Guild Wars 2

Just another thought on that. I remember a rumour that players were mixed in “winner” and “loser” teams in season 3 (or 4?) which made matches absolutely terrible and created that ruby hell.
What if this system still is in place?
Helseth would almost never end up in a “bad” team that way, because he had a 80% win ratio – only if there is no team with positive win stats and the system picks players available instead.
If the system ever worked (don’t remember if this was the case) in a way like that, there would be no way a “good player” with a new account would be stuck in bronze, because he would always get the good teams over the bad ones if enough players queue up.

edit: my bad, someone mentioned it already..

To be honest I don’t know how this Elo hell is defined, so I may argue in the wrong direction.

But I play ranked with three accounts this season. One is mid gold, going up sometimes, going down and one is stuck in bronze like forever. (one is in silver now with about 30 games, so not important) Both accounts have about the same number of games now (about 250 on the gold one with start in plat 1 and 220 on the bronze one with start in gold 3)

On the bronze account I got a terrible loss streak where I couldn’t carry any teams. Even my 1v2 and partially 1v3 made my team cap or keep a base. Meanwhile it is impossible for me to get my other account out of bronze.
I had a 6 game win streak this week, got 10-14 points for a victory, then lost two games (1 with an afk and 1 with a really terrible team) and lost 28 points. Since then I won a game, lost a game, won a game, lost a game. And mostly gain 12 points, lose 10, win 10, lose 14 and so on.
There is absolutely no way I can carry people in matches where they lose a 4v2 or go afk after they lose the first fight on mid.

I still don’t know if I am a bronze player or a gold one. The matches are always one-sided as kitten.

for info and speculation: I play both accounts in most of the seasons, both were active in season 2-5 with being in ruby or diamond – so no new account without mmr was used and I think that’s the main reason for people being stuck somewhere. If you “damaged” your mmr in season 3 or 4 in ruby hell – where you couldn’t drop a tier, you may be on the “losing” end until a hard mmr reset may take place.

There are too many unknown factors to take Helseth’s way as prove for something.
- what time of the day you play (more afk players, more stupids, smth)
- do you play EU or NA (
- stuck mmr from previous seasons as mentioned above

And you can avoid that by not “hugging” siege. So epidemic is a solution for the terrible “siege curse” Anet brought into wvw.

Learn from it:
- don’t build too much siege
- don’t siege hug

From my point of view the op is right. I’ve played around 200 matches on NA and dropped from plat to bronze and since then can’t get up anymore. I can carry my teams to a point but sometimes teams are that bad that we lose a 200 point advantage while I fight 2-3 from the enemy team at a base and meanwhile we lose the two other bases or people start disconnecting or everyone runs for a boss kill.
On EU I started in gold 1 and ended up in gold 3 and I stayed in gold for ~300 games now and there are no stupid matches yet.

On this toon (EU) i played around 20 games and i fight my way up from low bronze to silver without an issue, because the teams are mostly even and we win by a 100+ advantage – or lose by another small margin.

NA is absolutely terrible. People throw matches, people just sit on the map typing or are so bad that they show up with power builds and condition stats and run into a meatgrinder (mid or far with 3(sic) enemies) every respawn

pdemo.8312:

D Dongs here. All we’ve done is smurf which is a problem but the creator of this post is also doing it so why should people play on their mains to q into kat/tokers alts where it means nothing to them if they lose but we lose rating on our mains? If everyone wants to play on their mains and winning/losing is equal to all of us that’s fine with me..

“Hey everyone is an idiot. WHY NOT ME TOO”.

NA is the worst environment for pvp. The players are more toxic then EU, throw games more often and the NA esl guys are mostly the kind of players from the screenshot on top. Additionally you have timezones where players don’t speak English so communication isnt possible and OCX guys with terrible pings that are unable to play and reporting toxic or afk players has zero effect.

That what happens when the company does not care for their esports environment.

SkyShroud.2865:

shagwell.1349:

SkyShroud.2865:

Derail? I am showing your flaws in your argument.

There isn’t a flaw in my argument. It’s your “witch hunt” against epidemic which is pretty much flawed.
Boon share wasn’t nerfed because it was overpowered in wvw, it was nerfed because of pve raids. Boon share is nothing you can avoid or interupt.
You can avoid epidemic by cleanse, you can dodge it and you can just move out of range because it’s a visible cast.

