Guild Wars 2

XenesisII.1540:

Read McKenna’s post and figure it out. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/New-Worlds/first#post6390324

Snip 8<

there are people every once in a while come to remind us in here they prefer lower population servers because they don’t get blobbed or zerged down.

McKenna’s proposal at its core attempts to ceate “Fair & Balanced” Match-Ups by allowing ANet to move players around based on “_______________” please fill in.

Ok…you pointed out that people prefer lower population servers, but I feel that you cited a secondary reason.

I believe one of the Primary reason why most of these eccentric players prefer a lower population server…is for the unique community that used to exist under their care.

World Linking constantly & consistently errodes these unique communities. This WvW ecosystem that took years to develop is constantly under pressure to survive.

World Linking was done to help “Balance” population/match-ups by allowing ANet to move players around to where they were needed to create large scale zerg battles that makes WvW “exciting”.

World Linking worked great in the beginning, but the side effect was that it destroys the small communities within the ecosystem that fueled players to migrate from the Low Population Worlds to the Top Tier Worlds.

World Linking is like dumping the small fry directly into the main fish tank. Eventually the source gets exhausted & we loose all diversity.

WvW population levels are dropping without a solid ecosystem that naturally replenishes the Top Tier Worlds…imho

Don’t balance population. Let players stack on any server as much as they want to.

Instead…We need a solution that leverages & makes use of these huge population differences between servers as “bait & target”.

We could seriously resolve this problem if a 2 King of the Hill Match-Up design is used instead.

Make the Highest Ranked World Server in NA & EU to be the “target” for each region.

1. Assign only 1 Map to each World Server.
2. Re-purpose the 3 Spawn Points on all these re-assigned maps…that basically allow Players to enter the map through their (Single Red-Home Spawn), OR enter on All Other Enemy Server’s (Green or Blue-Enemy Spawn).
3. Re-purpose Server Guesting & tailor it to keep track of server fight choices of Players & Drop them into Maps using these Re-purposed Spawn Points with Weekly Limits on How many & Which servers that they can fight on.
4. Adjust Player Rewards based on their Home Server Rank & the Rank of the Server that they attack. Reward More if Enemy Server Rank is Higher. Reward Less if Lower.
5. Re-purpose WvG Panel to randomly display every time it’s viewed the Top 3 Servers attacking a Player’s Home Server…aka…“bait”.

Match-Ups are uniquely Player Driven…yet ANet Controlled.

Yours truly,
Diku

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Ok…just for giggles.

PvE Week – Players can’t kill each other. Players can only kill or heal NPC. Players can be killed by NPC.

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Current base game mode mechanics encourages & fosters…what I’ll term 800 pound Gorilla in the room effect.

We need to change the base game mode mechanics to directly fix this issue.

Implementing a Refugee Resettlement Initiative only re-creates the 800 pound Gorilla somewhere else & the cycle repeats.

WvW Communities are slated for dysfunction unless they’re on the 800 pound Gorilla world.

We really need the right vision & developer guiding us to a future that encourages & fosters Long Term Communities & Healthy Competitive game play…instead of what we have now…imho

There’s a better vision available…imho

Diku.2546:

I totally get what you’re going to try to do & commend you for it. Hope you succeed.

Make sure you choose to build your community on a Host server & hope it doesn’t get demoted into a Guest server. Encouraging & nurturing a Long Term Community isn’t the Primary Vision behind WvW…imho

Good luck, but be prepared for heartbreak When changes made by development will work against your community of friends & family…for the sake of what the Majority of Players of WvW want…as defined by ANet.

Yours truly,
Diku

Fatherbliss.4701:

Thanks Diku! I hear what you are saying. My honest fear is that a big change will happen and completely demolish what players have built on their own. There are not a ton of positive people left that I run across.

I hope that WvW can be changed into a Healthy Competitive game mode, however, I highly doubt that it will happen…based on the past track record that has given me too many heartbreaks to count…and the forum has never provided a place for solace for being able to complain or provide feedback freely.

Yours truly,
Diku

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Fatherbliss.4701:

I’m busy attempting to build up community involvement again, offering some humorous diversions and getting back to the basics.

Snip – 8<

Whatever it takes.

I totally get what you’re going to try to do & commend you for it. Hope you succeed.

Make sure you choose to build your community on a Host server & hope it doesn’t get demoted into a Guest server. Encouraging & nurturing a Long Term Community isn’t the Primary Vision behind WvW…imho

Currently the vision behind WvW is un-known & often changes direction without any explanation…

Good luck, but be prepared for heartbreak When changes made by development will work against your community of friends & family…for the sake of what the Majority of Players of WvW want…as defined by ANet.

Yours truly,
Diku

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

oscuro.9720:

miguelsil.6324:

There is no cake.

That’s okay, I like pie better.

