Guild Wars 2

Lol, nice shot man! My record right now is 968k without any buffs outside of Assassin’s Signet, I’ll break a million one day. :P

Not too shabby, I do kind of resent you though because now I know there’s a Ke$ha song I actually like. xD

Lumines.3916:

@Cyric, I’m glad you’re less of a troll than I initially perceived you as. I think what the bigger community needs to understand about thieves in general is that yes, thieves hurt like kitten but kitten they’re also squishy (relatively and depends on spec). We also happen to melt under condition pressure extremely easy, just take a look at all the removals a thief can have, it’s very limited.

Stealth IS a defensive mechanism, but it does not stop incoming damage at all if others are smart about locating the position of the thief. Stealth is a diversion, it’s a visual confusion, the culling issues make it more deadly than it really is.

I’d be more than happy to have a toned down version of the thief burst if there were more answers to just “shortbow and wait for cds” in between our moments of glory. Right now, thieves have to play an extreme of hit-n-run style and make it count because chilling in the clusterkitten is asking to get killed. Once we have the tools to sustain better in a longer fight, doesn’t matter how hard our moves hurt, good thieves will kill you.

This I can completely agree with, well said.

I’m done with this thread, I’m getting infracted for stupid stuff like telling someone they’re “silly”. Nevermind that the rest of the post was informative, the fact that I ended by calling someone “silly” gets it deleted. At least infract me and edit the offending line out, kitten I feel like I’m in pre-school.

Lumines.3916:

If you were really trying to have a meaningful discussion, you wouldn’t have spent texts on texts of telling the OP to L2P.

I actually gave him some feedback to go on seeing as I know how the scenario plays out on both sides of the equation. Every thief will bring out warriors as a case and point as to why they should be allowed such high burst. It is my opinion that Hundred Blades stationary or not, does far too much damage too. Thieves generally will also be biased as Warriors generally is (not saying always, but is a trend) a tougher match up for most thieves. High base HP and Toughness hurts when they can equally dish out the pain in melee.

That being said, there’s a good reason why you still see more thieves in tPvP than warriors as of now (even though most thieves will think warriors as OP). Superior roaming and dueling capabilities with the highest burst in the game (you can’t argue this at all).

There is a point to buff all other classes, but that also creates a power creep(look at GW1). A nerf is a slight buff for everyone at the expensive of one that will receive this negatively without having to resort to a power creep. Do I want to see more threatening builds from all classes? Yes, but that can only happen once the meta is less centralized on Mesmer, Guards and Thieves and after all the bugs have been washed off. If everyone got buffs and were on the same level as these three classes, PvP will be even more zergy than it is now.

It wasn’t my intention to tell the OP to L2P, so I honestly apologize if that is the tone of my response. You make a lot of good and valid points that I really can’t argue with and, quite frankly, I have to agree with. Truth be told, I wouldn’t have an issue with our damage being nerfed to a more “manageable” level if our health pool was simultaneously buffed. At level 80 with zero vitality gear, our base health pool is 10k and some change. Our damage potential is the only thing that makes having such a pathetic health pool okay, in my opinion. Fact of the matter is, thieves probably will see a nerf regardless of the thief community’s protests. For me personally though, it’s simply the lack of a respectable health pool that justifies the damage.

Ixal.7924:

Want balanced PvP? Either give other classes equally threatening combos or town down the thief.

Other classes should have equally threatening combos, I think that would really spice the PvP scene up quite a bit actually!

Vaerah.4907:

Only hammer warriors and elementalists play like NPCs. People have up to 4 seconds to “dodge” certain attacks, it can be done by simply walking away…

If the majority of attacks could be dodged by simply walking away, I would be nigh unstoppable. Exaggeration is not a suitable retort, sorry.

Vaerah.4907:

That’s why we got 1 million endurance points and we can dodge the endless string of 5k-6k attacks (some spammable) coming from thieves.

This makes me laugh because it’s almost as if you believe that only thieves can achieve those kinds of results with damage. There have been plenty of times my HP has practically vanished before my very eyes and stealth doesn’t even save us, we still get hit by channeled abilities and AoE!

Thieves are built around the initiative mechanic, our abilities are supposed to be spammable. What everyone seems to forget is that our initiative puts ALL our abilities on the same cooldown resource. This means we can’t swap to a different weapon set and have a whole new bar of abilities to use, this also means that if we’re spamming abilities we’re going to run out of initiative pretty fast. You know what a thief without initiative is? Dead.

