Guild Wars 2

If there was more actual personal skill involved in the majority of wvw….you would see less people relying on the amount of people they run around with. That is a simple fact. Not my opinion.

Granted there are some situations where really talented players run with bigger zergs, VERY VERY infrequently the case.

IDarko.4709:

I’m pretty sure that most WvW guilds have a lot of players who venture in Tpvp from time to time. I know it’s the case for our guild. That said, the two PvP formats are so different from each other that it really doesn’t matter that much. Zerg busting is very different than small scale fighting.

A good Tpvp player will defy be a great roamer tho.

That because roamers and 5 manners are 2 different skill lvls of pvp…real 5 manners womp on “roamers”

Gab Superstar.4059:

Jscull.2514:

Here’s the deal, if zerging servers (servers with very little offense besides 20+) decide like they have for the past 10 months or so to only ZERG in wvw….there’s going to be alot of players just leaving this game. JUST LIKE WARHAMMER at a certain point even zergers get bored (check all the “Im a zerger and never thought id get bored but i am” threads) and end up wanting more. If there were more competitive players in this game not using the “go to s/tpvp for good more fairish fights” excuse wvw would be a hell of a lot more enjoyable because after zerg school people could graduate to “time to man up and compete with alot less reliance on others and more on my own skills”. Problem is the graduation rate is at an all-time low and the competitive players are just leaving because 70-90% of the time it is just red zergs around.

I know people have a bias about our guild because we have spoken up alot about our opinions and I am not trying to troll or cause crap, just stating from witnessing the forums and even zergers complaining their bored…..and watching wvw endlessly a map full of 3 zergs circling taking/retaking points…..its incredibly redundant. If we get more people to graduate to the “time to man up and rely more on my own ability to use my character to its fullest” stage of pvp this game will be a hell of a lot more fun.

No, people don’t dislike your guild because you speak up about your opinions.

People dislike you because target specific players, guilds and even servers and talk kitten about them to no end and act really bad in-game too by, for example, interrupting fight clubs(?).

You are at a stage where there’s really no point trying to dress the troll in nice clothes. Whatever you have to say is tainted by what you have said in the past.

Lol It doesnt matter what your opinion of our guild is, the problem this game has is not PAXA, the problem is everyone logging in and ONLY zerging for the most part.

Here’s the deal, if zerging servers (servers with very little offense besides 20+) decide like they have for the past 10 months or so to only ZERG in wvw….there’s going to be alot of players just leaving this game. JUST LIKE WARHAMMER at a certain point even zergers get bored (check all the “Im a zerger and never thought id get bored but i am” threads) and end up wanting more. If there were more competitive players in this game not using the “go to s/tpvp for good more fairish fights” excuse wvw would be a hell of a lot more enjoyable because after zerg school people could graduate to “time to man up and compete with alot less reliance on others and more on my own skills”. Problem is the graduation rate is at an all-time low and the competitive players are just leaving because 70-90% of the time it is just red zergs around.

I know people have a bias about our guild because we have spoken up alot about our opinions and I am not trying to troll or cause crap, just stating from witnessing the forums and even zergers complaining their bored…..and watching wvw endlessly a map full of 3 zergs circling taking/retaking points…..its incredibly redundant. If we get more people to graduate to the “time to man up and rely more on my own ability to use my character to its fullest” stage of pvp this game will be a hell of a lot more fun.

Lyonell.1753:

I play both S/Tpvp and WvW, problem here is, when you’re in T1 – 4 maybe even 5 servers are so big the small fights are hardly seen. This gives the impression that WvW is a Zerg fest and to a certain degree it is. In Tpvp you get the feeling that you’re skilled bla bla bla, but in reality is all about bunkering a point and coordinating the next attack/defense. In WvW you do the very same crap just in a different scale and with siege weapons and what not.

Spvp got a lot less variety of gear and stats mix also since it is a domination style game, class balance is lean towards the classes that can bunker the best or CC/support the best, thus leaving other classes in the shadows. Both take their own skill level, yet just as I can tell 7 out of 10 S/T pvp player suck at pvping, I can also say 9.5 out of 10 WvW player suck at pvping, but on the WvW side many of these players are people looking for free Exp/Karma and gold when their team is winning, thus giving the WvW players a bad name.

Dont know who you are dude, but I concur…Well said, its not a shot at anyone, it is simply the truth with the community of GW2, just not natural or experienced (for the most part) pvpers.

aathomas.4638:

Simple, make the In-Combat Speed the standard speed and get rid of the out-of-combat speed, so the only way to move faster is through swiftness and movement skills.

