Guild Wars 2

ArtemusHunter.9521:

After two days of farming semi-casually, I’m at around 830 drinks basically from the karma vendor and farming the activities(mostly bell choir). I never considered the selling gifts to buy drinks method. Mostly because I didn’t want to deal with the TP at all for this.

I currently believe I’m well on track to farm the drinks out, but with the TP method, that makes this seem a whole lot easier. The price gap seems to have closed though.

You’re getting most of the stuffs from completing the Meta-objective.
You also got those one-time bonus from completing the AP.

After you finished them, you have to finish the remaining 9000 by grinding JP or Bell Choir.

People are mad because this is not the first time post HoT. (Nightfury being the first)
People are seeing this has starting to become a trend now post HoT.

The time-limit also makes things even worse. (There’s no time limit for Night-fury)

Btw, calling people who have incentive for something as"greedy and needy" is plain immature. Everyone is greedy and needy, every incentive is driven by greed and need.
Otherwise there’s no point of doing anything.

Azure.8670:

Since HoT I’ve seen more necros in fractals than any other class. Reaper and dh everywhere

Reaper condition dps is so great, that it’s slightly lower than Engi’s “perfect rotation” (which is extremely tedious and complicated and narrow), but higher than anyone else.

But the vast versatility it can bring, from excessive CC to hard tank to damage reduction to condition spread to condition transfer is just too great to give-up. The rotation is also very simple yet flexible too!

Check this post if you don’t believe me:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/3uyisk/condition_reaper_crazy_damage_potential/

Zephyra.4709:

It’s not hard nor difficult. I believe the word(s) you are looking for is either timely in realistically; a very short time span so impossible or costly if one chooses to buy their way through the achievement.

Hopefully there is a “consume all” option for stacks.

Stuff like this already existed in GW1; I am glad to see it make a comeback in GW2.

Even Thirst Slayer achievement exists here.

Difference is GW1 counts ALL ales, and there’s no TIME LIMIT to gain the achievement.

GW2 counts ale coming from presents, which then only come out during wintersday, and only when doing the winterdays event.

GW1 also have all the ales counted for the AP sold by NPC, while GW2 forces you to play with TP and let the market determines the price, which is often overpriced due to lack of supply and huge demand.

I can only shake my head that people even bring GW1 to compare to GW2 now, since their objective and goal now are nothing alike at all since HoT.
Every of GW2 post HoT is a grind-fest and gold sink. Period.

I’m a GWAMM player from GW1, and I can tell you that aside from things like Lucky and Unlucky, or Party Animal/Sweet Tooth, there’s nothing in GW1 that can be called grind. There’re just too many objectives/goals to work for. Hard-mode and map completion is probably the best thing GW1 ever implanted. It satisfies both casuals and hard-core players alike. They even afford ot make new challenging free-to-play story line before GW2 launch! (The new Cathan side-story is so challenging and very satisfying when beated. It’s nothing like GW2’s grind-fest for shiny items)

Gambit.8425:

I felt the need to express my thanks for making the best Winterdays event this far.

Why:

• No inventory clutter.
• No time gating.
• Less grinding.
• New titles.
• Better rewards.
• New, useful food
• Good Karma dump for Asc. crafting.
• The karma for presents, presents for karma feels fresh to do and very suitable for the season.

We’re two days into the event and I’ve had about 1000 drinks from casual playing, so I don’t get all the whine about the shoulder piece. Drinks can even be bought on TP if someone want it now, or a solid income if not, and we don’t even need that achievement for Meta to be completed. So a very nice, relaxing event this year compared to previous years, which I appreciate immensely. Thanks for a job well done!

You got your 1k drink from one time bonus while you work for DIFFERENT ACTIVITIES.

Rest is up to you to grind for yourself.
60 hrs of JP or 100 hrs of Choir Bell, choose which route of suffering you’re taking.

Depend on which class you play.

If you’re playing a MM Necro or Ranger, ofc it’d be easy.

DoctorDing.5890:

In reality, most people that manage the title in the festival will do it with a combination of all the methods. The presents drop like confetti from everything, there are free ones, there are ones you can buy with Karma, and you can buy presents or booze directly off the TP.

Yes, it will take a certain amount of dedication and gold but it’s definitely do-able in the three or so weeks we have and, you know, some things in the game are not meant to come easy.

But whatever you do, don’t ignore that Karma guy. An easy way to turn Karma into drinks or gold.

And dev is smart enough to make presents progressively more expensive after each expenditure, end up with 3.7k karma per one present for that day.

If all presents is a consistent 1000 karma, then it’d be much more reasonable.
(Although whether 10 mils karma for a shoulder is worth it or not is debatable)

Gaile Gray.6029:

I am not sure that I will be able to find out the answers to your questions, Starfall, but I’ll see if the devs are able to tell me the details you’ve requested.

(As a GW veteran and official Life of the Party and Incorrigible Ale-Hound, I’m thinking about going for the beverage thing myself. )

Well, ofc you’d get all the beverage for free.
I don’t expect you have so much time to grind this for the duration of Wintersday, nor do I think you can endure it. (Most couldn’t. 60 hrs of JP or 100 hrs of Choir Bell in 3~4 weeks is beyond ridiculous)

Hint of making “fun” design and objective:

Make your own Devs do it. If they can finish it without any complaint and have fun while doing it, you have your design right. If they give-up half-way or think there’s no point, you have your design atrociously wrong.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Caladrius.6594:

Soooo… basically if you’re a casual gamer and/or have something more to do the coming days you’re not getting the shoulders… that’s great, well done Anet

(Looks at the requirements for the Nightfury shoulders)

You didn’t actually think that they would have this new Holiday shoulders easily available for the masses now, did you? So far that’s not what they’ve been doing.