Vaerah.4907:

You know why they aren’t easy to dodge? Because you can’t dodge what you don’t see and thieves appear on screen well after they landed their “next attack”.

This kind of stupidity also affected Warhammer Online, a “thief” of that game could open with a stun that lasted 2 seconds, and in those 2 seconds he could kill a squishie who would not completely go super-t*rd defense spec + full tank gear.
They’d also appear on screen almost at the time when the other guy died.
They were as fun as GW2 thieves to fight, and like them, if they would be countered they could just stealth away in peace.

Funny story, that’s not a thief problem. The whole “perma stealth thief” nonsense is actually a result of the player culling issue, which I’ve also had to deal with as a thief.

Vaerah.4907:

Poor kitty, they won’t attack if they don’t have the 100% safe retreat abilities full up.
How sad, when all the other classes beginning with warrior and necro can escape whenever things don’t go according to plan, eh? Oh wait, welcome to being like the other classes.

“But but but we are squisheeeeeeee”. Really? Tell me about squishie, I also play Elementalist, same health as yours and even full bunker spec, exotic cleric gear etc. I still get spam critted for 6.5k by yours truly.

You are waaaayyy too angry to be on the forums right now, lmao. My response to you got lost in a forum bug, so I’m gonna make this short and sweet. No player makes it a point to blow their utility skills before rushing into combat just for the ego boost, no players, I promise you. Secondly, I full out charge people in WvW all the time. The reaction is always either backpedaling or they begin to charge as well. More often than not, the player that charges me and initiates the combat before I do is the one with the highest odds of sending me running with my tail between my legs, figuratively speaking.

Ixal.7924:

Cyric.7485:

Ixal.7924:

Cyric.7485:

In my opinion, you were outplayed and haven’t realized how to counter this particular attack yet.

Before Mondays patch there was no counter to this as Basilisk Venom couldn’t be broken. Now you have a split second to hit your stun break before the thief lands backstab, otherwise you are dead.
Sounds balanced.

Well considering how commonplace backstab thieves are, it shouldn’t be too much trouble to move your finger to your condition cleanse hotkey when you see a thief approaching, huh?

So where are the other classes “instant kill enemy unless he uses one specific ability within 0.2 seconds” combos?
And of course every class has as many stun breaks as there are thieves in PvP.

I can’t answer that as I don’t have any alts currently. By the tone of your replies though, I’m getting the impression you’re one of those players that thinks every class should be able to do the same thing as any other class, effectively removing the entire basis of a class system. Each class fulfills a particular role in GW2, it just so happens that thieves are built around the role of dealing damage.

As for the whole “avoid in 0.2 seconds” remark, I’m curious if you think all players should have a charge-up animation similar to NPC mobs so that you have time to contemplate where you want to dodge, because as it stands now you pretty much have 0.2 seconds to dodge any attack most of the time as well. Every player attack in the game can be dodged to my knowledge… this means you can dodge Steal, you can dodge Cloak & Dagger, you can dodge Backstab, you can dodge Heartseeker, etc etc. When Basilisk Venom is activated, it’s applied to the next offensive action performed by the thief and only lasts for 30 seconds or one action, so if you dodge it…. guess what? It’s gone now. :-\

I won’t deny that thieves aren’t easy to dodge, what with all our shadowstepping antics, but I firmly believe that becoming familiar enough with something will allow you to anticipate it properly.

Vaerah.4907:

Cyric

Well considering how commonplace backstab thieves are, it shouldn’t be too much trouble to move your finger to your condition cleanse hotkey when you see a thief approaching, huh?

Good thieves clearly run around like headless chickens, well in the open, holding a sign saying: “HEY GUYS GET READY FOR ME!”.

Yeah, because we’re all so bloated of ego that we blow all our utility skills just to GET to you and backstab you, never once thinking we might need to escape if things don’t go according to plan.

Good argument.

Ixal.7924:

Cyric.7485:

In my opinion, you were outplayed and haven’t realized how to counter this particular attack yet.

Before Mondays patch there was no counter to this as Basilisk Venom couldn’t be broken. Now you have a split second to hit your stun break before the thief lands backstab, otherwise you are dead.
Sounds balanced.

Well considering how commonplace backstab thieves are, it shouldn’t be too much trouble to move your finger to your condition cleanse hotkey when you see a thief approaching, huh?

