Guild Wars 2

@OP

What would you suggest IF this was your situation:

You fight against a World Server that caps DAILY EVERYTHING in WvW and TOTALLY dominates everything between 11 PM – 11 am your time.

Let me guess…You dig in & fight when your enemy isn’t there, or you move to another server?

Or, would you suggest that WvW Server access be turned off between 11 AM – 11 pm daily because the needs of your enemy outweigh your needs?

I agree with you…ANet needs to do something to fix this, but my solution would be to change the base Map Mechanic.

All WvW players…on Strong & Weak Worlds need to have a reason to play WvW…but the solutions I’ve seen so far only favor the Needs of the Many…

WvW is a Game Mode that needs to encourage the Weak Worlds…otherwise…we ened up playing Cops & Bank Robbers…with only Bank Robbers playing.

Why not create:

Dishonor Flag

1) Let the WvW community of players flag the player(s) they think are Trolls.

2) Put limitations on how this flag is applied to prevent abuse.

3) Then decide on what the Dishonor flag does to these Trolls.

Does anybody know what will happen to all Customized Guild Ranks that have specific Rights Assigned to them?

Will the Old Rights remain intact?

Will the New Rights be given out based on the level of Old Rights?

Will the New Guild Rights remain un-assigned until a player with an “Edit Ranks” permission properly assigns them?

Will the Guild’s membership have their Ranks reset to some default rank?

Hope ANet might shed some light on these questions.

Diku

Oh…I get it now.

Earlier…when I was looking at the picture…

I was thinking OP was trying to point out some hack or exploit advantage.

As it turns out…having more than 3 catapults setup to take an objective is not a normal occurrence for OP.

For me…when my Home World was in the Rank dog house…this was the only way to capture a heavily fortified objective…fast enough.

It’s rough being the lowest Rank World without troops.

5 People vs 50 People…

Our team of 5 having 5 Catapults to quickly take out a heavily fortified objective before the 50 people respond…is priceless.

Kudos to the 5 people who can build 5 Catapults in the above scenario without being found out and stomped on.

Bloodwort MacFangho.4638:

I believe the PPK doesn’t add to the tick (the points attributed to each 15 or w/e period). This is purely the current number of camps, towers and keeps + the castle if owned at any one moment. The ‘tick’ is whatever those points are at the turnover point (when the counter hits zero and the counter starts again). Any PPK (including sentries and yaks) is added directly to the score.

You’re correct.

I’m asking ANet to have the WvW Scoreboard modified to show:

Total WvW Points Earned

Then below this number…a breakdown for us to see:

Total PPK Earned

Total PPT Earned

Currently…they just show us Total WvW Points Earned

It would be nice to know how much points we earn by Per Kill:

Edit – Added a link to show the Current WvW Scoreboard here:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/File:WvW_Stats_and_Bonuses.jpg

Suggestion to ANet

New WvW Scoreboard for XYZ

Total WvW Score = 1,000
Per Kill = 300 / Per Tick = 700

Next Per Tick = 180

Junkpile.7439:

Doesn’t work. You get lot’s of point if you win pointless open fields fights. For example if some bad guild wanna have open field fight and lose every time. How we can force them stop this?

Think you’re misunderstanding the post.

This is referring to our current War Scoring defined here:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/World_versus_World

The Current WvW Score that’s Displayed in Game…only shows the Total of what has been already earned by Per Kill + Per Tick.

I’m asking that ANet show the already Earned Per Kill & Per Tick below the Total Score.

Hoping to suggest that ANet consider a New WvW Scoreboard that displays the Per Kill & Per Tick Points Earned below the Total Score.

Currently…only Total & Potential Points (next per tick) are displayed.

WvW Scoreboard for XYZ

Total WvW Score = 1,000
Per Kill = 300 / Per Tick = 700

Next Per Tick = 180

@MinerBob

Doing things that help your WvW Home World…and Doing it Solo…

I think we’re kindred WvW Solo spirits.

That is refreshing…

You’re a True WvW fan, but sadly…

Our Solo Roles will become meaningless, or impossible to do…if ANet decides that everything in WvW Requires 3 or more people to do anything.

We need to suck it up & group with 2 other players to do anything….or quit playing WvW.

p.s.
Yes…your upgrades often made it hard or made it impossible for me to do anything…

Balance…we’re old school balance…

For balance…

For every action…there should be an equal opposite re-action.

I’d like to encourage this…balance.

Also, WvW gaming should allow all types of player…from single to very large groups to do something to change the tide of battle.

Based on my observation…there are times when the following happens pretty consistently on WvW servers with low population servers:

1) Players don’t choose to form a 3-5 player havoc group.
2) Players don’t choose to form a zerg to save a fully upgraded structure.
3) Players don’t choose to form a 3-5 player group to take down anything.
4) Players leave WvW if no ktrain is running.

A single player flipping camps is fine because everybody can do it…that’s the balance. Also, flipping camps creates opportunities to draw out players to fight outside towers and keeps…instead of turtling inside.

The topic here is balance…Free & Automatic Up-grades and Supplies Increase…one way up…but no equal opposite reaction going down. Free & Automatic Down-grade and Supplies Decrease…

Free & automatic upgrades of objectives will happen with HoT.

To provide balance…

I’d like to suggest that Free & automatic downgrades of objectives should be also be implemented at the same time. Also, have Enemy Yaks Deplete Supplies in an Objective.

