Guild Wars 2

xbutcherx.3861:

Esplen.3940:

Additionally, you can add in Crit-heal food for almost 700 hp/sec.

Are we playing the same game? 700 hp/sec? This is the reason some people shouldn’t be posting at all.

Have you looked at what the on-crit foods do? Just those and Healing Signet are very much capable of 700 HP/sec. With 0 Healing Power, you can easily get 687 healing/second. 200 healing power from traits and you’re at 707 HP/sec. Factor in Adrenal health and you’re looking at a very impressive 934 HP/sec at just 200 healing power.

Pregnantman.8259:

We may get cleave on two targets or splash on axe even though I expect otherwise. Even with those tweaks the core issues we have regards to PvE are not yet resolved.

Outside of giving us cleave, the only way to resolve the core issues necro has is changing PvE enemy design to use more boons, condition removals, healing, etc. and fewer CC/condition immunities.

I would love swapping some of our bleeds for Torment. That and making our traits all function in death shroud are the numbers 2 and 1 things (respectively) that I feel necros need.

Tree.3916:

Let’s say you lose 10% dps for 10 seconds. Warrior dps in a fully buffed party is around 12,000 so by activating this skill you lose around 12,000 damage. This skill would have to provide +12000 damage vs whatever else your options would be. Meaning, the skill would have to do around 24,000 damage before it breaks even. FWIW, a 24,000 damage skill in a fully buffed party is around a 3.0 coefficient.

This is the same coefficient as Eviscerate. And that is just to break even. If you want it to be an actual dps increase it would have to be even higher. If you think Anet is going to make this skill hit as hard in aoe as Eviscerate does in single target I would recommend rethinking it.

So, using your burst skill drops your DPS to 0 until you get back up to max adrenaline?

…excuse me if I cease listening to any math breakdowns you do.

EvilSardine.9635:

Harper.4173:

ens.9854:

It’s so wars can’t start a fight with adrenaline ever.

Makes sense now.

Why is it that necro’s death shroud doesn’t drain when leaving combat then?

Different mechanics are different.

Adrenaline has always drained when out of combat. All that is being changed is how soon after leaving combat the decay starts (and possibly the rate, though it’s tough to say due to how inconsistent it currently is). Life Force has never decayed when out of combat, but it always decays whenever the necro is in death shroud.

Life Force also builds much slower than Adrenaline, so having it decay out of combat would ensure necros never get a full bar.

Hitman.5829:

This will completely ruin the warrior cleansing conditions. Now you will be spammed THE SAME with conditions, and you will not be able to cleanse the conditions lots of warriors are going to die to condition kitten. People are going to rage quit and complain about this cleansing ire change because there are no changes to conditions! How many times did you die because of conditions even when you had cleansing ire?

You could, I don’t know, work some other cleanses into your build and learn how to use them properly.

On my power build necro, my only cleansing is Consume Conditions, and I never have trouble with conditions. Yeah, that’s a really good cleanse, but work in two or three cleanses into a build(easier than you think, but you might have to give up a stance or off-hand) and you’re probably set.

Then again, the whole mentality of “I must be totally free of conditions or I’m screwed” is one of the root causes of people saying that they are difficult to deal with.

Not necessarily. They could just change it so that instead of:
“At cast completion, did attack hit?
If Yes: set Adrenaline = 0”

to be
“At cast completion, set Adrenaline = 0.”

I can almost guarantee that Adrenaline only disappears after the skill is completed to be consistent in behavior with traits now.

Almost, but not 100 % sure.

Wanze.8410:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

It’s less people complaining that they can’t afford a precursor at this moment and more people complaining that the price keeps climbing, and at a pretty quick rate, too.

As far as i know, the average rate for forging a precursor has been stable since start, in fact, it has been buffed once. Unless Anet severely lowered the droprates for mats and ingredients that are used for forging precursors (t5 and t6 common and rare mats, rare and exotic weapons), it has been pretty stable.

