Guild Wars 2

So many over-the-top suggestions…

When it comes to the holy trinity of Celestial builds the Engi is the most beatable. That being said certain skills are simply lacking in a easily visible tell or last too long.

Overcharged Shot: I used to be against “nerfing” this skill because often times it can be the only way to reliably CC a skilled opponent since skills like Magnet have a massive tell. That being said making it a quick 1/4 second cast and adding some sort of animation (it can even be subtle) would make it feel way less frustrating to be hit by. No need to remove the condi removal (I think that’s a cool part of the skill, especially with Entangle being so strong).

Healing Turret: Again, all it needs is either a slightly longer cast time (3/4ths of a second), OR a delay on the secondary burst (1/4th).

Gear Shield: Either a duration reduction of a recharge increase. I wouldn’t go overboard though, while on cele builds it feels cheap please remember that Static Discharge Engis use this as some of their only sustain.

Slick Shoes: The oil circles disappear after someone slips on them and they can’t be overlapped. It’ll still be a solid skill if you can surround your target but there’s still a way to escape.

Incendiary Powder: This one is tricky. Rather than it be a trait that is basically guaranteed to hit you eventually I’d rather it be a “on kit swap” effect like say Sigil of Doom. When you swap to a kit (with an ICD of course) the Engi will get a little icon and maybe an aura effect of some sort. If their next attack gets block/blinded/etc it misses and goes on ICD.

Yes, this may screw over some sort of no kit build…but I can’t think of one that would use IP and be effective in the first place. With this system the IP becomes more predictable for both the Engi and whoever they’re fighting. You could still run Sigil of Geomancy and swap next to your foe…but if a generally kiting class like Engi is trying to hug you then you should know what to expect.

I don’t find any of these changes to be too extreme. They would not destroy the classes viability but would add just a little more counterplay. All changes may not even be needed. Start with the simple ones like OC Shot, Slick Shoes, and IC and see how that changes things.

OP as usual seems to want to just destroy something that’s meta rather than tuning it.

Seriously? How often do you see a Mesmer do reliably well in tournaments, heck even in normal TPvP if the enemy team has a even semi-competent teef? As it currently stands you have to play perfectly in order to beat a teef 1v1 unless you’re one of the few Mesmers that are true masters at the class, in an actual game it’s even more chaotic and 1 Backstab that double crits Fire/Air means your death.

Is the utility and mobility good? Yes. Is the class good at 1v1s? Yes. That doesn’t make the class OP when several of the current meta builds flat out counter them. Focus the Mes and chances are you at the very least make them have to go purely on the defensive or they have to retreat. Atm Shatter is the only real viable build and the TPvP setup has generally no condi removal and is weak to focus fire.

Meanwhile, we have teef that is pushing Mes out of the meta and the cele builds that are generally not that weak to the Mesmer’s way of dealing damage. Man oh man, I can’t wait to master this class and have the update land and make people give me crap for my interrupt build.

Compared to teef, Mesmer looks flat out weak atm. Oh, and MediGuard is also very strong vs Shatter. I’ll admit I used to hate Mesmers as a Warrior main, but once you play one for yourself beating them becomes much easier. It’s all about knowing your enemy.

I’ve been trying to refine a Mace/Shield build for a while. One mistake I used to make is that I was overly reliant on the Unsuspecting Foe trait. It was focusing my damage too much around the Skull Crack + 100b combo. Even if you’re a good player, chances are you are going to miss a burst every now and then. When this happens, your DPS plummets. There’s also the times when you face players with an abundance of stability so you want your damage equally distributed on both of your weapon sets.

The build in my sig is more dueling/solo based. The build’s greatest weakness before was soft CC, but Brawler’s Recovery helps with that. In a TPvP match though I would run something like this.

I notice the Stability is a point of contention, as I expected.

The logic behind it is that currently, you almost never see more than one Physical Skill on your bar. The reason is simple, they don’t offer much utility. They are generally purely offensive. The thing is, even if Physical Training becomes an Adept Trait it’s still not going to be worth using if you aren’t going to bring more than 1 Physical skill (unless you plan on using Mending). Even with a Master tier Brawler’s Recovery and mending you’re gonna need a skill like Berserker’s Stance to act as adrenaline gain/condi mitigation.

There most likely won’t be room in a Physical skill focused build for a skill like Balanced Stance/Dolyak Signet. Having the stability stacks and duration on Stomp be upped a little bit would make potential builds as a whole be a lot more viable.

Having the arc of the jump vary depending on the distance so that it could abuse the Z axis like Blink/Wurm/Lightning would be pretty amazing.

I’m still against endurance increasing the launch distance because while it may be funny it would just be counter productive more than anything else.

With the upcoming buffs to Physical Skills there’s still a sever issue keeping a mostly-Physical Warrior from being a thing, Stomp isn’t that good. Thematically it’s awesome, slamming into the ground and sending all around you flying. However the skill itself is SUPER clunky. The big issues are that it’s really easy to accidentally interrupt the skill and that the skill itself is really obvious.

I’ll make my suggestions in handy little bullet points:

• Keep the stun break functionality but make the skill like Seismic Leap and have it be a ground targeted skill only with the Launch effect instead of knock down. The distance traveled can be less if it feels OP, though I think 600 on the Rampage skill feels fair.

• Have the distance be tied to your endurance amount because I don’t think many Wars want to send enemies miles away from them.

• Allow the Stability to last for 3-5 seconds (depends on testing) and increase the stacks to 3. Chances are Warriors will still be taking a skill like Berserker’s Stance (mostly for adren gain) or Signet of Stamina and won’t have room for Balanced Stance/ Dolyak signet. The stability provided will still not be that impressive but only taking 1 Physical skill (not counting Mending) doesn’t seem that enjoyable and it seems like the Devs want to encourage builds focused on them but without a bit of utility they’ll still see minimal use.

