Guild Wars 2

Ohoni.6057:

I will note that this mission would have been WAY more fun, across the board, if we’d had access to Bloodstone gliding powers.

Seriously. And not just this fight, but other situations as well. The gliding skills are among the best things from this LS season, and it’s a shame to see them dropped like a hot potato after the first episode.

I think the problem with the dragon arc is that it’s really hard to portray a confrontation with unfathomable forces of nature in a satisfying manner. Both the way they handled Zhaitan and the way they handled Mordremoth got a lot of flak from many players. The campaign against Zhaitan was often considered boring, impersonal and unheroic — I disagree, it worked for me, but YMMV. Mordremoth on the other hand ceased feeling like an Elder Dragon the moment 1) a bunch of yokels could zerg its physical manifestation to death like any other world boss and 2) a completely nonsensical kitten pull destroyed its mind. Both without any planning or preparation. They tried to make it a more personal and immediate confrontation but completely removed the ancient world-devouring threat factor in the process.

So now I wonder if switching away from the dragons and towards an easier-to-depict threat is them kind of throwing the towel on the issue, or if it was planned from the start.

Personally I’m kind of glad that Taimi’s plan didn’t work, because it would have made the Elder Dragons even more pitiful if TWO of them eliminated each other in a throwaway cutscene. There’s been way too much asura-ex-machina BS for my liking as it is. If I never have to heard the word “magitech” again, especially in the context of “oh yeah I have this toy that’ll fix everything because who needs planning or collectively coming up with solutions in the spirit of everyone-comes-together-to-save-our-world” I’ll be a much happier GW2 player.

I imagine it can be immersion-breaking for most human characters, yeah, and as someone who wants to staple a sign saying, “Give us more race-specific dialog so the PC feels less of a one-size-fits-all faceless blob!” to the devs’ faces I’m annoyed on behalf of human-favoring players.

On the other hand, for us non-human fans, it’s kind of nice to get a chance to kick the god of human supremacism in the goolies. :p

I haven’t finished the Whispers storyline so I never met Demmi and didn’t care for her one way or another, but her death was definitely cheap as hell … especially compared to the constant untouchable-mesmer-ex-machina spam the writers enjoy so much.

IMO it’s completely irrelevant what kind of weapon he may or may not have used, because it doesn’t affect anyone else in that way. So yeah, this felt like cheap drama for cheap drama’s sake, and without making sure people have a reason to be invested in this character to boot.

Granted, writing a “good” on-screen death isn’t easy … especially when you should take player agency into concern as well. But after the shameless fridging of Eir, I’d say the story should take extra care to avoid cheap deaths, not add more. (Then again, after Ep3 I’d consider it poetic justice if Braham-the-Brat got offed pitifully too.)

Not the story, just the maps themselves. For me it’s:

1) Bloodstone Fen. Yeah, the Jade bosses are hp sponges and Mantle freaks who knock your glider off can (still) go kiss a trash compactor, but I genuinely enjoy the gliding in this map and was sad to see that none of the new skills carry over. As someone who’d really like to see mounts in this game and absolutely loved the mobility my feral druid had in WoW, I find that using the glider in Bloodstone Fen is the most enjoable way of getting around in the game, which often feels like a slog otherwise. This is verticality done right. Plus the dailies don’t take too long and unbound magic is plentiful.

2) Bitterfrost Frontier. What can I say, I am a sucker for winter maps since we don’t get anything worth calling “winter” where I live anymore. Berries are easy to come by, though you also need a lot of them. There are no White Mantle to tick me off. I kind of like the kodan, arrogant gasbags though they can be at times, and enjoyed the new lore about them. Hopefully the Flame of Koda will continue to play a part in fighting Jormag.

3) Lake Doric. Many enemies there are annoying and I don’t enjoy the dailies so much, but the “feel” of it, of a chaotic warzone, works quite well and there’s always something happening. Bonus points for being a map with a cat in it.

4) Ember Bay. It’s ugly, the enemies are kind of boring except for the jade boss and veterans which are a pain instead. There’s too much comic relief for my liking with both the skritt and the circus, which makes it feel more like a whacky holiday destination than a supremely hostile place about to explode under everyone’s feet, and the jumping puzzle is just sadistic.

Crinn.7864:

Introverts have little to no trouble with text based communications, it’s only face-to-face group settings (like parties and things) that introverts struggle with.

