Guild Wars 2

I want to take those 2 minutes, to give my thanks for Evan dedication.

He work hard on bug.

He read and answer on the forum more than the community manager (well in pvp section at least).

He is not just that guy doing programming work, he is our only “link” with Anet.

With all the QQ the Match-making did make.
All the drama about the balances.

All the bad decisions Anet did take, he is still there answering around.

Please Evan, take some breaks. We need you for the next 4 years.

Dal

Trigr.6481:

Josh Davis.6015:

Hey folks,

Just a quick reminder: the PvP team is not responsible for profession balance. The PvP team, along with all of the other major feature teams, provides feedback to the skills team, but the PvP team itself is not directly involved in making balance changes.

-Grouch

Even though grouch isn’t to blame, he essentially just told you the problem regardless if you’ve realized it or not. Since PvP is not being balanced separate from the rest of the game, the most “balance” you’re going to get is from a team who’s main concern is not SPvP. There’s a reason why every major balance patch there’s an amulet gone and a new one taking it’s place, because that’s the only thing other than runes and sigils that the PvP team in particular has complete control over, it’s just the only thing they have to change that won’t effect the rest of the game. So of course that’s the only action they can take, however that doesn’t mean it’s the right move, just a desperate one.

Until this changes the overall player population will suffer, pro league will continue to suffer in both team participation, team quality, and so on. Primarily fueled by players who are not even in it for the competitive aspect or even enjoying the game as a whole, but to siphon off whatever money is left in a dying community, it’s sad really.

Countless

I am sorry Countless but you got the smoked screen.

In negotiation or politics, the tactics to say “We are not responsible” really means, we are responsible for being powerless.

And they are not powerless.

They did removed Cleric without giving alternative to the support playstyle.

Support need a way to beat some cleave to REZ and stomp properly.

Now… to make some PR damage mitigation, they say they are not responsible… but they ARE.

They removed an amulet that was for 4 years important for a class archetype of our game mode. The support bunker. They did this without giving a Templar rune or something with less toughness on it.

The worse is Cleric Amulet is just fine, since Tempest got nerfed across the board, it could be correct to let Cleric live.

Here is the key word of the Powerful PVP team:
“For this release, we wanted to take support down a notch and increase the pace of combat.”

Well.. a notch would had been to give us a 4 stats amulet with toughness and healing power with perhaps less damage.

But no…. it’s not a notch. The PVP team clearly want to delete ROCK.

Mender is bad. People like how it feels, but when META will settle… no one will play squishie support over squishie dps or bruisers condies.

tl;dr – The not responsible is a smoked screen that means they are powerless.

They are responsible for the removal of the amulet. The nerf on Tempest were enough.

Removing the amulet without giving another one to take down support a notch, is removing support as a whole on the meta.

Last year, we had discussed about the PVP offering of Gw2 compared to what is happening on the MOBA scene:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/sPvP-needs-its-own-business-model/first

Now that those games are out, we see the MOBA scene growing stronger than ever.

It’s still time to keep Gw2 as it is (and not deleting features in it, plz plz plz) and offering a new game based on SPVP (simply cut all pve and wvw out of it, to have a small download, so f2p try it without wasting 60gig of download).

It should be easy enough to make a SPVP only downloadable game with specialization rotation and a means to buy those specialization at high GEM cost.

That way SPVP players could contribute to GEM store like the others with clear incentives.

Both model work, make them work together.

Put that game linkable with Gw2 game buyers optional. So, the Buy 2 Win crowd would still be happy to get their same old model, while the f2p pvp players could cater with mind like players into a fair competitive model.

Without a PVP only offering, Gw2 can’t compete in the sPvP scene like the MOBA do.

And when I say compete, I don’t talk about 10 000 spvp players.

I think about the 100 millions potential customer.

No, it’s not buy to play.

It’s buy to win.

Buy to play would imply that Specialization are side-grade of core spec. Colin said hundred of time they plan to side-grade.

Actually, we all have been lied to buy something.

It’s cleary an upgrade.

So, it’s not buy to play. It’s Buy to Win. So plz everyone, use B2W in regard to that topic.

Celtus.8456:

Give players 3000 stat points (the total number on most amulets) to spend as we see fit. And add a soft-cap if needed (like 1200 or 1500 max spent on any one stat). Or bring in PvE gear to PvP. Either way will give us more diversity and I’ll bet balance won’t really be worse.

This would help the casual crowd get bigger. The “replayability” would sky rocket. People don’t like to play the same thing over and over, except those one that want to win money. (minority of players).

We would still had META build, but it would be possible for players to choose stats/builds to counter META again.

Quickness rez was removed… too hard to cap a point, because your guyz were always up and running again. Same for Runes of Mercy.

