They should allow you to buy HoT elite specs individually with gems and it shouldn’t require a lot of gems. The expansion has been out for quite awhile its made 99% of the money its going to make. The fact of the matter is though most core specs are much weaker. There are a few that can hold there own at middle and lower levels of play but you are putting yourself and your team at a disadvantage the vast majority of the time. Really just block the players that do this, report them, and move on.
Interesting idea. I like the idea of unlocking elite specs for pvp (without all the HoT content) with gems. People could just pay a little money for the elite they want or even convert gold. Seems like if someone hasn’t bought the expac yet, they likely will never buy it.
Shield: fine
Given the history of shield, this is quite an accomplishment on anet’s part.
Honestly, the only thing I could think of is to switch to Symbolic with PoB trap. 2 symbols with blades should be enough power aoe to punish the rezzer even in stealth.
I disagree. Core guardian, necro, and ranger are all viable. The skill floor is a little higher, so you have to know how to play, though. For instance, I destroy meditrappers and Symbolic DHs in almost every 1v1 I encounter, and I’m not anything special. Just a previous ruby player in gold 2-3 now.
Somebody who has spammed dh for a month and wound up in gold is hardly a GM dh player. They probably dropped the ball pressuring you pretty hard. Against other DH, you can take the double aegis trap and honour skill tree and heal for pooploads while spamming blocks. Theres nothing core guard can do against that.
Wait, you think that every DH I’ve come across is either less skilled than me (don’t belong in gold, or I belong higher) and/or they just screwed up when faced me 1v1 on point? As someone who’s played both DH and core this season, I speak from experience rather than conjecture.
I’m not sure how the OP knows that these people are f2p. It seems as though you are:
1. Assuming they don’t have HoT (Some people, like myself, run core specs with HoT)
2. Assuming they have a f2p account rather than just an old account without buying expac.
3. Assuming they don’t have enough skill to belong where they are.
That’s a lot of assumptions, and you know what they say about assuming…
50s CD “double” stun breaker. Clear 3 condis if you will use chain skill. 1200 range.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shadowstep – “just” stunbreaker and 1200 teleport (f.e. mesmer have the same skill – https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blink with 30s CD and YOU AS NECRO have same skill – https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Necrotic_Traversal with 32s CD – which is also blast finisher, doing poison condi to 5 targets and generates life force and 1st skill in chain (Summon Flesh Wurm) is also doing damage.
The second chain skill is Shadow return https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shadow_Return which is stunbreaker, clears 3 condis (nothing special) and 1200 teleport where you can`t choose where to teleport (you just know where you will be ported back).
I don`t see nothing special on Shadowstep if I will compare it to other similar skills. “Side” effects which are connected to this kind of skill are different for different classes, f.e.
Thief – stunbreaker, clear 3 condis, teleport
Necro – stun breaker, doing dmg, teleport, blast finisherSo I still don`t understand this flamewar you created. But… I saw your other threads…unfortunately.
I would swap any utility on any class for shadowstep. It is the best utility in the game bar none. Should the best utility in the game not be nerfed?
I would trade shadowstep for endure pain in a heartbeat. Now that would be OP on a thief.
If free to play player is in platinum, then he has the skills to be in platinum. Dont blame others for your loss or lack of skills.
Quoted for truth.
Well played Moonsinn, well played.
FWIW I still shout “ALL NECROS MUST DIE FIRST” at the start of every match, (even when there aren’t any on enemy team)
That’s one of the warrior shouts, right?
You realize that core players will get targeted first, right?
Core builds are weak so they consider it griefing. You are losing them mmr. It’s not actually a f2p game.
Core classes are bad, and are being kept bad on purpose, and will never be good ever. For instance, even after “buffs” guardian core virtues are not 1/8th as good as DH. It’s the differance between giving spell immunity to your team for 8 seconds+ and blocking one attack for them.
If you wanna play effective f2p builds, the only actually viable one off the top of my head is p/p condi engi. It’s pretty bad and actually better with scrapper even with p/p but it’s the best f2p build for spvp, since you can take tool kit alongside elixer s and basically be immortal due to the invis potion.
