Guild Wars 2

It’s a waste of a slot if there’s a decent thief, rev or guardian on the enemy team. It’s a great pick if you have to suffer through facing two warrs though.

You’ve all mentioned skills that are at least used.

I nominate Signet of Undeath.

Spectral Grasp gets an honorary mention for still being terrible all these years despite all the cooldown reductions and whatnot.

Well, I’m getting a refund for sure if they reduce the size of it.

It’s perfect the way it is.

Lahmia.2193:

The funniest thing is when you see these youtube videos in which someone gets 25 – 30k dps on the golem with a necro. Only to find they’re running full unrealistic buffs.

Barely matters for Condi Necro in its current iteration tbh. Realistic boons is like 1k-1.5k lower than Unrealistic.

Sublimatio.6981:

ps. the rotation doesn’t feel awkward. its actually pretty awesome and tight!

Feels terrible tbh. Maybe it just takes some getting used to. I doubt it, but who knows.

Sublimatio.6981:

the condi rotation with gs and soul reaping gave me 28.5.

Honestly, the GS should probably be dropped from that build. It will be dead weight when you can’t reliably do ice field finishers, not to mention how awkward it makes the entire rotation feel. In the pic I posted earlier I was using good old S/D + S/D in the new build. I just can’t picture condi GS working even remotely as well in raids with all the ethereal fields from chrono and fire fields from condi ranger etc.

Eponet.4829:

Aktium.9506:

On the bright side of things, both condi and power specs have similar dps benchmarks now.

With or without epidemic bouncing?

Without.

Bouncing Epi would require you to run 2 Necros. A single Necro is enough of a detriment so one should never even bother to factor in Epi. Not to mention only one gets to ping it back to the boss.

DTATL.9641:

Aktium.9506:

On the bright side of things, both condi and power specs have similar dps benchmarks now.

Awww yeah! we can now fight with condi mesmer for a spot in the team!
Future is looking bright.
uuh, wait a second…

But seriously though it’s nice that neither condi or power is massivly better than the other. So we are at least balanced by ourselves.

I’ll take what I can get. It’s not a nerf, which is about as good as we can hope for.

On the bright side of things, both condi and power specs have similar dps benchmarks now.

kakumbien.8047:

Are you serious about using deathly chill in power builds ? Seriously ? What ?

The other traits are 100% useless for a power build. You should never actually enter RS unless you have to use RS2 for mobility or to soak damage. It’s a massive dps loss compared to GS auto above 50% and Gravedigger sub 50%.

Zenith.7301:

you pull out a big godkitten ed scythe and it turns out it only tickles.

Well, it is made out of feathers after all.

Zenith.7301:

buff Reaper Shroud so it’s actually a DPS form you build up life form for.

You would have to more or less double the power damage modifiers on Reaper Shroud then. Reaper Shroud only clocks in at about a 18k~ benchmark.

Kahrgan.7401:

Aktium.9506:

Sublimatio.6981:

Aktium.9506:

Disregarding pinging Epidemics, which would require two Necs, Power DPS benchmark is higher than Condi since the Jagged Horror nerf.

I just tried rotations with all buffs 4mln large golem – power got me 26.5k, condi got me 24.1k.
that being said, condi dps didnt account for thorn rune bonus – with it condi would outdps power. add epidemic and you get a huge dps difference.

bonus info: because gs auto had reduced aftercasts, it got me 2k more dps than rotating between dagger and shroud! actually camping gs is now better

Ye, when I was doing my dps tests a while back I came to the conclusion that using dagger, shroud or any combination of them results in a dps loss regardless of the rotational configuration. Camping GS is top dps.

Compared to 36k thief, or 39k ele :P thats still a significant difference.