Let’s see the new rez that is better than quickness rez:

“Search and Rescue!”
45 Recharge time

Your pet teleports a downed ally within range to you and begins reviving them. Grant regeneration to nearby allies.

Gain health every second; stacks duration. Regeneration (8s): 1040 health
Radius.png Radius: 1,200

With this rez, you removed the downed body from cleave and stomp. On Legacy of Foefire, you can place two pew pew druids on ledges to rez your DPS…

Meaning, that now Runes of mercy or Quickness rez that was great to rez people is banned from sPVP but search and rescue is faster rez than a quickness rez. The pet rez, the ranger rez, the regens helps…. it is at a safe place.

It seems bug, the 1200 range is from pet and not the caster, so you can send your pet on mid, while you are on home or far and rez mid players.

We will get a patch… I hope they adjust this before pro league, I want anet to either upgrade the cooldown of the shout because of that trait: “Beastmastery Resounding Timbre — Shouts apply regeneration and swiftness to allies. Reduces recharge on shouts.”

More the rez trait of ranger don’t have any Internal cooldown:

Allies’ Aid
“When you begin reviving an ally, you use search and rescue on them. Increase revive speed.

Radius.png Effectiveness Increased: 10%"
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Allies%27_Aid

Please for “healthy” game play, find a way to limit the BEST REZ of this game since lunch. Jesus like rezzing is too much.

And if you don’t please balance other support classes or builds with similair trait with similar cooldown (0 CD on the trait, remember?).

Thank you,
Dal

Mysticjedi.6053:

This season, in my mind, is done. I say experiment now so season 2 can be great.

Lol… do you remember the first test season in December 2014?

The Second test season of spring 2015?

This is their Third try.

And it suck.

People ask for a public test server to have real BETA process before going gold.

Not sure that the Fourth try will get better.

Anet don’t have proper balanced matrix for their classes and stats. They don’t have proper balanced matrix for their match making. They really need to get a real Mathematician and stop trying to improvise gaming system.

Math is GOD in game system. Good Math is golden, bad math bring you down.

It could be great to have all the complains at the right place.

So all stuff that players QQ about should be at the same place.

This would help to get all other forum in a positive, constructive place.

If you like this, +1 it.

Since you are working to get a SKILL based RANKING system, please +1 this petition.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Skill-based-or-Grind-based-rank-system/first#post6032785

I did quote your idea on this thread, to make sure your idea would be read in that petition.

Thank you,

Blue Hare.8612:

I like moba games and started playing GW2 sPvP when the game became F2P. I also found the PvE part enjoyable and bought HOT so I would say that sPvP does make money for anet and they maybe could uset it to draw more ppl to the game.

…

And I like how ppl agree that sPvP is pretty much a moba and that anet should embrace this more.

Thank you Blue Hare. Your testimony is important to let MMORPG players know the truth… MOBA is 10x stronger than MMORPG and it’s still growing.

http://www.geek.com/games/the-10-most-streamed-video-games-1646668/

7 Dayz of streams:

Here are the top 10 streamed games from February 1 to 7:

League of Legends (22,703,372 hours watched)
Dota 2 (9,688,853 hours)
Hearthstone: Heroes of Warcraft (8,813,318 hours)
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive (8,437,020 hours)
Call of Duty: Black Ops III (5,262,717 hours)
XCOM2 (2,777,702 hours)
Minecraft (2,238,235 hours)
Gaming Talk Shows* (1,962,004 hours)
H1Z1 (1,766,414 hours)
World of Warcraft (1,636,759 hours)

27 MILLIONS of HOURS in a week of streaming for LOL. more than x10 the hours of WoW the most successful MMORPG of all time.

Twitch is giving so much money to those streamers… why not for Gw2???

http://riot-web-static.s3.amazonaws.com/images/news/November_2011/2011_11_17_lol_numbers/riot_lol_infographic_full.jpg

5 YEARS AGO.

http://www.riotgames.com/articles/20140711/1322/league-players-reach-new-heights-2014

2 YEARS Akitten

, so now… let’s make US like we ARE. LOOSERS with TOXIC attitude…

Gw2 is not a MOBA. We can’t have those numbers with balanced patch and stuff… bla bla bla all the kitten around.

Selling The Hearth of The Mist on the MOBA market for F2P with same kind of business model of LOL, even if it failed… can bring more than thousands of competitive players to SPVP.

This can snowball the twicth users… from not even 5k to something like 100k per week? This is not even 5% of LOL streaming numbers.

Let say we have 10k more competitive players… do you still think that Gw2 sPvP is dying? This would be 10x the numbers of competitive players we got selling sPVP like a MMORPG.

