Guild Wars 2

yeah but im 90% sure they are not visible to the enemy until they are triggered, the 10% is because this is Anet we are talking about

it would be pretty idiotic if they were visible.

TheBandicoot.5294:

Not possible. Even if he does two complete runs to get a total of 14 bauble bubbles just from the rewards that leaves us with a total of 14 baubles to be baught with baubles. So seven bauble baubbles to be baught per character – thats just 1750 baubles each character has to collect, an amount which is not only blocked by the limited storage space of the purse but is also not even obtainable since there are not that many baubles to collect in one playthrough.

getting 500 doesnt take that long with digging and hidden rooms, doesnt take long to warp out trade em in and re-enter and do it all again, they didn’t say in 1 playthrough.

Fact is the only thing that being able to delete/create characters to farm boss chests does is lower the price of the sellable skins, which is generally actually a good thing as it means the skins are more freely available to everyone even those that dislike jumping puzzles.

LameFox.6349:

Does this screw up if it happens between firing an arrow (as in auto-attack) and it hitting? I’ve noticed lately I sometimes use my heal and find myself already with ‘revealed’ on, and I guess if I’m taking slow damage it must trigger about the same time as I want to use HiS.

It occurred to me that if they just made it a short-duration (like 2s) version of smokescreen, it’d be defensive without getting in the way and it would still be possible to stealth yourself from it if certain skills were available (like HS).

Yes it does because the attack lands after you have stealthed from it thus triggering revealed

Fritz.5026:

I suggested a 3 second cooldown on thief skills to get rid of 1 button spamming months ago.

It was largely ignored because honestly thieves are in denial and just think that thief players are magically better than the rest of the world, like that actually makes sense.

Its not that thieves are better its just that good players already have no issues with most the thief toolset because it relies on understanding how it works to counter rather than pressing a button on the keyboard to counter.

Seriously if your dying to HS spam your dying to much much worse things a thief can technically do more damage autoattacking than spamming HS unless your low life (at which point thats where HS is made for).

Nerfing thieves because new players and players who actively refuse to fight back/play defensively/run something other than full zerker cloth armour would totally trash thieves against higher level players who already counter things reliably at which point thief would then be locked out of high level pvp because low level pvpers decided they were too hard to learn to fight against.

Kallist.5917:

Goloith.6349:

Personally I would like to see some debuff/reduced damage if they constantly spam one skill. I just don’t like the cooldown idea. In my opinion skill is doing something other than HS, HS, HS, HS, & HS. So my idea would be that the effectiveness of a skills is reduced by 20% everytime they use it in succession. That means that they still can use it, but they will be deterred from spamming it. This might cause them to use a different skill in between. I know it seems just like a cooldown, but it’s not, it’s giving them the option. Personally I think this would make this class much better and more fun to play.

A far better solution would be after the second consecutive skill use, the Init cost goes up.

Actually a better solution would for people to realize unless your low health already that HS spamming thief is doing less damage than if they just auto attacked while also locking every single non auto attack skill from both his weapons out.

If your dieing to “HS spam” your either a) at low health already b) a potato c) in desperate need of some actual defense

I could have sworn had 2 pop up, one being the worm chieve one being the babys first tier, oh well at least theres more things for people to check if they are missing one.

… no fricken daggers…. blah

hmm could have sworn I got one when visiting the shortcut worm

Yeah the main things to look out for if your missing one or two of the feats is:

The first shop in the first zone has one on entering

Shortcut worm has one but so does the regular root so make sure to go both ways.

The split path in zone 3 both contains feats so make sure to go both paths

After killing the frog king wait for the warp to the bonus zone this also contains one (this is the one that caught me out)

The rest should be easily obtained just following the marked path/rainbows

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Taril.8619:

~snip~
and hit with the highest damage roll from weapon damage with a dagger you get:
~snip~

Pistol has the highest damage roll.

but a pistols damage roll isn’t the highest damage roll possible with a dagger… because its a pistol damage roll..

(as in they where stating that with the highest damage roll possible for someone utilizing a dagger not that the dagger has the highest damage roll)

people must be using lots of alts to get 100+ chests already.

