Guild Wars 2

IndigoSundown.5419:

Aomine.5012:

IndigoSundown.5419:

- snip -

Hey sir, do you think people will ever complete the goal when new COOL legendary Greatsword, Sword, Longbow, Hammer, etc is going to come every 3 months?

Yes, I do. People always adapt and overcome. That’s what we do. Well, at least those who don’t waste their time complaining. Oh, and as Xiahou Mao pointed out, Spiritwood has already dropped back from its high.

Even if it didn’t, all that would be required to get this stuff done is to collect the raw mats yourself and then craft your own. That’s unacceptable? You’d have to wait too long? As I suspected, these complaints are about impatience and a desire for rapid gratification.

Way to divert the topic.

We are talking about economy as a whole and you’re moving the topic to people being greedy and stuff. Realistically everyone is greedy, and this greed is the incentive to push our economy moving forward. If no-one has this greed and incentive, our economy will fall apart and die. There’d be no trade because there’s no point to do so if there’s no incentive and opportunity cost.

As for patience or impatience, yeah, might as well save money and buy the inflated product than wasting 100 hrs doing robotic logging woods on low tier trash maps that has no fun factor in it whatsoever. You’re sacrificing 100+ of your supposedly play-time into logging endless woods. This is opportunity cost, and I wish you’re happy about doing such monotonic task. This is where the design of a game fail.

PopeUrban.2578:

Their intent was that by lowering liquid gold income, the value of loot across the game would increase.

This is exactly what happenned. it’s extremely difficult to simply waste your time in the game now. if you’re acquiring loot or gathering pretty much anything, that stuff can almost always translate directly in to a nice sum of gold by trading it to another player.

Contrast this with before the patch, where so much of the the economy (crafting materials) was utterly useless.

if you’re attempting to gain wealth by hoarding your acquisitions in stead of selling what you don’t need to buy what you do, you’re playing exactly the way that anet wanted to discourage. That “hoard everything and spend only liquid gold income” was exactly the economic model they intended to change.

Gold is a token designed to trickly in to your pockets enough to create a supply, but its purpose is to change hands for the things players actually need, materials and gear. The problem with the old system was that yuou could easily make enough money to buy pretty much anything without actually selling anything, which created undersupply of a lot of items and oversupply of a lot more.

Now that supply/demand is more in balance across the game, the economy is healthier as a result. You aren’t forced to run just a handful of pieces of content to make decent money. In stead you’re encouraged to prioritize your goals and offload loot and mats that don’t contribute to those goals in exchange for loot and mats that do.

How’s it wealthier when ONLY raw materials are raising in price, but the source of gold and the value of EVERYTHING ELSE does not change in price/drop in price?

So we’re still getting the same crappy rares/greens that pretty much worth the same, or even less than before, while the raw materials continue to rise in price because only raw materials have value, while exotic/other 95% of loots are as worthless as usual.

Making 5% of raw materials extremely valuable and keep everything else constant is a healthy economy?

All the “cool skins” are bound to those materials, so even if you sell them, you’re not getting any closer to those cool skins. Chances are the high value materials are actually the only materials you actually need. So by dumping them, you’d have to rebuy them eventually.

Angus.5961:

You do all realize the probable end result if enough of a fuss is made about devs posting so much on Reddit and not here, right?

They will be “discouraged” from posting about the game on Reddit, and nothing will change here.

And what good does running away do them?

People would being angrier and angrier without anyone to address the problem.
They’d lose customers by hiding in the shell instead of confronting the problem and the angry mobs.

Do you honestly think that kind of positive remarks would get flamed when posted in official forum? People are angry not only because of questionable decision, but also lack of communication.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Chrono.6928:

Lots of people just enjoyed doing dungeons to make gold. Myself included. “Selling mats” to make gold doesn’t really cut it for me, because I tend to be one of those players who stockpile mats in my bank for legendaries and other rare items, so now it feels like I’m constantly broke. Do I have liquid assets sure. But that’s not how I want to make a profit b/c chances are I will have to rebuy them later that way.

“I miss doing dungeons for gold” is, I think, a reasonable point. However, the OP’s complaint involves considerably more than that. “It’s no longer worth my time to farm dungeons” does not equal, “There is no way to make gold except to spend RL money.”

As to mats… Ask yourself whether the mats you are storing are currently valued high, and whether they’re likely to continue to go up over time or will they come down as more players complete their goals? If so, as has been the case many times, selling some now and buying later might be to your advantage. The further advantage is that you can always re-farm them later if you need to.

Long term rewards in MMO’s are designed to be marathons, not sprints, and certainly not 1K jogs. If you “have” to finish the marathon in the lead group, then there’s going to be a lot more stress and concern than if you just want to finish at your own pace.

Hey sir, do you think people will ever complete the goal when new COOL legendary Greatsword, Sword, Longbow, Hammer, etc is going to come every 3 months?

Price may lower “slightly” after some time, but would spike up yet again whenever new shiny armors/weapons are out. They would all be competing the SAME materials just so you know.

The new PVP legendary back asking for Gift of Fortune yet again pretty much forshadowing the direction Anet is taking.
New legendaries would still consume almost the same amount of T6, Ecto, Dust. New precursors will still consume those 75~100 Deldrimor/Spiritwood.

So how on earth can you say that the price will lower down eventually?

So do you think Anet will buff all the other weapons to the degree of LB, or they’d just nerf the LB damage?