What if these recent 2016 developments were done to weaken the WvW game mode, and to prepare for a massive steal of its player base from a vendor that would offer a similar product?

Anyway…these recent developments…intentional or un-intentional…I like pie better.

oscuro.9720:

Adding a better reward track for WvW rank ups would be nice. Instead of a box every rank up, so a progress bar that gives increasingly better rewards every 5 ranks, with good rewards at 5 spots, and really good rewards at every 10 levels. And then add very good rewards every 25 ranks.

I’d suggest creating a new Reward Track Currency…instead of Instantly doling out WvW Tract Rewards...the currency can be used to purchase the items in the same progression from a WvW Vendor.

Or, make the Rewards STACKABLE in your Inventory.

Yours truly,
Diku

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

God, Country, Family…

New players that come into WvW are attracted by gimmicks or sheer chance, but it’s the Family they find on a server that encourages them to continue to play.

It’s Critical to create a WvW universe that allows the possibility to create a ton of places for “Communities” to form.

The more places you provide to exist…the more chances a ton of “Families” will be born.

Reduce the places for Communities to exist & this reduces the opportunities.

World linking strips away the purpose & sense of Community that lower tier servers had previously.

It’s true that lower tier servers didn’t have a lot of players, but they had a close knit group of individuals that where “Family”.

New players that started playing in the lower tiers…found this “Family” & learned to play WvW….then grew up & matured…and then would move to the upper tiers to play.

Home towns are now linked directly to the Front Line of Battle…and can’t cope with the Battle stress. It’s no wonder that Homeland Communities are dying out, or struggling to survive.

Development efforts have been on providing Short Term fixes without a solid vision to guide it properly & then end up having Long Term negative ripple effects…imho

Development Focus needs to be on creating a WvW Universe that really encourages Long Term Communities to be nurtured & Healthy Competitive game play that naturally attracts new players to fight for their “Family”…imho

Yours truly,
Diku

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Deli.1302:

Newsflash! It’s almost 2017. This game is over 4 years old. WvW is declining because population is declining. Anet has at least done more for WvW this year than they have the past 2 years combined. If you don’t like a particular change, there’s a 100% chance that there are people who do like it. Because WvW accommodates many different play styles. You may not like the linking cos it’s killing your server but I’m 99% certain your server would be dying regardless because this game is aging and people are moving on to other things. If you aren’t already in the few lucky servers, then time is your enemy. Your server will eventually die out too. Circle of life boys and girls.

I disagree.

WvW seriously has the potential to evolve into something truly epic…similar in scope to the Super Bowl or World Series Franchises…which only gets bigger & better from my perspective…imho

Providing a Healthy Competitive game mode is the fuel & desire that would motivate players to sign-up & serve their tour of duty.

The fix isn’t that complex & uses existing game mechanics that’s already being used daily in GW2…we just need to re-purposed & tailor it for WvW to use.

The game mode also needs to be re-designed to systematically allow All Player based Communities to be Recycled for whatever reason… over time… by individual Player’s decisions to stay or leave on their own accord… without any developer interference:

Birth -> Growth -> Death -> Rebirth

Yours truly,
Diku

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Straegen.2938:

Pretty much every MMO experiences declining populations particularly in PvP. GW2 WvW has gone longer than most with this level of population.

That said, there is nothing in WvW that attracts new players and the learning curve in WvW is pretty steep these days. Not sure how to fix the problem but seems nobody else has really figured it out either.

We seriously need to fix the broken base map mechanics & deal directly with the problems of population in-balances & outnumbered match-ups first.

If we don’t Deal with the Source creating this Decline…then anything else that we do to fix anything will never be right.

All the game mechanics are in place & being daily used….they just need to be re-purposed into a solution.

There’s a solution. Just Google search for WvG.

Attracting new players is easy…imho…I’ve got mechanics already envisioned, but it wouldn’t make any sense to discuss them without first fixing the broken base map mechanics that doesn’t allow for healthy competitive game play since GW2 first launched.

Once you Can Have Healthy Competitive Game play that systematically encourages birth, growth, and rebirth of large scale & unique player based communities…it will naturally attract players…imho

Jeknar.6184:

And nothing kitten me off more than seeing that the other server rather just secure second place instead of trying for first. Now with 2-1-1, they either play for first or they lose just like the other server.

^^Agree on this.

ANet is making a huge step in the right direction from my viewpoint.

Encouraging a Classic King of the Hill fight cycle.

This breathes competition into the game mode…which is lacking due to the secure 2nd place (side effect of the 800-Pound Gorilla phenomenon) that happens often in the current Fixed 3 Way Fights & Locked Tiers.

It’s not the best solution, but it has the right intention…given the flawed base map mechanics that prevents a healthy competitive game mode…imho

ANet next has to figure out a way to make Score & Individual Effort/Recognition… Meaningful for both Host & Guest Servers.