The Baws.5164:

I feel like we’ll see something similar to Mantras but have them labelled as something differently. We’ll almost definitely get Taunt and the whole tether idea has been done with Necro and now Dragonhunter so Mantras seem like they could fit the bill.

I don’t think they will be changing the actual name of the skill type because I have a feeling we’re going to see more runes that work on different skill types like how we have Runes that deal with Shouts and Signets.

I really hope that we start seeing runes that are viable so I can stop using Pack on half my builds.

I should probably mention that I started playing Mes as a 44600 CI and I’m not to bad at it. I think the habits I picked up from that build are fairly different from traditional shatter builds. I can play CI and be fairly aggressive but shatter is more about waiting for your moment.

Ah, I think the cancel casting of Sword 3 is what has been throwing me. I’m used to doing that on War but I didn’t know that it basically let you trick the system. It always seemed like my Swap took much longer to work.

I also wouldn’t call my opening predictable, I just hated using one of my stunbreakers as the opener. Using F2 to fake them out is a pretty cool idea though.

I don’t think it matters what spot CI is in due to the fact that we take all points in the line anyways. The only thing they can do is move Sundering Mace to Master but that wouldn’t change anything, either you’re going to use the Defense line or you’re not.

Making “Gain Adren upon being hit” baseline though would indeed open up some new options. With Mending becoming a Physical skill it’s Healing Per Second will be only just behind the nerfed Healing sig. There’s also the option to bring a Banner that has regen AND 2 Shouts. I think even if your new specialization ends up being underwhelming Warrior will stall have some solid builds, of course they will probably be Shoutbow and Modified Hambow.

So, I’ve actually been playing a decent amount of Mesmer (Ben the Annoying, some of you have probably witnessed my salt, some of it directed at myself). That being said, I feel like there must be some tricks that I’m not picking up on.

I play mostly your traditional Shatter (44006) and CI (44600). I have 0 interest in PU and not much interest in Torment builds. One thing I struggle with is opening up a fight, mostly in 1v1s. I use several like Decoy – Zerker – Mirror but that is super predictable. There’s also Blink – Wave – Zerker – Mirror which can work really well but can MAJORLY backfire too. There’s also the really strong Prestige – Zerker – Mirror + Shatter which is great if they don’t see you but if they do and avoid it you’ll have trouble. All of these are good for spiking unaware targets but if they see you and understand Mes then chances are those combos are too predictable. I’d like to improve in those situations.

I’m also really bad at using Distortion wisely. My instinct is to use it as a last resort but I notice a lot of good Mesmers seem to use it at the first sign of trouble. This is probably a holdover from playing Warrior and Engi where you can use skills like Endure Pain and Elixir S after things start to go wrong and be OK with Distortion seems to be more about predicting trouble.

I also have issues with using Sword mainhand. I always forget that I can use sword 2 as a defensive move, but that’s just on me. What I sometimes run into is making use of Swap reliably. It feels like swap always teleports me a few feet behind where the clone actually is and the immob doesn’t actually connect even if they aren’t evading/blocking/blinding at all. Am I doing it wrong?

Just any general tips would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Finding a utility type that hasn’t already been used and can make some sort of sense on Warrior is tricky. Any sort of Pet/AI seems unlikely, Gadgets are a bit too close to Physical skills, and many other either overlap in theme or are just too tied to another class thematically.

One type does stand out, Mantras. I’ve always found the mechanic behind these skills to be interesting. On Mesmer, you can set up a build that is almost immortal 1v1 (high condi cleanse, healing for both you and those around you) and the traits surrounding them give the skills dual purpose.

Thematically, it would be possible to spin the skills in such a way that they aren’t necessarily magical (although Warriors already sort of use magic in the form of Signets) in nature but that the chant you recite gives you some sort of power.

There’s a lot you can do with Mantras gameplay wise. You can have a low CD and “spammy” skills like Mantra of Pain (something like Distracting Blow or Distracting Strike), one that gives a type of CC that Physical Skills don’t provide (Taunt?), and some sort of sustain focused ability (Maybe a Stun Breaker that does a small push back when you use it). The Elite is where you could add a bit more skill to the class. Perhaps something like “Flourish”: only it recharges your Mantra charges. It would theoretically force you to manage your charges and not just spamming them so that you can avoid the lengthy cast time.

This probably isn’t what we’re going to get, but the concept struck me as interesting.

So, I think the thing that is more important than the matchups are the trait loadouts, the ammy used, and the runes/sigils. If the duels aren’t using the updated versions of all of these factors the matchups basically mean nothing. If they’re dueling with runes/sigils/ammys that won’t be the same when HoT comes out then we have no idea what the real power of these builds are.

Also, I do think giving players that aren’t devs a chance to get behind the wheel and duel/craft would increase player confidence. Even if there is no funny business some people are going to assume that one player isn’t gonna give it their all so that the specialization looks good.

I think letting community members make and show off builds would go a long way.

EDIT: At the very least it would be nice to be able to give feedback as to what build will be used.

Maybe less experimental builds but I would like to do some experimental team setups. I feel like we may be overestimating the removal of Shoutbow. I think a dedicated Condi Team could be pretty successful against Cele builds.

The potential setup:

Standard Condi War

Terrormancer (the empty trait is your choice)

Burn Engi (you can move some points into Firearms for more bleeds)

The last 2 could be your choice of zerker whether it be Teef, Necro, or Guard (Leaning the current hammer MediGuard) and maybe your traditional Bunker Guard. I’ve wanted to try this setup out but haven’t found enough people who are experienced with all these builds.