And yet, we have multiple precursors now breaking 1k gold on the trading post.

The thing with the Mystic Toilet is that it’s an expensive gamble with long odds. Even if they tripled the current precursor forge rate, I would not think it worthwhile to try for a precursor that way by buying/crafting exotics. It is extremely likely you go backwards for meeting your goal because there is no such thing as progress when it comes to Zommoros.

Dungeon tokens? Sure, I’ll drop those on exotics and toss them in when I have enough. Any other exotics? Unless it was a drop of the appropriate type, forget it.

It’s already easy enough to land (I actually have a 100% hit rate with the skill so far in PvP and WvW). No reason to make it braindead.

It’s easy to land with a decent reward if you do. It also gives good counterplay options to your opponent. Leave it as-is.

Axe 2 could also use a whirl finisher.

Matisse.9356:

Protoavis.9107:

Wanze.8410:

Herr der Friedhoefe.2490:

Excuse me? I have over 7k hours in game. I’m hardly a casual player.

You and I used to play on RoF together, a whole lot of WvW.

I guess you’ve forgotten that?

I havent forgotten that, i just find these complain topics of little use.

So you make a troll post because they’re so useful?

I think he made that post because the recent precursor crying on the forums is hard to bear.
Don’t have the gold to get a precursor? Don’t go for a legendary or work on it. Done..

It’s less people complaining that they can’t afford a precursor at this moment and more people complaining that the price keeps climbing, and at a pretty quick rate, too.

There is no set goal for a precursor: you either get lucky via drop or Mystic Toilet (no progress ever gets made) or you farm away and watch as the price keeps climbing while you work toward crossing a finish line that keeps running away.

If they do implement a precursor crafting/scavenger hunt, I’d be ecstatc regardless of what it entails, because now there is a definite goal for me to work toward. I know exactly what I have to do, then, even if it is more work than getting the three gifts combined.

HHR LostProphet.4801:

Another idea would be to bind the range of the attacks and the movementspeed to the body height. That would d**kslap all filthy asuras out there.

Fine with me. I’d love the advantage on my max-height charr.

In seriousness, though, they definitely need to do something to make Asura animations more readable.

Liewec.2896:

The old philosophy of, “all professions can fill all roles if they spec into it” seems misplaced atm.

what class cant support? what class can’t dps? what class can’t bunker?[/quote]

Necros lack on the support side outside of healing (which is awkward to use) and they can’t bunker due to being easier to throw off point than a tennis ball. Neither can thieves, really, since their most durable spec is SA, which gives the point to your opponent.

I think Thieves have one evade-spam spec that can kinda work, but only on Legacy of the Foefire’s graveyard due to the amount of space it requires.

Arcades.4689:

Schattenlied.4873:

Regarding cheese builds in wvw you´re absolutly right, there are a lot of things that are worse than running warriors out there – but you also see a lot of people complaining about them. What I don´t like about warriors is this “I´ve beaten this stupid idiot but then he runs away without paying for his mistakes”-feeling. That´s a bit different to losing a fight vs. “cheese” builds, but still annoying. :P

warrior gs is a pretty crappy weapon, while mesmer’s staff is atleast good for condition dmg.
And you can get the same feeling by fighting a thief or ele… if he runs away, it means you’ve won. That’s the same thing I think when a thief disengages and comes back 2-3 times in a row.

And when the Warrior comes back before you’ve even exited combat, having passively regenerated a hefty portion of his health (yes, Thieves do it too)? If you’re not a Warrior yourself, you probably don’t get to enjoy the healing in the short downtime without blowing skill cooldowns that you want for when he returns.

Even in PvP, Sword users are pretty common, so that’s a good leap on a short cooldown if they want to run away. I did not say every Warrior runs there, but I do see them leave a fight with almost a perfect record if they choose.

It could stand to be toned down some. Not much, because I recognize they need those gap closers, but some small nerfs would be good.

Juggernaut is kind of a hybrid skill, though. The damage on it is actually pretty good. Not a full-on offense elite like Lich Form, but pretty good.