Think about it. The answer is rather obvious yknow.

morrolan.9608:

StickerHappy.8052:

Here is the problem

Even in Emerald grinding is very hard, you HAVE to win 5 straight matches to ensure a safe tier spot. As a solo q player, How often will that happen?

The problem is worse when you get to ruby.

The Mtachmaking system and MMRs (Pugs vs Premades) and the whole leagues primarily cater to teams except AMBER Division

This, how about anet address this issue.

Because clearly Anet only wants the top 20~ players to get the goodies while everyone else suffer.

No wonder GW2 PVP base was so small. It has a spike now because of all the PVE newbies wanting the shiny loots atm :P

Chris Cleary.8017:

pandaexpress.1458:

After just advancing into the emerald division after 20-something long games of getting through Amber division, I lost a game because we had a teammate refuse to play. He stayed at home and did nothing. He did not d/c or leave, but he sometimes left home and died while autoattacking the enemy player taking the point. I wouldn’t be too annoyed at this loss if I didn’t lose a pip.

The game is rewarding players who deliberately toss games by making future games easier. When a player comes in with the intent to lose what are the rest of us supposed to do. His loss becomes all of our losses.

Deliberately throwing games is not something that we are OK with, and we should have something in-place in the near future to discourage this activity. I would look for enforcement against this negative behavior to start sometime early next week and may be retroactive since the start of the season.

I can’t really comment on system changes, as that is outside of my realm, however I do know that it’s actively being worked.

How about making people not losing Pipe at all when lost against a extremely disfavor match-up, like 5 solo q people vs 5 man organized medium~top MMR team?

Also lowering the MMR measure if a person Q up alone, so they’re less likely to be qued up against high MMR organized team?
For example, if that person has a MMR of 100 (I don’t know the number, but that’s assume this is a high number), when he que up in as a group, he will use this 100 value, but when he que up alone, it’d have 100-50 = 50 MMR as value, so he is less likely against high MMR organized team.

This should decreases the incentive of people lowering MMR.
If you just want to punish people instead of fixing your system, people will eventually just leave the PVP all together.

Honestly, before you care about the MMR and matchmaking, can you PLEASE add SOLO Q back so everyone can climb the ladder in a fair and justified way?

How on earth do you think anyone Solo Qing would win a top organized team like Abjured or anything of such? People try to lower MMR because of your bad system and unjustified/unfair matches against Org team.

nacario.9417:

Hammer is a gimmick in spvp.. its great when ur at distance, but when figthing onpoint or when enemy goes in ur melee range it’s hard to keep up. The reason why its not toally bad is cuz of the evade, kd, and dark field it provides, but still suboptimal. On the plusside u have a melee weapon to swap to, often sword.

Same argument can be made to ranger’s LB….

Hammer actually does better when fighting on node compare to LB.

On the plus side, Rev can still swap to sword/shield, while ranger has this suboptimal sword and GS…

Burtnik.5218:

And imo also notice how good lb on dh is (meta) while our hammer has no place whatsoever.

Hammer actually does more damage than Guardian’s LB. It actually counters DH pretty well in fact. (He can’t reflect you, but you can block his arrows while dishing damage. You also outdamage him in terms of range damage.)

The traps daze/damage of DH, in conjunction with other numerous cc like f1 pull is the issue here.

jewishjoyride.4693:

I still don’t understand why this is an issue. What possible use do you guys see for using staff auto without a target? What is the value of having the tip of your staff light up? How does this help your pvp team or raid group?

Don’t get me wrong I’m not against changing it back. It just seems like there are other staff improvements that would have a much larger impact, such as tweaking 2 and 4.

Also as a side note, the thief change to steal reverted it back to how it had worked since launch. Rangers have had a staff for less than 2 months. It’s not exactly apples to apples.

Do you know, every single professions can spam their autoattack without target right?

This is the “flavor” of the weapon, and without it, makes it the weapon extremely boring our of combat. Plus it actually has very bad consequences in PVP, making staff the ONLY weapon in the entire game that CANNOT cleave the down foe no matter how you use the weapon. It basically means if anyone use invisible on down target and you’re in staff, it’s a free rev for them.

Since it’s so insignificant, why the heck Anet choose to make it that way in the first place then? Apparently Anet think it’s broken.

Kanto.1659:

It’s even worse now. If we dip a toe in water then the facets turn themselves off after couple of seconds. We need to switch legends and back to have Glint working properly.

Seriously? Why touch something that was working, albeit in a borked manner? Even if we didn’t get to swap legends under water at least we benefited from the facets and might, swiftness and fury was plenty enough for most things.

I had this bug awhile ago.

However, all you need to do is change your underwater legend.
Now the game automatically swap your legend between the land and water version, which is a pretty good QoL change.

tuck.2719:

Kanto.1659:

Why on earth is Glint not selectable under water anyway? It’s not engineer turrets or certain skills which would demand new animations or art.

I’d guess Glint is not available underwater because there’s a single facet consume that’s ground-targeted (Elements), and the dev(s) couldn’t be bothered to make the underwater version of that activate at your target’s location instead (even though other skills do this) and possibly create a new animation for it.

But the real reason is they decided ages ago that underwater combat was a mistake because it’s just too much effort to balance for how much it actually appears in-game, and they don’t feel like dealing with it.

Actually asdie from new maps, around 1/3 of Tyria is covered with water.

It’s quite a large proportion of Tyria that’re covered by water in the older contents. Good thing is even without Glint, Revenant is still a super-strong class under-water.

In fact Rev is one of the stronger classes in underwater, with Shiro’s disgustingly strong Jade Wind and impossible odds, as well as good range and super good melee damage of 1 and 2 that cost no energy and has no cd.