But yeah only from boss chest (once per day per character)

but you shouldn’t have to change mechanics to appease people that think somethings unfair or overpowered simply due to their lack of understanding of how it works.

Thats how you end up with 1 button counters to classes and such.

The fact that you can spam heartseeker 4-5 times before you have to wait for the cooldown comes with a multitude of penalties and still doesnt stop it from being a really ineffectual way to deal damage (to the point where against some people you’ll be dealing no damage at all) if that is enough to cause an entire reworking of a profession where do you stop?

Do you totally rework guardians because they can get a load of boons and a group of people think thats unfair because their top health tier high armour character doesn’t get access to that many boons because they have other stuff?

I just don’t see what there is to “fix” a good thief won’t spam the same move unless theres a clear advantage to it (such as burning all your initiative on HS when a dungeon boss is below 25% hp) at which point any alterations will nerf the burst damage capabilities the thief was designed to have.

On top of that the bads and the new players will still “cheese” in some form or other and the idiots who think spamming HS is so overpowered will still refuse to use any form of defense.

The fact the entire thief is sort of designed around cooldowns coming after burning x number of attacks means as soon as you decide to change that one component you have to change practically everything about the thief, at which point you may as well just remove the thief and merge the skills with people who already use the mechanics you want to change to.

Oldgrimm.8521:

i also have an idea if we have cooldowns

but mine is a little brutal

3 secs cool down to all weapon skills except auto attacks

but we will have an added unique mechanic: NO CD on weapon swap

im really thinking of multitude of combos from switching back and forth weapon sets

(mind you, we cannot abuse on weapon swap sigils because sigils have ICD)

That would also require the complete removal of the initiative system

Throw in the fact that skills do have a cooldown due to initiative regen rate and such… sure we can use HS 4-5 times before we have to wait on regen but then we have to wait on the regen to use ANY weapon moves.

it really wouldn’t do much beyond break every thieves current rotations and cooldown balances.

Players would still complain about thieves mechanics they’d still see it as “spam” and they still wouldn’t realize that initiative based combat has drawbacks.

Not only all that but the bad players who think someone heartseeking 4 times at them while they are at full health is something really powerful would be able to continue not learning the game mechanics and instead find that if they complain enough anything they don’t understand would get removed/nerfed

Elmuerto.9840:

I think people have gotten used to stealth ocurring so very frequently both in attack and defense. I wonder does this particular problem affect heavily those who use D/D?

Basically it would effect anyone who likes to use stealth as a defensive mechanism that would possibly be attacking as their health hits 25%.

Doesn’t have to be someone who’s using stealth constantly but if you wanted to use stealth to escape or have some small breathing room when your health gets low and you where attacking as your health hits 25% (considering base 10k health going from 50% to below 25% is only 2.5k damage not a great deal)

If its even just 1 out of 10 times last refuge has this happen thats still unacceptable for a trait that you are forced to take if you want a specific line of traits, the traits should never become a hindrance at all ever doubly so if they are the static ones.

wait… theres jumping puzzles that require more than 1 person? Then of course theres Super Adventure box currently that can be solo’d as a jumping puzzle dungeon…

And of course the game is an MMORPG, its not designed to be solo’d and putting in lots of content to that extent sort of goes against what they want the game to be.

Iove.3902:

Puru.4217:

stof.9341:

Iove.3902:

I quite like the trait. I don’t see a problem with it, and have not experienced a problem with it. If anyone wants to enlighten me, please do so. Though, the reason I might not have problems is because I’m not a stealth spamming Thief — I use Evades.

Regardless, what are the problems you are having with it?

If you aren’t really using Stealth, why do you spec into Shadow Arts?

If you want to use a lot of Stealth, you have to spec into Shadow Arts and then the trait gets annoying.

Because:

1)This trait is powerfull if not massively using stealth
2)reducing the cd of deception by 20% is powerfull regardless of using a stealth build or not.

The trait is good but i agree it shouldn’t fork you if you rely massively on stealth, it simply needs to be modified slightly.

Indeed, I only have 10 into SA for the Deception CD. Acro > SA! Also, a thief’s main defense is his evades and mobility. Stealth is just a crutch.

actually its both, using just one or the other is when it becomes a crutch either way.