This. Plus my brain seens to be wired weirdly — I understand and retain written communication/information much better than spoken words, which when I’m “overloaded” can either fail to register at all, or feel like a kick in the teeth. So I avoid voice chat if at all possible, especially if it is just chatter.

Since the friends who initially tried the game with me didn’t stick with it and the guild I’m in is pretty much in “sleep mode”, I exclusively play solo or sometimes join organized events. Pugging fractals or dungeons is our of the question because 1) I’m not very confident or experienced and 2) too many people love to spew BS, which in combination can get very nasty very fast.

This is one reason why charr are so hard to find a good look for — a lot of shoulder pieces are not only ridiculousy oversized, but also hover so far away from the body that you could drive a truck through the gap. The size and posture of charr characters makes it a lot more noticable than with other races, too.

One of the worst examples are the Chronomancer’s Epaulets, which I’d love to use for my charr mesmer if they weren’t quite so huge and floaty.

The lighting is definitely different, but what really bugs me is how zoomed in it is now … you can’t really get a good look at charr characters at all. Can we get that reversed please?

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

However, it would be a terribly-written story if we liked everyone all the time, if we didn’t second guess at least some of their choices, if we didn’t see people get a second chance to do better.

Probably, but I think then complete lack of player agency makes big drama-llama moments really annoying for quite a few people. Plus, story-missions are few and far between and the actual talking in them is still often second fiddle to combat, which means the length and depth for a “proper” reconciliation arc just isn’t there. Or the fact that there may be something that needs to be worked out with at all isn’t even acknowledged in the first place if the person being insulted or abandoned or kept in the dark is the PC.

The PC has a lot of experience speaking truth to power and speaking kindly to friends and allies; there was no evidence of this in LS3.3.

The PC is a doormat now. I liked Eir’s memorial, and Aurene is okay if overly cutesy, but that aside it’s like nobody takes us seriously. Marjory, Taimi, Braham, and now Jenna is a massive condescending tosser towards us as well while the PC fawns all over her in return.

Note: I don’t want everyone to fawn over my character, either, or for me to be able to flat-out murder someone for disagreeing with me. I just want a) to be taken seriously and b) for supposed “friends” to actually act as such i.e. show some interest, support and desire to actually be around the PC once in a blue moon. There’s none of that with the biconics and never was, Canach aside if you’re a sylvari in HoT.

If Braham gets to spew his wangst all over us for the length of an expansion and a LS season and possibly more, but we never get to express that we went through some serious hell too (especially as a sylvari), something’s messed up. Let the protagonist be the protagonist.

Ardid.7203:

IMO the humancentrism of everything in the game is one of the bigger problems in it, it diminishes the amazing work they did creating these beautiful races in the first place.

Absolutely. The same applies to armor, of course (which along with all the stereotypically gendered armors, is the reason why I don’t even bother looking at new skins because they’re as good as guaranteed to be utter garbage in my eyes), and really does the game a massive disservice. If devs want to see their more orignal and interesting species get more love from more players, they need to actually support us being able to make our characters and their halls look the part instead of just “humans in funny suits”.

It’s particularly bad with/for sylvari and charr. But some distinctly norn-themed stuff would be great too, I love the suggestion of spirit-statues and shrines.

I liked it a lot too. Ridhais was a bit impersonal towards a fellow sylvari, but the all too brief talk with the Pale Tree made up for that, and seeing big brother Trahearne again (even as just a memory) was touching.

Full agreement with the statements in this thread. If a collection item can’t be sold or handed in, don’t make it an actual item in the inventory. Pointless clutter is just annoying.

I like Canach, too, though I’m not normally a fan of the “snarky” types. What sold me on him was (playing as sylvari) the slowly developing sibling-bond with him during the shared trials with Mordremoth’s call during HoT. It went from mutual prickly mistrust to being each other’s apparently only source of support. So yeah, I hope we’ll keep seeing more of him and keep building the new friendship.

Honestly, I never wanted a guild, nevermind this guild. I want the Pact back. Most of my actively played characters are sylvari, so getting the Pact up and running has been one of the big focal points of their young lives aside from their Wyld Hunt. With all that history, duty and responsibility, they’d never just tell the Pact to go eff itself and flounce off into the wild blue yonder, especially after the massive death toll of HoT.

There’s also the issue that I never felt as if the “biconics” are actually my “friends”. They never show any friendly interest, concern, whatever … which is particularly blatant when going through HoT as a sylvari. You’re constantly on the verge of having your mind shredded by an Elder Dragon, and they not only don’t give a toss, some of them are actively hostile towards sylvari. Which, okay, is understandable … but not the way you act towards a “friend” in dire straits.