You will be very bad at playing it for a little while, but with rune/sigil of smoldering/flame legion, you can shotgun somebody for 17-20k dmg in a few spells on a 15s cooldown. It’s still trash, but it can kill druids and other classes with bad condi clear.
I disagree. Core guardian, necro, and ranger are all viable. The skill floor is a little higher, so you have to know how to play, though. For instance, I destroy meditrappers and Symbolic DHs in almost every 1v1 I encounter, and I’m not anything special. Just a previous ruby player in gold 2-3 now.
I wouldn’t say DH is way better. The heal trap and virtues are nice, but the rest I could take or leave. You can get easier survivability with DH, but at the cost of skills that are easier to interrupt and counterplay. Honestly, right now I would say that if you are an experienced guardian, you can make both work well with different play styles.
As for your specific build, I think it’s going to be fairly squishy, but you have nice synergy with Virtue of Justice in the Radiance line. Wrath of Justice makes for nice burst combos, but sadly the cd is so much longer than that of Justice. I’m assuming you took Perfect Inscriptions to synergize with that. It’s too bad it does so little for your build for a GM trait. I think you will have to adopt a bit of a burst and kite play style to make this build work. Go for small team fights when you can.
Yeah, the last few skyhammers I’ve played, I’ve been the only one on my team there and have had to deal with 2 from enemy team. Sometimes I can stall, but mostly I just have to give it up to them and go to recap a point. I think people can get tunnel vision a lot and don’t look to see what’s happening elsewhere. They probably thought they were “defending”
Almost everyone knows how op it is. Even necros know. It does so much in 1 skill, stun, stability, damage, chill, bleed, life steal. What other utility does so much on any class? Imahine if “Feel my wrath!” stun locked, damaged, and chilled you too.
OP, I feel your frustration. I run core by choice, but I try not to make it obvious. I win the majority of matches and do well carrying my weight, but I know if we were to lose they would blame my “garbage” spec.
Not much to do but report and hope that elite specs get nerfed to be equal with core.
I’m not so sure about new debuffs. You already are revived with less than full health (less with each successive rez) and have less downed health with successive downs. That’s why there are traits that provide buffs when you rez or rez with more health. I feel like freezing the cds is the most reasonable change. You’re not really in a worse state than when you were downed, but it also doesn’t undo so much of the work you did getting someone down. The’re heal skill and whatever immunity/block/no damage skill will still be on cd. It would be a challenge after being rezzed for sure, but at least you still get another chance.
The sheer number and speed of all these necrofancers jumping to defend this OP skill proves just how good it is. The sooner anet nerfs it the better, for the good of the game.
Hmmm, if that’s the case, let’s make a thread about the ranger’s “Rampage as One” being OP. If a bunch of people say it is not, then that will mean it is indeed OP right? Lol.
Anyways, this looks like one of Henry’s threads, so I’m guessing this has to be a jab at him. At least I’m hoping so. I’d like to think no one could seriously think this skill is OP but……we are in the pvp forums and I’ve seen some crazy stuff here.
Are you suggesting that I’m engaging in baseless accusations and hyperbole just to get a rise out of someone? Who would do such a thing?
The sheer number and speed of all these necrofancers jumping to defend this OP skill proves just how good it is. The sooner anet nerfs it the better, for the good of the game.
Let’s face it. There’s a reason you see 1-3 necros at a time on teams. They absolutely destroy mid fights, and this skill is the largest culprit. The only way to burn through their 2 hp bars before dissolving into a pile of Thaumanova Reactor waste is to cc them, and this skill gives them 10 seconds of unbridled devastation, even if they don’t explode you during the 2 second stunlock.
Aethelweard Rex – Guard
Trist Lockwood – Thief
Aelius Swift – WarriorYour joking right, you seem to play 3 of the most OP classes in PvP and your QQing about a necro ELITE skill, yet you mention nothing about the instant trap spam pull push guard, the perma invis 3 hit kills thief, with more evades than any class, and the invinci warrior, that can neglect condis, do daze for days, and has massive burst damage,
But yes the necro Elite skill is OP
GG.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Skull_Grinder
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/VaultTheres a good example of OP.
Actually, in ranked I only play core guard, this build.
Thief I only play in pve now, and I haven’t played war almost at all this season. My F1 key was getting worn out.
