Guild Wars 2

Bhawb.7408:

Warriors.

Oh wait, you wanted a Necro build. I think Spoj’s build is probably the best for dungeons. Basically dagger builds. DS LB builds using Deathly Perception and LB spam are maybe more popular, but I think they underperform compared to his.

Also I think minions are becoming a lot more common, but unless you go hybrid minion/DPS power you kitten yourself too much. And while hybrid is probably the easiest as far as pugging goes, it definitely isn’t the most optimized build.

Just go find a spoj post and check his sig, that’s the best route.

I remember I used to debate with you about stuff all the time. Now I look at your posts and they all now resemble my old posts. What happened?

Title says it all. I’ve largely ignored dungeons/fractals for a long, long time (months). I’m wondering what the meta build is these days for powermancers. Yes, I went and looked for it, but the search function is either bugged or broken. I always end up with no posts found no matter what I type into the box.

Heimdallr.7021:

Kravick.4906:

Heimdallr.7021:

It would be nice to backup claims like with my warrior after “5 hours max i wreck faces with it”.
I could say i wreck faces after half an hour with my elementalist in pvp.

I did the same thing with my warrior. I picked a random hammer mace/shield build and just completely wrecked people without much practice. After about 3 hours of actually playing the build, I felt like I was unstoppable and could take on anything, and winning 1v2 fights easily enough. I still struggle with uneven fights on my necromancer, most of which I don’t win, and I have over 3000 hours logged on that class.

This is what you say without any proof, with my guardian i often face warriors winning the fight (sometime i lose of course), do i find only noob warriors or maybe reality is different from how you picture it? If the class is so OP and easy to play any noob should destroy me (or everyone else) pretty much every time.

Not sure if this counts as proof, but sure. I can try.

I haven’t sPvPed in months. Look at the solo queue stats, especially. I decided to dust off my warrior and kitten around on it. Those 4 solo queue wins were all on my warrior. The one loss, we lost by 2 points, and that was because the other team sniped Svanir for the win. Standard Hammer / Mace/Shield combo. I just go in and wreck people without any prior experience with the build. Its really easy to succeed with a warrior as long as you don’t try to stand there and HB people.

Heimdallr.7021:

It would be nice to backup claims like with my warrior after “5 hours max i wreck faces with it”.
I could say i wreck faces after half an hour with my elementalist in pvp.

I did the same thing with my warrior. I picked a random hammer mace/shield build and just completely wrecked people without much practice. After about 3 hours of actually playing the build, I felt like I was unstoppable and could take on anything, and winning 1v2 fights easily enough. I still struggle with uneven fights on my necromancer, most of which I don’t win, and I have over 3000 hours logged on that class.

I’m really not liking the answer to the condition stacking problem in that Q&A.

lchan.2169:

Thats the problem people dont understand. We stand at melee range thus we need to do more damage. If range characters do almost the same damage as warriors, then screw having a warrior in the first place. Also, doing damage like these mean we are very squishy. You can do the same with range characters. Both my rangers and engineers run full zerk and 30/30/-/-/- setup. They dont do damage like a warrior, but i am in a very save zone away from potentially massive hits and radial AOEs from bosses. So please, spare yourself the embarrassment by at least comparing apples to apples.

Rangers have more weapons than just bows, but thats a different thread and different topic for discussion entirely.

maxinion.8396:

Too many rangers using bows and too many rangers that cannot control pets. If I was seeing spotter and frost spirit around, I would be ecstatic, but I have literally never run into a pug ranger using those

If I am not mistaken (I could very well be, I’m not well versed with rangers), I think the reason you don’t see them is because spirits are in the defense tree, and with the current “Everyone go balls to the wall max DPS!” meta when it comes to dungeons, it would be like a warrior putting points into Tactics or Defense and calling it a DPS build.

Juba.8406:

Kravick.4906:

I make plenty of sense.

Necro is OP

…explain?

Juba.8406:

maybe if you make some sense in what your writing and do some proper math, ill change my view about necros a little .

Well thats a rather self righteous thing to say. You’d doom an entire class to mediocrity because… Honestly, I don’t even know what your problem is. Whatever.

