For fractals it’s best you run Berserker gear, as it allows you to deal as much dps even when running support traits. Magi/Minstrels can work, but the healing capabilities doesn’t really matter when you’re in a good group. In a good group, assuming everyone is pulling their own weight (not dying frequently), Berserker’s is better.
While not a lot play raids, a majority does play Fractals daily which is almost half a raid.
Its easier to find 4 players with guildies or friends than 9 slots without looking for group.
And your point is? Raid builds can be applied to fractals. So… the question is still relevant.
Well still how much of a DPS increase would One Wolf Pack+Leader of the Pack would be on a power focused subgroup? For the entire duration, it hits 8+4x4=24*2=48 times maximum. It takes the stats of the ones affected and not the ranger (unlike Thief venoms). With a Daredevil or DH which has lots of modifiers it would increase Soulbeast DPS much. So it would be pretty possible even if SB DPS ends up like 24k~ and it adds so much dps it becomes worth it.
This is just speculation of course :P
While not a lot play raids, a majority does play Fractals daily which is almost half a raid.
0.75 duration dodge isn’t really long though. It would only cover one spell/action for the duration. Adding the fact that we don’t have that much means of generating endurance.
Just pointing out that it is a dps increase but it’s really small. Just want to clear that out.
…Puzzle Jumps !
dodging when you go forward twice.
What a pleb.
It is good. But is it good enough to merit the ‘Elite’ status? nope.
Torch 4 is no dps increase in pve unless you are running a condition build which was very uncommon (and still is) for mesmers in general because our class lends itsself the most to be run as power.
MoP is trash and gets only run because we literally have no better damage utility skill (which actually says a lot about what state our utility skills are in).
Phantasmal disenchanter is the only useful utility phantasm and is so niche that it rarely gets used since our autoattack and shatters already provides enough boon strip for most situations.
SoI only became good once quickness was turned into a boon, so basically shortly before HoT was released.
Portal is basically used to skip most pve content or pressure/defend points in spvp is indeed very powerful and one of the only reasons mesmer stays in certain metas.
The Prestige is a DPS increase due to having a small power scaling and direct damage while also not having a cast time. However it is important to note that The Prestige interrupts your auto chain, which means Mesmers should be using it at the start of the chain to optimize its usage. It is however a really small DPS increase, only about 1k.
MoP isn’t really that trash by Mesmer standards… (1 additional auto per 10 seconds lmao) but yeah in comparison it’s pretty bad to other damaging utilities like Glyph of Storms, DH and ranger traps.
Phantasmal Enchanter is great but it is outclassed by Arcane Thievery when there’s a need to boonstrip (99 nightmare primarily cause of Protection). Other than that most other encounters only need autos to boonstrip.
Go go Power Ranger dream is dead? ;-;
What would be better to use in raids? Oppressive Superiority or One Wolf Pack+Leader of the Pack in a power subgroup?
Oppressive Superiority gives a constant 10% increase but One Wolf Pack+Leader of the Pack combo would be pretty good too especially when you use it on something like KC.
Air and Fire nets you the most spike damage iirc. Force is better for sustained damage, but Air becomes better for Mesmer.
Well, Eles are punished for going into Water and Earth in PvE. Being punished is subjective.
Anyways, Shatter=Stacks is kinda icky for me…. and not to mention there’s a duration tied to it. Also I only thought it was OP cause I thought we’re also applying 25% damage to the Mesmer itself. My mistake there.
I do see its use though mostly with Chronophantasma.
Yeah it’s an interesting interaction. A trait like:
Grant Illusions alacrity whenever you gain alacrity.
Basically it just copies your current alacrity to illusions whenever you gain alacrity. It would increase Phantasm dps but… I don’t know where to put it.
Just tested it out, applying Alacrity to Phantasms make them attack faster. I tested this by summong 3 Sw Phantasms on the Golem and then shattering them so that all of their attacks are on sync through Chronophantasma. Afterwards I casted Well of Recall on one Phantasm to observe if its attack pattern would desync from the other two. Turns out I was right.