This will make the maps feel bigger.

This will make it so a small man has better chance of taking towers, a zerg can’t just ignore a small group and be on the other side of the map then run all the way back when the wall is at 5% because the 5 people in the tower reporting are just waiting instead of going out to fight.

This will make it so the second half of the zerg that is Out-of-Combat can’t catch up to a small roaming group just because they are stuck In-Combat.

This will make positioning of all the players in the map much more important since everyone will be moving across the map much slower.

Not bad ideas dude. Bottom line is maps should be redesigned and made bigger. fact. 20-30% of the BL map is water that no one fights in….wasted zone space. Keeps towers camps all 5 feet away from each other. ANET FIRE YOUR MAP DESIGNER! lol

Lol, all of PAXA are former 8manners…daoc’ers are praying for unchained’s 2 years to be over.

Mickey.8345:

There is definitely an imbalance with numbers, and without numbers you are just going to get steamrolled no matter how skilled your player base is. You might have some good battles but ultimately you won’t win the war because you just can’t field enough people to keep control of points you have taken. Or, hell, even break out of your spawn point for that matter.

With the lower tier servers it’s now painfully evident how imbalanced the system is.

Just gaining rating even tho you’re not accomplishing anything on the map is not fun. If I wanted to just play a numbers game I’d break out the board games and turn off the computer. I want to win a battle, kill things, and gain territory to go up in rank. Gain something tangible. Sitting at your spawn point being murdered because you’re outmanned 100v1 is not fun…even if you are gaining rank while you do it. That’s not a real testament to skill.

If there was some sort of population control so it evens out the playing field when you try to enter a BL or EB.

The cap could be based on the lowest population server on that particular map set up in mb 20 player increments or percentage based. So if the lowest # a server can field in Eb is say 70, the other 2 servers can’t field more than a low% more than that each. For the BL’s it would be based on the home servers population. So if you can only get in 30 people in your own bl then the enemy can’t have more than that, but if you go into enemy territory you’re at the mercy of their #’s. Home court advantage.

I think you would really start seeing skilled fights and not just a mindless hack and slash because the server you’re up against can field 30x your #‘s. I really don’t mind losing a fair fight, but c’mon anet, even the 300 died in the end to greater numbers.

Heaven forbid anyone try running without 20 people around them….that’s a new concept for the GW2 community. It’s shocking!

Onshidesigns.1069:

WvW is not PvP only! It’s PvP/PvE together.

Terrible that youre ok with that. Good god go back to dungeons.

Sola.7250:

I think WvW is slowing turning into PvP, which is not good!

Are you talking about hold the capture point and forget about fighting this is more important syndrome? Cuz it’s not slow, it’s already there and it’s extremely boring.

Benjamin.7893:

Jscull.2514:

The few times a guild known for tpvp or spvp has come out in wvw, our 5 man absolutely pooped on them. Bunker wars is not skill…its just who can bounce each other out of the circle more. Player vs player is open world combat….sorry but pvp arenas came after open world combat platforms.

Spvp has teams not guilds.

Lol nice microscope. Call it whatever ud like, our 5 man guild smoked them.

Anet starts losing a mass exodus of people, you really think they won’t change the Aoe cap? Lol business wasn’t your major was it?

Running in small groups 5-10 isn’t easy. It takes time; thought, and Focus. 3 things the average terrible back peddling zerger knows nothing about. Anet made this appeal to the masses folks, and the masses want to come home from work, feel like a roman or some mythical knight, and have ez mode doing it. Cha Ching goes the cash register.

The few times a guild known for tpvp or spvp has come out in wvw, our 5 man absolutely pooped on them. Bunker wars is not skill…its just who can bounce each other out of the circle more. Player vs player is open world combat….sorry but pvp arenas came after open world combat platforms.

2 things, I dont know how any of you BP or DR people have fun on your own servers with carpets laying across the maps of people.

Second, to the THUG commander, congratulations….you officially had to have 6 players come fight the two of us PAXA to get 1 kill…didnt even get both. Good work, I see why you “earned” that commander tag. Thanks for getting absolutely worked 2v2…2v3….2v4… lol

Lol I love the response “put more seige down”… Clearly you guys that say that have zero experience in open field combat, or just don’t win when you do do it.

Lol you’re suggesting radar. Daoc died because of radar. Good idea. Ask Anet what they think about radar.