I make plenty of sense. Maybe your reading comprehension needs work? I mean, even looking at it logically, necromancers are condition class. Condition damage is capped, and anyone with on proc bleed effects drastically reduces the damage a necromancer can put out, so this forces necromancers to go power, or group with builds that don’t proc bleeds (which would require no warriors be present, which is the meta currently). This also prevents necromancers from being able to group with other necromancers that want to run conditions. In order to “cleave”, a necromancer has to run a condition build. Everyone knows that condition builds are borked in PvE.

With no cleave weapons, necros are stuck as single target DPSers. For this reason, along with thieves, they tend to get kicked from parties attempting to do speedruns, which tend to be most dungeon groups these days. So when I need to do a dungeon, I’m kinda forced to go on my warrior. I don’t really like playing my warrior. Its to easy, dumbed down, and simple minded to play.

Juba.8406:

rogerwilko.6895:

Juba.8406:

Necro is in godly shape PvE, PvP and WvW.

You should post on the necro forums, people there seam to think that the necro is in a crappy state, but I guess you know something that they don’t.

Kravick shouldn’t post here either .

Do you even play a necromancer? I mean actually play one in all facets of the game. Not just occasionally when you feel bored of playing your chosen class.

Juba.8406:

working as intended .

Clearly. This is why in PVE necromancers are still seen as useless.

Fuschia.6573:

Do Necros need a buff for PvE? Not really. Do the things they do need more relevance in high-end group PvE, i.e. CC and condition stacking? Absolutely.

Then how do you explain that necromancers have absolutely zero cleave abilities and see this as balance?

Juba.8406:

Kravick.4906:

And give classes without access to cleave, or limited access to it, more options.

agreed all classes should get buffed except necros .

Why you hatin’ on necros?

And give classes without access to cleave, or limited access to it, more options.

Delay.6908:

Use Scepter/dagger, do fire #2, #4, #3, go earth, #4, go air and drop LH, spam 1. Win, if your organized guardians or a staff ele will keep providing fields and you keep spamming 1. Boom perma fury/might for your whole group very easily. Also this might unlike forceful GS actually lasts a long time, so when your warrior(s) switch to their axe in their rotation they are still at 25 might instead of it dropping off due to lasting 5~seconds.

Yes, I’m aware of what eles can do, but like I said before, that rotation is far more complicated than simply switching to GS every 7 seconds and popping HB, which if you do this every 7 seconds, you’ll never fall off 25 stacks of might anyway. Your rotation also heavily depends on having someone else on board to drop fire fields for you. Warriors do it better simply by hitting 1 button and don’t have to worry about having other people around to do certain things.

Delay.6908:

Rotations? Eles DPS rotation is do a might stack and spam 1 on LH, also in a group wehre the ele hits top DPS it should be organized enough so no one picks up his LH, furtur more im assuming competent players that can dodge and wont die.. which is very realistic on ele builds since you have enough dodges/blocks/invuln to dont die to any boss except maybe HOTW p1 butcher since he is just overall a kitten to deal with.

True, except a warrior doesn’t need to worry about might stacking, since they just do it automatically. No thinking involved. Forceful Greatsword does it all for a warrior without having to push buttons. Ok, FGJ every 25 seconds, but its far, far easier to do than the might stacking rotation of an ele, which requires 3 attunement swaps, and very precise targeting on a thin line (Firewall), and has to be maintained every 20 seconds or so. Warriors just get it naturally without thinking by hitting HB every 7 seconds. Forceful Greatsword is per target hit, so it stacks up to 25 very quickly.

Delay.6908:

Well to be fair eles crush warriors in terms of cleave and AOE damage given the same buffs and banners.. so saying warriors do everything better is not entirely true considering they dont do the most damage in cleave, let alone 5 target AOE (which ele can also do a lot better)

But a dead person does no damage. Eles also rely on a very specific rotation to do this. If someone accidentally picks up their lightning hammer off the ground, or they go down while holding a lightning hammer, their DPS drops considerably and they’re stuck auto attacking with lightning whip. I know what eles can do, but you can’t look at raw damage in a vacuum. Those eles will get one shot, while a warrior will take 2-4 hits before actually going down. Plus Healing Signet really takes the thought out of needing to activate a heal.