Well yes, it’s only good in the context of Necro builds. I never said anything else. Functionality-wise, a Power Nec fills sort of the same function as a Guardian with hammer build. Except Power Nec does 1k less dps benchmark, less prot uptime, less party healing and less breakbar dmg. But it’s an alternative to Condi for sure. I refuse to believe Thorns adds 4k~ dps to the benchmark. I could be wrong of course since I haven’t done the math. And Epi pinging is irrelevant because if you’re running Necro in raids its most likely because you’re either stubborn and refuse to not play your main or because its the only character you’ve got properly geared. So the chances of ever having a 2 Nec comp are relatively low. Not to mention Epi only boosts one of the Necro’s dps. It’s not Power that needs to be buffed, It’s Necro as a whole because both Condi and Power are lackluster nowadays. I think nerfing other classes down to similar levels is a better way to do it though.

Sublimatio.6981:

nice rng, or did you use night sigil?

Nah, Force/Air.

Sublimatio.6981:

Aktium.9506:

Disregarding pinging Epidemics, which would require two Necs, Power DPS benchmark is higher than Condi since the Jagged Horror nerf.

I just tried rotations with all buffs 4mln large golem – power got me 26.5k, condi got me 24.1k.
that being said, condi dps didnt account for thorn rune bonus – with it condi would outdps power. add epidemic and you get a huge dps difference.

bonus info: because gs auto had reduced aftercasts, it got me 2k more dps than rotating between dagger and shroud! actually camping gs is now better

Ye, when I was doing my dps tests a while back I came to the conclusion that using dagger, shroud or any combination of them results in a dps loss regardless of the rotational configuration. Camping GS is top dps.

Disregarding pinging Epidemics, which would require two Necs, Power DPS benchmark is higher than Condi since the Jagged Horror nerf.

Just give us the ability to use the /gg command from raids in PvP.

The placement games are fine, they do need to the add class stacking prevention they use for tournaments to ranked though. I don’t mind the higher queue times.

If I was a salty person I would be saltier than the Dead Sea about losing 2 of my placements games because of 3 necros in one match and 3 thieves in another.

After some quick DPS tests I’m getting 18 500-19 000 dps with qTs realistic buffs on the standard condi build, 18k on GS only with Soul Eater build and 20k on Dagger above 50% Gravedigger below 50% with Decimate Defenses.

So it’s about a 3k dps loss on golems compared to pre-nerf for condi. Should be a bigger loss in actual fights.

Well this more or less kills Necro as competitive DPS in raids. Since without JHs you do less DPS than a PS warrior.

What a shame. It’s a good thing raids aren’t hard enough that it actually matters, still.

The solution is not to buff Necro’s defensive or offensive capabilities. The solution is to nerf everything that was introduced with the HoT release in varying degrees. Make the numbers game smaller and LF will naturally become a stronger defensive tool.

NovaanVerdiano.6174:

Name one thing only condi (necros) can solo.
Because even back then there were solos of old 50 cliffside etc. on power classes and whatnot. As long as the content doesn’t have mechanics that prevent you from soloing it, it can be soloed by someone, even if the content wasn’t scaled with a single player in mind.

I haven’t actually tried with other classes, but I imagine some of the chak champions with all those adds in the hot maps would be a bit tricky to do without epidemic and contagion since there’s a lot of unavoidable damage. Probably not impossible for other classes to solo though. Just more difficult.

I can’t relate to any of those mistakes.

what happens if a necro uses this on another necro in shroud?

Was pretty good all in all.

All the necro downstates did crack me up though.

Holl.3109:

There is only one way to use it. Scrubs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XvaUasILUY

You know as well as me that WvW scenarios are utterly irrelevant when talking about balance, man. Especially considering BB without dumplings.

Mea.5491:

So when did we start hating GS? When Reaper came out, everyone was happy with it.

When Reaper came out no one really knew what the kitten they were doing with their elite specs. People mostly know what the kitten they’re doing now and thus its widely accepted that GS is trash.

It also helped that when Reaper came out, Reaper had Blighter’s Boon before it got nerfed to kitten.

Josh Davis.6015:

Thoughts?

I still think the Downed penalty should be added to PvP.

Even if the class I main would end up suffering the most for it.

