Guild Wars 2

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Try not to put all the blames for bad Thief profession on one designer because it is a team effort when it comes to balancing it. As far as we know, Karl might have a lot good ideas for Thief that other designer like Robert and Roy just shut down — thus it looks like their professions look a lot better.

Again, this is just a speculation but I won’t be like one of you guys who blames a particular designer.

However, all the blame will always fall on the head of the balance team — that is his responsibility.

I don’t mean to, and I couldn’t say if Karl’s to blame. but whatever’s happening, there’s a disparity that needs addressed. either a specific dev’s messed up, or the team as a whole has, but there needs to be some consistency.

Kocoff.7582:

I truly wish Robert Gee would take care of us, but I don’t think ONE dev takes care of the whole profession. They must work together and give each feedback because… balance.

Is Karl the one who pulled a stunt on Acrobatics? If so… meh. If not… meh.
What really matters now is that throughout BWE, they will be given the chance to rework the Thief. This is the most important point. I mean they have to make the elite Spec very appealing for the noobs.

They are putting all their marketing investment on drawing new GW2 players for HoT. So with that logic, it is safe to say that have no choice but to fix things. pretty much fix everything. Pretty sure they don’t want new players to read the kitten we are going through right now. That’s just bad looks.

So to be honest Karl or not, Gee or not. I remain positive to the fact that Anet has a serious stake at tidying up the huge mess we are in before the honored new guests arrive. Trust Anet’s will to make a profit, and not the devs.

I’d like to think that, and I’ve heard some devs suggest similarly – but you can’t deny that classes and specs looked after by Gee and Roy have been better thought out, better made, and better maintained that those done by karl. (Rev/Reaper/Chrono work thematically, mechanically and have had great dev interaction – less so on DH/Tempest)

AikijinX.6258:

Gray.9041:

AikijinX.6258:

Our prayers have been answered.

/Amen

wait for wednesday – we need to know if we’ve been blessed or cursed.

Anet knows they’re standing on a thin line with the Thief community, so they already know that if they don’t make this other option (elite spec) viable then a majority of thief population will either quit or switch toons, which is not what they need for their game.

if they know that, why haven’t they fixed base thief yet?

MiniEquine.6014:

Black Box.9312:

Expect about the quality of traits you’ll find in Tempest or Dragonhunter. Or lack of quality, rather.

You are truly the most negative person here (and on every single thread, mind you). Could the same be said about what they did with the Reaper, Chronomancer, Herald, and Berserker? What indication do you actually have that the traits will be bad when they are quite good on at least 4 of the revealed E.specs and at least decent on DH.

I try to be positive, but the last 4 E-specs weren’t Karl.

Ardid.7203:

Sad staff is confirmed. But after the Tempest disssapointment it was easy to spect Anet giving Thief yet another melee style. I hope is actually a good one, truly different from the actual base, and not only a new set of gimmicks to do exactly the same…

Wich could be the name of this new Elite Spec?

The Ninja? The Distractor? The Dragon Poker?

assuming datamine is wrong, Deceiver makes sense.

Sicarius.4639:

Sicarius.4639:

I’d go as far as to say you’re next (after this warrior reveal). If this is just a coincidence or not https://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/professions/ you’re next in line, then Engi. The only one who was skipped out most likely due to “not being ready” is yup… Ranger.

Nailed it.

they might not be releasing according to the profession page at all – it could be a coincidence.

that said, it might be that they are following that order. who knows.

Kocoff.7582:

Endlos.4852:

Kocoff.7582:

All of you switching chars cause Thief is getting Staff;
All of you who will stop playing because Thief is getting Staff;

GOOD RIDDANCE, I tell you. For it shows how questionable your loyalty to the profession was in the first place. You didn’t even see traits or weapon skills but act like you are agonizing in injustice and oozing of some imaginary unsatisfactory performance by Anet.

I’m tentatively excited for staff, depending on what they do with it. If it can differentiate itself from the glut of playstyles already offered in melee and be mathematically viable to make it an attractive option, then I’m on-board.

That being said, I don’t main thief, and a staff won’t suddenly make me main thief. I won’t main a profession that doesn’t have a good ranged option/backup available. Shortbow is decent but more used for the utility (dem teleports) than single-target throughput, and Pistol/Pistol is a joke.

Will staff be fun to screw around with and add to an already well-established close-range playstyle? Hopefully. Will it truly enhance the class or allow it to break into a new area or function like a rifle, or heck, even functional pistol/pistol could have? Incredibly doubtful.

