Guild Wars 2

Bran.7425:

Can I have your stuff?

No I owe a friend some gold and I might come back in 6+months.

Hi Necro community,

I’ve been somewhat active this summer, and while most of you didn’t really know me or take me all that seriously, I just wanted to say that it was an honor to complain about how kittened up this class is, was, and always will be, with all of you.

The reasons for me leaving are simple: the hype from the feature patch, starting with the godsend ranger buffs disappointed me way too much when we finally got to necromancers. I honestly feel like the devs don’t really play, understand, or even care about this class. Secondly: I’m honestly just bored, anet is too slow putting out content, and the LS isn’t meaningful content. PvE bored me to tears, while WvW/GvGs/PvP are still fun, they are boring, and in the case for pvp, it feels like go cheese or go home, something which grinds my gears beyond all reason. I’m also getting too busy with grad school stuff and whatnot, as well as my anticipation for a few new 3DS games coming out this fall.

Anyway, I will still try to log in from time to time, and maybe post, but devoting so much of my life to GW2 is over, at least for now.

Message me if y’alls want to fight me in pokemon or something. Oh and I just want to give a few shoutouts to forummers here that I’ll miss.

Firstly, Spoj, you inspired me to try to change the pug pve perceptions of necromancers. And even though I may have failed by hating pve too much, and the necro balance changes being pitiful for pve, I just wanted to thank you for all the hard work you’ve done to making us understand the breadth of this class in PvE, you sir are truly a gentleman and scholar.

Secondly, Bhawb, you are the necromancer official representative, and I wanted to thank you for all of your hard work in getting information about the necromancer and the community out into the world!

Thirdly, NeXeD, my guildmate, my friend. Keep on doing what you’re doing. You’re honestly such an asset to [TB]‘s GvG team and I’m so glad that such a great necromancer will be there as I fade back into obscurity, although I’ll still try to do general raids with you guys when I can. I’ll never forget the sacred nights of incinerating edge pugs in our wells.

Also minor shoutouts to others such as Popolita, Muchacho, Lopez and Drarnor Kurnoram (spelling), as well as Zombify, Noscoc, and Xerreck. You all do our profession well.

So finally, I am glad to say goodbye to you all, and may you all show everyone how great necromancers can be in the hands of someone that is truly passionate about them.

(Although I might post on here occasionally when I’m bored out of my mind and don’t have GRE’s to study for).

I agree Mcbelch. The cheese has mutated into pancreatic cancer and we need moar chemoQQ noaaaoooow!

Hi all, due to my college induced insomnia, I have decided to right a post summarizing my frustrations with this game as I slowly break up with it while I study for the GRE and wait for SSB4 and pokemon ORAS (ironically far better e-sports than this crap is made by nintendo).

Anyway the big thing for me is that the suspense for the feature patch tired me out. 2 months ago near the end of July or whatever, we got the engi and ranger skill bar previews, and they recieved so many great buffs, reworks, and changes to underused or ineffective weapons/traits/skills/kits that I was genuinely excited to see what they’d do with the other classes I play (I’ve been playing mainly necro, ele, and ranger as of late). As the weeks went on I was glad for the adrenaline nerf, as one of my pet peeves of this game was how blatantly amazing warriors were in every part of this game compared to necromancer, the class I main. When the mesmer/ele changes came out, I noticed something was terribly amiss, I realized anet was buffing cancerous cheese to whole new levels, such condition mesmer, while doing nothing to make elementalists drop their daggers and water/arcane specs with celestial perfection. As a necromancer main, I’m honestly jealous of the buffs that mesmers got, because so many of them actually fix mesmer’s issues in WvW/GvGs.

When we saw the necromancer changes, it was the last kittening straw for me. The class that I main, the class that I made howler for, did not get any changes that would open up new playstyles, or give me any other reason to play necro in pvp without cheap fear spam and nightmare runes. In fact the one different, subpar but fun build in the form or zerker power necro was nerfed to the kittening ground. Sure people abused lich, but without it theres no reason to run that spec. And two dirt tier necro skills/traits: Unholy Sanctuary, and Signet of Vampirism are still utter garbage.

ANET, why does Unholy Sanctuary heal for a pathetic 1/3rd of a Warrior’s healing signet (and doesn’t even scale with healing power) when its not even active all the time? And do you devs even know that SoV’s passive will never be able to keep up with any reasonable damage source on hit except for maybe a cleric scepter ele spamming arc lightning? Why do you want us to play the cheesiest, most skilless, most AI spamming, most random rune proc dependent, most perma regen, most boonspam, most mightspam, most stealthspam, most condition spam builds? Are you afraid of driving away new players with actual fluid and complex gameplay?

Anyway, on top of that, the lack of meaningful new content is another huge factor. You aren’t working on new dungeons. You even kittened up the dungeon community even further by kitten the ranger frost spirit in the kitten , and lets be real… that 2-target necro cleave is a paltry rotting bandage excuse of a fix for necromancers in PvE. I could handle the FGS/all elite forms/all wall intagib skills being nerfed but whatever.

