[SoF]
LOL. That’s my response. 3 days? It takes 20 minutes to learn the depth of and play skillfully any class in this game, tops. 10 minutes maximum to learn all of the different setups and weaknesses, then another 10 minutes to learn optimal roles and matchups
I’m sorry, who are you? What team were you on? What is your competitive experience with this game?
Solo queue personal best rank: 613 15-11
Team queue personal best rank: not found.I see, you’re one of those people that hasn’t actually played the game at a high level but think it’s extremely easy anyway. Just so you know, no player or team is anywhere near the “skillcap” of this game.
But you’re telling me you can go at least 50-50 in complete mirror matches with top players after playing a class for 40 minutes? We’re talking about specs that aren’t spirit ranger, necro, s/d thief, and instead builds like d/p thief, shatter Mesmer, s/d ele. Since you’re NA, I’d like to see you 1v1 people like caed, Supcutie, and phantaram on their main builds in a mirror match.
That’s not even getting into team play, which is what this game is all about. You’re telling me you’ll out bunker someone like lily or davinci after playing for 40 minutes? Good luck with that.
Folly, I didn’t once mention outplaying people in the segment you quoted me in lol. Also, you can pull rank on me all you want, I never dedicated the time to this game because I dedicated enough time to guild wars 1, and have a life and family now.
I’m not saying it takes 20 minutes to be able to outplay anybody in the game, I’m saying it takes 20 dedicated minutes of gameplay time, combined with the resources available (forums, twitch streaming, etc) to adequately learn the ins and outs of the specs and rotations in this game, especially when the gameplay has been severely dumbed down from the transition from guild wars 1 to guild wars 2.
The main component of skill in this game is teamplay. Communication, proper rotations, and trust and reliance on teammates.
I’m sorry I don’t have the time or the resources to find and play with a dedicated team in a community so small and a pvp so stagnant that it isn’t enjoyable to me, but that doesn’t invalidate any opinions I carry (yes, they are opinions), and it doesn’t immediately make things I say wrong just because I’ve spent maybe an hour in solo since its been released, and don’t have the time to play on a dedicated team.
I would love the opportunity to play against any of the people you mentioned, from my admittedly open fanboyism alone (I tell people in the ranger subforum to watch people like you to play all the time because it shows off rotations better and allows people to gain visual experience to learn the game). But I would appreciate it if in the future, you didn’t get on a high horse and try to pull rank and speak down at me, and instead, being on the high end of the leaderboards and such that you are, actually provide a counter argument from the experience I am incapable of achieving.
Until then, I will continue to stand by the fact that I believe that the classes in this game have an easy learning curve, especially after playing guild wars 1 competitively for about half a decade. The part of the game that takes skill involves learning the flow of combat, learning rotations, learning how to rotate properly, and gaining the confidence to make on the fly decisions that determine the outcome of the game.
If gw1 was so easy then why are you struggling in gw2?
Personal best of 650? My fiancé who focuses on PvE was rank 78 on her main and a best of rank 90 on her alt.
Funny that you don’t have time to be decent in gw2 but you have time to type those walls of text and rant about how gw1 involves do much more skill than gw2. I feel sorry for your neglected family =\
[SoF]
we were in the same ranking he was 12 and i was rank 11 so it should have worked
Rating, not PvP rank. Your ladder rating/rank.
If they both started fresh, which they seem to have, they’d have the same MMR.
i spoke about the leaderboard rating not our pvp rank sry for the misunderstanding….our pvp rank is currently 50 both
You were both rank 11 and 12on the leader board?
yes i was 11 with 11:0 and he was 12 with 11:1 wins/loss
The logical explanation while keeping the popular theory in line is that one of you filled a pre-existing queue and the other was placed in a different match-up. From there the rank differentials likely contributed.
[SoF]
Just because people can b skilled at connect4 doesn’t mean it’s as demanding and challenging to play as chess.
[SoF]
The spec is extremely easy to play get over it. You can make a ranger and do 3 matches as a spirit ranger and be good at the spec.
Why does my spirit ranger beat every other spirit ranger? If there’s no skill involved, shouldn’t they be able to beat me at least some of the time?