Currently…it’s a farce…due to the manual Glicko manipulation they’ve been doing.

Also, Guest Servers with World Linking…are still being relegated the role of mercenary slaves…imho

MaLeVoLenT.8129:

2,1,1 is better than 3,2,1.

This makes everyone compete for first place instead of settling for second.

ANet can’t control Population In-Balance…so they’re trying to use it as a part of their solution to create “Fair” Match-Ups.

Classic King of the Hill fight cycle.

ANet made the right decision to try & put the focus on competing for 1st place…encouraging the 2 weaker “Servers” to combine efforts on fighting a “King” server that typically is over-stacked in population…imho

However, it appears the Fixed 3 Way Fights & Locked Tiers have greater weight as the 800-Pound Gorilla effect & current WvW mentality...overrides these scoring changes…imo

Players have grudge matches & old habits that are hard to change. Rivalries are good when it’s put to use in the right setting…which the current WvW game mode is lacking.

Players also might have shifted focus away from doing PPT…to just enjoying fights since World Linking & Glicko Manipulation was introduced & scores became meaningless...so this might also be contributing to the lost effect of using 2-1-1 point scoring.

Yours truly,
Diku

Note – Recent game mechanic changes can easily have deep changes to the culture of the core player base that have ripple effects…some of which…can not be un-done, or will have lasting effects moving forward.

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Nuzt.7894:

If you’re brand new to WvW I could see the concern because you may not know of the other exits but if you’re not … how do you not know about the other exits.

To the brand new players:

Welcome to Oz…

Josh,

Who’s gonna post Glicko?

Just joking…thanks for putting up with us…we’re not the easiest community to deal with.

Good luck!

Your’s truly,
Diku

9:05 AM – 12 Dec 2016 – Tweet

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Crapgame.6519:

Then it will be handled accordingly if deemed necessary.

To the topic we’ll see if anything spills over into WvW from the patch. If not, then we have to wait and see what the devs have in store. Maybe nothing, maybe something. Until then it is all speculations anyway and I don’t see a drastic disable happening anytime soon.

Agree…hope this post stays up & is considered relevant to this thread.

The OP expressed an opinion that things need to be re-built.

I totally share this sentiment & will continue to encourage ANet to see a Long Term Solution to properly build Communities…instead of implementing mechanics (World Linking) that destroys them.

ANet is being forced to implement these complex solutions to fix problems that’s rooted in a flawed core base design…imho

If the core base is not designed to naturally deal with the problems associated with the flow of Match-Ups and Population In-Balances…the developers will forever be stuck in putting out fires with complex solutions…which in the future…creates more fires.

Vicious cycle of complex solutions & complex problems.

Resources can never be used to expand & evolve the game mode into something epic.

The below vision that I’m proposing is very simple & not that drastic, but it’s been proven that it can’t be discussed in this thread.

I agree with the OP…that WvW needs a Reboot.

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Balthazzarr.1349:

@Diku – +1 !

Thanks!!!

Hope my reply is good & relevant.

Crapgame.6519:

Edit: @Diku – Birds of a feather flock together… You still have populations, real world clock, transfers, and of course map capacity.

Let’s not discuss this topic because it’s not good & not relevant.

Sarrs.4831:

Diku.2546:

I have a clear vision that preserves server identities, encourages a healthy competitive game mode & it uses existing game mechanics within WvW to accomplish it. See my below signature for details.

You have a pipe dream.

World Guesting is already here & is a mechanic being used today in GW2.

ANet just needs to re-purpose it for WvW needs.

It’s not a pipe dream, but it’s definitely a dream…but totally possible…imho

There is a clear vision & solution available to create a better future for WvW.

Yours truly,
Diku

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Eleazar.9478:

I come to the wvw forums for interesting discussion and I’ll see are pipe dream reworks or stuff for gw3 rofl. Nobody has a clear idea what wvw needs.

I have a clear vision that preserves server identities, encourages a healthy competitive game mode & it uses existing game mechanics within WvW to accomplish it. See my below signature for details.

Yours truly,
Diku

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

@OP

WvW Ultimate solution – Interesting concept.

You’ve managed to maintain the “Tiers”, but you’re using it in a different way than how it’s being used now.

Servers “keep” their identity & basically funnel into your modified “Tiers” to fight on behalf of Colored Alliances…from what I can understand.

Servers & Guilds for that matter fight for Rank that is obtained by earning it through the battles that they do in your version of the WvW universe.

Hope I didn’t screw up & lose the gist of what you’re proposing…and gets your thread back on topic.

Yours truly,
Diku

Norbe.7630:

so basically this is Diku’s modified WvG
the modification is the xp system as a score

OP is trying to work out an idea that’s very different from WvG.

Major differences:

WvW Ultimate – Each Server Do Not Own any Borderland
vs
WvG – Each Server Owns a Home Borderland

I’d encourage folks to discuss the OP’s concepts in this thread & not WvG.