In addition, WvW is still static as hell, real GvGs don’t exist so I feel like I’m bringing my guild down if I don’t have full ascended/infusions, and spvp desperately needs new game modes and something other than CHEESE. BUCKETS AND BUCKETS OF NACHO CHEESE.

Anyway, it was a great summer of playing GW2 again, maybe even a little too much, and I’m honestly grateful for all my friends in this game, both in game and on the forums. I will proably come back again, when theres new stuff to do, if that ever happens, but right now, school, tap dancing, the GREs, and nintendo games are more meaningful to me than the cheesestorm that this game’s “balance” has turned into.

Sina.9208:

It looks like (maybe) not all is lost for serious pve rangering. With a point blank Longbow + Sword/A,H rotation the dmg seems to be so high, that even spotter alone could make us viable. Needs more testing.

longbow will NEVER be viable in high end pve unless you’re afk bearbow soloing belka.

manveruppd.7601:

Zerker is better in 99% of instances but I’m sure there’s a few niche builds that rely on on-crit effects for whom assassin’s would be at least an option, if not optimal.

I thought it could work with fresh air ele, but you really have enough procs witth zerker and the lower power on your air bursts does nothing good for you.

Of course it was overhyped. 90% of all rangers on these forums have an extreme festish for bows, and arrows, and archery, and feet. Those people were the one’s that overhyped this.

That being said, operating at 1500 range in spvp, with almost no defensive ability besides the GS or long CD utilities, while being outclassed for range DPS by Eles and Mesmers 1000 times over does your team very few favors. At least condition builds are able to actually be on a capture point, and even trap builds offer some form of support, even if its not that great.

To me this trait buff was designed for old, or blind people, as a way to survive battles with horrible reaction times. For those of us that can press F1 fast enough, its meaningless.

I HONESTLY do not understand why the amount of health restored from the trait can’t be equal to that of a warrior’s healing signet (1/3) or even an ele’s SoR procs (1/2). I mean DS isn’t even active all the time!!! WTF FREALZ.

/signed

Afya.5842:

nearlight.3064:

I’m so ready for pokemon ORAS and SSB4 for 3DS to come out so I can stop playing this steaming pile of stagnant kitten to get my competitve fix.

I just love all these hollow balance updates that promote cancerous cheese like AI builds and condition mesmers while ignoring ways to actually fix the worst class in the game (us) while providing only hollow new content like UI updates, boring living story, no new dungeons or wvw or pvp and even dumbing down the leveling process to vegetative state levels.

kitten it anet. You’ve successfully driven me away from GW2 from all of your hype that has now died. I want to take my legendary howler (my token of wasted time grinding) and blare my song of QQ in your ears until you go deaf!!!!!!1!!11!

Oh to add salt to your wound, howler’s night effect is gone.

Oh, no amount of antibiotics will save me from the wound this game has given me. Every day I keep playing the MRSA gets WORSE

The trap runes won’t be coming to pvp. So yay for all the condi tank wvw roamers out there, but I hate that and love traps in pvp. I guess krait or balth is still good if I don’t quit this game to my boredom and rage with it.

I’m so ready for pokemon ORAS and SSB4 for 3DS to come out so I can stop playing this steaming pile of stagnant kitten to get my competitve fix.

I just love all these hollow balance updates that promote cancerous cheese like AI builds and condition mesmers while ignoring ways to actually fix the worst class in the game (us) while providing only hollow new content like UI updates, boring living story, no new dungeons or wvw or pvp and even dumbing down the leveling process to vegetative state levels.

kitten it anet. You’ve successfully driven me away from GW2 from all of your hype that has now died. I want to take my legendary howler (my token of wasted time grinding) and blare my song of QQ in your ears until you go deaf!!!!!!1!!11!

With out the frost spirit working as it SHOULD, you might as well not even bother.

Oh yay anet, lets nerf the heal skill that no one in their right mind ever takes! Cuz that makes no sense. We might as well make SoV give the necromancer’s health to the enemy while we’re at it then!

This ball buster of a patch is one of the big reasons why I’m glad that the new SSB/pokemon games are coming out soon. I’m really thinking about quitting until my favorite class isn’t such a joke, or until there’s meaningul new content to play instead of this LS crap and UI updates.

I am not. Mainly because the ranger previews two months ago got me overhyped, that when we got to the necro changes, they were utterly dissapointing to me and I’m honestly thinking of quitting this game.p

Wanderer.3248:

nearlight.3064:

Blegh. All y’alls are haters! If every other MMO allows this and a trading post system why can’t we?

Because they don’t want you evading taxes. The end.

Yup. This is basically why I wanted this. I’m a really greedy kitten xD

Blegh. All y’alls are haters! If every other MMO allows this and a trading post system why can’t we?

Oh anet, lets nerf torment on other classes on their coolest and most balanced builds like the axe/sword LB or pure condi war, and turn mesmers into a purple torment spam win class. I’m actually more afraid of condition shatter builds now that PU abuse should be less tear inducing to fight against.

