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Will we ever going to see Gear Progression?
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Kalocin.5982
Guild Wars 1 managed to give progression by skills instead of weapons and gear, in the sequel we mostly have elite specs which don’t measure. That being said, there would be a mass exodus if they ever increase the gear level. There was massive outcry when ascended was announced and many people probably quit there because they joined under the no-gear grind mantra. IF they do implement it, I can guarantee the game will lose its identity.
Gear grinds can be inserted into the game without replacing the gear anyways, simply make a grindable “buff” growth every patch for certain zones or modes. Then you get to the idea of: “Why?” though.
Don’t think of specializations as weapons, think of them as whole new classes. Instead of a dark knight class they added a greatsword to the dark mage instead. Not exactly the same but it’s a similar idea.
If they want to avoid numbers/bars they can probably put rings around party members (Like whenever you target someone) that change colour depending on their health. The graphics are already there so it wouldn’t feel out of place.
It won’t break it but if it doesn’t live up to it then I can’t see the game growing anymore. I am positive for the next one though.
I disagree with showing events for the whole map. I rather enjoy wandering around and then coming across an event that I didn’t think I would hit. But the range at which they show up to you could definitely be increased substantially
I’d be on board with a larger range
I think Zhaitan’s weakness is that he was the weakest out of all the dragons, but his raising of the dead thing made him have an incredible difficult army to fight against.
If I recall, the whole downfall of Abaddon as god came about due to the diluting his gift of magic to humans with bloodstones, so I imagine something related to that considering the current game? Wouldn’t be too far-fetched anyhow
You can build reaper to be stupidly tanky (in PvE) while being able to dish out decent damage too. With shroud you pretty much get to wait for your heal CD to come back and take no damage, and can be traited to be really good too. Revenant is kind of boring in pve since you don’t get to use a lot of your left skill bar due to energy restrictions. Druid is really solid all around in all game modes.
I think there’s a bit of a disconnect between veterans and newcomers. One thing that people forget is that ANet originally intended for max level gear to be incredibly easy to get since it wasn’t supposed to be the focus. As a casual player myself, I don’t mind ascended gear being stupidly easy to get, I do think it’s kind of silly to put exotics behind a massive cost.
Another thing people here forget is that at a certain point it’s actually more profitable to just make ascended gear and swap the stats to something better (Ie Viper stats).
Most people just want to be able to play their class, but for most people who play condition, they’ll want that viper gear which kind of screws them over.
For those talking about grinds in other games, you generally do not need to grind to switch builds, you grind for more power to your gear, but you’re usually not too disabled from standard lower level gear.
While 100g isn’t necessarily hard for people to get, the big thing is that it ‘feels’ daunting to newer players. People tend to forget they also need to get their bags, runes, sigils etc on top of these things on top of raising crafting levels up. Simply put, it’s not a tall mountain to climb, but if you have another mountain beside it that’s easier people will do that instead (other games).
When I think of something like FFXIV, I can get a decent set of gear in a day or two without too much of a grind. If I’m geared decently, I can max out to what could be considered exotic quality in a couple of days. It’s recyclable sure, but the content and means to do so is still interesting.
My question is: So what if gear (exotics) is easy to get? That’s not content. That’s getting the right tools so you can play the content. This is especially important if you sell your game on the idea you don’t have to grind for gear.
I’m not sure why people are criticizing this post, it’s pretty valid. Don’t insult people that feel burned by their purchases or else they’ll never purchase again, which is obviously bad for the game.
The kites should be patched to have equivalent boosts, or a way to upgrade them in-game.
The forums:
‘Give us new stuff, ArenaNet, we never get new stuff’
ArenaNet adds new items.
‘OMG, ArenaNet is trying to kill its own game! This stuff is OP (or soon will be)’
and
‘What junk! This isn’t enough! We demand more!’
Poor Devs. =(
Welcome to the “entitled gamer” generation.
If you’re an unsatisfied customer you should be allowed to voice your opinion without being criticized. The “entitled gamer generation” has always been there, people just seem to recognize it during specific moments rather than always.