Yea I agree pve sucks. I have 8% map completion. Don’t remove Zergs, remove the advantages other than being just a ton of people.

Hickeroar.9734:

Stop. Stop. STOP.

Stop trying to discourage zerging. I am SO sick of seeing these whiny threads over and over with people crying about zergs endlessly, and how they’re unfair to small groups of roamers. OF COURSE they are. That’s the POINT.

The majority of people in WvW love the zerg experience. There is NOTHING wrong with the zerging experience. Strength in numbers. It’s simple, elementary math.

If you don’t like zerging….don’t do it. Simple as that.

I personally only like to zerg when it’s in an organized guild setting, and I roam/havok the rest of the time, but zerging is a VERY IMPORTANT part of WvW for a myriad of reasons. You can roam on any class you want. You just have to build for it. I’ve done it on Ranger. I’ve done it on Ele. I’ve done it on Guardian for pete’s sake.

If ANet removed the ability to zerg from the game, WvW attendance would plummet.

If you want 1v1, go play sPvP. You get objective capturing, and small groups.

Dude you and everyone else likes Zerging because it’s comfortable. You say man we kicked their kitten in when you win, and you grab kitten “hey you guys had more than us nice flank” when you lose. Comfortable, casual environment. Well there are other people in the mmo community who are extremely bored of the current meta and want competition to increase. So you stop. You already have what you want and that’s an ez mode pvp system. We don’t want that. It’s flat out boring.

Lol at least we agree on raising the Aoe cap. That would keep me from ever having another conversation with you ever Mezo. Plz Anet just raise that crap.

mezo.9568:

Velron.3729:

Please remove the AOE cap, it definitely empowers the mindless zerg.

Yes I call it tactics to AOE choke points.

I also call it tactics to have your ORGANIZED zerg put up stability and double dodge right through it all and plow into the tower/whatever.

I agree, I think the AoE capped should be raised higher, and I would say pulling someone where you want them (choke point) is tactics. I was more appealing to the thought that “our 3 eles drop a group of 30 before they can scramble” like with stability or dodge roll is NOT tactics. If they can kill them that fast that is in now way tactics, that’s firepower. That’s blatantly dropping a nuke on North Korea saying “You cant do crap about it, good luck.”

They are saying (I believe) that those 3 should be able to wipe out 30 before they can use tactics to counter an ambush. I would say that if they are smart enough to roll out and stability up, those 3 should get their butts whooped, which is likely what is happening to them now.

Since two of my guildies have pointed out what I meant already clearly about 3 eles and 30 zergers clumped can someone else try and explain what I ALREADY CLEARLY wrote. Oozo wanna help him out here? Mezo go back and retread what I wrote oringinally and read what you just “thought” we meant. Good heavens.

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

I think it is funny that people think they know that the zerg doesn’t have skill when they really have no clue at all. Juat a bunch of assumptions based upon their ego after getting rolled by that zerg.

I also think that a lot of you people have other issues seeing as how you feel people should be punished just because they don’t have any game knowledge. Never heard of newbs before obviously.

A lot of ego stroking in here from those that think they have the 733tz skillzzzz.

Ignorant comment man. There are numerous 5 mans with video footage of 5 rickrolling your “you have no idea about us Zerg”… If there was so much unfairly unnoticed skill those videos wouldn’t exist. Not here to troll, not interested in mindless conversation. Interested in Anet waking up and making the game COMPETITIVE.

mezo.9568:

Jscull.2514:

mezo.9568:

Jscull.2514:

osif.8673:

mezo.9568:

You 5 spike a choke hold and drop your uncapped AoE. It will NOT kill them, they dodge roll out or use cool downs. They spread like bugs. Now you have 10:1 on you. You think that you can take on 10 guys yourself, with them all spread out? It only helps you in Towers and Keeps where they (temporarily) cannot get to you. Siege already does this.

You seem to be describing players that know what they are doing. Skilless players, which there are plenty of in WvW, will not be playing smartly, and deserved to be punished for it. Right now, they are not punished what-so-ever for their lack of game knowledge.

Seconded. Lack of game knowledge shouldn’t be catered to after a point. This game allows for content land to extend forever with success!

“You consider dodge rolling or using cool downs to get out of mass AoE skill? If they do this they “know what they are doing” and if they do not they are “skill less”. If that’s all that makes the difference from a skilled player to a not skilled I think you and are talking very different levels of tactics. I apologize for wasting your time.” – Me

Then your lack of comprehending what sarsbear wrote is a falsity. 3 staff eles aoeing on top of 30 guys should drop said 30 guys if clumped and remain clumped. That is fact if the Aoe cap was removed. You telling us that Aoe cap won’t help is incorrect.