NeXeD.3042:

Won’t play on mobile for me but if that’s edge our guild has wiped the other blobs, trains or whatever with like 10 people. It’s really not hard.

I hated our edge stomping nights because there were never enough merchants to keep up with the random crap that dropped from the upleveled ranger zergs.

I’ve made a similar build to yours before. What I can say is that you absolutely need earth sigil and skirmishing 2 for this build to work. Swap out geomancy for it and you should be fine.

Also I felt like taking both empathatic bond and SotF was overkill on condition removal, so I ran 2/2/4/6/0 with muddy terrain or Signet of renewal over the hunt signet and the crappy healing spring over kitten unugent for moar cleanse.

My thoughts on the build were that it was basically the glassiest, least sustainable condition ranger class you could ever play, but also the burstiest it could ever be in terms of condition output. Basically you need evades to survive and to really nail your foe with a kitten splitblade with a sharpening stone w/fury to instantly put 10-15 bleeds on him, and when entangle has a low CD, it’ll be even stronger.

I may be wrong about the condition removal though so in that case take EB over keen edge and troll unugent instead. Anyway non-trop non-spirit builds are tough to make, and probably not viable at high ends at the moment, but I plan on testing out the possibilities in addition to settler/celestial builds later on.

I find spirits to be boring as well. But I find traps to be really fun and interesting to play! Especially with celestial or settler stats! Its just that the stuff that engineers can do really outclasses trap builds.

Spirits are basically a cheesy carry build from what my friends say.

Apparition.1576:

Yuiuo.8017:

Just make solo que have the same maps of team que

skyhammer doesn’t have a sense for the difference that can have a cc or an immobilize.

without stun breaker/condi removal:

immobilize on glasses = dead

random cc in the wrong position = dead

if you want to be an esport game i think the 1 cc into dead mechanic is not the best way to go

why do you continue to believe in this map?

We (all the pvp community) don’t understand!

1. Why would you walk in the breakable tiles rather than dodge/rolling over it?

2. Secondly, you speak for yourself. A lot of us actually enjoy the map and the uniqueness it brings over the standard bunker based gameplay you tend to see on just about every other map.

Yeah the bunker thing is a good argument . But playing builds that BUNKER a cannon, or just bunt people off the edge are even less skill and less fun than the traditional maps.

Skyhammer forces a lack of build diversity and a promotion of people using cheesy skilless builds to bunt people off of cliffs and hold the godkitten cannon!!!!

DESTROY IT

While I am grateful for this trading post UI update, I was disappointed that Anet STILL will not be implementing formal trading systems between players.

Right now we still have to take the huge risk of being scammed using the mail system, so myself and most other people only trade items with trusted friends and guildmates.

#FeatureUIPack2014 #NoNewMeaningfulContentUpdates #WaningInterestInPlayingGW2

The only classes with truly viable condition oriented builds for tpvp are necromancers, engineers, and rangers. But even for rangers and engis its generally better to go more hybrid (celestial) or more bunker/sustain (settlers for ranger but not engi). However there is concern as to whether those specs even are truly viable, as even though ToL had a fair amount of condition necromancers, they still had notable shortcomings that could only be mitigated through having really awesome teammates.

dancingmonkey.4902:

I disagree. Personally, I feel if we are permitted to heal in DS, that the base health of DS needs to be lowered.

I was just thinking this too!

+1

It could be like poison but w/o the DOT effect.

Raven.9603:

jcbroe.4329:

Those are my current thoughts on it anyways. I wouldn’t even place Carrion/Rabid in the running though as long as Celestial exists. Options for PvP are basically Zerkers/Soldiers/Celestial/Settlers as far as I can tell for rangers.

Carrion is a very strong amulet for trappers who are getting toughness and precision (+fury) from traits already. Rabid is a very strong amulet for any condition build that doesn’t invest significantly in skirmishing.

nearlight.3064:

@raven, I honestly haven’t used the shortbow much over axe/dagger. To me it seems only good for focusing bleeds on a target from the sidelines in a team fight. I think axe/dagger w/sword torch pulls ahead for 1v1s and settler builds in general because it has greater benefits to being on or near a point instead of the sidelines. Plus the might will let you match the match the condition damage level of carrion w/krait/balth runes on a trap or spirit set up. Right not I’m using a streamer’s settler trap/regen build and its great, for having nearly the sustain of a bunker but the condition pressure and “team support” of a trap build.

The beauty of shortbow is that you can be on the sidelines but you dont have to be.

If you are in a fight as a mainhand axe ranger, you have to be in melee every 6sec in order to shotgun your spitblade. Failure to shotgun spitblade means you are only applying on crit bleeds on a 1second attack rate (only .5 sec in the lucky cases where you have exactly 2 targets, and even then that can be bad because your sigils have a good chance to proc on the wrong target).