Harmadda.5971:

Well it was useful in neutralizing an opponent and capturing a node so that much is for sure. I know how it was done now since the video was given to me in this thread though.

I just think it’s pretty lame, and I can’t see myself doing it in PVP.
I actually like the challenge of the fight and outplaying an opponent.

Not this “I DIDZ EAZY ATTACKZ MOVEZ” to down someone in 2 seconds and get a kill.

It’s not even worth bragging about.
There’s no skill involved really.

It’s just not me and I think it shouldn’t even be in PVP at all.

- H

It’s really weird that as a thief, I’ve never been backstab one-shotted by a thief before. I can imagine the feeling of utter despair though when my dagger severs a spine and leaves my enemy crumpled at my feet, life is unfair sometimes.

Anyway.

In real life if I got into a fight to the death with someone, you better believe I’m going all out, I really couldn’t care less how my opponent conducts themselves in combat. I need to win, that’s the entire point, survival. “But Cyric, this isn’t real life, it’s a video game! Real life comparisons are invalid here!” Of course, let’s move on.

In my opinion, you were outplayed and haven’t realized how to counter this particular attack yet. I’ve come across players that have totally negated my opener and started giving me the D pretty hard, forcing me to retreat, and come back in at the next opportune chance. Maybe it was just my overzealous desire to eat the enemy’s face off in a mere 2.4 seconds flat that cost me my opener or maybe my opponent saw me coming and made a quick tactical preparation for what he/she thought was most likely to occur.

Lastly, I don’t know when this whole “kills I deem unskillful don’t count” nonsense came about but it’s silly. In real life, it doesn’t matter to me how I put you down so long as you’re face down in the dirt. In game, it doesn’t matter to me how I put you down so long as it’s legit and you’re face up with a giant banner in your chest.

In the end, while I somewhat sympathize with your dismay at being insta-gibbed, I can’t help but feel like you’re partially responsible for your own defeat either through lack of preparation or poor build choices.

Sup fellow Coaster.

My build

I run a “beefy” backstab build, meaning I’m kitted with Valkyrie gear (power/vitality/critical damage). In WvW I generally run with Hide in Shadows, Blinding Powder, Assassin’s Signet, Signet of Shadows, and lately I’ve been using the “oh so terrible” Basilisk Venom to great effect.

My attack damage/power is sitting at 3.3k and my critical damage modifier is 100 (250%). My average backstab w/AS is about 8-9k on heavies, 10k on medium, and 11-13k on squishies . What I like about my setup is that if my opener doesn’t flat out down the player immediately, I have some staying power which allows me to keep the pressure up in a prolonged fight, lately I’ve been able to last in some 1v2s (and win) and 1v3s (usually only get like 1 stomp before I have to retreat). However, 90% of my 1v1 engagements don’t last more than 3-5 seconds. I’d also like to note that my build isn’t a one trick pony, there is plenty of damage to throw around even after the opener, provided my enemy is still on his/her feet.

I know all this information about my build probably isn’t what you’re looking for, but I found comparing my build to other thieves earlier in my thieving career really helped me put together and tweak the build that best supports my style of play, so maybe it’ll do the same for you.

I backstabbed a warrior for 14k in WvW once, on average though my backstabs don’t usually surpass 10k. I build power/vitality/critical damage, IIRC my attack power is roughly 3.3k and my critical damage is 100 (250%).

That being said, I can’t imagine myself doing too much more damage than this even if I went full glass cannon. Not without an absurd amount of setup anyway, currently my only “setup” is to use Assassin’s Signet before I bury a dagger in someone’s spine.

Also, I suspect the warrior I backstabbed was whatever the warrior version of glass cannon is.

Quite often, when attempting to dodge on my human thief, my character will get snagged on the terrain and perform a stationary dodge. It’s really annoying and completely defeats the purpose when you dodge and move nowhere, then still get hit by the attack you attempted to (and would have successfully) dodge. Furthermore, it happens often on obviously “risky” terrain areas and occasionally on not so “risky” terrain areas i.e. flat ground.

I like to use Carrion Legionnaire daggers, they’re normally pretty pricey but occasionally you can find the daggers on the TP for under a gold piece. Another cool dagger skin is the Shiverpeak Dirk which is far less expensive or you can buy the Skinning Knife with karma for the same skin.