Imo, mounts should not be added because the game was originally designed to not have them. If they do add mounts, then they would likely have to release larger maps because the current ones are way too small for mounts. The other reason I’m against the idea is because the cash shop is already a large deter for newer players, throwing a ton of mounts in there would only make it worse. In addition, it would also become monetized like crazy, which would further the “gold grind endgame” that is thrown around on various forums.
I would not be against mounts if:
1) Maps were made larger and enemy mechanics prevented you from being able to run through a group of enemies.
2) Most mounts are acquirable in game for a modest amount of farming
3) Not usable in cities
The game dose not need a gear treadmill. You want to feel like your getting stronger? how about actually getting better at playing the game.
L2P reply is insulting…
I wouldn’t say that the game needs a gear treadmill for power, but it definitely needs something that you can build from.
I agree with both those things.
To people jumping on the guy telling him to go back to WoW: I like players in my game, please stop telling them to leave for having a different opinion.
I think there needs to be something that is not a treadmill but a fun and unnecessary mechanic, such as being able to level an alt while using your main character. Or another might be like a “legendary” mode or something where you can set your character back to level 1 but with the same stats as before (basically for achievements and titles) kind of like Prestige in Call of Duty.
I don’t understand why people think a single player would be stronger than 30 other players that could all just drop area heals. If a zerg wants to survive as a group, then it should learn to defend as a group imo.
I think there should be a small toggle button for either sound in the option menu, problem solved.
I think the main issue is that the difficult of an event is determined simply by the amount of enemies available rather than how difficult those enemies are.
Merge every server and use overflow servers for the big zones. Population problem solved.
Titans…Oh god the titans….Ran as a minionmancer (oldschoolterm) and then the final missions decided to make my build worthless lol.
On topic: I find 50-80 much easier than the previous levels ironically, there are more events and overall action. I don’t mind the risen because every mob in this game behaves the same: Run to you, attack, random control attack. Range remains ranged.
If there was a variation in enemy attack patterns I might care more.
And it’s not even great to play low level characters after you have some lvl 80 characters.
All the fun stuff begins at lvl 80
For some people. There are also a whole lot of people who enjoy leveling alts. It’s a completely different playstyle.
To me, the fun doesn’t really begin at 80, but then I’m more “into” each character. I’m building a play style for each, weapons and armor I want them to wear, personal story choices…all sorts of stuff that some people don’t consider fun.
I agree that for certain types of players leveling is boring. For other types of players (even in other games) leveling is what’s fun.
And the fun DEFINITELY doesn’t begin at 80 for some of us.
I find that the fun begins around 40 when you have all of your skill slots, gear generally has two stats (precision+condition damage, power+precision etc), and you also have the second tier of traits to play with. From 60-80 there is not as much of a rush as there is from 1-30 simply because of the non-complete character unlocks.
I did this for a presentation and since I accidentally just deleted my previous message, you’re getting it in point form:
-All games are art due to being created from multiple sources of art (graphics, sound, programming etc) They are essentially a collaboration of art pieces
-People choose to stop appreciating the artistic elements, in Skyrim someone might do the quests but one day just look around and appreciate the look of the game (especially with mods)
-Some games focus heavily on aesthetic over play elements such as Heavy Rain or Journey, the goal of these games are to cause a connection or an emotion. For instance: The cutting finger scene in Heavy Rain is not fun to do, and nor is it meant to be, it is there to allow the player to feel disturbed by their own actions – Also to compare to Roger Ebert’s idea, you do not “win” the game, your only reward is the story
-These games are called “art games”
-There are some games that still have gameplay elements but focus on trying to create a connection still, a few examples would be Shadow of the Colossus and Spec Ops: The Line. Both games essentially make you feel terrible for playing and have a heavy atmosphere. While they still have gaming elements like shooting or killing enemies, they are doing so to create a message.
Imo, video games are interactive works of art and it truly depends on your perspective as you play the game.
In relation to Guild Wars 2, you could state the same ideas that the art is there and people ignore it. In addition, it would also be advisable to keep in mind that Guild Wars 2 was designed in the same way an artist would paint on a canvas: Through love and dedication. Yeah it sounds kind of cheesy, but the way I see it is that if I was one of the designers in any of the teams, I would be angry if somebody told me my work was not art. From concept to truly being created, the final product itself is what I would consider the work of art in the same way that I would consider any design.
