Guild Wars 2

yanoch.7051:

I would be curious to see how FA does VS a T1 server.

Last league was in Sept. At that time FA performed vs JQ or TC as T3 now did vs them or SoS
http://mos.millenium.org/servers/view/39/213
http://mos.millenium.org/servers/view/36/211
…

Deli.1302:

Life isn’t meant to be fair. If you are not enjoying the WvW on your server, either you pay and transfer or suffer the consequences of not doing so. Anet is unlikely to do anything about “dead” servers for a very long time, especially with an expansion on the way.

That’s non sense and you likely know it.

We all know that WvW-player hours (and numbers) seriously went down during 2014. My subjective impression is it’s at around 20-30% of it’s one year ago numbers in EU.

The number of severs is much to high now, 9 would likely be enough to let all EU-player play without queue.

ANets very slow reaction time to that problem turned out to be quite disastrous for the fun of playing WvW.

And concerning the expansion: A new map will not improve fun if it will be empty or unbalanced. I hope even ANet noticed that and that parallel to the expansion (but for all not only for expansion owners) also match-structure and server change.

Generally quite good ideas.

I am also thinking since a while on something related. Balance is a matter of (nearly) equal numbers. So far we had proposals, to limit the map-capacity to the numbers of the smallest force. However, this is to susceptible to manipulation. (Stay away to hinder the enemies attacking you)

How about Foraging as follows:

Each map is divided into 4 areas. Each sides corner and the center (ruins and south, east and west supply camp on BL, SN and the Merc-camps on EB).

In the center-area there is no limit. In the side-areas there is a soft-limit corresponding to this sides-force on this map (anywhere on the map) plus 5, e.g. if Red has 20 people on EB, the soft-limit of blue and green in the red-area is 25 for each.
What does soft-limit mean? Simple: If your side exceeds the soft-limit you cannot “live of the land” anymore, but need supply to survive. The more people are over the limited the more supply each player consume per minute. And if he runs out of supply he starts to starve, i.e. loosing life per minute.

The optimal force-size to attack an enemy third is therefore enemy-size plus 5.
Leaving a map-emtpy is not a good strategy, because 5 vs 0 can easily turn it, the more people the weakest side has the easier is it for them to defend. So the usual manipulation problem is dissolved.

As the strongest size, you face a limit now. You can only concentrate all your forces for defense and for attacking the center, but you will start to starve when you try to overrun the opponents in their third. You can still play, you just have to split your forces to attack both sides.

Junkpile.7439:

Play EotM. It’s superior game mode. Match actually start soon and need to go kill desolation upscaled players. It’s so much fun kill PvE players.

Yeah play EotM, but Junkpile, Maguuma does neither fight Deso nor you

And concerning your quetion: Nothing happened to WvW, to much of nothing for much to long to be precise.

And hey: if you stopped as one of the first, maybe you are only one of the first returning, so maybe in some month it wil be full as on first day?

Krustydog.3072:

Make it so the ONLY way to get in is if WvW is full.

Maybe it was once meant as overflow, but in the meantime it is the

• better game mode, as it able to adapt the provided game-capacity to the demanded game-capacity.
• more popular game mode.

Why would you restrict access to the principly better game-mode based on people play the bad mode? Just to make the dying of the worser game-mode WvW a bit more lengthy? It will die as fast, simply because 24/7 fixed capacity is bad design, just additionally no one can play the better mode.

Another “side-effect” of course would be: Everyone that likes to play EotM has to move to kitten be able to play what he likes. So you just presented another reason to increase overstacking on a single server. Great, thats what WvW and EotM really miss

Ultimaistanza.4793:

I don’t really like this idea. How is it really going to be implemented so that it helps more than hurt? I mean, say I was tagged up fighting in a keep and the auto-balance kicked in and I ended up getting ported to a different overflow or lost a fair bit of the people because they were zoned into another map.

In PvP autobalance has to move people around as a match with 5 people and 5 min has no fluctuation and 2 people more or less make a big difference.