You put up some good questions mate. Idk which profession you main but it doesn’t really matter. I don’t even expect Staff to get us into a new era like you said simply because before getting to the new era, you need to make sure everything is fixed. So far, that is not the case.

My expectations, I believe, are reasonable : I just want traits to be fixed, top notch repairs, so that we can get back to that diversity we used to love so much. Daredevil is fulfilling that role in some way, but repairing comes first. So that when next Expansion comes, we will welcome Rifle with open arms.

while I agree with all these sentiments, it this the right thread for them?

beastahead.9732:

I don’t know guys. When I got the this freaking game I wanted to be a god kitten thief with god kitten dual pistols pew-pewing people around with Ricochet. This is the only reason I got this game… the freaking dual pistol pew pew video sold me the game. Now we get a stupid staff(Congrats to all happy people by the way). Unless they return ricochet and fix dual pistols for me this will be the last patch. Have over 1500 hours on thief. Will not be playing another class.

Once again – congrats to everyone happy about the staff.

Staff on thief isn’t inherently a bad thing – it depends on the skills/mechanics/traits.

but I agree that pistols need fixing – if not completely redoing

Rauderi.8706:

With a stick!
Bwahahaha. XD

I wonder if more people will be upset over thief-stick than Dargonhurrdurr.

Though now I’m curious what the spec will be, since Sniper is off the table.

to be honest, it was pretty apparent that we were getting staff for a while. and staff’s not a bad weapon – if they do the skills/traits/mechanic right, it could be incredible.

really what matters is the details, which we’ll be seeing later this week

(plus, while dragonhunter didn’t make sense with guardian mechanically or thematically, staff thief certainly makes sense thematically)

given the tagline this week, perhaps Deceiver would be a fitting name?

AikijinX.6258:

Our prayers have been answered.

/Amen

wait for wednesday – we need to know if we’ve been blessed or cursed.

Zero Day.2594:

Wait, we do have a way to apply burning…?

not really, but that doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be in the poll. it’s a good way to see if people are happy without burning or want access to burning (anyone who says less however, is a kitten ed fool.)

the question about the steal mechanic could take more than 1 answer.

(for example, I think the stolen items are too random, and use it for either shadowstep or traits, depending on the situation. – that’s 3 options but I can only pick 1)

also, asking about our outlook on thief as a class is a bit vague:

I think it’s a good theme,
I think it’s good conceptually
I think it’s bad mechanically
I think the details (specific numbers on skills etc) are bad
I think the dev attention and treatment of the class is bad

it’s hard to put the above on a 1-5 scale.

also, confusion isn’t on the list of conditions

other than that, great poll, very in-depth, and probably more details than I could think of.

AikijinX.6258:

Sagat.3285:

AikijinX.6258:

Sagat.3285:

Cynz.9437:

oh btw from what i understand the guy responsible for thief spec was also responsible for tempest and dragonhunter…. you can imagine how crappy thief spec will be

Based on their forums the ignored feedback will be the worst part or maybe it’s because he’s on vacation or something.

Vacation. Is that a surprise to anyone? How long do you estimate this one? Sorry im digressing.

I have no idea it’s a different dev that gave out the DH and tempest changes so at least we know Karl is not in the building and thief elite spec is not ready yet. I expect us to go before ranger who are obviously last for unfortunately obvious reasons hopefully he’s back before they announce engi.

Well lets all get our hopes up for tomorrow’s reveal!

Only to be let down because all these Thief threads to try to get a dev to communicate with us is annoying them, thus bumping engi or ranger next in the rotation for reveals.

/gg

assuming we get a reveal tomorrow.

just because it’s long overdue doesn’t mean it’ll be out.

Fox.3469:

Gray.9041:

do a little PvP, get daily logins – 60-80 tomes of knowledge won’t be that hard to get.

Did you even read my post? I just said i don’t want to do that. I don’t want to insta lvl it, by crafting or any means. I want to play the personal story, play the living world season 2, and then go to the jungle. I do not want to be forced to rush to 80 and have a character with almost no waypoints in the normal world.

my bad, missed that. thought you just said you didn’t want to craft level.

short answer is no. they won’t release it early for so many reasons, and this is just the price you pay.

do a little PvP, get daily logins – 60-80 tomes of knowledge won’t be that hard to get.

suggestion – try posting this elsewhere (the reddit for example) to get more responses.

taunt’s a big one too. it can be just as bad (make you walk out of SR, make you attack while stealthed)

Jana.6831:

Zero Day.2594:

Is that a challenge to the devs?