Even a failed attempt (having less than 5% of the MOBA market) would a 10x better success than what we got actually.

We have the combat system. We have the competitive scene. We have a great game that need to get MARKET like a MOBA (spvp is a MOBA game) to get successful.

SPVP is not a part time, mini games for the MMORPG crowd. SPVP should be the entry for MOBA players to become MMORPG players… bringing x10 numbers than what we have so far.

Dal

Almost 10k games put into sPVP.

Wow, let’s play a team based ranked games without giving a team a shot.

@confused

Ninski.5680:

Is there any reward for playing in S4? I have the wings and I’m not seeing a title in the achievement section and have 210 pvp tickets rotting.

The reward is the satisfaction of winning games when you must carries bad players wins.

As a spvp veteran, with around 6k games with Guardian… I can say that the staff range is breaking it for me.

I had a homebrew DH Bunker, I did place in the plat range (barely) with the build. I am an olschool bunker guard and my build was kinda effective in the right situations.

With the new patch, the staff range is breaking my build for good. My build don’t do enough damage in 1v1 except versus perhaps, bad players or squishie dps (sustaining long fight). The range with aoe cone was the biggest part of my damage (except mace 3 and smite conditions…).

Now, I will play something else than guardian, in hope we get the range back.

I agree and +1 with OP.

The only nerf need to get DH inline:

1- Heal trap (other trap should have cast time too, they did this to scrapper gyro, why not DH OP traps?) should have a cast time to get interrupted like all other classes.

2- Cooldown should start when the trap is triggered, not when it’s put on floor… because that give 2x traps when a DH hold a point.

Please nerf cleave.

Tempest, Scrapper, DH, Reaper, Thief or Revenant can kill one rezzer alone. So cleave is definitely op. Kappa.

It’s fantastic how people want the game to be balanced, but always forgot to nerf the “counterpart” of something.

If you nerf rezz, you need to nerf cleaves.

I completely agree.

SoloQ don’t play the same as TeamQ. Since the change, spvp guild are dying unless for the elite one that exist solely to find a duoq partner in the platinum range.

The spvp community growing come from TeamQ with competitive rewards and AG style tournament that Anet stop sponsoring.

When they introduce Temple of the Silent Storm (Febuary or March 2013???).

The balance of the CORE classes was great.

A lot of people where trying different build and was somewhat viable.

Queue time reduced a lot, because they got rid of the auto-tourney feature to make only spam 1 game and not 3 games in a row.

The reward system was better, way more interesting to CRAFT skins than opening endless bag of bags that only give pve stuff with skins you already have.

With runes setup that could be chose like you want, (ie. 2x monk, 2x sanctuary, 2x …) you could stack some nice effect over different kind of build. (boon duration in that case on a DPS guard with symbols, it was a blast to play)

With Jewels that give you some edge to make more fine-tuning of your attributes.

With trait lines that gave attributes points…

We had choices and choices and many more choice that I didn’t write in, for great build diversity and HEALTHY gameplay.

It was before Celestial was OP.

Chokolata.1870:

Wow, seriously? Are you being serious right now? Really?

I am main bunker support since 2012. I hve 9k games over 7 classes. I played all viable support build.

I want that all classes got their viable support build. If one got OP versus the others we go back to the cheeze mesmer/rev quickness rez part. It’s clear anet tried to fix the problem, but with search and rescue changes, they simply move the problem from mesmer (that is in broken state right now) to druids.

Stacking two druids is enough to replace 2 bunker mesmer, 2 quickness/infuse light rev comp.

If it’s the plan, at least give a viable rez option to all classes to get rez support somewhat balanced.

So, yes I am serious… and if they don’t do nothing about it, the pvp forum will get flood by all the crap the last meta bring… the QQ will not be about mesmer, but druids.

Do you really want to get a broken druids build because of the search and rescue change? You know… when they nerf, they overnerfed all viable spec of a class.

Razor.9872:

runeblade.7514:

Dominik.5162:

Phaeton.9582:

inb4 endless semantics about if it’s B2P or P2W

Oh wait too late sorry

It’s silly to put spvp behind a paywall. It’s a bad idea commercially and narrows the gameplay.. I’ve written several threads on this and won’t be repeating myself here.

But just leaving something here to register your arguments for a paywall as invalid.

You’re welcome.

Why do PvP players deserve to play this game for free, while PvE and WvW need to pay for it to play it?
That’s absolutely ridiculous, either all pay or none, period.
Players who bought HoT play the most recent version of the game, the game will obviously be balanced around them, and not around the F2P players who think it is in their right to leech of off others who bought the game.

Then the solution is simple, HoT and free players should be split away from each other.