NeHoMaR.9812:

So, in how much time after combat the adrenaline will start to decay? one example:

If a Warrior is hitting the gate in Durios (WvW), and the gate breaks having full adrenaline, will he still have the full adrenaline after moving to top where the lord is?

Only if he manages to stay in combat the whole way. Adrenaline is going to start decaying as soon as you leave combat.

They don’t have larger numbers of escape tools (except compared to necros and guardians). What they have are much lower cooldowns. The only profession that can get away better is a Thief, and they are designed to do that. Extreme mobility is one of the primary defenses because they can’t stand to be in combat long. Warriors can, but they can disengage almost as easily and come charging right back in due to low cooldowns on those mobility skills.

And most of the melee weapons have some sort of leap or dash for Warriors. Greatsword has two, Sword has one, Axe and hammer both have their burst skills. Longest cooldown on any of those? 20 seconds. Even banners have a dash (15 second cooldown).

Burning Retreat: 20 seconds
RtL: 40 seconds (if used as an escape)
Decoy: 40 seconds
Elixer S: 60 seconds
Flesh Wurm: 40 seconds (requires pre-casting for escape use, can’t be used to chase)

The shortest cooldown on any of these skills is equal to the longest cooldown on a Warrior’s weapon skills. Most are at least twice that cooldown.

The change more seems to be in the line of making Adrenaline management an actual weakness for Warriors (as ANet stated was in tended). Right now, you literally cannot waste adrenaline. It’s the only resource in the game like that. If you lose adrenaline, you guaranteed got something out of it. As such, actual management of the resource is a non-issue.

This change makes adrenaline more valuable and those Warriors that use it recklessly will be punished. Right now, they just get a short weapon cooldown.

Poplolita.2638:

Oh my god, I was reading some stuff about the lich king on wowpedia, don’t judge XD

Too late. :p

Arcades.4689:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

In my experience, any that decide to use Berserker’s Stance and Signet of Rage and just run. When they can’t be slowed down and they move faster than you do, not that tough to get away.

So they’re using an elite (60-48secs CD) and a utility (60 secs CD) just to escape from a fight?
And I don’t think there is a single dps build that doesn’t have at least a leap/gap closer or a ranged weapon in pvp.

I wouldn’t go acting like using Signet of Rage to escape is a big deal. Most Warriors use it on-cooldown anyway.

And sure, I have ranged weapons. But I’m also working to secure an objective. Chasing is counterproductive unless I know where all of his teammates are..

In my experience, any that decide to use Berserker’s Stance and Signet of Rage and just run. When they can’t be slowed down and they move faster than you do, not that tough to get away.

Flitzie.6082:

Personally, I’ll be happy that I can’t use Eviscerate as a travel aid anymore.

depends…
has it been confirmed that you loose all adrenaline the second you activate the skill or at the moment it ends? Because if the second is the case we can still use earthshaker, evis etc for movement.

Edit:
I sure hope we can cancel bursts without loosing adren. 50% of my earthshakers are attempts to catch up to my enemies. If they have the awareness to dodge it in time I’d like to be able to cancel my ES aswell without loosing adren. Otherwise it’d be kittened.

My guess is that adrenaline gets spent when the skill completes. That’s the way it works now (when it hits) and allows burst skills to benefit from Berserker’s Power and Heightened Focus. This also means that if your burst skills get interrupted, you shouldn’t lose adrenaline.

Of course, I may be wrong, but it’s the most logical path.

hihey.1075:

Why are people complaning about adding skill into the Warrior profession? :/

My guess? Some of them lack it themselves and were relying on the crutch to feel like they were good.

This isn’t the case for all of those complaining, but I can guarantee it applies to a good portion. The really skilled Warriors will barely notice a difference.

Personally, I’ll be happy that I can’t use Eviscerate as a travel aid anymore.

killahmayne.9518:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

killahmayne.9518:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

New Arcing Slice can deal ~86% of the damage of a full channel Hundred Blades in one hit, and also does it in an AoE around you. That’s a really hefty hit.