It is far, far easier to do this on a warrior. Its more forgiving and far more easier to pull off. Even the rotations on a warrior require far less effort. AKA, better.

Delay.6908:

You cant really talk about the DPS meta and use PUGS as examples, whenever i run with glass ele’s (which i run with ALOT) they rarely ever die since they can dodge and are not bad. If you are using pugs as your foundation for the “meta” then of course warriors are on top, they are easy to play and bring their own might/fury/banner uptimes. But if you use an actual organized group stacking warriors is not always the “best” way to go…

But you have to consider this as part of why the meta exists in the first place. ANet created a class that, IMO, is far to forgiving and far to easy to play in comparison to the other classes. A necromancer is never going to pull the numbers a warrior can, nor can a thief, all because of cleave damage. Thieves have 1 cleave attack on sword, and its one of the worst DPS autos in the game. Necromancers have zero cleave attacks. Even their “condi cleave” is nullified by any class that auto procs bleeds on attack, which every class can do as far as I am aware.

Its go zerk or go home, and right now warriors do it best. Its true what people say. Warriors can really do everything other classes can do, but better, since they can, you know, live longer and apply it more often.

Delay.6908:

You realize that if we take a LH ele for example the first 2 strikes of its auto chain (highest DPS it can have using LH) hit 3 targets, and the 3rd strike is 5 targets? Along with the fire might stack combo in fire hitting multiple targets aswel. Eles can easily outdps warriors on things other then single targets using either LH, Staff, FGS, Icebow etc… Saying warriors are the king of cleave DPS is pretty silly

Yes, I’m aware, but these kinds of eles get one shot more often than not. I’m always picking elementalists up off the ground in dungeons. This guy summed it up much better than I could. Pulled from https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/PvE-Revising-the-DPS-Meta/page/7

TPMN.1483

The current meta for high level zones is 3wars+guardian+other (FoTM) or 4wars+1other(many dungeons). Mostly all are running zerker.

Zerk wars seem OP (Due to heavy armour and high HP) compared to a zerk Ele (or thief with lower health pool, very squishy armour).
Many foes can one-shot the Ele or thief (12k HP), the War (~20K-30 KHP+) will take 2-4 hits before he feels any damage.
A balanced FoTM team at high levels (>2-4 hrs), zerk war based team (1-1.5 hrs).
Why is this the meta? One shot mechanics which kill other professions instantly (unless they are running full PvT) leaving the warrior still alive (regardless of armour).

This just doesn’t seem right- it kicks most other professions to the side.

Theres a reason berserker warriors are the meta. They do to much damage for the amount of HP/armor they can achieve with just glass cannon specs. Everything else is pushed to the side because of, and even ANet agrees, which is really all that matters.

mahariel.4981:

Somebody please beat some sense in to this guy.

Whats the matter? Logic to much for ya? You said auto attack is where most of the damage comes from. I showed you how only guardians and warriors have auto attacks actually worth mentioning.

You’re going to need more than just veterans to test it on. Believe me, smarter people with better math skills than the both of us have already shown how warriors with their cleave damage are why 4 warriors and a guardian is the DPS meta.

This game is far from balanced. It heavily favors heavy armor users, its very obvious with how everything these classes do cleaves. Light armor classes get 1 cleave on an obscure auto attack (Mesmer sword is not a dungeon friendly build). Medium armor classes the same (Thief sword auto is one of the lowest damage attacks in the game, even with cleave). Necromancers have no cleave what so ever. Engineer, 1 cleave attack on their Tool Kit ability, and the 3rd attack in the chain is single target. Even worse DPS than the thief’s sword auto.

mahariel.4981:

Eles cleave, mesmers cleave, guards cleave, rangers cleave etc etc. I’ve already given you numbers now stop crying. Guardian sw/f + gs combat rotations will wipe the floor with warriors. Lightning hammer and staff eles have great dps, rangers have sword auto giving them solid cleave, mesmers have good sustained dps.

Everything you’ve just mentioned, except the guardian, is false. Yes, mesmers and eles cleave with one attack set (auto attack), but auto attack alone is not where the DPS comes from. You’ve given me numbers on a class that is considered part of the DPS meta. Since I know you can’t give me any solid numbers for any of the other classes, as has already been requested by more people than just me, I’m going to go ahead and say you’re full of it. You cannot look at one ability in a vacuum. You must consider the ENTIRE classes skill set.