I don’t care if you have a Shoutbow or not, they will not be able to keep up with all of this condi pressure. The Warrior build is actually probably one of the highest potential DPS builds the class has if you land all of your bleeds and paired with a Necro is can be crazy devastating. The Engi has good sustain and more importantly a ton of cover conditions to keep the War/Necros bleeds on.

I suggest a traditional bunker because many of these builds are fairly selfish but with the support-oriented MediGuard and a bunker Guard they should be able to keep the condi players alive.

I would accept “AI” if it were implemented in a way that wasn’t terrible. I think Spirit Weps would have been cool if they were “attached” to your character and when you used their active they lunged forward then returned to your side.

I could see something like a Matra that summoned weapons next to you that get a certain number attacks before breaking. I like being the class that doesn’t depend on magic but I’m not opposed to us having a little. We kind of already do considering what Signets are lore wise and we probably use a little to set our arrows on fire.

I honestly have no idea what ANet has in store for us. I’m not opposed to anything so long as it’s implemented well. Hopefully it also raises the skill ceiling a bit.

The adrenaline on being hit should be split…and be made baseline. Looking at the proposed changes I would still be forced to run Defense, not because of CI, but because of the adrenaline gain it provides. It seems like it would be very possible to run Mending and Brawler’s Recovery and be covered on the condi removal front.

However, without the adrenaline gain many builds become unviable.

The same thing MIGHT have to be said about Fast Hands but we’ll have to see what our Specialization is first.

I really, really hope we don’t get torch. We already have LB as our fire focused weapon and I don’t really see a need for more. Guardians can already focus heavily on the fire angle and I’d rather have something more unique.

I could see offhand dagger and the Spec being a more nuanced fighter that’s more of a duelist than a barbarian. That being said, ANet said that if you only get an offhand the 2 skills you get would be flashy and I don’t know what you could do with a dagger that would that amazing. Of course we have have misinterpreted what ANet said and we may get a main 1 handed weapon.

Offhand Pistol on the other hand, you could get super creative. Perhaps the spec is a more technologically enhanced Warrior trying to remain relevant in a world where brute strength just doesn’t always cut it. I could see gadgets fitting in thematically. You could make them different than Physical skills that are all about pushing and shoving and make them about pulling and weakening.

Honestly, nothing in theory. We have solid power builds in the form of Greatbow, Hambow, Skullcracker, and a few others. We got a really strong Condi Build in the form of S/S + LB. We got plenty of supports with Cele + Shouts and Cele + anything hybrid.

What they do lack is the ability to be power and also bring support. MediGuard has AoE virtue buffs. Teef has Boon Stripping/Sharing and Mes has stripping and Portal and they can abuse the Z axis. Any Warrior power build is going to be mostly selfish. With Hambow you do have some Might stacking but Ele can handle that role and bring even more support.

This upcoming huge update doesn’t look likely to change that. Even with the Cele nerf we’ll probably end up running 2 Shouts and a Banner. That being said Stronghold might be more receptive to the selfish zerker playstyle.

http://metabattle.com/wiki/MetaBattle_Wiki

This site will give you a decent starting point. I would suggest tweaking your build to your taste but for the most part the builds there are best the the class have. The one exception would be the build in my sig. Is it high-level TPvP viable? No. Is it still solid? I’d say yes.

It can beat Shoutbow, fights D/D Cele to a draw, generally beats Cele Rifle Engi due to reflects, MediGuard you can have the edge but you have to bait out their countermeasure first, D/P Teef is hard but if you don’t get hung up on landing Skullcrack they’ll eventually use all their countermeasures and that’s when you pop Zerker Stance and take them out.

It’s also fun, be ready for rude pm’s.

Cecilia.5179:

I can share some of what I’ve been taught.
-Open 1v1 fights with staff 3. Chill/poison limits their options at the first move.
-Cast staff 5 on top of yourself or in places the enemy is guaranteed to be. For example, if you put it on top of yourself before fighting a d/d ele or a thief, they cannot safely rtl/shadowstep into you.
-Count your enemies’ dodges and make sure that Signet of Spite will not miss when you cast it. Fearing with ds 3 then using it works.
-You can bait dodges by delaying your ds 3 when you enter ds.
-It usually helps to save corrupt boon for stability
-Use your condi transfers wisely. Never waste staff 4 and dagger 4 can be used for the blind, but it is also best saved for condi transfers. For example, if a p/d thief applies 10 stacks of confusion to you and you send it back, they’re in big trouble.
-manage your life force. As a condi necro, your options for ds generation are staff 1, scepter 3, and spectral skills. Spectral armor is an excellent source of life force IF your foe hits you. Don’t be afraid to use staff 5 if you have to, but most 1v1s won’t require/allow you to.
I’m not a great player, but the person who taught me is. Hope these tips help!

These are all good tips, I knew most of them but some I wasn’t sure if this was just me making nooby assumptions.

I’m getting mixed messages on the auto attack situation. I did find myself not using them much because as a Warrior player you rarely do more than one combo due to our fast weapon swaps and that habit carried over. Scepter 1 does seem pretty crazy strong with Terrormance though so maybe that’s why my bleed stacking power seemed so much lower even with being on top of my enemy when wep swapping.

Sigmoid.7082:

BurrTheKing.8571:

WhiteCrow.5310:

Roe.3679:

Some people already think power necro is too strong, just wait until someone like that gets blown away by a reaper. The tears will flow.

Indeed. The PvP and Necro forums will be nerf central for the first few weeks when all this drops. I guarantee it. Some of it may be valid, but I’ll bet money that most of it won’t be and here’s why: People have gotten used to the state of Necro, and just how easy it can be to shut them down and drop them. Having trouble with them, and even losing to them regularly will simply be unacceptable. Mark my words.

Similar situation to when Hambow first became a thing. I’m not saying that some complaints weren’t justified but many were because players were so used to not having to worry about Warriors and suddenly they did and that annoyed them.

