be to ban those who complain about the problem. No matter what anet does, there’s going to be SOMEONE who complains about it.

- You clearly don’t know how the broken matchmaking system this season works.
- I know about wvw, release expected early 2017, yay.
- raid is implemented for hardcore, no life freaks, but because gw2 hasn’t much of these kind of players anet added all endcontet there (HoT mastery points, legy armor, special items, only reliable way to get asc without spending $ or hours of gold farming, achievements, gw1 lore story, etc.). This is why anet has to add a normal mode there, it’s just insane to create all endcontent for only 0.1% of the playerbase (and that aren’t even the whales… oO)!
Currently raids are only for the 0.1% special snowflakes, that has to change!

confirmed

-Raids too hard for keyboard turning skill clickers – must nerf to prevent feelings of inadequacy.

- 99.9% gamewide agreement to stop the implementation of content requireing anything less than 80 players – otherwise players get depressed realising the storymode npc praises aren’t matching up with real gameplay.

- dodge roll tutorial is too complicated – many failed exit exam

- Only players who mindlessly run farm maps for hours have lives

By that last line it was clear that you enjoyed this last wintersday XDDDD

- Stop requiring coordination with multiple button presses – we are humans not calculators, we lose track of our fingers easily.

Bebunw.8137:

echo.2053:

Focusing on the casual playerbase was a bad idea – they are finicky and are in a constant demand for instant gratification – Even after effort is put in all another game developer has to do is flash something shiny and BAM! there they go – it’s a no win situation.

On the contrary, mmo companies make more money by growing up the player base, they shouldn not focusing on the casual or hardcore players but on both, that how wow deal with it they made 3 versions of raids one easy, one normal and one hard, and it’s still the 1 st mmo on the market with the biggest playerbase. And they can make more money from casuals because hardcore players are big farmers too, they pay their gems with gold.

in my concern, i’m not into raids and never will be because doing raids it’s like working, it’s time consuming and you have to make a commitment for a guild.

Indeed including both sides is better, but that hasn’t been the case for the last 3 years has it? Its been ground level mindnumbing, and now after the AMA they will be scaling hot (excluding raid) back down to that level….zzzz. I never played wow and yup it has alot of users……but if its so great and suits your needs why are you in this game? XD. The best I can relate to is coming from gw1 where there was a variety with difficulty levels.

Don’t like / want to do raids — don’t do them bam done and done. I am rather curious though by the last statement…. if your issue is that raids are “time consuming” what would you be doing then in place of doing the raids?

Tumult.2578:

I have seen how long they generally last until bordem sets in. Constant repetitive easy and constant difficult content =/= fun. Please do not take the “my way or the hiway” definition of what fun is.
Focusing on the elite playerbase was a bad idea – they are finicky and are in a constant demand for instant gratification – Even after effort is put in all another game developer has to do is flash something shiny and BAM! there they go – it’s a no win situation.

Talking serious mode : Holler at me when one of those upcoming “fun” games hits the year mark and still is active.

I would but you’ll likely be gone to the first game thats comes along saying its challenging.

LOL the Trixx box nearly got you huh XD remember to tell that rabbit “silly rabbit trixx are for kids”

If thats the case both groups are leaving so then why should they bother to do anything? Cut their loss early to maximize profit.

Just food for thought: Been around waiting for increasing challenge content for 3 years but barely 5 months in with this completely optional content already has you holding your breath threatening to quit the moment its not your way – can’t imagine who they should give attention to XD

Tumult.2578:

Have you seen some of the new games coming out? They are going for fun, not challenge. You got the raids you wanted. ALOT didn’t get what they wanted.
Clearly, challenging does not necessarily equal fun.

Now watch the casual player base, and their money, dwindle away.
I wish there was something positive here but I don’t see it.
Hard content alone will not sustain this game. Fun content will.
They’re sitting backwards on the horse right now.

Have you seen how long they general last until bordem sets in? Constant reptitive easy content =/= fun. Please do not take the cereal box definition of what fun is.

Focusing on the casual playerbase was a bad idea – they are finicky and are in a constant demand for instant gratification – Even after effort is put in all another game developer has to do is flash something shiny and BAM! there they go – it’s a no win situation.

