6k+ PvP games
6k+ PvP games
I don’t really see why S/D would come back. So far it looks D/P is gonna get the most out of it once again. Pulmonary impact on headshot, damaging evade that combos stealth in smokefields. Probably players will replace Blinding Powder with signet of agility to get all the benefits it already gives + more stealth and dmg. And then they take the weakness on crit or the +x%dmg after dodge rolling for insane backstab ganks.
I wish it was more S/D reliant… or staff reliant if its fun. I don’t think that it has the kind of outplay mechanisms that other s/d and d/p have tho. (teleports, stealth)
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Finally some well deserved focus on thief’s dodge. (ATM masters of evades are eles and rangers, and even warriors or mesmers have a better on dodge effect but its gonna change! x) )
Bounding Dodger
- Your dodge changes to Bound, which gives you the ability to leap in a direction, dealing crushing damage at the location where you land. This dodge ability also functions as a leap finisher.
— if it is like heartseeker so it deals dmg then hides you. If it’s like cluster bomb it instareveals you. This could end up favoring stealth camping :/ would be good for other weapon sets but D/P has too much stealth already
Channeled Vigor:
- Channel your energy to gain endurance and health per pulse. Heal for more if your endurance is full.
—Pulsing heal for thieves? Can only be used in stealth or else you isntadie if u try to cast it
Evasive Empowerment:
- After dodge rolling, your next attack deals bonus damage.
—10% dmg is a little low, why isnt in on evade? if its just dodge roll all its gonna be useful for is random dodgeing in stealth before a backstab
Escapist’s Absolution:
- Remove a condition when you successfully evade an attack.
—Why aren’t traits like this merged with traits of the same nature in acrobatics?
like steal recharge+condi cleanse on successful evade and heal + inititive gain on succeful evade?
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they wont reimplement a bug ofc but they could at least make pistol whip so that u can dodge while casting the wind-up like sword3 for mesmers.
Edit:typos fixed
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(edited by Kicker.8203)
It’s almost as if Elite specialisations are capable of enhancing existing aspects of the profession, like every single other one that was announced.
yeah too bad they had to actually destroy meta build just to they can sell spec…. lol
it is like: hey let me break your leg so i can sell you wheelchair super duper diamond pro 7000
Perfect example! I wouldn’t even mind if we had to take the new one, but why not just rework acro to be useful in its own useful way? just move the on evade traits from acro to the new one, initiative+health on evade would be worth about 1 trait and same with steal rcahrge+condi cleanse.
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— thieves have no choice but to go d/p
— mesmers – pu is too cheesy
— dd ele is too… god
— very low diversity overall
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This is not a nerf to mesmer… they also rally when heir own clones die. I was playing 1v1 on ranger against a mesmer and it happened when noone was around. (no my pet didnt die)
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It was a skillful addition to the game and it even made something hard- unlike d/p thief- viable for the class: Pistol whip thief was a lot of fun with this.
I was about to make a video out of it but in short: you had to stow weapon, wait like 200ms then cast+dodge very fast and you got the evade frames for the first 3/4sec of the skill u casted. One of the thing you could do was: when some1 was chasing you you could dodge cast pwhip backwards , getting behind them and starting to hit them immediately. Or you could use it to just not die instantly when fighing an other thief or mesmer. It was really fun and had a high skill cap. However, the last hope of playing a non-faceroll thief build is gone.
I don’t get why they have to fix fun bugs but not midair-immob, obstructed (when ppl move bk and forth right in front of u), teleport bug, or unavoidable ranger taunt, and in this patch they added spontaneous rally from downed to the list.
Solution for S/P: Separate the stun part and the evasion part so if you precast the stun part in the air you can activate the evade part at any time.(giving an evade on an almost 1 sec delay(its more than 0.75s)is ridiculous) or you should be allowed to dodge while casting the windup (althought its weird mesmers can already do that with sword 3).
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(edited by Kicker.8203)
THE DYES ARE ACCOUNT BOUND
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what r u talking about? the dyes you get from presents are account bound! I’ve noticed it when i tried to sell my electro blue… a warning would have been good, i wouldnt have chosen that fugly dye.
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Oh, right the other weaponset! It’s greatsword+dagger mainhand with pistol offhand obviously.