They used to give-out those things from holiday more easily, by completing the Meta AP.

Nice try, but 1 hr for 1000 drinks is greatly over-estimate, if not out-right exaggerating / lying.

Assuming you make PERFECT run, a minimum run for JP would be 2.5 mins. (This is including loading screen and opening the chest and returning to starting point)

Assuming there’s a margin of error you could screwed up some times due to RNG box explode or you misclicked, let’s average up the number to 3 mins per run.

Each run grants you exactly 10 presents, so an hr of JP will net you 200 presents.
Each present has around 85% chance of getting an alcohol drink, so 200 presents will give you around 170 alcohol points.

You’d need to do this JP AT LEAST 58.82 hrs, or 60~ hrs of JP to finish this.
Assuming the event lasts for 3 weeks, you’d need to do around 3~ hrs of JP EVERY SINGLE DAY to get this shoulder.
If you are going to vacation (and have no choice) during Wintersday for a week or so,
you’d only have 14 days to gather 12000 presents. You now need to do around 4.3 hrs of JP EVERY SINGLE DAY to get the shoulder.

Your statistic is completely off.
3~4 hrs of JP everyday is by no means casual.
Forcing you to do JP for 3~4 hrs everyday is beyond the definition of outrageous too.
I see no causality here.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

lighter.2708:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Aomine.5012:

Burtnik.5218:

Youre not supposed to beat necro with condi.

Olny necro is supposed to faceroll condi builds with condi -Anet 2015

Duuhm Fire with no ICD helps too.

People were complaining about old Duuhm Fire and Incendary Powder, but now Necro has a 2nd perma burning called chill, on top of AOE attack frequency burning from Reaper’s shroud. Stacking 7 stacks of Torments or 12 stacks of poison in ONE cast doesn’t help either.

Not to mention they can deal with conditions while spamming them like crazy while you can’t do anything about it.

You could try…I don’t know..avoiding some of the attacks? Soul Spiral should always be gotten out of ASAP since it hits as hard as Gravedigger before accounting for the poison. Executioner’s Scythe should also be avoided and don’t stand in the ice field. That is where the Chill comes from. This seems obvious, but I see people doing it all the time.

I know Mallyx Revenants have gotten used to just ignoring condition attacks, but it really isn’t impossible to beat a condi Necro with any profession. Mallyx Heralds should still have a strong shot at it, since they only observe the conditions about 40% of the time anyway. Necro boonstrip has cooldowns, after all.

doesn’t matter if you avoid executioner’s scythe or chill shout or all the reaper attacks

you die by no cast time plague signet, which transfer 5 conditions also corrupt 2 boons and it’s 1200 range…

So once that pops, hit Pain Absorption. Bam, you aren’t dying to those (up to) 7 condis. The more allies in the area, the less you have to worry about it. If they’re running Curses with Plague Sending, that one can be baited out with a single stack of 3 different condis. You know it’s coming, so save some energy for when it does. Or bait its stunbreak functionality early so they can’t use it for 24 seconds.

And yes, you can see when Plague Signet pops, as the icon appears over the Necro’s head.

Basically it means Mallyx Rev need to outplay Reaper by 300% to remotely have a chance of beating it right now. On similar skill level, Reaper should never lose to condition Rev.

You have a 30 cd oh-kitten bottom, one chance of beating Reaper. If you mess one thing up, or he removes that long duration resistance from you, you’re a goner since you have no other tool to deal with condition anymore.

Let’s be honest, even strong condition cleansers like DH and Druid has some trouble against the massive Reaper’s condition spam. A one-trick ponny spec which its trick is being taken away with no compensation has no place in the current Meta.

Btw, Idk what build you’re facing, but how on earth do I see GRAVEDIGGER, a useless GS from Reaper in one of your posts? Condition reaper uses Scept+dagger with staff.

Btw, you way underestimate the chill source of Reaper. The good ones utilize combo field and staff. And chill is not even the biggest problem of Reaper.

Makai.3429:

Silvatar.5379:

Makai.3429:

The real world makes many accommodations for disabled people. Why should GW2 be any different? People are requesting alternatives to acquiring the skin: not handouts.

++++++1

I work within the disability community and the lack of understanding and empathy here is incredibly disturbing. This issue is not about “entitlement” or asking for “handouts”. It is not even about making the achievement easier. People are just asking for Anet to design the game to accommodate a wider demographic by creating more options. There is no logical reason that the jp has to be part of the achievement, nor does it have to be removed. All that is required of Anet would be to create more options for HOW one completes the achievement to get the shoulder skin. It already does this for many things, such as dailies, were you can pick which tasks to do in order to complete the overarching achievement.

Furthermore, “practicing” is not always the answer. Yes, practice will help many people but for others, practice alone will not enable them to overcome serious disadvantages like missing limbs; deteriorating reflexes; serious medical impairments; or, countless other challenges.

No one is asking for the impossible – a game that is everything to everyone, but there is no reason why Anet could not provide people with more options for how they obtain something as special as the winter day shoulder armour, especially considering the time of year :/

Happy Winterday….

Clearly these people just don’t get it: it’s not at all about entitlement or marginalizing the challenge: it’s all about leveling the playing field (just like many government and private institutions attempt in real life). Hopefully they’ll have a greater understanding and appreciation for this issue as they get older.