Talking serious mode : Holler at me when one of those upcoming “fun” games hits the year mark and still is active.

blue, teal, turquoise are the only colors that matter XD

Beldin.5498:

echo.2053:

Beldin.5498:

And don’t tell me legendary is not better than ascended .. heck in the actual
drought of bew armor sets even just an exclusive armor set skin for raids
would make me angry .. as long as it isn’t ugly in my eyes ^^

Legendary is not better than ascended…. its exactly the same stat level with more required energy to make. Before you hyperventilate and pass out, just want to point out a itty bitty tiny weeny detail that you kinda glazed over- legendary armor hasn’t even been released and based on previous legendary craft requirements its going to take most months for each piece. By the time they are finished you’ll already have multipe sets of asc armor.

most likely will be more butt capes

I said : DON’T TELL ME. You should maybe read before you answer.

The QoL to not have to carry other armor sets with you is what still makes it
“better” in some way.

Jokes on you I don’t follow directions of others regardless if wearing dorito, apple or other.
case and point :

Are you really sure about that QoL? I was going to touch upon it in the previous but thought it was kinda obvious.

Weapons can get away with stat changes because sigils have universal use – sigil of energy has same use for condi builds as power builds. Runes however do not. Using Superior runes of undead with power stats would hamper your effectivness as would superior runes of the eagle on rabid stat armor. Unless you are willing to carry stacks of runes for everytime you change stats its not really a qol improvement.

Harper.4173:

Anet has 300+ employees – 5 working on raids – the rest on other things.
But now “they are focusing on raids over other things” – sure.

That actually makes soooo much sense and explains the worry about the resource being divided…. only 5 able to fulfil their job description :o

Harper.4173:

Everyone is complaining about Raiding – nobody notices the lack of armor skins in a primarily cosmetic driven game.
Nobody notices that we’re getting outfits that are less valuable to players because you can’t mix and match them.

FALSE!!!! we’ve been getting tons of reskinned armor!!!
Oh wait you were probably talking about armor that wasn’t aquired from the gemstore because thats a fun design – Build a game where end game is dress up but then only offer vareity outfits for gems

Beldin.5498:

And don’t tell me legendary is not better than ascended .. heck in the actual
drought of bew armor sets even just an exclusive armor set skin for raids
would make me angry .. as long as it isn’t ugly in my eyes ^^

Legendary is not better than ascended…. its exactly the same stat level with more required energy to make. Before you hyperventilate and pass out, just want to point out a itty bitty tiny weeny detail that you kinda glazed over- legendary armor hasn’t even been released and based on previous legendary craft requirements its going to take most months for each piece. By the time they are finished you’ll already have multipe sets of asc armor.

most likely will be more butt capes

you dont transfer anything. its automatically linked to your account. you play the same characters but to use elite specs you have to use mastery points to unlock the skills for each chacter ( if you want to use that spec)

Its always been a complaint waaaay before elite specs.

watch some mesmer streams on twitch – reality is deceant mesmers don’t rapid fire moa as you guys claim. If that has happened to you chances are they are trolling you – blind nerfs should not be made for troll moves.

moa signets passive is more valuable, only really time its wasted is either the mesmer needs to quickly kill you to get back elsewhere, or the mesmer is out of cooldowns in trouble.

Weaksauce – Quitters will never get ahead in life.

yeah gw1 mesmering was alot of fun with hexs and punishment.

I tired different classes once… the number of mistakes you could make and still walk away was like condi pu without having to trait for it. I can’t live in that world, rather my terribleness be show flat out.

Best of luck with whichever class gets you to where you think you should be XD

rchu.8945:

Agemnon.4608:

• Moa form’s duration reduced to three seconds down from 10 to account for the possibility of a double moa. To compensate for people losing their class mechanics (e.g., can’t cleanse or dodge out of it) moa gives the affected player triple their total (as opposed to base) toughness. This will increase the liklihood that moa’d players will remain in the game after it ends. Moa form cooldown reduced to 90 seconds.

umm, are you freaking kidding me?

