Guild Wars 2

Sounds like skill lag will be permanant now. Lets hope I am hearing wrong.

KratosAngel.7289:

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/world-vs-worldthe-end-of-culling/
One point confirmed

“The end of culling, the start of lagfest 2013”.

Mayhem.1935:

sostronk.8167:

I don’t think 900 health regen is alot. I mean, a warrior just one hit me for 9k and I have 1k health left and I regain 900 health, Im not going thank god for that 900 health. Im just running hoping he doesn’t get another hit on me and wishing I didn’t use shadow step trying to chase him down. And yeah, thats a common scenario for me and a major reason I try to avoid warriors :p

I find that if i have any life left at all and i get into stealth i’m pretty much in the clear. Stack that with shadow refuge, which heals, and thats alot of hp pretty quickly. The few times that i do actually get downed, if i pop shadow refuge right before im back up in no time.

Shadow Arts line is tremendous, and i use it, maxing it out because it’s that good. Being a thief (atleast a p/d one) feels like im a pro football player playing in a pee wee league, it’s that silly.

I used to like Shadow refuge, but Im seriously considering dropping it. It seems the WvW community, at least the ones I face, are learning its simple mechanics. If I have 2k health I don’t gamble on it anymore. Every class has something that can deal with this scenario, so its a gamble on whether they are good or bad players (in a situation where you rely on it for survival). I used to feel fine dropping it whenever I liked, but most days players know if you drop AoE or any kind of CC is going to make it redundant. The only time I really find SRefuge all that useful is when dropping it before I go into a fight, but its not that great. Unless your near full health its gonna get you killed. Although thats a GC thief talking and survivability is pretty much completely reliant of stealth and outplaying opponents.

With my playstyle, with mobility and chasing down players and attempting to pull players away from where they should be/distracting them, its not really fitting for me. I just don’t like to stay in one place for long. Ive been playing around with switching it out with roll for initiative, but Im yet to see that add "survivability"in most scenarios I get into.

I don’t think 900 health regen is alot. I mean, a warrior just one hit me for 9k and I have 1k health left and I regain 900 health, Im not going thank god for that 900 health. Im just running hoping he doesn’t get another hit on me and wishing I didn’t use shadow step trying to chase him down. And yeah, thats a common scenario for me and a major reason I try to avoid warriors :p

For logging, mining and harvesting, maybe try messing with your mini map. I found getting the zoom right makes these nodes alot more visible.

Rifter.6591:

sostronk.8167:

Rifter.6591:

PocketMafia.9314:

That is what confuses me like honestly Warriors can do anything, why in the world don’t they get a nerf?

Yeah go play a warrior in PvP and then tell me they can do anything with a straight face.

I actually think they are the most overpowered class in WvW. But Im one of very few.

Im going to assume you are trolling here because i cant find a reason why you would think that unless you have never played another class and just dont know.

Nah I play all classes. I have 8×80s with full exotic/ascended kits.

Rifter.6591:

PocketMafia.9314:

That is what confuses me like honestly Warriors can do anything, why in the world don’t they get a nerf?

Yeah go play a warrior in PvP and then tell me they can do anything with a straight face.

I actually think they are the most overpowered class in WvW. But Im one of very few.

Jahn.7019:

wondo.2870:

Avenge.1478:

If you’re in WvW, expect to get hit. There are no ‘truce zones’ in my opinion at least. Everybody is fair game :/

The GvG area is very well known….

I think it’s fair to say it is only known to GvGers. Most of the casual population and probably every single individual who doesn’t visit these boards or guru has no idea about the GvG area or even that GvG exists.

But I digress, back to my original question, who won the GvG? Are there any fraps?

I don’t know where the GvG areas are.

I think Asurans look cool. But try the human areas, I thought they were well done.

Classes I didn’t enjoy in PvE: Mesmer, Elementalist

Classes that were Meh in PvE: Necro, Guardian, ranger

Classes I loved in PvE: Warrior, Engineer, thief.

Jahn.7019:

sostronk.8167:

I don’t know, I kinda like SOR guys

No, they are bad people and truly evil.

In that case, Sanctum of Rall players, you cannot hide, I am coming to kill you.

Amins.3710:

sostronk.8167:

Amins.3710:

sostronk.8167:

Amins.3710:

sostronk.8167:

Amins.3710:

^^ comming from a thief…. oh the irony.