The damage nerf of 40% of one (non-final) hit on Hundred Blades and a 5% hit on whirlwind Attack are probably entirely justified.

That is a common misconception. You can see clearly on the tooltip that Arcing Slice has a base damage of 2000 damage on the tooltip while hundred blades has a 3,500 plus an 800-900 final hit on the tooltip. So already there the numbers do not add up.

And in that video only 4 of the hundred blade hits crit.

“Can deal,” not “deals”. Because of the lower chance for 100B to be all crits, Arcing Slice will be more reliable under 50% health.

@Juba: the total damage nerf is 40% of one of the first 8 strikes (5*8=40). That’s actually 4% of the total damage of the skill.

“Can deal” is just talking very vaguely and doesn’t mean anything at all in relation to anything. All my hundred blade attacks can be non-crits and then I crit a hammer auto attack at the end of chain for almost the same amount. Doesn’t necessarily mean it is strong. My arcing slice could be a non-crit and deal only 15 percent of hundred blades.

I was also addressing people in general who think that this skill is nearly as strong as a decent fully channeled HB. Which it clearly isn’t.

The video showed a likely circumstance with approximately a 50% crit rate (of 10 total strikes, 5 crit). This really isn’t farfetched at all to expect the damage to be around 80% of a full 100B when hitting a low health target.

Arcades.4689:

RyuDragnier.9476:

Have you ever seen a necro escape from any battle successfully?

Have you ever seen a warrior escape a battle successfully in pvp?

All the freaking time. It may not be the best choice, given the Conquest game mode, but it’s definitely an option for them. Not so much on necros.

That said “escaping a battle” may just mean that they actually move on to contest a different point or objective (like, say, Tranquility on Temple of the Silent Storm: well worth abandoning a point to secure it.)

I’d rather being able to stomp/res in all transformations, not just Death Shroud. Moa could conceivably be excluded, though.

Spiteful Marks needs a total overhaul. As long as it’s % damage bonus to marks, it will never be good because the damage on all of them (but Putrid Mark) is so low.

Arcades.4689:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Because they fulfill completely different purposes, so they cannot be compared. When Adrenaline makes up near the entirety of Warrior defense, then you will have a point.

Necromancers were also designed as the “attrition” profession. While in-combat, they’re actually terrible at it, a necro becomes harder and harder to stop the more fights he’s won (to a cap, naturally).

Except that adrenaline makes up the entirety of warrior’s condition removal, and most of warrior’s damage.

I’m not saying DS should decay as fast as adrenaline, but if adrenaline got nerfed like that, then DS shoul decay, even slowly.

Hardly. Cleansing ire is just the one bit of condition removal most Warriors take. They have a lot more options, some of which are very effective. Also, it only makes up their “burst” damage, not the majority. Consider that between every Eviscerate, the axe auto does at least double the damage (frequently more).

There is no reason for Death Shroud to decay out of combat because it fulfills an entirely different purpose and design than Adrenaline. It also decays whenever it is actually used, while Warriors can get several benefits for just keeping it high and never using it. Necros have one minor trait that gives them a benefit from life force while not using it, and it’s a pretty small benefit at that.

Charlie.1726:

Completely unnecessary nerfs to a class that is already rather weak at high skill levels.

Which is why a lot of the top teams have been running double-warrior comps.

Arcades.4689:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Adrenaline decay rate isn’t changing. When it starts to decay is.

By looking at the video, it seems to decay faster than usual.

It doesn’t happen for death shroud because death shroud has never decayed unless you were using it (in which case, it always decays). Adrenaline has always decayed, it just took forever for it to start doing so.

I know how that shroud works. I don’t understand why it doesn’t decay while the necro is out of combat (not even slowly, like 2% a second) since, just like adrenaline, is a bar that fills while attacking.

Because they fulfill completely different purposes, so they cannot be compared. When Adrenaline makes up near the entirety of Warrior defense, then you will have a point.