Because you are better at the game then they are or they are relatively new to the game. The only skill that class involves is learning how to body block and learning how to time your evades thats about it. The rest is just easy condi spam with passive burning. I guess the self rez takes a little skill…
I think I would beat you too. >_>
Yes because the class is overpowered.
You are welcome to play spirit ranger in the way you just described. I’d beat you on it still.
I do a play ranger…… the spec is easy its not your mad skilllzzzzzz that are beating people. Its the fact that the spec isn’t balanced.
But if that’s the case, how come someone who runs the same spec as me loses? Ah kitten it we go around in circles now don’t we.
Are you mentally handicapped? Why are you automatically assuming that everyone who plays spirit ranger is on the same skill level? It is a easy spec with a low skill level. Players can still suck and be better then other players playing the same spec. Or they could just be better at the game? Better rotations quicker reactions better movement. I am sorry I am the one who had to tell this to you.
Well that was incredibly rude, but I suppose I’ll answer you anyway. I know alot of younger people play, (hopefully with parental guidance.) I’m not automatically assuming that everyone is on the same skill level. That is exactly my point. You said there is no skill required to play spirit ranger. There clearly is if one spirit ranger consistently beats another spirit ranger with the exact same spec.
He said its easy to play not that it takes no skill.
[SoF]
I have trained with my Eles for months and tried hard to perfect my combo with Engineer, and yet I lose to some FOTM build ranger, he/she plays for 3 days Q___Q. Why is that? Maybe because I am suck, maybe….
This
[SoF]
That’s your opinion. Team Q is just like that too. Log on and press play now and bam you’re in a Ta match. Is that casual too?.
ideally, if you want to play and win team queue, you get 4 people and make them your friends, practice x hours a day and win team q fights. and you decide to go esports and join prized tourneys etc.
your example is a casual joining a team q match. which will be frustrated because matches are automatically uneven.
thus soloqueue. now the casual player who just press button and want an instant match is in even matches (minus the syncing cheaters of course, those you refer who take the boards seriously)
Even Anet stated that SoloQ was specifically designed for players who wanted to improve their competitive play without having to form a team. For players to be exposed to the competitive aspect without commitment.
The evidence suggests that Anet created this format to be competitive and for serious players looking to improve without committing to a team.
[SoF]
solo queue is meant for casual play. just log in press a button and you have a match. that’s it.
Casuals with a leader board yes.
Don’t box hot joins with casuals. Many who are serious about their glory rank are farming hotjoins. certainly not casuals.
That’s your opinion. Team Q is just like that too. Log on and press play now and bam you’re in a Ta match. Is that casual too?
Many people believe and/or want Solo Q to be competitive regardless of whether it not you think it is.
[SoF]
Saving it for the upcoming PvP reward changes
[SoF]
You can’t build PvP around casuals with E-Sports in mind. Competitive and ambitious players are bored pretty fast since the meta turned into this BS.
but Solo-Queue is for casuals and not esports. Esports is like PAX or mmorpg tourneys.
High end tourneys aka E-sports could just resort to “prohibited builds” rules and not ruin the fun of the casuals solo queuing.
Casuals with a leader board? Hot joins are casual. Many people are taking solo q very seriously. Anet perpetuates that mentality with the leader board.
[SoF]
There’s no specific formula for carrying a team. All you can do is put the odds in your favor as much as possible.
What it comes down to for me is this:
- communicate roles as much as possible before the match starts.
- switch classes if necessary and ask others if they are comfortable switching before the match starts.
- know your match ups but also identify bad players in key position s on the enemy team(a terrible bunker on their home pt for example).
- anticipate what your team will do and what the enemy will do. If you capped far and you kill 1 person at mid but the others at mid are bunkering and it will be a long fight don’t stay to just let the guy you killed decap fr uncontested.
-know when to peel from group fights.
-obtain positional advantages where you can see enemy rotations. The sooner you tell someone to get back to home the better.
- be specific. Don’t just ask for 1 to go home tell your guard to in order to prevent two ppl going back when only 1 is needed.
- never engage in an argument with your team. It’s solo q and your teammates will do whatever they want so it’s up to you to rect accordingly. If no one goes home at start when you asked someone to you just need to suck it up and cap home. React, don’t dictate. An argument in team chat is detrimental to the whole team. It prevents communication, lowers the motivation and increases hostility.