I hope free players don’t experience horrendous queue times and get a bad impression on game population.

It would be the other way around, many spvp vets would pay 100$ to go back vanilla pre-june 2015 patch.

So, serious spvp players would go F2P and play vanilla.

It’s like Stronhold. People would go where fun matters. HoT OP bunker skills/traits are bad for spvp design. Removing amulet, didn’t solved the problem.

“Pre 6/23/2015, GW2 had finally reached an acceptable level of balance in player vs. player. "

All classes had 2 or 3 viable builds with different role into it.

They said we will change traits and attributes on traits line to improve more viable build.

The result: Most viable build got wrekt. Each class got only 1 viable build, no more of 2 or 3 differents one.

Warrior: Pre patch – Shoutbow, Hambow, Banner Regen – summer patch : Berzeker Rampage.

Ele : Pre patch – fresh air ele, staff ele celestial/zerker, dd ele – summer patch : dd ele

Guardian: Pre patch – bunker guard, meditation dps guard, burn guard – summer patch : burn guard

The attributes on traits was giving us more options than cookie cutter amulet only stat system. Since we can’t customize it, we have less options to make viable build. Less options should give you better balanced… but with HOT we had the less balanced META ever.

Now people say this meta is the best one, but I don’t agree. The best meta was after turret engi nerf and before june patch 2015. The second best was after dhuumfire nerf before april 2014 patch.

Best meta means: where you have a lot of viable build for all classes that are balanced versus meta.

Actually, Mace + Shield is Overpowered.

If you don’t happen to meet that 5 warrior man team… you will surely do, if you become more serious about your gaming.

So, if warrior is boost in a direction, they surely deserve nerf in another direction.

Moot points. Warrior have the best HP pool of the game. And in doing so, are the more easiest to simply do 30/30/… build than all others classes. More, they have the same armor has guardian with more CC and DPS.

Bunk Guard + Bunk Warrior with all shouts are invincible on mid fight.

So please, go find a build that is reliable (yeah many in the warrior class are reliable) and practice more.

This is made artificially with amulet.

If the skills scaling on attribute would be balanced across all classes, the spvp players could build their stats freely like any other MMORPG on the market.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

No, and that is based on class concepts not all classes should fill every roll or have the similar skill sets, that would make the classes very boring and exasperate the massive amount of power creep, would you want a warrior who has some of the best passive trait defenses in game to also be able to stealth or blast water fields making him even more powerful in the defensive department while still doing as much damage?

Look at Engie he has access to both of those skills and they are one of the strongest classes in game in terms of pvp.

Some classes were given those due to them having little to no strong passive defenses or base line defenses, Ele, and Thief. If anything they need to go back and redefine and separate the class concepts since a lot of them have been blurred with recent changes.

Since the last nerf, nobody would say scrapper is the best 1v1 meta classes.

Even if we bring water field + blast, we are much more efficient for supporting fights now, since tempest got DELETE from the game.

duster.7013:

They added in automated tournaments for exactly this reason:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Automated_Tournaments

You WONT find mlg 5 stacks playing ranked 24/7. AT’s are much more sane than a 5 man leaderboard, which would be more about farming than anything.

I am sorry to disagree here.

3 AT a day is not enough to sustain 5 man teams. AT in 2012 where constant, all time… you could Q an AT at any time of the day.

What 5 man and spvp guild need is a mean to make competitive play with a full team.

Like some said, back in the day, you could SOLOQ in a team Q setting. Many did this even if the SOLO rank Q was up and running, since both gameplay are different.

I hope with the next EXPAC and population URGE, that Anet put back SOLO rank Q and Team Rank Q for all years. Season lf 2 month is not enough to stabilize MMR.

Viper Revenant + Viper Revenant.

They have something when they burst together that two shots any bunker around.

(remove all boons + shinro heals + sword 3 at the same time??? with one cc while the other burst, and reverse)

When you try to do two thing at the same time, you got a problem.

Ranking people on GRINDING Wins to get a reward is bad.

The system should RANK people on their SKILL. The skill should be determined on game you win versus WHO. Like it was in 2013-2014.

Then give a GRINDING reward track for those who want REWARD.

Mixing both will always get problems.

The new MM seems good for the 55%+ MMR players in soloq (or team with a better MMR). For the rest, it’s bad.

Each division got their low MMR player, so even if you CLIMB, you will get stuck in the BAD team. This is UNFAIR. Grinding divisions to get put in soloq with BAD players, is BAD and unfair.