Same when rangers changed from free kills too.

I think the frustration there was that every “good” Ranger build has been really unfun to fight against.

Spirits: You basically function off of the passives that they give you.

LB Power: Your main source of damage comes from your AA and skill 2 which both have long (and bugged) range and short CD.

Beastmaster: You basically just evade and regen and slowly wear the enemy down.

They’re all beatable but the mechanics are generally not that engaging. They were the original Turret Engi, not unbeatable but not fun to fight. I would say complaints like that are fairly justified because ideally builds should be fun to play AND fun to fight.

WhiteCrow.5310:

Roe.3679:

Some people already think power necro is too strong, just wait until someone like that gets blown away by a reaper. The tears will flow.

Indeed. The PvP and Necro forums will be nerf central for the first few weeks when all this drops. I guarantee it. Some of it may be valid, but I’ll bet money that most of it won’t be and here’s why: People have gotten used to the state of Necro, and just how easy it can be to shut them down and drop them. Having trouble with them, and even losing to them regularly will simply be unacceptable. Mark my words.

Similar situation to when Hambow first became a thing. I’m not saying that some complaints weren’t justified but many were because players were so used to not having to worry about Warriors and suddenly they did and that annoyed them.

Muchacho.2390:

Silv.9207:

Similar how must necros already beat warriors in 1v1s…

Do they? Atm I can think of several specs that hit all the weakspots in a Necro. Anything with Shouts will have the condi cleanse needed especially with Cleansing Ire. Also, Brawler’s Recovery is becoming a Master trait and Mending is becoming a Physical skill so theoretically condis are just going to melt off.

Even currently a build like the one in my Sig puts out so much CC that even with Wurm and Walk and even FitG the CC can overwhelm Necros. Your standard Greatbow build has good enough removal if you play start. Shoutbow is…well…OP so yah. Anything with a Hammer can lock you down hard and often and is often paired with Leg Specialist so that it’s not that hard to land Earthshaker.

Unless the Necro starts with full LF (even then you can win) or the I misuse Zerker Stance and lets my Stability get Corrupted I rarely fear fighting a Necro. Power Necro can be tough but since most Warriors run with double Endure Pain or have Reflect Missiles even they are beatable. I think when a War loses to a Necro it’s because they are so rare that they aren’t used to the animations so they don’t know what to look out for and don’t avoid skills like Reaper’s Mark or Corrupt.

As for Reaper’s 1v1 prowess, if they did their job right they aren’t designed for that. I know as a Warrior I would probably let myself eat a Chill so that my Whirlwind Attack hits multiple times. We’re generally fine with fighting up close and personal especially with LB cause normally the problem is keep people in the Combustive Shot. The Spec does look like it has a bit more Stability access but with buffed Physical Utility skills it’s still probably not a huge deal.

It seems like Reapers are basically the Necro’s version of a Warrior but with a focus on bringing and keeping your foes close while Warriors move to where their enemy is.

So, I’m back after trying Power Necro. The ease of use probably gives even Warriors a run for its money. That’s not necessarily a bad thing, but I feel so much more fulfilled using Terrormancer but Power does have that appeal of seeing damage numbers popping up constantly.

I feel like the learning curve basically just comes down to dealing with the classes inadequacies. While a well played Terrormancer is to be Feared (heh), if the enemy has a Shoutbow that doesn’t blow all of their removal and spaces it out right good luck beating them. Power is fun but it lacks the mobility of D/P Teef or the support/sustain of MediGuard.

I’ve basically walked away with more empathy for the class. I can see why the devs would have issues balancing because if you have full LF you feel like a god but with none you’re basically a third wheel. One buff too many and we got the Dumbfire problem all over again, but as they are now they have a place in WvW with Wells and that’s it.

Hopefully Reaper impresses me more. If nothing else I’ll be able to enjoy my Greatsaw and Executioner’s outfit.

EDIT:After thinking about it…Reaper on paper seems to be really weak to Warriors. They don’t mind you getting up close and you chilling them just means that skills like Whirlwind Attack are going to hit you a ton of times. That being said they’re team fighters so we’ll see.

sinject.4607:

woops all your leeches just got wasted by blinds, invulns, blocks, evades, or poison

vampirism is only good on engie cause you can activate any toolbelt skill while in mistform even if it’s on cooldown (lol) and can synergize with leeching sigils as well since it’s on swap and engie is good with those

otherwise pack runes are way better

Running it with Static Discharge Engi and Elixir S is pretty funny cause you can use your 2 damage toolbelt skills then toss down the Elixir S for stealth which means you can reposition or heal.

It can sometimes really screw you if you really need that heal and it interrupts it.

flow.6043:

Aktium.9506:

You will be pressing 1 most of the time regardless of what build you use.

That’s not true.

@Burr:
I could write a really long list of stuff that probably some veteran necros don’t even know, but reading about them and trying them in game a very different things.
Also, a lot of it comes down to getting a feeling for skill timings and coodlowns.
So imo the best thing you can do is find a good necro in game and have a little sparring session. In terms of getting experience this would probably be the fastest way to get into the necro groove.

I honestly wouldn’t mind reading them to at least know what to attempt -_-. Also, I almost never see Necros in duel servers and I’m one of those terrible people that run Skullcracker which wrecks pretty much any Necro build that I’ve seen. I have to screw up pretty hard to lose. If I know they’re power I just save my reflect blocks for DS and if they’re condi I just…use Zerker Stance and start with an early Bull’s Charge + 100b which forces them to either use their generally only stun break which means it’s Skull Crack city from then on or they still eat a ton of dmg from the combo. Because of this I feel bad because the Necros never stay long after that.