I play every character in WvW, Im not only a thief. I wish others would do the same, seems most of the people who QQ have only played 1 or 2 chars, like yourself. Hence why they need to learn the mechanics. Just look at this thread. Its full of people that are basing their opinions of dribble that they seen in a video or read somewhere and then come in stating it as fact like they have a clue.

You’re right, I know absolutely nothing about WvW & PvP & what classes can and cannot do.

Thank you…. /slaps forehead

Your welcome.

You’re.

I know, but I prefer your because Im lazy

Explains why you play a thief as your main.

Not sure where your going with that one. If I played a class I thought was easy, Id probably go ranger.

I don’t know, I kinda like SOR guys

Amins.3710:

sostronk.8167:

Amins.3710:

sostronk.8167:

Amins.3710:

^^ comming from a thief…. oh the irony.

I play every character in WvW, Im not only a thief. I wish others would do the same, seems most of the people who QQ have only played 1 or 2 chars, like yourself. Hence why they need to learn the mechanics. Just look at this thread. Its full of people that are basing their opinions of dribble that they seen in a video or read somewhere and then come in stating it as fact like they have a clue.

You’re right, I know absolutely nothing about WvW & PvP & what classes can and cannot do.

Thank you…. /slaps forehead

Your welcome.

You’re.

I know, but I prefer your because Im lazy

Liquid.9672:

Pvp.2758:

Just remember, SoR might not have enough coverage to win, but they decide who wins.

Did I seriously just read that?

In that case, JQ sends their love and kisses.

Absinth.6917:

sostronk.8167:

3rd – We were farming badges all evening (all week for that matter) and seeing that the map was rather quiet at the time we went to where the badges could be found.

You must be a badazz. Can I have your autograph?

Actually when the incident occurred I was on my fresh lvl 80 necro. So I’m very far from being a “badazz” as you put it on that character. But yes you may have my autograph in the form of a rubber stamp pounded lovingly onto your forehead.

Cool. I love it when the internet tough guy does that.

3rd – We were farming badges all evening (all week for that matter) and seeing that the map was rather quiet at the time we went to where the badges could be found.

You must be a badazz. Can I have your autograph?

Burnfall.9573:

sostronk, i encourage you to post that to the theif forum and get back to me, please!!

Im tempted to try this just to see what is said. My impression is that the class specific areas are mostly taken up by sPVP players who would tell me that most WvW players are casuals and bad at PvP, which I would agree with.

Columba.9730:

style.6173:

Columba.9730:

Daeqar.8965:

Columba.9730:

Where does it say that only thieves are allowed to solo?

Secondly, if Spvp and WvWvW are the same, how about we balance thieves in WvWvW the same way they are balanced in Spvp?

No where, and there’s lots of people that run around with D/D Ele, GS Warr, Mesmer, and even some Necros and bunker troll Guardian builds and the like running around solo looking for 1v1 targets. And lots of them have great success with it and particularly look for Thieves to single out. I even saw a Ranger doing it last night who was shockingly good, although I’m not entirely sure he wasn’t cheating because I saw him using abilities of sorts that were completely new to me.

The thing is, most other classes have lots of good teamplay options to build for – and they use them. Why would they setup for dueling instead of setup to actually win? Thieves don’t have much of an option because small scale is literally the only thing the class is good at – the only thing that makes them special. They are deliberately designed to be lacking in other areas as a trade-off. The only logical thing left to do is scrounge for small scale tasks in WvW that are helpful and just be really good at them, no matter how limited those tasks may be.

Thieves do fine in Zerg vs Zerg. What you wrote isn’t accurate.

Lol. Thieves are the weakest zerg class. Name one class that is weaker. Go ahead, really. Waiting…. Waiting.. The correct answer is none. Thanks for playing though.

Lol wrong. Thieves that know how to play do well in zerg vs zerg. Rangers and engineers are weaker. hands down.

Not from my experience. Try that in Tier 1 right now. I would get dropped by Blackgate before doing any damage to their zerg as a thief. Which is why I have been either A. rolling Necro and playing with the zerg or B. Roaming with a thief and looking for small scale fights. I have rolled pretty big zergs before with thiefs, thats true, but when the zerg has alot of good players it doesn’t go down so well.

Columba.9730:

sostronk.8167:

Xsorus.2507:

Culling is going to get fixed, and people are going to see Stealth is still insanely overpowered…

Because Culling has very little to do with Stealth being overpowered.

I disagree… I don’t think culling will ever be fixed (without a lag-a-thon resulting).

Fine. then let’s start adjusting stealth since your fellow thieves claim that only culling is causing problems with stealth.

