OP what would the alternative be then? Should most damage give you the credit? Do you suppose it would be possible to steal the enemy’s boss then, if that were the case? It clearly wouldn’t, because of the distances involved. So then, each team would get their own boss each time. So then both teams would be no better off than the other. So then there would be no point to the bosses because neither team would get an edge for skillful play.
With the “last hit” mechanic, skilled teams have the opportunity to gain significant point and bonus leads vs teams that are unable to coordinate and protect their bosses from incoming enemies.
I agree NIEKler, pvp needs more polish, but we’re in the home stretch at least. The heavy lifting’s been done, now they need to close the deal.
Respawn times are actually every 20 seconds, but at 18,38,58 seconds every minute. No idea why.
this game is far from being finished
I love how he takes all the hard work, innovation, and polish that have gone into the game in all other respects for granted.
Good post pandara
sami try Elixer S
It’s a choice only a mortal can make.
that sounds like a nightmare
Just give things time to settle. I think combos are not really meant to be the focal-point of team-build making, but a thoughtful secondary concern. As things become more steady you’ll see players looking to take advantage of combos to gain that little bit of extra advantage.
You’re completely forgetting it’s the reason we don’t see x5 thief teams.
Also I’d hate to be downed near you, can’t expect you’d try to get me up.
I really enjoy 055, but 012 is cool too.
Etang, there are a couple L2P threads about downed state you should read.
People need to stop giving so many kitten. Lol I wonder what that sentence will look like when put through the kitten filter.
They are not “impossible” to counter at all, they’re just “substantially more difficult” — there’s a difference. For stealth, any aoe interrupt will work, and there are several I can think of off the top of my head. Actually, I believe that even if an enemy is stealthed, you can still aim and fire any interrupts you may have at where you last saw him and they will hit him. If you’re downed you can’t however. For quickness it reduces the stomp time to like.. 1.5 seconds? which by gw1 standards should be an easy interrupt for anyone that is paying attention (I have trouble with it too, but I assume I will get better). Edit: but then again the interrupts we have in gw2 aren’t 1/4th second activations so maybe depending on the rupt you are using it could be as low as .5 seconds stomp, which is basically impossible to rupt.
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They downgraded the call system? wtf are you talking about?
Aginor, try taking skills to help finish downed players.
they’ve no incentive to stay
Downed state makes sense when you’re in a good team. If you’re dying alone constantly then yes, it probably seems pointless.
There were technical reasons why we had to implement it this way, but thank you for voicing your ideas and opinions.
I think most of us are just confused because in the beta weekends, you allowed us to store multiple PvP skins in the lockers without a hitch. Could you explain to us the technical reasons why you’re not allowing this anymore? I think a lot of us would be a lot more understanding if we knew why – it’s just legitimately confusing to me, it’s really quite tedious to juggle all of these items.
No. No. Just, no. Don’t waste his time by asking for some technical explanation that you won’t even fully understand. The only relevant question because it wasn’t clear is “Is this a bug then that will be fixed at some point, or is the technical limitation a permanent one?”.
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they said they would
I was expecting some over-the-top childish whining, but these are all fair points
Solidox I had same problem with flamethrower kit. Not very useful in pvp, although the airblast is excellent and may be worth taking the whole kit…
Downed skills:
- 2 is an interrupt
- 3 is skill that is rarely used by any class unless you have a teammate keeping your enemies occupied
Engi purpose:
General versatility like ele, cc, support, survivability.
I’ve seen builds for engi on youtube that burst for respectable amounts (both rifle and pistol) but I prefer to build more balanced so I am useful in most situations vs most enemies. I can solo guardians (gasp). I solo almost any melee class with rifle (and bosses, just give me a bit of time). i solo eles, I remove condies from my team like a boss, toss boons around, keep warriors off my squishies, etc.
On that note: why the kitten are retaliation and fury so similar. wtf.
Great post Pinder.
This is something they will change. I just hope it’s sooner rather than later.
I’d prefer a skilled player of any class.
I think the downed skills are reasonably fair (excluding elementalists). The guardian aoe knockback is really not a problem if you let only 1 person try to finish him. Likewise for the warrior you don’t even need to use your stability if you have 2 people trying to stomp him.
Rhydian:
From https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Downed-State-Tutorial/first#post102407 about mesmer and thief downed states:
- When you’re finishing a mesmer and they disappear, their clone will appear, and then a second later somewhere else they will appear. There will be a giant red down arrow over their heads. That’s them.
- When the thief disappears, just move to cancel your finisher (save time), walk over and finish them again.