I see maybe 1 if I’m lucky and they’re often as new as I am.

zapv.8051:

BurrTheKing.8571:

Aktium.9506:

BurrTheKing.8571:

The scepter AA tip is useful. I tended to go right for the main skills. As a GW1 Necro player I’m drawn to condi but I guess I can try Power if you have any tips for it. My perception is that everything leading up to it is just filler for the inevitable 1 spam. I know there’s a bit more to it but I like it when my damage comes from a bunch of sources.

You will be pressing 1 most of the time regardless of what build you use.

That’s….disappointing.

You can weapon cancel a lot of the staff attacks, only really worth it on reaper’s mark and putrid mark. These can be dodged easily because the caster’s hand glows on putrid mark, and reaper’s mark the whole staff is waved. Cancelling reaper’s mark looks cool cause you can cast it to where it shows the whole animation. Similarly, dagger 5 can be cancelled if you think your going to miss. Recently I’ve been moving back to dhummfire because you need the damage to kill a lot of classes especially in teamfights. I run double geo double energy on weapons. Spectral Walk and Flesh wurm are still the best stunbreaks in my opinion as well, terrormancer is a kiting build and nothing is more valuable than space in a kiting build.

That’s interesting, I guess I never really thought about canceling ground targeted skills. Have you noticed that if you sheath skills right at the end of the animation it actually goes on a shorter CD than if you interrupt it mid cast? I noticed that with Pin Down at least.

Aktium.9506:

BurrTheKing.8571:

The scepter AA tip is useful. I tended to go right for the main skills. As a GW1 Necro player I’m drawn to condi but I guess I can try Power if you have any tips for it. My perception is that everything leading up to it is just filler for the inevitable 1 spam. I know there’s a bit more to it but I like it when my damage comes from a bunch of sources.

You will be pressing 1 most of the time regardless of what build you use.

That’s….disappointing.

Aktium.9506:

BurrTheKing.8571:

What do you typically open with on Terrormancer? I see a lot open with Staff 3 then typically 2. Or is it better to start with Scepter/Dagger? I tend to start with Scepter 2 then go for 5 but the delay on those skills seem to make it so annoying to land reliably. I can land nades on Engi all day but Scep/Dag seem to be really troublesome to land consistently and not doing so is a huge knock on your DPS.

Also, I had this troll D/P teef ambushing me constantly in a duel server and giving me crap for not being able to beat him (I did generally force a SR and camping in stealth to remove condis). As a Terrormancer starting with little to no LF am I supposed to reliably beat D/P teef? I fully acknowledge that I’m not great at necro yet but if I’m supposed to be hardcountering something then I may have a ways to go.

I barely ever play condi, so I’m by no means an authority on it. I saw the light of zerk necro at launch and never looked back. But if you wanna play it safe as a condi nec, start auto attacking with scepter to procc any possible auto removal and possibly bait out a cleanse before you start stacking up on conds for real. You can reserve staff for when someone gets close and you’ll be having an easier time landing all your marks. Terror isn’t a dueling build so don’t expect to win against equal or better players without 100% DS. If you’re less than 50% DS you’re gonna have a hard time against D/P, best you can do is to try juking them with Wurm and Walk to get away and find a teammate when they’re on you. With Full DS you should be able to kill or force a disengage.

I would go with the run of the mill Terror build over the FitG variant. A single stack of stability won’t do much at all most of the time and Greater Marks makes it a lot easier to land marks on moving foes.

The scepter AA tip is useful. I tended to go right for the main skills. As a GW1 Necro player I’m drawn to condi but I guess I can try Power if you have any tips for it. My perception is that everything leading up to it is just filler for the inevitable 1 spam. I know there’s a bit more to it but I like it when my damage comes from a bunch of sources.

Bias.4306:

DonFurtuna.7340:

That only think I want: nerf warrior. Please, it’s been years

During the first few months of the game we did really really well against Warriors, would be great to bring that back.

As a War main who’s been hanging around Necro forums recently I have a few things to say:

1: EVERYTHING was good vs the Warrior at launch if you knew what the dodge key was.

2: Warrior has gotten many nerfs AND will be getting another nerf to Heal Sig. The reason we ended up at Shoutbow was because of how much weaker everything else became. Builds like Hambow and Axebow are still decent builds but very much counterable (which I’m totally fine with btw). The upcoming Cele nerf is also going to hit Shoutbow as well, how hard we’ll have to wait and see but if it’s significant than who knows if Wars will even be viable until the next big update. Teefs are better roamers, Guards/Engis can be better bunkers, other classes can stack might just fine.

3: I’m new to Necro but the new Foot in the Grave seems decent for countering Warrior CC.

I’m all for Necros having a fair shot vs Warriors, but being able to just walk all over them like launch? No thanks.

What do you typically open with on Terrormancer? I see a lot open with Staff 3 then typically 2. Or is it better to start with Scepter/Dagger? I tend to start with Scepter 2 then go for 5 but the delay on those skills seem to make it so annoying to land reliably. I can land nades on Engi all day but Scep/Dag seem to be really troublesome to land consistently and not doing so is a huge knock on your DPS.

Also, I had this troll D/P teef ambushing me constantly in a duel server and giving me crap for not being able to beat him (I did generally force a SR and camping in stealth to remove condis). As a Terrormancer starting with little to no LF am I supposed to reliably beat D/P teef? I fully acknowledge that I’m not great at necro yet but if I’m supposed to be hardcountering something then I may have a ways to go.

Also, I’ve been running this build because the newly buffed Foot trait seemed pretty solid but maybe it’s better just to have the unblockable marks on staff?

