Guild Wars 2

Glamorous Recovery sounds GLORIOUS! (glamour enthusiast here) I’d rather have it give you and allies healing per second you’re inside of it. And scrapping DS it isn’t a reality, so suggesting such is counter-productive imho. If that were the case, many gms would have been scrapped by this point. Those are some interesting gm traits for Inspiration though.

Well I’m more ignorant than I thought then. haha I guess I’ve never really used SC enough to remember that. I actually don’t think that’s too horrible. It’s not optimal and cuts back a tremendous amount of power in exchange for some team condi removal. However, the goal would still be similar to that of the classic shatter Mesmer.

You’re right. It does sort of out compete the other skills, but that isn’t hard to do.

I’m ok with the idea of having the ICD to prevent aoe interrupts from proccing, but the healing should be higher if this is the case. I would even accept a healing of 500 if it meant that AOE interrupts would proc the trait. lol Mesmer would be your go-to fro team condi removal!!

Shattered Conditions should remove conditions per illusion shattered and have an internal cool down to prevent from being really OP with DE. Restorative Illusions should heal more than what it does and be AOE. Those simple changes make them worth going 0/4/0/6/4 imho.

Also, this would work just like BI, so AOE interrupts would be devastatingly strong. Maybe my healing number is too high in that case. Maybe it’d be a bit overpowered with the amount of interrupts we have at our disposal.

Eta – Now this is how you would sustain someone that is aggressively disrupting the enemy!

Guys, let’s try to keep the discussion focused on how to make “Disrupter’s Sustainment” better. Keeping the name in mind, I think it’s best to have it remain an interrupt skill. Let’s face it, Anet isn’t going to look at this thread and scrap the name to give us something more phantasm related, so we have to be realistic in our discussion if we’re trying to have updates given to us.

After some more thought, how I would change it:

Disrupter’s Sustainment
Remove 1 condition from yourself and nearby allies when you interrupt a foe. Conditions removed grants healing.

• Healing: 1000
• Number of Targets: 5
• Radius: 400

I’m not sure how these numbers look, but hopefully you guys get the idea? It would give rise to a legitimate support melee mesmer using mantras to heal and remove conditions from your team in the thick of battle.

Criticisms of this design are welcomed.

ETA – I changed the healing from 1500 to 1000 to make it somewhat comparable to the other gm traits in this line.

It’s essentially the other two gm traits combined except for interrupt builds. However, the differences would be interesting if implemented this way. I like that with my DS, you only get healing with conditions removed, which isn’t exactly hard to time, but Restorative Illusions is guaranteed healing. There is a chaotic nature to interrupts even for those best interrupters out there. For this reason, I don’t think it’d be over powered, but when it works it can be AMAZING for your team (like all interrupt builds).

Sticker <3 <3 Miss you too. I’ve been extremely busy lately. I’ll message you on fb.

I’ll be back to play the living story tomorrow though. I’m sure some pvp will be involved as well!

I like Sticker’s suggestion. Making it heal AOE on interrupt for a decent amount would be nice and pair nicely with the mantra heal. It would make healing bunker builds more viable. I’m envisioning a 0/4/4/6/0 build that would be really fun to play.

Or better yet, 0/2/6/6/0 for both CI and DS. Oh how nice that would be with sword/focus+staff!!

It shouldn’t have an internal CD. It should effect AA.

Those two simple changes would make it viable even with it not effecting thieves. The ICD makes it almost completely non-viable especially when it’s next to CS. The PB nerf was way too severe.

If anything was added, I would love something like Weakness being applied on interrupt. We have enough boon stripping. Let’s not be greedy and suggest this bypass stability.

CI lockdown builds do well.

My main tpvp Mesmer build is a 0/4/6/4/0 hybrid support build. vigorous shatters for support. CI for the AOE lockdowns. S. Inspiration for the massive boon sharing. IT works pretty kitten well in all of my teams.

You’re forgetting the increased daze duration especially in combination with Mesmer runes. If all CS did was give a 50% 1s on daze, it WOULD be worthless like you describe, but it doesn’t.