I’ve worked in publishing for several years, and like most magazines, my company moved to digital exclusive in early 2014. The platform we used was not as friendly for people with limited vision as we originally thought, and as such we switched to a different program with greater zoom functionality, audio cues for turning certain pages, and other necessary features to help our audience. Getting our graphics designer accustomed to the new system was a bit rocky at first, but it turned out well in the end. A few weeks later we received many emails from subscribers and advertisers thanking us for the switch, and letting us know they would help promote the publication out of appreciation for our goodwill.

Obviously companies cannot account for every disability, but Anet should strive to create greater accessibility where and when it can (How long has the colorblind thread been up? I still can’t place bombs in the Dredge fractal.): it’s not just ethical; it’s smart business.

On a personal aside, thank you for your service to the disabled community.

Yeah, they should also strive for being inclusive for all the casuals too.

Not many people have the time/mind to seriously grind through 12000~ presents for 10000 drinks. They’d have more success not just being inclusive to the diabilities, but also people who realistically don’t have that much time from real life to realistically grind through 12000 presents. Those are the adult customers that’d actually more likely to spend Gem on Gem store if they’re happy in-game, since they usually would just buy stuffs from Gem Store due to having limited time for in-game gold.

Riku.4821:

As stated this is not really HoT related.
Second locking titles, and other cosmetic behind long tasks, especially consuming holiday items is something they have always done. It is just the first time in gw2. It was all over gw1 and still accepted.

As it seems the collection isn’t going anywhere. And as Arena Net is famous for. Next year will be a other chance to get the drinks. Or buy the gifts way later in the year for cheap and get the drinks.

Gw2 has always had the problem of no prestige factor with cosmetics. Dungeon armor, everyone had, mystic forge skins no one cared for, fractal skins were not very good. Legendries’ I am assuming 75% of players bought them.
So then came the Halloween skins you could earn by RNG, the first year ones. They cost more than most legendary weapons on the TP. And so on.

Now we come to the current. Where we have a mystic forge recipe that costs a lot of gold, and is also more costly than more legendary weapons.
People complained about the RNG.

Now we have a collection for the next prestige skin, 80% of it is is doing the holiday events and making a few easy mystic forge items. The rest is drinking consumables that you get foe just playing

These skins are suppose to take time to give prestige. I have only seen two people with nightfury, and 1 with the snow one.

This is good, it adds what the game needs. Just my two cents. I know people will complain about needing to grind for something they want fir free or cheap. But it is what it is, and remember it is an optional thing to do.

If you want prestige, work for hellfire Armor like I did (30k AP).
Work for HOPE/ASTRALLIA/ NEVERMORE to keep your prestige. (Not many can afford it, it’s more tedious than Winter’s Embrace)

We don’t need every supposedly festival that has nothing new for years, and only has minor rewards gating behind grindfest or gold wall.

Seriously, this game doesn’t need 0.0001% happy customer and 99% angry customers.
This game need to make 99% customers happy instead. It does way more harm than good to kitten up 99% of player-base with this type of kitten every single events.

insanemaniac.2456:

i wonder if op has been around for past festivals where the achievements were actually as grindy as he is suggesting they should be and if he remembers the grindyness complaints.

And those grindy ap does not tied to any skin at all back then.

Nike.2631:

Aidenwolf.5964:

This reads quite differently now.
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/is-it-fun-colin-johanson-on-how-arenanet-measures-success/

That reads like bad comedy now.

This post from 2012 makes me feel extremely sad.

Now every word the post makes any sense now. All of them are lies and contradiction now.

Look at the new Precursor system, and look at the Season reward we’re getting post HoT: Nightfury and Winter’s Embrace. All of those decisions are work against the concept of fun and only push the number of log-ins like all the subscription games.

Look at the linear design of all the Meta-Events and Fractal and Raid now.

I actually miss living story 1 very much , since it really makes me attach to game with fun thing to do more, and actually reward me for my effort.

ZachAttack.3957:

Firelysm.4967:

ZachAttack.3957:

Guys. Nightfury was hundreds of times worse than this. The ONLY costly part is the drinks. Just about every component of nightfury was costing in the hundreds of gold. And think about it- what kind of “special” item would it be if just about every player in the game could get it? You don’t HAVE to get it- heck, I don’t even really care about it because I don’t feel like having no shoulder skin.

You forget that this game is not getting enjoyable, and it’s getting contradictive of what anet have said! They promised us that we won’t need to grind like we grind in other games… But the reality is even worst, we have go HORD AND GRIND. There is not a single event or thing … that would let us enjoy content…

Why cant they give 50x win every event in wintersday, then you get your achievements done… why do we need 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 drinks?

I’m hardcore player, and i find this absurd due to one reason, there is a lot of enjoyable content in this wintersday holidays, and we should do events to accomplish achievements, not toasting 10.000 times where is the fun here?

This ONE achievement brought ABSURD BAD GAMING EXPERIENCE to literally every player that came to the point where he needed to get 10.000 junk drinks.

I’m sorry, this is just bad design team that decides what and how many things we need to acquire to get the desired item.. If you ask me they could remove 9900 drinks… keep 100 drinks in, and rise the event expectations to win.. from 3x > 50×.. and this would be a lot more enjoyable!

It kittenes me off that i was growing up with ArenaNet and now they became backstabbers.