To Conclude: We consider films as art work due to various aspects such as acting ability, the overall aesthetic (ie Tim Burton), or simply the overall form and structure of the narrative. The same can be applied to games, there are voice actors, body actors, narrative structure, and aesthetic (ie Borderlands, Journey, Limbo, Flow, Flower etc) and we choose to ignore them. Films can be seen as artistic AND entertainment, and the same can be applied to games. Guild Wars 2 can be seen as artistic and a form of entertainment depending on how you perceive it.
On a side note: Something like Call of Duty would never be considered artistic.
http://www.gameseek.co.uk/images/screens/cod_black_ops2_s1.jpg
This is considered artistic to me imo.
P.S. I’m tired, ideas may be scrambled lol
I’ve noticed a lot of people want to have first person camera to take beautiful shots in the game, and I myself wouldn’t mind either. My suggestion would be a literal item called a camera that you can place/plant in the world similar to a an environmental weapon that lets you view in first person. This way people could have first person but wouldn’t be able to play in first person mode, and it wouldn’t require any design changes.
Brand loyalty….Very nice XD
As a level 33-34 thief (I leveled up during the dungeon) with a group with nobody past their 60s, it was actually manageable. However, it went by slower than a party of 3 decently geared 80s when I was on my warrior, also we did not get downed as much (like twice compared to 10+). It is however doable with anybody under 80 so I recommend just saying “Lvl ?? lfg MK (You get scaled to 80)” and eventually somebody will invite you.
They were brutal before but as noted, with the daily karma it’s actually pretty easy to pick up.
I think a big detriment to my enjoyment of the game is the fact that there are creatures that just stand there and literally will never move. It makes sense that you would want to make the world look more alive but by having creatures that just stay in play it ends up doing the exact opposite. I don’t really understand the point of them other than that, as they don’t really improve on the world and they seem to just be around for grinding materials. Another way to look at it is that in the manifesto they claimed that you would see centaurs actively coming for villagers rather than just standing in a field. The irony is that there are literally non-moving centaurs standing in a field…Why are they there, not moving, every day?
You may look at other mmos and acknowledge that it is all over there as well but the reason why it’s significant for Guild Wars 2 is because they went out of their way to get rid of world-breaking things such as casting fire spells under water or named mobs being respawned (ie Veteran Cave Troll rather than Mr.Troll). Anyways, I don’t know how the problem could be fixed but I think that it really ruins the concept of a virtual world and makes you acknowledge that it is just a game, which is a real problem for mmos.
This is a real big problem in keeping the game world somewhat realistic. It makes you realize that there’s still 10 centaurs sitting in the field and nothing has changed.
This is totally going to happen widespread now lol
To some degree there is some permanence as it isn’t like WoW where after you kill 10 centaurs they’ll still just be there and nothing was solved…However the main issue is that the village is attacked every 5 minutes with the exact same npcs saying the exact same dialogue. This can be said about the bosses which I feel have been hit the worst with this…ESPECIALLY in Orr.
opinion =/= fact?…
No such thing as facts because anything can be disproved, we merely make theories strong enough that we can’t really disagree with them. Remember, the world used to be flat.
Anyways, discussion or progress in anything really, stems from opinions, thoughts and theories. If you don’t want opinions on a forum then you really need to look somewhere else, such as gw2 wiki. However, people like us want to discuss, we want to make issues that we obviously find a problem to just ourselves known so that we can discuss if it isn’t just our issues. Once we find out that it is more than our own issues, we can realize there is a problem, and thus a discussion for how to change said problem is created.
Theplayboy.6417
I think it’s completely natural for women to have such a smile on their faces when riding a piece of wood.