The shortbow can be in melee, it can be at range, its equally effective at either distance, and if for some reason you cant flank your target you are still firing every .5sec getting tons of bleed on crit procs.

As far as axe might, i doubt its going to be a game changer. axe rangers are getting all excited for it, but a 3 sec base duration of might on a 1sec cast time auto attack is terrible for any single target situation, and all those stacks will wear off completely within less than 6 seconds with even the booniest-durationest build possible.

the strength of axe is in winter’s bite and customizing offhand abilities for your build.

Yeah I can agree with that, which is why I think axe/dagger is better for more bunkery builds. I need to try out the shortbow more, but I keep getting into the mindset that its a sucky and boring weapon tbh.

Honestly, anet should just let us leave the match with no effect on our overall ranking in the case of a 4v5.

Its an utter JOKE to allow RATED matches to fall victum to such BULLkitten for the people who actually care about improving their ranking..

@jcbro, yeah thats basically why I’ve been running traps, to have more AoE condition pressure for both bunkering and team fights. I know I’m doing it wrong, but I basically just use my pet as a meat shiled to take conditions and the occasional CC.

@raven, I honestly haven’t used the shortbow much over axe/dagger. To me it seems only good for focusing bleeds on a target from the sidelines in a team fight. I think axe/dagger w/sword torch pulls ahead for 1v1s and settler builds in general because it has greater benefits to being on or near a point instead of the sidelines. Plus the might will let you match the match the condition damage level of carrion w/krait/balth runes on a trap or spirit set up. Right not I’m using a streamer’s settler trap/regen build and its great, for having nearly the sustain of a bunker but the condition pressure and “team support” of a trap build.

Raven.9603:

GOSU.9574:

Raven.9603:

• QZ is still going to be a 50% damage buff after the patch hits, which makes it stronger for sustained burst like rapid fire or autos than signet of the wild.

How does one reach “sustained” using a utility that has a short duration and a fairly long CD (for a non elite utility)?

Bow users will use anything to try and eek out some dps.

not “sustained.” “sustained burst.” i gave the example of what i meant by sustained burst in the description you quoted: something that applies across rapid fire or auto attacks.

sustained burst as in “high damage burst for a short duration” (found in skills like SotW, QZ) works for rapid fire or sword auto attack sustained burst, as opposed to a single hit like SotH or omen of clarity, which is generally only valuable for maul or a max range LB auto.

I think after the patch, everyone will run power rangers for a week before realizing how they’ll still be lackluster in the conquest game mode compared to any condition or hybrid build. And thats mostly due to being outclassed by eles and mesmers for ranged “burt” or general ranged DPS.

jcbroe.4329:

I honestly think Celestial is just the way to go right now, especially compared to other amulets.

Like, evaluating it versus Carrion and Rabid, you lose some condition damage and about 100 stats off of the secondary amulet stats with Celestial, but end up with an overall more offensive build with the right setup due to having every stat you need on the build, and easily more tanky builds with having all of the defensive stats on the same build and the beneficial relationship of healing power/toughness/vitality and how they affect each other.

You honestly don’t even need might stacking right now. You can just run Celestial with Runes of the Pirate (like the meta staff ele build) with a Shortbow and Sword/Dagger and you’re set.

I left out comparing it against Settlers because Settler’s ACTUALLY has a slight advantage in one area over celestial, and that’s bunkering. However, people in general would argue that by the time you go that route in PvP, you may as well take a different profession. Though I don’t personally agree and believe that, and especially after the update, Settler’s bunker support tanks (if running spirits) are going to be pretty great at sidepoint assault and self/teamfight support.

All of the celestial talk assumes a hybrid build though (running Shortbow and Sword/Dagger).

After the patch, Longbow/Greatsword will ACTUALLY be an option, though I don’t think people see it because they are thinking of playing it differently role wise than how it will actually perform.

longbow/GS builds are meh to me.

Anyway, I like settlers with undead runes because with might from axe it should be equalish in condition DPS to carrion with krait/balth runes. I like it becuase, even now, its damage isn’t much lower than the condi amulets and it has so much more sustain, except against conditions. I think celestial will be good as long as it doesn’t get nerfed somehow.

Eggyokeo.9705:

infantrydivEU.9670:

I think we might start seeing a build like : 20606 celestial signet beastmastery a/t s/d pop up in solo queue as a homepoint defender or attacking far point. This build would have extremely high survivability due to signet of stone & renewal, as well as the passive regen from

Shortbow doesn’t have enough damage to be able to deal with elementalist/warrior sustain currently

I think when using axe and a pet spec, that picking up NM’s Fortifying bond will be the key. while we may only be getting 3s of might on hit our pet will be getting 10s of might on hit and we will be able to stack might on our pets in to the realms of ridiculousness. The options I’m considering are 0/0/6/3/5, 0/4/0/6/4, 0/2/6/6/0, you get the pitcure. what I’m realy look foreword to trying is something like this

and to address the OP I’m a big fan of celestial builds for YOLOq I almost always use Celestial over the condi amulets and i only use Settlers in tPvP when I’m playing home point bunker.