It was like this for me as well. I actually had to put forth effort with my necromancer, and my thief I actually had to pay attention to attack animations or get nearly one shot by regular mobs. My engineer? Holy crap, its like night and day. Hundred Blades is one of the best leveling skills in the game.

mini.6018:

There was already a thread proving that warriors are 3rd or 4th best dps class (only in pve).Still people crying war is op ,nerf and all that kitten?

I remember that thread. All that math was for single target. Since warriors cleave with all of their attacks, you’ve gotta look at it from an AoE perspective. Warriors are still kings of the mountain.

Its already been shown mathematically how warriors dominate other classes in terms of raw damage. This is why you constantly see “zerk wars only” LFG posts. And people kicking thieves and necromancers out of groups because “LOL they can’t do damage.”

Just for funzies, I’d like you to show me how a thief or a necromancer can pull those numbers. Guardians are part of the DPS meta. Don’t forget that. They cleave just as much as warriors do, and give tons of group support while doing it.

mahariel.4981:

Also, all weapons used are capable of cleave. So warrior DPS isn’t as overpowered as you think it is.

You’re still ignoring the fact that in your first test you pulled some pretty insane numbers. 35k HBs are not something other classes are capable of pulling. This is on a 7 second cooldown as well. I’ve personally pulled off 20k eviscerate criticals in dungeons on my own warrior. These are numbers that even my thief is incapable of reaching. Don’t even get me started on what a necromancer can’t do.

mahariel.4981:

Hundred blades does 15% more damage than the axe autoattack chain (this is with slashing power and forceful greatsword by the way, my axe damage is without axe mastery), and if you’re not including hundred blades in an attack rotation, greatsword auto will make your dps drop to the point that it evens out or even drops below axe auto damage.

For example, my hundred blades on a Champion Risen Giant did 35,587 damage over a 3.5 second channel which is a DPS of 10,167.

My axe auto chain did a total of 30,381 damage over a period of 3.6 seconds (this is the length of an autoattack chain) which is a DPS of 8,437.

If you want to make hundred blades worse, you basically want to make greatsword not even worth taking.

And you’re failing to realize that no one else is capable of pulling those kinds of numbers. HB and axe auto is also capable of hitting 3 targets at the same time. Cleave makes a BIG difference. MAYBE a guardian with Whirling Wrath can hit those numbers, but thats it.

Come on, people have to come to the realization that Hundred Blades might be doing just a tad bit to much damage? Eviscerate seems a bit excessive to me as well. Even a thief doesn’t backstab that hard.

ens.9854:

Coldtart.4785:

I’ve never seen a ‘stealth counter’ that I couldn’t easily find a workaround for as a thief based on cursory experience playing it. The fact that these ‘counters’ get results simply proves that thief promotes unskilled play.

found it
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stealth_Disruptor_Trap

Thats easy to counter. Shadowstep Heartseeker spam away til the debuff drops. Besides, it doesn’t exist in sPvP.

I’ve never actually have a stealth disruptor trap actually succeed in doing anything but making the thief use their amazing mobility to jump away across the map for 30 seconds.

ITT: Thieves forgetting that they have shadowsteps, evades, blind spam as other defenses. A thief outside of stealth is hardly defenseless. Lets not forget the heartseeker spam to run away.

I swear, its like this in every MMO with this class archetype. If they can’t kill everything with impunity and get away with it scott free, then its unbalanced and everyone needs to be nerfed or their class needs to be buffed. Classes like this have always promoted unintelligent game play.

Life Leech in general is a bad mechanic the way its been implimented. ANet has, unfortunately, backed themselves into a corner regarding this mechanic. The healing side of it, unfortunately, is just not enough to sustain anything. When you’re taking damage in excess of 4k, and you are only siphoning 37 per attack, its not even a drop in a bucket at that point. Its more like a drop in an ocean.

ANet can’t buff siphoning without unbalancing the amount of damage a necromancer can out put. Until they detach the amount healed from the damage it does, and they seem very unwilling to do this, siphoning will forever be in a bad place.