Perfect name for this post lol
(broken quoting again)
lacrimstein.5603
I agree with the OP in the sense that GW2 has an identity crisis: It has elements of both sandbox and themepark MMO’s, but doesn’t quite reach the level of either. It lacks the carrots and character progression to be a themepark, and it lacks more complex mechanics (like player/guild housing, faction PvP, inter-guild politics, etc) to be a sandbox
I agree with this a lot and I think that is my biggest issue with the game. I think they’re clearly (or else we’d have named mobs and a less realistic world) leaning toward a sandbox game but they wanted to hook in the WoW and traditional mmo players.
possible critical issues which could very quickly make the game be responsible for its own failure
Posted by: Kalocin.5982
I wonder if it would be better to make the trading post on gear only possible through black lion traders and simply increase the amount of them around the area.
Another place to check out is the catapults in Orr just outside of the Arah dungeon entrance….Miss miss miss
Whoa whoa whoa guys he just said something really good here: " not animal crossing"….This game would be so much more awesome if we could have animal crossing features. He makes a good point, it isn’t like animal crossing, there’s more to be improved on if that’s the case. Think about it…Imagine having like townfolk we can get to know in our main cities…and like…buy house objects. Yeah, totally needs more animal crossing.
If implemented correctly, I would not kitten. But walking in to a camp, clicking 6-8 people with a quest marker, then rolling out to do everything, only to later return…do not want.
I don’t think anybody wants that kind of style…As noted above “No 10 boars” quests =P
Anybody who wants a questing system is probably done their personal story and/or just wants more fill of lore or things to do on your own. Doing dynamic events is fun but sometimes you just want something that isn’t as shallow (ie stop the centaur waves, kill the leader). There’s hardly any mascots or characters to like because we’re not really given any to like outside of our personal storyline. =(
Ironically, I liked the medium armors more than the heavy armors on my warrior so I made a thief….and the one I like most? Heritage armor with shoulders hidden. It looks awesome, almost medieval especially if you keep the colours really normal (I have dark/faded blue for the stripped parts and bronze for everything else). I kind of look like the Witcher (Geralt).
@AlexanderFaust.4518
That was actually a really true statement, especially with the For the Horde! comment….Ultima Online was awesome because you could create an identity and in a sense, live in the world with this identity. In GW2 the identity is created for you, and you play that identity in a world meant for everything else but you the player. In short: It’s like watching a tv show or movie unlike a book where you use your own imagination. Just my two copper anyways.
The one thing that questing does in both mmos and rpgs is create background lore and stories. As it stands, there’s no deep story quests outside of the main line which kind of sucks for lore building.
I think it would be cool if we had instanced questing similar to the personal storyline (ie an instance) that our order gives us.
I disagree, personally, unless they can make it so you don’t feel alone. One of my major problems with GW1 was all the instancing the game had. If I wanted to play alone I’d play Skyrim. I personally prefer to be in the open world.
Storyline quests are good here an there but I’m actually glad they’re not constant.
Yeah I see your point there but I don’t think it would be too bad if we had assassination quests from the Order of Whispers that came to us randomly via mail XD
I think it looks awesome too, however, I do wish that more npcs and mobs did…things like maybe moving or interacting with the environment. They have this beautiful world and nothing moves. =(
I think it would be cool if we had instanced questing similar to the personal storyline (ie an instance) that our order gives us.
My issue with the temporary weapons is that there appears to be no stats on them which makes them useless in combat…I guess they work if you want them while in town?
I would probably quit as well as this is the reason why I quit WoW. The main thing I liked about GW1 and somewhat for 2 is that once you’ve got your stats, you can finally just enjoy the game. Anet needs to stay far away from the idea of making gear grinding and progression the “fun” element of the game. What needs to be fun is the content, and by that they need to change up the content…expand on it.
I didn’t buy any keys because I’ve seen this done in other games and it never ends well (ie. Maple Story), to some degree, Anet had other examples to look at in the past and probably could have considered the reaction more. In addition, I myself would have liked a bind-to-account skin to purchase because I do want to support the company, but $10 can buy you a lot of things….Like the Assassin’s Creed 2 and the sequel Brotherhood are $5 each at the moment. With that in mind, would I rather pay $10 on a really rare chance of getting a nice looking skin (and a 1 in 6 chance of getting that one), or would I rather have two games released about a year ago?