Why celestial over carrion or rabid?

I’m also greatly interested in making a trap build, but theres no way I could take empathatic bond, trapper’s potency, and fortifying bond all in the same build. I could make due with healing spring and SotF for removal, but I’d only have enough room for lighting reflexes and entangle in such a build, plus no offhand training… so I guess I’m stuck playing BM, regen, or spirits.

Torch is absolutely fine on ranger. I run axe/dagger and sword/torch on most condition builds that deal mpre with regen than shortbow spamming. It gets a lot of mileage out of Balthazar runes and offhand training. Axe is a viable mainhand condition and hybrid weapon, as splitblade is such a strong condition burst skill, but it works fine with sword, another hybrid weapon as well. It’s strongest on regen bunker based builds.

The main issue is that most condition ranger builds prefer offhand dagger for the extra evade, and it synergies well with shortbow and sword om spirit and trap builds.

For mesmer they just need to improve the aiming of the 5 skills projectile, other than that it’s the Mesmer’s strongest offhand.

witcher.3197:

@ nearlight – maybe it’s a strong roamer, but problem is, the guy who uploaded the build overtagged it for no reason – which means he made this build to be used in PvP, Zerg, roaming, Dungeons and general PvE – which obviously means it got negative ratings from the sections it does not belong to.

Then are you just able to change the tags on that build so it only exists in the WvW roaming category, instead of zerging, dungeons, pvp, where its obviously suboptimal?

I understand that that is the reason why its trashed, but I think you guys should as a rule of oversight clean up things like that and place builds for their most viable category, and not throw them away for things like being overplaced. If you want I can even join this site and recommend that there.

Pride.1734:

Just wondering…. will axe actually be viable in PvP or PvE after the changes or will it still be crap?

It will still be crap for power necros in pvp unless as an alternate to staff (which is bad because you’d need axe training over chill of death).

For PvE, dagger will be better because of the cleave and higher damage with buffs in a 6/6/0/0/2 setup, but pug-friendly DS builds may use it as a pug tactic for the lifeblast damage modifier, but only use it for the slightly better 2 skill and lifeblasts.

I play ele, necro, and ranger in pvp right now (and formerly mesmer, may play it again after the patch) And I can honestly say that ele is a top notch class for pvp right now. D/D to me is a tad too easy and faceroll, but very effective. If played right you’ll rarely die. I like Zoose’s S/F build a lot. Its a fun burst build that carries in team fights.

The other night I was playing carrion terrormancer with a team on my guild and while I did fine with it, I couldn’t have any chance to get away if I got focused. I switched to my ele, and all those problems disapeared since with S/F, you can kill most classes before they can kill you. I even FGSed a thief in one shot when using the 4 skill on the treb in khylo, which was a funny moment that will never happen again for that skills nerf :/

I play condition ranger a lot too, and its a bit more forgiving than necro due to perma protect and evadespam, but the teamfight pressure isn’t there as much.

I personally get my pvp fix from spvp simply as a matter of convenience.

Roaming personally isn’t for me. I don’t like the idea of being unable to quickly find an opponent for a while, or running into zergs, as well as difficulty associated in acquiring gear/consumables and being able to make the “best” possible gear set up as possible. The customization I personally find stressful. Having the amulets in pvp is simpler, and does have some pretty big drawbacks like zerker having no toughness, knights doing crap damage, celestial being OP on half the classes.. things like that.

But that being said, I have the utmost respect for roamers, especually those like Lightningblaze that play cool specs like fresh air ele, or others that play things like regen ranger or power necro. And lets be honest, those youtube montages are absolutely a blast to watch compared to watching a pvp match! And the conquest game mode gets pretty meh real fast.

On the plus side, unholy santuary will be the best buff for you if you lack mechanical skill due to athritis, myopic blindness, and dimentia!

Yelloweyedemon.2860:

nearlight.3064:

Yelloweyedemon.2860:

Atherakhia.4086:

Yelloweyedemon.2860:

Chicago Jack.5647:

I’m super psyched over the power ranger changes, but let’s face it. It’s not going to compete with the thief.

nearlight.3064:

Power ranger will not be viable after this patch for several reasons.

Traits for max LB damage, RtW. —> RaO,activate signet of hunt, signet of wild, quick. zeph. From max range.

I’m gonna laugh if I read “ranger sucks QQ” after this patch.

Oh and yeah, power thieves will stand a chance with 6s sic ’em…

There is so very much more wrong with the class than its ability to kill people. I fully expect to see ‘rangers suck’ to continue after the patch. We’ll know when things improve because commanders will ask the Rangers to do something. I don’t care if it’s 1 or 2 things like Mesmers. Something isn’t asking too much.

What has that to do with power build rangers? Hell what has that to do with anything. Rangers are usefull where they need to be. We have our roles in both spvp and pve. We have our builds for small group/roaming.
WvW zergs do not require any skill. You could let your cat walk on the keyboard and none will even notice. If you have more numbers, your zergtrain wins and that’s all about it.