That is not precisely why the AoE cap was put in place, see my earlier responses.

I would like to confirm from you though that you think it is fair for 3 Eles to drop meteor shower on a group of 25, and should wipe them out without actually putting thought in to the fight beyond “put them in the choke and drop one spell”. That would be “tactics” to you?

Anyone else is welcome to answer this question as well cuz I think it is relevant…. I agree it should be able to happen, and I believe those 30 should learn to GET THE F OUT OF THE WAY

So we are emotional or immature because we want the Aoe cap removed or increased and don’t agree with Zergs not being forced to ever get better as players in order to achieve success?

mezo.9568:

Jscull.2514:

osif.8673:

mezo.9568:

You 5 spike a choke hold and drop your uncapped AoE. It will NOT kill them, they dodge roll out or use cool downs. They spread like bugs. Now you have 10:1 on you. You think that you can take on 10 guys yourself, with them all spread out? It only helps you in Towers and Keeps where they (temporarily) cannot get to you. Siege already does this.

You seem to be describing players that know what they are doing. Skilless players, which there are plenty of in WvW, will not be playing smartly, and deserved to be punished for it. Right now, they are not punished what-so-ever for their lack of game knowledge.

Seconded. Lack of game knowledge shouldn’t be catered to after a point. This game allows for content land to extend forever with success!

“You consider dodge rolling or using cool downs to get out of mass AoE skill? If they do this they “know what they are doing” and if they do not they are “skill less”. If that’s all that makes the difference from a skilled player to a not skilled I think you and are talking very different levels of tactics. I apologize for wasting your time.” – Me

Then your lack of comprehending what sarsbear wrote is a falsity. 3 staff eles aoeing on top of 30 guys should drop said 30 guys if clumped and remain clumped. That is fact if the Aoe cap was removed. You telling us that Aoe cap won’t help is incorrect.

osif.8673:

mezo.9568:

You 5 spike a choke hold and drop your uncapped AoE. It will NOT kill them, they dodge roll out or use cool downs. They spread like bugs. Now you have 10:1 on you. You think that you can take on 10 guys yourself, with them all spread out? It only helps you in Towers and Keeps where they (temporarily) cannot get to you. Siege already does this.

You seem to be describing players that know what they are doing. Skilless players, which there are plenty of in WvW, will not be playing smartly, and deserved to be punished for it. Right now, they are not punished what-so-ever for their lack of game knowledge.

Seconded. Lack of game knowledge shouldn’t be catered to after a point. This game allows for content land to extend forever with success!

Mezo how many people does ur “5 man” hit back peddling facing you coming right at them? Get maybe an ability or two off? Seems like the majority of zergers play with this style that we hit….

mezo.9568:

Jscull.2514:

Mezo and raf, clearly you guys are of the zerging camp and DO NOT wish to leave content land or ever be challenged…Thats fine. There are some that do and we hope Anet realizes this or will be faced with the few competitive people leaving their game for good.

I have mentioned already that my group never runs with more than 5. I hope this doesn’t constitute a “zerg” in your opinion. I am trying to help you achieve what you are looking for because it IS fun, but it requires that you use your head (something you clamor about, and why zergs suck) before you can be competitive. I am sorry you don’t see that.

I’m not sorry, but you play for meta and we play for kills.

Mezo and raf, clearly you guys are of the zerging camp and DO NOT wish to leave content land or ever be challenged…Thats fine. There are some that do and we hope Anet realizes this or will be faced with the few competitive people leaving their game for good.

Raf.1078:

I think its just sour grapes. Maybe PAXA’s oh so skilled small groups have gotten wiped by zergs so they’ve taken to the forums to try and get ANet to change the game in their favor.

I applaud thier tactics…but at the same time, I’m not going to let them go un-challenged either.

Dude we are not saying we are the best. It isnt an kitten competition. We want challenge more than just 5v25. We would like more groups attempting to think past “put seige down fire arrow cart or gather 15 before heading out”. Think, how can this group composition work, with these players, these classes….and how can we beat those guys who seem to have their stuff together. THose conversations dont happen that much in this game because Anet has allowed a default way to win, ADD MORE PEOPLE!

Thus this threads arrival and the complaints about wvw becoming stale and boring with ONLY ZERGS!

mezo.9568:

osif.8673:

mezo.9568:

If you (a five man group) successfully defended, why isn’t your second five man heading to the next tower? They can do the same thing. After enough “NOPE” from you, they have no choice but to split it up!