Canach is the only one who shows any support, so he’s the only one of the new characters I feel an actual connection to. I’m cautiously positive towards Caithe again as well because at least she shows some remorse, though I’m still waiting for a chance to rip into her and the Pale Tree for keeping the big secret from us for so long. Everyone else ranges from “meh” to “go kiss a garbage shredder”. There’s no way I ever want to see Braham’s face again in particular now, and Taimi never does not rub me up the wrong way with every word.

It’s a shame that there’s no room for roleplaying or actual choices in any of this. Dragon’s Watch is such a joke anyway, it basically doesn’t exist.

Overdue but very welcome and quite satisfying, new title and all. Good skins, too, though right now it still feels a bit weird to think of Caladbolg as anything but a greatsword. :p Definitely cheers and thanks to the event team.

Also two thumbs up for me! It finally touches on some of HoT’s unfinished issues, and I do hope that the Pale Tree will feature in more current or episodic content again soon, since she does say there’s much to talk about. I’m still not sure if my sylvari can forgive her for keeping the big secret, and that really should come up at some point, but it did feel good to see her again. Trahearne, too, even as just a memory fragment. RIP big brother.

I enjoyed collecting the motes, and I wish the shards had similarly had some flavor text attached to them. If I have one quibble, though, it is that the talks with Ridhais felt rather “generic” and impersonal as a sylvari, as if she was talking to any random clueless outsider instead one of her own people. You don’t need to tell me about Caladbolg’s history and powers, since I’m the one who retrieved it and avenged Riannoc! In contrast, the brief conversation with the Pale Tree was much better.

I like the skins, too. I’m actually tempted to get all of them the “proper” way i.e. with other characters, though that is rather expensive …

Yes, I just didn’t have the impression that the Legions are so entwined with each other that a higher-ranking member from one can boss the others around. There’s quite a bit of conflict under the surface, even if they’re technically supposed to be part of the same “nation”. It’s a comparatively minor complaint, really, but it’s not like using Blood Legion NPCs would have been some kind of resource drain since the models are already in the game.

I’ll be a little peeved if Rytlock gets kicked out, to be honest, just as I was extremely peeved when the writers kicked me out of the Pact. Cutting ties to the characters’ past willy-nilly instead of exploring them always annoys me.

Above everything else, I want less gendered armor. It’s beyond infuriating to see male characters wearing something really impressive, menacing, and/or thematically appealing — and then see the same set turn into yet another half-naked cutesy fetish k*tten trainwreck on a female character. A few months into the game, I flat out stopped paying attention to new skins because it’s always the same BS (with the exception of the decent ascended sets). There are some skins on the gem store that I’d absolutely buy if I could just have the male version.

If there absolutely “must” be skimpy outfits, at least have them be equal-opportunity, just as the practical outfits should be equal-opportunity. I’m sure many straight women, gay men and bi folks among the playerbase wouldn’t mind some eyecandy aimed at them for a change.

More cultural armor would also be very welcome. There’s way too much human-themed stuff, especially in the light armor department, and too few outfits that don’t look out of place on charr or sylvari in particular. I absolutely love playing both species for both the visuals and the lore, but they’re really hard to find good gear for.

I’m also adding my voice to the “more pants for light armor” and the “no more trenchcoats and butt flaps for medium armor” chorus.

Generally, I’m not keen on outfits because we can’t mix-and-match them. Armor >>>> outfits any day.

Exactly. Caithe is the only character in whom both the internal and the external conflict actually manifested in any meaningful manner, and while she undeniably did some really bad things in the past, I think it’s a little unfair that she gets “singled out” in that way. The writers have some good ideas, but never really explore them, and that is regrettable and unsatisfying. Anti-sylvari sentiments, sylvari identity crises, the fate of the Soundless as the most vulnerable group, Trahearne’s death, the condition of the Pale Tree, the Commander’s reaction to her secrecy especially if they’re sylvari … all of that is begging to be explored, and I fear it won’t be.

With all the people swarming into the new map, I noticed that it’s easy to have your storyline-conversations with certain NPCs interrupted by other people. The dwarf and the ghost captain were both in mid-exposition with me and then suddenly talked to another person about something else. That is rather aggravating, and I’d really like to see the devs prevent it from happening in future open-world storytelling.

A Rytlock-focused episode would be awesome, though at this point it’s hard to imagine how it’d tie in with the dragons we’re fighting.