GvGs require skill, and right now rangers are almost never taken over an additional theif, memser, warrior, or even ele on gank squads, because in that environment, longbow rangers are a one trick pony. They might be able to instagib an out of place necro or staff ele once, but if they’re fighting a team who’s gank force has a modicum of intelligence, they’d adapt the next round, focus the ranger, and dispatch him before he can do anything.

Its not as bad for them in pvp to be sure, but against a team that has a decent player filling their roaming DPS role (ie thief, mesmer, fresh air ele or condition necro) the ranger won’t be able to do anything for various reasons that should be obvious. And in pvp, a ranger will be ineffective because the ranger “Restrictions” make it more difficut for them to hold or contest a point properly. Mesmers have that issue as well like you’ve noticed, but its not nearly as bad because they have shatter burst which is arguably more effective at close range, making assualting points easier for them. Plus they have team support stuff like portals blah blha blahhah

And @pyrisin that sounds like a really balanced build. Do you have videos of it in action? (for pvp I mean) just because whenever I see longbow rangers in solo Q (the most common ranger build I see) they tend to be horrible players who will camp longbow even when I get into melee… so they probably aren’t built “properly”. I just have never had a longbow ranger ever give me a run for my money.

How often proper GvG’s happen? …
Even so, a spirit ranger could still be very effective depending on the numbers.

About sPvP, spirit rangers are top.

Proper GvGs happen frequently in my tier of WvW.

Spirit ranger might be effective in 5v5 GvGs, but those aren’t really that frequent or popu;at compared to 10v10s, 15v15s, and 20v20s. A spirit ranger would be completely useless there, in part because condition damage is negligable in these sorts of set ups, unless you have 7 necros and engis epidemicing everyone (which isn’t a good comp). All the support a ranger can offer can be provided by other classes, leaving long range gank as their one niche, but like I said, thats a one trick pony.

Slalom.3174:

Nice commentary/ideas. Thank you.
I have a Carrion set waiting, but haven’t yet seen a real benefit with Celestial armor.
Maybe post-update? …Maybe?

Yeah, I’m thinking more in terms of pvp amulet stats, in which celestial is a lot better these via relativity.

Whats the best pvp amulet for condition (or hybrid/condition) rangers for the coming meta with the feature patch in your opinons? This applies to spirit, traps, and more niche survival/signet set ups

These are my experiences:

Carrion: streamers tend to like this one on traps/spirits as it helps against conditions and many of our weapons are hybridized.

Rabid: lower physical DPS is made up for greater bleed application from crit procs. It seems more viable on rangers than condition classes with slower attacks, because things like shortbow autoattacks are quick, and skills like poison volley, and splitblade hit 5 times at point black range, maximizing the amount of extra bleeds you can theoretically get in a single instance. When using it, troll unugent felt like a better heal, but my overall sustain felt worse because I was more vulnerable to burst and conditions. EB can only help so much.

Celestial: Currently the lack of might makes this a lower damage option as most of our weapons don’t have a strong power coefficient besides sword autos.

Settler: I wouldn’t use this with traps at all, only spirits and more regen focused builds (natures voice guard spam). It makes us tanky beyond belief, but it take a lot longer to kill anything than the other amulets.

Runes: These are some of the runes I think are the best for condition rangers

Balthazar runes: Usually seems to be taken with carrion on spirit or trap builds to maxmize burn damage and output

Krait runes: I think these are best on rabid trap builds with entangle for the cover condition condi bomb, and to maximize your mileage from the fast bleed stacks you can put out with a proper rotation.

Undead: near mandatory on settlers so they can have a decent level of condi damage.

Weapon combinations.

Shortbow. Its a boring weapon, but I think its okay for what it does, which is basically pew pewing enemies while flanking in team fights to overload them with bleeds. The volley is good too, and the other skills are a bit more situational, but have their uses.

Axe/dagger. MH axe is Lacklustre right now, but might with the auto, will be very good on builds that go into nature magic due to the boon duration and fortifying bond to make pets more useful. Splitblade at point blank range can be incorporated with condition “burst” roations so to speak with either shortbow or s/torch, and using all the cooldowns on this weapon set can overwhelm enemies quite quickly.

Sword/dagger/torch, the autoattack is only marginally useful on carrion/celestial but could stack bleeds on rabid. I mainly like this weapon as a defensive choice on condition builds for the evades, and the cool things I can do using the torch skills!

So what do you guys think will be the best type of condition build set up for the future meta after the patch?