For those LOW MMR, going versus high MMR (and not LOW one), make it HARDER to let them work their MMR higher…

THIS IS TERRIBAD.

mrauls.6519:

I think everyone should be some type of DPSer. Whether it’s sustained or burst DPS, or relying on conditions. Being tanky goes against the ideal of having no trinity IMO. Just make everyone straight up killers with the ability to sustain themselves

Another Scissor that want to DELETE Rock.

Reaper Alim.4176:

Drafigo.4690:

So I guess all the scum of the earth Pvp players are off to pve then?

Since no one can state a game with pvp as good as this game with the variety this game does now give us .

Same ole thing,

That will be all donkey!

Smite is where I go now to get my competitive and skillful small structured PvP fix when I’m feeling in the mood. Atleast till ANet decides to push GW2’s sPvP back in the right directions. I gave some ideals in my previous posts so I will not beat a dead horse anymore there.

Paragon from Epic (one of the best pvp studio – Unreal) OPEN Beta is the 16 of August.

You sure bet, that the people that find Overwatch boring will start to play that.

With the removal of support/bunker, bads that need support will QQ more and play something else.

Bunker/support guy will be bored with the bruisers build and will find something more interesting to play (in another game).

Many will come back, it’s free.

But nobody sane in his right MIND, would choose to alienated his customer based more than this.

We are suppose to make the game grow, but more time advance more the options are limited or deleted… more our beloved game is “shrinking”. The customer base is doing the same.

Duo Rank Q == Slot Machine Random Match making.

Team Q give you the chance to choose with who you play. Strong players will choose Strong Players. The bad one, will get stuck until they get better and proof their worth.

Community players will play with their guilds, with some bads some goods, they strive to make the community better.

Sunshine.5014:

On the other hand:

• please fix it so that launching gw2 while you’re in a match loads directly to the match instead of having the 2 map loads through HotM.

On the other hand:
Please put a character selection combo box in a match. Select that character, reload the map with new character.

Going into through 3 screens is way too much.

Because the Leagues are a JOKE based on GRINDS not on SKILL.

For the Get Good Clan, please go play Legendary… many people in there are baddest than many rubies.

The system need to goes back to what it was. If you win versus better player, you got better rank. If you lose versus lower player, you got a lower rank.

If you lose on a balanced mmr match you lose less rank.

And so on.

And… stop doing Match Making with Divisions or Pip range in Mind. Doing this is bad for Queue time for all divisions at start of the League. (they refuse to divide the queue for soloqer, why doing more than 7 divisions or queue than?)

The solution to smurfing should had been less PIPS rewards. Not season 2 match-making. Overfixing, Overnerfing, Over engineering like amateur.

If your team play with a player with a difference of 2 divisions, simply cut the pips gain by half. (season 1 pips system)

In 2014, between a top 10 or a top 100 players, you had something to do to progress.

Even the Abjured was not able to dethrone BrL supremacy on the leaderboard in the top 10(readymade, gorn, tesla…). (yeah I know, they Queue Dodge you… but they had at least been able to win more than once versus you to get there)

So, top players that are competitive, tried harder to get to top 10 even if they were top 100. This was a good competitive model.

Now they are legendaries playing with player that are at 90% of the old leaderboard system.

tldr; League are a joke. Even Legendary players prefer to reroll than play at their level. Because more than half of the Legendaries players are bad like amber but the queue time is too long to enjoy the game.

R O C.6574:

Jourdelune.7456:

Power.2957:

Akachi.1352:

Evan Lesh.3295:

This is a really great analysis. I appreciate all the work you put into this. We recognize the problems that the season 2 matchmaking is causing and are looking into solutions that will provide a good experience and satisfy our goals for the league system.

abolish mmr and just match people randomly within division? Can’t be worse than it is now

Hell no. There’s nothing I hate more than having bads on my team.

So make it MMR vs MMR again.

Anyway, “top players” don’t need a faulty Match Making to wins matches, isn’t?

The problem with that is it punishes you for having a high MMR by pairing you with players with really low MMR to make the teams average out.

Nah… the problem with MMR vs MMR is the PIP range. kitten THE PIP RANGE. kitten THE GRIND. Problem solved.

All high mmr player should queue with high mmr players and be paired versus other high MMR player.

I don’t care if above average team are paired versus1 high mmr and 4 avg mmr….

The problem with our MMR vs MMR of season 1, was the divisions and pip range. Not the MMR skill based system.

And before the fix to smurfing, the MMR vs MMR system was better. But it should had just paired MMR vs MMR and don’t care about divisions. divisions means you have time to grind games, it’s not a good indicator of SKILL at all.

PROOF: 80% of Legendary players are average players that had time to grind 400 games.

gloflop.3510:

First, thank you Jourdelune for the explanation of what mmr is. Now the important question is: Do you think it works as planned?