EDIT:
There are things that are fun and awesome, mostly 95% of the content, and there is this 3% that we are ok with, and there is 2% that destroys every kind of gaming experience that was pleasant warm and fuzzy.. gone in a blink of an eye!…

Ehm… ANet said that all of the grind should be OPTIONAL, not that there would be no grind at all. Heck, look at legendaries- those are a hell of a grind! You do not NEED the shoulder skin- while I agree that they could lower the amount there is literally NO point in having a cool skin if everyone else in the game can get it. When you feel something is an acceptable place in regards to grind:reward, the odds are a lot of other people will too- which then makes you no longer a special snowflake (literally, because everyone else will have the snowflakes too and yours won’t be special xP).

As someone who already made Bolt by myself with 80% of materials collected by myself, I would say it’s less grindy and more reasonable than 10000 presents/ 1000g in 3 weeks.

Dejavu.2349:

Hakuryuu.8634:

You’re complain about grinding for COMESTICS. They’re entirely optional, and no one force you to do so. No one is going to crap on you for not having one. You won’t die without it. You choose to commit to the grind yourself, and even though ANet has been a kitten lately, don’t stab yourself and blame it on them.

This game is about cosmetics. it always has been, as it is not your traditional (thank goodness) Linear MMO model.

The big problem here is that they were not content to make fluff grinds ridiculous in their regular HOT content (read the forums – this is an issue for many many people who have been playing GW2 since BETA, many of whom came from GW1. These are not people are aren’t used to working for stuff… These are people who are used to a reasonable grind), but they’ve expended the grind forever or pay us scheme to holidays – to Items only available during a 2-week event, which is ridiculous. Especially for people like me who have no freaking choice but to travel for the holidays. It’s not like I can tell my kid’s grandparents – “Sorry, you can’t see your grand kids this year because I have some very demanding virtual drinking to do.” I mean – I COULD, but they’d cut me off…

To fix it, they could:
Lower the amount of drinking required
or
Extend the variety of drinks that count
or
Make drinks available at a vendor for a decent price so we don’t have to deal with auction house flippers again (did Nightfury teach them nothing?).
or
axe that requirement alltogether – encouraging alcoholism isn’t socially responsible.

I’m annoyed. Again. They just keep making decisions that alienate me.

Constructive post that gives good solutions.

+1 to this.

This post is much more productive than some of the white-knighter who want to earn absurd amount of profit by abusing the TP as they always do.

ekarat.1085:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

ekarat.1085:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

I think a couple of things might help with the JP hate.

1) Remove or modify the built in timers (mainly the health degen, snowflake rotation doesnt seem to bad)

Or

2) Give us our skills back and let us help each other.

Snowflake rotation gets me every single time. I can always buff my vitality.

Please slow down or remove the timers and I will struggle through it.

Which snowflake path are you taking? I know I had issues with the snowflakes at first, but after a few (ok a lot of) attempts I did get the hang of it. It does feel like some paths are easier than others.

I’ve tried all of them. Is there one you would recommend if my problem is that I can’t turn quickly (since I can’t use a mouse)?

I’m willing to make an effort, but I want to succeed eventually.

I think we notify your problem now.

Go get a mouse for GW2 please.
You’d perform way-worse w/o a mouse in any other contents too.
You’re handicap yourself.

NilSatis.6720:

Unbelievable….While this is a good thing on initial viewing; it is something that is sneakily changing the economy; which isnt a good thing. Things do not get “missed” when being changed and patched. That is crap.

Also; I have recently made 40 spiritwood planks; which required an obscene amount of this wood. Am I going to get the wood back since you stealth patched this?

Think of it this way, every new woods you make from now on will cost half of the amount of spiritwood.

Why’s people mad in the first place?
Spiritwood was merely 5g pre HoT and was 15g after Nevrmore released.
TP exploiter already got more than enough of share from the woods, it’s ok that the price drop back down now and benefiting the regular players who’re working for legendaries.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Aomine.5012:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

I can understand some things being exclusive. Necessary evil, I suppose. Tribulation mode SAB skins are a good example, imo. Anet made a comment around roughly that point that they didn’t necessarily want everyone to have everything; which I can understand.

I don’t particularly feel festival items/rewards should fall into that boat though. There’s a difference between being able to get it quickly, vs having to work towards it over an extended period of time, vs just not being able to do it at all.

Treb mode never ask you to grind. It’s a one time thing that’s less than 10 hrs total, and can be done via watching a youtube video for easy solution.

Yes, you actually EARN it. No amount of credit card or brainless grind would help you get it. This should be the main method of acquiring rare skins in a game.

I wasn’t even going into the grind component there. Was simply addressing the whole mentality on exclusivity.

However, I wouldn’t say SAB didn’t make you “grind.” If you wanted more than 1 weapon you had to do each trib mode zone and get its associated token, and you could only get the tokens once a day. IMO that’s just as tedious.

Well, overall, only 2-1 and 2-2 are super tedious. Rest if you memorize it, it should take alot less time. And ofc it’d be tedious if you want more than one skins

It’s not like we’re getting 12 different types of shoulders for the Wintersday, just one.

I See No Tomorrow.7302:

While I personally enjoy jumping puzzles it’s very odd to me that Anet expects everyone to be able to do them since out of everything in GW2 there is the largest number of people who are unable to complete them for a variety of reasons. Motion sickness, physical disability, slow reaction time, etc. The timed jumping puzzles are stressful even for me and I’ve done the ridiculous thing many times so far.

If Anet insists on having JPs be required to unlock nice pretty content like that shoulder piece, there ought to be an untimed version of the puzzle at the very least that more slowly finishes the achievement but allows everyone to finish.

Well, why’re you surprised?