Thief has about equal parts both evade and stealth a good thief knows when each ones appropriate for use, it only becomes a crutch if you find one skill that you found works well against new players and utilize just that skill.

Only time you shouldn’t be utilizing both for defense is if you’ve built heavily to improve one aspect over the other, so a shadow arts will focus more on their stealth for defense while an acrobat will focus more on their evades, both are limited enough that unless traited heavily you can’t really get by relying on just one or the other against anything but bads and news.

I like to think that HS spammers are people who QQ about thief who have decided to try them out, found that people still kill them while they stealth and that it doesnt instantly kill the population of the server and then, because they are so godlike so that one thief that killed them before must be OP or cheating, tried out the OTHER thing that killed them which is HS spam.

That way every time I kill or see one being killed I get that happy little feeling somewhere deep inside my blackened shriveled little heart

hidden killer is just chance no effect on the actual damage of the crit.

10k mug in spvp may be doable but would require a very specific set of circumstances as well as glass cannons both sides. Most likely frenzy involved somewhere also.

people seem to think you need to be spamming buttons for the trait to begger you, but you don’t even if your fighting slowly pressing buttons one at a time, if it triggers in the middle of an attack your done for regardless wether your “spamming” or just having pressed it once to start that attack.

either way something that can get in the way of your actual skills should not be a forced passive.

unfortunately thats part of the choice, yes you’ve given up a bit of dps for 40% more health but if you want more still you have to give up yet more, everyone faces this choice to some degree, granted were the only low health tier profession that doesn’t get around its squishiness with actual damage reduction rather evasion and hoping the thing we are against doesn’t know how stealth works.

I don’t think we’ll get more health and at the same time I don’t think we really need more health, those that do can already build for it quite nicely, those that don’t don’t.

At the very least it prevents yet more QQ about thieves.

PopeUrban.2578:

Dasorine.1964:

precisely, I dare say there isn’t THAT many skills that absolutely no one uses to the point where complete removal/replace wouldn’t royally hurt them.

The only one I can really think of that, in its current version, has almost no use is body shot (this of course not counting underwater weapon skills) and thats only really that bad because the vulnerability doesn’t really last long enough for real use compared to other vulnerability stackers.

IMO they could just add swiftness to body shot and it would be a useful skill on any pistol setup without altering its cast time or cost. P/D would have a potential swiftness+cripple with dancing dagger for closing in to use CnD, and P/P would have a real kiting tool that also increased their unload damage a bit at the same time.

I’d be happy for a 10 second duration or a 10 stacks per shot myself.

Of course the biggest problem with changing weapon skills is if they change completely then people that have been utilizing them have to get new stuff from simply a new weapon to potentially an entirely new gear load out because of a change (depending on the weapon skills and severity of change)

Now ideally they want players to be playing lots anyway but they should want them to be playing lots because they enjoy it not because they are now forced to farm up a new set of gear/cash to buy gear because they changed something integral to the build they where using. Unhappy gamers are gamers unlikely to spend money on account expansions or “happy fun time fluff”

precisely, I dare say there isn’t THAT many skills that absolutely no one uses to the point where complete removal/replace wouldn’t royally hurt them.

The only one I can really think of that, in its current version, has almost no use is body shot (this of course not counting underwater weapon skills) and thats only really that bad because the vulnerability doesn’t really last long enough/stack enough per shot for real use compared to other vulnerability stackers.

It would ruin any semblance of balance as all the current traits are based around having only 7 customizable and 8 static traits suddenly increasing the amount would raise player power rather ridiculously (some more than others but everyone would get much stronger)

As for the choice thing, sure you get to choose more traits in total but your choice is less important because your taking that many.

Where before its about weighing the pro’s and cons of putting points in a trait line deciding which traits in either tree would work best etc it would be “well I get them all so I don’t have to think about it as much”

And of course diversity would drop as theres less combinations of 15 trait choices out of the big pool than there is of 7 out of the big pool.

If they DID allow traiting all lines fully they’d have to redo all the traits to lower their power OR buff everything else up ridiculously to compensate.

All in all it WOULD cut down on both diversity and choice that actually matters while raising power in ridiculous and uncontrollable ways while giving nothing really beneficial to the game as a whole.