Those are my personal favorites anyway. As for a helmet, I use my starter hood.

Encountered this problem today on my alt, I can’t represent my only guild… thankfully my main is representing the guild, so there’s that.

Still mildly frustrating.

Incurafy.6329:

Why is it that this is the only post I can see in this whole thread? I can’t even see the OP.

Oh wow, was just checking in to see the replies and you’re right… the OP is missing.

LOL?

ClickJ.6287:

nearly unlimit stealth, unstoppable, burst damage.

LOL, yeah… something like that.

I’m deeply intrigued by this build. I recently changed from D/D backstab to a D/P backstab because I felt that never using DB was a waste. I also dropped my Deadly Arts line to pick up Acrobatics, to put it lightly, I’ve had better results.

I think I’m gonna adopt your core build, make some personal tweaks to it, and see how it pans out for me. I’m also going back to D/D, lol, this D/P business just isn’t for me.

Thanks for sharing!

Something about that video is just eerie.

ddak.3150:

Pretty sure? With all respect, there is no option for target locking.Your post didn’t do anything helpful .

Well aren’t you delightful… Actually my post would’ve directed you to the in-game Options menu. The very first tab has a checkbox labeled Promote Skill Target which, when you mouse over it, provides a tool tip that reads “Automatically promote targets to lock targets when hitting them”.

Hope that was helpful enough for you.

Pretty sure there is an option to enable a form of target locking…

Medallions also work.

I don’t think being a valuable member of a team equates to needing a nerf, arguably rogue archetypes are inherently biased to be exceptional at PvP. As I said up above, everyone is going to excel at something in the game world’s combat and it just so happens that thieves excel at player vs player combat due to it’s very nature.

In the end, I disagree with your proposal because I think stealth stomps/revives are nothing more than a clever use of the stealth mechanic. As also stated in a couple arguments here, other classes have special abilities (stability, blind) that mesh well with the stomp/revive mechanics and if the thief were to see a nerf in this regard, then I feel it would only be fair that all classes would receive a similar nerf.

ryston.7640:

@meta: so i want to get this straight, you think the thief is more, about the same, or less mobile than other classes?

@cyric: if i understand, you prefer balancing decisions not center around what high skill players are able to do, but be based upon each persons individual opinion and abilities? Also, i have played some thief, i just wouldnt say ive played a lot of it.

If I understand you correctly, yes. I don’t think just because 1 out of every 100 thieves can chew someone’s face off in 2 seconds flat that the class needs a nerf. I also think, as seems to be tradition in any MMO with a rogue archetype, that people are quick to call for nerfs on thieves instead of taking the extra step to learn how to effectively combat them. What people fail to understand is that each class is designed with certain values in mind and they’re obviously going to excel at these values. It’s rather tiring to have to constantly read how OP every class is in some regard and to see how these QQers just want every class to be similar. What’s the point of even having classes if we’re all just gonna be doing the same thing?

The way I see it, each class brings it’s own unique element to the field and that’s what makes all forms of combat (PvE, PvP, or WvW) enjoyable. If a class is running around all willy-nilly just AoE one shotting people or has a very low skill cap on an incredibly potent move, then yeah sure, it’s OP and needs a nerf. Otherwise, I don’t see a problem with classes excelling in a specific arena.

I approve of this thread.

ryston.7640:

@all: Look I’m not intending to attack your sacred class, I’m aiming to discuss balancing of an individual class, primarily for tPvP. My comments come inspired more from watching matches (largely from BWE3) featuring team paradigm, legacy, synergy, GS, GuSu, etc — and post launch from listening to and watching Last Pride, War Machine, Idiot Savants.

So wait, I just want to make sure I’m clear on this. Your proposed nerf and dubious knowledge that you’re tossing around isn’t even from your own experience with/against the thief? You listened to some people talk about the class and watched some videos and now you’re an expert on thief mechanics? Seriously?

Wow… /thread please.

The amount of ill informed players who think thieves just run around with 6 arms all holding soul eating katanas that we forged in the sun and can just spam abilities with no consequence is absolutely absurd. Such ignorance is not to be unexpected, but it’s still appalling to see.

Just completed Griffonrook Run and the bomb didn’t make the chest accessible… While I’m sure I’m just missing out on some whites and a blue, it’s still irritating.

GG.