Prysin.8542:

@nearlight
I can do a stream sometimes during the upcoming weekend. Most likely at sunday or friday night (night in EU)

Also, LB in melee range is fine IF YOU CAN USE IT. Meaning, control the enemy and be fluent with it, not just pewpewpew AA till you get rekt

Yeah exactly! And I’m sorry if I seem like a bow hating kitten. I am biased towards condition builds though, so honestly I should stop even posting about it. Night at EU is pretty hard for me to be awake during, but if you put highlights on your channel I’d love to check them out.

witcher.3197:

Off-hand sword fits soldier amulet too. It allows you to use the Dual-Wielding trait on the Strength line, and a full Impale still does 4463 dmg to moving targets on Soldier which is not bad at all. Not to mention off-hand Sword provides 2 and 1/4 sec block on 15 sec CD while shield gives a 3 sec block on a 30 sec CD.

But this build has many situational things, not to mention player preference (dogged march or sure-footed, warrior’s sprint vs signet mastery, hoelbrak vs pack vs str runes, etc). We can’t please everyone at the same time, that’s why we have the “Variants” sections.

About the voting, double ranged shatter isn’t the easiest spec ever, still had a 5.0 rating. I’d say it’s just that for most people killshot’s not worth the effort you have to put into it just to even make it acceptable.

Its none of my business, but considering Olrun did GREAT in the first ToL with it due to his skill, I think you really should display it as an okay option somehow on the website.

And in our ingame conversation you said that power ranger might be viable after the patch. Which I and most non-ranger mains think is blatantly wrong. So I’m just adding that to this argument, because I think that the status of some of the builds is a bit vulnerable to bias by people who run this sight.

Also I just checked your trashed builds section and I’m puzzled why the regen tank ranger build is placed there, when its arguably the ranger’s strongest WvW roaming and dueling spec.

Also like I said before, please change the axe/focus from the standard power necro build to dagger/dagger and put axe/focus/warhorn in the other options section! True it won’t be viable after the patch to the lich form nerf, but I think it should at least have the correct best build according to people that actually play power necro at high levels (like Xerrex in the EU ToL).

Yelloweyedemon.2860:

Atherakhia.4086:

Yelloweyedemon.2860:

Chicago Jack.5647:

I’m super psyched over the power ranger changes, but let’s face it. It’s not going to compete with the thief.

nearlight.3064:

Power ranger will not be viable after this patch for several reasons.

Traits for max LB damage, RtW. —> RaO,activate signet of hunt, signet of wild, quick. zeph. From max range.

I’m gonna laugh if I read “ranger sucks QQ” after this patch.

Oh and yeah, power thieves will stand a chance with 6s sic ’em…

There is so very much more wrong with the class than its ability to kill people. I fully expect to see ‘rangers suck’ to continue after the patch. We’ll know when things improve because commanders will ask the Rangers to do something. I don’t care if it’s 1 or 2 things like Mesmers. Something isn’t asking too much.

What has that to do with power build rangers? Hell what has that to do with anything. Rangers are usefull where they need to be. We have our roles in both spvp and pve. We have our builds for small group/roaming.
WvW zergs do not require any skill. You could let your cat walk on the keyboard and none will even notice. If you have more numbers, your zergtrain wins and that’s all about it.

GvGs require skill, and right now rangers are almost never taken over an additional theif, memser, warrior, or even ele on gank squads, because in that environment, longbow rangers are a one trick pony. They might be able to instagib an out of place necro or staff ele once, but if they’re fighting a team who’s gank force has a modicum of intelligence, they’d adapt the next round, focus the ranger, and dispatch him before he can do anything.

Its not as bad for them in pvp to be sure, but against a team that has a decent player filling their roaming DPS role (ie thief, mesmer, fresh air ele or condition necro) the ranger won’t be able to do anything for various reasons that should be obvious. And in pvp, a ranger will be ineffective because the ranger “Restrictions” make it more difficut for them to hold or contest a point properly. Mesmers have that issue as well like you’ve noticed, but its not nearly as bad because they have shatter burst which is arguably more effective at close range, making assualting points easier for them. Plus they have team support stuff like portals blah blha blahhah

And @pyrisin that sounds like a really balanced build. Do you have videos of it in action? (for pvp I mean) just because whenever I see longbow rangers in solo Q (the most common ranger build I see) they tend to be horrible players who will camp longbow even when I get into melee… so they probably aren’t built “properly”. I just have never had a longbow ranger ever give me a run for my money.

Prysin.8542:

warriorjrd.8695:

Prysin.8542:

nearlight.3064:

Prysin.8542:

In terms of ranged single target DPS the “leaderboard” has since before december last year been;
LB Ranger
GS Mesmer
LB Warrior
SB Thief
tha rest

Ranger IS the best ranged damage dealer. The most reliable and tanky? that is another discussion entirely.

Zerker Staff Ele says Hullo?

read – single target Ranged DPS

If looking at AOE or cleave (pierce/splash) – ele is vastly superior in every way.