Funny how thief main recommending nerfs to Mesmer is by overnerfing one of it’s most useful elites.

No, just no.

Agreed, that would be the absolute dumbest nerf to even be imagined.

a 90 sec recharge, single target, long cast activatio, 3 sec duration would have nothing aginst engi’s 120 sec recharge ( unless trait which would only be 10 sec more than suggested mesmer elite change), aoe, quick activated, 3 sec duration

You would literally have engi’s toolbelt elite elixi x overwrite another classes elite.

This this is why we can’t have the balance team listen to suggestions

maddoctor.2738:

The entire mindset of “zerker or go home” has been in the game for a very long time, it’s nothing that will be enforced by raids. How much more toxic than that do you think Raids will be?

Last thing – off topic – no intentions to call out – That mindset is an unfortunate result to an absolutely terrible game mechanic ~ the down state~. Its also killed support roles.

Its kinda " Why bother use any other amor combinations when I can max damage, face tank everything, and be easily revived with no penalty?"

MadRabbit.3179:

echo.2053:

MadRabbit.3179:

echo.2053:

I must be foolish and misguided, I tried to use nonsense logic to see how raids even remotely impact wvw but couldn’t. Go ahead explain that one.

Maybe, if you used sensical logic, you would see that they don’t which is why the decline of my WvW guilds before HoT is a seperate issue and doesn’t have anything to do with my PvE guilds staying steady until HoT.

Sensical logic would be if had noticed that the thread was about raids not general HoT. Perhaps you should find friends that know the meaning of the expression "When the going gets tough, the tough get going ". Quality over quanity my friend – 15v1 is fun but calling it a night at 16v15……ehhh

MadRabbit.3179:

Cool story again, little sista, but completely pointless.

MadRabbit.3179:

What you are suggesting is what is ruining the game, not better and things would have better served if you had played another game that focused on challenge as part of it’s design philosophy instead of endlessly harping on it’s “lack of challenge” as a con, not a pro.

So you were pointlessly suggesting that I find a different game for challange….thats rather …..odd

Look, dropping all this snark we have been exchanging and just being straight up with you, not trying to make a jab or get you relied up or anything….

I, honest to God, have no clue what you are talking about or what point you are trying to make or what point you think I made that you are now discrediting.

If you want to list out what you think I said and what points you are trying to make, I’ll gladly respond.

But I am not going to keep playing this game of trying to guess just what the hell you are thinking.

I’ve been jumping in and out of other games to fulfill that challenge need. I enjoy trying to combine the keyboard with the wall out of rage. That stuff doesn’t phase me. I’ve completed pretty much everything to do within gw2. Me logging in consists on making some sort of innuendo based on what was last said in guildchat and then logging off within the 5 min mark. The last remaining things for me is pretty much to solo dungeons ( yeah I know thats already been donemany times by others but I held off).

The reason why this verison of raiding is good is because it instanced, its not forcing people who don’t want to be a part of it to do it. From the AMA they’ve already stated they no longer care about dungeons, esports is an underdeveloped joke, wvw and fractals have been neglected for years, and they are going to be rolling back the hot areas…

I hear you on the worry about toxic groups, but really they are already there. Just look what occurs when events fail – IF they fail because they are pretty much designed to be unfailable- the map just ends up playing the blame game. Maybe it will occur but maybe it wont – gw2 is prettttty casual.

Again though I am not imply that raids are hardcore extreme content – some groups are getting kills with less than the recommended amount and I believe there was one group that got a kill doing a green gear only requirement.

MadRabbit.3179:

echo.2053:

I must be foolish and misguided, I tried to use nonsense logic to see how raids even remotely impact wvw but couldn’t. Go ahead explain that one.

Maybe, if you used sensical logic, you would see that they don’t which is why the decline of my WvW guilds before HoT is a seperate issue and doesn’t have anything to do with my PvE guilds staying steady until HoT.

Sensical logic would be if had noticed that the thread was about raids not general HoT. Perhaps you should find friends that know the meaning of the expression "When the going gets tough, the tough get going ". Quality over quanity my friend – 15v1 is fun but calling it a night at 16v15……ehhh

MadRabbit.3179:

Cool story again, little sista, but completely pointless.