Hey there. I’ve mained a Warrior for a while and decided that it was time to jump to other characters and learn the tricks of their trade so that I can not only play them well, but counter them as well. For example, for Warriors it’s important to know how to time weapon sheathing in order to bait out countermeasures so that you can actually land skills like Pin Down and Backbreaker reliably. For Mesmers it was combos like Torch 4 – GS 4 – GS 2 – GS 3 While shattering and just general clone placement for maximum effectiveness. On Engi there’s the devastating Rifle 4 – Magnet then swapping back to rifle to use skill 5 for massive and almost unaviodable dmg.

I’m going to be honest, as a Warrior I rarely fear Necros unless they start with full Lifeforce. That being said, I would like to learn the optimal combos and little tricks that a noob to the class like me wouldn’t know. I prefer Terrormancer over Power Necros but tips for both are welcome.

What’s the optimal combos? How/when should I use DS? How do I gain Life Force more easily (That’s always the issue I run into in 1v1s)? Are there any little tricks I can use to gain the advantage?

Thanks in advance!

I agree that sigils should not be as build defining as they are currently. Someone with Air&Fire can miss a bunch of attacks but connect with one auto attack that procs both and suddenly you’re missing a huge chunk of your health. For example, fighting a D/P teef as a Mesmer, you’re doing OK then suddenly 1 backstab hits for 6K+Fire+Air and you’re dead.

I feel equally as bad when I don’t play well but win due to lucky sigil procs on Mes, SD Engi, or Greatbow War. I didn’t EARN that damage, it was given to me for basically free. The same applies to traits like Incendiary Powered, there’s no way to avoid the burn, it’s going to hit you eventually.

Having Air/Fire not work on AA and trigger after a crit would be a good step. Maybe add a particle effect “aura” around users weapon and if they miss that next attack you don’t get the damage and it goes on the ICD. It still wouldn’t be perfect but it would at least make it somewhat predictable.

I would also suggest maybe simply making it impossible to combine two sigils of the same type. Most of the most troublesome combos are of the same type whether it be “on crit” or “on swap.” This would probably solve a decent number of problems and would make other under used sigils more appealing without any sort of direct nerf.

MidoriMarch.8067:

m8s pls…

i am talking about the mobility here didnt even mention about any kind of damage or other stuff.

and someone talked about mesmer/thief has better escape ability but thats different. thief burns up initiative and skills like shadowstep = 60 sec cool down and mesmer as well has long cd. but warriors? extremely short cd less than 30 sec and doesnt even burn up initiative like thief or long cd like mesmer. and that 25% sprint trait line make them viable to run fast without sacrifice any skill utility slot or doesnt force u to use 25% ms runes. its extremely unfair to warrior have all the mobility offence and defence stats as well. well ok i wouldnt give a kitten about anything about warrior but the mobility on warrior is insane. u guys are saying that mobility is needed to catch those thieves and mesmers but thats wrong. warrior shouldnt meant to out mobility these classess.

Rush/Bull’s/Whirlwind can only go in a straight line. Teef, Mesmer, even Necro (Wurm) can abuse the Z axis and instantly get to areas of the map that Warrior has to run around to reach.

Being able to blink to places like this are much more valuable for escape than just simple land speed.

It seems like you want Teef and mes to be able to ALWAYS escape from a Warrior. Having high base stats is a must when your class lacks mechanics like stealth and constant evades.

You really shouldn’t put that much stock in points in PvP, they are an unreliable indicator of performance. I’m not saying this guy was in the right, but certain roles don’t always end up with a ton of points. If you’re roaming, you’re probably not sticking around for caps so that can be a major loss in points. You can also tap a foe with a few autos and get kill credit.

Honestly, the point system should probably be dropped. It’s like Kill/Death ratios in objective-based FPS, they might indicate skill or it might mean that the guy focused more on killing than the actual objective and the guy who went 5/10 but completed multiple objectives actually won the game.

Saiyan.1704:

The biggest issue with Rampage is the perma Stability.

How in the name of Melandru’s first born do be counter it when they’re channeling the Soul’s Hero buff in Stronghold? So. Frustrating.

Terrormancer. Strip the stability right after it pulses, then immediately Fear. I’m pretty sure that even once the Stab is reapplied it does not remove the fear. Also, Moa.

BlackTruth.6813:

^
Before bulls charge becomes cleave, I hope ANET gives stomp the rampage treatment where it knocks people down instead of launching them out of attack range.

I’d rather it be a ground targeted skill. It doesn’t need huge range. If not that, at least allow you to move while you’re leaping, it’s so easy to cancel it accidentally. Atm it’s a bit too easy to just walk away from someone using Stomp so being able to move or leap even a little would be great.

I’m more than fine with it being a launch. Physical skills already have a knock down and a push. Even in it’s current form it’s not a bad skill for pushing people off point. Stomp + Pin Down is great for getting a decap.

Juba.8406:

xDudisx.5914:

We are talking about the mobility not dmg. If you want to compared dmg we should also say rush hits about 2times RTL dmg.

Rush = 634 * 1 = 634
RTL = 340 * 5 = 1700

Anyway, GS is one of the worst weapons for spvp warrior. 3 out of 5 skills are weak/easy to avoid. For pve and wvw rush is just a run away skill.

then why the QQ ?!

Rush + bulls charge is one of the few thing that make us to keep up with heavy kiting professions like thief and mesmer.

If some warriors use it to escape then what about mesmers and thieves using stealth and teleports to escape ? should we nerf stealth & teleports because of that ?

BTW Bull’s Charge is 40s cooldown a single target skill, while engi Rocket boots is 20s cooldown, AoE, Blast finisher (can grant stealth) and Cures immobilized, crippled, and chilled…….. if thats not the perfect escape skill then i don’t know what that is.

I demand 20s cooldown for an AoE Bulls Charge, how about that ?

see you can’t compare skills like that, it doesn’t work that way.

