Guild Wars 2

Hello all, I’m just wondering with the Chinese release if anybody knows if the trading post will be connected worldwide. I know the precedent is set already from Europe to America, but China is a different beast.

Thanks guys.

Also if you feel like posting any speculations let me know haha. I’m happy to discuss

Well I rarely ever die, I love my elem. it comes die. To how good are you, and are you willing to practice?

I’m not expecting much seriousness in this thread, but I do think conditions need a reform.

I don’t understand in what logical world… Anything should be able to cast one skill and walk away after…. And then that persons target dies from its condis.

To test this.. I had a S/S dire condi warrior to hit me with ONE skill. Impale. It put on over 20 seconds of 5 stacks of torment. And when he was on the other side of the sanctum already engaged in a duel, the duration hit about half way, and my health hit zero.

I didn’t move an inch during this test. So torment wasn’t even doing the max damage possible.

Torment was the worst addition to this game in my opinion, but all conditions need a reformation.

—

So obviously for all the naysayers and condi lovers, yes there are counters to taking all of your health in one skill. Dodge it, cleanse it. Doesn’t matter; you can get rid of it. But that is a low cooldown skill and it shows that high damage conditions can be spammed quicker than high damage skills from power to conditions.

One huge problem is that we can train our brains to know, “A warrior has an axe and is leaping on me. I should dodge.” But we can’t train our brain the same way about conditions. One auto attack can do two thousand damage just from a lengthy bleed tick, and pray tell me who would honestly cleanse one bleed stack. There are some telegraphed condition skills out there for sure, but most are the equivalent of a thieves backstab. Deadly and hard to predict.

How does this topic (obviously a well written joke) get two red tags. Legitimate suggestions in profession balance get nothing.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

style.6173:

@OP: Ele is already good in WvW and PvE. In WvW it is one of the three most important classes actually.

It is in PvP where the class is weak.

…If Staff support is your cup of tea maybe.
Other weapons? Nah. They are all low damage, low support.
What if you get focused? Well you are going to die.

Ele is FAR from “Good” in WvW. PvE, does it really matter? unless doing high level fractuals then the class and the build mean nothing because its so easy.

Ele is definitely far from “good” it’s great in WvW.

We have the ability to beat almost any other build out there. We struggle with P/D thieves and Terrormancer/Chillmancer necros. Two builds that counter us out of every build in the game isn’t bad in the scheme of things.

Chill my friends, chill. That’s the biggest killer of our class.

I agree eles have one of the highest skill caps, and I don’t exactly want to change that.

Every so often I use the active in a duel without much consequence. Although 50% of the time it will result in my death, as I only use it when I’m in the 15% health range when I’m just bursted out of water.

Was awesome to meet you too! Nasty condi build there.

Lol I know it got deleted but limeburt you sound so jelly.

Amon, keep it up and you’ll be posting here more as well!

Heidia, I’ve had a lot of fun in this matchup thus far. The roams have been fun 1vX as well. Dueling wise, I wish I could convince you to stay engaged, but I agree some counters can be too obnoxious. Like terrormancer necros slotting signet of spite and boon corrupt.

katniss.6735:

I had to duel two thieves at once to make it fair for SoS.

Not to be mean but I’ve seen you 1v1 and it isn’t purdy.

Add a bit of toughness. You’ll get dropped in a heartbeat.

Could be Amon. But there’s a lot of thieves in BLNT.

Bad Ele great to hear. We’ll chat soon.

Mag missed SoS too :O

Bad ele!!! How goes your deployment?

When will you be getting back on?

Yeah that’s a good point but this is a condi thread :P.

I don’t actually think we suffer from direct damage much. I have 2500 armor and never really lose to direct damage classes. It’s always the ranged condi spammers that get me.

15 percent sounds good. But it doesn’t truly help handle a fight vs a condi spammer.

That sounds too powerful Ash. I like the line of thinking from those proposals though. It’d be nice if each time you got hit with 4 or more condis, it cleansed them (30 sec ICD.)

I can’t speak for him, but Serane should be recording a host of our duels.

If you’re looking for the best ele dueling matchup in NA right now, it’s on FA, Mag and SoS.