What bugged me is that neither the two Adamant Guard grunts nor Smodur have any business ordering Rytlock around. He’s Blood, not Iron, and he’s not on Iron territory either so what gives?

As far as story boss fights go, it was definitely among the best, yes. Seeing a boss called the Destroyer of Hope pop up and charge at our new little dragon added an extra kick of “Oh no you don’t!” urgency. A bit in-your-face, but it worked for me.

Lazarus’ arrival also worked quite well because I was in a serious spot of bother just when he popped in and saved my hide. From “This is BS, how am I supposed to beat this?!” to “Holy cow, that was … kinda kitten!” in a heartbeat. While I haven’t played GW1, he’s definitely caught my attention as a character whose further actions and development will hopefully be as interesting as this sets him up to be.

I like the patch overall, and think the game continues to head in a more enioyable direction. The new mastery is fun in a hilarious “that can’t possibly be a good idea” kind of way, especially if you get cannonned through several tubes in a row. The story was a bit heavy on the legwork and light on meaningful dialogue, but I still had fun with it, especially the finale. It’s good to interact more amiably with Caithe again, too, though I missed my spiky brother Canach. While I haven’t tried fractals yet, the removal of boon thieves and an improved balance between power and condition on all levels sound very welcome.

For the future, I’d like less of the tiresome Taimi-fawning, please, and more quality time with the new dragon — as well as an overdue chat with the Pale Tree, especially for sylvari players. I could see her play a part in Aurene’s future, too.

Agreed, Electro. I liked the naming, and the vision, and despite my dislike for the tryhard cutesy face (*) I was definitely all “GET AWAY FROM MY LITTLE DRAGON!” when the destroyers attacked. Overall it was a good finale for an enjoyable episode — but there was a distinct lack of Aurene and the PC actually acknowledging each other directly and that is a shame. Please Anet, give us a touching personal moment or three in the next episode!

(*) Tryhard cutesiness feels manipulative and can flip over into creepy territory, IMO, especially with bits of Mordremoth’s face incorporated into hers. That will take some getting used to for my sylvari characters. :p

Guardian fits the theme of heroic protector very well, IMO, especially as a sylvari due to the “destroy the Elder Dragons” Wyld Hunt. It’s like you were literally born for this.

Caithe is an ambiguous and divisive character, for sure. I liked her a lot during the original story, partly because I mainly play sylvari. LS2 … geez, what a train wreck. Her being Faolain’s mindless patsy to the point of murdering a whole tribe of peaceful beings and very nearly watching Faolain torture a fellow syvlari to death made me loathe her, and combined with the sketchy behavior surrounding the egg and keeping a secret that nearly wiped out the whole Pact, it’s certainly understandable that a lot of players aren’t keen on her anymore to say the least.

That said, I actually like the fact that Mordremoth’s influence messed her up so much. For an Elder Dragon whose sphere of influence included Mind, it was pretty pitiful when it came to dominating anyone but nameless redshirts, at least during HoT proper when it should have been at its strongest. Both Canach and the sylvari PC just shrug it off without much effort or any apparent lasting effects, and I don’t like that at all. That is why Caithe’s behavior in LS3 went some way in making me like her again. It’s a good thing when characters aren’t so impossibly resilient that nothing can mess with them, plus she is trying to do the right thing again.

I’d like to be able to rebuild my relationship with my “big sister” and former mentor. When push comes to shove, I still like her more than all the new NPCs.

Given Glint’s legacy, I expected Kralkatorrik to be #3 and make an immediate move on his new grand-minion. But a fire-versus-ice battle could be interesting too, though so far there’s been no sign, I think, of active Elder Dragons messing with each other? It’d be interesting to see how they and their minion relate/react to another Elder Dragon and its minions.

Considering the fact that Taimi hacked into Tarir’s systems, I wonder if her tampering is partly responsible, too. At least I hope so, because it might finally be a reason to give her a serious thrashing for her I’ll-do-whatever-I-want recklessness and disrespect for other people’s private business.

I admittedly never liked Marjory, so her aloof and me-first attitude didn’t strike me as odd here because she’s rubbed me up the wrong way in similar ways before. Never had the sense that she really gives a toss about anyone who isn’t Kasmeer, so she can walk off a cliff without a glider as far as I’m concerned. :p

I missed the vote, but just want to chip in a big YES for the change, anyway. The gendered armors are a blight on the game as far as I’m concerned, and playing charr or asura is the only way to escape that utter garbage. (And for goodness’ sake, no more tail-clipping or hover-pauldrons either.)