Steath needs a counter. Currently it doesn’t have one. If you attack something from stealth, it should reveal you regardless if it does damage or not.

Would you be willing to share this build, or are you keeping it secret? I’ve been searching for a good condition build on warrior.

I used a siphon build for a while. It sacrifices a bit of damage to gain a not so terrible amount of sustain, but the only problem with this build is it requires every possible type of leeching you can get to make it work. The dagger 2 is a 3k heal, the locust signet is another 5-6k heal depending on how many targets you hit. Plus the standard amount you leech when hitting targets. Its not meta, but its something different.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQRAoY3dnYElsZmGWawwZCZSh3wNQK6l3j6h7sOfIA-j0xAYrBRTYCEVAO5VEN22QR0Y11YKXioapAKXYE-w

The dagger off hand is interchangable with warhorn. I just like having a condition transfer available.

Travis the Terrible.4739:

Actually Signet of Vampirsm fits the necros theme better than healing signet. They are after all about DEATH AND UNDEAD. Necros not having mobility? There is nothing stopping you from taking a warhorn and swapping it out unless you’re in PvP and playing a room with locked traits, weapons and skills. Granted it’s kitten but it’s better than nothing.

Necros have far more party support ability than warrior does in anyway shape or form. Warriors party support is either shouts or banners and a fire field here or there courtesy of a burst skill. Might stacking? Other classes do it better and more easily unless you’re talking about the greatsword trait and that only effects the wielder.

Also don’t complain about a bad mechanic. Necros have 1 of the better class mechanics. Sure it’s not the greatest but hell look at rangers. Pets have and always will be a useless nuisance to the ranger in this game. They took the concept of the ranger in gw1 and turned it into a beast master that is either forced to spec into the pet so it doesn’t die in kittens or completely ignore it.

Play to the strengths of the class and not to cover your weaknesses of them.

Also if you’re using a greatsword sword/warhorn on a warrior. The only thing you’re killing is NPC’s and not actual players and even then if you’re doing that in WvW you should be switching out that sword for something that gives more raw damage.

I’m guessing you don’t, or haven’t play a necromancer longer than a few hours. But hey, grass is always greener syndrome I suppose.

Mechanically, for this game at least, leeching is laughably broken. It doesn’t scale, it doesn’t work, and ANet is afraid to decouple the damage/healing portion of the effect so that it can actually be viable.

Party support? Are you kidding me? WHAT party support? Our skills are designed or function in such a way that people are trained to avoid what we do to support our party. See a big black well on the ground? 95% of the people will literally dodge roll OUT of it simply because the effects are so similar that people can’t tell at a glance which Well is which. And besides all that, it pales in comparison to simple just slotting every person in the party with a berserk war and just plowing your face through a dungeon. As I said before, there is a reason you see LFGs advertising berserker warriors only. Necromancers have NO cleave weapons. At all.

The class mechanic is… still pretty bad. Its good if you trait specifically to use it, but otherwise all it does is prolong the inevitable. Its designed extremely poorly in that DS only scales with power builds, and the class is a condition class. Does that make any sense to you? Oh, yes, Tormented Shackles, the skill where ANet said we’d have the most access to Torment… except we don’t. Thieves, Mesmers, hell, even warriors stack torment better than we do on skills with lower CDs (5+ stacks with 10 second CDs vs 3 stacks at 40 second CD). You also seem to be unaware of the recently introduced bug (or maybe its a feature now since they did the same with Putrid Mark, yay for stealth nerfs disguised as bugs!) where we are literally locked out of every skill for 1-2 seconds on dropping DS. Our normal HP bar is vulnerable, but we can’t cast anything. Are you starting to see the flaws yet, or are you still thinking warriors aren’t doing everything a necromancer does but better?

Swiftness is not mobility. Its a speed buff. Everyone has that in some form or another. Mobility is GS Whirlwind, Sword Leap, Bull’s Rush, GS Charge. Ever try to catch a warrior that doesn’t want to be caught? Yeah, I’m talking about that. Its impossible for necromancers to run unless they have Spectral Walk slotted and standing next to a cliff.