Auto-balance in EotM hasn’t been that drastic. It’s probably enough that everyone that joins EotM is added to the smallest team, then natural fluctuation will be enough to lead to balance.

Only server-color-to-team has to be replaced by new-joiner-to-smallest-team to reach balanced EotM.

892 (days GW2 is online) * 24 (hours of the day) * 12 (dolayak respawns per hour) * 6 (no of camps on a map) * 2 (2 dollies per camp) = 3’082’752

If you do it 8h per day, on a Map where your side do not own any camp and never miss a dolly you could have made it

But I was to lazy, only 3’738 dollies in 892 days so far

Yadidi.2910:

Gotta get some friends first lol

Join a guild

On the other side:

Being in the bottom tier means you will have very good chances that you do not meet anyone on the maps in the night.

Gather some friends, best at least know played WvW already and get anything you need at 5am.

Azhure.1857:

The issue is on your end, not Anet’s.

It’s ANet that produced

• the client that crashes
• the situation that produces the crash in their client.

I never had these problems before mega-server.
And I’ve my other-players-settings low as I play a lot EotM/WvW.

Aidan Savage.2078:

Also, just an fyi, no way in hell is it going to have only positive effects. Have you ever fought triple trouble? That one more or less demands a full map to be successful.

It may demand a full map (but probably thats a matter of scaling if it does or not).
In any case I would rate tripple trouble (and the marionette and the boss in the lion arch reconquest) as better game design, because it requires the people not all in one place, but distributed over several places.

The current world bosses suffer a lot under mega-server technology:

• You crash very often as having that many people at the same place seem to be behind the engines/internet capabilities. (I experienced all three times I tried a crash today to do the jormag-daily, still missing to complete him.)
• If you crashed you relog on a map where the boss never happened
• It is REDUCED fun (challangeless) to have that many people at the same place

Please fill every instance from 15min before till boss is dead only for 50-75% of it’s normal max-capacity. This will have only positive effects

• less crashes, as the engines doesn’t have to operate at its limit
• rejoiner after a crash could get a place on the map they left

Anaktas.7390:

Its a WvW map its survival of the fittest.

“survival of the fittest” would be cool, but from last time with same color as SFR I remember that there was no fitness-difference only a masses-difference

xGraver.4918:

But all commercial is good. So keep telling SFR is best it just bring in more EoTM ppl.

In fact I am awaiting the time where they will be the only ones going there

xGraver.4918:

SFR killing EoTM again.

I was more blaming ANet, but yeah all the people that transferred to SFR for easy baggies are a double fault as well

• they pay to win, such that Anet likes the current system
• they pay to win, as an easy way to be on the winner side

xGraver.4918:

Besides were blue this week so can’t plaim us about green OP.

Opener did not said green is OP. 2nd poster said green OP, but he is NA In EU blue is dominating EotM this week, not green, green has out-manned buf quite often.

Malediktus.3740:

Auto balance seems like a stupid idea to me. Its not a structured pvp where it has to be balanced.

Says a SFR commander that needs a 3:1 to farm the baggies he want?

After 2.5 years I’ve killed 3700 doylaks. Just 996300 till Yak Slapper.
If I continue as I did so far, Ill have the title in just 650 years, Yeah!!!!!

Chameleon Dude.1564:

So, I can just create a new character and unlock every skill almost instantly? Yeah, sure. That sounds fair.

That’s already the case. You just have to walk to your bank currently.

Only Problem: my mouse will probably break, while I make my new revenant lvl 80 with 500+ skill points by doing nothing than tutorial and walking to the next bank.

Siphaed.9235:

Hmm….3 years in August will GW2 have been running.

And at least the WvW-achievement title hunter need at least another 40 years till we will have the first: Yak Slapper

PS: I’ll probably need a bit longer, after 2.5 years I am only at 3700 of 1000000, so in 675 year I likely made it I hope Gw2 will stay online long enough!!

I’ve 15+ Birthday lvlup-to-20 scroll (in 2 incompatible stacks, grrr)
I’ve now 70+ tomes of knowledge
I’ve over 750 skill point scroll,
most of my chars have a pool of 350+ (my main WvW-char 1100+) skill points.