Enemy Owned Camps will spawn Yaks that Down-Grade objectives.

As a solo camp capper…this would allow me to continue to play WvW with purpose.

Under the new HoT being planned with Free & Automatic Upgrades without the opposite mechanic that provides balance…my solo camp capping has little impact to WvW…once an Objective is Fully Upgraded.

ANet…please consider implementing HoT with this map mechanic:

1) Auto-Down-Grades of Objectives by Enemy Owned Camps & Yaks.

2) Have Enemy Yaks depleting Supplies in an Objective.

Very good idea. Actually provides a way for hard core WvW players to get Ascended gear without having to go farm in PvE.

Only thing I would add to this suggestion is:

EotM Map implemented without WvW Rewards (i.e. Badges of Honor, WXP, WvW Achievements, Ascended Equipment, etc.)

That way the Badges of Honor really reward players that actually participate in WvW fighting…and not the Karma Trains that run through EotM.

Downside…can’t really determine which Current Badges of Honor were earned in WvW Borderlands/Eternal Battle Maps vs. EotM Map…so if this is done…EotM players will gain a huge bonus.

@Entashe

It’s not fun given current match-ups can have servers stuck fighting the same enemies for months…with no reprieve. Or, worlds that have lost their communities for some reason.

I blame the current map mechanic, but that’s a different topic from this one.

Given your situation…Server Loyalty Bonus Chest Rewards that I describe above would be nice.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Server-loyalty-1/first#post5496685

I agree with you…server imbalance is a huge problem with WvW.

Guesting should be free, but with a weekly limitation on the number of Enemy Worlds you can visit.

ANet can adjust this number to reduce or prevent un-fair matches, or during tournaments

I currently have another thread that terms this as Enemy-Guesting, but it’s implemented using a completely different map mechanic.

Edit – That being said…implementing Enemy-Guesting using our current map mechanic may have consequences that lead to trolling.

styx.7294:

Diku.2546:

Better Suggestion:

Server Loyalty Points:

Every 500 WvW Ranks earned unlocks a Unique WvW Bonus Chest Reward. Warning – Server Loyalty Points reset to Zero if account changes WvW World.

Rewards Edge of the Mist the most and people who zerg.

I don’t think WvW ranks were a good addition to the game.

Forgot to repost the following:

ANet should remove the ability of players to earn WvW Badges and Rank in EotM. Only permit players to earn WvW Badges and Rank in Borderlands & Eternal Battle Ground.

Better Suggestion:

Server Loyalty Points:

Every 500 WvW Ranks earned unlocks a Unique WvW Bonus Chest Reward. Warning – Server Loyalty Points reset to Zero if account changes WvW World.

@styx

Agree…you don’t get rich playing on lower tier servers.

ANet…it would be nice if you reward players that show stable behavior patterns…because this helps WvW Communities weather the storm when they collapse.

Suggestion:

ANet would need to keep track of the WvW Rank earned on each server for a player.

Earn 500 WvW Ranks on a server within a year you get a Server Loyalty Reward.

Earn 500 WvW Ranks consecutively in year 2, 3, etc…your Server Loyalty Reward goes up exponentially.

ANet should remove the ability of players to earn WvW Badges and Rank in EotM. Only permit players to earn WvW Badges and Rank in Borderlands & Eternal Battle Ground.

@styx

It would be nice to be rewarded when you stay on a dead server fighting & earning your WvW Ranks on this server for a year.

Most players wouldn’t stay on a dead server to level up their WvW Rank.

It’s not greed…because most normal players leave when faced with fighting on a dead WvW server.

If you’ve ever tried to increase your WvW Rank on a dead server…you’d understand.

Try doing it for a year…and it’s pure torture.

Having an annual reward sure would be nice.

Or, better yet…try staying on a WvW server that is constantly dominated by a T1 server when they drop to T2.

Diku.2546:

@OP

I get what you’re asking for. Reward the player that continues to fight for a World that has been abandoned by most others.

Server loyalty is not a joke to a few…it’s a choice some players do make.

I’ve been on my Home server since GW2 launched in August 2012 & continue to fight for my World. I know a few others on my server that have played just as long.

My World has never made Gold, but we’ve seen Silver…we’ve also been at rank 24 in the NA Match-ups, but have begun to climb back up again.

I’ve seen my WvW community in both happy & sad times…being loyal has been rough.

Before reading my suggestion below…keep in mind…I believe ANet should remove the ability of players to earn WvW Badges and Rank in EotM. Only permit players to earn WvW Badges and Rank in Borderlands & Eternal Battle Ground.

---

Why not make this an annual (account based – 365 days) reward based on the amount of WvW Badges you’ve earned for the year (maybe minimum 500)?

Also, could exponentially increase the annual reward for players that earn it consecutively for the same world..

Instead of WvW Badges earned…maybe use WvW Rank.

ANet would need to keep track of the WvW Rank earned on each server for a player.

Earn 500 WvW Ranks on a server within a year you get a Server Loyalty Reward.

Earn 500 WvW Ranks consecutively in year 2, 3, etc…your Server Loyalty Reward goes up exponentially.

ANet should remove the ability of players to earn WvW Badges and Rank in EotM. Only permit players to earn WvW Badges and Rank in Borderlands & Eternal Battle Ground.

@OP

I get what you’re asking for. Reward the player that continues to fight for a World that has been abandoned by most others.