Travis the Terrible.4739:

Warrior damage has been NERFED since the launch of the game. Seriously GO BACK AND LOOK. Anet has nerfed warriors DPS potential with the quickness change, leg specialist nerf, amongst other changes, and actually nerfing the damage numbers on skills. The warrior having high defense with high hp? GO COMPLAIN ABOUT NECRO HP! They have twice the hp of a warrior (yes thats right death shroud is basically another hp). With great damage and decent mobility and everything a warrior has.

Seriously warrior damage? Its atrocious compared to what it use to be. There regen has only increased because of trait effectiveness, healing signet being buffed to actually being viable instead of Healing Surge all day everyday.

Hammer auto does nothing really other than to serve a purpose to build adrenaline.

I’ve mained a necromancer since day one. I just want to point out that necromancer damage, while isn’t terrible, is still utterly lack luster in comparison to a warriors damage output. From a PVE perspective, Hundred Blades alone puts out far more damage than a necromancer can in the same time span, and the longer the fight continues (because HB is only a 7 second CD, WTF?), that damage gap only increases. Yes, Life Blast can crit pretty hard, but its nothing compared to cleaving 3 things with HB. You wonder why you see LFGs that say berserk wars only? This skill, plus the fact a warrior can stack might like a champ, buff his party’s damage output with banners, and still boast ridiculous survivability in the form of that Healing Signet and high HP pool.

I’m not dismissing necromancers as terrible, far from it. They hold their own quite well, but its really short sighted to call Death Shroud a second life pool when its very mechanic is whats holding the class’s potential back. As far as survivability goes? Necromancers are not that good at it. They’re pretty terrible at surviving compared to thief, warrior (post Healing Signet buff), mesmer, and ele. High HP with no skills to block/dodge/avoid/absorb/regenerate incoming damage is meaningless. I can live practically forever with my warrior because of the GS/Sword mobility. My necro? If I get caught by more than 2-3 people, I’m dead. No exceptions.

I need to point out that your statement about necromancers having any kind of mobility is flat out wrong. Necromancers have ZERO mobility, and ANet has not given them anything meaningful to compensate for this lack of mobility. To be quite honest? Necromancer should have gotten the warriors Healing Signet. It actually fits the necromancer theme, but instead we get that kittenty Signet of Vamprism.

I have two different looks I use. Top one is more casual for RPing and dailies, the bottom is for doing dungeons, WvW, and farming.

Iris Ashensoul.

Vodac.9742:

So for instance, Rytlock Brimstone is Rytlock of the Brim warband and his personal nickname within the group is “Stone”

Actually, his warband is the Stone warband. I only know this from conversations with Rox about the trials she has been through in order to join Rytlock’s warband. You can still find her in the North Nolan Hatchery where that Flame and Frost instance was. You can still enter it and talk to her.

There is also the Night warband in Diessa Plateau. Some of the members break the traditional rule and have “night” as the second compound, such as Hazarar Razenight, Faint Ghostnight, and Rankar Harrownight who are part of the Flame Legion event in the northeast corner of the map.

These examples seem to be the exception rather than the rule. The majority of warband names do typically list the name of the warband as the first compound, followed by the nickname as the second.

Rennoko.5731:

I am on Maguuma

Next time Maguuma goes up against Tarnished Coast, I’m gonna look around for ya. Or perhaps just ask you to duel me behind the windmill. You look like you’d be a fun fight.

What server are you on Rennoko?

OP plays mesmer. Nuff said.

Also, people shouldn’t expect to keep conditions off them 100% of the time. Otherwise conditions would be completely useless. You need to use your clears strategically. 9 times out of 10 people will blow their condi cleanse on the first 3 bleed stacks I put on them. L2P issue I think.

People in this thread are missing the bigger picture. Fear itself is actually a very weak CC effect for two reasons. 1.) Its both a condition and a stun. Stun breakers AND condition clears remove it. 2.) In order for it to do damage, the necromancer must trait into it. This damage is actually extremely weak by comparison to other CC effects. Earthshaker can crit as high as 11k damage and will stun you for up to 4 seconds with sigil of paralyzation. Skull Crack can hit you for upwards of 5k and stun you for 4 seconds with sigil of paralyzation. Yes, both of these skills can be chained. Sigil of paralyzation no longer works on fear, but fear is still affected by stun and condition reduction effects. A thief has the best CC chain in the game using S/D. They can spam 3 second dazes every 4 seconds leaving you with next to no time to do anything. Each time they do this the damage you receive far FAR exceeds the damage you would take from Terror.