The quality of players dueling is the highest I’ve ever seen concentrated in one place.

If you’re looking for duels and have money to blow or want an ele crash course this is the place to be.

If you’re already on these servers and want in on the action, just let me know! I’ll PM you when everybody is dueling.

In spvp they nerfed our best traits while at the same time we are unable to cover our stat deficits like we can in WvW. Ah well.

Try 30/30/0/0/10 :P jk. But back on track guys.

What do we hope they change in this next patch for condi removal?

Also how did you all feel about the fake patch notes that changed condi dmg with auras?

Hedger.9261:

Mbelch.9028:

You really think you know a good bit about this don’t you?

It would be difficult to balance every class for 1v1, but it is the best option in my opinion. If you balance for 1v1, everybody in a Zerg can take care of him or herself. They ditched the trinity for a reason.

I won’t go past that. I have valid views, you have yours. Don’t call mine illogical when yours are very similar to mine, just on the opposite side of the spectrum.

No one called your views illogical, they arent. Misguided, probably, filled with an agenda most definitely, but not illogical. They fit perfectly with someone who is not happy with facing things they dont know how to beat yet but is slow coming to the realization that they cant, wont and possibly arent supposed to.

Anet didnt ditch the idea of the trinity, they just renamed it and swaped around how each part is handled. damage is still damage, tanks are now control, and healing is now support. Instead of every class falling into one main role and possibly into a second, they all have a little of each but can build to focus on any role they want.

This has been just about the only important topic in the mes forum for about a month now. I seen valid arguments to 1v1 concepts but at the end of the day they all have one fatal flaw, anet did not build this game on 1v1 foundations. Dueling may be fun but its just not what the game is made for yet people still attempt to fabricate “information” like this to try and influence the devs one way or another.

Are our opinions similar? I cant say. the only point ive made is that balancing around 1v1 is not a good idea in a game like this. All i can say is that close only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades, and that i will continue pointing out blatant opinion labeled as fact where ever i see it.

This is the profession balance forum, lets balance around things that are actually a thing in the game…

My opinions are misguided? I think you just turn a blind eye to whatever you choose you dislike. You dislike duelers and roamers. That’s fine, just admit it.

Anet ditched the trinity. Nobody can be a pure healer, and the most optimized players are the ones that give ancillary healing.

Your opinion expresses poor build crafting. If you’re a healer, you can only heal five people. So mantras, shouts, and eles come to mind. Staff eles can support with heals, but at the same time, the GOOD ones are dealing most of the damage in your beloved zergs.

Tanks are control? People who build intelligently make highly defensible classes that dish out conditions. Period.

Everybody is truly dishing out and building for a 1v1. And in my opinion, and I express this to my guild, if you can’t win a 1v1, you shouldn’t be running with me.

I also “seen” arguments towards why small mans and duels should be overlooked, but none have convinced me. Zerging isn’t skill. I’ve seen 5 people beat a 25 man Zerg. This is the epitome of how I play this game. I love taking on 1vX, and classes that can’t compete deserve a fighting chance. One person doesn’t matter in your map zergs. My agenda is this: get classes balanced so that each has a fighting chance vs one another in 1v1. Most do have good 1v1 builds but their users are terrible at build craft.

Secondary agenda? Conditions aren’t in a good place in WvW or spvp.

You want to talk about agenda.. You pick one thing to speak on and turn it into why you hate duelers. My take on it? You can’t build craft and you lose duels vs good players.

They gave duelers a new map, and they attempted (and failed) to make a map which accommodated zergs and roamers together. To say anet doesn’t appreciate small man fighting is the most abhorrently biased thing I’ve ever heard. Go troll elsewhere.

You really think you know a good bit about this don’t you?

It would be difficult to balance every class for 1v1, but it is the best option in my opinion. If you balance for 1v1, everybody in a Zerg can take care of him or herself. They ditched the trinity for a reason.

I won’t go past that. I have valid views, you have yours. Don’t call mine illogical when yours are very similar to mine, just on the opposite side of the spectrum.

Well it’d be a waste to let the thread die.

Well. Over 3000 views. Wonder if any of them were a Dev. I’d love a comment pretty please.

Eles are good times. Your ranger rant doesn’t belong in this thread though.