The culling thing is not really something to discuss. In all honesty, I have more problems with the effects of veil on culling than I do facing other thieves on whatever char I am playing at the time. And the mechanics of veil and culling tend to promote one another. If you are in a 1v1 with a thief though, its likely they will Anets code will let you know they are there. But when your facing a 50 man zerg with 3 or so mesmers constantly dropping veils it becomes pretty rough.

Burnfall.9573:

Even theives are admitting their class being way OP. “I’m a terrible player and I’m sick of any class that can beat me”. Why don’t you ask that to a level 54 theif newbie who was in my party in wvw who took out 3 people in less than 5 minutes of how terrible player they are?
She told the party “they were way too easy” and laughed. So that justifies us for being a terrible player? In support to the Over Post.

I took out 3 thieves with a Necro 1v3 two nights back, therefore Necros must be OP and need a nerf.

Burnfall.9573:

It is not off topic in one bit, as a Rng, and Eng. class as well, this concern me a lot. This not only affect one class beside theif but all others as well.

The OP said this was a “This is a Constructive thread, meant to help the game designers to get stealth back on track in WvW.” All we have is clueless noobs complaining when they don’t even understand the mechanics of the thief other than what they have read and heard. Id say thats well off topic.

Amins.3710:

sostronk.8167:

Amins.3710:

^^ comming from a thief…. oh the irony.

I play every character in WvW, Im not only a thief. I wish others would do the same, seems most of the people who QQ have only played 1 or 2 chars, like yourself. Hence why they need to learn the mechanics. Just look at this thread. Its full of people that are basing their opinions of dribble that they seen in a video or read somewhere and then come in stating it as fact like they have a clue.

You’re right, I know absolutely nothing about WvW & PvP & what classes can and cannot do.

Thank you…. /slaps forehead

Your welcome.

Jaytee.9513:

sostronk.8167:

Jaytee.9513:

If thieves are blaming culling as the fundamental problem to the OP’ness of stealth, What should ANET do if they can’t fix it?

That is the question…….

People state that this is the reason for the seeming imbalance to the skills of thieves, now please state how they should fix this if culling can’t be eliminated.

This is not about crying or whining, this is about a problem that many players feel needs to be addressed…..

How can so many complaints arise if there wasn’t a problem?

Responses from the ANET dev teams would be greatly appreciated.

Not that many complaints have arised. Its just a vocal minority on an internet gaming forum.

So the thousands of responses is a vocal minority? Go look how many threads appear complaining about stealth…..

Such exaggeration. It must be and epidemic.

Xsorus.2507:

Culling is going to get fixed, and people are going to see Stealth is still insanely overpowered…

Because Culling has very little to do with Stealth being overpowered.

I disagree… I don’t think culling will ever be fixed (without a lag-a-thon resulting).

Jaytee.9513:

If thieves are blaming culling as the fundamental problem to the OP’ness of stealth, What should ANET do if they can’t fix it?

That is the question…….

People state that this is the reason for the seeming imbalance to the skills of thieves, now please state how they should fix this if culling can’t be eliminated.

This is not about crying or whining, this is about a problem that many players feel needs to be addressed…..

How can so many complaints arise if there wasn’t a problem?

Responses from the ANET dev teams would be greatly appreciated.

Not that many complaints have arised. Its just a vocal minority on an internet gaming forum.

I can see the trolling issue with this immediately. Guild goes around claiming all keeps with no buffs.

Amins.3710:

^^ comming from a thief…. oh the irony.

I play every character in WvW, Im not only a thief. I wish others would do the same, seems most of the people who QQ have only played 1 or 2 chars, like yourself. Hence why they need to learn the mechanics. Just look at this thread. Its full of people that are basing their opinions of dribble that they seen in a video or read somewhere and then come in stating it as fact like they have a clue.

Waffler.1257:

Volrath.1473:

Waffler.1257:

Hexin.5603:

Not true, even traited with gear for duration, thieves have a window open on CD’s. Often will leverage CnD on npc’s in the area not to use there utilities.

Here’s one of the first videos I found on Youtube by typing in perma stealth thief, please point out where the CD window is that you can see the thief to attack.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DSbw8Cpy-3s

Video is outdated, stealth doesn’t stack like that anymore, d/p thieves are harmless if you died to one that you probably played bad. Plus to stop him from stealth all you had to do was get close to the smoking ring on the flor, one of the heart seeker will surely hit you and trigger reviled.