Epidemic isn’t a problem, when you have enough condi cleanse and your group isn’t stupid. For a necro it’s easy to “miss” epidemic when there are too many conditions on the target and it goes in downstate before the epi hits or the target dies fast.

You try to get an ability nerfed that isn’t the problem. The problems are condition output and guardians in combination with revenants. There wouldn’t be a condi meta without boon spreading. The condi meta exists because of this and is the only answer to it.

If you nerf condis you will have to nerf boons. End of story.

And why should we go there again? Because power meta was more fun? It wasn’t. You put on stuns on enemy group, bomb on it, run, repeat.

Witch hunt? Nerf because of PvE?

PvE people calling for nerfs, lol, why should they? Because it must be fun to throw away the 500++ golds worth of ascended? Because they feel sorry for the mobs they killed due to their op-ness? Which part of my comment appear as witch hunt? You never even read all the comments I have posted, you even repeated what I wrote in one of the comments I made.

Regardless, I find it pointless arguing with people who conveniently make up stories as counter argument. Good luck to you.

You haven’t brought a single argument into this discussion and yet you blame me for “having no arguments”?

I never said “community” called for a boon share nerf, it was a nerf based on pve by devs. You can read that here:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Balance-Changes-Upcoming

And sure, you are almost on every page of this topic posting how overpowered epidemic is and still are not answering to the discussion – that’s pretty much a witch hunt. You see epidemic as problem because you fail to deal with it and you don’t get the real problem of wvw these days.

Epidemic isn’t a problem. It’s not used in any content besides wvw and in wvw you still can counter and evade it. So it’s pretty much pebkac.

SkyShroud.2865:

Derail? I am showing your flaws in your argument.

There isn’t a flaw in my argument. It’s your “witch hunt” against epidemic which is pretty much flawed.
Boon share wasn’t nerfed because it was overpowered in wvw, it was nerfed because of pve raids. Boon share is nothing you can avoid or interupt.
You can avoid epidemic by cleanse, you can dodge it and you can just move out of range because it’s a visible cast.

Epidemic isn’t a problem, when you have enough condi cleanse and your group isn’t stupid. For a necro it’s easy to “miss” epidemic when there are too many conditions on the target and it goes in downstate before the epi hits or the target dies fast.

You try to get an ability nerfed that isn’t the problem. The problems are condition output and guardians in combination with revenants. There wouldn’t be a condi meta without boon spreading. The condi meta exists because of this and is the only answer to it.

If you nerf condis you will have to nerf boons. End of story.

And why should we go there again? Because power meta was more fun? It wasn’t. You put on stuns on enemy group, bomb on it, run, repeat.

Try to derailing the topic? Boonshare isn’t the topic, right?

People think it needs a nerf because they have no combat awareness and don’t know how to condi cleanse or to avoid being hit by things.

To be honest the matches this season are as terrible as the seasons before. I play one account on NA and one on EU.
The majority of all the matches are not even close. Which means that one team must be packed with “good” and one with “bad” players.
I don’t see another reason why I win one match by 300+ points and lose the next one by 400+. It’s happening on both of my active accounts.

Can this be a random effect? I think that’s most unlikely.

Eleazar.9478:

They need to blow up the servers and introduce a server loyalty program. Like the longer you stay with said name server the better it gets (have a bad case skin at the end like idk guild cap?!) however when you transfer it goes on cd and resets. If they approached servers as giant teams and did things to really make you feel a part of that team players will hype themselves up. Part of the reason wvw feels so bleh now is most players don’t feel like they’re having an impact and aren’t contributing to the fight you just feel like a cog in the machine which is kind of the opposite of why people play video games

This is pretty much it. You should be rewarded for every month you stick to your server. Your characters get birthday presents each year. Why not presents for server loyalty like the new monthly thing.
And make them good and retroactive (maybe precursors after a year or a full ascended gear or something)

The whole mess started with people transfering for seasons and jumping servers. Servers should have been locked before the anouncement of seasons and transfers should have been watched more carefully.

The backstab nerf? You mean it doesn’t crit for 12k (or 18k in wvw) anymore? And you still think this nerf wasn’t necessary?