Hedger.9261:

you all realize that “1v1” is not a game type. “roaming” is not a game type…

the purpose of a list like this is the get the things you dont like about the game nerfed or removed. The problem is that changing mechanics based on game types that dont exist is bad design…

Zerging isn’t a game type either.

People duel because it is fun. People knock dueling because they’re skilless.

Conditions are definitely an issue for small teams and roaming. Don’t pretend they’re not, people.

Rising Dusk.2408:

I just wanted to chime in about a common misconception: Diamond Skin does not promote passive play.

It is, on the contrary, quite active. You actively have to make it a point to try to stay above the 90% threshold, and your opponent actively tries to whittle you out of that 90% threshold to again be able to apply conditions. This is nothing like Healing Signet, which does promote passive play, whereby Healing Signet simply does the same thing regardless and has no play or counterplay at all (at the moment). Diamond Skin invokes a lot of play and counterplay, and although it’s rudimentary in the form of “stay above a certain amount of life”, it’s still very much active.

That’s all. Carry on.

Hey I hear what you’re saying about needing active play to maintain it. It’s just not a great trait in my opinion. The threshold is too low, and I don’t support 100% counters.

Prysin.8542:

To all of you, if you want to become good with Ele, IE; learn to manage what you here claim to be issues, you should play a ranger in WvW Roaming.
WHY?
Just like ele, the ranger is somewhat squishy, so you are forced to dodge. You cannot mistform, you cannot blink/teleport or use RTL. You are forced to deal with it in a close quarter battle. Trust me, a few weeks on a ranger and you know what i mean.
Secondly, rangers has less and worse condi removal then Eles. Thus if you think you are in a bad spot, now, you will learn to take care of yourself with even less luxuries then you have already.
Thirdly, Glass Ele, Thief, Warrior, Mesmer, Engineer, Necro or Guard is nowhere near as glass as rangers is, as ranger glass builds (thanks to how traitlines work) makes them super glassy. Yes the DPS is awesome, you can do 6-7k crits with a LB on AA alone, however, you’ll get downed if someone as much as farts in your general direction.
In other words, with time, you learn to survive while being left with fewer survival tools then you have on ele.
A thing you should NEVER do is run trap ranger. Not because its hard to use, but because once you learn what real condition pressure is like on other roaming professions, you get sad when you try to do it on your ele. Just doesn’t come close to that pressure, like ever.

Why do i say this?
Because iv’e mained a ranger for over a year, and once i started leveling my ele i found it to be the easiest profession (apart from attunements, they still kitten me off royally) to keep alive. So many tools, cooldowns a kitten but thats ok.

Oh and forgot to say; Conjuration DF roaming FTW.

Are you not getting Enough attention in your ranger threads lately? Please carry on, troll.

unleashed.8679:

Only if every other damage multiplier will effect condition damage as well.

Mbelch.9028:

If eles and mesmers get it, I’ll be happy.

You mean this eles, that get completely imune to Conditions with diamond skin and a little bit of heal? Why would they need this?

Oh you’re funny. You must not play much. Or you’re terrible.

Diamond skin is terrible. Has no place in the game.

Where is skill in here? Skill+any build>All those builds.

Making lists is pointless when my d/d ele hasn’t lost to a build on that list — outside of terror necros in spvp — in months.

Razor.6392:

Mbelch.9028:

Razor.6392:

P Fun Daddy.1208:

Razor.6392:

Ether renewal is great fyi.

Until people learn to interrupt it or DPS harder during it because you can’t dodge.

Not everyone has disables on demand. Also armor of earth helps for that one time where you must not get interrupted no matter what.

Sorry. Everybody uses that “armor of earth” BS.

No. Ether renewal is utter crap for a large scale fight. It can be OK for dueling, and if you have rock solid sure you can arrange it so it heals you OK. But the 3 seconds you’re not pressuring is just a groove killer. Good luck stacking might.

Oh and when a good player comes around (yes every class has CC in their wep sets) you won’t get that heal when you need it.

It’s the other way around for me. ER is bad for dueling because people only have to focus on one target to cancel the heal. It’s more noticeable and easier to pull off as opposed to doing it in a huge zerg.