Thank you,
Diku

swellercross.3974:

There is no solution to wvw population imbalance

There is a Solution…imho

Just accept & embrace the idea that Highly Ranked & Powerful servers will always have large populations.

Then make these Highly Ranked Servers into Targets for the entire WvW universe to attack.

Implement Server Guesting tailored for WvW…that lets everybody visit any server they want with limits on How many & Which servers per week.

Then offer a huge bounty for attacking any server ranked above your chosen home server.

And, offer pennies for attacking any weak & lower ranked server below your chosen home server.

Yours truly,
Diku

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Jeknar.6184:

Diku.2546:

Please ask yourself:

What’s the past history on how effective have these polls been in Helping WvW?

Better than just being ignored. At least someone’s opinion will be taken in consideration.

Some decisions should not be entrusted to players to choose.

Some Polls are like the Pandora Genie in the Crack Bottle that should never have been opened.

You can’t ask an addict/child how much “WvW fun” they want…and then Not expect them to reply they want as much as you can give them…until they overdose & kill the fun.

Sometimes back seat drivers will give you the wrong directions…and we’ll end up driving off a cliff.

Sometimes it’s better to let the Airplane Pilot fly & land the plane….their fiduciary duty to players on keeping it fun…imho

I agree…it’s nice that we’re not being ignored.

Devs that are in-tune with their customer’s taste in chocolate…and can create the right flavor & amount of sweet that we’re craving…is what I hope these polls will allow ANet to create.

However, ANet seems to be missing a Willy Wonka with a vision…to lead their wonderful candy shop…imho

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Polls are only a tool that allows decisions to be made that will either help or harm WvW.

Please ask yourself:

What’s the past history on how effective have these polls been in Helping WvW?

Personally I like the DBL for selfish reasons, but given the current state of WvW…I’d probably want to use it when things improve…population numbers & balance wise.

From a Dev’s point of view…I’d have different reasons on when & why I’d choose to implement it…in relation to the state of WvW.

Creating a healthy & robust WvW…is similar to making chocolate…you have to add the right ingredients at the right time/temperature. If you miss the timing/temperature…the taste of the chocolate is affected/ruined & you can’t undo the result.

We’re still missing the Right ingredients also…imho

Tofu Turkey anyone?

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

@OP

I’m guessing, but I think Black Gate has 10%-15% of the Total Active players for All of NA WvW.

Here’s my best guess on what the Active Population levels for NA WvW:

Rank 01-03 World – 30% – 3 Servers
Rank 04-09 World – 27% – 6 Servers
Rank 10-15 World – 21% – 6 Servers
Rank 16-21 Wolrd – 16% – 6 Servers
Rank 22-24 World – 06% – 3 Servers

It’s possible the time you play just so happens to be during a period your server “lacks” coverage, or your server community is hybernating or tanking for whatever reason.

Servers ranked below Black Gate probably have it more difficult…so folks might be so nice, but I agree with you…it’s not fun being camped & farmed.

Was being serous about the Signs & Lights…hoping ANet does implement it to help new & casual players that might not know that starting spawn points are typically designed to have 3 or more exits.

Citadel’s spawn point has more than 3 exits…in fact…the exits are the whole border wall enclosing it…anywhere you can manage to slide down it.

Peppel.9736:

Morning

sounds good Diku. I have an other suggestion

Example:
T1-3 for Blobfights and Queues.
T4-5 for medium Blobs
T6-7 for Roamer and small Guild fights

Anyone could choose what they just want. So no server membership, but simply after now just desire and mood, select in a field/selection, without transfer.

I have fun today/few hours on blobifights – I join T1-3

or

I wanna just roam today – I join T6-7

Hey Peppel,

Hmmm…if we tried & keep the Tier infrastructure…Server Guesting tailored for WvW wouldn’t work properly.

Sadly…Tiers systematically encourage the 800 pound Gorilla effect…imho

Here’s my most recent research & analysis concerning this well known WvW phenomenon:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Gonna-be-a-LONG-week/first#post6399041

Actually… IF Server Guesting tailored for WvW is enabled…players can visit Any Server.

So your wish to Blobfight or Roam…would still work…you’d just need to visit any of the “Lower” ranked servers within the New Sediment of a WvW universe without any Tiers.

i.e. for NA Players

Ranked 01-05 Servers – For Blobfights & Queues
Ranked 06-15 Severs – For Medium Blobs
Ranked 16-20 Servers – For Roamer & Small Guild Fights
Ranked 21-24 Servers – Peace & Quiet – Role Playing Guilds (joking…or do they exist?)

Plus, you can pick any Home Server to help build a Long Term Community with Friends & Family…if there’s an open slot.

If there isn’t an open slot…then perhaps you could convince your Friends & Family to pick a Lower Ranked Server to make it your Home…then work together to raise your Home Server’s Rank in the Long Term.