Necromancers were also designed as the “attrition” profession. While in-combat, they’re actually terrible at it, a necro becomes harder and harder to stop the more fights he’s won (to a cap, naturally).

Arcades.4689:

Rush didn’t get fixed (I don’t care about the distance, make it 900 for all I care, just let me hit something with it!)
100b still useless in pvp, even more with a 5% damage decrease (A 5% nerf to damage is meaningless, and this skill is already useless in pvp… )
Buff to rifle and arcing slice (finally!)
Nerf to adrenaline (so every warrior will be using longbow. Good job, so much for build diversity)

And adrenaline decays at superspeed as soon as you leave combat. I wonder why that doesn’t happen for death shroud.

Adrenaline decay rate isn’t changing. When it starts to decay is.

It doesn’t happen for death shroud because death shroud has never decayed unless you were using it (in which case, it always decays). Adrenaline has always decayed, it just took forever for it to start doing so.

Dirame.8521:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

or Mesmers had a 3-clone skill.

But… mesmers have a 2-clone skill though

True, but it doesn’t quite compare to Warriors having 3 skills which can all fill adrenaline to max (Healing Surge, Signet of Fury, Berserker’s Stance)

killahmayne.9518:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

New Arcing Slice can deal ~86% of the damage of a full channel Hundred Blades in one hit, and also does it in an AoE around you. That’s a really hefty hit.

The damage nerf of 40% of one (non-final) hit on Hundred Blades and a 5% hit on whirlwind Attack are probably entirely justified.

That is a common misconception. You can see clearly on the tooltip that Arcing Slice has a base damage of 2000 damage on the tooltip while hundred blades has a 3,500 plus an 800-900 final hit on the tooltip. So already there the numbers do not add up.

And in that video only 4 of the hundred blade hits crit.

“Can deal,” not “deals”. Because of the lower chance for 100B to be all crits, Arcing Slice will be more reliable under 50% health.

@Juba: the total damage nerf is 40% of one of the first 8 strikes (5*8=40). That’s actually 4% of the total damage of the skill.

Loading.4503:

Am I missing something here or….

Don’t u automatically regen hp when ooc anyways so what’s the point if using a heal?

I don’t get it either. You can still pop it for the adrenaline and immedietly burst at max power.

How is the adrenaline gain rate slowing down with Signet of Rage generating it 50% faster and some attack speeds getting buffed (with no nerfs on that front)? However long it takes now to generate 3 bars of adrenaline, it will take just as long or less time after these changes hit.

Consider how long it takes to build up stage 3 Combustive shot. You should be pretty familiar with the timing, and that works nicely with showing how always losing adrenaline on your burst skill (whether or not you hit something) actually is.

Thaelias.7432:

Additional cleanses are already the norm. Most warrior builds use Berserker Stance, Signet of Stamina, and Balanced Stance. The signet can be popped for a one time cleanse, zerker stance once for delayed condi pressure, and then cleansing ire for sustain.

With all those tools warriors can still easily fall to condi pressure. It’s a legitimate worry that burst skills will be wasted. Most of warrior burst is literally burst skills. If adrenaline generation is curbed and misses negate it all then you will see a large drop in both warrior damage and increased susceptibility to condi pressure.

It’s already the case that axe warriors bait out dodges before committing to eviscerate. But, if you add in blind spam into the picture then it could look pretty bad for the slow large effect burst skills and their associated specs.

I keep running into triple-stance warriors, but I guess I just don’t play enough PvP

In any case, average adrenaline gain is actually going up a bit due to Signet of Rage’s changes and no nerfs on the attack speed front (faster mace auto and whirling axe being more frequent are good for adrenaline gain too). The Beserker Stance hurts, but it really was too much. Just think if necros had a skill that instantly refilled their life force (Locust Swarm can completely refill life force on its own, but it requires 5 opponents in melee range for 10 seconds to do so) or Mesmers had a 3-clone skill.