I always use ER though I admit that in some situations the signet would be better. I find ER better in general however. I can’t count how many times it has saved me from multiple conditions being spammed on me.

It has counterplay, yes. But that’s better than simply being a sitting duck whenever you get more than 3 conditions at once. Also not everyone runs 30 in water.

Not everyone runs 30 in water which is why I’m trying to get a buff for this for people like you who don’t.

ER could be a great heal if it’s cooldown wasn’t so punishing. I’d even be happy if it was a 20 second cooldown but had a gradual step cooldown when interrupted.

Nice fights. Sorry I didn’t reply. Didn’t see it. Your build lacks power or crit dmg. I routinely hit double what you’re hitting. As your skill increases, gradually build glassier. You’ll like the result.

And about the might stacking. I suppose that frees up 10 trait points for you, but I just can’t see how a front line ele wouldn’t want 21-25 stacks of permanent might.

I’m curious as to what you’re taking over it

I’m not going to bash aside from saying you can tell the person here wasn’t living up to his max potential. The botched lightning flashes are a good indicator.

However he didn’t die under pressure, he used a good rotation under fire as staff so props to him.

But I also didn’t see him make any life saving moves for his team.

Kyon.9735:

Mbelch.9028:

His facts may be wrong but even he admits eles are affected “by chill like no other.”

So it should be changed

Sorry, I might have jumped the gun. I got a bit too edgy because I might have misinterpreted him saying “my necro got nerfed and is as weak as hell so you don’t deserve to be fixed.”

He was edgy as hell first :p I’m just interpreting his statement’s relevancy in this thread.

A 30 point investment shouldn’t be so situational.

I like the water signet suggestions though.

If eles and mesmers get it, I’ll be happy.

Klocknov.8219:

Razor.6392:

P Fun Daddy.1208:

Razor.6392:

Ether renewal is great fyi.

Until people learn to interrupt it or DPS harder during it because you can’t dodge.

Not everyone has disables on demand. Also armor of earth helps for that one time where you must not get interrupted no matter what.

Do you play ele Razor? Since you would know 90s is twice as long as most CC so in comparison you have less on-demend use.

This is the problem with Ether Renewal, that and it taking you out of combat for 4 seconds due to the 3.5 casting time and the .5 after cast. Top that off with canceling it or getting it interrupted before the first pulse sticks it on the full 15s recharge and you have the most broken healing skill in the game for bad reasons. The worst part is it is sadly one of the best heals they have in the current meta…

So why is it wrong to want the skill reworked somehow? Guardians closest skill to this is Shelter and Mesmer has Mirror, both of those have their full heal and ability to cancel the channel, but you cancel the ele on and you lose everything. If it worked like those I wouldn’t have a problem with the condi cleanse being on ticks, but why is the healing? That makes no sense for an active combat game where every other healing skill you can stay in combat but this one.

Ahh you get it. Thank you. I’d love to see this changed.

I don’t and won’t use it, but for the good of eles, I hope it is changed.

His facts may be wrong but even he admits eles are affected “by chill like no other.”

So it should be changed

I believe it, Bran. Just a little love verbally thrown our way would go a long way IMO.

Razor.6392:

P Fun Daddy.1208:

Razor.6392:

Ether renewal is great fyi.

Until people learn to interrupt it or DPS harder during it because you can’t dodge.

Not everyone has disables on demand. Also armor of earth helps for that one time where you must not get interrupted no matter what.

Sorry. Everybody uses that “armor of earth” BS.

No. Ether renewal is utter crap for a large scale fight. It can be OK for dueling, and if you have rock solid sure you can arrange it so it heals you OK. But the 3 seconds you’re not pressuring is just a groove killer. Good luck stacking might.

Oh and when a good player comes around (yes every class has CC in their wep sets) you won’t get that heal when you need it.

Yep. Cleansing water is to be unnerfed.

I love the change. It was a mistake to nerf it in the first place. You don’t nerf things to make new builds you buff other things to encourage people to try them.

Thanks for your reply. My comments in bold.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

The problem with Diamond skin is that it merely takes a few auto attacks from most classes to get us below the required health point. So even against other Condition classes – it is rather useless as they can all still do enough damage to get us below it, once that happens we are dead.