Server loyalty is not a joke to a few…it’s a choice some players do make.

I’ve been on my Home server since GW2 launched in August 2012 & continue to fight for my World. I know a few others on my server that have played just as long.

My World has never made Gold, but we’ve seen Silver…we’ve also been at rank 24 in the NA Match-ups, but have begun to climb back up again.

I’ve seen my WvW community in both happy & sad times…being loyal has been rough.

Before reading my suggestion below…keep in mind…I believe ANet should remove the ability of players to earn WvW Badges and Rank in EotM. Only permit players to earn WvW Badges and Rank in Borderlands & Eternal Battle Ground.

Why not make this an annual (account based – 365 days) reward based on the amount of WvW Badges you’ve earned for the year (maybe minimum 500)?

Also, could exponentially increase the annual reward for players that earn it consecutively for the same world..

Please consider doing 2 things with Guild Claiming Upgrades and Standard Upgrades:

1) Implement a Despawn of All Upgrades on any Objective & have a Master Upgrade “Despawn Kill Switch” nearby showing a Decay Timer available for players to use at each Objective to Refresh the Upgrades.

Edit – Display Despawn Timer on Map …similar to Upgrade Timer.

2) Timer above the Tactivator Switch to show status for Use or Cooldown.

p.s.
Idea behind Despawn…if nobody goes into a Fully Upgraded Objective to refresh & Kill the Despawn…for a very long time…it should not remain Fully Upgraded…this is for Low Population WvW Servers to stand a chance to getting back their Home Objectives.

ANet should make playing WvW content required to un-lock PvE content.

Like a PvE Player needs to defend WvW objectives in order to un-lock a PvE based mission.

That way it would be fair trade.

PvE players should bite the bullet & take one for their PvE team & play WvW too…in order to satisfy this un-lock of Guild & Personal PvE missions.

p.s.
Of course this won’t happen…there’s a double standard here.

What’s the reason behind this New WvW Map Mechanic?

The answer can be found in the following WvW Vison below:

1) World based War…that’s why it’s called WvW.

There could easily be 3 Worlds to 1,000 Worlds at War.

New Worlds can easily join the War in the future.

Old Worlds can be retired from the War if its population can’t support it.

2) System that allows World Communities to grow or survive.

All Worlds should be able to increase their WvW Home Rank themselves, or through Players Creating Alliances with other Enemy Worlds by teaming up.

Low Ranked Worlds that have a low or declining population level are automatically protected & allowed to survive.

3) War between Worlds should typically have no borders, but should have limitations to reduce or prevent un-fair matches.

All Players/Guilds are given the ability to attack any World.

All Players/Guilds are given the ability to team up & play together with friends that have moved to other Enemy Worlds.

Map Mechanics will be in place that scales and can be adjusted to reduce or prevent un-fair matches.

PROPOSED NEW MAP MECHANIC

A) Require Players & Guilds to Choose 1 Home World Globe to represent.

B) Allow Players the Potential to Attack All Enemy World Globes & to Team-Up with Players from other Enemy World Globes. It’s possible for Players to create an In-Game Alliance with other “Friendly” Enemies to attack a 3rd Enemy’s World Globe.

C) Implement a WvW Home Globe Rank system based on weighted statistics.

Note: Players can pick a different Home World Globe from their Guild, but can only Claim Objectives if they share the same Home World Globe.

1) Core Map Mechanic

New Home World is contained in a Globe.

a) Home World is called a “Globe” and is made up of 4 maps (Green, Red, Blue, EBattle). Home Team is given WP advantage on all maps except in Eternal Battle

b) Geographic Theaters of War are setup to create player match-ups that are physically closer to each other for performance, but players can still visit any Geographic Theater of War

……….i) NA – North America – 24 Globes
……….ii) EU – Europe – 27 Globes
……….iii) AS – Asia – Planned
……….iv) AU – Australia – Planned

c) Players Enter All 4 Maps in their Home Globe as an Ally, and Enter All Maps in Other Enemy Globes as an Enemy-Guest

d) Enemy-Guest follows a “Guesting” limit of (1-3) Enemy Globes per week that a player can visit. ANet can adjust this number to reduce or prevent un-fair matches, or during tournaments

e) Top 3 Enemy Globes attacking a player’s Home Globe is diplayed in a Random fashion every time it’s viewed by the Home Team

f) EotM Map implemented without WvW Rewards (i.e. Badges of Honor, WXP, WvW Achievements, Ascended Equipment, etc.)

2) WvW Home Globe Rank based on Weekly Weighted Statistics listed below:

WvW Home Globe Rank is used as a reference point in giving out Weekly, Monthly, and Tournament Rewards.

a) Cumulative Kill & Tick Points earned from All Kills & Claimed Objectives on both Home & Enemy Globes

b) Home Globe’s Active WvW Players Total Count
c) Home Globe’s Outnumbered Buff for Server Total Time Count

d) Weekly X,Y,Z – Code the Map to allow a future variables not implemented

3) Advanced Map Mechanics & Triggers – Major Sub-Categories:

Advanced Map Mechanics & Triggers are used to create & maintain balance & harmony within the WvW Universe.

a) Players & Guilds
b) World Globe Rank & Scoring
c) Feedback & Reward System
d) Services
e) Anti-Trolling, Buffs, & Counter-Weights
f) Defense
g) Offense
h) Supply
i) Portals & Spawn Points
j) Events – PvE & WvW

If ANet uses my idea…any personal rewards would greatly be appreciated =)

See Expanded Advanced Map Mechanics & Triggers – Major Sub-Categories here:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Discuss-New-WvW-Map-Triggers-v1-0/first#post5538481

Updated & Posted a New thread:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Discuss-New-WvW-Map-Mechanic-v2-0/first#post5363989

@Dusty Moon & illenos

I get the server pride thing. I actually have that for my Home World.