If I go back to last season where both teams were in my mmr range (if I understood it correctly). A game on the forest map started with one player running to close and 4 to the forest creature. After the forest creature was killed, both teams battled for mid. However, when I entered ruby (division 4), the dominant strategy changed entirely. Now 1 player went close and 4 players went mid. Once close was captured, the player from close killed the forest creature.

I dont want to start a discussion about the optimal strategy. Let us for now assume that it is the division 4 strategy. Let us furthermore see my annecdote as a signal for better players in division 4, worse beyond. Last season we got ranked against players in our mmr and in our division (roughly). What happens now with my mmr in this situation? Since I play against better opponents and since there are some players improving strongly and enter diamond, I start losing more than I win. Hence, my mmr drops (as I said: paired against similar mmr). Let us now compare my mmr before season 1 with after season 1. Am I higher, lower or equal?

Now the question again: Is mmr a fair representation of your skill?

Do you think, I am comparable before and after season 1?

MMR is a fairer representation of your skill than your enemy pip range.

MMR is good enough to pair you with same skill for season 2. Why using it just for your team?

Ok…

IS MMR Perfect? No.

Is it better than random team? Yes.

Now… I think that Lead is wrong. It’s not just about win and loose ratio. Glicko gives a rank to a player. The rank is then affected depends on who the players win or loose. More point will get add or substract with the “difference” of MMR between both.

In a team game, MMR is not like in a single player game. Glicko 2 is an algorithm for chess…

Anet did fine tune this a lot.

From my past experiences in ranked play form 2013 and 2014, players that where top 200 where better than player that where 200-400 that were better than 400 to 600 and so on.

But… it was “generally”. I did recruit some guyz that had 90% ranked and in a week I could say he play like a 500. why? He played with casual players that where not trying to win that much, making mistakes a lot and so on…

Same… another flaw of MMR, is if you play with high MMR player, you will get high MMR opposing team too. So if you win, you raise your MMR. So part of the MMR is “social” based.

I’ve played with top 100 players that were really bad on rotations… that always peel on even fights with 3 or more players, and he played meta ele or engi. Yeah… bad players got carried by team leader saying goes there or goes there… and when that bad was not listening he got kick from his team but was able to sustain his MMR because his RANK was shown and other high RANK continue to play with him.

The decay on RANK was bad too. Need more finetuning.

But… this was way better than the grinding of WINS that gave us RANK since january 2015. Test season 1 and 2 were bad. League season 1 and 2 as well.

RANK should show who you can beat. Not how much game you wins.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Skill-based-or-Grind-based-rank-system/first#post6048108

messiah.1908:

unranked is worst ppl testing build doing 4 cap on close or far versus 1 thief who run away ….

You need to work your MMR.

The difference between both MM system, is unranked let you goes out of low MMR by giving you opponent team in your MMR range.

In ranked, the problem is PIP range is not good enough to have equal skill MMR range 10 players accross the board.

My unranked experiences is way better than yours. I am team with pro leaguers versus other pro leaguers.

In unranked you don’t have the MMR hell from division entry. So, if you are serious about playing good spvp, unranked is way better MM than Ranked…

But if you can’t climb your own MMR in the ladder, please don’t blame me or Unranked queue.

A ladder got a bottom and a top.

If you played under 20 games in unranked, you need to play more. After decay, your MMR will be really bad but you can overcome that with ease in duo/trio or premade for a night or two.

Unranked MM system can be work on. While Ranked is harder if you got MMR hell in divisions entry (or playing with pver guyz that have avg mmr as default and wreking all avg players in the procesS).

To make it short, sPvP would benefit to be all around Free to play because it’s game design is based around “equal” chance to compete. (no grind or money involved)

This would be a “Free-trial” to new HoT spec-like thing. It would boost sPvP population.

To access PvE or WvW, you still B2P.

For sPvP with the simple solution, people don’t think you are B2W and so, you got “good perceived” value of your game and not the “Pay to Win” junk reputation our beloved game now have.

R O C.6574:

S1 and S2 both have there own problems. This season is definitely punishing lower level players. Personally, I think S1 was better. Maybe give extra pips for carrying a match. If the MMR difference between best and worst player passes a certain threshold, the higher level player is eligible for an extra pip if they win. S2 might have worked but alt accounts and late starts are not allowing the skill levels to spread out the way Anet said it would.

The 2014 Leaderboard season was way better than anything else to show skill.

The problem with them:

1- Decay wasn’t good enough. You play 1 game of 2 weeks of nothing to get your rank back.
2- No indication of your RANK in game, meaning less value to it.
3- No rewards tied to it.

I say give back the old ranking system, tweak it further and put the GLORIOUS LEGENDARY REWARD track that is estimated at 200 games played / month grind.