Can’t say I find any of them particularly appealing or thematically appropriate, so I’d rather keep Destiny’s Edge, too. There’s more connection to the old DE than to any of the three options, IMO.

I mean, I’d kind of like “The Unbroken” as a title for any sylvari who withstood Mordremoth, but as a party name it just doesn’t do anything for me. Dragon’s Watch is too passive and Eternity’s Guard just feels both random and presumptous since they’re hardly immortal.

I agree that deep turquoise would fit more colours and I was almost set on it, but since she has scarlet leaves now, I think I’ll carry that over so the “new her” doesn’t look totally different from the “old her”. Armor colours might vary. For now I’ll probably go with dusky dyes since that’s her cycle.

This is her most likely new look. (Posting the image directly refuses to work for some reason.)

I dislike making a big show and dance about something as silly as a level-up. To make it more exciting, there would need to be more “crunch” (actual power gain) and not more “fluff” (fireworks and angel choirs). You get a skillpoint and that’s it, and most skills can’t even be purchased with a single point anyway. Traits are heavily backloaded in this game, and if you’re playing a new character you need to zigzag all across the world to get the ones you really want. Making level-ups even flashier than they are now while leaving them as shallow would feel patronizing IMO. Or in the words of a certain Bard, “much ado about nothing”.

Seconded, I’d like this a lot.

Thanks you three, especially for the pictures and the color theory pointers! I like both the “harmonius” blue and purple on the elementalist and the bold combination of blue, red and black on the thief. And yes, cultural armor is a must with sylvari.

I spent way too much time trying various armor dye schemes with various skin/leaf/pattern colours in the makeover kit, but am still ridiculously undecided. Currently I’m more-or-less settled on using either sandalwood, which is kind of a pale sandy colour, or phoenix red which is quite intense. I wanted to use purple but there’s no shade that looks “right”. The sandalwood looks better with a wider variety of dyes, so I might go with that after all instead of one of the more vivid colours. Now the second question is: scarlet or deep turquoise leaves. Argh.

There’s no need to justify one’s weapon or playstyle choice. If someone feels the “need” to sneer and spit at you for playing with a greatsword instead of marching in lockstep with whatever the current minmax fad is, it really says more about them than about you.

I find the “living story” totally mind-boggling and just about the worst way to spend developer money. A game needs permanent, quality content that everyone can enjoy in their own time and on their own schedule. Zones. Solo, group and guild challenges. Dungeons that are actually fun and engaging instead of skip-stack-skip-stack exploit-and-cheesefests interspersed with one-shot gimmicks.

Its even worse from a story perspective. First and foremost, it has completely written the player characters out of their own game. It’s all about the “iconics”, their story, their relationships, their world. We don’t exist anymore. That’s such a slap in the face that I’d be ticked off even if I gave a kitten about them. And I say that as someone who mostly liked Trahearne and doesn’t mind sharing the spotlight. Second, if you miss a story chapter and thus miss what paltry few seconds of character development there are (for the “iconics”, of course, not for you) it gets increasingly harder to care about them. They’re random yokels the game — when it can occasionally be bothered to remember that my character is still there, too — wants to pretend are kind-of my friends though they know nothing about me and don’t care about me. I’m just the mute grunt who has to do the dirty work before their story can move forward.

I get it. It’s so much cheaper to write and voice a story that revolves entirely around a handful of NPCs instead of paying ten different voice actors for the same role so that the players can actually participate in a story that was supposed to be ours. But it’s fundamentally dishonest, too, to keep pretending we have any place in it. Why does all the money go this instead of content the player actually HAS a place in?

I love this quote from the Flameseeker Chronicles article:

All of the little things players are used to seeking out in MMOs — quests with unique rewards and pets, reputation vendors with unusual permanent souvenirs — are pretty thin in GW2, and it’s a shame that this wasn’t expanded on, especially since it’s left the karma, heart and event systems underutilized.

That’s my sentiment in a nutshell. I loved quest chains with unique rewards like minipets or other neat toys or unique-looking gear. Why does GW2 have so little of that? Finishing a karma heart is flat-out boring because the related NPCs very rarely have anything unique, and finishing a map or an event chain is even worse. Oooo, an item my character can’t use with a skin I’ve seen a hundred times and and a stat combo I have no interest in. Oooo, 40 potatoes. And even if it’s 40 orichalcum it’s still boring and meaningless. Why don’t we have some special rewards themed on the zone they’re from? Everything is gemstore this, gemstore that. Aside from the ascended armors, has there even been a single actual in-game armor in the almost two years the game as been out?