MadRabbit.3179:

What you are suggesting is what is ruining the game, not better and things would have better served if you had played another game that focused on challenge as part of it’s design philosophy instead of endlessly harping on it’s “lack of challenge” as a con, not a pro.

So you were pointlessly suggesting that I find a different game for challange….thats rather …..odd

MadRabbit.3179:

echo.2053:

Yup and for the last 3 years that small development team has been soley focused on casual pve. Do remember what the general reception to each of those updates? Unless it was a straight farming event – complaint whine complaint whine whine complaint whine complaint complaint. I seriously question why they even bother to do more than just rehash the same farm map. Any slight resistance = players giving up.

Oh your guild and friend list started going dark since hot…… cool story bro. Thats been happening for me and other looong before hot release. I preordered this game and have just barely hit 4.8k account hours with countless afk hours. Pve is a complete snoozefest just target boss and autoattack to gold – there is 0 incentive to put forth any more effort. The games strength really is just having mass number of players attack a boss that had little to no mechanics.

Am I saying that raids is ultra 360 kick flip pop shove it in your face hardcore parkour content? Nope but it is a start to adding some challange.

Cool story as well, little sista. Maybe, you should make better friends, because the population in my guilds outside of WvW has remained constant up until HoT.

You feel that adding challenge to the game is a good thing. I do not. I consider saying that it “needs” challenge is a misunderstanding of what made the game special to begin with and imposition of your own personal interests.

What you are suggesting is what is ruining the game, not better and things would have better served if you had played another game that focused on challenge as part of it’s design philosophy instead of endlessly harping on it’s “lack of challenge” as a con, not a pro.

The sentiments you are expressing here are foolish and misguided and we’ll have to agree to disagree on that point.

I strayed to stay away from zerg guilds bb, if thats yo thang ham it up.

I must be foolish and misguided, I tried to use nonsense logic to see how raids even remotely impact wvw but couldn’t. Go ahead explain that one.

huh I thought math would be better or is it that one player that sees 3 enemies and yells zerg? Ehh I have time to teach….

-Take 4800 hours / (divide by) 24 ( cuz 24 hours in a day ) = 200 days worth of gameplay.

-The game is about 3.5 years old (give or take) x (multiply that by ) 365 ( number of days in a year) = ( which equals) 1278 ( rough estimate of the number days the game has out * remember to round up if 5 or above)

- Now take number of days game has been around 1278 – ( and subtractthe number of days that I have played) 200 = 1078 days (or 2.9 years if you convert) unexplained where I have NOT been in game. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you know the statistical chances that I probably picked up another game for a challange.

MadRabbit.3179:

echo.2053:

Grogba.6204:

echo.2053:

Grogba.6204:

But raids always create kitten flinging contests where one side has the craving to always feel superior (I’m Elite because I raid) and the other side continueosly belittles the first group as a bunch of no-lifes.

Why is this an issue? Thought this game was rated at least Teen. Pretty sure by that point in life people should have developed coping mechanisms. If not well pick up a single player game.

^ Proving the point

Because these kind of threads drown out any proper discussion we could have instead.

There isn’t a point to have a discussion for it. It’s either you can or you can’t “just deal with it”. Yup there is going to be players better than you, yup you are going to make mistakes, yup there are players who think they are flawless……so what? In the real world class mates make better grades than you, people have more friends than you, some guys get more girls than you, co workers make more money than you etc etc etc….players have been using these skills unconsciously the majority of their life.

To deny content because of fear that someones feels will be hurt is just utterly rediculous espically these days where every single thing offends someone else. Furthermore denying content will ultimately just lead to players switching games at which point you’ll be in a singleplayer game —- just cut out the middleman by playing single player games and as a bonus you’ll be 100% guarenteed free of even remotely having to entertain the thought of a player telling you whether your good or bad.

Plenty of reason to have discussion about it. It’s not about “denying content”. You have a limited development team with limited number of man hours who can only produce X amount of content. You can’t have every type of content in a game; it’s doomed to fail if it tries to be everything. You have to make decisions about what you want in.