Which patch changed that? Most of the thieves I fight use this technique to stay in stealth indefinitely, including ones I’ve seen 1-2 days ago. And sure they won’t burst you down in a second or two like other thief builds, but in the wide open area of WvW you don’t need burst to kill another player when you can always stay just out of range and remain untargetable with stealth. I personally don’t die to them because I play a healing power guardian so there are very few things that can kill me, but I don’t waste my time trying to kill thieves either.

Out of interest, are you running sub 80 exotic chars? Ive never had a problem with permastealth thieves. But I didn’t play WvW until I was fully kitted. I have had problems, at least until I learnt how to play them, with GC thieves. Now I pretty much ignore perma stealth thieves and immediately turn and fight GC thieves.

felivear.1536:

Is this the most casual AAA MMO ever? I know some of you will get offended by this question thinking I’m attacking the game, but clearly, it was a design decision that Anet went for. Just curious if there has been another with more casual elements?

Honestly, I can’t think of a more casual game that I have played. I guess maybe minesweeper or something like this. Or hearts.

I disagree that this is a AAA title though. At least from my definition, a AAA title would have an automatch-making system for things like dungeons. I expect basic functions like this to be in game at launch or shortly after. But for this game I don’t think these types of things will ever be implemented.

Amins.3710:

Dual.8953:

Amins.3710:

Stealth is equivilant to an Elite.

Most Elites prolong death or provide Burst Dmg.

Stealth gives the avenue for both of these aspects.

Give Stealth the Cooldown of an Elite via increasing the Stealth Debuff to 20+seconds.

Make thieves use tactic’s, not abuse of an ill thought out ability.

If they come out of stealth, they are forced to fight for more than 3 seconds, then hide again.

I had a copper for the of amount I have to times I’ve had to explain this I’d be able to buy my Precursor.

This suggestion would render the S/D and P/D worthless, forcing P/D to only fight with its incredibly weak auto attack and making S/D completely inferior to S/P. And better yet, this suggestion will do very little to stop D/x builds from making insane Backstab bursts and spamming Heartseeker.

The Burst isn’t the issue.

The issue is never being able to target your enemy or when you do, you only have them targeted for 5s before they restealth from the PLETHORA of stealth abilities they have and the screwed up Inititive Regen they’re alloted.

Burst is just an issue w/ other people playing glass cannons. That’s a Choice… nothing more and you, as thieves, deserve to wrech people who decide to play glass cannons. That’s part of your role.

The issue is STEALTH. Not Burst.

If you’re a single target class that doesn’t have good AOE, you’re hosed… any competient thief is just going to lay waste to them.

Sounds like culling. Ive never had trouble targetting a thief.

There are some thief commanders in JQ and they seem to do quite well.

Handin.4032:

Honestly, I don’t have stability, ever (unless given to me), and I almost never get pulled off the ledge. As someone who pulls, most of the people who I pull off are the ones who jump up onto the side of wall and stand there for 3-4 attacks.

Just an observation.

If mesmer is your main, Id suggest you start to experiment with it. I can pull players over the lip if they are not standing on it. I can pull them off siege over the lip and onto the ground sometimes.

Columba.9730:

Chanting L2P doesn’t do any good either. I get killed by lots of classes very often.

You didn’t have to tell people, its pretty obvious you do.

Liquid.9672:

Bursts.1540:

We got more oceanics? and from JQ?

Would be news to me. I think he’s mistaken maybe?

There is a rumor floating around that BG recruited Oceanics from JQ. I think its just a rumor. Haven’t heard/seen any different. Our Oceanic seems to have more than halved, but I think its just because people are taking a break. Could be wrong though.

I can pull over the lip with one pull in some locations.

BBMouse, the vast majority of people will agree with your sentiments. I just think Anet really failed to deliver here.

Don’t rush the levelling. In all honesty, its one of the most enjoyable things about the game… that is learning new classes. What becomes a little less enjoyable is the missions and quests you do, which become “been there done that”

Mercucial.6759:

sostronk.8167:

Mercucial.6759:

Wanderer.3248:

Some people are just so addicted to rare Internet pixels, that they’ll spend all their time, in a game they payed for, avoiding having fun to get them.

Annnnnddd that’s where your wrong.

To those people, chasing those pixels is fun. Who are you to judge?

Do you see a problem with it?

Do I see a problem with people playing the game how they want to play?

Not at all. The way they play the game has no bearing on how I play, so why would I?

So would you say you don’t care about them?

jportell.2197:

Mesmer phantasms suffer the “Obstructed!” message more than any other skill in the game.