Ellie.5913:

We were losing builds because of amulet/rune removals long before HoT came out. Anyone remember that super fun build called shout bow warrior? I had a blast with it, and it had good team support in it which is how I like to play, never been a fan of glass cannons and never will be….

Please link the balance patches long before HOT that did this.

In season 1, many shoutbow was playing Settler amulet because the sustain on celestial amulet was not good enough (the nerfed of the healing signet did make warrior bad for 2 seasons).

Celestial amulet was still a thing in season 1.

http://dulfy.net/2016/01/15/gw2-upcoming-changes-to-pvp-runessigils-and-amulets/

I didn’t understand why.

Because dd ele, the king of celestial was not working into HoT bunker creep (bunker abilities on squishi bodies for the win).

Nor Cele Engi…. it was either soldier rifle engi or marauder scrapper.

Celestial was not working on shoutbow or any other META build (that where OP for 2 years) anymore. Some druids were using it. Some necro too.

Some bunker mesmer did played with celestial, but other played Soldier or Sentinel. For the first time in Anet history you could play 3 different amulet for 1 META build.

The nerf on Mesmer bunker where enough, removing the amulet wasn’t appropriate.

They didn’t explain why they did this. They got some cheers by fanboyz for doing so, but the balanced work on ele, engi and war on celestial had been done for good.

For me, right after season 1, the big BOSS left Anet or got fired… and the NEW boss is trying to make sPVP his own.

Still… he alienated the third of the player bases that like to play support hybrid build and still do.

Storms Fury.9307:

Some classes and some builds are forced out of higher end PvP because bunker outclasses them.

These leads to build inequality and forces you to play bunker meta instead of having more choices.

Bunker needs to be tapered down a bit so that other builds are more viable.

Some classes/builds have way too much defense.

Lol.

Bunker build are fine (high defense, low damage).

It’s Bruiser build that are not (and were always OPed) that have bunker defenses and dps damage (or so).

Main problem here, is the Paladin amulet and most new block/evade from HoT specs.

WereDragon.6083:

Ill save the forums the balance QQ. I wanted to say bravo to the dev team for some precision on the nerfs to rev and mes. Despite my absolute detest for these two classes (Necro main since launch) I am glad the team decided to shave and not sledge their knee-caps out from under them. Hopefully we see some more shaves in general to all classes, all around. I would prefer slow little balance tweaks to everything, all around moving into the next season.

I don’t agree with you.

CORE classes to HoT Specializations are not balanced.

All classes and specialization should have a viable power, condi and bunker build that have counter class/build and are counter class/build to another.

This would been balanced.

From my perspective of the 10 hours I did put since last patch (i played way more before), the condi builds are better now than ever. And we had a condi meta in season 2.

So, actually, we don’t have enough options to counter a condition meta, it’s why the condition meta will dominate again.

Since we got nerfed all around, I am really enjoying all the effort MESMER are doing to find builds in PVP that could work.

We don’t see QQ and hate thread out of it (like thief or warrior HOT nerfed) from us.

It’s really nice to try the new mesmer build even if they don’t really work out.

I think Mistrust buff is bad because when you are disabled, you can’t attack… so confusions is a wasted on it (or raised the confusions duration by x2).

To make mesmer viable again, i think we would need to customize our stats like we had pre june 2015 patch. So, we could tweak numbers for conditions or power or bunkering builds.

It’s like the amulet is not doing enough versus other classes because our utility skills are less based on dps, condi or bunkering and more on utilities.

Our weapon skill seems to scale less than other with the attribute, so we need to invest more into them to get the same result.

They removed our ability to change attributes, without normalizing all weapon of the game. kittenes! (my QQ of the week).

Good job guyz, I hope mesmer will get some buff before season 2.

Dal

People are upset because the skill level of players of the same divisions is way too different.

We have Legendary players that play bad compare to some emerald.

Divisions pairing is bad.
Divisions stucking at first tier is bad.

Grinding games don’t show you are good at the game.

I play less than 5 hours a week now. I am not the best player, but I am way better than many Legendary, right now.

I was playing 30+ hours a week for 3 years before Seasons happens.

I have more fun in unranked but even that, the player based that have skills play other games.

Yeah time changes and pvp in Gw2 is not changing for good.

Aereniel.7356:

Evan, a couple of suggestions:

… snip …

• Please add a visible match making rating that can be viewed in-game.

Thank you.

Please consider that MMR is subjective to with whom you play. In case of people mentoring other players, their MMR would be “underated”. Many great players have bad MMR because they are doing the “pig” work. Showing Noob how to play the game.