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Sorry to disappoint u guys who thought it was gonna be staff for thief but it will be Greatsword/Shortbow as the new weaponset.
Proof:
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Expect about the quality of traits you’ll find in Tempest or Dragonhunter. Or lack of quality, rather.
You are truly the most negative person here (and on every single thread, mind you). Could the same be said about what they did with the Reaper, Chronomancer, Herald, and Berserker? What indication do you actually have that the traits will be bad when they are quite good on at least 4 of the revealed E.specs and at least decent on DH.
I try to be positive, but the last 4 E-specs weren’t Karl.
I play guardian and thief. I’m so tired of getting Karl’d. Please please give at least one of my classes the Robert Gee treatment.
Karl made the last thief overhaul so it is very likely that thief won’t get Robert’s treatment… also guys try not to mention Karl in a bad way because he might even read a few articles in the thief forum this week.
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There are lots of threads about this issue but my opinion is they should at least add 1 more utility to each hero if not 2. If they add 1 good one it would be good for release
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First of all the changes were really good, I’m glad you have implemented so many changes already, thx Roy!
Perhaps you didn’t have the time to tone everything yet but I have a few more suggestions anyway:
Hammer
There was a tweak to a cast time here to help with the flow of the weapon. The after-cast on Field of the Mists was actually much higher than one second so this should make it feel much better.
The hammer 5 is really slow, it should be like engineer’s Orbital Strike(3/4 sec cast time but the hit is delayed after the cast has finished)
Edit: Hammer 4 could use some sort of secondary effect that help against melees like some slow on cast or anything really.
Legendary Assassin Stance
This stance had a lot of positive response, but based on feedback I felt as if we could really improve the feel and flow of this stance. A big one was allowing Phase Traversal to work like other teleports so it still would go up to the 1200 distance if used on a target further away then that.
- Phase Traversal: This skill can now be used on a target out of range to close the distance similar to how Infiltrator’s Signet on thief works.
This feels too mobile because it is a repeatable skill: if you have 50 energy and you use it 3 times in a row travels you 3600 distance straight away(some energy regens during the time). I feel like it was in a good place before the change.
Devastation
There was a bug fix here and the redesign of a trait. Increased attack speed bonuses felt lackluster when you have access to Impossible Odds, which grants quickness. The increased attack speed values did not stack so I felt as if it was a good place to add in a damage multiplier that would also help out sword’s damage.
- Rapid Laceration: This trait has been changed to Vicious Lacerations. This trait will now increase damage by 2% per stack while attacking with a sword equipped. This stacks up to a maximum of five times.
To clarify, does the trait now give both damage and speed increase?
Do attack speed bonuses stack now? If not, why is it a problem to stack a little over quickness speed?
Legendary Mallyx Stance:
- Unyielding Anguish is still too powerful for decapping capture points, ignoring stability, ressing teammates, and keeping away melees while you attack them from range, all this on a 100% uptime. I think it would be fair to limit it with some CD and let people with stability pass through it. The problem is not solely that it is too strong but it encourages passive gameplay at the same time. (spamm of unyielding anguish and autattacks from range) On the other hand the skill has no effect when there is nowhere to teleport foes so they can just stay inside maybe change it simply to launch?
- Pain Absorption: allows for 100% resistance uptime coupled with the resistance trait while even having some excess energy for skills. Also some CD added would feel right.
Staff
- The autoattack #3 generates healing orbs. However, these are barely visible especially during fights with all the clutter going on. I’d change its models to the ventari healing orbs or make the staff attack heal right off the bat.
Thanks for all your work, revenant is really fun already!
P.S. How soon is soon?
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(edited by Kicker.8203)
Puns > skill designs
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Not even that, since a D/D ele can probably sustain 2 D/D eles for as long as he wants.
Dont forget its not just their sustain thats op but also their dmg.
According to Phantaram 2 fire cele dd eles dueling eventually results in either one dying.
Honestly pre-patch meta was more fun. It’s all cheese now. DD eles – good at everything+mobility, thieves&mesmers endless stealth with enormous amount of sustain heals, bunkers everywhere. The only good thing was that we got to change builds which is somewhat refreshing however, the diversity only got worse for most classes
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This Grandmaster Trait gives a stacking 2% crit chance every second and resets when you crit. This is, in effect a fancier way of providing an increased crit chance trait that is slightly more interesting than “Increase crit chance by 15%” or similar.