There are pros for stun vs immob. I don’t think we need to argue about that. Both CS and CI are valid lock down varieties. Remember, you don’t need to land an interrupt to lock someone down in a stun. That’s the key difference here. Also, stun breakers are less common than condi clear. That’s another difference.

I use CI way more than I use CS, but I don’t think it’s fair to call CS a garbage gm, because it’s actually QUITE strong.

I’m still distracted by the fact that someone said “CS is virtually never of any benefit.”

Advent.6193:

keenlam.4753:

Crossplay.2067:

I agree that Time Warp should be a glamor and it should chill enemies inside of it. That would make up for the 50% quickness nerf that it was never compensated for. Mass Invisibility, on the other hand, needs a lot of work as Thief’s Shadow Refuge does the same thing but better. What’s worse, not only is it a normal utility skill but it has a shorter cooldown.

We should have a grandmaster trait that buffs our glamour skills while we at it.
Look at mantras, they have been getting better and better with 2 gm traits dedicated to them. Meanwhile glamour skills see less and less play and are strictly utilities.

Maybe grandmaster trait: glamour skills inflict 2s of chill at target location. Get rid of that abomination Disrupter’s Sustainment for something like this would be nice.

How does the phrase go, keenlam?
All of my Yes.

Nothing sounds more magical than this.

Pwent.2639:

I just want portal to be an elite, i would take it over mass invis every day of the week. Even more so if it got a slight buff.

Then, they could make Time Warp a glamour utility. It’d need to be reworked a lot for people to even use it though. If glamours builds were viable…

I think the strength of dps and bunkering should be equal. What’s so horrible about that? As of right now, I see it pretty balanced. It’s more of a meta/player culture issue than anything else at this point, especially when looking at it from an EU vs NA perspective.

We’re in a pvp state of balance between the professions. I feel like there should be a huge celebration of this.

Fay.2357:

MailMail.6534:

Forget the elites. I just want Chaos Storm to count as a glamour, and I’d be eternally happy.

That would sorta be breaking the standard among all classes that weapon skills do not ever count as one of the utility types that traits affect.

Ahh I didn’t know that. I only play Mesmer and haven’t ever taken the time to study other profession traits. I need to get my study on!! That is a good standard to have though.

You never wanna +1 the guy with the name “Elitist” but here I am…

Forget the elites. I just want Chaos Storm to count as a glamour, and I’d be eternally happy.

The only buff it needs is for enemies to not know which Mesmer to stomp. It adds to the Mesmer theme of chaos and chance. Hell, you could get stomped the first try or get lucky and have your enemy stomp the two clones which gives enough time for help.

It still gives me a chuckle when noobs stomp the wrong Mesmer. lawl

Fay.2357:

zaxon.6819:

ross biddle you are saying how effective PU is in competitive pvp.. yet you do not play it and either does any other team.

Yeah, and pretty much no top level team uses mesmers at all, so what does that tell you?

Well this is fanatically wrong.

Ooo that Pyro shade was bone chillingly delicious!

It’s a shame that threads like these still exist. sigh There’s a low skill cap on PU, but so what? Anyone who says otherwise are fanatically wrong. That being said, it IS an effective build in the hands of the skill for several formats, and they shouldn’t be shamed for using the tools in their utility belt. It’s not the “best” in team fights or tpvp, but as some have said, it has its arguments.

Don’t be silly, of course not. I’m guilty of making fun of Mesmers who use PU, but it’s an effective build and a force to be reckoned with. Ignore the real scumbags like me and enjoy playing the game!!

Oh I understand what you mean there, but people I have played with tend to use my definition of the term more often I guess?

Like I said before, when people in game tell me something is a crutch, it usually is in a somewhat derogatory way that you mentioned. However, I don’t see many people running dps Shatter Mesmer and saying they don’t use DE because it’s a crutch that they don’t need. lol

To call something a “crutch” is to imply that you’re using something because without it, you’d be much less effective otherwise. However, there’s usually the second implication that people who use these “crutches” aren’t actually handicapped to begin with.