Most classes are much weaker in under-water. Revenant seems to be the least affected by this and still out-perform most classes under-water. (Except losing to op water classes like ranger)

Doam.8305:

Welcome to the world of Precursor crafting

Your problem is that you expected it to be a none RNG method like some people expected it to be a cheaper, faster, or merely a method that can be done solo.

Nope it’s there just to drain all of your mats the Bifirost needed like 40 spiritwood planks or something I think. Well those are daily CD items that can’t be used to craft legendary armor and any future items. Like the Damask Patch to drain leather from the economy this is just mats and to get you to stay on longer because the mats you don’t have you’ll be on for hours farming them or draining gold buying them.

40 Spiritwoods is nothing compare to Dawn’s 100 Deldrimor Steel Ingots

Oh, not to mention Never cost 75 Spiritwoods and 4500 additonal elder wood logs.

Mercurias.1826:

Your grand theory is that the entire development team in charge of keeping the game balanced is, potentially subconsciously, attacking only one class?

Man, there are some people who just aren’t satisfied with tin foil hats, so they wear their pants on their heads too so the whole world knows that it’s dealing with.

Did you ever, perhaps, consider that those were needed balancing nerfs? Druids are still massively powerful healers and support characters. They aren’t designed to be part of the meta community’s silly DPS wars. If you want a character with that kind of competitive stance, then go play a Revenant.

Seriously, everyone crying into their chereos over not having fun with their classes in this game should just switch out until they’re happy. This isn’t complicated.

Except they are NEVER the thing people actually QQing about, like bristleback HP and pet blind on f2. No-one ever QQ about ranger’s staff AA either , yet it got nerfed.

Actually they buffed Rev’s OP hammer 2 lol…
And everyone is QQing about DH’s traps daze spam but no fix.

Logic? There is none.
Don’t use balance to defend Anet’s action anymore. There’s none.

Agemnon.4608:

If you set AoE fields to lock under target it solves so many problems, like actually being able to move when using staff 3-5, well 4 still needs to be aimed properly while moving but worth it.

Balancing should be determined by both developers and top ESL players, since players good enough to actually win money and glorious hero armors know the classes inside and out and use that information to form strategies they can also be consulted for balancing purposes.

A good question to ask when balancing is, “If two world class players played against each other would one’s class overwhelmingly beat another in 1v1?” If yes then is it an intentional rock paper scissors kind of a deal? In that case the balance comes from another class hardcountering the other, and others being hardcountered and it’s one big circle. If not and the class is simply objectively better that’s when you tune it.

lol, you give Anet waytoo much credit. Seriously.
If Anet really care, Ranger wouldn’t be in bottom class, not showing up in ESL for such a long time back then.

Favoritism is clear as day.
Rev / DH damage and CC level is on a different level.
Tempest/ Reaper/ Scrapper sustain is on a different level.

Kicker.8203:

“We strongly believe that regular balance updates are one of the key pillars of building a successful competitive game. As such, prior to each season, there will be a balance update. League play will generally begin about two weeks after a balance update to ensure that the metagame has stabilized in an appropriate manner. Balance will be closely monitored throughout the season with the goal of having solid balance going into the postseason tournaments.”

Their “balance patch” = constantly nerfing ranger/Druid. Period.

Yes, we got “balanced” for 6 times. 6 nerfs to Druid/ Ranger in under a month.

Curring.9752:

Dahkeus.8243:

It’s the berserker amulet of condi. Personally, I think the issue is more along the lines of a class/build being able to thrive with absolutely no defensive stats.

It’s not the Berzerker of condi, it’s more like sinister but forgoing additional power for some extra condi pressure, it’s a hybrid. The condi equiv to berzerker would be condi/prec/exp, just like the wanderers is basically the condi equiv of Marauders.

I agree with the second line, it is issues with the class it self rather than the amulet. I’ve been playing a few builds with viper but wanderers typically does better.

Viper has 20% more stat than Berserker/Sinistar.

So according to this patch note:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-December-1-2015/first#post5820320

So thief got the steal target requirement fixed in ONE DAY after thieves QQ much.

So why doesn’t Druid get Solar Beam fixed after they make AF unable to be gained when healing full health target?

Instead we constantly got those knee-jerk ONE DAY quick nerf instead. (WHaO rings the bell)

Clearly Irene is the only dev that HATE HATE HATE the class he’s in charge of very much. He even went missing for more than a month and ignore us every since HoT released.

We rangers got nerfed for a total of 6 times despite being borderline functional, while other OP spec like DH or Rev got BUFF. (Rev hammer 2 has range “fix” that makes it hit further, despite it does more damage than RF, can’t be reflected, hit up to 15 targets, and has a CD of 2)

Good thing I already re-roll a Rev and DH in PVP. It sucks to play a class that’re being treated like a punching-bag.

So Revenant is fine with all the OP tools and got a buff in hammer, while ranger is not fine with those borderline functional build? The double standard is real.

Irene is the only dev that actually hates the class he is in charge of. The dev that is in charge of Rev and DH clearly loves their classes very much and never touches it despite numerous evidence of it’s opness.

Mercurias.1826:

1. Because you already effectively have double the utilities in combat that most other classes have. You get your customization from what legends you use, and most of their skills are already very powerful.

As for your example claiming that Revs are too predictable against good players? Be less predictable. Also, why would you just sit there and attack a blocking person while draining away your energy with Impossible Odds? Toggle that thing off until their block skill runs out and then engage again. Impossible Odds has a crazy short recharge time. You can actually BUILD UP energy for a bit waiting for the enemy to run out of block.