The reality is that the trait is very weak because of the fact that even at low crit rates it resets itself pretty regularly. The best case scenario is for a person with a base 5% crit chance, who will gain an average of 12.64% crit chance from the trait if they attack once per second.
This maybe more true for pvp than pvp but you have to dodge, chase enemies, kite, heal, wait until target comes out of stealth etc. so it is a lot more ufesul than it seems. For bursting its bad but for sustain damage it is good.
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I Its biggest issue is with Unrelenting Assault. My solution was to DRAMATICALLY increase the damage per hit based on the number of targets around you within Unrelenting Assasult’s radius. This way, each strike is actually worth it. And the evades honestly is necessary. Why does Riposting Shadows get an evade and Unrelenting Assault doesn’t even though the overall concept of travel is the same? It’s inconsistent.
That is a great idea indeed. I said it should just attack the target at first but this sounds better if it drastic enough.
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Well to be honest without resistance, i’m afraid Mallyx can’t survive his own condis, gonna be hard to balance. The problem is Mallyx is the exact counter of any condition user by his design, taking advantage of ennemis condi.
Yea revenant does need resistance but not this much… its also strong because it can send them out in an aoe at the same time (mostly worth it if you r specced for condi).
EDIT: reasoning is no spec should be completely ignore a mechanic. there has to be a downtime, so adding CDs would help that.
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(edited by Kicker.8203)
Utility skill should have CDs. Example: against condi: resistance spam+autohit=win, against melee: unyielding anguish spam+ranged hammer autohit=win. if you had no utilities however you would die in seconds. Uptime on these should be reduced to half or a bit less.
However, since revenants almost exclusively rely on utilities to survive, the weapon defenses should be improved greatly. by that i mean +1/2 defensive properties to each set (sword2 – 1/4s daze but on longer cd, sword 3, staff 2 – evade, staff 4 – blind, hammer 3 should let you choose if you want to stay at your destination, hammer 5 – way faster cast, hammer 4 would apply slow to foes who are in it, sword 5 teleport backwards even if it doesnt hit a foe, axe 4 blind, mace 3 evade)
These wouldn’t be op because limiting utilities is a great throwback but if they aren’t limited they lead to cheesy & boring gameplay.
Stealth seems to fit thematically for revenant but there is none. It could be also added here and there instead of an evade or something. It’d be also a great shiro utility #4 if they decide to increase the number of utilities to 5 for each legend. Defensive traits are also too weak.
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(edited by Kicker.8203)
— Retribution has 2s stability on dodge(not protection), passive endurance gain, dmg reduction traits, protection on stunned, and the hammer proc deals decent unblockable dmg/blindcleanse, that’s why i prefer it, but in terms of flat dmg invocation is better for PvE for sure. Although, it felt like even on retribution it is too glassy(on marauder amulet)
— Invocation grants a lot of 30% crit chance fury, + 7%dmg flat, a stunbreak on legend swap + a useless master trait
Another thing that’s useless is arguing about it since hopefully they gonna improve weak traits soon.
—Shiro’s heal does trigger on sword 3, only it has an internal cd of 1sec . it only triggers about 3 times during the 7 hits
— Yeah I know resistance can be stripped but not every class can do that. Also you can dodge a lot of boon removes like necro signets which are pretty well telepgraphed and slow, mesmer shatters you have to be careful of too ofc and even if they manage to hit you with one it isn’t guaranteed they strip the right boon. You just have to reapply resistance not long before it ends(rather than stacking up a long duration) so that way you have enough energy to reapply it quickly even if they strip it.
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(edited by Kicker.8203)
I’ve used cele signet reaper (same weapons and utis as current meta or dagger instead of warhorn) +burning duration and ice sigils on 1 set http://dulfy.net/gw2traits#build=AgQB1AWsBuQ~
Reasoning for reaper line:
- Chill dmg is too low, but with tons of might stacking the healing trait appears to be more helpful.
- The chill proc trait is less important than snare duration decrease as necro still suffers from bad mobility. And there is plenty of chill anyway.
- The vuln on crit isn’t worth it vuln gets cleansed too fast and there isnt enough vuln.
This seemed slightly more powerful than current meta necros. But shouts and GS on necro are absolutely terrible.