I expect them to win this.

doesn’t matter who wins – we’ll lose.

as mentioned above, only an issue if you buy on the last 3 days of the sale.

Kocoff.7582:

Yeah Berserker has this trait man. I was always thinking about that too. traits to escape death. It is a lot more suitable for the Thief than the berserker in my opinion. but I guess the thrill of adrenaline could also help you completely negate pain.

They already have Endure Pain though.. That’s pretty solid death cheating mechanism to me.

OH WELL. We deal with things that’s what we do.

endure pain and defiant stance, which not only negates damage but also turns it into healing (it’s pretty skill based though, the timing’s important)

roamzero.9486:

Have you seen the Berserker notes? Warrior is going to get a trait that does almost exactly that, it might not even have an ICD if the tooltip screenshot is an indication.

wait what?! how does warrior possibly warrant that?

Aye.8392:

Challenging group content: I hope for Fractal rework with new fractals announced and new dungeons. Fractals would qualify for the “core game” content.

they already announced a bunch of fractal changes, and said that the fractals weren’t the challenging group content (they did say that fractals were the end-game 5-person bit)

Danikat.8537:

Last time they had Colin and Mike making an announcement at a convention and made a big deal of it like this they were announcing the expansion. My guess is they’ll be announcing the release date and probably the ‘challenging group content’.

ham.8209:

Test.8734:

Brother Dulfite.5793:

When I see the word announcement, I think of things that we don’t already know about (another words, not specializations).

I’m curious what everyone thinks these announcements will be?

GW2 will now become Pay to Play! Prepare to wonder and marvel at the infinite possibilities that a monthly fee will add to the world of Tyria!

Honestly, though, are you really going to get hyped? Even if ArenaNet weren’t famous for overpromising and underdelivering, that’s obviously marketing speech. Whatever those “big announcements” are, if you really expect anything good at all you will be massively disappointed.

very well said and not only that but i think GW2 will now become Pay to Play! just look how the gem store is . if that ant pay to play i will buy a Daniel Webster cigar and give ever one a free good cigar

Pay-to-play is meant a lot more literally than that. It actually refers to subscription games where you have to pay a fixed amount per month simply to log in to the game, and you don’t get anything in return for it except access to the game you’ve already bought.

When GW2 starts telling you to buy $10 of gems a month simply to get past the launcher, and then those gems are removed from your account when you log in so you can’t spend them on items , then the gem store will be pay-to-play.

interesting as this is, it’s kinds gone off track a little, maybe make a separate thread?

Amante.8109:

Like most in this forum, I’m not concerned with “doing fine” in a single preordained role. GW2 is ostensibly designed around player choice; I’d rather have more than one option on how to play my Thief (e.g., the tank, support, and/or condi builds that every other profession has).

I can’t see thief ever really being a tank, but Condition and support we should definitely have.

Overworld.9613:

Can I point out that our core specialisations are Shadow Arts, Critical Strikes, Acrobatics, Deadly Arts and Trickery. None of which are a title like many of us seem to be treating Daredevil as. The name of the trait lines (or specialisations as they’ve come to be known) were supposed to be descriptors of the groups of traits, Engineer has Tools as a trait line, does taking that trait line make the player a Tool? Yes, but it’s the exception.

• Druid
• Reaper
• Chronomancer
• Dragonhunter
• Tempest*
• Herald
• Berserker

all – with the possibly exception of tempest – are titles. it’s not about other specs.

Overworld.9613:

Going by the thread title we don’t have to call it that, but if the datamining did hit paydirt then someone will

we’re all calling it daredevil because “Thief Elite Specialisation” is much longer to type. tbh, any placeholder will do.

(that said, I’m hoping it is a placeholder)

sebradle.7034:

yolo swaggins.2570:

The F1 skill will be changed to YOLO!

So if we yolo what do we do man.

going by thief’s current state… die.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

one-hand or two-hand weapons will have to balance the same number of skills — 5.

one-handed:
3 dual wield skills (skill #3 from main-hand weapons)
2 off-hand skills

two-handed:
5 skills

I don’t see the problem.

they also have to make sure that a skill on the 1-handed weapons isn’t too weak or too strong when combined with other 1-handers. what works decently on Sword/Focus might be useless/OP on pistol/focus

I think it’d be interesting to see a complete overhaul, but who knows.