All of these, I’ve played since day 1
Freezing cds would be interesting. Often they are out of cds when they are downed, making it hard to do much after rezzing, but someone who maybe got cc burst would be much more effective.
I don’t like the idea of attacking canceling rezzes. I already have to deal with rezzing dummazzes. I don’t them canceling my rezzes because they are dummazzes.
Dear OP, git gud.
THE MAIN REASON CTTB IS BROKEN, IS BECAUSE ITS 100hp lifesteal CAN THEN BE COMBOED INTO A 200hp lifesteal gravedigger.
You need to balance from top, new players can always get better, but top legendarys cant do anything about this.
No respectable necro uses GS in pvp. That’s just silly.
You guys are all deluding yourselves if you think this skill is acceptable. Typical necrofancers.
I seldom land this skill. Know why? People can file their taxes and run a marathon before it finishes casting. It has a big tell and has a long cast time. The Times I DO land it… Yes, the fight swings in my team’s favor, but if it does land… It’s kind of deserved.
I tried reaper, and I was able to land it no problem. Same cast time as chaotic release with less of a tell.
I’ve sat silent on this for too long. This skill is breaking pvp. It does too much. It’s a hard hitting aoe that chills and bleeds. Plus they use it in teamfights and stun everyone for 2 seconds and get 10 stacks of 10 seconds of stability, allowing them to mow over the whole team in reaper shroud, decimating their opponents.
And you can trait it to siphon life and reduce the cd to like 58 seconds. This is unacceptable! This absolutely needs to be nerfed for the good of the game. I’m seeing 2-3 necros on a team just /laugh at opponents that melt without being able to do anything. Everyone knows this skill is broken, which is why necros are the first to be targeted in team fights.
Anet please:
1. Increase cd to like 180 seconds at least
2. Reduce the stun time to 1 second and stability to 1 stack of 4 seconds for each target.
Or
3. Cut damage in half and radius to 240.
Thank you
Mesmer called, but I couldn’t really hear him clearly beccause he was laughing so hard he accidentally teleported 4 times in a row.
If you’re running mimic and you use CS just to blink 3 times in a row you are playing mesmer wrong in PvP
Well, you’re obviously ignoring my point. But the possibility to chain teleports is there. And it’s stun breaker. And it’s on 30(24)s cooldown which is much less than 50(40)s that thief has. I’d take mesmer’s cooldown before condi clear on second port any time.
To add:
If we were to compare skill for skill like I just did for mesmer then you would see there is a lot of imbalance like this. Two skills or traits that have same mechanic can differ a lot between classes. Some get more some get less, depending on how their class is played and what mechanics it has.
Calling Shadowstep op is really not knowing basics of the game and being salty. Thiefs don’t really have going much for them and few goods skills keep thief alive in what would otherwise be being one-shot scenario. But I guess it’s easy for Necro to talk stupid stuff like op did, he isn’t the one that will get killed by one or two strong attacks. He has effectively 40k HP (minimum) and he doesn’t care most of the time.lol dude, a vault hits me for 12k. PI hits me for 4k. backstab for around 10k. So instantly I lose half my health with no visual tell at all. How is that fun?
Lmao! Show me these 12k vaults and 10k backstabs. And both from stealth out of nowhere? You make up some funny stuff.
Why doesn’t Anet realize this whole match making is broken af. Bronze and Silver is a nightmare for above-average players. They match you up with players below your skill rating and they expect you to carry your team because you get punished and lose a LOT of points if you can’t. It’s impossible to get out of this pit called Silver because the broken match making system looking at your league points rather than your MMR, so I keep getting matched with players way below my level, which results in losses, which results in me getting matched with even worse players, and yeah you get the idea…
I climbed out of silver1/bronze3 as well. Had a lot of bad teammates, but also, fortunately, a lot of bad opponents.
Logic and thoughtfulness OP, plz nerf
GS war can hit hard, sure, but they typically go down fairly easily, compared to macebow, with some burst and kite playstyle. Symbol guards have very few stun breaks and no stability, as well as less condi cleanse than their meditrapper counterparts. Get out of their aoe and cc them. Neither needs a nerf imo.
I think Henry’s been taking the Nerf Wish List a little too seriously.