Hmmm…I never stick my head out of the WvW maps too often. You’re probably correct about Platinum & Mithril players.

My Gold rank was based off my solo camp capping.

I’m glad the Developers got a chance to talk to you (Dusty Moon). It sounds like you play a lot of WvW.

I’d hate to come across you (illenos)…because my build is pure camp capper. I’d loose in PvP to you. My main reason for playing is to fight for my Home World. We need good PvP players that can often turn the tide against solo cappers like myself.

ANet needs to really change the base Map Mechanic on how Match Ups get done. The current Tier & 3 Worlds fighting will always be a huge Pigeon Hole that leads to stagnation.

ANet can still use the 4 WvW Maps as they are, but break out of the Tier System & allow players to “freely” choose who they want to fight against by changing the Base Map Mechanic.

Going to sound like a broken record…but here it goes again:

Using current NA Matchup & Alpine map as a reference.

There would be 24 Worlds. Each World would be assigned 4 Maps.

The 4 Maps would be setup for the following use:

Red Map – Player’s Home Base

Green Map – Open Enemy
Blue Map – Open Enemy
Eternal Battle – Open Enemy

Players can only Enter as an Ally if they choose any Map connected to their Home World Base.

Players Enter as an Enemy-Guest if they choose any Map that is NOT connected to their Home World Base.

Edit – Shameless plug to New WvW Map Mechanic thread:

Current:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Discuss-New-WvW-Map-Mechanic-v2-0/first#post5363989

Old:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Discuss-New-WvW-Map-Mechanic

Please consider changing the underlying Base Map Mechanic.

It’s critical to involve WvW players & get their input.

It should be very easy to find hard core WvW Players.

Hint- Typically players with VERY high WvW Ranks are hard core…

You’ll make having a High WvW Rank mean something…when lately it’s been feeling like it’s meaningless.

Current 3 Worlds Fighting each other in Tiers lead to Worlds being Pigeon Holed & stuck fighting each other.

Please See this suggested New WvW Map Mechanic thread for an alternative:

Current:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Discuss-New-WvW-Map-Mechanic-v2-0/first#post5363989

Old:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Discuss-New-WvW-Map-Mechanic/first#post5352335

Hehehe…WvW

A.D.A.M Mode vs. E.V.E Mode

Recent screen capture of our WvW Home BL.

This is before the proposed Automatic & Free Upgrades of Enemy Positions on a Player’s Home Map.

I had to blank out the Home World Map names for the shame. As a Veteran WvW…I failed to recapture things…even after 4 hours of Solo Capping our camps.

Bully Enemy World simply recaptured everything faster than its 2 Enemies could capture.

Be very afraid of the new Automatic & Free Upgrades for your Enemy in your Home BL.

Under Dog WvW communities will become extinct if ANet does nothing to create a Preserve.

Diku

p.s.
Anybody else a MegZone 23 fan?

WvW should have an Eve Mode when all failsafes are overwhelmed by your Enemy.

@WvW Community

Please keep this thread alive by Voting here.

ANet Developers…please make one change to the planned WvW Maps for HoT.

Disable Automatic & Free Upgrades to Enemy positions on a Player’s Home Borderland.

The plan for Automatic & Free Upgrades on the New WvW Maps will happen & in most cases are a positive change.

The Removal of Applied Fortitude & Stength will happen. I’ve already posted my suggestion in this thread & can only hope to be heard.

What is more important for WvW Players to shout disproval about is the Automatic & Free Upgrades to Enemy Positions on a Player’s Home Borderland. Allowing this to be implemented will have a long term negative impact that will erode Under Dog WvW Communities.

We’re already approaching a WvW wasteland with the current infrastructure. The Developers intention to bolster the WvW Ecosystem with Automatic & Free Upgrades has good intentions, but will backfire if they also implement it for Enemies in a Player’s Home Borderland.

We need to keep our request as simple as possible in the hopes it will be answered.

As a PUG Commander & Solo camp Capper for an Under Dog World…who fights daily in WvW to make a difference…don’t take away my reason to play WvW.

Please join me & Vote to Support that the Developers Disable Automatic & Free Upgrades to Enemy positions on a Player’s Home Borderland.

Don’t let this thread die…please stand with me in supporting this simple request.

Diku

@WvW Community

Once the hoopla over the new map content & mechanics wears out…what will remain?

What tactics will be used by new WvW players to win?

WvW will be waged on 4 Tri-Colored Maps…based on the preview recently published.

Upgrades will be Automatic & Free on all Maps.

Home BL gives an edge to Home Defenders of course.

We’re supposed to fight each other equally on all maps…so there shouldn’t be any map that gets dominated by one world.

The maps are engineered so that we should be in perpetual battle. That’s how balance will happen.

WvW will be a huge success.

Pop <—- Bubble Busted

Bully Worlds Dominate…that’s what makes WvW fun.