From this, would it be a good trait if there was a way for us to share Alacrity with Phantasms? Maybe we could change one of our slow traits in Chrono to sharing Alacrity to Phantasms? Would be a nice addition.
They’re upgrades alright but they should be on 1-2 departments only. Like how Chronomancer upgrades Mesmer’s supportive, utility and control roles properly. Like how Berserker makes Warrior a strong bursty beast. Like how Dragonhunter is a pure upgrade of guardian’s DPS capabilities. Like how Druid becomes a powerful healer. (well Tempest is 100% an upgrade in healing, damage and tanking making it the most poorly designed out of the 1st gen elites.) They are upgrades for sure, but look at Mirage… literally not an upgrade in any way. More like a sidegrade (even worse lol).
I definitely understand people’s frustrations with Mirage, but I think the theme has some potential just that they really undertuned it/were really conservative on the numbers.
If you read my initial comment and understood it, you would see I understood your proposal clearly. The stacks are moved to the Mesmer instead of the Phantasms and the effect affects the Mesmer and the Phantasms. That’s why I said specifically it would also even help out Chrono since Chronophantasma would work well with this new PF.
I said it’s really OP since no other class has a 25% overall damage buff. I guess Tempest Defense and most execution trait has a 20% damage buff (Think Close to Death and similar traits) but those are conditional and can never have 100% upkeep even in PvE. Lowering it to 15% would still make it a DPS buff over the old PF and it would still shift the power from Phantasms to the Mesmer. Just saying no other trait has 100% uptime with a large modifier as 25%.
Edit: Rereading your initial post. It’s quite unclear whether the effect affects the Mesmer or not. Then I read your last comment, yeah you make it clearer that you only want the effect on Mesmer but it doesn’t affect them. Sorry about that.
(edited by Refia Montes.3205)
I would like to have:
1. Number Tweaks – some skills are just too weak.
2. Make Mirage Cloak affect Phantasms – If they can’t make an ambush just make them reset their attack cooldown.
3. Lengthen Mirrors and Ambush windows.
Never said that it didn’t affect Phantasms. It’s OP because a 25% overall damage buff is way too good.
So basically what it does is Phantasmal Force but the stacks on you rather than the Phantasms? And you can only get stacks through shattering and getting might?
It looks weird and clunky to me imo.
Sure, in an organized PvE content it would be better than our current Phantasmal Force since there’s a might stacking warrior in our party to keep up the stacks easily. It would increase DPS by about 4k since our current benchmark is on 30k (17k from Mesmer, 13k from iSwordsmen). It would serve well with Power Chrono as well, since Chronophantasma will synergize well with this trait.
The shattering for stacks also doesn’t make sense. In open world you’ll have a dilemma of whether to shatter your Phantasms or not. As the encounter lengthens and since you will not always have a warrior by your side running around you’re not gonna stack this thing. In PvP, Master of Fragmentation will be better definitely as it enhances all your shatters, and not just your damage.
… but this trait is way too overpowered and doesn’t fit the name of Phantasmal Force. If they’re gonna make a trait like this, they should probably just let all main Mesmer modifiers affect Phantasms, like Force Sigil, Fragility, Superiority Complex affect Phantasms, but that sudden change would really make Mesmer broken in PvE content lol.
Power Mesmer isn’t bad but there are other good choices for DPS cause other DPS classes have cleave and don’t rely on Illusions.
“Ambushes are available on the first skill of every weapon set and are designed to complement each weapon’s playstyle. It’s also possible to force all of your clones to use ambush attacks via the Illusionary Ambush utility skill, or by taking the Infinite Horizon trait, which, when active, applies Mirage Cloak to all of your clones.”
Quoting the dev diary on elites, take it as you will. But it is clear that they want clones to use ambush as well.
It does, so does Blink, Mirage Advance and other skills with no cast time.
Godtier? So let’s see…. Focus has Temporal Curtain which grants swiftness and cripple to anyone who passes through it, pretty weak condition and boons. Then you can shatter it for to pull which is pretty strong if people don’t have Stability yeah it would be pretty effective to combo it with AoE bombs. (lol only bad zergs have no stability). Yeah Temporal Curtain is a pretty good skill.