Burst skills aren’t going to be any tougher to land than they are now, there’s just going to be some risk involved to missing them.

It does look to decay a little too fast out of combat, however. Half the shown speed would probably be better.

fellyn.5083:

No other class has such harsh penalties attached to the use of their class mechanic.

Dodge a mesmer shatter and not only have they wasted a cooldown, they also have to build up their illusion count again before having access to 4 skills. Two of which every Mesmer build finds useful.

Khenzy.9348:

Burst skills such as Eviscerate, Kill Shot or Skull Crack will never be on a meta build with these changes. A random blind, block or dodge will negate the burst skill effect, put it on CD, lose the Adrenal Health trait effect and negate any condition cleansing with CI, way too much punishment imo.

Warriors are going to be condi food now just like when they were trash tier.

Every Warrior uses Longbow not becouse it makes Warriors immune to conditions, but becouse it’s madatory to withstand condi preassure at all.

So…bring additional cleanses? My god, it might mean you don’t run triple-stance anymore and have to make choices on your defense.

Hotfixing is reserved for things that are actually breaking the game’s functioning. Overpowered stuff is not hotfix material.

Certain siege weapon skills making people invulnerable breaks the game’s functioning. Mesmer paratroopers breaks the game’s functioning. Event chains not resetting breaks the game’s functioning.

Warriors being OP? Well, it’s been over a year, so clearly, that does not break the game’s functioning.

Reason why hotfixes are reserved for literally game-breaking issues is because those immedietly negatively affect play and have a very clear resolution. Balance changes require extra thought and time to figure out what the ideal change is.

For example, it’s easy to say that Healing Signet was healing for too much (some say it still is, but that’s irrelevant). Great, so it needs reducing. How much of a reduction? That takes a lot of time and tweaking to decide. Not hotfix material.

fellyn.5083:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

The Adrenaline change needed to happen. Adrenaline reliance is supposed to be a weakness of the Warrior profession (as stated by ANet themselves), but right now, you literally cannot waste it. Resource management as a weakness only is meaningful if the resource can be used poorly. Adrenaline cannot be used poorly right now.

This change will separate the great Warriors from those FotM Warriors, but more importantly, will introduce meaningful weaknesses to the profession instead of “Use F1: did you hit? If yes, awesome! If no, well, no biggie, you still get bonus health regen/crit chance/damage and can even try again immedietly if you want on your other weapon.” Now adrenaline will have to be carefully managed because if you use it wrong, you are in trouble.

That said, it also opens the door to other buffs that currently would be broken.

So this is a crutch that only 1 specific class has to worry about? Seems fair.

One of the changes by themselves would have been okay. But all of them together is a massive nerf.

And if as you said it leaves the door open to other buffs then the changes should be delayed until they’re all in at the same time.

Necros and Mesmers are the other resource management classes, and if they blow their life force/illusions poorly, they suffer HARD. All this is doing is bringing Warriors in line.

As for why not delay until the buffs are ready? Two reasons.

1. They don’t know exactly how this change will impact the game. Any buffs they implemented may end up being far too powerful because the actual impact of the adrenaline change was much lower than was predicted (both by ANet and players).

2. This is ANet we’re talking about. Remember that Ferocity was a step toward phasing out the Zerker meta in PvE (and nothing has followed that up yet).

New Arcing Slice can deal ~86% of the damage of a full channel Hundred Blades in one hit, and also does it in an AoE around you. That’s a really hefty hit.

The damage nerf of 40% of one (non-final) hit on Hundred Blades and a 5% hit on whirlwind Attack are probably entirely justified.

Sixpool.9421:

They aren’t as creative as they think they are. Kinda obvious copy of WoW, not to mention a kitten change.

Actually, this is closer to how Adrenaline worked in GW1. Adrenaline didn’t last long after you stopped building it. Also, if you used an adrenaline skill and missed/got interrupted/blocked, you still spent the adrenaline.