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good build for sure I just dont like signet of vampirism…….reaper will bring whole new gameplay tho.
Not at all, after playing around with different builds i settled with playing signet cele reaper, same weapons and same utilities as current meta, with these traits http://dulfy.net/gw2traits#build=AgQB1AWsBuQ~
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Hope this one will help with energy management in some way. Other traitlines never give any energy.
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There are many good suggestions but also nonsense like:
- ‘Assassin’s annihilation:(…)we are not thieves, we can’t really hit someone from behind…can be good in pve vs stupid mobs though…’ — The entire skill 3 flanks with each attack plus you have 270° around the enemy that you can flank them from. Also counts vertically so if you ranged auto them from above it will flank every single time no matter where they r facing. It’s really easy to flank someone.
- ‘General hammer feel is good, hammer 5 should be faster, right now the wind up is super long and you can even fail to hit normal mobs with it if they move a little. the only good thing is that it’s so slow that you don’t even feel the energy costs as it repelenish during the animation.
My only real concern with hammer is the lack of synergy with any legend other than Ventari.’
—Skill 5 has to be faster but that is not all, it would still be clumsy in pvp i suggested making skill 3 toggle into a skill that lets you stay at the location you’ve leapt to, or/and make it deal damage once again at returning. And make the skill 4 shield have some use against non-projectile ranged attacks.
- Invocation doesn’t actually feel like ‘almost a must’ I’d prefer the mallyx line with resistance trait, devastation and retribution as as third one. (retribution has stability, energy reload, protection etc.) despite this there are still not enough defensive traits.
- Devastation: ‘Malicious Reprisal, whan one attack is blocked, next 2 are unblockable…too situationnal to be usefull in any way.’ It’s very useful against engis and shield warriors not so much against guardians because they pop your trait with aegis and it goes to waste, rangers revenants also have blocks so it has its use.
- ‘Shiro:(…)healing skill is completely useless’ — No. It is true that it needs 6-7 seconds at least for healing the full amount but you don’t lose stacks if your attacks get evaded and adds insane dmg to your skills.
You have lots of good ideas, I agree very much with:
- ‘Eye for an Eye is a CC’ed traits, not really usefull imo.’ — Taunt when getting CC’d is pretty much helping a thief in a way that he doesnt have to spam 1 after he stunned you. This trait makes no sense to me. It should either have a way shorter cd because it doesn’t help too much(I’m aware that they cant use a nonautoattack skill UNLESS they are instant) but it would make the most sense if it somehow taunted people who hit stunned other allies or something.
- Equilibrium that deals some dmg if you swap above 50% energy — goes against revenant playstyle completely you should drain your energ before swapping. should be completely replaced, don’t like energy as a deciding factor at all.
- and like all of the other suggestions you came up with are fair.
Things to add:
- Perma resistance and perma decap aoe mallyx skill needs some toning.
— Like make stability work against the teleports.
— Tone down resistance duration slightly(?)
- Remove weapon skill energy, it enforces really cheesy spam of a certain utility and the spamming auto attacks. In return gently decrease energy regeneration or cd increase(there are pretty high CDs already though)
EDIT: now after thinking about it there is no need to remove energy from weapons just make them much more impactful and put a CDs on certain utilites that you would spamm all the time in some situations(unyielding anguish, resistance skill, shiro stunbreak and perma stability skill)
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(edited by Kicker.8203)
After killing an enemy, Rev gets very fast (after 1 sec) out of combat and cause of this, energy drains instant to 50.
Is it intended to get such fast ooc?If not (and I think ist not^^) —> bug^^
Not the most bothering thing but it would feel better if it worked like adrenaline for warriors, so it would start to drain gradually instead of reset instantly
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theres shiro upkeep for out of combat mobility u dont need more.
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I agree that it feels unfun that weapon skills consume energy. Often times you can only auto attack because you need to have your stunbreak in shiro ready or you have to keep up the mallyx teleport field.(or any other utility). Having CDs on them is enough… If it becomes too powerful nerf it in an other way maybe slower energy regen or a bit higher cd on wep skills but let us use weapon skills.