The gemstore is the way this game is kept alive, but the way it’s handled — while it certainly could be much worse — is really not done well. I have not spent and will not spend real money on something that irritates me like all the gemstore-only items do, especially the ones that need to be gambled for.

You say “NO” to your own false assumption, but seem to have no problem with PvE suffering for the benefit of PvP. Hardly fair. And it is false because there is a simple solution: balance PvE and PvP separately. It is already implemented in some small ways, but not nearly enough.

Imbune.5497:

But…as we’ve seen, they have a very….unique vision for how the game should be played-dungeons for example…in every other mmo stackskipstackskipstackskip would be seen as broken as hell and need fixing, here, that’s how it’s meant to be played.

I’m so glad I’m not the only one who’s massively bothered by this. Tanking dungeons in WoW was a joy for seven years, and there are some that I still really miss because of how much fun I had doing them. Here, content doesn’t exist to be played and enjoyed, it exists to be cheesed and avoided. Bloody sad state of affairs. I blame the greedy, lazy players as much as the devs, but it’s on the devs to fix it. If they don’t, well, I gotta agree with your rather cynical assessment.

Personally, I loathe the idea of letting an event fail on purpose. It runs directly counter to both gameplay logic and immersion. Any benefit gained from a successful capture should at least be equal to the original capture. Trait unlocks, reward chests, whatever — the Lysssa change is a welcome first step but not enough. Holding an area for a long time (I like the idea of increasingly difficult enemy waves) should be a point of pride for the players instead of something that you get attacked for even suggesting.

@Zalyn: Thanks. You have both more patience and more eloquence than I do.

Aerlen.5326:

I voted for more non-skimpy and by non skimpy, I mean no freaking boob cups, boob windows, or other crap that screams look at my T&A. I can’t tell you how much light armor I can’t see my toons using because it’s stupid skimpy.

This. There’s maybe a handful of non-cultural light armor sets that I can stand in terms of being aesthetically appealing as well as not quite as sexualized. As people have said before, it’s NOT only about the amount of skin, though that alone is irritating enough. I felt hugely uncomfortable with my sylvari elementalist for most of her history because the light outfits are soheavily gendered, and her being an animated plant made them look all the more stupid. My norn necromancer got the cultural T1 ASAP, which shows some chest but at least has fully covered legs instead of yet another bare-thighs-and-panty-shots-skirt. And don’t get me started on the starting outfits. I made my mesmer a charr in no small part to get away from all that nonsense — though playing charr has its own gear-related frustrations.

Jahroots.6791:

This is probably the main reason why some of us have an issue with views like yours: we do not want our games to become politicized.

They already are. They always were.

No matter where you go or where you look, the status quo is not neutral, not apolitical, not free of agenda, especially when issues like equality, diversity and prejudice are concerned. These don’t just go away because we don’t like to deal with them. The stories we tell are heavily influenced by culture and influence culture in turn. They’re part of what makes is human. And only some of us have the privilege to be able say “Shut up and go away with your BS, I don’t wanna hear about it”. The rest of us have to live with the BS no matter what.

You are “politicizing” “your” games every bit as much as we are. The game designers, the publishers, the marketing teams all “politicize” their games before any of us even get our hands on it.

I’m dusting off my elementalist at the moment after leaving her on the backburner for quite a while. Since I never really liked her looks, I also think she also finally deserves a makeover to change that. The problem? So many choices! And I’m not very good at colour coordination.

I’m thinking about using some flamboyant colours on her, as a nod to the elements and as a contrast to my guardian, who looks more “plain” (oak skin, mint pattern, white hair, lemon glow). As much as I love the subtle greens and browns, I don’t really want my characters to look too similar.

My worry with the deep/dark purples, blues and reds is that using them as her skin colour might lock me down too much into a single armor dye scheme. I’ve seen some absolutely phenomenal sylvari, both in-game and in screenshot threads, who rock the fancy skins and matching dyes in ways that leave me in awe of their players’ eye for colour. So I’m asking folks whose sylvari look like that: how much do you feel locked into that one matching armor dye job? Can you vary your dyes without feeling your character’s own colours look “off” now? If you want to show off pictures of your characters in various armor colours, please do, I never get tired of looking at sylvari! Bonus points if they use the branch “hair”, which is my elementalist’s one original feature that I’m hesitant to change.

phys.7689:

By trying to fight sexualization, you further cement it.