Caedmon.6798:

Tadsoul.6951:

it sounds like you will just need to use more cc skills to make sure your not wasting your burst skills and run less stances and maybe use other options to clear conditions

more importantly the change to the banner #4 that remove cripple and chill should it not also remove immobilize. It kinda pointless to remove chill and cripple if your immobilized

the changes to rampage …
the condition reduction is more or less fine just that its almost making the skill have no counterplay
the reduced damage however is it really necessary they already get increased toughness and increased health. large concern here because it essentially could make a zerker warrior a tanky warrior for 20 second with good movement speed
I think the rampage skill is fine (maybe it isn’t I don’t know) but won’t be use until it is overpowered

Well said,and imo they would have needed to increase the general dmg output from rampager form.Lich form atm is 3 – 5k each hit with a 30 sec stabi uptime.When a warrior and a nec would 1vs1 and both pop their elite at the same time..Rampager Vs Lich..Who would win? I think the answer is quite kitten obvious.Every skill from rampager is Useless unless youre spamming 1 Vs a Lichform.And then you have the issue of who has more dmg output ? It clearly still is the necro,and that just..does not make any sense at all.

While true, Lich Form also can’t take anywhere near the punishment that Juggernaut can and has nothing close to the same amount of CC.

Yes, Lich vs. Juggernaut fights are in the Necro’s favor, but the elites are intended to do two different things.

The Adrenaline change needed to happen. Adrenaline reliance is supposed to be a weakness of the Warrior profession (as stated by ANet themselves), but right now, you literally cannot waste it. Resource management as a weakness only is meaningful if the resource can be used poorly. Adrenaline cannot be used poorly right now.

This change will separate the great Warriors from those FotM Warriors, but more importantly, will introduce meaningful weaknesses to the profession instead of “Use F1: did you hit? If yes, awesome! If no, well, no biggie, you still get bonus health regen/crit chance/damage and can even try again immedietly if you want on your other weapon.” Now adrenaline will have to be carefully managed because if you use it wrong, you are in trouble.

That said, it also opens the door to other buffs that currently would be broken.

roamzero.9486:

Geiir.7603:

They ruined choking gas from stealth :/ oh well, guess it is unfair to stack damage while in stealth, so that is sort of ok.

Tell that to Mesmers that stay in stealth while their Phantams/Clones do their work :p

You can do the same with Ambush Trap and Thieves Guild or minion-summoning runes * coughpiratecough *.

Lightsbane.9012:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Lightsbane.9012:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

It was hinted at by Karl in the chat, but don’t bet on it.

bet on it for thieves though.

Considering it was explicitly announced for thieves, that’s a sucker bet.

i saw that, it’s just pretty insulting that something with the exact same AA animation will get cleave and we won’t. maybe it’s because of all our l33t power aoes.

We don’t know if we will or not. I was just saying that it’s explicit for thieves.

If we do get dagger cleave, expect the life force gain to not proc per-hit and rather once per skill use. It really should proc per-hit, because if we have two enemies, we need more life force.

No free cleansing. Karl clarified in chat that Cleansing Ire will not proc on a miss. Combustive Shot’s interaction was not mentioned.

Khenzy.9348:

We need to know if Cleansing Ire procs from a missed burst skill or not, or if its interaction with Combustive shots remains the same…

If it doesn’t proc on any missed burst skill, get ready PvP folks, it’s a massive nerf.

It doesn’t proc on a missed burst skill. Karl clarified that in the chat.

He did not, however, say if Combustive Shot’s interaction would change at all.

Lightsbane.9012:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

It was hinted at by Karl in the chat, but don’t bet on it.

bet on it for thieves though.

Considering it was explicitly announced for thieves, that’s a sucker bet.

alchemyst.2165:

If you’re crying because you think your precious S/D is going to be completely broken or you won’t be able to D/P spam stealth any more then theres something wrong with you.

Sorry, I got a little ranty

What’s funny is that D/P stealth spam is completely untouched. The smoke field is exactly the same as it was before.