Not from temple and I’ve not really heard of any other karma merchants selling exotic armour.

You could probably get the missing legs from a dungeon though if you wanted to save the WvW stuff for your weapons.

well most likely they’d be doing weapon skills, there’s not much point replacing current utility skills unless they are doing so with something that does the same thing but better as they could just add new skills in to be bought with the thousands of skill points we have laying around (in fact many people are asking for more skills)

Since they can’t do the same with weapon skills without introducing new weapons (or shock horror customization weapon skills) thats most likely where any changes would hit most.

And for me, like many others, it comes down to what they remove and what they replace it with, for example my 2 main weapon sets (d/d and shortbow) I use most the skills and would be sorely upset if they changes THOSE ones but stuff like dancing dagger and disabling shot which are my two least used skills in the set, well I wouldn’t be ecstatic but if they where replaced with more useful skills I’d not complain.

But then I know some people use both those skills who would be as upset as I would be if they removed deathblossom for instance.

problem is shirou if a thief is going to be hitting the amount of damage thats in any way a problem compared to anyone else there not going to HAVE those defensive abilities or be able to just shortbow out, we can’t just swap weapons after using all our initiative on burst and if we don’t use all our initiative on burst the fights most likely going to be drawn out, something thieves are not good at surviving.

The fact that you seem to be able to see every warrior upto 1500 range away loading up to shoot you but you can’t see that thief that has to be at furthest 900 range?

In a WvW situation a warrior is much more likely to snipe you than a thief is due to being able to stand way back in the middle of a zerg so you can’t see the shot loading (the shot that is only .75 seconds longer “cast time” then cnd)

A thief you will most likely see coming close to 900 range at which point he will most likely teleport to you which you can evade if you know the timing of thieves, if you do evade thats his burst combo over, he’s just likely burnt his venom and his mug both of which will be around 45 second cooldowns.

If you don’t dodge then you have a perfectly avoidable CnD coming thats highly telegraphed, if you dodge that then not only has the thief burnt 2 big cooldowns he’s also burnt half his weapon skills if he tries again he’s burnt ALL of it and has to wait at base 8 seconds before he can attempt again (6 initiative at 1 initiative every 1.33 seconds)

If the thief is waiting for cooldowns theres going to be no way he can keep you at 900 range for at least half a minute without burning all his stuff so when the 2 cooldowns do come around he’s not going to have the initiative or such to do the burst either and devs forbid that you carry around some sort of range weapon you can switch to that would most likely chase the thief off if not outright kill them.

As for stealthing away, well for one if there running away that means you’ve won, congrats, second a single CC is often enough to completely negate their attempts to flee, or a channeled attack or aoe attacks where they stealthed etc.

If you really think stealth is THAT powerful try running with it against people that have played thieves and learned that its basically non-existent if you know its coming.

If you really think that a thief getting to 900 range, closing in on you and burning multiple cooldowns (sometimes even all if they are burst built), positioning and then escaping is easier than sitting at 1200 range in the middle of a group of people and shooting people that have no hope of seeing you then there is something wrong.

If your failing to evade anything a thief does it is not because a thief is overpowered, there are many many people who can and do evade/counter or just simply outright shutdown thieves most of the time without needing to actively build for it, so if they can do it why can’t you?

Im thinking they’ve given up on their thoughts of becoming an E-Sport and decided casual is the way to go, as casual pvp is really the only place a thief becomes any real sort of powerful (though would still not say overly so)

now that thieves have found a use for needle trap I daresay no ones ever going to finish that jumping puzzle again :P

knight.8926:

swinsk.6410:

Yea, but thieves can stealth, so let’s nerf them first.

Thieves can stealth 90% of the time that’s the problem.

Only if they are not doing anything but stealth and are therefore almost ambient critters

or even just “Does absolutely nothing” cos then at least it wouldn’t actively contribute to deaths.

The problem I have with x amounts of use per activation is that as a thief I can use up multiple charges rapidly, if those charges happen to apply something that doesn’t stack then any beyond the first application is pointless or if it does stack but applies a condition or limited amounts of condition that don’t make any real difference/easier/better ways to apply them then why would I take that utility?