Many real collections skins are gated behind silver rank adventure, all of them all harder than this JP. (Go try Sanctum run and see what’s called time pressure rush)

They even expect you to get 1000g or 100 hours of grind for 10000 presents!
What else not to expect? Seems like many people here has a good credit card rdy that they worry about tiny effort more than the huge grind. Credit Card can solve most of the cost problem I guess. I even heard some people complaining about new Legendaries require a Chak Gerent kill, that he said he’s ok to pay 1000g for precursors, but not ok to fight a Chak Gerent. (This is before the bug fix and nerf of Gerent ofc)

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

I can understand some things being exclusive. Necessary evil, I suppose. Tribulation mode SAB skins are a good example, imo. Anet made a comment around roughly that point that they didn’t necessarily want everyone to have everything; which I can understand.

I don’t particularly feel festival items/rewards should fall into that boat though. There’s a difference between being able to get it quickly, vs having to work towards it over an extended period of time, vs just not being able to do it at all.

Treb mode never ask you to grind. It’s a one time thing that’s less than 10 hrs total, and can be done via watching a youtube video for easy solution.

Yes, you actually EARN it. No amount of credit card or brainless grind would help you get it. This should be the main method of acquiring rare skins in a game.

khani.4786:

The jumping puzzle is easy…if you’re the only one there. I can consistently get to the midpoint but getting up the presents is a nightmare since they disappear for everyone as soon as one person gets near them.

I hate pvp jumping puzzles. (Not pvp in the sense that I am attacking another player, but player against player in the sense that I am forced to compete against others to make sure I have a place to stand before things disappear).

If it was strictly timed like the Mad King Tower it’d be different. But this one has obstacles that disappear when a single player touches them. If they could find a way to code it so that the disappearing boxes/snowflakes were per player (or make it a solo instance) I would someday be able to make it to the end with practice.

I can’t practice the second half if everyone jumps the gun and doesn’t let me try.

Just saying, most players, including me, consider mad-king tower way harder than Wintersday JP…

cocowoushi.7150:

Seeing all this salt just makes me want to grind and get the achievement more. I’m more worried about needing 150 Mystic Coins.

If you have trouble with that insignificant cost, you should give up right now.

it’s 20g vs 1000g, just saying.

It’s not as easy as you’d expect since one present exactly give you one alcohol and worth exactly one point, which is a rather dumb design.

Evans.6347:

Winter wonderland is by far the most efficient at only 34 hours of perfect playing.

Gl jumping that thing 1000 times in 3 weeks = 48 times per day.

If you include the random failure due to presents random explosion, it’d be at least 100 times of that per day, assuming you’re a perfect player.

I’m not doing that…

Ruffles Tater.9086:

Briars.1425:

3 years and ive never completed the wintersday puzzle. and not for lack of trying. ive sunk endless hours into it and this year is the first time ive even made it to the present wall.

Wait a minute there’s “Presents” in the JP I’ve never got pass the snow flakes.

I do agree with Kitty about the alternate way to get the pieces and parts for the items.
Like when you take the mini angry chest to the Charr in lions and journey around Tyria to get the mini red spark…. just a thought…

Yeah, there should be alternative way to compensate 10000 drinks too.
Majority would be happy.

Who cares about prestige? Most people other than some rich brats don’t.

kuritsutian.2987:

There’s always a chance to reduce the cost by playing Winter’s event … not all has to be black or white, … (Grind/Gold sink) … combining both makes it easier for those who really want the cosmetics. ..oh but wait… it would take time tho… -> no longer viable ever..lol

Grind Choir Bell for straight 100+ hours V.S. 1000g.

Which one is worse?

If you do other activity, which is alot slower, it’d be a 300~400 hrs.

Burtnik.5218:

Youre not supposed to beat necro with condi.

Olny necro is supposed to faceroll condi builds with condi -Anet 2015

Duuhm Fire with no ICD helps too.

People were complaining about old Duuhm Fire and Incendary Powder, but now Necro has a 2nd perma burning called chill, on top of AOE attack frequency burning from Reaper’s shroud. Stacking 7 stacks of Torments or 12 stacks of poison in ONE cast doesn’t help either.

Not to mention they can deal with conditions while spamming them like crazy while you can’t do anything about it.

Rin.1046:

Zioba.6182:

And what other things do we get for this event?

A new dress -> In the gemstore
A new gliderskin -> In the gemstore
A new mini -> In the gemstore
A new mini -> rare in the gifts ~4gold right now
A new mini -> that requires 3 of the rare minis ~12 gold right now
A new mini -> that requires 3 of the minis made of 3 rare minis ~36 gold right now
4 old minis back -> one obtainable for the meta, all obtainable via the gemstore
1 old mini back -> obtainable verry rare from the gifts ~58 gold right now
1 old mini back -> obtainable by combining 3 of the verry rare minis ~110 gold right now
A new shoulderskin ->with every drink now worth ~10s just the worth of the 10k drinks is 1k gold. plus 2500 candy cane worth ~ 6s each, ~150 gold in total

For me it just feels like wintersday is only for rich ppl or for ppl with a lot of luck. I already opened about 1k gifts and didn’t get a single skrit or snowman mini…
There is no problem with things you can work towards. I rly liked the mawdry stuff. That was fun, that was not just a mindless grind.

That’s more items than I was expecting actually. And many of them you can buy for some gold? And some of them not that much gold? Thats easier to get than I expected too.

With the exception of the shoulders, the other items do not seem that difficult to get, so I’m not sure what your point is. I do agree that getting items like Mawdrey are more fun, and I agree that more items should be implemented this way. But the point I am trying to make is that the shoulders are not the only item coming with Wintersday and there are other items that are relatively easy to get within the time period provided.

