Guild Wars 2

To say that uplevelled warriors were deliberately brought in it complete rubbish, with full que it is not viable to alt switch even if they wanted to. What you saw were people playing wvw in midtier, not upper tier ‘omg everyone must be level 80 in pvt gear’.

CharlieBear.2741:

where are all the solo-roamers hanging? i only seem to find a stun warrior once in a while, which my power necro can’t handle due to lack of stun breakers

At bloodlust buffs or camps if we hold buff and non contested, before primetime (8pm Uk). Then also at buffs but preferably in EB from 10pm-midnight UK time. Best buff point for a fight usually Temple, obviously.

Power necro is interesting fight for my build, always up for fighting one.

Decent roaming in this matchup now we’re clear of reset. Such a nice change from Piken/Abaddon and on par with Kodash/AG for fun.

[Lion] doesn’t really exist as a guild any more, and it was usually a troll one. Just gank them back

Well after playing this build solidly in wvw over last few days I have to bump it again. I’ve played a lot of good builds – PU condition builds, confusion bombs, shatters and especially those by Senostix, however purely for WvW roaming this is simply the strongest I’ve come across.

Condition removal on the surface can be a problem, but with so many stealths and ranged damage, as long as you keep distance against necros / condi classes, you just don’t let people stack enough conditions on you before taking them out.

Tanks with a lot of boons were a problem for me, can eventually wear them out though and I did have a couple of soldier’s accessories I could have swapped out for berserkers. Also could have stacked might better before adding burst with blurred frenzy.

Big thumbs up for creating a great build and sharing it.

Itchy.6340:

thx abbadon <3

OCD bag organiser.

Very nice build Doiid, going to give this a bump.

milton.1796:

“Get farmed as usual”

In your fantasy world we didn’t get to rank3 by being farmed.

When did you bandwagon on to Piken? Before last week Piken lost 5 matchups in a row.

Gunnars already faced Riverside and Piken in a matchup when we were #20. Piken has much more offpeak now, which we all know leads to massive score imbalance, but nowhere near the quality of guilds they had back then (VII etc). Riverside has always been much stronger than Abaddons and were in full arrowcart mode all week. Compared to that, this matchup is a lot less challenging for Gunnars.

Yeah but take away veil as the OP suggests, and none of these abilities are reason to take a mesmer into organised gvg. They’re what you use after veil and inbetween timewarp to try and add some use, but still well short of what other classes can bring.

I’ve yet to see a single class vs single class GvG, would be entertaining though

It is OP at surviving in smallscale, but I do think it is mitigated by good players on certain strong classes who kite well and avoid unnecessary clone deaths and confusion damage. Doesn’t mean they get to kill me, but they can turn it into a stalemate of endless chasing.

It’s a nice beginner build, but imo much better builds out there for mesmer to win fights decisively.

Melee train is totally dominant, so you take mesmer to support melee train – veil essential, timewarp if placed well is useful and to lesser extent nullfield for additional stripping and even feedback (if trait blind on glamour to try to disrupt enemy melee burst).

1 mesmer is enough, although some take 2 (in 20 vs 20) for extra veil to try and gain advantage in intial duking.

No point at all in 3rd/4th mesmer, don’t need any more veils and other classes i.e. necro, ele bring more to large heavy melee group fight.

Where are you moving from btw?

Website is here: http://www.gunnars-hold.eu/index.php

Great builds and videos Sensotix, really nice work

Is that the one who was /sit spamming for ages?

Great vids guys. Very neat arrangement of golems and a disciplined march

Nothing wrong with building siege when outnumbered, would be crazy not to.

Running big zerg at 7am to 8am is pretty nuts, Millers do the same thing.

Silent Shino.7239:

I must remember to ask at least once a week
is FURY going to come back to AG?

You can join them on Gunnars, but only if you play mornings.

Try Sensotix Bountiful Interruption TPVP build (works in WvW) or Osicat’s Shattercat Heavy. These are more powerbased, might stacking and burst but also decent survivability.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Build-Bountiful-Interruption-TPvP/first

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Guide-WvWvW-Pve-Shatter-Cat-Updated-16-8/first

There’s a lot of small groups on Gunnars, especially after 10pm. Problem yesterday was lack of enemies to keep our big groups occupied. Also reset and parts of weekend in general is zergy from midtier upwards.

Yeah the current group meta is harsh for us. Glamour utilities and timewarp still situationally useful, but everything else is kitten in GvG or Zerg fights and being utilitybot gets boring.

Gandara would be perfect for Gunnars, fresh opponent, nice attitudes and guilds. I would settle though for a return to matchups with two competitive servers, 1 v 1s like the last two weeks are too punishing on the losing server.

lordkrall.7241:

Indeed, by nightcapping (right before a long downtime) and golem rushing.
Is that really a fun way to win?