Should I ever make new chars again (I’ve 10 already) I don’t need to play them anymore

Where is the sense in this skill-point inflation?

such that you can win any 3 vs 1.

But you can only play him on WvW/EotM map on which your team has outmanned buf (i.e. you can always play him, you just have to be in the right team)

This way he may solve the most urgent problem of WvW/EotM: Imbalance

Tom Gore.4035:

Not relevant. Anet cannot forcibly balance numbers in an open world PvP map, unless they reduce the map cap to 5 people per realm.

Why? They could use the PvP random team assignment and rebalancing algorithm at least in EotM.

you would have the balance you currently always have in WvW/EotM.

What would you do?

• Be happy? As you will clearly win 5 out of 7 matches!
• Write a bug-report?
• Complain in the forum?
• Play something else?
• …

In EU I am surprised when I do NOT have outmanned buf (but it never last longer than a few minutes). The team with SFR has nearly always 3:1 superiority over both other teams since months.

Balance is more important than a new map and it’s broken since nearly a year:
Do something useful, ANet none cares about the JP boxes.

When will you recognize the current WvW/EotM-imbalance as that what it is:
A game-breaking bug that disables gameplay.

Comparing it to PvP: If all PvP-matches would be setup by the system to be 5 vs 2, how long would you need to recognize, search and fix the bug? A week? A month or as in WVW/EotM over a year?

As long as match-structure and balance aren’t fix, WvW and EotM are unplayable.
Be it on an old or a new map doesn’t really matter, being out-manned or outmanning is always equally boring.

The population status in the world transfer dialog counts everyone, WvW-playing, PvE-playing, and even inactive since years, probably even banned ones.

So it’s more or less around 4mio sold copies divided by 51 server ~80000 on every server. If you see less, you have more deaths lying in your servers catacombs

Transfer costs where once introduced to limited wtj and KEEP balance.

Now that balance is gone they only preserve imbalance.

I agree that transfers should be free till we got new better balanced WvW-mode (i.e. forever).

Jim Hunter.6821:

they just need to adjust the scoring system and add a floating cap for the amount of players allowed in to WvW to keep the matches competitive…. of course that would mean they need to assign some people to work on WvW so it is unlikely we will see that happening anytime soon.

No it would not be enough. It took a while to notice it, but WVW-matches were never decided by fights, it was always nothing else than night/morning/day-PvD that decided matches. Even if you reduce the score advantage from it, it remains: The one with better coverage sits in T3, the one with worser coverage sits in wood. Will not result in 150k score advantage if you adapt scoring, but worser coverage will still be without any chance.

Jim Hunter.6821:

Dayra.7405:

Still the point is: This thread don’t look for fights on eotm-map.
It asked for a BL-map in Eotm-mode, to get more fights.

The point is it wouldn’t be any different. It’s just wasting more time on eotm that the devs should be spending on WvW.

24/7 matches with fixed capacity where a bad idea from the beginning, but as long as people could maintain the illusion of a competition it worked.

But WvW died in 2014, 24/7 competition is widely recognized as illusion that can never work, spending time on it is a waste.

Still the point is: This thread don’t look for fights on eotm-map.
It asked for a BL-map in Eotm-mode, to get more fights.

In any case the will for fight could dominate the will for karma-train, if it would be there.
If YOU start fighting in EotM, you either empty the map or you get fights

This week in EU guilds on red and blue server could be very funny in EotM.
20 ppl guilds groups farming the 100 ppl green blob, that outman red and blue 100% of the time.

If the BL map is unchanged it will have the same (low) rewards in EotM-mode as a BL map in WvW-mode. In any case BL isn’t usually considered a PvE map (even if it is a PvD map over 90% of the time)

And already in T3 you do not have enough people in WvW for fights during the day or night. That’s better in EotM-mode (not map).