Although, it would be nice to keep the same CDs but have those skills be AoE just from a functionality perspective. They seem to be much more reliable in terms of connecting with their target. If your target sidesteps a little bit it still hits. I also don’t witness skills like RtL rubbing up against their target before activating like BC does. I’ve lost so many fights because even though they didn’t do anything to avoid BC, the skill just didn’t work right.

I don’t really see Rush and BC becoming OP if they cleave. In fact, it might actually make them a bit more attractive in serious PvP.

xDudisx.5914:

Just give Rush the same treatment as ride the lightning. If you miss the multiplied by 2. Or rework rush into a skill that is good for something other than just a run away button.

That would be fine if Rush was as consistent as RTL in terms of accurately going towards it’s target, but it isn’t. Even if you use Rush offensively it will still overshoot or go the total opposite direction at the last second. It’s not fair to punish players for something out of their control.

Also, using Rush to kite is often times the only way you have a chance to beat MediGuard and certain teef specs.

GoogleBrandon.5073:

I find that Rampage and Lich fall under a different category really…

Lich is incredibly bad designed, sorry for saying, but the emphasis of the damage being on the first skill without any thought makes it boring to play as, and frustrating to fight against… You can counter it, do not get me wrong, but gameplay wise it is incredibly boring… Most people do not even understand that the 5th skill is one to use as well at times

Rampage however is a bit different… All skills on the bar are extremely situational and are well thought out in my opinion… I honestly think that this elite is balanced rather well

I agree. I don’t hate Lich, but it’s really boring to just see some1 pop a couple of the 2-5 skills and then just press 1 from range. Meanwhile on Rampage every skill has a huge tell and the damage it causes comes from landing all of them. The 1 skill hits hard but is also melee range.

Kagamiku.9731:

First, let me quote what Midorimarch said roughly 1 month ago

and btw warriors are ezpz cake to kill 1v1 as medi/dps guardian

^Which is actually true

Secondly,
Why create a second thread two days later about the same exact thing? I take it you’re just in troll mode now. Noted.

Yah, I don’t know how anyone can complain about GS when in WvW it’s used mostly as mobility and in PvP you only see it being used “seriously” in duels, and any good MediGuard has all the tools to totally trash it if they have a Scepter. If the MediGuard has GS and Sword, it’s possible to kite them around with LB, but with a scepter they have enough range that it no longer works and all they really have to do is stand outside of Combustive Shot and not eat a Pin Down or Bull’s Charge. Even if they do, they have enough blocks and blinds to counter it the first time around and an Elite that allows them to get those counters back.

MediGuard and D/P (sometimes S/D) Teef are the Zerkers you most commonly see (I see a few Power Necros now) but you rarely ever see a GS Warrior because they don’t do anything better than those two builds. Sure, they can run fast, but Teef can use SB or a Shadow Step to totally bypass parts of the map and MediGuard can bring good damage AND good team support with the Hammer version. Heck, even with the more selfish GS version you can bring an AoE condi cleanse at minimum. I used to think MediGuard took some skill, but after you learn what skills to look out for on the current meta builds there’s almost no real risk and you can beat most any other zerker build.

So yah, I have no idea why this “War mobility OP” crap is still a thing. Even in WvW the “worst” thing that can happen is the War gets away, which Teef and Mes can do just as well and in many cases better because of terrain abuse using Blink/Shadow Steps. If you allow yourself to be kited by GS and die, that’s on you.

lordhelmos.7623:

BurrTheKing.8571:

I could see Warriors getting Venoms, although I hope they would be a bit more flashy than what teefs have. Honestly what you described just sounds like a slightly different take on teef and I would not be OK with that. I already find that class to be too forgiving and straight forward, I wouldn’t want my main class to go that way even more than it already has.

Whatever spec we get, I would want it to increase the skill ceiling because atm the most complex mechanic we have is weapon sheathing which is something every class has.

I would disagree and am absolutely sure the devs stated somewhere that they wanted warrior to remain “simple and easy to play.”

Classes like the Chronomancer are there for high skill ceiling play. I don’t think the warrior will benefit from being overly complex. For those that are unsatisfied with warrior simplicity, I think that is a player issue and not a design issue and those players should try more complex classes.

Here was the criteria that I used to build the above specialization:

1.) New specialization mechanic must harmonize with the current burst F1 and not replace/overshadow it unless the entire system and F1 are being changed by the spec. In this instance the core class mechanic must still be competitive.

2.) New F skill must be easy to use and understand. Warrior must remain an accessible class that is easy to pick up and play by a newcomer, but has enough depth and pressure combos to allow more experienced players to stay interested. This is the opposite of mesmer, where you go in knowing you will have a rubix cube to unravel.

3.) Must maintain an “in your face/hack and slash” playstyle of hyperaggression with tools to stick on an enemy. To this degree it must have tools to mitigate enemy soft and hard CC and stay alive long enough to do significant melee pressure when used correctly.

4.) Must allow options for both physical and condition damage build types.

As a counter, specializations give you a new icon and abilities to where you are no longer just a Warrior. The Warrior base class can remain simple mechanically, but you can add more complexity on the specs to add more depth that they currently lack.

Your argument about being friendly to newcomers doesn’t really make sense, because newcomers won’t be using specializations until they reach level 80 (except for maybe PvP, but the game discourages you from diving into that when you’re new).

You got to give veteran Warrior players a reason to stick with the character that they’ve spent so many hours on. Personally, I’ve recently become fairly bored of most of the builds because the most complex thing we have is weapon sheathing, and that’s not even Warrior specific.

I would say ideally Warrior as a class should be “easy to learn, hard to master” and not just “easy” and that the spec adds new mechanics that are simple conceptually but require a bit of skill to use effectively.

I could see Warriors getting Venoms, although I hope they would be a bit more flashy than what teefs have. Honestly what you described just sounds like a slightly different take on teef and I would not be OK with that. I already find that class to be too forgiving and straight forward, I wouldn’t want my main class to go that way even more than it already has.