Wrong, you have to make stealth less accessible.
Thief is the only class that is always in a top spot in wvw roaming since GW2 and that’s because of easy access to stealth, high mobility and great damage.
You still can outrun most players without stealth but you have to play more carefully.
“If a thief runs from you, you won your fight” is just the poor excuse for being overpowered. A thief should die the same as any other class in this game when making mistakes – yet, it doesn’t.

While at it, Make stealth less accessible. It shouldnt be a free out of jail card. You always should have to decide if you use stealth for an opener or to run, not being able to open from stealth and run instantly again.

So you don’t think thief is op?`I think it’s the best class for pvp at the moment. Which makes it op.

How can you lose a match in bronze when you are a gold player?

The problem is the pull into traps. That’s ~14k Damage without the DH using his Longbow – or one bad dodge is most likely your end.
That combined with a lot of blocks and you have a low skill based gameplay.

So, I got a disconnect in a ranked game. Got back into the game after about 60 seconds (restart GW2, joining Mists, joining game). We won the game and i got +15 rating.

Still I got an 11 minutes dishonor timeout.

Why?

I really like the code of conduct idea. I’m playing counterstrike for all of my online life and “afk’ing” matches is almost no issue because of punishment for violating the coc.
It is not a bad thing to ban people after a number of warnings for afk’ing or blowing a match or going full kitten on other players. You still get your warnings, but after a second warning you are out for a week (or sth) – and of course this should apply to connected accounts too.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

Note that he uses Team chat instead of expecting people to do their jobs automatically.

And we all know how good team chat works when trying to coordinate people that don’t listen, already know everything or don’t even have team chat activated.

That video proves nothing and especially not the point you guys are making. Maybe 5% of the player base is exceptional good at this game. A normal gold player won’t carry a 4v5 in this match.
Helseth couldn’t carry any of his three matches in conquest even while he was winning his 1v3. All the matches were lost.
The same thing will happen if he has players on his side that were on the enemy team at this 4v5. Why? He can win a 1v2, maybe a 1v3, but if his team still loses the other two bases it’s game over.
So how do you think a player that is not Helseth should win a match on silver or gold and carry a really bad team?

And not to forget he has a slight “new account” advantage not starting at 1200 and so he is fighting new people or people that are blowing games because they tank rating or just farm 3 pips per game.

We will see how these matches end when he finally is in silver.

On most of the maps DH stacking is an instant win. You can’t outrotate them because it takes to long to capture a point when a DH is at it.
You can’t really kite while getting shot with a long bow and you can’t stay on point with the traps damaging you. There is not a real counter to this. If you need to outnumber them every time you are most likely to lose another base.

The balancing of DH this season is by far the worst of any season this year. Not even the bunker meta was this bad.

lol thread /15 chars

And take away condition cleanse from stealth!

Run away. That’s what they do on FA for a living! Get your nikes out, we need to run faster!

Never use google translate to translate arabic into english into french into russian and then into english!

beatthedown.2651:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dodge

Super secret technique to counter traps.

Non sarcastic answer that might be helpful for newer players: Bind your dodge on “v” and now you can dodgejump easily by pressing space and “v” with your thumb. More range and your dodge ignores cripple/chill bullkitten.

Yeah, because you never need to dodge otherwise!

Sounds like a typical thief statement. “Dodge! you should have three or four”

Running away is losing too.

Why are you posting this? Want someone to applaud you or something?

I’ll afk my next 100 games and see what happens err I mean I collect data what exactly happens with my mmr!

Shadowstep.6049:

Evan Lesh.3295:

Also all those games are on thief, maybe you could switch up your play a bit and then come back to thief.

This is just straight out insulting. It is your very balancing team that brought classes to the state that thief can’t do much w/o decent team not to mention class stacking leads to every team having 2-4 DHs/wars. Why should players be punished for poor decisions made by developers? How could you say such thing to him?

Thief is the best pvp class at the moment. What exactly is your problem?

The matches are still bad. I’ve played 90 matches until today and the majority of them are either plain losses or plain wins. My last games look like this:

575:117, 500:302, 502:484, 503:149, 500:202, 301:503, 500:263, 250:500

That’s really still as bad as all the seasons before.

The scoring.