I guess we have just had different experiences in WvW then. Mindless zergs, in my experience, will always run with more people rather than split up. Or they just get frustrated and leave WvW, which none of us want, for obvious reasons as we don’t want WvW to die.

It takes a while before they get their heads on and start splitting up to fight you on smaller levels, it doesn’t happen right away, but when it does, you will get EXACTLY what you’re looking for. In the meantime, you get to remind your group that you are conditioning them and turning them into your little pawns with a fraction of their firepower.

As far as the second part, if they are going to leave WvW because you forced them to split up, how is forcing them to play AS five man tactics going to change their decision to leave. They are going to leave if you force them to fight AS five mans anyways.

When you arent roaming in a zerg, and you rely on less people to win, your skill naturally increases every fight. This doesnt happen as you are allowed to win in fights just by adding numbers to the pile. If we are allowed to hit more than 5 guys, it will hopefully allow for growth beyond the classic zergball mentality and leave some people with the option of get better or quit, not stay in content land and remain the same forever.

mezo.9568:

I like a lot of the ideas from you guys, but I fear that you guys aren’t playing WvW as tactfully as you can. Try it out, it really does work.

one thing about our group and a couple other smaller man guilds we know is the points system, capturing towers/camps/keeps/ whatever hasnt been fun after the 100th time taking something. We find enjoyment in fighting peoples best efforts on the field…using the open world platform to roam, best position our group for a fight, while giving ourselves the best advantages to win. Like the guy said, “there is a sense of whats over the hill” in wvw that IS NOT in spvp. We enjoy the random chance, the no time limit, the no kill limit.

What is broken is the fact that Anet has established ZERG ONLY mentality. The aoe cap removal would lessen this mentality and establish a bit more balance. The wvw scene should not just be 5 mans owning 20+ mans. It should be a balance of both. and right now, it is “Bring more numbers because this 5 man over here is good….or just run inside until those 5 guys get bored of our 20 on arrow carts….” pretty boring.

mezo.9568:

I do agree with a larger AoE cap. although I don’t think you understand that they are gonna carry the same firepower of mass AoE that you do when they have uncapped AoE. They are still gonna send five people after every one of you, and still have people to spare. I just think it will help small groups slow down a zerg, but it for sure isn’t going to stop them.

We have been dealing with 5 people to our 1 for months now. thats not new, what would be new, is my 5 being able to hit your 25……deal with that and then lets talk. Because we are already dealing many times with the 5 to 1 ratio of incoming damage. We are saying even up the playing field with DMG OUTPUT and you are scared and dont like the idea.

mezo.9568:

Jscull.2514:

mezo.9568:

Me

Wrong, our argument is to have more than 2-3 light/medium weights in the ring….maybe having 10-15 rather than 3 heavyweights and 2 lights. No dude, we dont want ez mode as small mans. Small mans implys just that, HARDER THAN ANY OTHER FORM to compete with heavyweight zergs. The argument is make it more realistic to be able to COMPETE…..not win all the time. Reread this thread, couple guys said well skilled/organized guilds/zergs should be able to beat small mans, but by using skill and coordination WHILE FIGHTING….not the games mechanics of aoe cap and downed state as well as small maps.

You want to compete. As a lightweight. Against a heavyweight. And have the possibility of winning. You are still thinking with your fists. Fight with your brain. If you keep them drained, they have no choice but to break up and attempt to be at all possible locations. You just used your brain to turn your heavyweight into lightweights, on your level. Then you can have the fights you want.

If i wanted to play RISK id be playing the board game. I am here to play against other players……so what you are suggesting isnt fun for our entire guild and guilds like us. We want to actually FIGHT and compete with skills and abilities….

Raf.1078:

It is NOT realistic to think that a 5 man can or should allowed to achieve parity or compete with a 60 man zerg. Each group “plays” a different strategy in game. Both groups should have different goals.

If the 2 happen to run across each other, the game shouldn’t give the advantage to the smaller group. The smaller group should just back off and continue with whatever business they were about before they ran across the army. Not be accorded some sort of in game buff due to the size of their group…you chose to run the small group.