If you’re successful…then your Home Server will fill up any open slots…and “Fair Weather” players will find it harder to transfer & join into your Long Term Community.

Also, damage to Long Term Server Communities from the Locust Swarming behavior done by “Fair Weather” players can be reduced by imposing a minimum stay period that scales upward for players that frequently change their Home Server.

Full details behind this idea can be found in my below signature.

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Eleazar.9478:

Diku made me laugh quite a bit, the sad thing is your probably on to something, I think some kind of explanation would be good for the newer or casual wvwers

Typically…everybody goes out the front exit…and rarely out the 2 side exits. So it’s not surprising that players don’t notice it.

Xenesis.6389:

lmao good one Diku lol.

Actually was being serious & hoped to improve things for WvW noobs & casuals.

Diku.2546:

Simple solution for ANet to fix:

1. Giant Road Signs that show players the 3 exit routes from a Spawn point.

While we’re at it…we might as well Add:

2. Enemy Detector Lights at the Map’s on ramp to help players Merge Safely.

Simple solution for ANet to fix:

1. Giant Road Signs that show players the 3 exit routes from a Spawn point.

I’ve said this in another post…but this is like trying to make a Turkey dinner with Tofu.

Tournaments will never happen without the right ingredients for a Competitive game mode that supports & encourages the existence of healthy communities in the Long Term…imho

Current WvW lacks the following:

1. Rock Solid Team Identities (see NFL franchise for example)
2. Fair Match-Ups even when it’s unbalanced
3. Score & Point System with Integrity

Fix the above…then you’ll see that having Tournaments will become possible again.

See below signature for a better recipe for WvW…imho

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Heather.4823:

You really need to merge and stop this linking. So many people just bandwagon to their server of choice by joining the low linked server so linking never does any good. We were linked, had lots of players but they weren’t linked anymore with their server of choice so on they moved.

Its just so pointless

Merge already

I agree…World Linking needs to be removed from WvW. It systematically neuters & seriously kittens the growth of guest server communities in the Long Term.

I’d prefer removing All Tiers & using Server Guesting tailored for WvW with limits on How many & Which servers that players can weekly visit to fight on instead.

Just make sure that players get rewarded more for attacking higher ranked servers & get rewarded less for attacking lower ranked servers.

Let the players drive the Match-Ups while ANet controls & regulates the flow to All servers to keep things “balanced”.

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Jeknar.6184:

In any scenario with 3 or more teams it will always result in the stronger ones pilling up on the weakest.

Then change the scenario to be 4 teams.

1. Then Allow All teams to attack each other, but with limits on how many & which teams that players can attack. i.e. Allow Players to Attack 1 enemy team and after they’ve chosen…they can only attack that 1 enemy for the week. Luckily this limit can be changed weekly…as opposed to every 2 months…to keep Match-Ups lively.
2. Then Reward a lot more when attacking a team Ranked Higher than you
3. Then Reward a lot less when attacking a team Ranked Lower than you

Encourage & Reward players to “systematically” pile up & fight together against the Higher (Stronger) Ranked Team instead.

Our current WvW exists in a Tier based prison…imho

Blue Pill or Red Pill – The Matrix (2/9) Movie CLIP (1999) HD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zE7PKRjrid4

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

macon.4065:

Ahem…. let me get back to the original point of my post. I believe that the GOB should be a universal item for everyone to get.

This is not a fun way to play a game.

I agree…ANet should make all things an universal item…in all game modes?

Many materials in crafting can’t be collected in WvW…period…you Have to go into PvE zones.

Currently I’m trying to collect a lot of Maguuma Lilies, but they’re only available for Successful collection in PvE zones.

Why Can’t we just make all materials an universal item…available in all game modes?

I’d say there’s waaaaay more things a WvW player has to go through to get PvE based things over what a PvE player has to suffer…imho

Why is that?

I agree…This is not a fun way to play a game.

Answer: This is to encourage players to try new & different things…outside of their comfort zone. You prefer PvE & I prefer WvW, but I bet you that I go into more PvE content than you have to endure WvW. Let’s agree to disagree & move on.

Tofu Turkey Leftovers anyone?

Competitive or Not Competitive

A Competitive Game mode needs the following ingredients…imho

1. Rock Solid Team Identity
2. Fair Match-Ups even when it’s unbalanced
3. Score & Point System with Integrity

New Competitive Recipe (see below signature for full details):

Rock Solid Team Identity – Check

1. World Server names already provide a “Team” identity

Fair Match-Ups even when it’s unbalanced – Not Check

1. Should Allow players to attack Any Server with weekly limitations on How Many & Which Servers instead of every other month
2. Should Give bigger “Rewards” for attacking the Top Ranked Servers
3. Should Give smaller “Rewards” for attacking Lower Ranked Servers

Score & Point System with Integrity – Not Check

1. Manipulating Score & Point mechanics should be discouraged & not really be fully relied upon to balance player’s perception for fair fights

With a Competitive game mode…Hibernating or Tanking using the above ingredients Only Hurts any Server that does it…as they fall in Rank as Other Servers step over them to Competitively try & to be the # 1 WvW Ranked Server for either EU or NA.