I win a match and get 12 points. I lose a match and I lose 14 points. Why? This indicates I always lose to teams with lower mmr and win against those with lower mmr? How is this possible when my matches are 500:100?

No, because you can farm pvp ranks with selfmade arenas.

- necessary changes: no pvp daily in custom made arena, no rank gains without participating in ranked or unranked
- resetting the mmr every season (players without any ranked experience start with 0, the others with 1000)

fishball.7204:

If a bad PvE player joins ranked and they keep losing they’ll eventually just tank to the bottom of bronze where they belong whereas you’d just keep winning after that guy is no longer on your team if you were actually underrated.

You can’t just blame every loss on these “PvE players” when perhaps you’re maybe just not that good yourself.

This argument is wrong.

If a “good” player gets into gold he is at +1500 rating. And at 1500 rating you’ll meet a lot of players that were lucky with their placing and don’t belong there. But they have to play a ton of games to drop down where they belong and most of them don’t.

This leads to a lot of bad matches.

Nikkinella.8254:

make it so that playing in custom arenas no longer gives rank points so pvers farming dailies cant rank up that way and have to play in unranked, and atleast have some knowledge of what to do.

This is a necessary change.

He gets carried by his thief friend to gold 1. “Best player”

Faux Play.6104:

keep in mind if they don’t rank their alt accounts where they belong they will be trolling the lower tier players. That probably was one of the main reasons for people griefing under the old system where you had to play x amount of matches to get out of sapphire/ruby/diamond.

Because people have too much time and are stupid? What kind of people do you know?

Nope. It’s great as it is now

Please, don’t talk to the “best player”. I met him on unranked a week ago and all he did was using say chat and taunting people fighting them off spots to “prove his skill” while his team lost by a large margin.

Haha, no loot in pvp? Why should i play it then? because of the great balancing and fun fighting the same four classes over and over?

Link.1049:

Druids, dragon hunter, warrior… Thief if he’s got the right build. Oftentimes they can’t carry enough condition cleanse

Mesmer, Ele

Most classes in the game counter condi necro 1v1

Getting 30 points for a match is pretty high. I never got more than 14 for a win and get about -20 when losing.

If you don’t understand the basics of pvp after reaching rank 20, you won’t after rank 30, 50 or 80.

Best season since S1.

Started at platinum 2 (after 9:1), dropped to gold 3, now one win away from platinum 1 again. Now at 50 games, 38 wins.

Only thing bothering me is the high number of DH and the problem with countering those.

Lilyanna.9361:

Warrior: “Oh you want to burn? Let me press two buttons and you’re irrelevant.”
Ele: “Traps? Lawl let me piano my way into earth and then water and not care.”
Engie: “What damage?”
Mesmer: “Good luck with catching me and my clones. Oh yea! I’m condi too and can heal”
Thief: “Backstab.”
Revanant: “Sorry, I’m too nerfed for this crap.”
Ranger: “Lol, DH, how cute. Let me proceed to bunker.”
Base Guardian: “Staff, Staff, Staff, Mace/Shield, Staff”
Necro: “Lemme put down three marks, go Reaper, and proceed to tank through all of your ‘burst’”

No, Dragonhunter doesn’t do crap. All of the classes [except for Rev] can check a Dragonhunter if played right.

Oh you want more proof that DH is garbage and only good for low tier, and solo que? Look at the professionals and the team comps. Guardian has not been seen for how long? Three or four seasons now? Dragonhunter has /never/ been in a professional team comp, only Base Guardian. Now to everyone who said this class is the most broken, just stop.

You are either a terrible DH or i can’t see the irony.

It is easy to carry “Amber boys”. How so? What if those “Amber boys” are on your team and you face a group of two good players on the other team? You lose 27 points, which makes at least two wins necessary to get back to your old rating.

It’s never “easy” to get out of a division if the game wants you to carry your team while it puts good opponents on the others. It’s absolutely random. You are either lucky or you die trying for a whole season.

DH destroys Mesmer, so Mesmer isn’t op, but DH is. Is that your argument?

It’s still the lowest skill and highest reward class. And in most cases it’s stupid to counter because you have to fight on point.

Is there any part of the game where DH isn’t overpowered? They are top tier in raid, pve, wvw and pvp.

The system still thinks you can carry your team. That broken system didnt change since season two.