Estes.3107:

well from a mesmer standpoint aoes tend to weed out my clones since for the most part they tend to bunch up if the mesmer activated the clones close together but an easy way to see a mesmer besides the icon on the target health bar on top which will have a butterfly mask on the real mesmer because sometimes its hard to shuffle through the clones and the real mesmer when the fight gets alil chaotic is to look for the only mesmer thats running around and doing more then the default 1 auto attack since clones dont really do damage you can let them be unless theyre charging you in which case youll want to dodge or kill them so the shatter effect misses some people will target the phantasms because they can do damage or other effects depending on the phantasm my recommendation for thieves is to use your short bow poison the area and bombard the area with cluster bombs if your chasing the real mesmer and close to them cluster bombs can do some real damage to the mesmer i recommend using cluster bombs when your close to the mesmer because the arc of the cluster bomb can be time consuming..also your number 1 attack on the shortbow bounces between i think 3 maybe 4 enemys so you can take out some clones if they are close together too.

Edit: when mesmers are in a downed state since they can create a clone and teleport to another location the only way i can think of killing them on the ground is to nver stomp because you might be stomping a clone which is time consuming and the real mesmer may beable to heal themselves in time also always twist your camera angle around so you can see if there is another downed mesmer if there is hes your guy/girl to kill if you cant see another mesmer lying around and you killed a clone most likely he teleported behind somthing so you can either try looking for him/her run off and look for somthing else to do or wait around to see if the mesmer is willing to go round 2

Punctuation ftw…

ColdEden.8693:

I may not be able to ever get back to Isle of Janthir, unless I catch a server population boost shortly after it happens. I may have to leave my guild of 4 years because I will not see them anymore, and guesting doesn’t even have an ETA.

That seems a touch dramatic, don’t you think?

Let me make sure I’m on track here… what I gather from the OP’s posts is that the root of their discontent regarding Obsidian Sanctum is that it’s making it impossible for them to finish out World Completion due to “griefers” and whatnot. The obvious answer here is that if you despise PvP, then don’t go there, plenty of other puzzles scattered around Tyria.

I might be mistaken but, when did jumping puzzles count towards World Completion? Is there a POI or a vista in that particular puzzle that I’m not recalling? If not, the puzzle is only worth whatever you get in the chest, your personal enjoyment, and the initial achievement points.

That being said, and assuming I’m correct in my post, this thread has zero reasons to exist.

Thomasqk.8209:

I’ve played since the update (couple of hours ago), and haven’t seen heartseeker miss once.
So i think it’s safe to say that the bug has been fixed.

OH HAPPY DAYS ARE HERE! REJOICE WITH ME, MY BRETHREN! OH HAPPY DAY!

According to the players who come into the Thief forums with tear stained cheeks, all the classes suck and/or are underpowered compared to the thief. Sooooo… yeaahhh…

As for an actual response, I main an 80 thief, I find him quite fun, deadly, and versatile. I recently started an engineer alt and really felt it was underwhelming for a bit. Then I got a grasp, or better understanding, of the class’ abilities and I’m much more pleased with my ability to kite things and make the world explode around me.

ostracize.8316:

Bloodtau.4672:

The love for the Engineer is no longer there. I tried to love the class, I really did but the problems with the class outshine the plusses. Fingers crossed we get some much needed time investment soon and I am able to come back to it. Wanted to play an Engineer ever since they were announced, oh the disappointment of playing one =(

So it’s now Mesmer for PVP and warrior for PVE and wow, i’m actually able to do things again =)

I can translate this.

I am retooling because Engineer is too difficult to master, and I came to Guild Wars 2 to Faceroll my way through everything. Maybe I played Warhammer Online and thought Engineers here would be like in Warhammer: stupidly high aoe damage, but they’re not like that here. I’m going to blame it on problems I’m too important to list in my Errol thread, and suggest these problems I refuse to mention get addressed.

I will quit as soon as warriors and mesmers are nerfed, or reroll whatever people are complaining about most on the forums at that time.

Sorry for being a bad member of the community, I’m attending classes at the local access centre to fix my problems. They are optimistic, but he road is long and painful.

Also, my cat died yesterday.

LMFAO! Pure gold. xD

Apology accepted. 10/10

Loving the fools who are basically saying “Hurr durr, learn to Heartseek!”… brilliant minds in this thread.

The problem currently, for those of you blissfully unaware, is that the skill misses a stationary (that means unmoving) target that is directly in front of you (implying melee range). This is not the fault of the thief, it’s Heartseeker being broken ever since it’s recent rebalance.