Then we have Phantasmal Warden. We all know how kittenty illusions are in WvW and obviously Warden is one of the weakest Phantasms alive in PvP/WvW scenarios. In PvE it has it’s use because bosses can be controlled to be stationary and they’ll be able to apply their full skill. In PvP/WvW it doesn’t really do anything other than being Shatter fodder. It doesn’t do anything. People will just walk away from the poor guy in duels. In PvP/WvW it gets easily destroyed lol.
Comparing it to Shield, Shield has a double block that’s invaluable. It also summons 2 Phantasms when you time it right! And these Phantasms aren’t useless either as they provide Alacrity and Slow opponents hit. They do decent damage instantly too!
Then we also have Tides of Time. It’s a god-tier skill. Double stun, doesn’t have a target limit, provides 1.5 secs of Quickness to everyone that passes through it. Sure it has a long ass cooldown but it’s all worth it for it’s power. It also destroys Projectiles?! What?
It’s not for everyone /shrug
Seeing how much I was disappointed with Mirage… I came up with an idea that would really transform Mesmer’s playstyle drasticly. What if we would wield Phantasmal Weaponry which would replace Phantasm skills? Example when you cast Phantasmal Swordsman, instead of getting a strong Phantasm like we always had, we would get Phantasmal Sword in place of our main hand and get new skills in the process. The new skills would replace your 1-3 skills and would have effects basing on the type of Phantasm you were supposed to summon. The name I’m thinking for this kind of spec is Phantomime? Since we’re using our projections of our mind to create weapons, just like how a pantomime acts as if he creates and interacts with objects in solid air. Adding h to the name makes it flavorful since we are using Phantasmal Weaponry and Phantom fits mesmer well too.
The weaponry would match the old skills of the Phantasm. The regular Phantasm attack would be part of the kit and an added additional one, maybe a modified Auto as well? Like using the Phantasmal GS for melee instead of range XD.
Sword gets quick melee Power skills,
GS gets hard hitting Power skills,
Focus gives an Axe that gives Mesmers utility and protection, Torch gives a purply firey sceptre that does lots of Burning with a bit of Fury,
Staff (although needs its Phantasm to be moved to 4/5) gives you a staff that deals lots of Power damage and additional condis,
Pistol would be a control weapon and will also deal lots of bleeds just like our iDuelists.
Lastly, I’ve been thinking of adding another offhand for it to showcase this new Elite’s mechanics, maybe dagger would work? A ranged weapon that bounces on targets. Maybe Power based with a bit of bleeds.
So what happens to our clones? They would still exist, and still act normally. Since we don’t use Phantasms anymore, we are free to Shatter them for rotation! This kind of concept could function really well with base mesmer and having many different Phantasmal Weaponry, we can all choose the playstyle we want!
What are your thoughts on this?
Yeah all three together. But I think Danger Time and Delayed Reactions are fine as is so I wouldn’t really touch them.
If it has a reasonable ICD on the quickness application, say around 12 seconds, then you could only get 1/6 uptime on quickness via this trait, and that’s with 100% boon duration and hoping that you slow an enemy every 12 seconds exactly. That’s not going to turn the quickness rotation into auto attacking with a few wells, it will just make it easier to pull off. Even if the ICD on quickness and alacrity were 20 seconds, it would still provide a bit of a buffer, but not a very big one.
True, but I still think it’s pretty redundant and in PvE it won’t really be picked over Chronophantasma’s utility, since good Chrono’s overcap quickness anyways with perfect rotations. In PvP it could work as a support build. Anyways putting up an ICD that long overcomplicates the skill. One part has an ICD while the other doesn’t.
Even without the ICD, I don’t really see it being picked over Chronophantasma. Slow is just one condition and you need to proc it with crits. Which means you will mostly be running this thing with a Power build, since you’ll need precision to crit (PvP). Because of running a power build you will not be applying that much cover conditions for your opponent to cleanse hence Slow can’t really be applied in long periods.
In PvE I see no use for the trait since applying disabling conditions is not really good and again we have Chronophantasma.