Necros have 2 fears. Walking into the wall is your fault and is definitely a learn to play issue. If the necro uses both fears at the same time, 1 stunbreaker/condition clear removes both of them. If you get hit with 2 stuns or dazes, you will need 2 different stun breakers to remove them. Be careful what you wish for.

Exedore.6320:

Here’s my unconstructive feedback: All people whining about the necromancer nerfs should shut up and learn to play. If you’re a necromancer and couldn’t tell how broken the dhuumfire condition necromancer build was in PvP and how it was trivializing gameplay, then you’re bad at necromancer. There’s more whining coming from necromancers in the past week than I’ve seen from warriors in the past 6 months when they’ve been in an even worse state in PvP.

If you want to offer constructive feedback, that’s fine. But re-posting memes and other insults toward ANet and non-necromancers across the forums doesn’t help your cause.

You play a thief, right?

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Thesilentflute.8761:

The other classes that stun lock have to constantly cast skills to do it they don’t get to dps in between cc.

This is also important. to chain CC other classes have to trait, use weapon skills AND utilities and they have to keep an eye on it and do it PERFECT timing to keep you stunned and what do they do while they are stunning you?

Necro = Chain the fear off the bat with Torment and then go to town with Marks and done.

So you’re implying that necromancers don’t do the same? In order for fear to last longer than 1 second, a necromancer must first go 20 points into Soul Reaping to get Master of Terror, which only adds an additional 1/2 second to fear. Then, in order for terror to actually do any damage, they must then go 20 points into Curses to get Terror. At this point, if the necromancer wants more duration, then they must put the remaining points into a power line for condition duration. This sacrifices defensive stats that they may have gotten from Blood Magic or Death Magic in exchange for a useless stat (power) for a condition build.

In other words, this build is equivalent to every other classes glass cannon builds. Yes, necromancers are a little bit tougher than the other classes glass counter parts, but the other classes have invulns, blocks, dodges, vigor, leaps, stealth and other such mobility skills to compensate, all of which are far superior to death shroud in terms of damage avoidance. Necros just face tank everything thrown at them, which they don’t do very well outside of a 1v1 scenario. This game is not balanced around 1v1. 2 people on a necro = guaranteed dead necro. This cannot be said for the other glass specs. Especially for mesmers and thieves.

Thesilentflute.8761:

The other classes that stun lock have to constantly cast skills to do it they don’t get to dps in between cc.

Are you kidding me? You’ve never been stunlocked to death by a warrior before have you? You’ve never been dazed locked by a S/D thief yet? Warrior stuns will last up to 4 seconds depending on sigils. Thief daze will last up to 3 seconds depending on sigils, and thieves can spam the ever living hell out of this combo. BOTH of these classes when they hit you with their CC effect can hit you any where from 3-6k with them (and Earthshaker can potentially crit for 11k depending on the toughness of the target it hits). Knock down effects also last a hell of a lot longer than fear, and stunbreaking knock back effects is extremely tedious. Use the ability to soon and you waste it, not breaking the stun. These FAR exceed the damage you would have received from Terror. All of this while they’re also beating on you with their other attacks.

Furthermore, if these targets have stability, they STILL take the damage from these attacks, where as if the target has stability and they get hit with fear, they take 0 damage from it.

Allie Murdock.8152:

Fungalfoot.7213, PvE balance is a completely different beast, as there are insane amounts of things that undergo balance changes (Different classes of creatures, dungeons, Story instances, events, etc.).

To balance PvE, you’re essentially involving every team but the PvP team. So, when you guys talk about Profession balance, please keep in mind what areas of the game you are referring to when you post your feedback in those sub-sections of the forums.

Which brings something else to mind. The sPvP forums are specifically to discuss sPvP changes, or things that affect sPvP. If you would like to discuss PvE, please use the appropriate sub-forums.

Thanks!

I don’t understand. A lot of the changes that happens to classes are the result of PvP balancing. This affects PvE players as well since up until yesterday, you have done very little to actually separate the two. Nerfing a skill in PvP has had the direct affect of nerfing it every where else as well. So when we see these nerfs, it makes a lot of sense for us to come to this forum to voice our concerns regarding these changes.