Overworld.9613:

Due to the devs having only all of their time set aside to work on more Thief content [/sarcasm] Our new weapon will likely only be one we can wield in a single hand (main or off-hand), that way they only need to make ~5 weapon skills for it.

except…

Main hand:

• 1 skill
• 2 skill
• 3 no-offhand skill
• 3 with pistol skill
• 3 with dagger skill
  (5 skills)

Off hand:

• 4 skill
• 5 skill
• 3 with sword skill
• 3 with dagger skill
• 3 with pistol skill
  (5 skills)

2-hand:

• 1 skill
• 2 skill
• 3 skill
• 4 skill
• 5 skill
  (5 skills)

and on top of this, main and off-hand weapons would need balanced with the other weapons’ skills in mind, while a 2-handed weapon only needs balanced with itself.

so it’d be less work to do a 2-handed weapon than a 1-handed weapon…

Black Box.9312:

I feel bad for you guys. The Karl McLain bulldozer has already smashed Guardian and Ele players into the ground. You’re next.

nah, it’s fine. we’ll just block it, uh, use an invulnerability.

hmm… I know! active dodging, acrobatics style!

well skritt…

narwhalsbend.7059:

Brother Dulfite.5793:

…somehow working in that Abaddon is behind the release of the Elder Dragons and that Abaddon secretly possessed Kormir and is only appearing like Kormir just to convince the other gods that he is truly dead.

That would be terrible writing, but I could see them doing that after all this Scarlet stuff.

Really though, we didn’t just “kill” Abaddon, Kormir completely consumed his power. He is no more.
If any gods were looking to get back into the picture now that the main ones are hiding, it would be Menzies or Dhuum.

or… maybe instead of fighting against a god, we fight for a god (or both)

I can see grenth getting bored and deciding to do something.

this entire supposition seems based on a bunch of assumptions which are shaky at best

aspirine.6852:

Daredevil is a staff user isnt he?

it’s assumed so, given a number of files datamined by That_Shaman. that said, despite what other people say, I don’t see any similarities between the old datamined image and the newly datamined headgear. (not that there needs to be)

TheMurkMuffin.8213:

Can someone tell/show me where it was CONFIRMED that the elite specialization is called Dare Devil?

it’s not been officially confirmed, but That_Shaman’s info is usually pretty solid.

the speculation on physicals isn’t from That_Shaman however, so it’s not as reliable.

Kocoff.7582:

Daredevil fits perfectly. It’s a well thought out name, and frankly, I don’t see the fuss with name they are better than typical name such as “Berserker” , “Druid”. “Forge” is very original, So is “Tempest”, but let’s get down to the dictionary. the New Oxford Dictionary:

Thief : a person who steals another person’s property, especially by stealth and without using force or violence.

The Thief in GW2 does exactly what the dictionary says. Not using excessing force or violence, but rather excessing stealth.

Daredevil : a reckless person who enjoys doing dangerous things.

If we follow the same logic, the Daredevil is only the natural succession of the Thief. Except this time, the Thief turns increasingly reckless and actually enjoys doing crazy things.

Now what those crazy things are, we leave it to Arenanet to decide. Nevertheless the wording is undeniably accurate and well thought out.

Better than Assassin, or Rogue. Also stop talking about a American superhero character who shares the same name… Not everybody is into superheros and it doesn’t mean anything if they share the name…

fair enough, though I’d personally prefer a more collected thief – the kind who thinks everything through, rather than the reckless kind.

Azure Prower.8701:

Shiro Revenant sounds like every thing Thief should be.

especially since the fixes Roy made post-bwe

Amineo.8951:

Bloodyx.5946:

Gray.9041:

uglydan.1638:

Little tid bit of info: the same dev that is responsible for Thief is also responsible for the Ele. There’s a reason why two professions hate their elite spec. Other professions are getting stuff they like, and are seeing changes done based on their feedback.

Guaranteed if Thief is playable during a BWE that any feedback we give will go unheeded. GUARANTEED.

no.

nonono.

say it isn’t so. say it’s a lie.