Bloodtau.4672:

Actually learn to heartseeker properly then instead of spamming it.
GOOD that it’s missing, might make you think a bit more.

Get off your high horse, not every thief is a Heartseeker spamming noob.

Wow, we’re really just grabbing at anything in an attempt to nerf the thief, huh? Being able to stealth and then revive/stomp doesn’t need a nerf, gimme a break. It’s in no way some massive broken gameplay mechanic that requires a fix. You say thieves are the best roaming and killing class in the game, well… duh? We’re the new incarnation of the former assassin class, which by definition is supposed to excel at murder and subterfuge. There’s nothing wrong with a class being the “best” in a certain facet of gameplay, somebody has to be the best. Maybe after I post this I’ll go QQ on the elementalist forums about how it’s unfair they’re the “best” at AoE and they should be locked into a single attunement during combat because life isn’t fair and I can’t be bothered to learn tactics.

Gimme a break already, every day it’s a new “QQ OP” thread… L2P.

@bwillb
I agree wholeheartedly, our purpose is to snuff out life. We’re the predators on the battlefield, if you’re not an ally, then you’re prey.

Channeled abilities will continue to hit a stealthed thief if activated prior to the thief stealthing and he remains in range.

I prefer to use Superior Rune of the Pack on my armor. Since I stack power it’s good, plus I get swiftness on dodge so the extended duration is nice, and the end precision boost helps my out of stealth burst.

Knyx.5926:

Im gonna have to disagree. The 60 sec cooldown for 4 seconds of quickness is not worth it on a backstab build. A stealth utility or a shadowstep utility is 10x more useful in its spot for a backstab build. Heck id take caltrops in a backstab build over haste

For a backstab build, I agree it’s not the most optimal choice since backstab is your main source of damage. All I’m saying is it isn’t the worst choice of skills for that particular type of build. Before I put together my stealth build, I was running a straight up eat your face and fashion your teeth into a necklace build focusing on power and critical strikes… I’ve ended many fights (100% health to 0% health) before that 4 seconds of quickness has expired, don’t underestimate the power of quickness on any thief.

Knyx.5926:

why is a backstab build using quickness…..

Deathpope.6253:

for the heart-seeker spam that comes after the backstab…..

Quickness is good for any build IMO, being able to significantly boost your dps is rarely a bad thing. Also, unless you’re under 50% health, you have nothing to fear from Heartseeker spam anymore. Of course, if you just got backstabbed by a one trick pony… well yeah, sucks to be you. xD

Shomaruki.7395:

^Issue with that is you know when they go stealth, you not just going to turn around and “HA” Cause then all they would just have to do is wait for you to turn around. There is zero counter to it. If I’m hitting you, (Like most MMOS) Usually they shouldn’t be able to return to stealth.

Okay, here’s some tips from an 80 thief, about thieves, to you regarding stealth:

*All stealth lasts for 2-3 seconds by default and 3-4 seconds if traited into, not including Shadow Refuge.
*A thief cannot return to stealth for roughly 2-3 seconds immediately upon exiting stealth, this is the thief’s stealth cooldown.
*A thief can chain stealth, this means he can activate another stealth ability before his initial stealth wears off to refresh his current stealth duration. This doesn’t mean he can stack stealth durations, it essentially means the thief can re-stealth without triggering his stealth cooldown.
*Shadow Refuge is the only thief ability that allows a thief to be stealthed for longer than 3-4 seconds with a single ability. To do this, the thief must stand in the Shadow Refuge for it’s duration. If the thief leaves the Shadow Refuge before it’s duration is complete, he is immediately revealed, unless he chain stealths out of it.
*Stealing will only confer 2-3 seconds of stealth if traited into, otherwise no stealth is conferred to the thief.
*Generally, if a thief is approaching you and vanishes from sight, odds are he is maneuvering to backstab you or just used Steal and is already behind you. A good idea, for either likelihood, is to dodge and keep distance between yourself and where you presume the thief to be.
*If you activate a channeled ability, ranger Rapid Fire for example, and a thief goes into stealth during the ability, he’s still being targeted and hit by your ability if he’s within range. I personally find this ridiculous and gawd awful annoying, but that’s how it works currently.

There you have it, now there’s no excuse.

Lorithias.2873:

Sure u can justify it’s ok if u deal that much damage cause the other op burst class do nearly same, nice try.