Im not talking 60 guys being taken down by 5….Im talkin LESS 60 MANS RUNNING AROUND and more groups want to compete via the group size or under 15. WHILE removing aoe cap.

mezo.9568:

A lot of small groups seem to be wanting to be able to go head to head with a large zerg and wipe it. These are the same mindless tactics you are accusing the big zerg of using that you want applied to your small man group. Stand at a choke and AoE, really, that’s tactics?
My small group flourishes at denying the map to zergs, with the API changes and the supply traps, siege buffs, and invincible camp supervisors, y’all are obviously not getting the hint. My group (which refuses to go above 5 members, we form a second group at that point) runs to camps as the timer expires, drops a supply trap near the mindless entrance, on top of the supplies, and still has enough supplies to throw up 2 arrow carts to defend a tower or keep. We watch map chat for zerg movements and after about an hour of us being on the map, we have enough siege built on our structures to defend keeps and towers. Someone mentioned before “A zerg with no supplies is a useless zerg”, AMEN. They can run around open field fighting all day long, and not be able to make an advancement in PPT if your two small mans play well. You build catapults or flame rams, slowly drain the supply of their tier three towers, run when you see the zerg coming, and keep at it, they cant repair if they are out of supplies, meaning they are gonna help you in draining their own towers and keeps more for you.

You guys are TERRORISTS, NOT WAR HEROS, NOT SPARTANS. Persistence is the key. I don’t know what you guys expect ArenaNet to do in order to make your small five man group of Sun-Tzus and Sima-Yis be able to take out a 60 man group head on, but you are very obviously over inflated.

They build trebs to start advancing? You take your five man and you build an arrow cart and destroy that crap, their zerg isn’t going to sit on their trebuchet, and if they are, you bring your two five mans together temporarily and counter trebuchet that trebuchet.

You watch map chat for zerg movements, they make a move to your tower or keep? You better hope you know how to place arrow carts and can hit the gate with the four arrow carts you built while one spotter is watching for catapults, trebuchet, or counter carts.

There are almost no instances where a dedicated group of five cant wreak havoc on a group of 40-60. You guys are making the request to ArenaNet to have a lightweight beat the crap out of a heavyweight, as opposed to winning the fight with your head, your still trying to use your fists.

Wrong, our argument is to have more than 2-3 light/medium weights in the ring….maybe having 10-15 rather than 3 heavyweights and 2 lights. No dude, we dont want ez mode as small mans. Small mans implys just that, HARDER THAN ANY OTHER FORM to compete with heavyweight zergs. The argument is make it more realistic to be able to COMPETE…..not win all the time. Reread this thread, couple guys said well skilled/organized guilds/zergs should be able to beat small mans, but by using skill and coordination WHILE FIGHTING….not the games mechanics of aoe cap and downed state as well as small maps.

Niim.9260:

Mister Mustard.7203:

Also, as much as the roamers and small scale fighters refuse to admit it, there is a skill involved in being a good large scale fighting team, the same as there is for small scale. It’s just a different skill set. If it were only based off of who presses 1 the hardest, you wouldn’t see certain guilds or commanders win the vast majority of their encounters.

I have no issues with zergs, I think they are a great introductory level for anyone new to WvW style of play. Exceedingly important in what it does, but there is more to the game and people as part of their natural progression should outgrow the zerg. In GW2 this is not happening.

Amen to you my friend. P R O G R E S S I O N is what keeps people playing the same game for years, not months.

Covenant and because of you’re committment to the game, Anet has offered a terrible end game ranking system and encouraged the mindless following of other non combative players to the next (10 feet away) tower to gain points for the META!!

Kami.7369:

Jscull.2514:

elinos.7493:

You really want to know why? Because you are sitting in vent and they aren’t. That about sums up 99% of your “superiority”.

I don’t disagree. It’s embarrassing they are not. To quote a dude from before "if 3 staff eles choke point a 30 man Zerg and kill them all…. It should be allowed. The morons in that 30 shouldn’t hve stood in the red circles. ". Hands down should be allowed. If youre dumb enough not to play in vent with groups that are focused on killing around, and then stand in circles or “clump up” and Aoe mows you down….learn those strategies don’t work. Shouldn’t be babied like Anet has created. Comfort zone lol.

What if a melee gets close to those 3 staff eles? Should the massive advantage they have at range mean that if a melee cuts the distance, he should be able to wreck 3 Elementalists at point blank?

You’re on to something. Absolutely. Cloth gets smoked by melee in every game. As a caster your skill becomes kiting. These aren’t new theories… Been in mmos for over a decade…

30 people pressing 1 is a ridiculous amount of dps incoming. I really don’t care if I never get through to you “large scale is better because you win the meta better” this meta still sucks. Just like WAR gw2 will fail because it’s capture point objective based “pvp” where people care more about the points than they do about learning to beat better players. Sorry, will never sell copies after a year or two. It’s Been proven by war hammer online rift ect.