- support what you own. Don’t be so aggressive that you lose what you own.
By working to attain as many advantages as possible and limiting the amount the enemy can get you will be in that much better of a position to win.
You can sit quiet in your team and go with the flow or you can be proactive and do what needs to be done.
Rank wise that match isn’t terribly imbalanced.
[SoF]
Yeah the meta will be hilarious when they balance rangers and necros since many players have been riding the fotm and will be stumped on what to do against the players who have been perfecting techniques on technical play.
Less than a month!
FOTMS/META builds are good for the casuals to get into pvp.
Nerfing them will be a bad idea.
a skilled player playing an fotm/meta build will win against a casual playing an fotm/meta build. so it’s still skill that matters.
just rebuff BM rangers so we will have spirit rangers and bm rangers viable.
In the name of build diversity.
I said balance, not nerf. Clearly we have differing views on what’s balanced and no discussion will have us agreeing with each other.
I agree that there should be easy-to-learn builds for newer players to enter competitive play but traditionally those easy builds don’t dominate the entire meta for the past two months. Even at the highest levels of play do we see spirit rangers. SYNC ran 2 and dominated their competition. The 2 players on SYNC said they hated ranger but it was so absurdly Op that they were pigeonholed into running it if they wanted to compete.
[SoF]
If you’re not implying them then why would you even ask? Flawgic akittens finest.
Funny how you quote me out of context on the topic of carry. I explicitly said “influence the outcome of the match for the better”
You can be dense, misquote, lie and misrepresent all you want.
With that mentality no wonder you can’t carry.
Add me on Skype if you want to actually discuss this. I’ll be home in 5 hours and will be on all night or I can catch you any time tomorrow.
Lux.Lucis.Ferre
[SoF]
Yeah the meta will be hilarious when they balance rangers and necros since many players have been riding the fotm and will be stumped on what to do against the players who have been perfecting techniques on technical play.
Less than a month!
[SoF]
we were in the same ranking he was 12 and i was rank 11 so it should have worked
Rating, not PvP rank. Your ladder rating/rank.
If they both started fresh, which they seem to have, they’d have the same MMR.
i spoke about the leaderboard rating not our pvp rank sry for the misunderstanding….our pvp rank is currently 50 both
You were both rank 11 and 12on the leader board?
[SoF]
(edited by Lux.7169)
So you’re basing 1 off of an assumption and your own small, limited tests? Where did I say I disagreed? I never once said I did and now your implying that I did. I was pointing out that what you’re stating as a fact in 1 is merely your personal opinion uncertified or disproved.
In 2 you’re incorrectly assuming my point. By team score I was referring to close games with low ranked players on your team against high ranked players. Where did I say I disagreed? You assumed that to.
In point 3 you’re assuming your own definition if carry. No one in these forums who talk about carrying us talking about 1 beating 5 consistently or ever. What I believe to be the general consensus of carrying your team is accomplishing more than what a team should expect of you so much so that you influence the outcome if the match for the better. You’re welcome to point out the bad players in the top 100 to me. Or better yet link me to any pro player with 20+ games not in the top 1,000.
If I said 4 then please show me. You mean to ask if I’m implying it and no, I never said not implied that. There is, however, a correlation.
You never answered my questions. Please, I’d like to see why you keep changing your story. Why do you keep making these assumptions and stating them as fast? Why are you so evasive and defensive about the conversation? When I bring a point up you ignore it and divert the attention elsewhere.
The straw men…. Everywhere.
[SoF]
Of course you can carry people unless you’re playing where you should be.
You’re contradicting yourself as well. You said since the rating method is hidden we don’t know exactly what’s factoring into MMR. Now you’re claiming as fact that personal score and team score have 0 influence on the match. Where’s your proof? Why are you stating it as fact? Why have you changed your story?
[SoF]
I agree completely, Lowell. I have gotten that message several times. In a game where communication and rotations are fundamentals to winning it is ridiculous to have communication BLOCKS.
If someone does troll chat as the other poster commented the team could report him for trolling. I’ve never seen someone spam chat in solo q yet. Definitely been blocked several times.