I think that MMR should be visible but only for the carrier of it (private). So he can know if he progress in the “social” ladder and adjust accordingly. Putting that number for all to show, would worsen the gap between hardcore and casual way worse than it is.

I can name you many TOP players right now, that have good MMR because some top players “mentored” them for a while. With a visibile public MMR, many would never had done so.

It’s a Myth or a Urban Legend to think that MMR equal skills. MMR equal your social positions in the game. Do you play with good players, winning match versus good players? (or not) ( I know many people who had bad old leaderboard rating that can carry game versus top players )

There is people that can carry a team for a week or two (myself included) to the 100-200 leaderboard positions (old skill based system 2013-2014) without being rated 100-200 consistently (because they try new people out for their guild, mentor some new promising pvp prospect, want to really give a player a chance to prove his worth).

-=-=-=-=-=-
But YES, skill based leaderboard are way better than grind based casual jokes of a competitive game. GRINDING LEAGUE is bad. Actually, it’s easier for low MMR to get to Legendary than high MMR player.

This is the most ironic joke of LEAGUE, right now.
-=-=-=-=-=-

Dal

sephiroth.4217:

Falan.1839:

Another option would be to increase the effectiveness of poison against downed enemies, maybe even make the res of posioned downed players impossible.

Not a lot of people use poison on people who are getting rezzed. Poison is probably the main culprit behind instant rez skills not working too…

It’s the main reason purge gyro is used, the toolbet skill is a pulsing poison fields.

People are kittened that scrapper are utility rezzer/stomper when they play versus them… but are so happy to have them on their side.

It’s the last thing that made scrapper viable and all of you guyz, do the same mistake over and over… (bunk guard… shoutbow war, bunker mesmer, tempest aurashare, scrapper) you simply cry because some “support” build seems better than your DPS build for team fights.

Oh and btw, since we are in pvp forum.

I don’t care PVE or WvW are Buy to win.

But for sPvP, a MOBA game inside that MMORPG you like so much, F2P should have equal chance compare to B2P, to respect the equal chance for all to win (skill based game).

This is the game design of sPvP —> skill based game.

Over 10 matches, I got 4 even matches. 3 versus premade with my trio queue. I finished the night with 8w – 2l.

There is two thing to consider.

High MMR player uselly are good and play a lot… so they raise divisions a lot.
No life players that grind and grind are not usually good and don’t have a good MMR.

So, if you are grinding and your MMR is not good, you will be FOOD for high MMR team players.

Mostly, at ruby grinders will stop progressing. So ruby will get you a lot of low mmr player (if you are low as well). So your grinding dream will stop.

It’s at diamond or more that we will be able to wish for better MMR players… but even that, will not cut it through high MMR one. Mid tier players will still be FOOD for high MMR farmers.

There is no perfect system.

Hardcore NA pvper had lost all hope since AG is dead and we don’t have ESL Weekly Cup like EU.

The tourney scene was the real reward for us. Now, going in for title or badges don’t make it up for it.

Rank Duo Q had killed hardcore none-competitive spvp players guild as well.

It’s like Anet do everything to make spvp dead.

I know I already said it, but for the people who didn’t see it…

In case you are looking for a skill based games (not a grindy pips trash match-making system) that will give you the most balanced matches related to your skill level….

… come join us in Unranked!

Fast queue time, even at top level. (making team on MMR only, no divisions or pips bracket means it’s easier to find people at your level)

Great sportmanship, no toxic shills, great plays all around.

More build diversities. More fun!

Everybody should play at least 300 games in unranked over the month, to work and stabilize their MMR.

Stop crying for ranked PVER grinding reward track. Come join the TRUE spvper into Unranked, Right-Now.

Love to you all,

I agree, unfortunately… the spvp game is dying. When you see pro leaguer into diamond (ezPz) and some grinder already Legendary… you know the ranked system is wrong.

Fixing the ranked system to be more “realistic” would help tons.

Meaning that top players should be at top of the ranking, even if they only play 20 games a week versus game spammer that do 200 games a week.

Unfortunately, 2016 is the year of the pvp free to play moba like game. So… it will only got worse.

Chaith.8256:

… Support builds didn’t exist pre-expansion in the meta, and it wasn’t half bad. …

What? You played 2 dd ele comp to get Champion of the World and you affirm that support builds didn’t exist pre-expansion? (dd ele was cleansing you, gave protections/regen and might stack, rezzing with mistform/armor of earth)

As I remember correctly, Settler Shoutbow Warrior was support and working good. DD ele as well. Soldier Rifle Engi did bring CC and some support.

Sorry Chaith, now I am mind blasted. Perhaps, you should had said 2 weeks prior the expac… but even that is flat wrong.

Care to explain your PoV?