EDIT: now after thinking about it there is no need to remove energy from weapons just make them much more impactful and put CDs on certain utilites that you would spamm all the time in some situations(unyielding anguish, resistance skill, shiro stunbreak and perma stability skill)
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(edited by Kicker.8203)
Quoting myself from a different topic:
I’ve tried revenant with Marauder amulet with all the weapons and the overall impression of it is that
—It is a lot of fun.(Might main it since S/D thief is being neglected by balance patches ;( )
—It’s very hard to disengage.
—Very squishy sadly and since hammer is so inversatile, you have to spam the teleport field in mallyx stance to keep all the melee away from you and keep autohitting. This hardcounters warriors and classes that don’t have strong ranged damage but it is quite cheesy and one-sided as a playstyle. It’s also weird that it teleports out players from the whole capture point even if they have stability so (even if it hurts me to say it) it is too powerful in this form. Perhaps let stability ignore it. Otherwise hammer is really getting rekt by melee AND ranged, I feel that the hammer skill 3 (leap) should give you the option to stay at the location you have leapt to. It could be like Sword 4 in a sense that it changes into a different skill after use.
—Hammer 4 ought to block ANY ranged attack that comes from outside your shield this skil is completely useless against i.e. mesmers as it is now and they already hard counter revenants.
—Hammer 5 is so slow that you literally get murdered by the time you cast it and then they also have time to dodge it -.-". This skill should be sped up tremendously.
Hammer skill are easy to dodge and with their slow nature also easy to blind or block them, while it deals big chunks of dmg on each auto-hit it is very slow so the overall dps is alright thus these hammer buffs would make lots of sense especially since its currently the only ranged option.
—Sword 3 should grant evasion because revenant is very squishy overall and especially while channeling that, you can’t dodge or choose where to go. It also should attack only your target and after it stealths or dies, only then engage on a different foe. Maybe if you deliberately change target during cast it could swap the skill’s target too as a fun mechanic.
—Perma resistance in mallyx stance(with the resistance trait+utility 1) is the other reason that made revenant viable in the beta weekend but it hard counters pure condi builds just too much in my opinion. DD eles still laugh at it and other hybrid builds because you have to use up almost all your energy to keep that up and they outdamage you through physical means.
—Staff 4 could bear an AoE blinding effect added to it. Thematically the dust it creates in the air could blind people but the main reason is that you take more damage while you cast it than you actually heal due to the fact you are rooted during this time.
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(edited by Kicker.8203)
I’ve tried revenant with Marauder amulet with all the weapons and the overall impression of it is that
—It is a lot of fun.(Might main it since S/D thief is being neglected by balance patches ;( )
—It’s very hard to disengage.
—Very squishy sadly and since hammer is so inversatile, you have to spam the teleport field in mallyx stance to keep all the melee away from you and keep autohitting. This hardcounters warriors and classes that don’t have strong ranged damage but it is quite cheesy and one-sided as a playstyle. It’s also weird that it teleports out players from the whole capture point even if they have stability so (even if it hurts me to say it) it is too powerful in this form. Perhaps let stability ignore it. Otherwise hammer is really getting rekt by melee AND ranged, I feel that the hammer skill 3 (leap) should give you the option to stay at the location you have leapt to. It could be like Sword 4 in a sense that it changes into a different skill after use.
—Hammer 4 ought to block ANY ranged attack that comes from outside your shield this skil is completely useless against i.e. mesmers as it is now and they already hard counter revenants.
—Hammer 5 is so slow that you literally get murdered by the time you cast it and then they also have time to dodge it -.-". This skill should be sped up tremendously.
Hammer skill are easy to dodge and with their slow nature also easy to blind or block them, while it deals big chunks of dmg on each auto-hit it is very slow so the overall dps is not high at all thus these hammer buffs would make lots of sense especially since its currently the only ranged option.
—Sword 3 should grant evasion because revenant is very squishy overall and especially while channeling that, you can’t dodge or choose where to go. It also should attack only your target and after it stealths or dies, only then engage on a different foe. Maybe if you deliberately change target during cast it could swap the skill’s target too as a fun mechanic.
—Perma resistance in mallyx stance(with the resistance trait+utility 1) is the other reason that made revenant viable in the beta weekend but it hard counters pure condi builds just too much in my opinion. DD eles still laugh at it and other hybrid builds because you have to use up almost all your energy to keep that up and they outdamage you through physical means.