Glossary of terms:
EotM-mode: matches take 4 hours, teams are composed of all servers with the same color
WvW-mode: matches take 24/7, teams are single servers only
EotM-map: the currently only map available in EotM-mode,
BL-Map: one of the maps available in WvW-mode

WvW-player claim that it’s mostly karma-train on Eotm-map, in fact, in lower tiers it has during the day more fights as WvW, simply because: there are so few enemies in WvW you hardly find them to fight them.

Jim Hunter.6821:

umm if you are looking for fights why are you playing on a PvE map?

You should try to read the text before giving the usual meaningless WvW about EotM statement

Is it a good idea to have WvW in an expansion?

I mean it will only further fraction the community, those with and those without expansion.

Useless tactic.

And that you complain in forum instead of ignoring it by using different exits/maps only shows that you are as unorganized and inexperienced as the people that placed/manned the siege.

Mishi.7058:

While I like some of the suggestions, I dislike making WvW into something like eotm.

I would rather see it as: Restrict the match to it’s most fun part: The reset evening

I did not heard anything.

Still I see a sense in expressing what I would like to play and I see a sense hearing what you as other players think about it, that’s why I posted it here. I also see more sense (and fun) in proposing a new WvW, that in wasting my time playing the current one.

Concerning ANet: If many player would express there interest and it is handable effort (and I think this proposal is handable effort, it’s only putting EB and BL’s under EotM match structure, and changing, who enters which match and which matches go to the leaderboard.) then they likely be happy to replace the current broken WvW (broken as it lost massive amount of player during 2014) with something playable.

yanniell.1236:

The new expansion will change WvW, so I heard. At this point, we’ll just have to wait.

Interesting. Beside
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/preview-of-upcoming-balance-changes/
that says nothing about WvW, I just found
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Upcoming_changes_and_features
but it only says about World versus World:

• Improving the commander functionality: Being discussed, but not being worked on yet
• Matchup information made available ahead of time is looked into, but complicated.

Using guilds directly has some problems:

• People can be in more than one guild
• usually guilds aren’t large enough to fill even one map completely,
• guilds have a lot of unneeded PvE stuff
• not every guild want to play competitive WvW

Therefore I though something new but guild-like would be best.

Advantages

• competitive matches are really competitive, i.e. they are balanced and there is motivation to get a high score, i.e. to win.
• competitive play is available as often and whenever your alliance wants it and is able to provide it.
• you can play 24/ on any map you like
• probably the maps determine the play-style, higher chance of karma train on EotM, higher chance of fights on EB/BLs even outside competition
• due to mega-server technology your chance to find friends and enemies all around the clock improves a lot as there are only as many maps as there are people want to play.
• Grief-play and hacking is dissolved in competitive matches, you can kick them from your alliance if you are a serious alliance, still every player can play mega-server WvW (there may be hacker-alliances, but thats something that only Game-Admins can resolve)

Problem:

WvW has no longer enough interested propulation to play competitive matches over 24/7 on 4 maps.
Real competition can only happen when teams have equal size, i.e. they have queue on all maps.
This is only the case for a few server during only a few hours of the week anymore.

Solution Proposal:

EB alone and 3 BLs together are setup as mega-server matches as current EotM already is. So we have all maps available for play 24/7 and the amout of copies of the maps depend on how many people want to play.

To enable competitive play and not only karma-train some of those matches are between teams that want competition.
The competition is based on a new kind of WvW-Guild (it operates like a guild, but every player can be in mostly one alliance and it’s stripped of all the PvE stufff and a player can be active in an alliance without having to change which guild he represents) called Alliance.

An alliance can have up to 1000 members, it has an alliance chat always visible to all alliance whenever they are logged into GW2 and haven’t deselected it in the chat-window.

Instead of last loggin (as for guilds) the member list shows amount of hours in (on map plus in queue) of last trainig and last competition match and if this is 0 which match the player last partcipated in.

New alliances can be build by anyone, it cost 10000 gems to do so. They start with 1500 glicko points, an alliance that falls below 1000 glicko points is dissolved.