Without a Competitive game mode…Healthy Annual Tournaments that don’t burn players out…Can Never happen.

Hope everybody had a Happy Thanksgiving…

Not using the right ingredients often leads to something Not as intended.

Tofu Turkey anyone?

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Transientbliss.7584:

Its an interesting idea. I just don’t think anyone has ever come up with a solid solution on implementation that moves us away from stacking.

Don’t move away from stacking…embrace it…move towards using over-stacked servers as a huge target that rewards more for attacking servers above your rank & rewards less for attacking servers below your rank.

Assign each server 1 map.

Then remove the Tiers & Implement World Server Guesting with Limitations on How many & Which Servers player can weekly visit to fight on.

Let players pick their own Match-Ups…instead of having to wait for 2 months for World Linking to change the dynamics.

There’s a better Long Term design for WvW…that’s a solid solution…imho

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Still waiting for ANet to fix WvW so that it can become a competitive game mode that encourages “healthy” competition & not burn-out.

How Population In-Balances are used in the game design:

1. Original design – Over-stacked servers kill competition. Fix is to block players from stacking, or to move players around to re-balance.
2. Competitive design – Over-stacked servers encourages competition. Fix is to make Over-stacked servers a target with better rewards for attacking them…then encourage competitive pressures to force change.

Competitive design - WvW Ranking naturally provides targeting & is allowed to have weight & meaning. Players are allowed to create their own weekly Match-Ups.

Intangible rewards like…Honor & Prestige are un-locked.

Players get a stable place to call Home that allows them to nurture their community of friends & family. Signature below is an alternative to our current state of WvW.

Original design - It’s really tiring & depressing with all these…now it’s open…now it’s closed thing…while shuffling players around to “temporarily” solve things…over & over again.

Playing peek-a-boo & musical chairs is getting stale.

Plus, it’s downright horrible being homeless & then not being able to find a home to move into with this constant & inconsistent way of solving the in-balance problems of WvW.

Also, ANet is now fixing WvW Scoring Improvements.

Please ANet…find a better vision & compass & stop letting players guide you in the wrong direction time & time over again.

Please be very careful when using Polls.

Polls can seriously turn into a Pandora’s Genie Crack Bottle.

Case & point…World Linking…is now making ANet constantly play peek-a-boo & musical chairs with us…imho

Please consider changing the Original game design…instead of allowing the “Majority” of Players to force you to do things through these Polls.

Don’t abandon your fiduciary duty to the “hardcore fans” of WvW that would make this game mode into something truly epic if you allow them to.

There’s a better Long Term Solution that will allow you to generate revenue streams not just off gem sales…if you can envision the future right…imho

Take a Cookie…You’ll feel right as rain.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvaE_HCMimQ

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

You should probably pick the NA server that has the highest 1st place winning in skirmishes.

Servers with a higher ratio of placing 1st probably have a better 24 hour coverage all around.

Here’s the current week’s skirmish scores as of Thursday Nov 17, 2016 @3 pm UTC.

Reset is tomorrow…so I don’t think the scoring trends should change that much.

Hope this helps you in picking a NA server for your EU Timezone.

Ziggy.3842:

“Removing tiers” is not an option xD

Removing tiers is an option.

Assign 1 Map to each Server.

Then enable World Guesting for WvW & let players visit & fight on any Server, but with limitations on How many & Which Severs they can visit weekly.

Give more rewards to players attacking a server ranked higher than their server.

Give less rewards to players attacking a server ranked lower than their server.

Then show players the top 3 servers attacking their single map in a random order.

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Chaba.5410:

atheria.2837:

How and why are two tier one servers pitted against a tier three server?

Easy.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/big-changes-coming-to-wvw-matchups/

Is this a trick question?

jweez.7214:

Is the population up and are people competing in it?

My haiku answer (5/7/5):

Depends. Yes & No
Pre-Determined or Empty
Then both are correct

joneirikb.7506:

@ Diku.2546

Think I just answered that twice already or at least my idea on it.

You did. I understand what you mean. It’s like opening up check-out lines in the grocery store when there’s lots of people wanting to pay & check out.

This concept doesn’t apply itself very well to WvW…imho

I’d be concerned that given the existing Fixed 3 Way stuck in Tiers…

The proverbial 800-Pound Gorilla phenomenon will just allow the Gorilla to abuse the Chimpanzee & Weakest Link across not just 4 Maps…but over however many more dynamic maps get opened.

Thanks for taking the time & effort to offer a solution. Let’s agree to disagree…and we can both move forward in our own way.