For example, in order to be an effective Shatter Mesmer, you need Deceptive Evasion. However, there are several builds that don’t need this trait yet most Mesmers trait into it, because in general, Deceptive Evasion is a crutch.

Arganthium.5638:

MailMail.6534:

I think that’s messing too much with the mechanics. If iWarden is ground targeted, I’d want consistency with all phantasms, and I don’t think that’s a good idea.

Yeah, I agree, the same way I think that Chaos Storm should be placed where you’re standing to maintain consistency within staff and Confusing Images should also apply torment to maintain consistency within Scepter.

My sarcasm senses are tingling.

You missed my entire point. Phantasm skills aren’t unique to just one weapon. It can be considered a category of skills within the Mesmer’s kitten nal. There is NOTHING to compare Chaos Storm or Confusing Images with (I take this back, Chaos Storm is like a glamour) so idk why you even mentioned these skills. -__-

To reiterate my point, the way Phantasms are cast should be consistent among all weapons.

I can’t 1+ this enough.

Ishmael.6740:

It needs to have a target because of the shatter skills…

If you’re using phantasms as purely cannon fodder upon creation, you’re probably playing Shatter wrong. Or at least… less effectively than the way you’re supposed to shatter.

I’ve been noticing that OMFG was trying to get a team together for a while now. I’m glad you guys followed through with it. <3

Can’t wait to watch the video and see some good footage.

I think that’s messing too much with the mechanics. If iWarden is ground targeted, I’d want consistency with all phantasms, and I don’t think that’s a good idea.

What Neptune said.

Not to thread jack, but how about you try Sword/Focus+Staff with CI? Now THAT’s a fun weapon set and build to use in PvP.

My opinion:

Mesmer is easy to pick up, but hard to master. There’s a huge gap in skill between experienced Mesmers and casual players. This is of course from a pvp perspective.

I’m kind of loving my iWarden right now.

We need more threads to be stickied.

I don’t think every Mesmer should have Distraction/Distortion on demand. That alone makes it kind of OP in my opinion. That being said, I haven’t really played a “shatter” build outside of my 0/4/6/4/0 support shatter build, so I’m not sure if I have much helpful insight into the situation.

Fay.2357:

jihm.2315:

Dondagora.9645:

jihm.2315:

Fay.2357:

jihm.2315:

Lachanche.6859:

mesmers are awesome !
they make the plays and are high risk high reward (talking about 4 4 0 0 6 shatter don’t get strange ideas), master mesmers mechanics and you will really play gw2 pvp to the fullest.

where is the risk when you never die?

Ooh ooh! It’s the guy from the profession balance forums that got torn into small pieces by Rylock and now complains nonstop about mesmers! We’ve been visited by a celebrity.

yeah besides thief who else can kill you?

Warriors, Eles, Necros, some Guardians, other Mesmers, Rangers[Especially with their new pew-pew builds], and a good many decap engis.

rangers are now for the first time equal with mesmers,
facemelters with too much utility and survivability also

See, let me explain to you the difference between yourself and a good player.

Good Player: Gosh, that [mesmer/ranger/other class] is quite strong and [beat/almost beat/destroyed] me. As a result, I’ll [improve/learn/adapt] until I can beat them.

You: Gosh, that [mesmer/ranger/other class] is quite strong and [destroyed] me. As as result, I’ll [go to the forums and complain nonstop].

Source: looked at your posting history. Over the past 5 months, over 90% of your posts have been complaining in one form or another about how you got beaten by someone else.

+1 #Checkmate

Esplen makes a great point. Signet Heal does have its uses though. It shouldn’t heal as much as Ether Fest, because it has utilities outside of just healing such as extra dps via refreshing phantasm CD as well as its passive healing.

Oh wait, how did I miss another ridiculous post by Fay bashing signets?! lawl

Fay.2357:

The signet traits have massive problems, but it’s not immediately evident.