Holding lots of territory and earning lots of points is fun!

How do you get to Dominate other Worlds?

Simple…capture your Enemie’s Home World positions & Upgrade.

Bully Worlds maintain their Home World map by making their Enemies feed off each other’s territory for scraps…that’s the best case scenario that makes maintaining your Domination easy.

Yes…Bully Worlds have a huge interest in keeping their Enemies divided.

Under Dog Worlds can look forward to weekly beat down until Home World Domination occurs.

Automatic & Free Upgrades of Enemy positions on your Home World Map will only encourage Domination.

Cheers!
Diku

p.s.
Just a reminder…all Tiers have an Under Dog World…it’s the 3rd rank World of that Tier. Trying to nuture a WvW community dries up when your Home World is constantly dominated. Anybody else feel the same?

Dawdler.8521:

Diku.2546:

@Dawdler

I think most WvW Veterns (Rank 1000+) will agree to the following:

1) Like seeing the Home World map all painted in favor for the Home Team.

2) Like the camaraderie of sharing victories with other Home World citizens.

3) Earning useful WvW based attributes (Applied Fortitude & Strength) that shows your commitment to WvW.

I don’t particularly like PvP, but will do it for the above reasons.

It’s great that the work to upgrade keeps are done Automatically & Free, but the Developers need to careful not to implement a system that will negatively impact the WvW dynamics…which I feel this upcoming Automatic & Free Upgrades to ALL objectives will do.

I agree with you…they may destroy the things that makes WvW great if they are not careful.

Diku

Why do you even bring up WvW ranks?

WvW veterans would agree to the fact that there was a time when there where no ranks and there where no masteries. Applied fortitude and strength didnt exist and the game wasnt worse off for that. In fact, WvW worked just fine even before the masteries. Hell, siege didnt do insane damage due to the +lolwtfpercentage increase to damage that masteries caused so I would even argue that the game was better when there where no WvW ranks!

I dont disagree with you on the fact that Anet should be more careful with implementations and take them by players first, testing fully so we dont have another situation like with… uhm… masteries and WvW ranks… that caused severe player/siege imbalance.

@Dawdler

I have to disagree with you about Ranks.

The WvW abilities can only be used in the WvW Universe.

Ranks are a visible way to show your “Jedi Knight” level…short of taking out your WvW Light Saber.

I wished that Masteries were un-locked by your WvW Rank…instead of by letting players choose.

Luke Skywalker didn’t become a Jedi Knight overnight.

It took Luke a long time to develop his Jedi Knight powers…Yoda was a Jedi Knight Master for a reason.

WvW should have used Ranks in this fashion.

As it stands…WvW players get less rewards for playing WvW than does a PvE player doing PvE based things.

All noobs can get Jedi Knight powers (Applied Fortitude & Strength) if that’s all they purchase with their skill points…

Of course noobs will ignore the other skills that would help Supply & Seige Objectives in WvW. Leave that to the other WvW veterans to do right?

I wouldn’t consider Masteries as an causing imbalance…

It’s the WvW noobs choice to do so…but why blame them? The system allows them to.

The Masteries should be un-locked based on your WvW Rank.

Supply Master & Flame Ram ===> WvW Noobs Rank 100

Applied Fortitude & Strength ===> WvW Veterans Rank 1000+

Diku

p.s.
There is no WvW Light Saber to show off…

So what do WvW Veterans have that reward them for playing over a PvE Player?

Mastery skills make it worth while in my opinion…if you continue to play WvW…long & hard…by earning those Ranks.

@TheGrimm

ANet will deploy the Free Automatic Upgrades that’s a given.

They’ve already invested a lot of resources to “improve” the WvW Ecosystem.

I can only hope that at the minimum…they will Choose to Disable the Free Automatic Upgrades for Enemies on a Player’s Home World.

If they choose to ignore this plea…WvW will turn into a Bully Wonderland…where I predict the following general trends will happen.

1) Less WvW noobs get motivated to play for Under Dog Worlds.
2) More WvW veterans move to Bully Worlds that Win.

3) Players that can’t afford to move to a Bully World…give up & play PvE…or quit Guild Wars 2 altogether.

4) Small Group of Elite WvW servers will emerge & constantly Dominate the WvW game.

Keep in mind some Home World’s population do not like to WvW.

Trying to nurture WvW players from these populations can be extremely difficult.

Diku

p.s.
I’ve earned tons of badges, but I’d be cautious on spending them. It took me a long time & a lot of effort to get…so I hope ANet can come up with something that will reward me appropriately.

p.p.s.
I Do Support Free Automatic Upgrades for a Player on a Player’s Home map.

I Do Not Support Free Automatic Upgrades for an Enemy on a Player’s Home map.

@Myself

Just had an epiphany!

Wonder if WvW map structure could be re-engineered to do the following:

1) Allow WvW Players to pick any Home World map to enter.

NA (24) or EU (27) Home World Maps.

2) All WvW Home World Maps are setup to allow 2 entry points.

Home team & Any WvW Invader.

3) Enable Home Team Free Automatic Upgrades.

4) Disable Enemy Free Automatic Upgrades on a Player’s Home map.

Imagine being able to play any of the 51 Home World maps. This would be like the GvG maps from Guild Wars 1, but on a World Wide Scale!

What do you think WvW Jedi Knights…I mean Veterans?