In other words: The risk isn’t worth the reward, and once you ramp it up past $20 you end up having items totally not worth their value….and anything past $50? Might as well go buy Borderlands 2 or some other game.
I think Anet should really evaluate the cost vs reward and general value on ALL of their items in the gem store. As it stands, most people would rather buy gems with gold because they make that while enjoying the game while spending $10 on something more useful.
You already get the devil horns and the backpack.
I also get the intense feeling that a lot of you haven’t tried farming for candy corn or any of the other mats and have an inflated sense of how rare they are (they aren’t.)
Halloween mats aren’t the problem…It’s the lodestones and wine.
I think the large point is that while we would want it to be hard to get the items…Why make it ANOTHER farming grind? It would have been more fun if they made a Halloween dungeon and the end boss gives you a weapon or something.
The main issue with the Halloween weapons is: Why use the mats for them when you can put the same time and resources toward a legendary and get a nicer looking weapon?
Guys, its this simple. You want something in life. Learn to work for it. Stop whining like a bunch of little kids and get over it. Nothing. Nothing is going to be handed to you on a silver platter. If you want something cool from this event, you have to be 1 of 3 things.
1. Determined as all hell to earn it, And work through the entire event to get it.
2. Rich as hell and just buy keys.
3. Really Really lucky.
If you are not any of those 3 things. Sucks to be you. Get over it. Life ain’t fair. Now if you excuse me. I have to get back to farming to EARN my weapon.
I haven’t complained 1 kitten bit, Even with the almost routine disconnects every 30-45 minutes or so.
Life isn’t fair? More like the game isn’t fair…Get over it? Okay, but I guess Anet doesn’t want to have players supporting their game, your game, and your future updates. I guess that also includes life not being fair.
Also whining like a bunch of kids? It’s precisely that I’m not a kid that I can’t have fun in this game. I need to work, I have real things to work for. I do not want to waste time on another job which is ironically worse than the grind WoW has (Why? The grind in WoW is actually more fun rather than just killing mobs)
You can say “Oh you work, go buy gems then.” I’m sorry but how do you tell your wife that you just blew $50+ on a cosmetic look in a video game. Reasonably speaking, throwing $5-10 down is fine every once in awhile…Throwing down more? Might as well go play a subscription game after all.
My opinion is that the reason for playing an mmorpg shifted at some point or another. Back in the day sure it was about the loot and mobs, but it was also about the community and making a place for yourself within it. Who was I in Ultima Online? That guy with a boat who fished stuff and had a guild castle. Who was I in WoW in vanilla/bc (before the community died)? The most annoying player ever, a rogue who caused wars in low level zones. Who am I in GW2? I’ve yet to figure it out but from a certain standpoint it doesn’t feel like the game is giving you any room to belong.
The player is merely a player within the world, they don’t have a place to claim for their own (not literally virtual ground lol). To some degree this also happened in WoW with the dungeon/raid finder and making questing all single, however, I might also argue that the game still allows you to have a place in it due to world pvp and guilds.
In any case, I think that GW2 needs to add in some more sandbox features, not necessarily change major things, but allow for players to make an identity right now such as something like visible WvW names or customizable homes….player stores etc. The only thing making an identity for yourself is legendaries, simply because they are easy to spot and nobody has them.
TLDR: Player needs to be able to make an identity/place in the world rather than simply walking through it.
(edited by Kalocin.5982)
It doesn’t really matter unless you have an automated program for you to collect loot. If I throw down a turret just in case and go take a dump, you think I should be banned? Sure it’s pretty dumb in that scenario but hey, if we banned people every day for being dumb we would have no players at some point or another.
Edit: Also for that specific event you would probably die anyways. The only issue is that you could collect loot via the event but it doesn’t happen constantly like mob spawning so you could probably even blame it on a lag-out or something
(edited by Kalocin.5982)
I think the main issue is once you make your character look awesome you kind of run out of things to do which makes you look at the legendary grind. (Quite literally a legendary grind /badpunlol) People sometimes need to remember that exploring isn’t for everyone and after awhile you do need some active things to do with your skill bar.
Howeeeever there was post recently stating that they are hoping to release more content soon (ie November probably) for your main skill bar. =]
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