One problem I have with it is it stimulates passive gameplay. I’d prefer it be a more active trait. One great thing about ele is the complexity of our class. I’d preserve that if possible.

Cleansing Wave is a JOKE. A 40second cool down to remove one condition and heal for a tiny amount.

I think the skill is fine. It just needs it’s cooldown cut in half.

Cleansing Fire 3 conditions removed every 40 seconds!? Really, sure a tiny Burning but again an insane cool down which the ele suffers with on pretty much EVERY weapon, EVERY heal, EVERY Utility and EVERY Elite for no good justifiable reason at all.

Could not agree more. It needs to be on a 20-30 second cooldown. So does LF.

Signet of Water, Cure a condition every 10 seconds? Not to shabby, i mean its not amazing and it wont save us but still. Now if only the active was WORTH using.

Passive. So useless. Also has the same condi removal of cleansing fire. (I trait for Cantrips)

My Ideas:

Ether Renewal Channel time reduced. It should be like 33% faster at least. 2 second channel to remove 1 condition every tick, increase the pulses to 10 for a tiny bit more condition removal. So 10 ticks in 2 seconds to remove 10 conditions and a little bit better heal, Maybe increase the cool down a tad to counter its better use.

the skill scales great with healing power. So it doesn’t need more healing. I wouldn’t be opposed to your change but I’d prefer it to have a gradual cooldown.

Diamond Skin: Make it so that its 75% health before Conditions are applied but give it say a 20-30second cool down. So once below that 75% mark you will have to survive for 20-30seconds before it works again or something? Though i do like the idea of making it a GM minor trait, the second idea for the conditions to be mirrored back at the target would be great as well. If it was a choice between the 2, i would go with that one.

Cleansing Wave: Make it a channel – That removes Conditions and heals for each pulse. Say 1 second channel, 2 conditions removed per a pulse, 4 Pulses and 500 health healed per a pulse (at 0 healing power) This would make it worth the 40second cool down.

No thanks on that.

Signet of water: Keep the passive, change the active to a 90second cool down that turns all conditions into boons for the duration of what the condition would have been. Much better than the current active.

Love it.

Cleansing Fire: Cure 3 conditions and another 2 conditions per target that is hit by the burning. Decrease cool down to 20seconds.
Love it.

Just some of the discussion.

Ryld.1340:

Mbelch.9028:

I don’t care to drag other classes into this, I just want it fixed for us; no need to drag them down to our level.

I love and appreciate the non eles jumping in and speaking for us here. Thank you.

Additionally, it would be cool if there was an arcana trait (maybe merge with elemental attunement to make it worth it) that did the one conditional cleanse if you swap to that attunement. All your attunement/condi pairs make sense.

I still like this idea.

Attune Fire = Cleanse Chill
Attune Water = Cleanse Burning
Attune Air = Cleanse Immobilize
Attune Earth = Cleanse Bleeding (This one was harder. Going for the stone approach.)

MonMalthias.4763:

Mbelch.9028:

That trait was brought up before I think on page two.

It’s an interesting idea, but not necessarily a fix for what I perceive this problem to be.

If the trait were to work, I’d say it would need to cure X condition and make you immune to it while in that element.

Air should be less powerful like blind. (This would also help a little with missed RTLs, blind can be applied while riding the lightning)

But earth should definitely be immobilize I think.

If it worked with lingering elements it’d be even better.

At the risk of going off topic

Personally, any immunity trait, no matter how situational, is just asking for abuse. If not at the time of implementation, then far, far down the track. Automated Response for Engineer as an example was an Immunity trait since launch. Yet only now is it seeing use and abuse given the proliferation of Rabid or Dire setups with little Power damage output – and this is even with the fact that pre-existing conditions are not cleansed. AR abuse has led to the Decap Engineer setup that aims to sit at around the 25% threshold with regeneration and other slow healing traits. The same thing could well occur with Diamond skin if left untouched and Signet of Restoration is ever buffed, or Stow Weapon+1 spam to eliminate aftercast is exploited to increase effective HPS.

Even if only situational immunity exists such as to particular conditions on particular attunements, the potential for exploitation will remain. I would rather that traits like Diamond skin or AR or any other immunity trait discard immunity entirely in favour of a different mechanic.