Aomine.5012:

Rin.1046:

Two? What is the second Wintersday item they added that is hard to get? I am only aware of Wintersday Presence.

Nightfury doesn’t ring the bell?

Even though flax seed is easier now, the endless Bat Brew still worth a tons.

Plus 7500 flax seed is still alot of grind-fest.

You need to go back and read my post. I said they are adding one new skin with the seasonal events. Nightfury was not added with Wintersday, it was added with Halloween. I think one hard to get skin per seasonal event it reasonable. But it seems clear to me now that all you want to do is blow this all out of proportion, in the hopes Anet will listen and reduce the cost of the shoulders, so I see no point in continuing to discuss this with you.

Feel free of being that happy customer that’d always be in favor of Anet’s current business model of exploiting their customers.

Majority of players already complained about the grind-fest of HoT contents and precursor and whatnot. I for one already endured it, got the mastery up to max level naturally because I play 10 characters, and even grind my own iron ores for Zap and crated Zap myself.

Even to me, who dedicated alot of hours in the game, feel like the current direction Anet’s is taking is disgustingly grindy, what do you expect from the majority of light/ casual players would think then?

For past reference, 90% of old events previous to HoT has no such grind-fest gold sink in any of the event, and reward you for actually doing the contents.

Last note, Nightfury can also be considered seasonal skin since it requires an endless Brew that worth 400g right now on TP, which are only obtainable in Holloween.
Wintersday and Halloween are 2 of the main Anet’s festival events, so they can be treated the same, so it’s TWO grind-fest gold sink event skins.

Yeah I know I should stop arguing with you because you have no interest in that skin in the first place, so you just want to make loads of money from this abusive event. That’s why you could defend this with a straight face.

Rin.1046:

Two? What is the second Wintersday item they added that is hard to get? I am only aware of Wintersday Presence.

Nightfury doesn’t ring the bell?

Even though flax seed is easier now, the endless Bat Brew still worth a tons.

Plus 7500 flax seed is still alot of grind-fest.

Rin.1046:

I think you are reading far too much into this. Just because they are adding ONE hard to get skin with the seasonal events is NOT a sign all future items will be like this. I think you are overreacting and jumping to conclusions. Also, it would be a very foolish move on Anet’s part if they made every cosmetic tem difficult to get. A large portion of their customer base are casual players, and they would be the first to go if Anet implemented such a tactic.

The fact is, there are and will be cosmetic items that are easy to acquire, and there also needs to be some items that are not so easy to acquire. Anet added Nightfury to appeal to those who like to have something to work towards, and the same is true for he Wintersday Presence. This is not a doomsday sign that all items will be impossible for casual players to get. You need to reel it in a bit I feel.

They added TWO already, not ONE.

It’d be 3, 4 , 5 , 6 if everyone thinks/acts like you did right here. Anet would keep doing that because they’d assume all customers are happy of being exploited, and lots of free Gem-sale for them. (Gem -> Gold conversion) Yay them!

Not to mention all those real HoT skins are all extremely rare RNG drop already, which some of them worth 300~1000g on TP right now even after 2 months of HoT released. (Showing how bad the drop rate is)

So aside from Gold Sink from the actual expansion, they want to do it again and again in the events/ festivals.

You said “the state of game I suggested”? They already did it since HoT launch!
Guild Hall, Precursor crafting (especially the new one sinking 2250 orbs!), and whatnot.
It was already there ever since HoT launched!
This is their business policy now, what else do you expect?

Rin.1046:

Aomine.5012:

If we stick to your logic, that every new cosmetic need to be gold-sink , and every event skins are gated behind 1000 gold, we’d never get anything. Period.

Stop using cosmetic as an excuse. This Wintersday day adds absolutely nothing other than this one new skin, and yet they don’t want to reward people with the new skin they make, but rather want sinking thousand of golds because it’d benefit their Gem sale. Can’t you still not see the trend of Anet’s current direction, and keep on blindly defending this?

You need to stop putting words in people’s mouths. I never said every item. There will be other skins that are not so grindy to get, but there needs to be SOME cosmetic items that are prestigious and difficult to get. You cannot expect to get everything easily.

Apparently this would be the trend of all future events if you keep on defending this.
We already have Nightfury as an example, and now this. What do you expect in the future? It’d be the exact same thing if people don’t protest.

New back piece, new shoulder, all either be in Gem Store or gated behind 1000 gold / 100+ hrs grind, or 0.000001 RNG drop rate that’d be sold on TP for 1000g.

Please be aware of what you’re actually defending.

Rin.1046:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Obsidian armor doesn’t fit here as these are seasonal items…

Yeah, I get your point here, but my point still stands. The item in question is only a cosmetic item, and while I agree it is harder to acquire than other seasonal items, it is only a skin. I was also pointing out that having grindy cosmetic items is nothing new to GW, even seasonal ones.

As much as I would love cosmetic items to be easier to acquire, as character customization is important to me, I accept and understand that cosmetic items are hard to acquire, because they are not required to play the game effectively. And Anet needs to add something to the game that players can work towards, and what better way than to add hard to acquire cosmetics. I would much rather they added things like that than add in ascended stat grind.

If we stick to your logic, that every new cosmetic need to be gold-sink , and every event skins needed to be gated behind 1000 gold or 100+ hrs repetitive grind, we’d never get anything. Period.