The first issue can be resolved numerous ways from putting internal cooldowns in (which I doubt anyone would actually want) to giving them a more passive effect (either making em sigil like passive until used or my idea of making first use put the “passive chance on hit” for 30 seconds then second use cancels the passive and gives you instant charges etc)

Second one just simply comes down to deciding whats actually worth putting on a utility skill, just stacking poisons not very good (unless heavily traited into venoms and thus whats good is the traits and amount of charges not the actual skill) nor is 3 stacks of vuln or 2s of immobilize not for a limited utility with a hefty cooldown.

For the most part your idea’s are basically just cooldown reductions with no real effect on any of the other issues plaguing venoms.

A utility shouldn’t rely on traits to make it useful either so yes it IS just about poison unless you decide to build your character around using them.

Would you be happy with scorpion wire if you had to trait specifically to add on the pull function?

45 AR is not meant to be enough for past 40-49 though, that one sites rule of thumb only works for the first 3 tiers of agony (where it raises by 18% damage a tier) tier 3 to tier 4 (30-39 to 40-49) raises by 24% which means you need more AR than that sites rule states and to the next tier I wouldn’t be surprised if you needed even more.

Basically level 50-59 comes when they put in the next ascended item/upgrades for current ascended items. When this comes I don’t know but it would be nice if it was sooner rather than later.

I’d also be happy if they just looked into what each venom applies, applying poison for using up a utility slot is a bit naff considering theres a few effective ways of applying it for a thief that does a bit more or uses up something less valuable.

Likewise immobilize/stun on a poison with potential multiple applications (that can be used instantly just with 1 link of an auto attack chain) that doesn’t then stack (meaning if you instantly apply both stacks you may as well only have had 1 stack on it to begin with)

Heck Skale is 5s of weakness and 3 stacks of vulnerability for 5 seconds (unless traited) on a 45 second cooldown, the conditions mostly just weren’t thought out for what the utility is for the most part.

the agony doesn’t scale in the way that post uses it though. For example that site states for 40-49 fractals you’d need only 35 AR while if you did run 40-49 with that amount of AR you’d get hit for 30% of your health per agony tick (thus being defeated at maw) for 40-49 your really looking at 40 (24% hp a tick) as the bare minimum to really survive (even that would end up requiring a fair bit of healing).

Your meant to be locked to certain levels with certain amount of agony resistance (as stated by Anet) currently the max you can get is 45 which is enough for 40-49 but wont be enough for higher until we get a bit more (considering 45 in 40-49 range is still 18% of your health per tick which is still a very dangerous amount of damage during maw if your unlucky but not instant wipe)

though chances are the next AR item will come from sPvP or something silly like that

same reason people use signets and same reason you didn’t want them entirely passive

Grackleflint.4956:

Kaimick.5109:

Reported for repeating a thread you made already and saying the same thing.

Every thief should be reported for Spamming.

And every one that complains about thief being overpowered with no real evidence should be reported for harassment :P

Where though? In WvW and hotjoin low level spvp I can spam autoattacks on my ranger and get kills with next to no deaths.

Just because people don’t defend against it doesn’t mean its undefendable.

well thats the thing they’d probably have to rework venoms completely (tbh they sort of need to anyway).

All the traits would most likely need reworking though venom sharing just the passive I daresay would be easy enough and effective, 4 more chances of the condition plus a longer duration on the share meaning stuff like healing from venom application becomes overall higher etc.

In the end with both venoms and traps they sort of need a rethink, one or two from either can currently be used to great effect, others can get OK usage out of all of them if they specifically build for them but for average utilities they are all kind of in dire need of being reworked almost entirely.

Yep except all other professions can switch weapons and have a whole new set of cooldowns to use, if a thief uses all his initiative thats ALL his initiative regardless of whether they swap weapons. So thieves get 12 initiative (at base) most others get 8 cooldowns, ele’s and engineers get slightly more with their own mechanics.

12 inititiave at best gives 4 attacks before your relying on the regen compared to everyone elses 8 before they are stuck waiting on cooldowns, sure thieves regen is faster than most cooldowns (our longest weapon cooldowns are 8s at base initiative regen) but thats again because we don’t get as many as others do before resource limitation kicks which limits choice of how many attacks we can make before we limit our other attacks/weapon swaps.