So the question is more, in a game like GW2 where it’s largest and most talked about strength is it’s in game community and the relationships among it’s players, does adding content that can increase the “feelings hurt” of people and incite potential drama in guilds make it a better game?

My answer is “No”. The game would have been better served focusing on stuff that played to it’s strengths. You can say it’s a better game now because this content was not “denied”, but my friends list and guild roster only being half full whenever I do actually login compared to what it was right before HoT launched suggests otherwise.

The developers clearly feel otherwise as well, since they doubled down on another raid wing. I hope I am wrong and it works out for them. I’ll miss the game though.

Yup and for the last 3 years that small development team has been soley focused on casual pve. Do remember what the general reception to each of those updates? Unless it was a straight farming event – complaint whine complaint whine whine complaint whine complaint complaint. I seriously question why they even bother to do more than just rehash the same farm map. Any slight resistance = players giving up.

Oh your guild and friend list started going dark since hot…… cool story bro. Thats been happening for me and other looong before hot release. I preordered this game and have just barely hit 4.8k account hours with countless afk hours. Pve is a complete snoozefest just target boss and autoattack to gold – there is 0 incentive to put forth any more effort. The games strength really is just having mass number of players attack a boss that had little to no mechanics.

Am I saying that raids is ultra 360 kick flip pop shove it in your face hardcore parkour content? Nope but it is a start to adding some challange.

Grogba.6204:

echo.2053:

Grogba.6204:

But raids always create kitten flinging contests where one side has the craving to always feel superior (I’m Elite because I raid) and the other side continueosly belittles the first group as a bunch of no-lifes.

Why is this an issue? Thought this game was rated at least Teen. Pretty sure by that point in life people should have developed coping mechanisms. If not well pick up a single player game.

^ Proving the point

Because these kind of threads drown out any proper discussion we could have instead.

There isn’t a point to have a discussion for it. It’s either you can or you can’t “just deal with it”. Yup there is going to be players better than you, yup you are going to make mistakes, yup there are players who think they are flawless……so what? In the real world class mates make better grades than you, people have more friends than you, some guys get more girls than you, co workers make more money than you etc etc etc….players have been using these skills unconsciously the majority of their life.

To deny content because of fear that someones feels will be hurt is just utterly rediculous espically these days where every single thing offends someone else. Furthermore denying content will ultimately just lead to players switching games at which point you’ll be in a singleplayer game —- just cut out the middleman by playing single player games and as a bonus you’ll be 100% guarenteed free of even remotely having to entertain the thought of a player telling you whether your good or bad.

Grogba.6204:

But raids always create kitten flinging contests where one side has the craving to always feel superior (I’m Elite because I raid) and the other side continueosly belittles the first group as a bunch of no-lifes.

Why is this an issue? Thought this game was rated at least Teen. Pretty sure by that point in life people should have developed coping mechanisms. If not well pick up a single player game.

CrashTestAuto.9108:

Plus plenty of people found Liadri difficult in the first year.

Liadri was difficult first year because of gravity orb hitbox being underground, camera being trapped in the cage – it was absolutely amazing!!!…..then they nerfed it

Its funny how this game is most fun when the mechanics are broken – In the first year the champion risen wraith that would just decimate zergs, even teq was interesting after the damage update but broken hitbox – I even partipated rather then afk loot it

CrashTestAuto.9108:

I’d rather they’d gone the other way and given us something like the Queen’s gauntlet.

o.0’ how was that difficult content? that was just pre-silverwaste.

Same common complaint " Its not fair to have legendary gear behind this wall" – Perhaps you are’t as legndary as you thought you were

I’d rather have guild mates leave the guild (and just adding them on friends list if they are someone dear), then to watch names go grey for several months until kick for room from bordem of doing the same mindless merry-go-round.

Aezyr.5304:

echo.2053:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

The video is by Fevir, right?

That was an awful video by that guy lol. " Im going to put aside made up numbers and facts and instead tell you stories that you can relate too" great way to explain why raids were bad by aiming for a like mind bias XDDDD

Raids are great for mmos ( coming from a player thats never played wow).