Sounds like you don’t roll a Necro with spectral grasp.

They can pull you over barriers without line of sight. Im serious about that. It should operate the same as Necros spectral grasp, which will consistently be denied if LOS is not there. Mesmers on the other hand, seem to be overperforming in ways it shouldn’t be.

I don’t think zerging is much of a problem of the games design, but rather the way alot of player see this as being the way to play the game right now. I don’t think players and leaders are really taking into consideration alot of things like manpower that should be. Its a little hard to explain this. But I think what is needed are tools that can address the issue and make small groups more efficient. One thing I think recently took a step in the right direction with this was the supervisor changes, which I see alot of zergs hang around 4 minutes for buff to go down, when you should be leaving behind 1-2 players to finish the cap.

Shinji.2063:

Even though i love what you have done with green garrison JQ we at BG had to move in. Its going to be our home garrison soon so we have to start getting used to the place. Thank you for keeping it in order and we will take good care of it.

Please remember to water the plants and leave some milk out for the cat!

Piedplat.3597:

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

Stealth is fine.

I disagree with your assumption that no other class can take out 4 players.

You kidding right, I never maid a 4v1 with my ranger, I mean in same time and same lvl.

Those class is gardian thief and mesmer and 2 class in that list use stealth.

Well, I killed 3 thieves (1v3) with my necro about 2 hours ago. It is completely possible. Once i killed the first one the second two tried to balance between getting their teammate up and relied on stealth and I dropped the last two with chain abilities. I always kept Fear for when they dropped Shadow Refuge so its a waste for them.

I wouldn’t go as far as saying a Necro is a “hard counter”to a thief, but Necros should not have any problems with them. Id say Warriors and Guardians are probably the best. I actually try to steer right away from Wars and Guards when I am rolling thief. A good warrior would completely own me 1v1 as would a guardian, but there aren’t alot of good warriors and guardians right now.

/meh. Its a double edge sword. It can be used against a team with a downed opponent or it can benefit them. I guess its probably not always such a good thing, probably better to have it removed for balance reasons.

1. when it raises awareness
2. Id put them alot closer to stupid than god. Also there are examples in this forum quite frequently where captain obvious has brought u kitten ues and Anet has thanked people for bringing them up because they overlooked them.

I don’t speak spanish, or whatever that is.

Danikat.8537:

Salacious.7358:

This will never be implemented.

What makes you think that?

Anet have said they’re going to add player housing and guild halls at some point in the future, but that it’s not a priority.

Id tend to believe what Salacious has said. I know they said it, but its not going to happen. They are dropping this game pretty quick development wise. We don’t see the figures, but it appears they aren’t making enough money on this game to warrant the level of development we want them to put in.

Columba.9730:

sostronk.8167:

Columba.9730:

sostronk.8167:

Columba.9730:

Aion, Warhammer, SWTOR, daoc, Eq2. Sorry, I am correct. I guess I should say decent games. More denial though, no surprise.

What were the decent games you were talking about, because they are all bad ones.

Lol dark age was much better to many of us, but you are entitled to your opinion.

Better than what? GW2? I think this game is pretty terrible from a PvP perspective.

We agree. I think the WvWvW is terribly imbalanced here due to thieves.

You talk alot. Load up your thief. Ill chuck on a guardian. Lets see what happens.

Columba.9730:

sostronk.8167:

Columba.9730:

Aion, Warhammer, SWTOR, daoc, Eq2. Sorry, I am correct. I guess I should say decent games. More denial though, no surprise.

What were the decent games you were talking about, because they are all bad ones.

Lol dark age was much better to many of us, but you are entitled to your opinion.

Better than what? GW2? I think this game is pretty terrible from a PvP perspective.

Columba.9730:

PolishSausage.1279:

Stealth and culling are both part of the same problem: they hamper the ability of people to find enemies when they’re right in front of their faces. The way things are right now, Thieves deliberately abuse the culling weakness in order to spam stealth moves and get easy back attack damage, or to make a getaway at the slightest hint of danger. It’s pretty much impossible to take them on in a 1v1 situation unless there is a really major gear/skill difference.

Culling is a part of the problem, yes, but to say stealth as it is right now is not also a problem is just admitting one’s own ignorance. Until culling gets figured out, I vote for either longer cooldowns on stealth skills, or a longer debuff period where players cannot re-stealth.

Yes, as it stands, stealth + culling makes for god mode.

If your sure of that, feel free to load up your thief and Ill meet you on the field with a char other than thief.