Stop using cosmetic as an excuse. This Wintersday day adds absolutely nothing other than this one new skin, and yet they don’t want to reward people with the new skin they make, but rather want sinking thousand of golds because it’d benefit their Gem sale.

Can’t you still not see the trend of Anet’s current direction, and keep on blindly defending this? Do you expect people to enjoy playing Choir Bell or Winter-day’s JP for 100 straight hours for 10000 presents within 3~4 weeks? (Other activity takes even longer, like 3~4 times longer I should remind you)

Hakuryuu.8634:

You’re complain about grinding for COMESTICS. They’re entirely optional, and no one force you to do so. No one is going to crap on you for not having one. You won’t die without it. You choose to commit to the grind yourself, and even though ANet has been a kitten lately, don’t stab yourself and blame it on them.

I bet this guys is making huge profit from Anet’s abusive attitude.

People are not complaining the grindfest, but rather complaining the short time period for such grindfest.

People are complaining that Anet move all the festival / event skins behind huge grindfest/ gold sink, which 1~2 years ago it’s suppose to be the reward for Meta event AP completion, which requires work, but within a reasonable range.

If Wintersday last for full year, and mobs drop them naturally, no-one would have complained. Too bad you have to do it in 3~4 weeks.

DoctorDing.5890:

So just buy the booze. From me.
Or stop complaining.

I realise neither of these things is going to happen.

Ofc you’d say that.
Many people are making unreasonable profit because of the dev’s abusive attitude.

More of the joke for nerfing dgn reward and inducing unstable, highly inflationary market.

DoctorDing.5890:

Instead of looking at it as “Boo Hoo! I’ll never get that many drinks in time” look at it as “10k drinks. Excellent! There will be loads of buyers for all the festive booze I get”.

And 10k is actually fine. GW1 anyone?

1. GW1 doesn’t have this insane market of TP which is highly sensitive and easily manipulated. The price is highly stable. (Except for the price of certain unobtainable mini-pets)

2. GW1 alcohol only grants a title and nothing else.
GW2 alcohol title ties to an event related skin, which should have been the Meta-completion reward like the past 2 years.

Xeno.4610:

I strongly second the request. JPs is something beyound my interest, I don’t like platform games, I consider it as a content for much different kind of gamers than me and will never ever do JPs in this game. Even items for legendary collection was a matter of hiring a skilled mesmer with portal. So good to know yet another content is not for me…. Unfortunatelly it means bye bye winterday…

Apparently grinding 100 hrs in Choir Bell or Jumping Puzzle to get 10000 presents is not the thing for most people too. JP is not the thing for you, and grinding endlessly is not the thing for me and the majority of player-base too. Majority of players just can’t do this, because of the limited play-time and whatnot.

I second that we remove the 10000 alcohol requirement.

Would Anet care? Probably not.

Zaoda.1653:

If it wasn’t the whole acquiring 10k drinks thing, it’s the requirement of doing the jumping puzzle 3 times (I can’t even complete it once), and bell choir which I also am bad at. This shoulder piece is just a no-go for me. Good luck to the rest who go for it.

Even with the current stock of all the 5 or 6 different winter-themed drinks, there’s like, what… 30-50k drinks total, in stock? So since it requires 10k drinks… 3-5 people can basically get it. Why even bother making the content if hardly anyone can get the skin?

Ikr. They used to offer end-event reward, such as cool back-piece, helmet, etc for Meta-event completion . All the requirements are fun and within reasonable range.

Now after some lame economists join their team, they make every event-related skins a huge grind fest and gold-sink. You get trashes while completing the Meta-reward.
What is the fun of event if you can’t get anything out of it while everything is repeated 3 times already?

Sad direction Anet’s taking.

Zenith.7301:

PvP ignorance doesn’t seem to realize that the nerf to the skill in PvE comes from the CAST TIME.

PvE mobs strike a lot faster, harder, and with less telegraphs than player skills.

Increasing the cast time to 0.75 seconds makes this a pretty weak reactive tool to defend your team with as most boss/mob attack rates are below 0.75 seconds so you basically eat the attack before the cast is done.

I laugh out loud when I see that someone saying PVE mobs strike faster and less telegraphic than PVP. (They even have big wind-up or fixed CD timer/ rotation)

Sorry I really can’t keep on reading and take this seriously.

LaCoria.8549:

Not gonna lie, I’ve attempted this puzzle every year it’s been out, and despite having easily spent 20-25 hours doing this puzzle over the years, I still have yet to finish it even once. You can say “practice, practice, practice” all you want, but the fact is, some of us truly cannot grasp jumping puzzles, especially ones with so many factors working against you.

Change your setting, camera rotation speed.
Make your screen quality lowest.
Watch Youtube video 10+ times until you memorize the whole thing.

There’s tricks to learn stuffs other than blindly trying.

SteepledHat.1345:

Aomine.5012:

Condition Mallyx is nerfed too yknow.

It was petted roughly. See mesmer for examples on how to nerf.

Mesmer’s nerf is not even remotely comparablable.

Durability rune nerf and 5 ICD of resistance makes the resistance up-time of Mallyx only around 50% or less, while Revenant still has no method of clearing conditions with Mallyx.

Way to kill the build without fixing the spec itself first.

If they want to gut Mallyx, they should at least make heal skills CONVERT some conditions, and make Elite Stance transfer conditions periodically.

Ayrilana.1396:

It’s what a lot of people wanted. Another faceroll meta.

It’s better than hardcore Meta that 99% of the community ignore. (TT rings the bell)

Too bad HoT only has 4 maps, so if you make 1 map’s Meta undoable, it’d take 25% of the content away, which is not smart at all.