2) I also really want to have Signet of Humility from Mesmer as my elite at all times. It is an amazing break bar skill, and it also turns your enemy into a Moa, which I still find hilarious. Perhaps not surprisingly, unless you aren’t very bright, my wish isn’t granted. I content myself with the numerous other strong bar breaking skills Recenants have. You can easily do the same. As powerful as Recenants are, you’re fine. If this upsets you, there are a lot of other classes to play which include racials.

3: Because you don’t need it. Every legend has a trait line which gives strong synergy, like Salvation with Centaur or Herald with Dragon. Not only that, but an argument can be made that people would call Boon Duration our unofficial class trait with as much as it does for Revenants. This class is powerful enough without a second required-slot specification after Herald. It actually gives Revenants more room to vary their builds.

Elite Specialization is not the core class specialization.

Glint is NOT the Revanent’s respective core specialization, despite it’s almost mandatory in any Revenant’s build. It is an E-spec that has it’s unique feature that changes how the class works, not the core class specialization.

Invocation is.

BadSanta.6527:

Stop whining about stupid things , racial skills for real? Most unneeded skills ingame and anet said they don’t intend to change this . If all you care about is being uniqe just ran as jail ventari with staff hammer, for most rev suit the game pretty well, what rev need is buffs to jail and staff mace skills . Also plz finish our water skills and our down skills

Despite the topic, the OP actually has some extremely valid points, unlike someone here who’s whining about other people giving constructive criticism and nothing more.

Invocation is a good line, but for some strange reason, it doesn’t has a minor trait that -CD on legend swap, or decrease energy consumption of skills by 2, or anything related to the Revenant’s core mechanic.

Ranger has pet swap -CD
Warrior has fast-hand.
Ele has attunement swap -CD
Guardian has Virtue -CD
Necro has LF generation speed increase.
Thief has steal -CD
Mesmer has illusion skills -CD
Engineer has tool belt -CD.

Revenant has… Swap legend break stun + fury?
Does that really counts?

Burtnik.5218:

Aomine.5012:

XxsdgxX.8109:

AoE of 15 people? I kittening lold, cant expect me to take this people serious

That’s why people of the forum can’t be taken seriously when talking about balance.
They don’t even know their own class.

Go use CoR on the dummy golems section (the section with lots of golems standing together in the mist) and see how many you can hit.
Each pulses count the 5 target-cap differently, so max is 15 targets.

Yeah so all 3 pulses can hit up to 15. Now tell me how hard it is to nuke hammer rev which is in your face? To archieve damage they speak about you gotta be pure zerk.. pure zerk that will explode in melee. Its unrealistic really.

Another forum people’s special feature: diverting the attention by moving the subject.

They can never just admit their mistake and move on.
They have to divert the topic so they seem less wrong, and make them feel better.
Thus is human nature.

I’m only here to correct the mistake. The other discussion I do not care.
Go argue among yourself.

1. You can use stacking sigils on your off-weapon which you don’t use normally, so your stacks do not disappear when entering water.

2. You can put on-swap sigil like sigil of cleansing to help you deal with condition.

XxsdgxX.8109:

AoE of 15 people? I kittening lold, cant expect me to take this people serious

That’s why people of the forum can’t be taken seriously when talking about balance.
They don’t even know their own class.

Go use CoR on the dummy golems section (the section with lots of golems standing together in the mist) and see how many you can hit.
Each pulses count the 5 target-cap differently, so max is 15 targets.

Thaddeus.4891:

There is 145 different skin for back item. There is 13 wings back item, 18 if you count all those later bladed Back Item which isn’t really wings, but look a bit like it.

There is still 127 back items that doesn’t look like wings at all.

And the problem is, around 80% of 127 back pieces that’re not wings are fugly as hell.

I think that’s why wings stand out. They don’t need too much creativity, yet they often look good.

Anyway, all that aside, i really think anet should start adding capes as back item..

Don’t forget the:
“Gain Top Stat x times in RANKED GAME” AP.
Now you’d see some noobs trying to zerg around and triple cap for the AP.

Shadow Phage.9084:

Aomine.5012:

Klypto.1703:

Hey guys I figured out how to make them and what the problem is. The mix up is the wiki states it takes 1 armored scale but the actual thing is that its 5 leaf fossils. Herald one takes the rev rune and evergreen loadestone and 10 leaf fossils so its just half of the fossils to make the rev rune. I hope this satisfies the frustration we all have had about this rune

Edit: Oh almost forgot it wouldn’t work on my character that had leatherworking but I have a armorsmithing one at 400 and that character was able to make it but other part of the problem is that you need do it on armorsmith(atleast for me anyways).

The problem is the recipe of Rune of Revenant does not exist, and cannot be discovered.

Here you go:

So they patched it today.
Make sense.

Pretty sure you can’t discover it before this patch.

You want proof? The price of Superior rune of Herald dropped from 50g to 6g in less than a day. Do you think people are so idiotic that they don’t know the recipe before this update? Clearly it did not exist before the update, otherwise it’d be 6g ages ago.

Klypto.1703:

Hey guys I figured out how to make them and what the problem is. The mix up is the wiki states it takes 1 armored scale but the actual thing is that its 5 leaf fossils. Herald one takes the rev rune and evergreen loadestone and 10 leaf fossils so its just half of the fossils to make the rev rune. I hope this satisfies the frustration we all have had about this rune

Edit: Oh almost forgot it wouldn’t work on my character that had leatherworking but I have a armorsmithing one at 400 and that character was able to make it but other part of the problem is that you need do it on armorsmith(atleast for me anyways).