Anyway IMO is a really horrific mechanic for pvp , making impossible to win 1 vs 2 fights , and i don’t care if you say that i’m not supposed to win 1 vs 2 , if i am better i should be rewarded for it , not being punished by a random guardian pushing me away to res the downed mate .
Obviously you are not better.
Liav, Araditus (edit: and Mescaline) was talking about 1v2 fights being impossible to win because if one of the enemy is downed they will just get ressed by their ally. If he understood how downed state works and had planned ahead by bringing appropriate skills he wouldn’t have so many problems killing downed enemies.
If you’re downed and are alone, you’re just dead. There’s little you can do, and I didn’t mean to imply there was. If you’ve got an ally nearby then you will see if that ally is skilled enough to res you.
Keltic, replace the word “blocked” with “locked” and you will suddenly understand this thread.
You can enter with no trait points allocated, and add them when you see the enemy team (and in fact I do believe you can just wait until you engage the enemy and then allocate them, even in the middle of combat). Once you’ve allocated your trait points, you can freely swap everything else as long as you are out of combat. This, gentlemen, is not a can of worms we want to keep open for long.
Having every weapon at your disposal is not a “minor advantage”. Your character’s capabilities are largely decided by your weapon choices. If you don’t actually have to make a choice at all before entering it severely devalues pre-game strategy. You can just build your character from the ground up after entering and seeing the enemy profession composition. You can just start fighting, see what builds they are specced to, disengage, and set up whatever weapons and armor (and traits!) that would help most, and go back in. All players become shifting targets, and it’s never clear to the enemy what you are capable of. Pretty terrible, really. If both teams do this it’s just chaos.
Can’t believe this thread got derailed so hard so fast.
Yes, as shukran said, everything should be locked down as soon as you enter. They had this same problem in the beginning of gw1 and only fixed it when people began abusing it. Which is probably going to happen all over again.
Actually it turns out 2v1s are possible. You just have to understand how downed state works. Which might be difficult to do… if you’ve given up and quit the game.
Varnoth maybe I didn’t explain myself properly. I was responding to those that would say the game has no teamplay. In fact it does, but the ways in which teams should act isn’t immediately obvious, and so people say that it doesn’t exist.
Probably the main reason everyone thinks gw2 is not a team-based game is because the team interactions are less obvious than games that feature the holy trinity. Those roles are set in stone, you wouldn’t try to heal your ally with a warrior — you can’t! In gw2 the roles are loosened up so that each class has the ability to support, control, and damage. Which also leads to premature declarations that gw2 has no teamplay.
I thought the counter to mesmer was aoe
He can compare if he wants, and I agree. Having about 50 tournament wins with engineer and extensive gw1 gvg experience I’d say that tpvp feels a lot like GvG. I play with some good people that are vocal and calling everything out and tactics are getting thrown around in mumble. It’s really good.
Pinder we’ll see what anet think of the situation. I’d certainly like to play with my friends in pug groups, but I also fear for collateral damage.
Great, thanks. Will probably try it when I roll necro.
Gentlemen, we are in the presence of royalty.
I guess. I don’t know. He has some youtube channel or something. He’s cool guy I hear.
Edit: good post!
Edit2: Read linked article, STRONGLY RECOMMENDED reading for everyone in this sub forum.
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Pinder I don’t mean to be dismissive — I did read your post and I can see you put a lot of thought into it — but everything is based on the assumption that 3 organized skilled players are not enough to make a significant difference in match outcomes. I just don’t agree with this assessment. If these 3 players are also the top 3 for score in the server, it’s madness in my opinion to suggest that they can’t be auto-balanced individually.
If PvE content had a similar reward system…it would be pointless. I like to play with the thought that I can become more powerful from my time spent.
This is a great philosophy for pve because the enemy doesn’t care that you have better gear than it. However, it turns out that you do get more powerful in gw2 pvp the longer you play…
It’s not “good for” anything in the way you mean it. You play because you enjoy melting people’s faces and tight teamplay (in tourney guilds) bringing you to victory. If you don’t enjoy it you don’t do it. It is its own reward.
If player rank is used in any kind of rating system to match players in pvp, you will never see it be character-based. You could simply make a new character and mow through noobs for glory farm, then delete the character and start over. You could even keep making them of the same profession.
Also I really disagree with people saying you should have to grind rank on each profession to be considered good at it. It doesn’t especially matter that it’s not your main profession, you as a person have gained experience from all your other fights and you will learn that profession much faster than a player that just installed gw2. There is no accurate way to measure player skill anyway, so don’t penalize players for playing other professions.