Tell us about how “war is large scale in real life and therefore should allow me to feel like general Patton when I log on” and always get stuck following some blue Dorito who may have less experience than you do, but got to the Hundy gold mark b4 you did.

In the end, you’ll never compete with good mmo pvpers. And the games like unchained that will require personal skill to develop in order to be successful in game, you will all cry and leave because it isn’t comfort land like Anet has so provided the masses to sell the most copies. Hellooooop wow 2.

Devon.9061:

Jscull.2514:

Plz let unchained come out tmrw.

http://www.unchainedgame.com

:D

Lol that’s a gooood wonnn. That’s what I feel this games “tactics are” rush to the AC and fire away. How boring.

elinos.7493:

You really want to know why? Because you are sitting in vent and they aren’t. That about sums up 99% of your “superiority”.

I don’t disagree. It’s embarrassing they are not. To quote a dude from before "if 3 staff eles choke point a 30 man Zerg and kill them all…. It should be allowed. The morons in that 30 shouldn’t hve stood in the red circles. ". Hands down should be allowed. If youre dumb enough not to play in vent with groups that are focused on killing around, and then stand in circles or “clump up” and Aoe mows you down….learn those strategies don’t work. Shouldn’t be babied like Anet has created. Comfort zone lol.

Wtb more competitive atmosphere and less grab kitten between this tier. Spvp blows, and so does the majority of wvw. Plz let unchained come out tmrw.

Tired of people never knowing what to do in fights to win but add more people.

For PR reasons im speaking for myself not all of PAXA

Aeon no its not. Otherwise more people would run outside of 15-20+. In Daoc our 8 man used to roll 20-60 people in a matter of 1-3 minutes. Why??? ZERO AOE CAP and no crappy rez system. This game has a ridiculous amount of first time mmoers who don’t know crap about fighting human being players in just about every environment.

Please answer why the 5-10 cut off from a Zerg die every single time in this game? And not “they were hit from behind” = pan your friggen camera.

Players in Zergs generally haven’t or don’t want to experience the challenge of killing players outside their comfort level. Perfect example is when a small group splits off 5-10 from the back of a Zerg, that 5-10 gets RICK ROLLED 99% of the time because they were forced to open field and don’t know how to fight that style.

The reason none of you “this is war and war is huuuuuuge numbers winning” people dont want Anet to change anything is because you won’t be able to easily compete with skilled coordinated groups if mechanics force you to fight (OTHER HUMAN BEINGS) rather than the comfort zone of we have 10 more guys spam one we win.

Raf.1078:

Jscull.2514:

Assassin X.8573:

TL:DR

Did the minute men of the colonies in the american revolutionary war complain about the British zerg when they were decimating them with guerilla attacks?

Anet will complain when 1/3 of their pop leaves for a better game cuz their mechanics blow for player vs player…

It will be heaven, all the starter mmo’ers will be left with each other in zerg land.

Yeah…it will be really nice to play with adults again.

Lol good one.

Assassin X.8573:

TL:DR

Did the minute men of the colonies in the american revolutionary war complain about the British zerg when they were decimating them with guerilla attacks?

Anet will complain when 1/3 of their pop leaves for a better game cuz their mechanics blow for player vs player…

It will be heaven, all the starter mmo’ers will be left with each other in zerg land.

AydenStar.4216:

Estus.1726:

Raf.1078:

Here is what I’m reading in this thread:

My group of leet hyper skilled players cannot compete against a zerg of lesser skilled players. Therefore, ANet must tilt the game towards our type of playstyle because….

Well, this is where you guys are losing it. Cause I’ve yet to read single decent reason for tuning the game to small group play over large group play. More people zerg than play small groups.

The zerg is tkittenense of wvw. Zergs can carry more suppy for siege…can drain supply camps to deny the enemy and speed build siege on the spot for the conquest of keeps & towers.

Not to say that there isn’t a place for small group play…but not at the expense of other forms of play.

I agree. it boggles my mind that people in this thread actually wants to discourage large scale group battles in a MMORPG. What do people want? If more than 20 people are in a certain radius of each other they randomly start to drop dead?

SPVP seems to be what ANET had in mind for small groups. WvWvW IMO was designed for three massive armies to go toe to toe with each other.