This is why I love conquest. It’s not always just about defeating other players. You have to think about your choices and strategy and try to coordinate with a team of players. I liked courtyard too, but only deathmatch would be too boring for me.
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I never really had a major issue with having mixed q last seasons. Sometimes I would get rolled by a 5-man premade. Other times my full solo team would roll them. Also, I like teaming with 1 or more people sometimes, so I don’t like being limited to either 5 or solo. I’d like to be able to grab a couple buddies and q without having to find a complete team.
I always thought Elo hell was when the matchmaker preferred to place you with teammates who were less skilled than you because your MMR was lower than your actual skill. You then got placed against higher rated teams which forced a loss, lowered your MMR, and repeated the cycle. Theoretically we saw this in season one and two. I seemed to experience this in season 2, though by the end I was getting more wins again.
However, they changed the way the matchmaker worked in season 3, and matches were aimed at being balanced with regards to MMR. What we experienced throughout all 4 previous seasons was people grinding to ruby division because of safety nets, creating a pool of players in low ruby who were anywhere from horrible to decent, but were being placed in same matches because of drawing from pip range.
Theoretically, both of these problems have been fixed. So I don’t really know what Elo hell is this season. Anecdotally, there seem to be issues, but I couldn’t surmise what could be causing them.
I would strongly recommend not posting a video. I was asked to kill myself by teammates in PvP after doing so, (at the request of a pro player.) They didn’t want me on there team.
Posting a video will get you identified and harassed in game if the opinions expressed about it on forum are negative.
If you’re bad, you’re bad. That’s the reality. Now instead of being negative about it, how bout use it as a challenge to get better?
I have been and continue to bust my kitten to get better.
That’s not really the point though. I recommend against the OP posting a video because I have experienced very negative consequences for doing so.
I fail to see how I’m being negative because teammates asked me to commit suicide. You might wish to rethink that.
So you did try to get better right? Out of the negative there came a positive. I am glad you did try to get better.
It’s their loss if they can’t handle criticism. It’s up to you to filter the kill yourself comments. I know you are an adult and you are able to see that this is nothing more than an internet linggo, not be taken literally.
Please don’t. I know you probably mean well, but please understand that it is up to players to refrain from making these comments, not the receiver to filter them. There is a reason it is against the ToS. People have actually killed themselves over online comments. You don’t know what the user on the other side of these names has going on in their lives currently or what has happened in the past. It’s up to each one of us to treat people as we would treat a stranger or acquaintance that we were talking to face to face.
This is basically a weaker in every way version of the symbolic DH build.
DH as a trait is better than virtues in nearly every regard. You’re better off running the meta version.
I’ve played a lot of games as meditrapper and Symbolic DH. They are both great builds, and DH virtues are nice. However, I think if you actually TRIED this build, you might see its value. I honestly believe it’s on par with the others. You definitely have to adjust your play style to accommodate for the lack of shield of courage, but the low cd and instant cast of the core virtues is actually pretty nice.
Some advantages as I see them are:
-Virtue of Justice active gives a hefty burn stack in team fights or 1v1 in addition to retal and might. Good for keeping pressure on kiting targets.
-Resolve is uninterruptible. Heals for less, but a lot of people are just waiting to cc your wings. Plus cures conditions on teammates.
-Courage has a much shorter cd (34 seconds), is an aoe stun break, and stacks stability. This is crucial for securing stomps and rezzes (even refreshes on rezzing). Also good for teammates who get caught in dragons maw, gravity well, hunter’s ward, tides of time, chilled to the bone, etc.
Granted there is a trade off as the DH virtues are very nice too. I just find that I have more to offer team fights with this build, with the aoe point pressure of symbols and utility of virtues traitline, while still being capable of winning 1v1s and bursting in +1 situations.
Edit: Besides, I wasn’t asking for build advice. I just wanted to share this.
(edited by Moonsinn.5382)
I just had a match with not one, not two, but three of these thieves, two of which would always travel as one, as the third followed one of the other two players around as they went for other points. Always bounding, always vaulting, never letting themselves be caught alone…
It was not pretty.
They need to say hi to a power warrior.
The real question is, did Helseth also queue at 5-10 am like the rest of the top 10 (you know who i am talking about, i have seen you and have screemshots, don’t deny it) so he could farm players divisions (silver/gold) below him and thus never lose matches?