So opposing a problem is always the same as supporting it, or does it only apply when the problem is aimed at women?

You have decided that frills, and highlighting boobs is sexualization. Its really not.

In our current culture, yes it is.

Also male light armor also blatantly screams I AM A MAN.

No. You could put just about any male armor in this game on a woman with no adjustments at all and it would look perfectly fine and normal and awesome. These outfits are essentially unisex, nothing in them is male-coded while petticoats, heels, garters, lace, etc. are heavily female-coded. Not to mention the panty shots, the boob windows, side boob, underboob …

Why is a man being half naked a muscle powered fantasy and a woman being half naked sexualization?

If you’re quoting me, please quote me properly. I’m was talking about the difference in design and presentation between a muscular guy who maybe only has his shirt off on one hand and a scrawny girl with inflated breasts and a bikini on the other. That difference exists and it is huge. Which character signifies strength, competence, power, potency? The guy. Which character is designed to be impressive and kickarse, respected and maybe even feared? The guy. He can also be sexually appealing if muscles are your thing and if he shows enough skin, but that’s not all there is to him.

Also you have to ask your self, is sexualization even wrong?

Yes when it is unequal.
Yes when it targets minors.
Yes when all other traits or features pale in comparison, are flat-out ignored, or actively dismissed.
Yes when it is forced.
Yes when there is so little choice or such heavy social pressure that it might as well be forced.
Doubly and triply yes when the only group of people whom it is essentially forced on are shamed for it at the same time by the people for whose “benefit” they are sexualized.

RedStar.4218:

I’m going to (sort of) agree to disagree. I feel that a lot of options you’re giving are a tad too feminine.

I really do think this is due to the fact that “sexy” is so heavily female-coded for no good reason. People are simply not used to seeing this sort of thing on men.

Except, butt jiggle…If my guardian’s butt jiggles as much as my necromancer breasts when wearing certain tops, I won’t be able to watch him run seriously.

That’s how some of us feel about those boobs, too. :p

Zalyn.9534:

I find this language a bit offensive – there are so many universals thrown out in this discussion about what is sexy and what isn’t, but when someone presents a different perspective (that is not isolated), you accuse it of all being “in their head.” I’m sure you didn’t intend it, but that type of language has been used a great deal in the past to demean what people, often women, said because they were perceived as stupid, overly emotional, or just not in touch with reality.

Very much this. This sort of language may not have been intended to dismiss or silence in this case, but there are too many instances in which it is (AKA gaslighting).

Also, I too would like to see more armor — non-gendered — that allow sylvari or charr characters to show off their awesome colours and patterns. They have the best customization options in the game, but on male sylvari or charr of either gender, you can’t really see much of it.

Kat and kimeekat: Thanks for the images. Yes, that is what the male equivalent of sexualized female outfits could/should like.

Jahroots.6791:

‘Sexy’ simply does not work the same way for both genders. Yes – as a society we are far more comfortable with feminine expressions of sexuality – but you cannot force males to be equally sexualised. Our bodies are different and perceived differently.

The key word here is “perceived”. There is a huge cultural element of men-are-THIS, woman-are-THAT forced on us, and the “THIS” is usually considered superior, so anything that treats men more like women is basically blasphemy. If men are sexualized, that’s “gay” or “emasculating”, because being made to be sexy is for women, so men simply are not, cannot be, must not be sexy.

If we “allowed” men to be sexualized, if we “forced” men to be sexualized like woman are all the time, you bet people would come up with a great number of ways to make it so. Some of these ways would be impractical, uncomfortable or flat-out health hazards … as it is for women. Some men might be horrified, others might find it empowering or liberating … just as women react differently, too.

Would you also propose that female characters’ nipples should be displayed?Y’know…for equality, of course.

It’d actually be awesome if the female chest was treated more like the male: no big deal, unless context and intent deliberately make it so. So if there is actual equality overall in terms of which outfit is designed to be sexualized and which is not, then yes. It’s not like some of the existing “armors” leave much to the imagination as it is. This puerile “Tee-hee, look look look BOOOOOOOOBS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! But it’s fine cuz no nipples so you can’t say it’s porn!” attitude that is so widespread in female character design in various forms of entertainment annoys me to no end — showing the whole thing could actually end up feeling less objectifying, as well as more honest.