WvW is a massive battlefield where players can participate in whatever way they want but my problem is when players from one form of pvp want to change the game so their style of game play has an edge. Spvp with most other arena style pvp in MMOs gets old and boring very quickly if you are running around the same maps with Rock/Paper/Scissors group make-ups.

WvW is a completely different beast to Spvp. I can roam around and kill other roamer all day long but that gets boring after a will and I rather just do spvp/Obsidian Sanctuary if i m in the mood for those small scale fights. WvW gives me and others the option to be part of a large force, scout/roaming, join smaller groups, skirmish in the jumping puzzles, level lowbies or even farm. WvW is not a balance area just like war its a 24 hr a day massive player battlefield and not a 24 hr a day battle-arena.

Rockstar we are not ARENA BASED pvpers…..our team is from daoc open world 8 manning……did it in WAR also…we dont want to have time limits or capture points…You are scared that 5 will come in a wallop you because you want lazy pvp.

snowaugar.1823:

Jscull.2514:

snowaugar.1823:

Jscull.2514:

Estus.1726:

Raf.1078:

Here is what I’m reading in this thread:

My group of leet hyper skilled players cannot compete against a zerg of lesser skilled players. Therefore, ANet must tilt the game towards our type of playstyle because….

Well, this is where you guys are losing it. Cause I’ve yet to read single decent reason for tuning the game to small group play over large group play. More people zerg than play small groups.

The zerg is tkittenense of wvw. Zergs can carry more suppy for siege…can drain supply camps to deny the enemy and speed build siege on the spot for the conquest of keeps & towers.

Not to say that there isn’t a place for small group play…but not at the expense of other forms of play.

I agree. it boggles my mind that people in this thread actually wants to discourage large scale group battles in a MMORPG. What do people want? If more than 20 people are in a certain radius of each other they randomly start to drop dead?

SPVP seems to be what ANET had in mind for small groups. WvWvW IMO was designed for three massive armies to go toe to toe with each other.

Dude you act like “wvw” is the first open world system…. “this is meant for large scale battles” news flash couple other games have had open world systems… And those games allowed for Zergs to happen. They also allowed for skilled coordinated groups to smoke said Zergs if the Zergs really were filled with new players who don’t fully understand pvp. This thread is not saying don’t allow Zergs, it’s saying allow for another play style at the same time.

What I hear as a counter argument is "we in the Zerg populus enjoy our press 1 epic combat and don’t want any “leet” players to ever effect our gameplay". To use your own saying, “tough it’s wvw my 5 smoked you 20+, you guys absolutely should have beat us but didn’t and in wvw that’s how it goes”. That’s not going to happen Everytime but Anet doesn’t provide ANY chance with its current setup of 5 Aoe cap and down state.

And jsculls famous rants that have no facts in them start again

Guys that take the time and spend the focus learning classes ins and outs and build synergy groups shouldn’t be held back from playing. Same as a zerg can exist….my team should not be limited by Anet’s mechanics….and since launch we have been.

I’ve never been limited when havoc by mechanics run 10 and tend to not have to many problems until faced with 40 can’t win em all gotta choose my battles carefully buut never been hindered by the mechanics

Pretty sure anyone that doesnt fight in groups over 10 has lost fights due to terrible down state mechanics….a mosquito dies so therefore 3 guys rally? Right youve never experienced that. Also, AoE cap of 5? Terrible….should be at least 10-15 if not removed….Please dont tell me the mechanics have never lost you a fight when it happens everyday to real small mans.

pulsecodesgnl.3470:

Cyphel.3659:

Lol, that is our resident EB troll..

I noticed most rangers use Longbow now. Last I checked everyone was “qqqqqqqqqqq LB sucks qqqqqqqqq” so what happened? haha

When this happened on SFR it spawned a huge increase in guardians and wall of reflection usage….until all the rangers quit/rerolled

LB/GS Ranger with PVT gear is tanky/evasive as all hell, and absolutely wrecks when focus firing. I love firing 5 on LB into a zerg, running in with a barrage, swapping, getting two rounds of auto-attacks of while evading tons of attacks with the 3 chain skill on auto attack of GS, and then dashing back out with 3. <3 dat mobility and control.

Not to rain on a parade, but LB/GS wrecks when in a zerg, or in a solo/2v2 fight…..other than that youre going to die as soon as you are focused.

Just so all you rangers in this thread are aware, YOU WILL be the PAXA 5 man’s target first just about 80% of the time. Hands down the easiest (along with staff ele) class to kill when focusing.