Signet Mastery
This trait shares a spot with the following traits:

• Mental Torment: Required for shatter builds focusing on burst
• Halting Strike: Required for interrupt builds that like doing damage
• Empowered Illusions: Required for phantasm builds that like doing damage
• Crippling dissipation: Required for clone-death builds that like some modicum of control

There’s almost no situation where you’re able to give up one of those traits for signet mastery.

Blurred Inscriptions
This trait shares a spot with the following traits:

• Deceptive Evasion
  …I think I’ve said enough.

Cleansing Inscriptions
This trait shares a spot with the following traits:

• Bountiful Interruption: A very important trait for interrupt builds to maintain damage
• Chaotic Dampening: Very important trait for builds that take staff, reducing cooldowns of a lot of very strong skills

Overall, this trait is the one most accessible…and it’s pretty inaccessible.

All 3 of these traits share spots with other very powerful and/or needed traits. This means that in order to have a spot for the signet trait, you’re forced to burn more traits into that line and forego either a master trait, or in 2/3 cases a grandmaster trait. There’s not a whole lot wrong with the traits themselves, other than them being potentially on the weak side, but the main issue is that they’re simply in spots that make it impossible to take them.

You’re right: the issue with signet traits in and of themselves is not immediately evident. There is pretty stiff competition in each of those spots. However your issue in judging them is evident: it’s not apparent that you recognize these traits are designed for signet builds “almost” exclusively.

Signet Mastery
Each of those builds you specified is a niche build. So of COURSE you’d take those other traits if you’re running one of those builds. Running an interrupt/shatter build means you wouldn’t be using barely any signets anyway outside of S.Domination.

Blurred Inscriptions
Every trait standing next to DE looks utterly useless. However, this says more about how us Mesmer view DE as a crutch than how less useful the other traits are. Besides, if you’re running 3 or more traits (what I’d consider running on the side of being a signet build) then you’re most likely going 6 points into Dueling where no one uses the gm traits.

Cleansing Inscriptions
This is actually a pretty weak trait. I’d like to see it buffed where it cleanses a single condition from AOE teammates OR change it to something like “Chaotic Inscriptions” where it cleanses one condi on you and adds AOE conditions. It’d be similar to Debilitating Dissipation. Or it could cause a single condi like Weakness. That’d be cool. This would tie it in better with the Chaos line.
_____________________________________
Overall, the key to these traits is that if you’re running 3 or more signets, it then becomes more valuable to take them. Additionally, traiting exclusively for those 3 spots still gives you 4 points to spend. It makes sense to typically go into Domination/Dueling where the next tiers have less competition for good traits.

The best thing about my Malignant Inscriptions and dps Signet builds is that it’s technically a hybrid version of Clone death / Phantasm builds. I honestly believe they represent a lot of what the Mesmer class is: a dual sense of chaos and tranquility. Passive and active. Offensive and defensive. I love it and think more people should try them out! <3

Bumping, because I’ve been kittening owning on my Malignant Inscriptions build, and I think Signets do not get enough play…

More over, if you’re a big tea drinker like myself, you’ll appreciate the hatred of other players soon enough! I brew mine in a special way!

“sorry new to game”

OMFG you are so shady. Whether this is true or not, I’m sure this line DESTROYED him. I’m dying of laughter. lawl

The game should NOT be balanced around WvW roaming. Sorry.

PvE = Power

PvP = Either can be effective

WvW = no clue!

I think Halting Strike happens the same time the interrupt does. A skill has to be used in order to be interrupted. When I think of skills “proccing” I imagine that the algorithm has these actions happen instantaneously, not “if this, then that”. From a programming viewpoint, that would require more work than necessary.

With that being said, I don’t think wastrel’s punishment applies to Halting Strike, but obviously I don’t know for sure. I see the logic of it applying as well.