Condition Mallyx is nerfed too yknow.

Sagach.3276:

I just gave up after a solid hour of attempting the JP. Yes, I even watched a couple of videos and read the guide. JP’s are one of those things that are fun if I can take my time on but kitten ear impossible when timed.

Only an hour?
How about 10?

You’d need 100+ hrs for the drinks though. Can’t afford an hour?
(100 hrs is assuming you can do Choir Bell non-stop for that amount of time, if you do other activities, it’d cost way more time)

Rayzah.4235:

Aomine.5012:

You’re funnier to assume people can’t do this JP.

I do know several people who can’t do it.

Aomine.5012:

It’s considered EASY by most.

At this point I’m out. To discuss with a person who invents his own “facts” makes no sense. You neither know most people in GW nor 95%, its simply ridiculous.

The fact is 95% of the community here are telling you to actually get good and learn it.
Only 2 people on the forum, this includes you, think it’s hard or impossible.

You can being as salty as you like and refuse to learn, but I don’t think Anet will change such an easy requirement for the majority of players.
Most people would be complaining about the 10k drinks/1000g anyway.

Rayzah.4235:

TexZero.7910:

Do you want the shoulder item or not ?

If so, while you may be laughing, you’ll have to put in the time and effort to complete the puzzle. Not everyone learns at the same rate, and while you’re no prodigy you are human and are capable of overcoming challenges. I mean unless you’re actually a cat in which case disregard prior comment.

Now i wouldn’t at all be against the snowglobe being a sell-able item that was given every 10 or 20 runs….. I’d love to make more money for minimal effort

Shure I do want this shoulders, but be honest, would you waste lots of time if you clearly know that it is not going to happen? And I clearly know that, as I wrote I tried this for hours, not only a few times. But at some point I’m giving it up, otherwise it would drive me mad.

Yeah, everyone would be wasting 100 hrs for the 10k drinks.
You should at least waste 1/10 of that for the JP.
Try JP for 100 hrs and still failing b4 you come here to complain
Realisticly it doesn’t even take that long. I bet you have your setting wrong.
Change some setting and watch a youtube video for a change.

I really can’t imagine that you would realistically stand for getting 10000 present, which would take near 100 hours, within 30 or less days if you can’t even stand several hours of practicing or “researching” (like watching a youtube video several times to memorize the path) for the JP.

Well, you’d probably solve the issue with your credit card most likely.
Inb4 alternative method for 10000 drinks/presents

Agemnon.4608:

Umm, you can get leather with karma, though I know of a better method. You just have to buy leather armor from the appropriate vendor and mix them in the forge just like with the cloth stuff.

Not like Msytic Forge takes equally amount of time to convert them lol.

Inb4 convert all option.

Would appreciate some official response like they did to Soft Wood Log…

Rayzah.4235:

Aomine.5012:

And you can keep trying for JP like you do for the drinks and eventually you will get lucky and win 3 times. Or watch a youtube video and see how other people do it.
Stop making excuses. This JP is not even considered hard by most. You can eventually do it if you practice for a few hours despite how bad you are.

Your logic is weird.
You’re ok to work on one thing but not others, which is significantly less work?

If alternative is possible, how about give us an alternative for not consuming 10k drinks? Everyone wishes alternative right?

It’s your logic that is weird.

Yes I’m ok with working for something which I can safely reach. Let’s take your 1000 gold, it would take me something between 50 and 100 hours of excessive working to get them. But I can be sure that I have it after that and that is the point.

On the other hand we have this JP. I spent around five or six hours there (with my trys last year) and after that I’m clear about that I could spend 100 hours there, I’ll never finish it. At the end I have NOTHING than wasted time

And guess what, doing it the time that I’ve done it till now was far away from what I would call fun or enjoyable.

I feel with you if you can’t see the difference between thos two things. Also you miss one thing, you have alternatives for the 10k drinks. You have alternatives how you get it. Gold if you’re rich, karma if have a lot of it or just doing the festival events (where you have also a lot of alternatives).

Aomine.5012:

I’d expect 95% of people find the 10k drink more unreasonable compare to that 5% who think JP is unreasonable. So you want Anet to address the issue for that 5% and leave 95% of players to rot then?

Lol are you serious? Do you really think 95% of the players are able to do this JP? You’re funny.

You’re funnier to assume people can’t do this JP.
It’s considered EASY by most.
It is even easier than MOST adventures in HoT.
It is easier than many of the JP in Tyria.

Much more people would have trouble getting 10000 presents or 1000g in under 30 days than merely doing Jp 3 times. Practice makes perfect. It’s better to have something that requires you to practice than things that require you to grind for 100 hours.

Dejavu.2349:

I’m not worried about the jumping puzzle… but where the hell am I going to get 10,000 drinks before this is over? I have to travel for Christmas, so I have until next Tuesday. My husband and I spent 10 hours on this today and we only got around 500ish drinks. If I spend 10 hours a day for the remaining 7 days I have before I have to go out of town, I will have around 3500 drinks. So… basically, I have done every other requirement for the shoulders, but I do not physically have time to earn that many drinks. Right now, If you were to buy them straight-up, it’d be 873 gold. This BS is why I quit skyforge (not that it was a great game anyway, of course)… it’s holiday stuff was virtually unattainable.

Starting a thread about this in hopes that someone has some ideas for me.

Seriously think each winter’s day alcohol should give like 4~8 points worth of requirement like ALL THE OTHER ALCOHOL
It’s much more realistic this way.