Diku

@Insanemaniac

Misery loves company…so let me buy you a beer or whatever other poison that you prefer & let’s cry over EotM together.

Diku

@Insanemaniac

Hehehe…isn’t that why they invented EotM to fix the long queues problem?

Sorry to poke fun at this…you actually sound like a long term WvW veteran with your comment to drop to a lower Tier to join your Brothers & Sisters in Arms.

I hear you…and agree with you about WvW is about being able to play with friends.

Which my thing about “Colors” mean a great deal.

In the Military…they have a special ceremony to raise or case the “Colors”.

The “Colors” represent very deep connections.

Why shouldn’t WvW share some of these emotions when it comes to “Colors”?

Diku

p.s.
Still don’t want a Home World that’s engineered to be Tri-Color like EB…still believe it’s all mine…my precious.

@Synosius

An easier way to implement Home World advantage that I really believe will encourage the Home Defenders to fight even if the rest of the World is burning…

(Cover ears)

Leave All Enemy positions paper in a Player’s Home map. Only allow the Home Team to Upgrade positions in their own map.

(Let the cries of dismay of Karma Trains din loudly)

I fear the Free Automatic Upgrades of Enemy poistions on everyone’s Home World map will only encourage Home World map domination…which will kill each World’s incentive to fight back once they’re stuck into Home World Domination.

@Insanemaniac

Hmmm…I just prefer seeing my Home World map all 1 color. I just feel that being able to own your whole Home map is one of the biggest rewards to why I play WvW. The new maps from design will make all 4 maps Tri-Color.

If I wanted to play on a Tri-Color map…I went to EB.

But now…I have no choice…all 4 maps will be engineered to be Tri-Color.

To each his own…but you’ll get that in the upcoming new maps. So you’re lucky.

We wants it, we needs it. Must have the precious one color. They stole it from us. Sneaky little WvW enemies. Wicked, tricksy, false!

Diku

@Paavotar

Ok…so you prefer all maps to be Tri-Colored. You’re wish will probably be granted in the upcoming new maps.

I prefer seeing my Home Map fly one Color.

Didn’t matter what Color the other maps turned into when things got bad, but it felt comforting when the Home Map was flying our Team’s Color.

“Colors” mean something to me. “Raising the Colors” in my opinion was one reason that kept me fighting past the time when other defenders gave up in our Home World Borderland.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raising_the_Flag_on_Iwo_Jima

Now…the new maps will encourage that we all share the 4 maps equally.

The Automatic & Free Upgrades are good to implement on all Maps Except for Enemies in a Player’s Home World.

If a Player’s Home Team is unable to field adquate defense…would you agree that they typically can’t field an effective offense?

It’s going to be a nightmare to re-capture your own Home World once all positions become Fully Upgraded in favor of either or both your Enemies…if your Home Team doesn’t defend & later recapture quickly.

All Worlds will quickly field resources to re-capture their Home World right?

I never go to EotM. I prefer defending my Home World map, or fighting in the Enemy’s map so they don’t attack my Home World map.

As a Solo Camp Capper…I will testify that the Success or Failure of trying to capture a Fully Upgraded will hinge upon having this.

Most noob WvW player are not ready to do Solo Camp Capping in my opinion.

It’s definately a helpful perk to have when Solo Capping Fully Upgraded Camps in my opinion.

Why not make these 2 perks unlock only after you’ve reached WvW Rank 1000+ so noob WvW can focus on the other WvW Abilities.

In fact…why not make all WvW Abilities unlock in a certain order…based on your WvW Rank?

Make all noob WvW get Supply Master & Flame Ram 1st.

If we alienate a noob WvW player by not giving them certain things first…that’s just how it is…Luke Skywalker wasn’t allowed to access the skills of a Jedi Knight overnight. Yoda was the master for a reason.

If anything…make ALL the WvW Abilities only work in our WvW Universe…

Oh wait…they already do that…

WvW Abilities are our Jedi Knight skills!

Stop taking stuff away from the hard core WvW player that make us happy.

Diku

@Lunacy Solacio

Awww…you’re right.

But I still don’t like jumping around & running on platforms where you can fall off.

There’s lots of other areas that make you do that already…and I don’t play them because they’re like that…namely Fractals of the Mist.

Diku

@Aeolus

Oh wow…I remember these maps. Also, don’t forget we could hang out on these maps as our Guild Hall.

Chuckles

Thank you for the memories.

Diku

@Atheria

I don’t like the jump pads and floating platforms either.

I’ll just pretend it’s the reverse of the shortcut path that I do when jumping down the cliff side near the NW & NE towers to get to the roads that leads to the W & E Keeps.

I’m not looking forward to falling off floating platforms as I’m trying to defend.

I totally understand about the jumping part…and yes…I also feel like the hardcore WvW player is left behind when it comes to getting what we want. We’re given things that PvE players want…a world of instant gratification & reward.

When the karma train ends…everybody leaves. When things are going to hell…only the hard core WvW players will continue to stand and fight against overwhelming odds.

Oh well…I just hope Under Dog Worlds don’t end up being constantly Dominated by the Free Automatic Upgrades to Enemy Position in their Home World.

@Paavotar

You’re joking that you like seeing your Alpine Home World map painted in 3 colors right?

Last I checked…most WvW players prefer seeing their Home World map fully dominated by their Team.

If they can…most WvW players would prefer seeing all 4 maps painted their Team Color.