If everyone in the top ten queued at the same time, wouldn’t they just play against each other?
I said this before HOT but anet needs to realize when you combine the acro line with DD you get broken stuff.
Both builds are based on spamming evades till you run out of them (funny fact you don’t)
I don’t have any problems with both of them but it’s frustrating when your team lose vs them in 1v2s and 1v3s OR when you actually face good players and these builds become useless..
A simple fix is remove or remake the acro line, atm the line is full of passives and provides little counterplay for most traits, that along with the DD line create unhealthy builds like the ones you said.
It would be interesting to see acrobatics focus less on passive survivability and evades and more on something else. Maybe a line with traits to enhance shadowsteps (pretty sure this was suggested somewhere a long time ago), since it traditionally synergized with sword. It could work with sword, p/d, sb, and d/p, as well as steal.
They are definitely low skill floor builds, like full traps DH, but having played them, they really aren’t terribly effective with any consistency, unless you actually DO have skill, at which point condi only gets slightly more effective while staff performs nearly as well as d/p, albeit in different roles. That said, thief has always been blamed for being spammy. Used to be 2, 2, 2,…, then 3, 3, 3,…, we still have 4, 4, 4,…Anyway you get the point. Initiative mechanic promotes spamming by novice thieves, and lets face it, what DH doesn’t wish he could spam true shot, especially the immediately post release version.
This is just another skill that goes on the long lists of HOT spec issues.
Its not OP because everything in HOT is OP but it does lack a certain amount of skill.
Yeah I agree no one skill should be so good that a class only uses that skill throughout a fight and be that successful with it. Sometimes I don’t get Anet logic, or why they are so slow to respond to these issues.
Honestly I think they don’t have the staff to do it. Not enough dedicated personal
Staff…haha.
I agree that vault damage is crazy if you land it. I was having fun destroying people in unranked with it last night. However, I think people should remember that if DD is not evading very often or out of the fray, they will die in seconds. Also, vault is a ground targeted skill that is highly telegraphed and has a vulnerable frame to it. It is counterable. It could probably use a minor damage nerf, but to see 8-9k hits, a thief has to build pretty glassy. I don’t see those numbers on an acro build.
I would actually love to see some functional changes to the other skills (the vulnerability on dust strike was a good start. I think it should be cone aoe though) while nerfing the damage of vault. Vault spam is boring, but so is debilitating arc spam. I’d like to see a DD build that actualizes their vision for it, something with enough survivability to have a meaningful team fight presence apart from aoe damage.
Edit: in other words, I want to be able to live long enough without evading to be able to provide the weakness, blinds, whirl finisher/projectile reflect to my team with consistency.
(edited by Moonsinn.5382)
Can someone explain to me how to permanently block as a guardian? Sounds amazing!
Ikr, I’ve been looking for that trait.
I agree that the amount is a bit absurd. I think if it gets reduced, giving more upfront would be a good compromise. Makes it less detrimental if you get counterplayed.
For pvp yes. I thought the division titles and the game mode listed in the link gave it away.
I’m so sick of these threads. Mesmer is not OP. There isn’t a single OP class now. Some might need some tweaking, but balance is very good right now. Honestly, I eat mesmers like candy. Maybe you just need to learn when to attack (not during BF or shield), and dodge or aoe the clones.
No and no. If walk onto a node and trigger a trap, guess what? You got trapped. If there’s a DH on other team, I never approach a node without being ready to dodge. The ONLY thing I could support would be a cast time increase, but even that I don’t feel is needed.
You know what else is even more OP than thief? Everything but necro. Let’s nerf all of them until necros reign supreme.
- A Necro Player
O.o
You know all this talk about how much damage PI does is very easy to prove. I already posted a pic of it doing 3k on the npc mesmer. Just use it in a match and post the results. It will likely be 3k or less if you are 1v1, or more in team fights or with vuln/might/bloodlust stacks.
That’s weird, tonight it was all thieves, eles, and necros for me. In fact, I was the only guardian in all my matches tonight.
No one would take a 15% damage nerfed ID on a 10 second cd. EA outweighs it by far.
Ea needs a nerf too then
Let me guess, 10 second cd on it too?