It needs changes that it could be picked over Chronophantasma in certain situations. Ori Ori’s suggestion on Lost Time is okay but I think it’s too strong imo. In PvE it will just make Mesmer use autos with a couple of Wells just to provide Quickness and in PvP it doesn’t really change anything tbh. And I think it kinda overlaps with Seize the Moment already, if it chooses to provide quickness as well.
The only thing that would make Lost Time good if it provided a damage boost/flat damage imo.
(edited by Refia Montes.3205)
The slow traits on Chrono are really underwhelming. Specifically Lost Time and Delayed Reactions. These two traits are never picked in PvP or PvE ever, since Shatter spam is better in PvP and Alacrity and Chrono Phantasma is almost mandatory on PvE.
If they would be competitive with the other traits… Hmmm why not add some flat damage on Lost Time? Like direct damage whenever you slow an enemy? Delayed Reactions also need some help but I think it’s fine as is for now. I see it’s use in PvP if Lost Time gets buffed I’d see how strong it would be. I wouldn’t really touch Danger Time since it has some niche use in PvE.
Edit: Seeing how strong this trait would be in PvE, maybe increase the ICD to 1s?
(edited by Refia Montes.3205)
Fix Mantras and make it a Mantra, makes it much better.
Yep you should never Shatter Phantasms until they’re of no use anymore. Seems counterproductive isn’t it?
He explained in the video, it’s not a review. It’s more of an introduction about the Mirage. He knows that the Mirage has its problems and he’s not there to address it or call them out. He’s just there to introduce the Elite Spec and advertise it. And of course to advertise it he needs to show every trait and Utility and what’s good with all of them.
For PvE, you would only like to go for damage. So most of the utilities Mesmer has are never used in PvE. These includes Veil, Decoy, Signets that are not Moa and Inspiration, most Manipulation skills, most Mantras, most Glamours. I’d say they’re pretty useful in specific builds as the only Elites you will be picking from is TimeWarp, Gravity Well and Moa. And the usage of Timewarp actually allows the Chrono to build more DPS and lose more boon duration in this process. Moa is used when there’s a giant breakbar. Gravity Well for trash mobs. For utilities the only ones that are extensively used are Signet of Inspiration, WoA, WoR, Feedback (which is only used when the boss needs reflects), Mimic. I wouldn’t say they’re useless or niche. They’re part of the meta.
Although Illusion of Life is really bad lmao.
And i still don’t understand usability of such skills as Mimic, Time Warp, Illusion of Life. outside of few encounters or very specific builds – you rarely even touch them.
Sorry, but I have to correct you on this. Time Warp and Mimic have their uses. Time Warp is used mostly on quickness builds on Chronos that have a hard time on maintaining their quickness uptime. It’s also used on Boonshare Chrono in WvW. Mimic also has its use to double some skills (mostly Well of Action), and is used on Inspiration-less builds in PvE to apply permanent quickness to parties.
Onto the topic. Shatters don’t do much in PvE content. And they go against Mesmer’s dps output since it sacrifices Phantasms which make a bulk of our DPS. Another problem is our reliance to Phantasms. Since Phantasms are mostly single target with the exception of Berserker and Warden, they don’t do well against scenarios when lots of cleave is needed.
They could always rework Phantasms to stay like Necro minions but I guess that would be too OP.
tbh this was the only redeeming feature for Mirage for me. Pretty effects O.O
There’s also a small golem version, which lets the ToT hits only two times, 29.2k dps. On large it deals 30.2k dps. In comparison the Sw/Sw and x/Torch does 30.7k dps. About 1.5k dps loss.
Also it’s clunky because most of your damage comes from Phantasms, so Sw/Sw is useless so you have to use your Focus to pull them and used Blurred Flurry only on mobs and Sword Phantasms don’t really help in those scenarios. With Chrono you can use Focus pull to clump them up, use ToT, WoC and Blurred Flurry. Sure for Raid bosses, which one big boss battle where you only have to worry about single target DPS, it’s better. But it has better cleave than core Mesmer in every way just because it has more cleaving skills which makes it worth bringing in dungeons/instances that cleave is a bit needed.
Eh this is not worth arguing about.