One of the persisting issues with Elementalist is that specialisation within trait lines is still very much prevalent. Fire works off of Burning procs or Fire Fields and lacks Cleansing (Burning Fire is terrible before you start, adept tier at best), Air lacks defense (Fresh Air would be less abusable if Air 15 was Blinding Flash instead of Lightning Strike), Earth lacks offense, and Water’s meagre offensive abilities are entirely overshadowed by the defensive abilities, especially now that Bountiful Power has been nerfed. Only Arcana has enough broad base applicability that it is the de jour line for investment.

I would rather that Diamond Skin as a GM Major trait instead be:

• 10% of Toughness becomes Condition damage, 10% of Toughness becomes Power (Combining old Diamond Skin with Warrior’s Armoured Attack for a hybrid tanky DPS)
  or
• When you are afflicted with a condition by a foe within 600 units, your foe suffers it also. Gain 1 stack of Might for 5 seconds for each incoming condition. ICD of 1 second. (Getting into Mesmer Territory with Mirror of Anguish ) but removes the hard counter gameplay and makes Elementalist get stronger the more conditions are spammed against its low HP pool.

All of this discussion is off topic, however. I would recommend that a new thread discussing Diamond Skin and associated traits be created instead.

I think there needs to be a discussion on diamond skin, and the ability elementalists have to remove conditions as a whole.

Firstly, eles are super susceptible to conditions. With our base HP, and our trait lines, we have to pick our poisons. Take vitality, and you’re missing out on vital power. Invest in 30 water or 30 earth, and you cripple your offensive abilities.

These are tough choices, and I think we need reforms to certain skills to make them a little better.

-If cleansing water wasn’t going to be fixed in spvp, I’d riot. That was a mistaken nerf in the first place.

-Diamond Skin is awful in that you go all out tank or the trait is wasted, but by being a tank, is your utility wasted?

-Diamond Skin is super passive, should it be like that?

-Cleansing fire is on a super high cooldown, especially given that when it was nerfed, it got no cooldown reduction. Is it fine, or should the cooldown be shaved down since the stun break was removed?

-Ether renewal is one of the worst heals in the game (In my opinion) I don’t see skillful eles using it, as A, it takes you away from DPSing and B it is a “CC on me” beacon. Not to mention that if it is interrupted and you haven’t even used one pulse, the cooldown is completely triggered. That needs to be changed to a gradual cooldown when interrupted. IE, you use half the heal, you get half the cooldown.

Those are some of the topics to be talked about, and I’ll additionally tack on some of the discussion from another thread of mine.

Thanks for everything, guys.

Ryld, thanks for speaking up. Yes it becomes out of hand. And part of the issue is many of our ways to remove condi are everything or nothing. Like if traited for Cantrips in 30 water, cleansing fire removes 4 condis. I wouldn’t just bust that for chill. Switching to water will remove several. I won’t just bust that for chill. Because as soon as you leave water or bust cleansing fire, you get a condition nuke and have NO way to remove it.

Basically for elementalists — it’s die or die. GL;HF.

I’ve had players use chill and bleeds very well against me in that I can’t just use one condi removal.

Kyon, I won’t comment on your friends situation, but I know the devs certainly are busy with ranger stuff. My only beef is the question “who needs help most” was answered with rangers, and eles were a close second. So don’t ignore us, help us, too…

Interesting suggestions. I have a few comments back but we may as well get that thread started. Where would you like it? Balance or Ele forum?

On topic again now :p

That trait was brought up before I think on page two.

It’s an interesting idea, but not necessarily a fix for what I perceive this problem to be.

If the trait were to work, I’d say it would need to cure X condition and make you immune to it while in that element.

Air should be less powerful like blind. (This would also help a little with missed RTLs, blind can be applied while riding the lightning)

But earth should definitely be immobilize I think.

If it worked with lingering elements it’d be even better.

Why does that little detail matter?

And I’ve watched the perma chill ranger build wreck people in WvW. Just call up Tanbin and ask him.

That little detail isn’t important. Chill is prevalent and every class can access it frequently enough that ele is affected in a good deal of fights.