There’s an easy test to this:
Try it out on a friend trying to heal. Try it with wastrel’s without. Look at the dmg difference keeping in mind that it will do a little bit more dmg due to being 1 point more into domination.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fhAQNAraWnsISjaWoGOoB3aGB3YM9ENEBKXaoSGwvA-TZRAwAAOCAKOBAlLDw5RA0b/BA

The PU build I was talking about.

ooo Riddle’s changes looks very nice. ooo what a NASTY PU build that’d be with duelist. I forget Staff isn’t always necessary, especially in a roaming type situation where melee isn’t always what you should aim for.

disclaimer: I’m a pvp purest, so I may not know the right strategies inherent in a WvW roaming format.

1) It looks a really interesting PU/Mantra hybrid. It’s nice.
2) There are several potential improvements I could suggest. The first is getting rid of MoR. You have plenty condi removal with the Mantra Heal, and considering in a bind you could use stealth to charge, I don’t see MoR being inherently necessary. Also, isn’t people running away an issue in roaming? You don’t have any control skills like pistol 5 or S.Domination. I’d suggest the latter in place of MoR. However, then I’d feel like your Mantra gm wouldn’t be worth it…

Alternatively, to keep with your usage of the Mantra gm, you could take MoD instead of MoR and then take the Bountiful Interruption instead of the Staff CD. The might will give boosts to your condi dmg as well as give you long lasting defensive boons.

Since you really can’t depend on your phantasms doing a lot of dmg even with the use of fury, I’d take away Phanstasmal Fury for Desperate Decoy, which will give you another stealth when you probably need it most.

3) There are better PU builds out there that you could use. Scepter/Pistol+Staff 0/4/6/0/4 would be nice, but this takes away the originality from your build using mantras.

Overall, you’ve got a great start. Most PU builds will be strong regardless when roaming, so you do have some flexibility. Good luck!!

We’re currently in the most balanced state of the game we’ve ever see.

Every class has at least two unique and highly effective builds for all types of spvp. idk what there is to complain about.

WvW is a different story, and PvE is all dps all around.

Definitely Elementalist/Engineer. Outside of those two, it’s worth noting that Mesmer skills need precise execution. You can’t just press buttons in any order and expect to survive as a Mesmer.

How are the reflects not reliable for you? I stand on top of the curtain, and nothing touches me. I know there are some bugs inherent in focus, but it tends to work for me.

Before I give any advice, I’d like to know what your goal with the build is. If you’re going shatter, there are much better ways to do it. For now, I’ll echo Esplen by saying that Decoy>Mirror. Lastly, you don’t need anymore than 2 sources of condi removal. I think that’s just right.

I love signet builds, but it’s hard to make it interrupt as well.

My suggestions:
1. Take the signet CD instead of the illusions power. This will give you more distortions more often.
2. Take a power based rune instead of krait in order to make up for the above change. Strength, Pack, Pirate etc are all very good options. The addition of so much might makes up for lower lost condition dmg. This isn’t a hybrid condition/power build so you should steer clear of the bleed sigils as well.
3. Here’s the hard part: You need the condi clear, so you need to either get rid one of your interrupt traits. I love CI, but in a power signet build, I think your might stacking should be enough to shorten the fights.

As a poster, I always try to keep your originality when it comes to advice, so the only alternative to point 3 is taking MoR/NullField instead of MoD. Here’s what your build would look like:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fhAQNAsaRnsISDaWhGmqB3aGx1YM9JhkCpCo0VM9GA-TZBCwAAOBAUOEAaeCAx2fIcZAA

Also thanks for inspiring me to use that stun sigil on my condi signet build. I’m going to swap out bursting for that and see how it does. A near 4second stun on S.Domination? Absolutely. See my signature for how I set mine up.

I may be in the minority here, but from a pvp perspective only, I think Mesmer is balanced along with the other professions. There are bugs that need to be fixed of course, but I’ve given up hope thinking that’s actually a possibility.

In terms of builds, I think we have a lot of viability to go around. I play a very successful support lockdown build with great results. Shatter is still great. All lockdown builds got a great buff. The only thing iffy are condition builds now. They’re still fun, but I think they’re overall a little bit less effective.

Traited focus is all you need to justify going into CI. The AOE interrupts are magical on focus/Staff.