Mos Matchup shows Gunnars scoring most on primetime, only time Underworld scored big points was Saturday before primetime and 3am on Monday morning.

As for the guy who is anti-gvg, just because a guild is big doesn’t mean it will have better players. In fact more likely to be weaker in even fight as they won’t be used to fighting tight and together. Also GvG and roaming is not just about winning, every fight teaches you something, about class composition, about communication and about fighting as a tight group. These are all vital components of competitive pvp, if you don’t see them as valuable than that explains a lot as to why Underworld struggles so much. If you can only win with a big zerg on public commander, you deserve to lose against those who play more organised.

I have no problem with people using golems as golem rushes are a lot more fun than trebbing, more importantly saves a heck of a lot more time as well. The only fun in this game is lag-free fights, sieging is a means to provoking fights and should not be what you have to spend most of your time doing. Nothing more boring than standing around while someone trebs and the enemies just sit inside building as many arrowcarts and ballistas as they can.

Agree with Osicat, issue is with the current garbage meta and conquest design.

As for the guy saying you can just pick up another class – not if you are playing at a reasonably competitive level, not by a long shot. Also rerolling is a sign of imbalance and certainly not a solution.

Yeah running with guild against big groups you definitely want to be tanky as possible (soldiers was best, although you can go some rabid if condition) and use GS and sword/focus. I also had most success running with guild against zergs / other big guilds using melandru and matching food on top of this.

In terms of build there were mandatory utilities and then traits were all much of a muchness for me tbh, the key is don’t die, and then try to be as useful as possible while doing that. Seeing as glamour utilities (veil, nullfield) were mandatory for me, and I assume are for you, the old glamour/confusion raid build is still probably the best for fights of 20+, especially if you want loot as well. Then it was a choice of feedback or blink for 3rd slot, elite being TimeWarp.

At times I did run a variant of shatter with points in inspiration for the glamour traits which worked ok (relying on shatter on self and phantasms as obv clones die fast vs groups and mainly for clutch distortions and a bit of wrack). Daze/immobilise and taking staff for chaos storm was another one I tried that stands out, given how important mobility is, but found it pretty limited due to constant stability and enemy movement, may be worth a try for you though especially if you mainly fight pugs.

The primetime fights have been very good. I feel sorry for Arborstone getting zerged to death though :p

Now that we’re getting passed the weekend should be much more even points-wise as well.

I like how these Mya/TUP posters forget that Gunnars is Tier 7 and has a lot less population. Let me just pull some 30 man guilds out of thin air for you crybabies to fight Also good that the one time we actually run a big zerg it has both servers in tears – when this is how your servers have been playing against us since reset. Not so nice to be on the receiving end for a change, eh?

Special shout out to the likes of Pony and Army who took on a much bigger number several times and don’t feel the need to cry on forums when they wipe. Will be much better fights for you rest of the week, this was just a one-off event. /salute

Cheeky to see AG players complain about blobs, even this weekend with their high numbers Millers still playing much more in separate groups than AG usually does. Maybe they should call it a ‘community weekend’ then it will be ok.

The skill lag from Millers and AG blobs is disappointing. Such a bad way to ‘play’ the game.

If you’re running glass cannon or even just partial glass you should feel squishy, especially in wvw. Have to say running proper soldier’s/knights, dodging properly and using distortion at right time I am more durable than any class bar the heavy’s, and even then I have escape and avoidance skills they lack.

Jumping on solo players and running away from similar sized groups isn’t roaming tbh.

conditions and condition builds are far from underpowered in wvw.

INC has made a positive impression, nice to have a strong guild join the matchup as it was looking a bit depressing on reset. Still not balanced but nothing we can do about that when random matchup means if you lose rating you can end up in the pit of oblivion that is tier 9.

Nice fights everyone. Dzag is always good opponent and Arborstone really good at taking keeps in enemy BL and holding them for a long time – Gunnars Hills yesterday, Dzag Bay today.

Was a lot of Millers in Gunnars BL this evening, huge group at cliffside for ages. Then good battles all over the map once that got dispersed.

By the sounds of Anet last blogpost they are going to do something about nightcapping, which is long overdue. WvW should be about beating players to take keeps, not doors.

In the meantime if servers like Surmia want to carry on relying on it, then you only set yourself up to suffer on weekends and at primetime and have no grounds to complain when that happens.

It is amusing to see so many Tarnished Coast people upset – seeing as some of the biggest advocates of the random system came from your server and were shouting any criticism down with how awesome it was going to be.

I think it’s great anet are going to keep going for a couple more weeks, as then everyone will experience just how bad and unbalanced a system this is.

Conquest mode is pretty awful for actual fighting. At some point ANET will admit defeat and implement proper gvg. May have to wait for expansion or new mmo first tho.