Analysis & Findings

23/24 Wins 1st Place – Black Gate – Full – Gorilla
24/24 Wins 1st Place – Maguuma – Full – Gorilla
14/24 Wins 1st Place – Stormbluff Isle – Partial – Orangutan
11/24 Wins 1st Place – Dragonband – Partial – Orangutan

Scores equally distributed among 3 servers = 8

I’ll have to conclude this is a perfect example of the 800-Pound Gorilla effect as observed in WvW.

This tends to occur due to the Fixed 3 Way Fights & Locked Tiers that serve to box combatants into a non-escapable cage.

Servers unfortunate to share the same cage as the 800-Pound Gorilla can be said that it’s on par to being in a Kobayashi Maru scenario.

I’ve included a current screen capture that details numerically this well-known effect for your reference. Dated Monday November 14, 2016 @2:00 am UTC.

Luckily with newer skirmish mechanics…we’re able to record & measure this phenomenon in greater detail.

My first research was originally posted over 1 year ago on October 15, 2015.

Please note: “Orangutan” classification ADDED between Gorilla & Chimpanzee.

This was made possible with the greater detail that became available through the new skirmish mechanic scoring.

Publication found here:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/WvW-and-the-Heart-of-Thorns-Release/page/6#post5614722

Below reposted for other WvW researchers to reference if they’re too busy to visit the original link.

The only known solution based on my past observation is to encourage your Home Server to “Hibernate or Tank” to get out of the Cage.

Hope this better explains what you’re currently experiencing.

Knowing a solution to remedy this problem…hope this makes you feel better.

Original Posted Research – October 15, 2015

Click the + if you agree with this post.

New Change in my opinion will change the tone of WvW Match-Ups to:

1-FRI – Hammer the Weakest Link

Influx of Players get on because it’s the weekend…and reset hasn’t occurred yet. The Weakest World Server gets hammered by this weekend influx crowd.

2-SAT – WvW Reset – Stomp the Weakest Link

Players unfortunate to be on the Weakest World…after Friday’s influx of players…now face a Saturday Stomp.

3-SUN – Roles Defined

800 Pound Gorilla, Chimp, and Weakest Link. Worlds will play off each other to try and avoid being the Weakest Link.

4-MON – Pecking Order

Worlds Falls in Line & continue to play off each other’s role

Only option for Weakest Link World

Stop Fighting for the week & Fall in their Tier Rank.

How about ANet implement a Guild Draft system?

World Servers get to pick from a pool of Highly Ranked Guild Raid Teams to join their server like in the NFL?

ANet automatically moves these Raid Guilds for Free of course to their New World Server that picks them.

We’re already linking servers…so it shouldn’t be too hard to somehow use Guilds to help.

“Raids are our answer to what skilled PvE players have to look forward to at endgame—the ultimate test to overcome and defeat.”
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Raid

WvW is also an end-game product to GW2…imho

All WvW Servers would benefit & this would allow ANet to “distribute” Quality Guilds between All Servers.

This should go a long way to improve their efforts with “balancing” Match-Ups & “reducing” the frequency needed to adjust skewed Scoring trends.

Disclaimer – Parody…not to be taken seriously…unless WvW is able to somehow support a healthy competitive game mode of play. In which case…Guilds would be offered the choice to move server for free & not be forced.

Servers could also offer more rewards to entice these Highly Ranked Raid Guilds with whatever that is agreed to be ethically & morally “legal”. Annual Draft would be a big PR event that helps these Highly Ranked Guilds gain recognition at an International level…if they accept their New Server’s invitation.

Manipulation is a very scary & slippery slope…imho

Justine.6351:

There really isn’t an appropriate solution anet could implement. While people don’t mind government regulating other people, they don’t like it when it is regulating them. Unfortunately too many don’t know how to regulate themselves. Population imbalance is 100% in control of the players already.

1st off…seriously…thank you for your feedback.

There is an approriate solution…and it’s sitting right in front of you. You’re just not “seeing” (below signature) the writing in this post.

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes

Chinchilla.1785:

Don’t stress over “becoming like BG” because that’s just coverage wars….no amount of training will change that. Get more numbers magically.

Neither is it BG’s fault for 24 hour persistent game modes that lead to burnout.

Agree…it’s not entirely BG’s fault.

BG somehow managed to place their server in a spot that the game mode systematically encourages immortality. I’m pretty sure other servers wished they could have done what BG successfully pulled off. I’m pretty sure it took a lot of both effort & luck.

Anyway…ANet is working on “fixing” the score numbers…to hopefully adjust the perception that WvW is ok…since World Linking isn’t fully doing it.

These short term solutions without a clear vision…are making a mess of WvW. I wish ANet would focus on providing a long term solution based on a concise vision for everybody to understand.

shagwell.1349:

Sometimes less is more!