The problem is the recipe of Rune of Revenant does not exist, and cannot be discovered.

The problem is they not only makes burning stackable, they also increases the number of stacks from burning on each skills.

They do this to poison skills too

At the same time, they never address the stacks of bleeding on other skills.
This is where the problem emerges: The scaling issue.
They only doubled/tripled the burning damage, while bleeding stays the same.
Ofc it’d make bleeding inferior.

Anet really need to balance things as a whole, not just one aspect.

Burtnik.5218:

NayNay.7680:

Kayberz.5346:

Lol how is heralds shield the most flashy elite spec weapon?

It’s literally a giant glowing dragon wing with sparkles coming off of it..
It goes great with the Revenants exclusive armor set…

Why do the other classes not have an exclusive armor set?

Too bad warriors and guardians can wear it aka fake revs that failed at the profession yet want to look cool /shrug

Im up for adding exclusive set for each class tho, but they all should be locked just for that x class

Well, I purposely make my Warrior more: “Steel-and-sword” type of heavy browser, my guardian “Holy-knight” type, and my Rev “magical/ energy” (like choosing something that glows/ emit energy) type of character.

So to me all of them look pretty different

Guys, stop arguing.
Ranger got 2 of the most ugly E-spec related stuff.
There’s no competition.

Well, boring or not is subjective.

Tbh, I like how almost 90% of Rev defenses come from active defense, like using skills on correct moment to evade/block/convert damage.

It’s not an easy-mode like pet-class (namely MM Necro and Ranger), but it also rewards good game-play.

Warrior, to me, is a class that depend mostly on passive defenses, like auto-proc endure pain, auto-proc stability, healing signet, etc.
So to me, Warrior is the more boring class.
Also, Rev actually need to click way more bottoms than Warriors due to constantly swapping between stances.

I don’t really know how you’re playing, but I think Revenant is more fun to play.

ZachAttack.3957:

Over time, as people learn the fight and begin to actually change their builds if they want to succeed, the fight will get easier and easier. Definitely not to the point of Tequatl, but it will still become easier. It’s nice to actually have a challenge, but unfortunately a lot of collections are based around it, so people are getting frustrated. Just keep cracking away, and eventually you’ll pull out a win. Like me, aha, with the timer literally at 0:00 as the final boss died =)

How long have triple trouble been out already?

Do regular casual players change their gears /classes/stretagy against it?

Nope, they just gave up and move on to something else.

Let’s get real, too few people actually care about what class/gear is optimal for serious contents. They won’t try to make a Zerk Ele, Zerk Herald, Zerk Berserker just so they can beat a Meta Event. They want to use their not-too-optimal classes/gears and sneak in an optimal organized team and get the credit.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Aomine.5012:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

YaYa.5879:

So before the release of HOT, i’ve read a post saying that they were gonna change the economy. The value of gold would raise, so they nerfed the liquide rewards on dungeons (wich was the main source of gold for PVE players). That being done, the prices would decrease.

Dungeons were only the main source of gold for dungeon running players, not for PvErs in general. Very few people I know ran more than a few dungeons. They earned gold through other methods.

Further, the price of just about everything went down, if it wasn’t part guild/scribing, legendary/collection, or ascended gear. T5 mats are nearly vendor price, exotics of various stats can be head for less than a gold, some luxury items (such as poly-lumi jewels) dropped 50-80%, and precursors are (for the most part) significantly reduced.

In any case, it takes far more than a month for a market to come to a new equilibrium after a shock like the sudden changes brought by HoT.

tl;dr the economy isn’t as narrow as claimed in the OP (some items crashed, some spiked) and the markets remain in flux, i.e. it’s too soon to say that the changes were good for the community or bad.

There’d be a shock in economy every 3 months just so you know. Anet’s going to release new legendaries every 3 months.

You & I are talking about very different things. The “shocks” to which I refer were monumental changes to game mechanics, introducing new items, new mats, and changing supply & demand for nearly everything traded on the TP.

Adding a few new legendaries 4x/year is going to affect things, but it’s not going to “shock” every single market, just the ones relevant to those legendaries. That might mean that demand for certain scarce items remains high, but in the meantime, the general population will have adapted. Already more people are rethinking whether to craft time-gated mats (for use or to sell) and more people are starting to change how and where they farm.

In other words, I can’t agree that we’re going to see “shocks” like HoT 3-4x/year.

It clearly will. Spiritwood price went from 9g to 16g THE MOMENT Anet fix a bug that prevent Nevermore part 1 collection. This is 90 time gated materials we’re talking about, and can ONLY be able to obtained through crafting.

Staff is not even the most popular choice of weapon.
Imagine when the new Legendary GS, Sword, and Hammer come out, what would happen to the economy when they ask for another 90~100 time gated materials that COMPETE with all the other precursors.

Swift.1930:

Aomine.5012:

Swift.1930:

Aomine.5012:

FrizzFreston.5290:

This problem is the same with any world event. You’re years late if you only just play on one map and now complain that the shatterer only spawns every 3 hours or so.

This is no different than it was on launch, except players are hyper focussed on one achievement for which they need this one specific event to not go wrong for. That achievement should be changed, the event itself is probably fine.

What could be interesting however is a mini “worldboss”/mapmeta cycle for just HoT so that lazy players have some incentive to cycle maps.