DevonCarver.5370:

One up and one down solves some problems but creates a bunch more. Including that it invalidates ratings entirely. It no longer takes into account quality of victory but simply uses the fact of victory to move a server out of the matchup they were previously in.

Here’s the thing Devon – Ratings are rubbish and will never be fully accurate. Besides what is more important, fun for players or you having an accurate system? Right now you are shafting the former to try and create the latter.

There is no peace in WvW, unless you’re at a dance party

spanky.4630:

we need one up one down . why is this so hard to understand ?

Yeah I’ve no idea why they are so slow to understand this, but bear in mind they just don’t have this promotion/relegation in American. They don’t understand it.

They seem obsessed with thinking it’s bad because it puts tier 1 against tier 3, but don’t understand it’s worst tier 1 and the best tier 3, which is competitive. Also every other server is matched well. We can see this in fact from the random matchups, they only go to heck when it’s a bigger discrepency in ranks.

Reset doesn’t show much of anything in an overall match, always get weird scores then. Let’s see how it looks in a few days.

ROS only lost last week because they didn’t have Nymeria manning the cannons in all keeps. If he gets on cannons this week look out, whole blobs will die in one shot.

Skill lag is why lower tiers are more fun.

Dayra.7405:

@Roo Stercogburn: Looks like you did not understood the new system.
So far Gunnars hold is the match winner with +56 rating points, Riverside is second with +23 points and Piken the looser of the match with -72pts.

Rating is what you are fighting for! Rating is the thing that remains with your server when the match is over. GH currently fights over expectation, and that’s why you win most.

And this is nice in the new system! It has different challenges for you. It can be either
- Defend your rating by dominating a weaker server (Piken fails to do so currently)
- win through in an even match (Riverside does this vs Piken)
- Resist the domination of a stronger server (GH’s does this well at moment)

In fact you can have every mixture of the above as you have 3 sides in the match.

We play the game for one reason mate and that is fun, not rating points. You may get fun from rating points but most of us don’t give a kitten about anything other than a good even fight. Under old system and with something logical like one up / one down we had balanced matchups. Not this kitten zerg wars and arrowcart fest (plus zoomhacking).

Saying that as a one-off this week has been ok for GH as we’ve won a lot of big fights and taken stuff. However if this was any kind of regular occurrence it would finally be time to move on to another game.

Dawdler.8521:

Zgorzel.4902:

We don’t have PS and RS numbers so we’re a bit more careful about choosing our fights.

3 hours ago PS still had the outmanned buff on GH borderland.

Either we are less than you think or you are more than you think :p

(RS is of course another story)

You need to realise that Riverside has had a constant big zerg on GH bl since reset, if you see big group of GH it’s usually because we were hunting for them. The Piken I saw earlier today in GH BL were just unlucky enough to get in the way of those battles.

Hopefully now weekend is over we see the usual dropoff in German numbers, so can be more smallscale.

I have to give a lot of credit to some Riverside players – in Gunnars BL you did have some roamers and they fought very well, especially two of you at Astralhome near midnight. Nice to see /salute.

Shame about the AC abuse in our Hills, especially when already outnumbering us by a lot. It’s clearly not intended by Anet, but seems some people will keep using it until it gets fixed or they get banned.

Murderous Clown.9723:

The best explanation from the other thread (seriously people, how many one up one down threads do we need?) is as follows:

Every week will have a T1 server playing a T2 and T3 server, no matter what.. this pattern continues all the way down the ladder. IE T2 server will be playing a T3 and T4 server..
No one in T3 will want to win because they’ll get smashed by whatever monster from T1 loses and no one in T2 will want to win because they’ll get thrown in with 2 T1 monsters.

This point ignores the fact that it’s the weakest Tier 1 server moving down and the strongest T3 server moving up, the difference between them is only 4 spaces on the ranking. Stating it in terms of tiers is a misnomer intended to make it sound a bigger difference than it is, and also infers all servers in a tier are equal which is clearly nonsense (and a big reason why this random matchup was even introduced). The 3rd placed Tier 1 server is a lot weaker than the top two in tier 1, and the top Tier 3 server is usually full qued on at least two maps and therefore more than competitive against anyone.

To add another point – the moving of servers up and down in the same week has been a feature since the beginning, all one up/one down does is make it fair and logical. Also your point ignores that most players want to balance between playing for fun and testing themselves against stronger opponents. One up /one down does that perfectly, guarantees that at worst you only get tested tough one week before putting you back into a matchup you can win.

I appreciate one up / one down isn’t a feature of US team sports, where you rarely even bother with promotion/relegation. But there is a good reason it is the dominant system in the rest of the world where we do have promotion/relegation. Because it works!