Even if we discredit AOE skills (idk why) to find single target dps, zerk staff ele would be near the top of that list. And then there is scepter fresh air ele xD That at least has the burst to be higher than LB ranger (even after the patch) and DPS to be second if not first on that list probably.

the thing about SF fresh air is this;
If you have stability, 70% of the rotation for SF will be worthless. Because your CC will not work, thus its nigh impossible to land any skills unless the enemy is AFK

Dragon’s tooth is more for area denial on points and telling people not to rez downed allies, and is not “70%” of the rotation. Phoenix is very easy to land if you can predict where the enemy is going. The air bursts in between comet, hurl, and arcane blasts never miss unless the target dodges, and those account for the “70%” of the rotation you were talking about.

Otaking.4675:

nearlight.3064:

Power ranger will not be viable after this patch for several reasons.

Firstly the amount of conditions we are going to see, from rangers, engineers, mesmers, and celestial ele will be greater than before and not bringing condition removal will literally make you a free kill to those classes that can out sustain you while spiking you with conditions. The damage of a power ranger isn’t anywhere near enough to beat these classes before they can kill you, unlike the burst of an ele or a thief.

Celestial with axe/dagger or carrion with either SB or axe will be the new meta for sure. There are many variants of condi ranger and most have adequate condition removal. Spirits on celestial with better might stacking will allow for greater team support options and using entangle with krait runes on more survival or trap oriented builds (carrion probably) will be extremely strong as you will probably be able to entangle every fight, and krait runes will be a huge AoE condition bomb. I also view celestial builds without spirits that focus more on regen and survival skills to be extremely viable as well.

In the coming meta I wager we’ll see fewer thieves and fewer warriors, but more engis, eles, rangers, mesmers, and necros (necros because they counter the new cheese options so well and will be better with less warriors around). But we’ll have to see what happens.

I heard necro is getting improved passive heal trait while in shroud along with the ability to res and stomp in shroud. That’s huge for them and they will be a popular home bunker. They’re one of the classes rangers can reliably kill also so it got a little bit harder for rangers there for instance.

My ranger build has plenty of anti-condi but torment on auto attack will cause it to be shelved. Already I’m not too keen on wvw due to perplexity runes. I think the new meta is going to be a lot like this meta with the addition of necro. Ranger & engi won’t be in it. Mesmer might be. It will still be war and ele at the core.

I really hate torment in the first place because kiting is a hard enough strategy to employ in PVP that you didn’t need something specifically anti kite and passive effort damage in a game already full of it. I feel like it was designed by a bad who raged at getting kited and it invalidates a lot of formerly legitimate playstyle out there while keeping the power in the hands of the bunkerish, evades and stealth.

The SoV buff to necro was a kittening joke, as its still the most pathetic heal in the game, and the unholy sanctuary “buff” is for old or blind people who can’t press f1 in time. They will not be effective bunkers in real pvp, but maybe decent for lower solo Q on minion builds.

The meta for necros will still be some form of terror set up.

Anyway @Prysin, while I respect your opinion and authority on ranger greatly, I personally don’t think they will be truly viable in higher level pvp, for many reasons, including relative lack of condition clear, as well as the inefficiency of using such a long range weapon in a game where fighting on or near a point wins matches. Do you have room in longbow builds to take empathic bond or SotF?

I’m sure it can work well with proper team support, similarly to how power necros can in theory, but I still don’t think it will truly be “the” definitive ranger build to win games at higher levels. We’ll have to see what the patch brings, but I don’t think any of the builds I run like condition ranger/ele or burst ele will have too much to fear.

I personally never viewed rangers as a counter to condition necromancers that are competent. Conditon specs can’t touch a necro 1v1, and nightmare rune procs and reaper’s protection mitigates a lot of the “burst” from the longbow.

Yeah thats true. I’m glad this was merged though, so that when/if the devs do read it for feedback, it will be in one convenient yet cluttered place, and no thread is lost in the dust.

I’m fine with not having a response, I just hope they’d consider some of the feedback posted here, such as my giant rant on page 2

I just recieved 3 infractions for various posts defending this class from people that don’t main it and say that subpar traits and our sustain is fine! Oh well, I guess its a good thing that this is merged so if the devs are able to look at this, they can gather appropriate feedback.

BrunoBRS.5178:

Bryzy.2719:

Anyone saying the Ranger “won” the balance changes couldn’t be more wrong.

Most of the changes to Rangers have been needed since day one. They should always have been an integral part of the profession. As a result, Rangers have been considered the worst whole-game profession. This isn’t a “buff” for Rangers in the sense that it’s giving them an an advantage, because it’s not. It’s an update to help bring-up-to-par the Ranger profession, and even then it doesn’t address the profession’s core problem mechanic. After this update Rangers might be on a more level playing field in the realm of power builds, however until the pet mechanic is seriously dealt with I doubt we’ll see much of a change.

buffs aren’t about giving advantages, buffs are about bringing underused playstyles into the meta.

ranger got a TON of positive changes that should open up just as many new playstyles. the fact they’re not suddenly OP is a mark of a good buff, not a bad one.

so they won.

I agree with this. Longbow builds will be better, but not really pvp viable in tourneys imo. Axe could be, but likely it’ll just be shortbow spirit 1111111.

Necros on the other hand got no new builds significantly improved or opened up.