In fact…when it does happen…they take screen caps and joyfully run around singing.

Hmmm…about Applied Fortitude & Strength…it’s a perk for hardcore WvW players…in my opinion.

If you compared 2 player…one that played Pure PvE vs Pure WvW.

Which player would be richer (Gold, Equipment, Materials)?

WvW players don’t have as much to show for playing as do PvE players in my opinion…so throw us a bone ok?

Hmmm…I’ve been a scout and solo camp capper.

I agree…it’s going to be nice that my camps get Automaticaly Upgraded for Free.

The work of a scout that caps camps & upgrades them with nobody helping can be thankless at times.

The Free Automatic Upgrades are a great idea.

Just Don’t Enable Free Automatic Upgrades for Enemies in a player’s Home World Map.

Hmmm…about masteries…once again…it’s a perk for hardcore WvW players…in my opinion.

Also…I believe these masteries provide an aspect that makes WvW unique.

WvW noobs soon learn how to use these perks by their WvW “Elders”…who hopefully will take them under their wings…which help people share & bond through a system that encourages seniority & chain of command…which should ultimately be building a sense of WvW community.

Come on…Luke Skywalker had Yoda…what’s not to love about masteries?

@Sich

Yes! Somebody understands…I think we’re going to end up with 4 EB style maps.

Currently…each Border Land map belongs to each World. This is the reason why most WvW players like seeing their Home World map painted with their Team color.

If you want to see a Tri-Color map…I’d encourage players to visit the EB map.

In the new map…they will all be Tri-Color map it seems.

I’m really gonna miss this aspect of the Alpine map.

Diku

@Dawdler

I think most WvW Veterns (Rank 1000+) will agree to the following:

1) Like seeing the Home World map all painted in favor for the Home Team.

2) Like the camaraderie of sharing victories with other Home World citizens.

3) Earning useful WvW based attributes (Applied Fortitude & Strength) that shows your commitment to WvW.

I don’t particularly like PvP, but will do it for the above reasons.

It’s great that the work to upgrade keeps are done Automatically & Free, but the Developers need to careful not to implement a system that will negatively impact the WvW dynamics…which I feel this upcoming Automatic & Free Upgrades to ALL objectives will do.

I agree with you…they may destroy the things that makes WvW great if they are not careful.

Diku

Paavotar.3971:

Diku.2546:

To the other long time WvW players who don’t think it’s useful…nobody is forcing you to use your precious WvW skill points to get it. Get the skills that you like.

I don’t think anyone have said its not useful. A lot of people said it’s mandatory skill and that’s why it’s such an awkward trait. And the fact that you had to kill guards to get it made it even more awkward, because how hard it was for defenders to get stacks and how easy it was for attackers to get them.

I’m mostly a roamer, group and solo, and am really glad we are getting rid of this trait as it was rather stupid from the start.

I have to disagree with your opinion.

I personally solo camp cap & rely on this trait.

The advantage might be small in your opinion, but as a solo camp capper…it sometimes can be the difference between success or failure.

Not all WvW worlds have 2 man teams or karma trains to help them re-cap Fully Upgraded camps in defense of their Border Land map.

This trait is a blessing for solo camp cappers that are trying to defend their Home World by re-capping camps…

Why would that be a stupid thing for defenders?

Diku

Reading the below should make many WvW veterans pause and wonder.

Eredon Terrace Empty
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/Eredon-Terrace-Empty

WvW is typically on the decline in the long term…in my opinion.

The fix that makes sense is to develop long term WvW communities.

Would having Rank Tier movement stagnate be the compromise in trying to develop a more stable & long term WvW community be acceptable?

Let’s face it…most hardcore WvW players play for the camaraderie…that’s the highest form of reward that comes from WvW.

Diku

p.s.
Hope ANet doesn’t cater to the PvE players that are motivated by other things that encourages instant gratification & does nothing to encourage folks to play once they are rewarded.

p.p.s.
In case you’re wondering…

Eredon Terrace

Currently is Tier 8 Rank 3.

Verified just now.

Lunacy Solacio.6514:

Diku.2546:

snip

Sorry Tier 8 Rank 3 World. You’ll have to stay Dominated.

Under Dog Players there…please move to a Winning World.

Diku

-_-

that isn’t a solution either, things like that have lead to our WvW situation. So many things should have been done 2 years ago to discourage the severe server stacking we have now. At this point, there’s nothing that can be done except the very thing many of us didn’t want… dissolving servers. Except idc if they do anymore because my server community was smacked around badly in recent moves and I can’t really recognize it since it’s being undermined and others don’t even realize it is happening.

The whole system is based on a Bully structure. We can’t get around that.

Somebody is going to end up on the bottom.

The trick that ANet is trying to figure out is:

How do you keep the majority of folks happy in the pecking order where they exist.

I’d like to emphasize Majority…because Nobody wants to be at the bottom.

I’ve been in the bottom (Tier 8 Rank 3.)…and it’s not fun.

Hmm…I might be condemning myself to this very sad existence…now that I think of it.

Diku

selan.8354:

Seems like they do listen to us.

Anet: what would you guys like to see?
Players: Less pve!
Anet: ok more pve, coming!

hahaha so true. we even gave them a detailed list of things that were wrong with eotm and things that could improve it..

oh and also
spvp community: we hate skyhammer
anet:ok lets put skyhammer elements into wvw map for hot

Chuckles…I agree with you.