—Staff 4 could bear an AoE blinding effect added to it. Thematically the dust it creates in the air could blind people but the main reason is that you take more damage while you cast it than you actually heal due to the fact you are rooted during this time.
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They should add like 2 more utilities to each legend and done
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The trait are overpowered on the new chronomancer especially the slow on every 5th crit(no counterplay, cant be dodged), the phantasm reviver trait and the clone on shatter. These all sohuld get an internal cooldown. The continuum split is a good enough reason to spec into chrono in itself anyway…. you can double up on moa, burst, use blink+portal for future kiting and being invincible only on 90 sec cd…. the gameplay though looks like more engaing than current mesmer meta. seems fun but need a lot of toning down. At the same time wells dont seem to be too useful
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In PvP: It’s true that evade on sword 3 sounds crazy but revenant is just so easy to kill even outside using skill3 that it does need more defense. BTW in a team environment it teleports to clones and pets randomly too so a lot of dmg is wasted + even if it hits other players the damage is unfocused so its pretty useless to dmg every1 at the same time, that way none of them will eventually die.
Suggestion: Make it attack the target only and if target goes stealth or dies, only then go to a next target. +Add evade to it
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The might is point-less especially since you can cancel jade winds over and over to build 20+ might with a single trait. It will also bait out dodges from people if they know what to dodge on a Rev.
That’s a bug, thanks for pointing it out. It’ll be fixed for the next iteration of revenant.
The might stacking is a bug but the animation would be great if you left it in, there are countless other skills u can fakecast, thats just an extra fun mechanic
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necro stolen is too slow to cast:
cast time 1.25 sec + aftercast
duration 1s / 1.5s / 2s
cast time should be 0.75
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D/P thieves and mesmers both stealth way too much. this playstyle is boring and also annoying to play against. They both can easily stealth from out of your sight walk to you and then burst u, when you havent seen a sign of them. especially with shadows rejuvenationa and bbons from stealth they are super sustainy too.
Stealths should be a lot shorter
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2v2 / 3v3? If only… :/
would love it soo much
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Make Assassin’s reward heal on succesful evade! evasion thieves have no sustain.
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Black Powder – Smoke Field to a Dark Field
this is maybe a bit too harsh but HSing through smoke field is way too cheesy indeed
(if you move stealth to d/p 3 they wont have any way to party stealth without refuge, would feel like justice as S/D tho)
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No just drop the vulnerability for blindness.
This.
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Let them think it through, no need to add another Throw Gunk suicidal self-reveal ability that has almost no effect.
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overloads are crap, the shouts too they are just way worse than current ones. Warhorn is pretty strong tho
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Imo it doesnt need dmg increase just more sustain to be able to deal their dmg.
It also hardcountered by blind and block because of the slow hits. If the first auto was a double strike while leaving its dmg in total the same that would be a fair change.
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Imo it doesnt need dmg increase just more sustain to be able to deal their dmg.
It also hardcountered by blind and block because of the slow hits. If the first auto was a double strike while leaving its dmg in total the same that would be a fair change.
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Imo it doesnt need dmg increase just more sustain to be able to deal their dmg.
It also hardcountered by blind and block because of the slow hits. If the first auto was a double strike while leaving its dmg in total the same that would be a fair change.
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Agree, the icicle should hit more and have a shorter chill. Or some different sort of revamp. Eles atm cleanse it by accident before realising they got chilled :/
The gunk you steal from engis is honestly the worst of all by far. Hurts you more than it helps. Really slow flying skill with a cast so its really hard to get someone caught up in it. By the time u throw ot on a downed body and then start to cleave immediately 1 person resses him up easily because it has so little damage. So it has no use since u r better off autoattacking. The only meaningful thing it accomplishes is that it reveals you if you try to go into stealth. IMO if its dmg was boosted greatly it would still be the worst stolen but at least it would have some use against downeds.
And the skull you steal from necros has the same cast time as the fear. I wouldnt have reduced the fear in the first place but now that they did they should reduce the cast time too.
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SA, even if it would synergize well with s/d -which it doesn’t- would be more boring for a playstyle than a fixed acro line.
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Is sigil of blood still the same?
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Adrenaline implant is basically perma vigor -that cant be corrupted- with weakness ignoring effect when u have vigor. Havent tested it but it must work great against weakness
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