Fact is your incredibly ignorant of so many things and yet you think because you died to a skill doing what its meant to do that you didn’t even try to defend yourself against that something is unfair.

if warriors had initiative whirlwind would most likely be 4 cost and thus not as spammable.

And if your counter argument is “give everyone this” then why bother making more than 1 class? just remove all professions make a new one called “noob” and give them every single mechanic in the game without thinking of how certain things are balanced around certain mechanics etc.

Fact is your bitter because you got killed, you got killed because you ran away at low health and someone used a skill designed to chase down and finish off people running away at low health.

The fact that heartseeker is spammable doesn’t change this all it does is make it sound like you only fight thieves that don’t really understand how things work and will have to run away or promptly die soon after “spamming” you with that one attack which once again only really deals damage if your low health already.

This sort of complaining is everywhere from people that haven’t a clue how things work, heck you still get people yelling at thieves being OP after they die from stuff like siege weapons in sPvP.

Either start using something to defend yourself against the attacks or try rolling a thief and see how well YOU do with this “overpowered and unfair skill”

well you seem to think that using up all initiative is nothing to a thief when its basically the same thing as another class spending all 8 weapon cooldowns, granted on the same skill but since that one skill by itself is not going to murder people unless they don’t take any actual actions against it.

Daecollo.9578:

Dasorine.1964:

tbh I always expected venoms to be more of a continual buff style thing like other games use the skill you get a buff for x amount of time and during that time your attacks apply/have a chance to apply the effects.

I mean that sort of venom still technically exists in this game as consumable.

I mean look at skale venom for thieves: for 3 hits you apply weakness and vulnerability for 5 seconds

Compared to the consumable: For 10 minutes your attacks have a chance of applying weakness and vulnerability

The way we get it at the moment just doesn’t fit, you don’t give someone that attacks rapidly something that only lasts a few attacks and in some cases doesn’t even stack.

Granted 10 minutes would be silly (as it would have to lock the utility for that long to prevent abuse) but still, a 45 second skill that when used gives you a chance to apply those conditions on every hit for 30 seconds would, in my eyes, be much superior.

Yeah, but then that dillutes active gameplay. I want to be able to apply venoms at the right time when I need them, not randomly just get them. Imagine immobilizing an opponent (Since its Immobilize, it will probably only happen every 10 seconds since its so powerful as a proc.) at the wrong time when you didn’t want it.

Or Poisoning the mob or player randomly when he wasn’t healing.

Its good to save it for when you need it.

Not saying the consumable way is best but its a lot better in general than currently.

Heck you could even make em flip utilities, on use applies the passive effect for the duration, this allows all thieves to utilize them in a much less neutered way (as in not burning all the charges in a single auto attack chain) then for that time frame if you hit the skill again it instantly puts up the current charges and throws the skill into its cooldown or such, granted exacts would be tweaked and such as to timings and when cooldown starts etc etc, but could also change traits to allow for more active use with the passive ones as well (residual allowing you to click twice rather than once for the instant charge etc)

So are a lot of attacks, should they all be nerfed because you don’t put any thought into countering them?

So far it sounds as if you are complaining because your being chased by a skill that’s made to chase people while also qq’ing about thief mechanics you have next to no understanding of.

tbh I always expected venoms to be more of a continual buff style thing like other games use the skill you get a buff for x amount of time and during that time your attacks apply/have a chance to apply the effects.

I mean that sort of venom still technically exists in this game as consumable.

I mean look at skale venom for thieves: for 3 hits you apply weakness and vulnerability for 5 seconds

Compared to the consumable: For 10 minutes your attacks have a chance of applying weakness and vulnerability

The way we get it at the moment just doesn’t fit, you don’t give someone that attacks rapidly something that only lasts a few attacks and in some cases doesn’t even stack.

Granted 10 minutes would be silly (as it would have to lock the utility for that long to prevent abuse) but still, a 45 second skill that when used gives you a chance to apply those conditions on every hit for 30 seconds would, in my eyes, be much superior.