I think the below screen caps you gave earlier…they’re gates into objectives.

These aren’t jumping puzzles though…they’re short cut routes in the new map.

@Myself

I guess I’ll stick with my original post for now.

Upgrades are Automatic & Free ===> Player’s Home World

Upgrades are Manual & Cost Gold ===> Eternal Battlegrounds

Upgrades are Manual & Cost Gold ===> Player’s Enemy Home Worlds

The logic & reason still holds true.

Cheers!
Diku

After thinking about it.

Here’s the scenario that Under Dog Worlds will eventually face.

Stronger Enemies capture an Under Dog Home map.
Positions get Automatically Upgraded for Free.

Stronger Enemies now Defend Positions in Under Dog map.
Under Dog World Community at some point will throw in the towel & give up fighting.

Now remaining 2 Enemies will fight over Under Dog World map.

When it gets bad enough…Under Dog World will drop in Tier Rank & become the Stronger Enemy.

As a WvW player I sometimes look forward to moving down in Tier for this reason.

However, the Tier 8 Rank 3 World will live in perpetual Home World Domination with this Free & Automated Upgrade system.

Oh wait…this Under Dog World will have 1 day of glory…Weekly Reset…before being thrown back down into Domination.

Automatic Upgrades done for Free still will definately impact our fragile WvW ecosystem.

My original post that encourages a mixed approach has a flaw:

Upgrades are Automatic & Free ===> Player’s Home World

Upgrades are Manual & Cost Gold ===> Eternal Battlegrounds

Upgrades are Manual & Cost Gold ===> Player’s Enemy Home Worlds

In the above example. Stronger Enemies will use the saved Cost of Upgrading their Home World and apply it directly into Expanding their Territory into the easiest place to claim…which would be the Under Dog Home World.

Vicious cycle. Moving Up or Down in Tiers depends on breaking the morale of your Enemies.

Free Automatic Upgrades will further contribute in making WvW into a Bully based system. You beat down your Enemy until they give up.

Only difference is that it’s going to be Automatic & Free for the Bullies.

I’d like to revise my original post to say:

Upgrades are Automatic & Free ===> Player’s Home World

Upgrades are Manual & Cost Gold ===> Eternal Battlegrounds

Upgrades are Not Enabled ===> Player’s Enemy Home Worlds

Side effect…Karma Trains will be encouraged…

However, Under Dog Worlds can be guaranteed some relief on being able to recapture their Home World if they don’t give up & continue to fight.

Side effect…Tiers may stagnate with no upward or downward movement…

Argh!!!

Sorry Tier 8 Rank 3 World. You’ll have to stay Dominated.

Under Dog Players there…please move to a Winning World.

Diku

selan.8354:

Diku.2546:

Hi everybody,

p.s.
Also, noticed that there’s going to be PvE style event that occurs every 3 hours. Winner gets a weapon that will attack your stronghold to help breach gates. Glad they didn’t say it would give a Tequatl style Chest. Imagine all the PvE players coming in every 3 hours just for this.

omg that will destroy wvw for good. a stupid chest a stupid pve mob for pve players to do something npc like which is pve. this is terrible and a stupid idea sorry anet but we dont want your pve karma trains in wvw. we wanna fight server vs server not server vs stupid ai npc pve mobs we dont want it we dont need it it has to go! we got stupid eotm for your pve crowd we dont want pve scrubs in wvw. this will push the entire wvw community away. we dont need npcs we dont want pve in wvw, we told u this for years! how long is anet going to ignore the fact that a true wvw player doesnt need shrines nor npc traps nore pve mobs!

They’re not putting in Chests. I was just glad they didn’t say it.

Agree on EotM not geared to WvW fans…I’m a hard core WvW player that plays daily, but I never play in EotM.

I felt it was a lure for PvE players to join the WvW maps.

Agree with the OP. Please don’t take this away.

As a long time WvW player…this is one of the Perks that I felt was a reward for playing WvW.

The only WvW Mastery that I don’t have is Burning Oil.

To the other long time WvW players who don’t think it’s useful…nobody is forcing you to use your precious WvW skill points to get it. Get the skills that you like.

Make it a buff that only works in the WvW map.

I’d still be happy with that, but I’m guessing that the Developers are taking it away because other parts of the map will give you a Buff.

I use the buff to capture enemy Upgraded Camps…so I hope the Developers have plans to put the same buff on camps for me to solo cap…if we capture a shrine or something.

Hi everybody,

Been reading a thread about the New WP system that will also be introduced with the Automated & Free Upgrades.

New waypoint system
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/New-waypoint-system

The Borderland maps are completely different as seen in:

Ready Up: Episode 30
http://www.twitch.tv/guildwars2/b/642258148

Have to wait & see how this New WP system will also impact the flow of battle.

Just hoping it doesn’t make Home World Domination easier. All Under Dog Worlds in all the Tiers will suffer.

In a boxing match…the referee temporarily stops the fight if a fighter is knocked down to the canvas.

Anet needs to be the referee to allow a Player’s WvW Home World to recover from being Automatically Dominated by Enemy Worlds.

What do you think?

Diku

p.s.
Also, noticed that there’s going to be PvE style event that occurs every 3 hours. Winner gets a weapon that will attack your stronghold to help breach gates. Glad they didn’t say it would give a Tequatl style Chest. Imagine all the PvE players coming in every 3 hours just for this.