The discussions from these forums are in fact where the ideas for these changes originate, right? I don’t understand why you would tell us not to come here when it is in fact the players and the feed back you are relaying from these forums that is facilitating these changes.

Warcry.1596:

Your argument is that “Corrupt Boon” is dodgable? You do realize it is an instant cast? You have to know when they will do it, and if as a Guardian, I use Save Yourselves, that is a good indicator of when they will use it, so I do dodge right after I cast it, but that isn’t a guarantee. They can Corrupt Boon ANYTIME without me having a chance to react to it. Saying it is dodgeable is a poor argument

Nah, its a pretty good argument. Especially considering that half the time we use it, it doesn’t even work. Its a projectile after all and gets obstructed by twigs and random invisible objects on the map no one can actually see. Not to mention that sometimes it just flat out fails to work period for some odd reason.

Seezungenschleuder.8319:

No, it doesn’t. Terror does the exact same amount of damage if you have two conditions vs 6 conditions. You guys need to actually read what the trait does. If the target has NO conditions, terror does 50% less damage. If the target has 1 or more conditions, terror will do 50% more damage. Its not increased damage per condition. Its a flat 50% increase in damage, regardless of how many conditions the target has. Just as long as there is at least 1 condition.

Dhuumfire is still not a cool thing.

Well, heres a tip. Nobody wanted it. Most necros want it gone because it doesn’t fit the theme of the class. We think its a terrible trait that has screwed up our class and gotten several non-op traits nerfed just to placate its existence. We don’t understand why it was even given to us.

Seezungenschleuder.8319:

Because the fear trait scales with conditions on the opponent, it synergizes well with Dhuumfire and the new torment condition. So I suggest to remove that condition-scaling component from the trait.

No, it doesn’t. Terror does the exact same amount of damage if you have two conditions vs 6 conditions. You guys need to actually read what the trait does. If the target has NO conditions, terror does normal damage (less than burning now). If the target has 1 or more conditions, terror will do 50% more damage. Its not increased damage per condition. Its a flat 50% increase in damage, regardless of how many conditions the target has. Just as long as there is at least 1 condition other than itself.

Streets.2705:

Enundr.9305:

Kravick.4906:

Fenrir.5493:

I hope they address the thing that they have so much deathshroud that is just OP, before this it was fair but now they have like 3 bars of health, they should give this class another thing to move and not make them tanks, this is not good aproach because they are becoming really OP by having so much health.

Actually, all they did was fix a bug.

First, necros took double damage while in death shroud. Second, instead of only giving us 66% of our base health pool, death shroud now gives us 100% of our base health pool. So now all the claims that we have two health bars is correct, as before we had only 2/3rds of what we were originally supposed to have, and we took double damage.

lol im trying to figure out where you guys are getting this much LF pool , with 20 into spite and 20 into death tree (and 30 into curses) i see a champion centaur in hinterlands drop me as fast now as it did before , just now i dont have that survivability vs a spike dmg in pve ( i would post in the pve /class forum but those forums are completely ignored at this point) , so yea there was no noticeable increase to our LF in pve atleast , still no good survivability , this is trying to use it defensively and still get mowed down btw……..this patch was a tremendous joke to Necros…..you ask ppl ingame that arent in the spvp / tpvp stuff and youll hear the same stuff.

You can try this trick to figure it out. I suggest doing it in Mists pvp staging area otherwise it’ll cost a bit to do the trait reset.

1. look at your HP, mine is 18372.
2. fill up LF pool to 100%.
3. add 10 points of Soul Reaping. For me, LF pool now says 91%, yes 91%.

10 points of Soul Reaping increases LF pool to 110% max HP. In my case 110% of 18372 is 20209 which 18372, the amount LF pool was at before step 3, is 91%. The Developers haven’t given any numbers out but stated they fixed a bug that caused Necros to take double the damage from direct attacks while in Death Shroud.

It was all percentage based. The same thing then would have done the exact same thing now.

There was also a bug that caused toughness not to work in death shroud, so there was a double whammy there. Toughness now works.