TLDR. Power Chrono can do 1k less DPS than Core Mesmer, while bringing more utility and cleave through Tides of Time, WoC and GW. And with those skills it brings Chrono at least close to core Mesmer by just shedding Domi. Imo, have tried playing core Power mes on fractals. It’s freaking clunky, compared to Chrono.
(edited by Refia Montes.3205)
False. Phantasms make up ~40% of our dps, even on condi builds.
40% of our DPS is still a bulk of it.
False, it takes ~10s to get 3 Swordsman up and you’ll have 3 Phantasms up within 3s of starting the fight. The ramp time is mainly getting them buffed, which is a non-issue for Swordsman (+8 Might on Spawn, high attack rate, etc). The slow ramp time on DPS is making up for the initial low burst where you’re casting instead of DPSing (think precasting, but after the fight starts, wasted time).
Umm, yeah 10 seconds. With a different class they just deal dps upfront, not needing to build up Phantasms unlike us. Other classes don’t need to start up.
False. Chrono brings it’s own issues. ChronoPhantasma is a terrible trait to pair with Phantasmal Force as it resets the stacks. You also lose a 15% damage multiplier on Phantasms for dropping Dom. Additionally, you run Chrono 313 because the extra crit rate from Danger Time is a huge stat boost for the Mes (note: this does not affect Phantasms).
The point of bringing Chrono is literally to start the fight with 3 Swordsman instead of waiting for the cooldown to summon the third. Additionally, you get to bring Well of Action for more DPS (lol). You don’t use any shatter after the start of fight cast phase and you get useful utilities (because base mes doesn’t have dps utilities).
Bringing Chronophantasma is worth it for that emergencies when you need to shatter. CCing the boss for his breakbar, Distorting to get out of a sticky situation. In this cases you shatter them and lose a bit of DPS but with Chronophantasma your Phantasms are still up (or some of them) although their PF stacks have reset. Better than nothing ‘yknow. Bringing Chrono also brings a lot of AoE and personal damage to Mesmer and with a perfect and more difficult rotation it can reach as much DPS as Core Mesmer. I can get 29k DPS on Power Chrono without providing any other buffs like a regular Chrono, but at least compared to Core Mesmer, I bring more CC and more Cleave through Tides of Time, Mimic, Well of Calamity and Gravity Well. Also you’re more useful than Core Mesmer against trash mobs.
(edited by Refia Montes.3205)
Also, tested Alacrity on Phantasms way back. It does affect them. It would be interesting if Anet changed one of the useless traits on Chrono to share Alacrity with Phantasms to further push DPS. Like replacing Delayed Reactions for it.
(but except Swordsman also do the lowest damage per hit).
Well this is kinda wrong. We know for infact Swordsman does the most direct damage out of all the Phantasms in realistic scenarios.
On to the matter. Phantasmal Force really augments Mesmer’s DPS cause the bulk of our damage comes from Phantasms. There’s maximized build that uses the new traits Superiority Complex and Phantasmal force that pushes Power DPS into 30k. It works with Core Mesmer Phantasm builds very well, but that’s not to say that the build doesn’t have problems. It has low cleave, long dps downtime due to waiting for our Mesmer to get 3 Phantasms up. It does have the utility of being able to slot 2 free utilities for anything.
There’s a Chrono variant of the Mesmer Phantasm build, and it does just a bit less DPS about (-1k) than the Core Mesmer one, it just replaces Domi with Chrono 3-3-3. It fixes the problems of Core Mesmer variant, which is less reliance on Phantasms, more cleave damage and better utility by allowing us to Shatter our Phantasms through ChronoPhantasma.
This set up has a good mix of burst and maximum DPS for core Mesmer.
You can opt to drop Domination for Inspirations if you need some reflects with Focus.
Carry 2 swords, GS and a Focus.
Power Shatter Chrono?
Inspiration is one of the best lines if you want to survive as long as you can as a Mesmer. Since you’re playing Power Shatter, you will want to avoid that. You want to end engagements as fast as possible so I’d recommend using Dueling instead for Superiority Complex.