Rym.1469:

You don’t generally use Death’s Charge, unless for mobility. It sucks dong for proccing any effects, since they occur on 9th hit.

Actually the small hits on the Shroud 2 skill do procc Barbed Precision. So if you’re standing in melee range its definitely worth using just before Shroud 5 for the 5-8 bleeds from Barbed Precision since you can also buffer Shroud 5 during Shroud 2 to make it cast slightly faster.

Aeolus.3615:

Yeah that purification can heal alot :\

11k-15k(with full regen boon duration) heal on full potato mode (healing stats).

What?

Activating Purification on Marauder stats with not a single point in Healing Power heals for a total of 11 865 in the meta builds, even if you exclude Smiter’s Boon procc it’s still 9 905 healing. There’s not a single class with a heal as overtuned as Purification.

Holy kitten no.

What is needed is lots and lots of nerfs for all classes and elite specs.

I’ve said it before and I’m saying it again.

Making everyone OP is not balance.

It. Is. Not. Balance.

The smaller you make the numbers the easier it will be to do shave balancing like they intended to do. But the more power creep you introduce to a game the harder it becomes to balance and the chances of even tiny changes having massive repercussions, usually for the worse, increases.

TheDevice.2751:

They’ve actually completely denied then an entire damage path. if you play necro, you have to play conditions.

As someone who played power necro from launch to HoT launch I’m going to play devil’s advocate here and point out that power necro is a more viable build for necro than burn builds are for guardian.

Going core with Curses/Death/Blood over the old Curses/Death/Reaper is somewhere around a 15% dps loss, closer to 20-25% if your group has high alacrity uptime. That’s under ideal circumstances of course, it’s less if you consider that you aren’t going to be pulling of chilling bolts every time you use shroud 4 because there might be another field under it that you combo instead, and it’s a dps loss if it’s ever anything but an ice field. Having Blood specced does of course also grant vampiric aura which is a sick 3-5% dps boost for your subgroup. So you can go core if you want. Unless you’re going for speedclears it doesn’t really matter much. It’s nice to have Transfusion if you don’t trust your teammates though.

The DH F3 and Purification are without a doubt the biggest offenders in making DH obligatory over core Guardian. Proper shaves on those two and nothing else should need to be nerfed or changed about DH as long as other equally imbalanced things in other especs are shaved accordingly as well. DH is much less of a problem than Druid, Warr and Rev anyway.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Can confirm, this build is pretty fkd up right now XD

Do we start shouting nerf Druid now, or wait a while for it to catch on? :p

There’s no need to wait for it tbh. Druids have been a bigger problem in the higher tiers than DH since the season start in my experience. Admittedly not build OP is playing.

Then again, we need massive nerfs for everything in PvP.

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/The_Guild_Wars

I’d rather have a core spec only week tbh.

Cynz.9437:

Aktium.9506:

Cynz.9437:

And you need a group for it too. Most of the groups have really idiotic requirements so,

I personally don’t agree with linking LI’s and whatnot, but I have understanding of why they do it though. A single bad player can cause the group to wipe for hours after all. So the paranoia is warranted.

This stuff really would be fixed if there just were proper DPS + healing and boon uptime meters so you could simply see if someone is slacking, alas.

Cynz.9437:

if you play undesired class XY, you might never get into raid, ever.

There is no undesired class though. All classes have a good meta build for raids.

Tell it to every thief in s1. 0 chance to get into any group because of crappy balance. Even now finding group as a thief is close to impossible unless you are in a guild and BFFs with GM.

That was then tho. It ain’t then now. The current raid meta has Thief is in a really good place where it’s usually better for small/medium hitbox bosses than Ele, but outperformed by Ele on the large hitbox ones.

gavyne.6847:

Aktium.9506:

gavyne.6847:

+1, I welcome anybody to go 1v1 on a point vs Toker. A good power rev can work a necro without lifeforce before you can blink..

You shouldn’t be going 1v1 with no life force to begin with tho.