[SoF]
That’s one thing I loved about gw1 you could immediately tell what your enemies were by their visuals.
[SoF]
Of course it’s who you beat? You’re talking as if no one knew it was when you won. Genius observation.
Your first response was about my statement. The points and loss gains, as described in my statement, was about a soloque which only qualifying measure was points gained through winning and losing…so yes, you’re also pretty genius. You don’t gain/lose ranks/mmr on anything other than a win or loss.
Did you also know that double clicking the gw2 icon starts the game?
I would love for you to point out who you’re explaining this to? Who didn’t know that you had to win to get a better rank? Please tell me.
Why don’t you take 2 seconds to read the post you are referencing. I stated, that a leaderboard for soloque that is driven on points from wins/losses won’t work. Your response? NO IT’S WHO YOU WIN OR LOSE TO…so apparently I’m explaining this to you.
What I read was you trying to contradict Silent when he corrected you and as the conversation continues you amend your story.
He corrected saying your rank is based on WHO you beat. You can lose 7,000 matches in a row and then beat the top 10 players 10 times in a row and potentially be in the top 1% of players.
After he corrected you, you argued sating that no it was based on wins and losses which implies a ratio. Regardless, his statement was far more accurate.
If you agreed with him that what matters most is who you beat then why perpetuate it? Now you’ve modified your story to act as if what he was saying is common sense and that what’s truly going over people’s heads is that you have to win to increase MMR and if you lose the your MMR goes down.
[SoF]
Of course it’s who you beat? You’re talking as if no one knew it was when you won. Genius observation.
Your first response was about my statement. The points and loss gains, as described in my statement, was about a soloque which only qualifying measure was points gained through winning and losing…so yes, you’re also pretty genius. You don’t gain/lose ranks/mmr on anything other than a win or loss.
Did you also know that double clicking the gw2 icon starts the game?
I would love for you to point out who you’re explaining this to? Who didn’t know that you had to win to get a better rank? Please tell me.
[SoF]
So all of you have reported this via the in-game bug reporting feature? I’m guessing if you got every player on your team to report it every time the map came up, something might get done (just to stop the reports).
I doubt coming in here and reporting it in a thread (rather rudely) is going to get more than a passing mention to the people responsible for looking into and fixing it.
It’s a discussion. On the topic of rude: coming in to harass the OP and post inflammatory remarks is the only rude thing I see.
There’s a report button for topics too, you know?
Hypocrisy in its finest.
[SoF]
we were in the same ranking he was 12 and i was rank 11 so it should have worked
Rating, not PvP rank. Your ladder rating/rank.
If they both started fresh, which they seem to have, they’d have the same MMR.
That’s an assumption he can verify. Regardless ONE single game of playing on different teams can set them apart by THOUSANDS of ranks even if they both won. That alone is enough to make it much more difficult to sync.
[SoF]
Of course it’s who you beat? You’re talking as if no one knew it was when you won. Genius observation.
[SoF]
It’s not win-loss. It is WHO you won or lost against. Their MMR rating is key.
It is win loss, if the system is working appropriately, you should be paired with people at or around your mmr. If you win you gain MMR if you lose, you lose it. The degree or point gain vs loss is hidden, so no one can speak of it. Is the gain based on the average mmr of the teams competing or my personal MMR compared to the other team. All of that is problematic, as you can see.
No, it’s WHO you beat. Correlation does not imply causation.
For example my w/l is about 50% but I am 300ish rank.
Someone on my friends list is 19/12 about a 69% winrate and he is in the bottom 35% about 3,500+++ ranks below me. It matters more on WHO you beat and what their MMR is and NOT how many more wins than losses you have.
[SoF]
we were in the same ranking he was 12 and i was rank 11 so it should have worked
Rating, not PvP rank. Your ladder rating/rank.
[SoF]
Played well over 100 games and I am absolutely positive that MOST of them were Temple and Spiritwatch. The least was forest and legacy.
[SoF]
yes, because hes ignoring how finishing moves work, and using a bug to insure target is downed. are you saying if you go down you should just stay still and not try to stay alive?
This should be fixed, along with the hundred of other bugs in pvp.