Have you really do anything that requires true coordination to win, and you need to come 1.5 hr earlier or the map is permanently fulled?

From the sound of it, I bet you never win Chak Gerent before.

Shatterer is a really bad example because people come at last 5 minute and can still face-roll the boss easily. There’s nothing you need to “wait” for it. You can do whatever you want and join in last minute and still be the boss.

Eh, but the TD Gerent is a taxi-in boss too. Sure, the map fills in a hurry, but you can come for the event alone if you get in 5-10 mins ahead.

The issue with the Gerent is that even groups who stand around taxiing and discussing CC and numbers and everything for 20-30 minutes often fail the event within the first few minutes… There’s a lot of demand for organization that anything short of a big TS3 guild is likely – but not guaranteed – to fail.

And do you think the last 10 minute taxi team really would win?

Those people who won were there an hour ago, and if you’re in that map, you’re just lucky someone that been there for an hr trying to recruit more people just in case.
Usually you’d NEVER get into a truly organized map if you don’t come an hour earlier at least.

Don’t I know it… except even when you run through full meta-event trails on the map with commanders/etc on a full map… there are early fails. Found that out the 2-hour 8-minute way, like the OP. =/

Exactly. You’re just proving my point.

I’ve been in several guild team that were extremely close (Got 2~3 bosses down and one boss 5%, usually SCAR due to bugs Anet never bother to fix), and the waiting is real. You HAVE to been there at least an hour earlier. Also most Meta events are over in 30 minutes, and after that the event numbers in that map drastically decreased, making the map less enjoyable.

Swift.1930:

Aomine.5012:

FrizzFreston.5290:

This problem is the same with any world event. You’re years late if you only just play on one map and now complain that the shatterer only spawns every 3 hours or so.

This is no different than it was on launch, except players are hyper focussed on one achievement for which they need this one specific event to not go wrong for. That achievement should be changed, the event itself is probably fine.

What could be interesting however is a mini “worldboss”/mapmeta cycle for just HoT so that lazy players have some incentive to cycle maps.

Have you really do anything that requires true coordination to win, and you need to come 1.5 hr earlier or the map is permanently fulled?

From the sound of it, I bet you never win Chak Gerent before.

Shatterer is a really bad example because people come at last 5 minute and can still face-roll the boss easily. There’s nothing you need to “wait” for it. You can do whatever you want and join in last minute and still be the boss.

Eh, but the TD Gerent is a taxi-in boss too. Sure, the map fills in a hurry, but you can come for the event alone if you get in 5-10 mins ahead.

The issue with the Gerent is that even groups who stand around taxiing and discussing CC and numbers and everything for 20-30 minutes often fail the event within the first few minutes… There’s a lot of demand for organization that anything short of a big TS3 guild is likely – but not guaranteed – to fail.

And do you think the last 10 minute taxi team really would win?

Those people who won were there an hour ago, and if you’re in that map, you’re just lucky someone that been there for an hr trying to recruit more people just in case.
Usually you’d NEVER get into a truly organized map if you don’t come an hour earlier at least.

FrizzFreston.5290:

This problem is the same with any world event. You’re years late if you only just play on one map and now complain that the shatterer only spawns every 3 hours or so.

This is no different than it was on launch, except players are hyper focussed on one achievement for which they need this one specific event to not go wrong for. That achievement should be changed, the event itself is probably fine.

What could be interesting however is a mini “worldboss”/mapmeta cycle for just HoT so that lazy players have some incentive to cycle maps.

Have you really do anything that requires true coordination to win, and you need to come 1.5 hr earlier or the map is permanently fulled?

From the sound of it, I bet you never win Chak Gerent before.

Shatterer is a really bad example because people come at last 5 minute and can still face-roll the boss easily. There’s nothing you need to “wait” for it. You can do whatever you want and join in last minute and still be the boss.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

The premise of this whole thread is fundamentally flawed. You are positing that gold is harder to get, and everything is more expensive.

Where do you think everything comes from? Those are people selling the mats for a profit, AKA making gold. You can make gold just as easily by gathering materials and selling them. You shouldn’t be lamenting the fact that things are more expensive, you should be celebrating that it is far faster to get gold due to how much everything sells for. Since the release of HoT, I’ve been making bank. Not by running dungeons or flipping on the TP, but by just playing the game and gathering materials.

The nerf to dungeons was a nerf to the amount of gold dropped from the sky. There are still ways to make money drop from the sky that doesn’t involve running dungeons. Every event you complete, every bag you open, every item you sell to an NPC vendor, every bauble as a map reward, you are getting gold from thin air. Every player is. Gold is still being put into the economy.

You think it the wrong way. TP is not where the money used to come from.

What money used to come from is dgn/fractal gold reward and vender selling.
Gold does not magically pop out of TP. The gold you get from TP by selling mats are those gold that people originally got from dgn/fractal/vender. Now the main source: dgn/fractal has a decline in gold reward, the gold becomes much more scarce.

briggah.7910:

Grim West.3194:

Stop white knighting this garbage.

Stop over exaggerating everything first

He actually has a point.

I am in T1 for like 2 years.
All maps used to cap out on prime time.
I never see the new BL map capped before since HoT, and I rarely find a big zerg in the map either.

EB only filled out occasionally even during weekend. In old days EB is much more populated than this.

Some WvW server like TC died down too. JQ becomes much less active than they used to be. Things have go into a downhill that’s for sure.