My haiku response (5/7/5):

This is very True.
Life can teach you many things.
Only Buddha knows.

If you prefer

Sometimes less is more.
Life can teach you many things.
Only Buddha knows.

X T D.6458:

Swagger.1459:

From observations it seems that BG has a lot of regular and dedicated players. They also seem to put in a lot of overtime. The recent dev post stating that BG had less population than JQ and linked worlds lends more credibility to my thoughts.

Despite BG being a top competitive server, that doesn’t mean it needs to be forever locked and players stressed to put in more effort to be successful. Brief periods of being open are healthy for current players and allows for the population to be maintained as other players stop playing or lose interest.

Y’all really have to stop blaming players on this particular server and look to improving your own servers instead.

+1 good post.

It’s Sunday and reset was Friday.

It’s true…even a top competitor like Black Gate can loose & doesn’t win ALL the time.

Players need to stop complaining & work harder like Black Gate.

Take a look at the Skirmish Scoring screen capture taken just now (Sunday Nov13 @4:56 pm UTC).

Out of the 19 current skirmishes…they only won 18.

This kind of scoring…to be “fair” doesn’t happen often…right…it’s a fluke.

Anyway…if this was football…Black Gate has seriously got the talent & is on par with being a Super Bowl team.

The remaining 23 of 24 NA server are really talentless & can only be on par with being a High School team.

I’m with you buddy.

Shame on the rest of the 23 of 24 NA servers….you need to train harder & be more credible while you’re at it!

Stop blaming Black Gate. They can’t help it if the rest of WvW doesn’t have a lot of regular and dedicated players like they do. They also seem to put in a lot of overtime.

It’s all your fault folks. It’s in your hands to train harder & while you’re at it…you should recruit better people like Black Gate does.

Please note…this is a parody & shouldn’t be taken seriously. Screen capture is real though.

joneirikb.7506:

This is also another reason why I keep suggesting the Dynamic Maps.

Make the number of maps adjust itself after the active population, avoid queues, and avoid empty maps. And also reduce map cap a little bit to avoid the lag while at it.

1. What happens to the importance of holding territory?
2. What happens if one side can’t hold any territory?

Tell a funny joke, or tickle them.

Hopefully it’ll make them feel better & happy.

Vova.2640:

If something they need to lower population per map down to 50 (same size as squad).
This will:
1. reduce skill lags in 3-way sm fights
2. create queues on over stacked servers (BG…) and hopefully make ppl get sick of queues and transfer out. Then if they over stacked server destack a bit Anet might go back to like 5 tiers to spread the population better.

But yeah… player caps should absolutely not be increased.

EU players have already voiced their opinion that they may prefer not to participate in linking…so the below might not apply to them.

How about we set the Max Map Cap = 25
AND
ANet Add an additional 96 NA World Servers

New World Servers could also be “Leased” out Monthly for VIP Guilds to own temporarily & to generate gem sales for ANet.

Special Exclusive Hidden Tiers could also be setup for VIP Guilds to host & entertain high level clients wanting to spend gems like no tomorrow.

All these New World Servers would then be used in linking & to easily re-balance the Match-Up’s population on the fly.

Hourly Match-Ups can quickly be re-adjusted. Players don’t need to wait for 2 months for the situation to get fixed with a full time “Match-Up Jockey” working for ANet.

The Match-Up Jockey would be in charge of spinning all the fights & scores so that everybody is having fun.

Who needs or wants a competitive game mode when it should be all about having fun & getting crazily sprayed with rewards?

Ok everybody…Let’s “Do the Hustle”!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7TsRdkrxl4g

Before Nike…there was the Hustle. Do IT!

Don’t get hustled by this silly joke. This is a parody…and should not be taken seriously.

Don’t forget how Disco ended in the 70’s…for a reason.

morrolan.9608:

Reaper Alim.4176:

Yet I hear the community blaming this on ANet. Lol helluva funny in my opinion. Then the community wonders why ANet don’t communicate much with such people? Pretty obvious to me why.

Its human nature, the game design has to account for that but doesn’t at all.

Agree.

This explains it in 1 sentence…instead of my long post on beaver dams & water wheels.

To really “fix” this & get us out of the “swamp” we’re stuck in…ANet needs to change the base map mechanic & switch from using beaver dams & Re-design WvW to use water wheels instead…imho

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Beaver-Dams-Water-Wheels/first#post6396100

McKenna Berdrow.2759:

Thanks for the feedback everyone! It still seems like there is a general lack of interest in the idea, so we’ll pass on it again.

Thanks for the update.

It’s true there’s a general lack of interest in the posted idea concerning New Worlds, but there seems to be an incredible amount of interest in other alternative solutions instead.

Hope some of these alternative long term solutions make it into your developer discussions.

For a Better Long Term Solution to WvW – Try a Google Search for – wvg world vs globes