To be honest often you don’t have a choice, as a good rev would always hunt down a necro as target #1 in any solo or team fights. They have perm swiftness, and with Phase Traversal, you don’t get to choose that engagement.

Tru, but getting mowed down in a teamfight because you had no life force is a whole different thing than picking a fight with a rev 1v1 with no life force.

In the former it’s just the way of things, you’ll get downed, there’s no real way around it and mostly likely you’ll get picked up again if there’s a druid or engi nearby. And then you’ll actually have some life force. In the latter it’s the necro being a dumbkitten and feeding instead of just going somewhere where he can be of use.

Cynz.9437:

And you need a group for it too. Most of the groups have really idiotic requirements so,

I personally don’t agree with linking LI’s and whatnot, but I have understanding of why they do it though. A single bad player can cause the group to wipe for hours after all. So the paranoia is warranted.

This stuff really would be fixed if there just were proper DPS + healing and boon uptime meters so you could simply see if someone is slacking, alas.

Cynz.9437:

if you play undesired class XY, you might never get into raid, ever.

There is no undesired class though. All classes have a good meta build for raids.

gavyne.6847:

+1, I welcome anybody to go 1v1 on a point vs Toker. A good power rev can work a necro without lifeforce before you can blink..

You shouldn’t be going 1v1 with no life force to begin with tho.

Raids are a nice alternative to PvP.

It’s a shame there’s only one in the game and its over in 2h on average and then you have to wait a week until you can get rewards again.

Josh Davis.6015:

We’ve been talking about personal score a bit. I’m personally of the opinion that it isn’t representative of a player’s effort in a given match, and it also can be incredibly misleading and potentially lead to bad gameplay habits (5-capping home).

If you were to redesign personal score, what would you do? Does it track different types of stats? Would you want your personal stats displayed to other players?

A global pop-up at the end of the match with a little compiled list of the stats in the Combat tab that you can look at post-game with the people who topped them listed would be super rad.

Kinda like pic related, but like, prettier.

Ravezaar.4951:

Velon.5016:

What kind of nerf was it?

50% dmg reduction to 33%

not sure if the cd was increased aswell..

They decreased the health of Shambling Horrors by 25% and their toughness by 20% as well.

Ravezaar.4951:

Hesacon.8735:

Revs should never kill a CONDI necro 1v1.

corrected it.

them feelerinos when glint heal inside your wells

Anchoku.8142:

If you are gathering hero points, power is best. Condition damage is the only viable build for raids and PvP but power is OK or better for other content.

Not entirely true. Even all on your own you can still average about 11-13k dps on the raid build and you can just slot parasitic contagion to make all hero point champs in hot maps into a complete joke.

Velimere.7685:

Aktium.9506:

Shaogin.2679:

I’m sorry, but who is seeing power necros in ranked pvp?

power nec is luv
power nec is lyfe

Dragonhunter can do just as much damage while taking a lot less.

The difference is that DH is for plebs tho.

Sunshine.5014:

Aktium.9506:

Shaogin.2679:

I’m sorry, but who is seeing power necros in ranked pvp?

power nec is luv
power nec is lyfe

I’m sorry you had an Ele on your team. You could have won that game.

Aww don’t be like that. Having a pocket Ele isn’t far from pocket Engi from a Necro’s perspective. The ressing capability is worse but the active healing and support is better. If you never go down, tough very unlikely, I’d say it’s better to have an Ele at your side as a Nec.

Shaogin.2679:

I’m sorry, but who is seeing power necros in ranked pvp?

power nec is luv
power nec is lyfe

R O C.6574:

You might not have a defensive ‘skill’, but you have a second life bar… aka damage sponge

If we’re getting technical about it, Shroud is in RPG terms more akin to a mana shield than an actual health bar. It’s also the biggest weakness of Necro in general. Disregarding the two dodges every class has, all classes except Necro do possess some manner of skill that negates damage rather than mitigates it. This means that even though they might have less health they can potentially tank an infinite amount of damage in the time frame where their iframes are active. Which is never the case of Necro.