Obtena.7952:

Argon.1563:

The TD meta has a 2 hour cooldown before it begins again, and my latest attempt at it lasted for 8 minutes and 18 seconds. I hadn’t even finished the first song in my music playlist before the event failed.

So much for ArenaNet’s “No waiting to have fun.” statements. I hate how the devs aren’t bothered with commenting with their thoughts on the event, yet they’re willing to throw out whole blog posts about e-sports, which only 1%-2% of the community actually enter and take part in.

Um, you CHOSE to wait for this event so blaming Anet for you deciding to wait is nonsense. If you knew it was going to start in 2 hours, why didn’t you go do something else … oh right, because it would have been a less awesome QQ thread if you did that.

Before you rebut, do realize you need 150%+ participation to get anything from the Meta.

TD has very few events after the Meta chain is finished. Also there’s almost no possibility of coming back into the same map if you leave an organized map.

I can take a good guess. You never beat Chak Gerent before. That’s why you can sprout out some NS like this.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

YaYa.5879:

So before the release of HOT, i’ve read a post saying that they were gonna change the economy. The value of gold would raise, so they nerfed the liquide rewards on dungeons (wich was the main source of gold for PVE players). That being done, the prices would decrease.

Dungeons were only the main source of gold for dungeon running players, not for PvErs in general. Very few people I know ran more than a few dungeons. They earned gold through other methods.

Further, the price of just about everything went down, if it wasn’t part guild/scribing, legendary/collection, or ascended gear. T5 mats are nearly vendor price, exotics of various stats can be head for less than a gold, some luxury items (such as poly-lumi jewels) dropped 50-80%, and precursors are (for the most part) significantly reduced.

In any case, it takes far more than a month for a market to come to a new equilibrium after a shock like the sudden changes brought by HoT.

tl;dr the economy isn’t as narrow as claimed in the OP (some items crashed, some spiked) and the markets remain in flux, i.e. it’s too soon to say that the changes were good for the community or bad.

There’d be a shock in economy every 3 months just so you know. Anet’s going to release new legendaries every 3 months.

Galandil.9641:

dronzer.8392:

Yeah I really don’t get the emphasis on the crafting too, it seems to be the “new idea” they have because it makes it easier for players?

No, because, for the new players or even old ones without all the professions capped at 500, it’ll be a huge cost of money, now more than before.

And for them, as I said, it’s good, more people that probably will open their wallet to buy some gems.

New players are probably the ones that’re most reluctant on spending money on something they’re indecisive of.

They’d choose to leave rather than swipe their credit card if they realize they need so much money to get anything now. (One can argue materials also sell for more, but when you look at what they actually need, all low level gears are getting more expensive, and the crafting fee is quite insane with the current material price)

Acratin.3910:

I agree that you only need so many tanks and healers with each raid. But there are more damage types than Berzerker! My thief hits 93% crit, 100% if beside/behind the target, with power and ferocity secondary. Granted that’s close to Zerker.

People don’t take thief because they didn’t give anything other than damage.

Condition classes are in a new league so I’m going to exclude them for now.

But for other dps classes, Berserkers bring banners/EA.

Herald brings perma might/fury/swiftness/big CC/infinite boon strip, which are all needed in raid. (Thief do bring CC at the cost of dps. Their boon strip also have long CD too ) Herald also brings +150 ferocity to 5 people too. Their “margin of error” is larger than thief due to damage conversion skill and higher armor/health.

Serophous.9085:

That isn’t Anet’s fault. That’s players enforcing those rules (and the 15k AP requirement is LOL).

It was obvious from the start that once someone found a successful raid comp, everyone would start copying it and trying to enforce it. This was a given.

As for the TD meta, there was a guild helping with the meta last night I believe, people in my guild were talking about it. Its probably the hardest meta in the game at the moment, and people needed to learn it in order to beat it. I’m hoping the guilds that help get more pugs in to learn it will spread and it gets completed more.

It actually entirely Anet’s fault to push player into this meta with their contents. People wouldn’t enforce something if it’s not needed. Chak Gerent and raid is a good example of a dps check. If you don’t run dps, you’re asking people to CARRY YOU because you contribute only 30% compare to other people. In this game, tank is actually the SELFISH spec because you can live very well without being full tank with just good skill rotation.

Burtnik.5218:

RyuDragnier.9476:

Burtnik.5218:

RyuDragnier.9476:

Necro is now reliant on Reaper due to the OP nature of the GS

I lolled. GS op? For real? You do realize that elite specs wasnt supposed to be stronger than core, right? They were mean olny to alter playstyle. If base rev issues wont get fixed like lack of 25% move speed/access to swiftness and fury, we will run into issues in future with new elite specs as they all will be worthless in comprasion to Herald.

Our mechanic is around utility skills, we cant just swap one trash skill for another one bc thats how they made revenant and for that reason all legends gotta be viable.

Utility skills = class mechanic in case of revenant. Imagine playing mesmer with half broken shatter mechanic.

If you hadn’t noticed, you have Shiro too for movement. Impossible Odds gives you a constant source of Superspeed. And you have access to Fury outside of Herald through the Invocation traitline. There are alternatives to Herald (though I admit are not AS good) that you can use, though I do admit Anet kinda pushed themselves into a corner with the utilities for Revenant. Though the swiftness problem could be somewhat fixed by making Staff #5 give swiftness during that charge.

Impossible odds is costly as f and ooc it works like swiftness which is olny 33%.. I can get the same effect from Glint for just -1 upkeep.