Whatever spec we get, I would want it to increase the skill ceiling because atm the most complex mechanic we have is weapon sheathing which is something every class has.

Warlord.9074:

lighter.2708:

Warrior doesn’t lack in AoE.
Almost every single warrior skill are multi target AoE except rifle

Cleave isn’t aoe. In a technical since Logbow fire field 5 person area of effect. Cleave 3 target max melee attack.

Anet said somthing about adjusting runes bcuz of new specializations I wouldnt be surprised if trapper runes just get changed. Like they changed other runes before.

Bcuz gaurdain with stealth is stupid too. they can burst just as hard as a warrior in some cases and in other cases harder.

They may also be losing a some of their sustain because of the virtues changes. We won’t know till we see it in action.

Warlord.9074:

well warrior lacks AOE. Besides Longbow warrior has none. Traps would be a good way for Anet to implement that. And why not? Just because one class is getting traps doesn’t mean another one isn’t too. How many classes currently have Shouts 3 and we know another will be bringing that up to 4.

In addition to the stealth issue, I don’t see ANet giving two classes the same thing, I just don’t. It would potentially cause a huge backlash with players saying “we basically have 3 rangers now” and the like. ANet can make some big mistakes, but when it comes to class creativity and variety they’re generally smart.

I really do want to duel wield pistols though man…I bet Warrior will end up being one of the last specs revealed.

Source on this image? I’m pretty sure it’s fake (as much as I wish it wasn’t).

My reasoning is that the other 2 pictures so far showed new armor pieces and new weapons. This picture is a mix of Phalanx, Grasping Dead, T3 Human Cultural, and I think Ascalonian gloves. The pistols are the Order of Whispers pistol and the sword on his back is I think the Ebon Vanguard GS. Nothing on here is new from what I can tell. Good artwork though, and really close to what I have on one of my armor sets (use a different helm and gloves).

I really would like this to be a thing and the new skills to be Gadgets, but I think it’s wishful thinking. It would also be cool if the new F2 made your other set appear on you and you can quickswap to it with an attack. But I don’t see Warrior getting to use pistol on both hands when Mesmer only gets 2 skills on an offhand (although they do seem to be powerful). Who knows though?

Zietlogik.6208:

lighter.2708:

dagger mainhand.

because offhand won’t work

Why not? Think Metal Gear Solid CQC style!

I was looking forward to that on teef, too bad it’s just a braindead build that I find boring (like most teef specs).

Well, considering that the Dragon Hunter is getting traps, this is unlikely to happen.

I’m starting to wonder if we’re going to get some sort of Warrior/Engi hybrid that uses a offhand pistol and Gadgets. What it would be called I have no idea. That being said, I can’t think of much else atm that makes sense. There’s nothing stopping Warriors from picking up so tech to remain relevant in a word that it rapidly industrializing.

Artaz.3819:

BurrTheKing.8571:

+ the now-master level Heightened Focus

You mean Brawler’s Recovery.

The answer is yes, because there is always Dogged March to assist against heavy condition. The real unknown factor is actually Mending (since it is will be considered a physical skill and be reduced cooldown too) versus straight up Healing Signet.

It’s actually looking good for a “skill-based” Warrior interrupt build.

---

The real issue is that Shoutbow looks to be even stronger. (Warhorn trait no longer competes with Empowered Allies. And Shrug it Off! another short and easily triggered shout will be interesting as a strong alternative as well. Healing Surge became classified as a shout as well (wee on HPS with the trait with that healing skill). And it might even be worth taking one banner for the Banner Regen healing trait now too (it’s a Master trait in Discipline for more party support) because of Healing Surge change to Shout so you lose nothing and gain Banner Rez that more often.

Fixed it, was thinking about how it no longer competes with Heightened Focus and Burst Mastery.

And yah, Shoutbow looks pretty kitten strong, although Celestial is getting nerfed so we
ll have to see. With Cele being weaker it may all even out.

One of my biggest disappointments when the game launched was how underwhelming Interrupt based builds were. Even Mesmer only had one semi-viable interrupt build, but now I see a ton of potential. Hopefully after the Specializations patch hits it’ll be possible to run an interrupt focused build on Mesmer, Warrior, and Ranger.

I’m not 100% on the Ranger options since I’m only a novice on it but I’ve spent a good amount of time on Warrior and Mes and I am seriously hyped. Physical Warriors will be able to apply Confusion and gain Might on interrupt and with Mending becoming a Physical Skill and Brawler’s Recovery becoming a Master trait I think it should be possible to not take Berserker Stance and take 2 Physical skills instead.

On Mesmer…hehehehehe…I can’t even begin. I see viable options in both power and conditions and both seem to be pretty strong.

With Ranger now having Moment of Clarity as a Master and Predator’s Onslaught it looks like you can really punish after an interrupt. There’s also Quick Draw which makes it possible for you to reduce the CD of your interrupts.

I’m cautiously hopeful that the next meta will require more skill and will have fewer turrets and master-of-all Celestial bruisers.

The trait itself seems pretty dang strong for Hambow. One thing I’m wondering is if Cleansing Ire + the now-master level Heightened Focus Brawler’s Recovery is enough condi clear that you can forgo Berserker Stance for 2 Physical skills. If so, if you space out your skills and time them right, that’s gonna be a ton of Weakness, Bleeding, and Confusion that is boosted in damage by Might which means you don’t have to invest in actual condi dmg.

I’m really hoping Physical Warrior becomes the skill based spec so many of us wanted. The focus on interrupts this time around is really encouraging.

EDIT: I forgot that Mending is becoming a Physical skill so I think that our condi removal will be OK without Zerker Stance.