Look at that impressive image from GW1 that phys linked (thanks, by the way). I agree that it’s not sexy even though the guy shows a whole lot of skin. There’s no emphasis or attention on his “assets”, instead he’s a stunning whole-body work of human art. If a female character was presented in exactly the same way, bare chest and all, it’d be far less sexualized than many female outfits in GW2 that put a nudge-nudge-wink-wink fig leaf over the breasts.

I can appreciate why you want to instigate change in society’s perception and attitude towards this issue. However for the time being, accept that it will take time for this to occur (if it ever does).

If nobody speaks up, or if they do but are silenced, it won’t change, either.

phys.7689:

They have a great number (more than they have skimpy) of armors that are fully clothed.

My problem isn’t just the ones that are show a lot of skin. Just barely hiding something or mostly covering it but drawing attention to it via frills or fishnets or boob windows or whatever also plays a part in objectification/sexualization. Plus, there’s the frequently huge difference in theme and design, especially with light armor. Men get the default, the original theme. Women get something that screams “LOOK A FEMALE!” which may end up looking very different or even nothing like the cool original male design.

What’s “offensive” to me, incidentally, is not that sexualized outfits exist or that people use them or how popular they are. It’s the difference in treatment of the genders and the excuses made for it. I’d like people to try to understand how the neverending barrage of female sexualization and the glaring lack of diversity and choice can affect women and society’s opinion and treatment of women — and I’d especially like to make that request from those guys who feel uncomfortable or flat-out revolted by rare cases of actual make sexualization (not muscled power fantasies).

There is no united point to miss here, really. What you’re saying is quite different from people who do not think content should be permanently available, or who dislike seeing others having the same things as they do because that makes the shinies less shiny in their eyes. I can understand and support what you’re saying, though I mostly function in an “I like this because it looks good to me and/or I enjoyed the process of getting it” kind of way.

Still, what does annoy me is people who make a big show of getting an item or title that used to be “high status” and flaunt it for attention as if it was still hard to get, as opposed to picking it up because they just happen to like it. People who flaunt things for attention that ARE hard to get annoy me too, just a little less, but at least they cared enough — for whatever reason — to actually put in the work.

Actually, you don’t get to tell me how to feel and you can stop being so condescending, thank you.

The fact that FINALLY we get an outfit that looks good on male charr and actually has a neat charr-specific feature is one step forward, yes, but to make the kitten thing gendered and look like crap on female charr is two steps back. We do not “have to be happy” about that.

I voted #5, but what I really want to vote for is “No gendered armor at all, each outfit should be the same for both genders”.

Demented Sheep.1642:

Funny of “attractive in different ways” tends to mean guys don’t get sexualized overtly and instead get ‘strong’.
Guess what? a lot of girls would like that “forced equality”. If we have deal with your kitten you should deal with ours.

Bullseye! Thank you.

No, (straight) dudes, a heavily muscled guy who maybe has his shirt off is NOT sexualized in the same manner as a scrawny slip of a girl with inflated boobs, heels and frilly underwear.

Larynx.2453:

Uh yeah. There’s a reason ArenaNet doesn’t have armor like that in this game. That looks kittening ridiculous.

So a half-naked man (un)dressed to look “sexy” is ridiculous, while half-naked women (un)dressed to look “sexy” are par on course. That is exactly the problem. We’re pretty much brainwashed from birth to not only accept but demand ridiculous, objectifying and even degrading images from women.

If you don’t like seeing a dude made up like that, it should be a wake-up call of how the hetero male gaze that we’re supposed to think of as the natural default treats women. What’s good for the goose should be good for the gander. If it isn’t, something’s messed up.

By all means, people should be able to have and enjoy their skimpy “armor” — for both genders. An outfit that looks like flamboyantly decorated lingerie on the girls should be a flamboyantly decorated banana hammock on the boys.

Astralporing.1957:

In the end people never really ask for a challenge they cannot pass (though are often perfectly okay with the challenge being hard enough that anyone else will be excluded). Which means that the contend needs to be easy enough to let them pass. It just need to present it as an accomplishment. Something that separates you from the “unworthy”. An illusory challenge.

That right there — especially the bit in the parantheses — is my general impression of people who are very vocal about how content needs to be more difficult, yes. And once they feel “too many” people “encroach” on their success-territory, it becomes a chorus of this isn’t hard at all, a lobotomized monkey could do it, faceroll LOL, just AFK and press 111111111. Anything to keep other people from feeling accomplished and happy, too.

And at the end of the day, that is usually my problem with people calling for exclusive things or for “respect” for “prestige”. Not in every case, of course, but at least a hint of it will always be there.