They provide instanced difficulty for players that wish for harder content- I don’t know about thest rest of you but I enjoy playing game on hard/extreme difficulty on first playthrough…..its a total waste of a game to play on very easy mode.

Becuase its instanced it does not force the rest of the population to do the content – don’t want to do it…..then don’t do it ( plenty of players who have never pvp/wvw). You can run around silverwaste farming your hearts out.

Anet has carebeared too much for the casual players in order to prevent hurting of their feels. Any time this community meets ANY sort of resistance at least 90% of the players will fold and fall out look at marionette, tirple trouble, even teq after its update and before strategy was devised by specific guilds.

Biggest complaints against raids:

time consuming – because many players are spending 4+ hours mindlessly farming 30 mins setup is unacceptable >_>

Gear focused content – unrealistic fear that future content will require raid gear …..regular pve content has still yet to reach ascended gear requirement for starters, and two rewards are mostly going to be comsetic if you are new to the gw scene aka 0 effect on stats

You forgot WvW game mode and players. We do require PvE gear.

Everyone has forgotten about that mode since that unnecessary update for starters, for the majority of players in wvw they moment they became separated from their zerg- gear became irrelevant, lastly in a manner much like infusions but unlike fractals have actual time spent improving mechanics

actually forgot a complaint:

Resources will be taken away from regular maps….. – just rehash silverwaste and they’ll be good for another 8+ months

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

The video is by Fevir, right?

That was an awful video by that guy lol. " Im going to put aside made up numbers and facts and instead tell you stories that you can relate too" great way to explain why raids were bad by aiming for a like mind bias XDDDD

Raids are great for mmos ( coming from a player thats never played wow).

They provide instanced difficulty for players that wish for harder content- I don’t know about thest rest of you but I enjoy playing game on hard/extreme difficulty on first playthrough…..its a total waste of a game to play on very easy mode.

Becuase its instanced it does not force the rest of the population to do the content – don’t want to do it…..then don’t do it ( plenty of players who have never pvp/wvw). You can run around silverwaste farming your hearts out.

Anet has carebeared too much for the casual players in order to prevent hurting of their feels. Any time this community meets ANY sort of resistance at least 90% of the players will fold and fall out look at marionette, tirple trouble, even teq after its update and before strategy was devised by specific guilds.

Biggest complaints against raids:

time consuming – because many players are spending 4+ hours mindlessly farming 30 mins setup is unacceptable >_>

Gear focused content – unrealistic fear that future content will require raid gear …..regular pve content has still yet to reach ascended gear requirement for starters, and two rewards are mostly going to be comsetic if you are new to the gw scene aka 0 effect on stats

[quote=6025675;Obtena.7952:
Regardless, I find discussions that refer to value for money ridiculous … MMO’s are cheapest form of entertainment you can get, especially non-sub ones like GW2. Your investment is typically PENNIES an hour.[/quote]

This guy gets it XDDD

Deleena.3406:

This whole thread is really no different then asking “was HoT/GW2 worth it”
anyway

---

In this specific case though…. whats your $:hours play ratio to determine if worth or not?
——————————————————————————————————————————————————————-

GW1— 8k hours (with a very long 10hour AFK limit xD) cost~180$

GW2 —11k hours (mostly playtime short/rude auto kicks) cost~100$

I clearly got more value/fun out of GW2 (but this only apply to me i dont speak for any1 but myself)

Its always fun to hear the 2 cent vs 1 cent debate XD. Obtena really nailed it with pennies per hour XDDD

Its perfectly fine and dandy to have a different preferenace……. but at least be truthful with yourself.

With factions and prophs base price being $60…..that will never equal $180 so 1 of 3 things has occured:

-you got severely reemed by a store ( hard to not notice overpaying $60),

-you included optionals that shouldn’t be included in base game comparisons ( even though there is a gold 2 gem converter its still very doubtful for a person not to spend money on the gem store when they have in previous games on top of 11k hours…I mean I myself preordered gw2 and have done everything there is to do and am only at 4.8k hours with a good portion of the hours being as a result of falling asleep in spvp matches all night),

-or more likely you’ve switched the pricetags between two games ( I can see a 11k hour player spending $100 on a gw2 colletor edition and buying a $79.99 on expac ( or vice versa order))

Deleena.3406:

echo.2053:

Deleena.3406:

At the time prophecy was a value for the money (over 10 years ago!)

still such an awkward comparison pretty much like you saying a gumball is worth $1 and me saying its worth 25 cents.

i think you missed something in my post! (in the end its really preference)

Nope not really I had addressed that in a previous post, some things are so predictable that you can actually preemptively reply to them before that user even begins to write a post. I was merely reiterating that awkwardness in difference in money worth – like how people are willing to pay hundreds of more dollars for an item just because of the brand name.