The fury you speaking about require constant swapping legends for 5sec fury which is not really a smart move as sometimes you want to stay in the legend longer rather than spam stuff and hope for the best. Meanwhile as a herald i can keep perma fury without any issues whatsoever.

Im not sure how Surge is supposed to help with swiftness either. Movement skills are not supposed to be affected by chill/cripple/swiftness/slow/quickness/superspeed.

We have 2 traits in devastation adept that doest exactly the same.. One provides 150 ferocity (10% crit dmg) for wielding offhand, another provides 10% damage in stacks while wielding sword.

One has to go as it doesnt make much sense right now and we can fix this “minor” issue by adding +25% move speed trait there. Shiro could give fury for using his utilities instead of might and 2 major issues are fixed pretty much.

And imo as i said utility skills are our class mechanic. We dindt get more than 3 utility skill per legend as they were supposed to come out as bundled pack of viable skills with synergy between them. How it turned out everyone see.

Mallyx since rework doesnt know what it want to do. Ventari healing is trash and the legend itself lack sustain. Jalis wants to be tank but even Shiro our supposed dps&mobility legend does it better. We suffer from half broken class mechanic.

Impossible odds doesn’t work like swiftness in combat. It is way faster than swiftness during combat, meaning better disengage and chasing ability.

Also it lasts 9 secs on 50 energy and recharged in 10 secs (50 energy = 10 sec to recharge), so the up-time is not as bad as you try to make it be.

Aidenwolf.5964:

Aomine.5012:

Aidenwolf.5964:

Knighthonor.4061:

Op is wrong.

Druid > Tempest > Ventari

Thoughtful analysis. Tempest is much better than you know, party wide healing is smooth and burst heals aren’t gated like Druid. I healed Gor on my Druid and spent the encounter fighting the UI. Just because you’ve seen vids of others running Druid it doesn’t make that the way to go. You’re ignoring the condition damage an apothecary elemantalist is putting out which is on demand and considerable but each raid composition is different.

A Condi ranger instead of a Druid would be my preference as they provide significant damage and utility.

Condition ranger’s condition dps loses condition engi and berserker (warrior) longbow f1 spam. In the video against 2nd raid boss, 3 cond warrior can easily stack up to 35 stacks of burning almost permanently.

For condition ranger, you need boss to stay in flame trap as long as possible, which in raid, can sometimes be hard to achieved.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKMxwsaSiE8

Those burns would go up with a ranger in there. We beat Vale with 3 necro 1 Dragon Hunter 1 warrior 1 Tempest (me on heals) 1 engi 1 chrono (tank) and 2 revs. Ideal comp? Clearly not, but what works for some isn’t the only way to do it.

Most people even my own guild see these vids and think “that’s how you do it” until I swap out of my Druid onto my Tempest and we see how it works better for our comp.

I would take my engi over my burn warrior any day, and I wouldn’t say no to a Condi ranger ever, but that’s me.

I think you have this bias that warrior is bad condition because of old days. Think out-side of box like you see Tempest now.

Things have change, and if you do some math, LB F1 actually do a CRAP LOAD of condition damage because berserker’s trait just benefit burning way too well, whereas there’s nothing in ranger that benefit their burning duration/damage.

There’s reason why you see more berserkers these days and less rangers.

Aidenwolf.5964:

Oh My God.8423:

10% – 15% increase in damage averaging over time?

But you don’t want to use Glyph of Empowerment on boss fight: you save it to boost healing output when in CA form.

You probably won’t take all Glyphs: you would have one or two Spirits instead.

So by my rough calculation, and some instinct, about 10% – 15% increase averaging over time.

Combining that with Druid’s healing capabilities, does it still head-and-shoulder better than the other two, which can provide steadier (and might be more) Protection, Might and Fury, and higher personal DPS?

Spotter is a party buff and one of the very best.

The Druid (not Ranger) buffs are short duration and not raid wide so extrapolating a set dps boost is guess work at best but let’s agree on 10% for 6 secs every 20 for half the raid (only affects 5).

The personal damage of the Druid doesn’t touch Ventari and certainly not Apothecary Tempest. As for fury might swiftness protection those are hands down the domain of the Tempest.

I did use a modified Druid build tonight that I prefered to the standard build and the regen spamming of shouts on top of the Druid heals felt closer to my Tempest output. I think once more groups use a Tempest healer the community will side with my assertion that Druids aren’t perfect healers (yet).

Spotter is probably one of the most unneeded buff among the 3 types of buffing (power, precision, ferocity from 3 different classes), because the “main dps” (Hearld x 3) can EASILY exceed way over 100% crit chance with just utility item and discipline banner. The precision from spotter would be a total waste because it doesn’t benefit the main dps, nor does it benefit the other 3 condition classes.

Aidenwolf.5964:

Knighthonor.4061:

Op is wrong.

Druid > Tempest > Ventari

Thoughtful analysis. Tempest is much better than you know, party wide healing is smooth and burst heals aren’t gated like Druid. I healed Gor on my Druid and spent the encounter fighting the UI. Just because you’ve seen vids of others running Druid it doesn’t make that the way to go. You’re ignoring the condition damage an apothecary elemantalist is putting out which is on demand and considerable but each raid composition is different.

A Condi ranger instead of a Druid would be my preference as they provide significant damage and utility.

Condition ranger’s condition dps loses condition engi and berserker (warrior) longbow f1 spam. In the video against 2nd raid boss, 3 cond warrior can easily stack up to 35 stacks of burning almost permanently.

For condition ranger, you need boss to stay in flame trap as long as possible, which in raid, can sometimes be hard to achieved.