Hmm, how about Illusory Weaponry? Casting Phantasms make a bundle instead of producing a Phantasmal clone and each Illusory weapon would have its own unique skills like a kit. For this spec, we will have a new Off hand weapon to provide another Illusory weapon, maybe dagger would be cool with it thematically. This would move away from our reliance from Phantasms and clones in PvE allowing the Mesmer do deal high amounts of damage or even support with the help of the right Illusory weapon.
Hot Boy sounds like a Fan Boy at this point.
Posted by: Refia Montes.3205
From a Mesmer main that was excited about Mirage on reveal, I got disappointed over time as more information on the spec was released.
I think Mirage Cloak is a pretty cool mechanic that you can dodge even when doing actions, allowing you to do stuff uninterrupted. In PvP this has many uses, as this allows you to dodge CC while doing a stomp. This also allows you to cast skills with long cast times without worrying much about enemies.
I like Mirage Cloak, and they even added ambush attacks for each respective weapon. This idea excited me more as this can give new skills to our old weapons, giving us variety on our old sets. Sadly, the numbers on the ambushes are all undertuned and not impactful enough to be taken. They all need large buffs to be a lot stronger than our autos. At least make them as strong as thief’s stealth attacks. Additionally, the window of time to use the ambush attack is way too short. Should have at least 3 seconds of time to engage the ambush attack.
The traits on the line are a mess. Some of them are downright useless and some of them are pretty good, but my current gripe is that the traitline doesn’t have anything that offers good support of Power play styles. Sure you can trait for defenses in the line, but having some power modifiers would be great for PvE and to some extent PvP as well. It’s like there’s no other way for Mirage to play other than spamming conditions and ‘Confusion’ onto the enemy. Thematically, a Mesmer swordsman has lots of ways to evade as well and make use of Mirage magic.
The heal, utilities and elite are all fine for me. They seem to be way undertuned for what they do, having high cooldowns that doesn’t make them worth picking over core Mesmer skills. For example False Oasis is a good heal, but its high cooldown and heal over time make it worse than Ether Feast, a heal that base Mesmer has. Needs a lot of tuning here and there but I think the functions of each Utility is good enough.
Axe skills are pretty… but they’re trash. All of them needs numbers tuning and some fixes. Axe 2 is clunky to use in PvP scenarios, should have a short evade during the animation. Axe 3 is great but… it never hits in PvP, so it should be looked on.
There are a lot of contradictory design choices with Mirage too. Firstly in PvE, Mesmer depends a lot on Phantasms for their damage and DPS. I get that clones are the focus of Mirage, but whatever clones do even with ambush attacks, Phantasms are better and more reliable. They have more health and damage and synergizes more with core Mesmer. Would be better if Mirage makes all illusions stronger, not just clones and includes Phantasms. Give Phantasms an ambush skill or else they’re a dead skill in our skill bar. Or if not, just let them reset Phantasm skills whenever they gain Mirage Cloak.
So let’s throw away GS and Sword and pretend that they don’t exist.
Self Deception has no place, cause it’s horribly weak. Make it so that every Deception skill summons a clone and regardless how many you currently have. Or change the whole thing, and make it so that it gives you additional damage % whenever you activate Deception skills for 5 seconds.
Nomad’s Endurance shouldn’t focus on Condi only. True Axe is a condi weapon and this spec looks like a condi Spec thematically, but you can still use Greatsword and Sword with this spec. Change it so it benefits both builds.
Shards of Glass chancey mechanic that’s contradicting with the Mirage’s concept. Are we really supposed to Shatter clones for more ambushes? I get that we need a trait that makes more Mirage Mirrors, but wouldn’t it be better if it was just summoned Mirage Mirrors on some intervals in combat? though Mirage Mirror’s concept is clunky to begin with.
Infinite Horizon is really useful… making your clones a lot stronger, but from tests. Obviously Phantasms are superior to them in every way. So in the end this won’t be even picked over Dune Cloak in PvE just because Phantasms are always better. Phantasms need ambushes too/work with Mirage Cloak. If they can’t make ambushes altogether, just make it so that it resets their skills.
Other traits are fine, just needs some number adjustments so that they don’t feel underwhelming.