Matches are played on either

• EB map (around 120 people per team),
• 3 BL maps (around 240 people per team), or
• EotM map (around 100 people per team)

Matches have a duration of 4 hours, on EB/BLs matches start with T2 (walls and doors already upgraded once), such that you loose something if you do not defend it and you have a chance to reach WPs during the short period of the match.

Each day has 6 slots a 4 hours (for EU I would recommend an alignment with 19:00-23:00 C(S)ET as a slot, no idea whats primetime for NA), and every alliance can register for every slot up to 1 week ahead. You can see how many alliances already registered for each slot. During registration you can distribute 6 bid-points for the 3 maps. You always play together as alliance when you registered for a match. If your opponents are registered alliances as well, you play a glicko-ranking-match, if at least one team is a random-team (as the number of alliances is not always devidable by 3) you only play a training match without influence on your ranking. An alliance which did not played a rank match during the week has a higher preference to be matched into one, than an alliance that already did. If your alliance did not played any ranking match during a week you loose 100 glicko-points. (If you are at 1500 and do not play for 5 weeks you are dissolved.)

So we have 3 types of matches:

• all three teams are registered alliances -> ranking match (map-bid points are addded over the 3 teams, the map with highest bid is selected)
• all three teams are mega-server-random-teams -> fun and 24/7 availability of WvW
• 1 mixed match, a training for the alliance, a chalange for the mega-server-random-team(s)

Ranking matches cost 100gems (or gold) registration, if you end in a mixed match you get them back. If you end in a ranking match the gems are refounded according to the result score. Each team gets as many % of the 300gems (or gold) it reaches % of the total score. (if scores are: 2500, 5000, 7500, the total is 15000 team 2 has 1/3 so it gets 100gems, team 1 has 1/6 so it get 50gems, team3 has 1/2 so it get 150gems). The main reason for this is: If you register but do not show up you loose your gems.

After 1 year of ignorance by ANet it’s broken and dead.

Just that Glicko has nothing to do with the match-score, Glicko is only used in between matches to compute the server-ranking from the match-score

But yes, your primetime performance has only very low influence on the score simply because its only 3-4 hours out of 24 and of course also as primetime score is never as extreme as off-time score.

pepper.6179:

so instead of fixing the regular competitive maps, you want to fix the alternate map designed for queues and increase rewards in a 3 hour matchup that does not benefit your anyone but yourself?

Which makes absolute Sense as WvW has two not fixable flaws compared to EotM

• 24/7 matches that are mostly empty 20/7 instead of 4 hour matches that could be made competitive.
• a fixed capacity (always 4 map and 27 servers) instead of a variable capacity (as many maps as needed at that point in time.

Therefore WvW cannot be made competitive, while EotM has at lest the potential to be made competitive.

The score not from tick increased from ~30% to ~50% (highest values)
http://www.gw2score.com/currentscore/total_score/desc
if that matters, I don’t know.

Last week EU-EotM was quite funny nice fight’s and at least green and red quite balanced,
but this week with SFR green it will be as bad as mostly. (Even worser than usual, as we are green as well, and running in the majority blob is even worser than plying the outmanned underdog.)

Write /sit or /laugh and enjoy the long time they need to kill you if you don’t do anything.

Malediktus.9250:

They cannot even balance 5v5 sPvP

But maybe they have hope of producing a balanced 0vs0 WvW

One of the mayor design flaws of WvW.

The fewer people are on the map, the more decisive is it for winning.

See

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/EotM-Green-is-King/4361800

SilverWF.4789:

Skeletor.9360:

See the attached picture

Nah, this is not WvW, this is PvD

Is there a difference anymore?

Aeolus.3615:

wil be introduced to wvw maps.

I would not fear this, as it would require someone on ANet still works on WvW
A thing hard to imagine anymore after a complete year of nothing for WvW.

Nanyetah Elohi.4852:

why do all of these guilds and personalities we never see otherwise come pouring out and clogging the system on reset? I don’t get it.

Isn’t that obvîous?

It’s the only 4hours of a WvW match that are interesting, the following 164 hours are complete boredom, as they are just: “Who has more people to burn the enemy houses when they sleep”