Tempest was bad, but Ele was already broken.

but thief? we can’t handle that kind of disappointment…

seriously? the dev doing ele does thief?

dear lord… I going to irrationally choose not to believe you because it makes me feel better

He did Dragon Hunter and Tempest which IMO are the worst Elite specs for now (especially DH, holy kitten it’s bad).

really? grenth kitten it!

well, there goes half my hype…

uglydan.1638:

Little tid bit of info: the same dev that is responsible for Thief is also responsible for the Ele. There’s a reason why two professions hate their elite spec. Other professions are getting stuff they like, and are seeing changes done based on their feedback.

Guaranteed if Thief is playable during a BWE that any feedback we give will go unheeded. GUARANTEED.

no.

nonono.

say it isn’t so. say it’s a lie.

Tempest was bad, but Ele was already broken.

but thief? we can’t handle that kind of disappointment…

tobascodagama.2961:

Sagat.3285:

Tabootrinket.2631:

With the recent berserker reveal, it’s pretty much confirmed that this trait is for the berserk trait line.

“Like all other elite specializations, the Berserker will come complete with a full line of traits. While we were not told any of the specifics, the traits fall into three categories to buff different aspects of the berserker. The first is focused on brawling by providing benefits for going berserk and to help gather up enemies.”

http://www.zam.com/story.html?story=36349

Unless the trait is wrongly worded Berserker doesn’t use physical skills they use rage skills so thief still could get it. I hope it’s wrongly worded.

The preview article directly compares Rage skills to Physical skills, which makes matters even more confusing. Could Rage skills end up counting as Physical skills or something weird like that?

The Brawler tag points to Berzerker, but the Endurance gain is a very Thiefy thing. At the moment, I suspect that it is indeed a Thief trait, that Dare Devils are getting Physical skills, and the name of the trait on the data-mined tooltip is wrong.

Anet should drop a blogpost… tomorrow? friday? between that and the PoI, we should see if it’s a Berserker trait or not.

and if not, then it’s either thief or fake.

ODB.6891:

Derigar.7810:

Where are the new Profession icons you promised us when changing to an Elite Specialisation? This was honestly a big thing I was looking forward too… It also makes sense in a PvP perspective to know what elite spec your opponent has.

They backed off of that whole concept pretty quickly over casual forum crying, due to people not wanting to give up any utilities/skills from the base class. I was also looking forward to them being nearly separate professions. The current implementation is pretty good though…close enough to what they originally advertised. Its not currently enough to warrant a new profession icon though…especially since you can just swap a trait line and be right back to where you started.

I heard they’re still doing them, they just weren’t ready for the last bwe?

well, as I’ve seen mentioned elsewhere – with the pact broken by mordremoth, it’s not impossible that we’ll see them revert back into the orders.

NinjaEd.3946:

Anyone forget that thief dies from “physical” encounters most of the time? In what world would you want to be up front with your thief using utilities like this?

Pretty sure the name of the trait suggests warrior anyways but people already had this discussion. Endurance gain on skill/action isn’t a thief only thing :/

it’s entirely possible that it’s a warrior trait. it’s also the case that – in my experience – elite specs don’t add traits centered around core skills. that being said, all we have is an image and the dataminer’s word that it’s from thief. either could easily be fake.

Snow.2048:

And people who think greatswords look neat would like new necro, guardians, warriors, rangers and mesmers.

An elementalists active play style relies on very different mechanics than the mesmer, mesmer is a lot closer to thief due to relying on evades and stealth. Elementalist uses movement and heals. (edit: yes this is stupidly simplified from the actual situation, and for that I am sorry)

And still, the whole evolve sideways thing means (if it actually hits that head on) that in theory any of the classes might end up being your new favourite combination of abilities, armor really is irrelevent.

And HP is better than armor. And hp division is pretty spread out. Why not focus on HP levels for these kind of theories (maybe they did the armor because each armor class has an even division of hp, so to insure hp levels spread evenly they took armor as division) [edit: Maybe they did it based on user scores, heavies and lights used more than mediums, they come first? So we’ll drip some info for the mediums in the beginning so they don’t feel too bad. Who knows, it could just be weird that it ended up that way and have no strange plot behind it]

again, I don’t think, and never thought, that there’s any kind of plot behind it. I just would’ve preferred a different order. (gotta feel sorry for rangers, they’ve been waiting for more info on druid since day 1)

well someone who likes to tank damage passively will likely enjoy Warrior and Guardian both.

someone who likes to use a more active defence style will likely enjoy mesmer and elementalist more.