So should aegis not affect players being stomped? How about distortion? Should you be able to stomp every mesmer using distortion to stomp? How about stability, should we nerf stability from stomping? No more DS stomping?
I’ve been interrupted by EVERY single skill that interrupts when downed after laying a BP to stomp. Every single class can time their attacks to LAND their interrupt THROUGH black powder and every other ground blind in the game.
If you’re good enough then it’s no problem interrupting and finding that sweet spot. This is a L2P issue.
[SoF]
Is there somewhere I can find a list of all of these CA commands? That would be extremely helpful!
[SoF]
I’d never thought of that. I like some of those ideas
[SoF]
Like Symbolic who started late? He went 11-0 about 30 hours ago.
[SoF]
Looking to see what more people think when it comes to the upcoming PvP reward revamp.
[SoF]
You want competitive and serious? Go tPvP. There are just as many no-shows and afkers at my level as the others.
[SoF]
You get downed by a thief and complain that he tele-stomps you?
[SoF]
I get afkers, quitters, trolls, people throwing matches due to failed syncs but what I have come to accept and what most people will accept sooner or later is that it’s random arenas with variables not easily controlled by arena net. Sure they could make some quality of life fixes or add incentives not to cheat the system but in the end the biggest problem is other players. Realizing that those losses do not reflect your ability and not taking the leader board in random arenas too seriously is what’s going to give you the most fun because you’d be in the game playing instead of spending most of that time in the forums complaining about the current system.
Did I stop playing when my winrate was almost 75% ? No. I don’t care about LB I just want to play.
On topic, I understand why you’re asking for this but no, it would make it seem like the LB is more important than it really is.
If you’re good I won’t know from the LB. I will know because you gave me a hell of a fight in game. Not because you went 11-0 and sat at rank 1 for 17 hours.
[SoF]
Why don’t you just enjoy solo q without obsessing over the leader board. You’ve played 15 solo q games since its been released and created over 50 topics obsessing over it or screaming for attention.
[SoF]
Solo Q is so much more enjoyable than the other modes if you just want to hop into a 5v5 serious match of randoms (barring the random leavers/disconnects).
I love it and won’t stop regardless of its current flaws.
[SoF]
This would only perpetuate the Syncing dilemma which I believe a majority of the community would like to see fixed rather than encouraged.
If they patched the syncing issue then yes, win streaks would be great.
[SoF]
It took 2.5 days for the NA ladder to hit 1,000.
I wasn’t keeping up with EU but I did know they had more people on the ladder than NA did when NA was around 500 EU was around 750.
[SoF]
I hate that it happened because its very unfortunate. It’s refreshing to know that you guys will still keep playing in spite of this.
The game needs more tournaments like this hosted in game so restrictions like these don’t stop the arguably best team from competing.
[SoF]
(edited by Lux.7169)
6pm-11pm EST weekdays and on weekends from 1pm-12am EST
[SoF]
I am very impressed with the warrior play I’ve seen in solo q by nikkle, riippii and Z O N E and Ezra ( plus a few more I don’t remember). At the moment if they are played right in high end games they carry their weight. Could use a couple minor buffs though.
[SoF]
Anyone who signed up for the qualifiers knows that mist league hosted them and not Anet. The extent of the qualifications to go to pax was the leader of the team clicking “I agree that all members of this team are above 18 and are in an eligible location—click to see list if eligible locations.”
[SoF]
Better PvP rewards is a must have for this game. I played PvP for like 5~6 months before go play some PvE and i felt really dumb for spent my time with PvP. Now I have an appearance i like in PvE but i want to play the same chracter on PvP. I feel like im a different person while playing PvP, It’s like i have a double life. I want a way to have the SAME appearance at PvP and PvE.
In my opinion a good start is to make all skins acessible in PvP, and ways to earn em (PvP reward towards glory, not rank). Not this ridiculous rank grind that takes forever to earn a skin that you can get in less than a week of PvE play.
Exactly. I felt like I wasted time when I first Ovid for two months and entered PvP and by the time I went back into PvP I felt like I had nothing at all to show for what I did on PvE.
[SoF]
500 000 Glory is nothing. I am sitting on around 850 000k. Legendarys should be achievable only by winning seasons or due to records (highest winning streak etc.). Glory is a kittenty indicator for who is a real legend and who is just a hotjoin scrub.