I swear, every rogue/assassin/thief class featured in any MMO has a wonderful following of tear stained cheeks relentlessly QQing in our wake.

We’re thieves, borderline ninjas, murderous assassins, etc etc. Everyone wants to cry and moan about how OP we are because we can “assassinate” other players. Tell me what exactly would the thief bring to the table without damage? We don’t have a whole lot of support abilities, especially if we’re not traited properly. If you take a look at our weapon skills, utility skills, and traits, you’ll notice as a thief our entire existence revolves around chewing on faces.

Instead of whining about how OP thieves are and how life is so hard and unfair, maybe it’d help to try and step up your game. I could go on and on about how ridiculously “OP” I think mesmers are, which I don’t anyway, but instead I acknowledge a difficult match up and try to devise tactics to overcome the challenge.

Humorless.1573:

Either way if you somehow manage to get stabbed IN THE BACK you deserve taking double damage.

^ A thousand times this. If I can get within 30 feet of you without you noticing me and shove a dagger into your spine, that’s your own fault.

I recently fitted all my armor slots with Superior Runes of the Pack and while doing a slot by slot test to see if the bonuses were cumulative or not, I noticed that bonus (3) +50 Power doesn’t activate properly. Bonus (3) lights up to signal it is active, when in fact the bonus is not applied to your character’s Power total. As far as I can tell, the rest of the bonuses for this rune function properly.

Get this every single time I fight Claw of Jormag, sometimes it causes a CTD and sometimes it doesn’t.

Claw of Jormag event starting?! Let’s roll the dice…

Martym.6971:

Thanks for contributing. Very nice post.

But at the same time, I don’t feel that mechanic is right, and you can’t say “when you are noticed”, because people are learning the games mechanics still, and as I said in my original post, I feel when people learn sound animations and class mechanics that they are battling against, it will severly weaken thief more.

Extremely smart dodge double taps already murder our offense in melee specs.

I don’t entirely agree with you here as I feel someone who is incredibly adept at dodging can really just toss a monkey wrench into anyone’s PvP gameplay. Then again, I don’t entirely disagree with you either as I think you’re correct regarding people still learning the PvP class mechanics. That being said, we thieves are still learning too. We’ll all grow wiser and more crafty as a community, new tactics will be discovered and developed, reflexes will be honed, newer and more efficient builds will surface… and through it all, I’m confident the thief will adapt and overcome.

Martym.6971:

Thief is extremely squishy. I am level 50 and run a pistol whip build for pve, the damage is great, but it’s just so easy to die with 2 adds on you.

Try injecting your build with some vitality.

Martym.6971:

I feel like I can do nothing but die and rely on my signet heal procs to try and outheal incoming damage. It feels extremely wrong as a mechanic.

Signet of Malice sucks without healing power… why the hell would you build healing power anyway? Time to rethink this strategy.

Martym.6971:

And don’t get me started in PvP. Melee isn’t a viable option in group PvP. No ways to mitigate damage at ALL, and very easy to die as any melee spec.

Nonsense, I shadowstep right into the middle of zergs rather often so I can chew on some poor player’s face. Once I get noticed I stealth and escape with little to no problems at all. Damage mitigation is for tanks, just have some condition removal and a couple escape utilities and you’re untouchable.

Martym.6971:

Even stealth doesn’t mitigate damage, people can AoE you while in stealth, I’ve died numerous times IN stealth.

Yeah, it’s stealth. You’re not dimension hopping…

Martym.6971:

Thief as a class just is off, big time, against anyone who is half competant, you will simply get shut down and blown up.

I disagree, it’s awfully rare for me to get shut down 1v1 in WvW (I don’t do a lot of sPvP). I feel like you need to re-evaluate your skill level and make sure you’re actually as good as you think you are, lots of players have a hard time accepting they’re not nearly as pro as they think… just saying.

Here is the build I currently use: Shadow Games
I roll with HiS for my heal and damage condition removal, SR for when I need a second to think or save an ally if I’m feeling heroic, BP for that POOF! WHERE’D HE GO?! effect, SoS for the speed boost (remember that using a signet’s active will remove it’s passive until it’s off cooldown), and either Reaper of Grenth or Thieves Guild depending on how I intend to approach a situation. RoG is my aggressive dive into a zerg elite and TG is my defensive I have no actual back up elite.