Killyox.3950:

Gray.9041:

Snow.2048:

XD OP just wants the Druidd to be posted so he can have a field day in the Ranger forums telling every new thread how ranger still sucks XD (for those who don’t know, this guy trolls the ranger forum, he is on almost every thread with a simple message said in many ways: Ranger is bad)

Probably it’ll be ranger last as we know the most of the 3 and have had some details the longest, thinking engi 2nd to last for similar reasons. Though they might put thief just to build the tension XD

I just wanted to point out that the order of release could’ve been better done. I’ve never been on the Ranger forums, and I don’t know ranger well enough to say how good or bad it is.

\
Like how ? every class you switch for another for release will have someone waiting. There is no better/worse, just different.

Revenant, as pointed out above, would have left far, far fewer people waiting.

and the three armour classes do have a reasonable amount in common, meaning each leans towards a different playstyle. as such, people of one playstyle might be interested in any member of a given armour class – a lot of people might play elementalist and mesmer, for example. these people would’ve been happy with the reveal of a single profession from that armour class, while the medium-armour playstyle has had no such reveals.

Snow.2048:

XD OP just wants the Druidd to be posted so he can have a field day in the Ranger forums telling every new thread how ranger still sucks XD (for those who don’t know, this guy trolls the ranger forum, he is on almost every thread with a simple message said in many ways: Ranger is bad)

Probably it’ll be ranger last as we know the most of the 3 and have had some details the longest, thinking engi 2nd to last for similar reasons. Though they might put thief just to build the tension XD

I just wanted to point out that the order of release could’ve been better done. I’ve never been on the Ranger forums, and I don’t know ranger well enough to say how good or bad it is.

could do. my personal issue is that even with the changes you’ve made, there’s still not a great deal of stacking.

• pistol basic does 2 bleeds for 4s, which won’t stack that high (I think 8 bleed max?)

• torment on the combo skill for 5s, but due to the relatively high initiative cost and the trouble of stabbing, shadowstepping away, and then running back again makes stacking difficult.

even with the traited poison brought up to 100%, the duration’s still not anywhere near where it needs to be to give thief the conditions needed to compete with other condition builds. as it is, none of the thief sets really allow for heavy stacking – and without burning, that really does cripple our condition potential

(and while skale venom isn’t bad, the fact is that the damaging portion can be pretty low (if they don’t move) and even then it’s the second best venom)

I just feel like thief doesn’t really have a condition set. Dagger/Dagger is power, Pistol/Pistol feels either power or utility based:

• Vital Shot is a bleed (not too stackable)
• Body Shot is a vuln (more utility than condition)
• Unload is pure damage
• Headshot is a daze – making it more utility than any specific kind of damage
• Black powder is much the same – more utility than damage.

Sword has no conditions at all, and shortbow is – as far as condition damage is concerned – a melee AoE weapon. (Choking Gas is passable. spamming detonate cluster is the only other option…)

It feels like at least one of the weapons really needs reworked to be a more condition-focused weapon. as it is now, I’m running D/D – using Death Blossom to stack bleed when I can, and then basic attack chains to provide poison (also spider and often skale venoms) which means I’m really only using heartseeker as a jump, I never use dancing dagger, and rarely have the initiative for cloak and dagger. even on the best condition setup I can find, I’m only using 40% of the weapon skills…
(also, I always thought Deadly Arts was supposed to be the condition tree, but I’m seeing raw-power builds taking it as a must. I’m just not sure where condition damage sits on the thief…)

Serious Thought.5394:

@Gray- What would you think I should change on it? I personally thought it was handy, seeing as the intended condi weapon set is pistol/dagger. Dagger/dagger is more versatile/disable. Poison reduces heal and causes weakness, weakness reduces direct damage, vulnerability increases damage. Death blossom feels like it was tacked on, it really doesn’t fit imo. I just want it to be more helpful. A dash to a target that immobilizes, which is another form of disable, or creates evasion (theme, something d/d lacks because number 3 is not supposed to be there) seems right, and the dagger trait that applies poison on hits still works (see also my change to the traits). What would you change?

I’d personally prefer a matching set for conditions, but hey ho.

honestly, none of the thief weapon sets are great for conditions. we get a fair amount of multiplier conditions (weakness, vulnerability, might) and a decent amount of control conditions (blind, immobilise, cripple), but no set gives us a viable number of damaging conditions (bleed, poison, torment, confuse) considering that we need serious stacking power on these in order to compare to burning, this feels like a flaw.

your changes are actually pretty good, but it does leave us without a fully viable condition set, and I think that’s something we could look at elsewhere.