And winning 250 tourneys is also fairly easy. Thinking back of how much chests I got during this year – must be around 2k-2.5k
I am basing prices off of the amount of time it takes to get one in PvE. How is grinding for the skin in PvE any different than grinding for it in PvP? It’s a stylistic choice not meant to be exclusive to the elite players. Those tourneys have cash prizes.
[SoF]
From my understanding (from reading announcements on what is scheduled for 2013) PvP reward changes are the next big thing in line. While we don’t really know what to expect I think it’s early enough to brainstorm and let the devs know what we want and how we want it NOW rather than wait until they finalize it and then complain.
I believe the entire community agrees we would like access to ALL of the skins that are available in PvE. The question is how should they implement this without making our past efforts in PvP meaningless.
My suggestion is as follows:
Someone mentioned PvP tokens as a currency for a PvP item vendor. While I realize that we already have glory as the main currency (we don’t even need tokens if they want to continue with glory exclusively but speaking in terms of tokens will be easier for me) the tokens could be used for special skins.
The vendor would sell exotics and legendaries at fixed prices. Now what would be a fair price?
I believe for a LEGENDARY 500 tokens would be fair. Tokens can be purchased for 1,000 glory or won during a ranked PvP match (1 for solo q wins and 2 for team arena wins).
That translates to either 500,000 glory, 500 solo q wins, or 250 team arena wins to get 1 legendary weapon. Obviously some combination of that.
Then we have items like Volcanus and Visions of the Mists which could be sold for half the tokens a legendary would cost.
I know some people don’t want the special effect weapons in PvP because of the animations but that can be fixed with a graphics option that tones down those effects.
I also feel that the current reward system needs to be nixed altogether. Rank-base armor just griefs the player base. Players want to make their dream toon in PVP but are hugely limited to select skins available at their rank and are forced to grind meaningless ranks just to improve aesthetics. If the token vendor sold ALLof these skins for XX tokens then players could save up tokens for whatever they wanted and it would give them inventive to be active in PvP.
While I fully support the split between PvP and PvE in terms of skill balanced they need to tear down that barrier with PvP rewards. Many of us are avid in both spectrums and it feels like I am playing two completely different games. Nothing I do in PvE helps me with PvP aesthetics and when I go to PvE I have nothing to show for my PvP accomplishments except /rank and no one has any idea what it means when I do it.
Thus, what would it hurt if we earned karma and gold for doing PvP. Not only would it be a great bonus for us to host more tourneys with gold prizes but it would bring a TON more players to the competitive scene who currently avoid it due to lack of incentives.
Eliminating the PvP/PvE reward barrier would solve a lot of problems the current system is facing: population and incentive.
My last note is about Team Arenas. It’s literally on the fast track to dying because its not worth the effort and possibility of people rejecting you to try and make a team.
I think the current team arenas with 1 match is not going to work now that we have solo q. I suggest revert back to a daily automated tournament system and offer big prizes. 3 tournaments a day, Swiss style like in gw1 and offer 100gold+20 tokens to the winning players and then have2nd and3rd place rewards. Motivation like that will be incentive enough for people to form teams and play.
Now that I’ve gone through my wish list, how do you guys think the reward system should be revamped?
+1 if you support something like I suggested.
[SoF]
(edited by Lux.7169)
I completely agree that these changes would greatly balance the system.
+1
[SoF]
Did you win Narcin?
He did. A testament that one player CAN carry a team.
/wishful thinking
[SoF]
Dishonored is definitely working. You can think of it like this: You can leave a maximum of 5 times in 3 days.
@Kito: What you described is valid, but we’ve kept you from leaving for 71 hours.
We will continue to watch the rate at which people acquire dishonor and make adjustments as needed.
I fully support the dishonor system but I have a question. My Internet isn’t 100% reliable and in the past two days of Solo Q I have dcd in 2 matches but open my game back up as fast as it can to hop back in the match. Does every dc count as a dishonor?
You will not gain dishonor if you reconnect. We specifically chose our numbers to allow for some unintentional disconnects.
Great! Thank you for the clarification.
[SoF]