In this specific case though…. whats your $:hours play ratio to determine if worth or not?

Deleena.3406:

At the time prophecy was a value for the money (over 10 years ago!)

still such an awkward comparison pretty much like you saying a gumball is worth $1 and me saying its worth 25 cents.

we shall see what happens against the test of time. we are just coming up on 3.7 years…

IndigoSundown.5419:

DaveyC.4398:

When I look at the expansion, it was more money than any of the campaigns in gw1 and did not even come with a manual or monster lore book.

Not when I bought them. I paid considerably less for HoT than for any of Prophecies, Factions or Nightfall. At release, the prices were virtually the same, $49.99-$50. you probably bought GW campaigns at reduced prices. HoT will get there sooner or later.

So, ~10 years later… the best burger in town has close to doubled in price; movies have close to doubled in price; my rent has gone up by ~40%, high speed internet is up 30-40%. A game XPac whose retail price has gone up by ~25% doesn’t look so bad (Eye of the North retailed at $39.99, $10 less than HoT).

But those were complete standalone games ( exception of eotn which was going to be another campaign expac that got cut short for gw2)…. can’t really compare that to 4 maps with a “soon” promise…

Unless you are a brand new players in which case……touche and you may continue to gloat over the old players

DGraves.3720:

Did anyone who is complaining here read the old forums of GW1?

Because it’s riddled with complaints about the game. Nostalgia is amazing sometimes.

is there actually a game where there no forum complaints? Its amazing how its so easy to blame nostalgia sometimes. XD

To be honest though – had no idea there actually was a gw1 forum. seriously always thought gwguru was the actual forum :o Live and let live I suppose

Astraea.6075:

And yet, some of us enjoy this game more than we enjoyed it’s predecessor.

In core GW2 Tyria, ANet has given us an immersive open world to explore with lore and stories scattered throughout each zone that I prefer to the instanced world of GW.

As for value for money, for me this game has easily surpassed the value I received from GW and it’s campaigns (I’ve spent about the same amount on each game).

And to each their own subjective view of game vs their money worth ( seems like a veryyy silly scale to use XD w/e floats your boat I guess)

Whats not subjective is complete lack of end game material or issues with other game modes going neglected for months on end.

laokoko.7403:

I don’t really know. It seemed Anet invested more in GW2 but people aren’t happy.

But in GW1 Anet seemed to be able to put lesser money but keep people happy.

That’s because they didn’t have too. All of gw1 runs at a fraction of gw2 running costs hence why it is said that gw1 will run indefinitely.

gw2 was aimed at casuals to make ncsofts mouth water for profits. Business wise it was a no brainer success, how ever longevity is a major issue. With the difficulty being aimed so low, players are progressing through content faster than the developers can make it.

however the moment content requires players to use more than 1 button to attack then suddenly player base is screaming about how content was developed for elitist only.

morrolan.9608:

warbignime.4610:

echo.2053:

oh my most handsome mesmuh eveah makes my banana hamick tight tight.

He nails the point at minute 4 with the common gw2 player mentality

“If game results in loss its because I was placed on kittenty team but if game results in win its because I carried the team”.

Sums up the pvp forum.

No it doesn’t actually.

sure we could include:

-Team had x number of specific class which = class op

-rando commando player stating how comp players don’t use class x which means it underpowered or using class means its op

Majority of players abused rev last tourny inflating what they believe their perceptions of what their abilities were, now only to blame the system.

of course there will be denial just like McDonald’s nobody wants to admit eating it, yet 6 billion hamburgers are sold daily….